I don't want to live in a place that bans soda

[Renew Deal]

Or plastic bags
Or live chicken sales
Or pet stores

That's the kind of stuff that goes on in San Francisco that we don't need in NY.

[Skinner]

1. New York isn't banning soda. It is banning large servings of soda.

I believe this could actually make a big difference, and I approve of it. We are killing our children with sugary drinks.

[onehandle]

4. Yep. nt

[Renew Deal]

6. Yes, I get that

And I think it could force some people to drink 4-16OZ less of soda. But I'm not really for this kind of nanny nonsense. This affects the individual. It's not the same as CFL's or mileage standards which affect the environment (everyone).

[Skinner]

12. Among the people affected are children.

I recently watched that HBO documentary "The Weight of the Nation" and it really left an impression on me.

One point from the film is that the human body does not recognize it is full when a large number of calories are consumed in the form of sugary drinks. You can keep drinking and drinking and drinking, consuming hundreds of calories, and not feel the need to stop.

I know that people don't like government telling them what to do. But as a parent, I would appreciate knowing that if my child went into a 7-11 to buy a drink, that 16-ounce limit would make a difference. Sure, he could buy two drinks, but I don't think he would. Remember the days when a "large" drink at McDonalds was only like 20 ounces? Nobody would buy two of them. You just got the large and you were perfectly satisfied with what you had.

[Renew Deal]

34. I remember the 20oz large

Now that's the small in some places (Wendy's and White Castle come to mind).

Not sure if your kids are in school yet, but do they have soda machines? I know my old HS does. It's disgusting.

[LiberalAndProud]

10. I doubt that banning the big gulp will have much affect on children's sugary drinks.

It would be a better tactic to resize child-sized drinks to child-size. Make smaller portions available rather than ban large portions. Limiting choices never seems like a good idea to me.

On the other hand, it's difficult to find an ice cream joint that sells the soft serve equivalent to a single-scoop cone, and that leads to overeating and sticky messes.

[Skinner]

13. I think you're wrong.

It might not have an effect on young children who are completely dependent on their parents to make purchases for them. But it will make a difference for teenagers.

[johnnie]

15. I don't know if I ever seen a child with one of those jumbo drinks

Maybe some teens, but not really any children. The teens are drinking more power drinks which are probably worse.

[RZM]

28. They probably are worse

If I'm not mistaken, they have just as much sugar and even more caffeine

[Renew Deal]

38. A lot of restaurants have a 20oz "Small Soda"

Skinner pointed this out and it's true. So unless the kid gets the kids meal which comes with juice or milk, they are pushed into the larger size.

[johnnie]

42. But if they are that young they would probably be with their parents

I don't have children so I really don't know what is offered to them, I only can go by the little I know. But I would think that if a child is at a restaurant they would be with a parent or two and I think it would be up to them to make sure the child isn't getting the super size even if it's disguised as a small.

[NeedleCast]

24. Not Really Correct, Skinner

Bloomberg's idea would not ban large servings of soda, it only bans the use of "big" cups. If I go into a Taco Bell and get a combo meal with a 16 oz. soda, I can still go up to the soda dispensing machine and fill up my cup four times. If I go into a restaurant, I can still get all the refills I want.

This, from a man who last week promoted National Free Donut day.

Give me a break.

[randome]

32. But some people, not all of course, would be less likely to refill.

The idea would be planted in their minds that gulping quarts and even gallons of sugary crap is probably not such a good idea, after all. It's more in the nature of an oft-repeated public service announcement. It's not an outright ban so, IMO...meh.

[NeedleCast]

48. Yup, the dude who's administration just backed "Free Donut Day"

is, I'm sure, going to make people sit back and say "let me think about my dietary choices..."

At least most nonsensical, feel-good laws have public support. This one appears to be pretty widely hated. The idea, as written, is so grossly ineffective that there's no reason to push for it. I wouldn't be able to go into a 7-11 and buy a 32oz Big Gulp of Sprite, but I could still go into a Starbucks and order an 800 calorie, 20oz milkshake or other coffee based drink loaded with sugar and whipped cream. I can still go into the same 7-11 and get a cup of ice, and buy a six pack of 12oz cans.

Whats next? A ban on steaks larger than 12oz at restaurants? (But you know, you can still order two 8oz steaks).

[randome]

53. But before you go to that Starbucks, instead you might recall why the ban on monster sized drinks...

...was implemented in the first place. And SOME people would come to the realization that they could find something less harmful to buy.

[NeedleCast]

65. Well, You've got a More Optimistic Outlook on it than me I guess

I don't think it's a good idea to implement bans on things (even when it's just a size ban) on the off-chance that someone who wants a big coffee drink is going to pause a minute and make the connection between an ineffective size-based ban on soda and acquiring the drink they want. I think the state of New York would be much better off spending whatever this implementation would cost on a series of PSAs or middle/high school level education.

Additionally, the law seems like it would effect some drinks that are better options than soda. Gatorade or similar sports drinks have about half the calories of soda, but it sounds like this ban would also effect them. The bottom line for me is that the idea, as proposed, has so many loopholes it might as well not exist.

History has shown us over and over again that explaining why you might not want to do something is a lot more effective than telling you that you can't. See: Prohibition.

[randome]

70. Maybe Bloomberg could hire an advertising agency to do the PSAs.

A competition for the contract, even. I'm sure some creative people could come up with a way to get the message across without insulting the very people it's meant to encourage.

[RZM]

27. I'm of two minds about this

I've always LOVED sugary soda. In fact, I'm about to eat lunch and I'm probably going to have one. But I recognize that it's not good for you and children should not drink it in large amounts.

OTOH, you can't help but roll your eyes at the nanny-state silliness. If an adult wants to purchase a 32 oz. soda I see no reason why they shouldn't be able to. It's an amusing juxtaposition that you won't be able to buy more than 16 oz. of soda at 7-11 but you can walk one block to the liquor store and buy a handle of Jack Daniels and a carton of cigarettes.

I would maybe support some sort of age restriction (have to be 18 to purchase larger amounts of soda), though that would be silly too. I don't believe governments should be in the business of telling adults how much soda they can purchase at one time.

[randome]

36. The government is not telling you how much soda you can purchase at one time.

You can buy five 16 oz. cups if you want. But many people would be less LIKELY to buy more than 1 cup at a time. And some would come to the realization that they should stop altogether.

There would be some benefit, IMO. Maybe not a lot, but some.

[RZM]

47. That's why I'm of two minds

I agree that people should drink less soda. But there are a myriad of other things that people should do either less or more of.

And a bunch of cups is not practical, especially since many people buy big sodas and then get in their car (although perhaps not as much in NYC). They are effectively restricting how much you can purchase at a time.

[TheKentuckian]

30. Then parents should do their job and control their children's intake

rather than utilizing the law governing the free will of adults to select the amount of beverage they want at the better price point that comes along with the larger cups rather than padding the bottom lines of merchants in a goofy game of buying a bunch of cups.

Don't want to "kill our children with sugary drinks"? Don't buy them for them or divide them into acceptable rations.

[ProdigalJunkMail]

58. we are killing our kids with

neglect and lack of education...banning shit like this just goes to prove it.

[Marrah_G]

2. just a couple comments.

just jumbo sized soda are targeted in only certain businesses: agree its sort of silly.
The live chickens are a health safety issue in some farmers markets.
Plastic bags do alot of damage to the enviroment.
Pet SALES, not pet stores.

[Renew Deal]

7. Live Chickens have been sold since the beginning of history.

And if I remember correctly, they were popular at those markets. They were fresher, healthy food rather than the pumped up birds from Big Agra.

[Marrah_G]

16. The problem was people walking around and browsing other stalls,

after buying the chicken. The farmers markets individually decided they did not want to chance health safety.

[OriginalGeek]

3. It wouldn;t surprise me to find this is more about

selling 2 cups instead of one. I think it's true that the cup costs more than the soda in it and my hypothesis is that 2 16oz cups cost more than 1 32oz cup so all those people who bought a large to share with their date at the movie (i do this almost every time I go out - my wife and I always share 1 large rather than 2 smalls) now have to buy 10 dollars worth of drink (movie drinks are expensive way more than restaurant drinks but i bet it holds true) instead of 6 bucks.


I'd rather see comprehensive education than stifling personal freedom.

[Renew Deal]

8. There are now very small cans of soda out there.

I always drink 2 if I have access to them. The normal size can is 12oz. The small can is 7.5oz. 2 7.5oz cans are 15oz of soda!

[msanthrope]

25. "The normal size can?" To lots of the world, the one on the right is the

"normal size."

And that's the problem...you've been told by a company what "normal" is.

The human body can only absorb about 8oz of water/fluid per hour through drinking...everything else is pee. If you use that as a metric, you are drinking about double volume what your body can absorb....that's not "normal."

[Renew Deal]

29. Sorry, normal for america.

I didn't realize how worldly some DUers are. Glad that's cleared up.

[msanthrope]

52. I think you miss my point....

I am suggesting you think it's 'normal' because that's what a company told you it was.

But that same company is telling others that a smaller-sized can is 'normal.'

For your health....start thinking that the one on the right is normal.

On edit--I'm not worldly--just born and bred in the heart of Manhattan....

[hughee99]

76. I've been a number of places around the world

and never seen a 7oz can of coke or beer before just recently. In which part of the world is the 7oz can "normal"?

[msanthrope]

78. Throughout Asia. I used to get them in Italy, too. nt

[hughee99]

79. I haven't been to Asia,

Though I have seen the traditional 12oz can for Japanese beer. I understand in Japan, though, they have 3 or 4 different sized cans. I didn't see them at all in Ireland, Germany, the Caribbean, or Brazil.

[onehandle]

5. If I could afford it, I would live in NYC in a New York Minute. nt

[randome]

20. Me, too.

Not because of Bloomberg but just because...it's New York!

[Johnny Rico]

37. To each their own...I would never live in a large city if I could help it.

I'll stick to the Rocky Mountains!

[obamanut2012]

9. People shouldn't drink their calories VERY occasionally

unless you medically have to do or are an endurance athlete. It is a really bad nutritional practice, ESPECIALLY for kids. This includes 100% juice for kids over two or three ounces. It's better for them to eat an apple or orange, or a banana.

And, diet sodas are probably as bad for people as regular sodas.

I agree with Skinner and others on this: good first step, especially for our kids.

[stevenleser]

45. Yes and yes! Since I started doing this, maintaining weight became easier.

Drink nothing that has calories in it.

[pansypoo53219]

11. i refuse to drink soda, until they get rid of HFCS.

hell, if i was fizzy, i am content in making my own grapefruit soda w/ seltzer. i would be pleases as punch if plastic packaging was banned.

[LadyHawkAZ]

33. I get the Mexican Cokes

I find that they taste better, and I drink less of the actual sugar drink than I did the HFCS American version.

Plus the glass bottle has aesthetic value to a child of the 70s.

[unreadierLizard]

14. I don't think nanny-stating will get anyone to stop.

It'll just cause people to consume more of less. Or start a black market for sugary drinks and HFCS.

[Marrah_G]

26. They aren't banning them

They are just limiting the sizes in certain venues.

[safeinOhio]

17. I'm not for a ban, however

let people take personal responsibility for their actions by raising the tax on them. The money could be used for health care as it goes up with weight gains. High taxes on smokes has cut use, big time.

[johnnie]

39. Not really

http://www.newsandsentinel.com/page/content.detail/id/549084/Smoking-rate-on-the-rise-in-Ohio-adults.html?nav=5061

MARIETTA - Despite rising taxes and continuing health warnings, Ohio's adult smoking rate saw its biggest increase in more than a decade in 2010.

According to statistics from the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, 22.5 percent of adult Ohioans smoked in 2010, up from 20.3 percent in 2009. It was the largest jump in the state's smoking rate since 1996, when it rose from 26.1 percent to 28.4 percent.


http://www.tobacco-facts.net/2011/02/rates-in-new-jersey-on-the-rise

After years of mostly decline, it would appear smoking rates in New Jersey are on the rise, ever so slightly.

In its recently released State of Tobacco Control report for 2010, the American Lung Assocation says the number of adults who smoke in New Jersey rose last year to 15.8 percent. It had been 14.8 percent in the 2009 report. The 2010 report also showed the smoking rate among New Jersey high schoolers rising to 17 percent. It had been 14.3 percent. The data was culled from federal surveys through the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention that were done in 2009.


http://www.legacyforhealth.org/4697.aspx


New Study Shows Significant Rise in Cigar Use Among Young Adults

[marmar]

18. I'm not too fond of the large soda size ban, but banning plastic bags.....

...... seems like a really good idea to me. Or charge 5 or 10 cents for them like Toronto does.

[Egalitarian Thug]

19. GBCW?

[JVS]

21. Live chicken sales?

Who would ban that?

[snooper2]

31. touchy feely good dooers who think they know what's best for everybody

[Marrah_G]

50. Some farmers markets in San Francisco

They are concerned about feces being spread around other stalls full of produce because people buy the live chickens and continue shopping with them.

[JVS]

72. They should just insist that customers buying chickens must leave the market upon purchase.

[Marrah_G]

77. That seems like a viable answer also

[sinkingfeeling]

22. I didn't want to live in a place that banned smoking either.

[onehandle]

55. I do. In fact I plan to talk to the Mayor of the Borough we just moved into.

I understand that they are considering banning it in playgrounds.

That's almost always where these bans start. And they are usually a bipartisan decision.

[Sheepshank]

23. I find it interesting the there are many that gripe about soda drink size/nanny state/lack of choice

and are willing to be vocal and outright rude (in the case of a RW board I visit)...yet are accepting nanny state/lack of choice when it comes to women's health care issues.

[OriginalGeek]

63. maybe at the RW board you visit

but are there really people here who are silent/accepting of the right wing attack on women and their health care issues? I think we are generally pretty loudly against that.

I am more surprised so many seem to be accepting that a legal product with no other restrictions regarding age or consumption can just be arbitrarily limited because Bloomie feels like it.

I think this proposal will probably increase the number of plastic cups produced and the number of paper cups used thus increasing the overall adverse affects on the earth.

And I suspect that's just fine with Bloomie and his cup manufacturing and soda distributing friends.

There is NO question that soda is bad for you and more soda is worse for you than less soda.

I THOUGHT there was no question that I had the right to decide for myself how much, if any, soda I drank and I thought a legal company producing a legal product was allowed to determine what sells best for them.

BTW, I don't live in NY and I don't drink soda any more (my wife and I split water now but we used to split soda) so none of this affects me..yet...

I would welcome the eradication of soda if it was brought about because so many people got educated and decided to stop consuming it. But it would take some fucking gall for me to tell another free American how much he can have at one time.

Unless I was the guy selling the cups.

[abelenkpe]

35. I do.

Except I hate winter so I'll stay in LA.

[stuntcat]

46. :)

me too sorta. What can ya' do about People and the sick stuff they keep wanting? oh well.. Tha's Freedum!

[Capt. Obvious]

40. Imagine there's no soda

it's easy if you try

[randome]

44. Amen.

[LadyHawkAZ]

41. They'd be better off banning HFCS in the syrup

than nitpicking over cup size.

[phleshdef]

43. I mostly agree. This is kind of nonsense that gives liberalism a bad name.

And I'm not sure banning sodas has anything to do with being liberal anyway... but such things are often attached to liberalism by the modern American public and thats really all that matters.

I can see some wiggle room on the plastic bags. But for the most part, we can't just go around banning everything in sight. Our energies would be better spent making healthier food and healthcare more accessible for more people. Or maybe even finding ways to recreate the taste of unhealthy foods that people like within a healthier alternative.

[RedCappedBandit]

49. Banning big drinks is a silly, short sighted band-aid fix.

If kids are still thirsty, they'll just buy another drink and end up spending more money and probably drinking more soda.

If we really want to prevent people from consuming twice their daily calorie needs in a cup of soda, perhaps we should educate people on how to maintain healthy eating habits.

But Bloomberg hates education, and that won't happen.

[randome]

51. Most people don't drink soda because they're thirsty.

They drink it because of the high sugar content, which provokes a mild 'high'.

If someone is truly thirsty, then water is the way to quench it. No syrupy gloop that gets transformed into fat.

The facts have been out there for a long time. You can't educate people who won't listen. And while this proposal isn't a ban on soda itself, it may result in fewer people with health problems.

[RedCappedBandit]

56. Won't argue with that, people won't listen if they don't care.

If people don't care about their weight, then there's nothing to be done about it. Best solution IMO is to give everybody the education they need to make an informed decision, and let them take it from there. Prohibition doesn't work, as we've all seen.


And I'm not sure whether or not people drink soda because they're thirsty. Eat salty foods, get thirsty, drink soda. Whether or not it's an intelligent decision, or will actually quench their thirst, is irrelevant. People do the same with diet soda, which obviously does not have a high sugar content.

At the end of the day though, I highly doubt a small change in the consumption of soda is going to alter eating habits enough to make a dent. If it were that easy, diets would be much more successful, no?

[randome]

57. I hear you.

An educational initiative would be good, too, but I don't see how that would translate well into the public arena. Post billboards of overweight people swearing off sodas? That would be a good way to insult the very public you want to convince.

But nothing else seems to be working now. We could just let things go and humanity will descend into over-sized, stationary gluttons. But I'd rather somebody try something.

Of course I don't drink soda so maybe I'm simply seeing things through my own 'virtuous' point of view.

[Komputernut]

54. Choices....

Removing choices as a way to prevent harm should only be done in relation to the consequences of the choices. If the result is acute harm then the cost of having those choices in our society can rightly be deemed unacceptable.

The problem I see is when the gov starts making choices that people should, through education and cultural influence, be making for themselves, I think the result can be an inclination to stop thinking and an expectation that the gov will care for us. We must view education as the best defense against a culture that desires freedom to make bad choices.

[blueamy66]

59. or black cherry koolaid

nt

[RebelOne]

60. Banning soda would not bother me

because I never drink it anyway.

But I do believe puppy sales should be banned in pet stores because those dogs usually come from puppy mills.

[NeedleCast]

68. Approving a Ban on Something Because You Don't Do it is a poor reason for support

[Johnny Rico]

71. I never drink soda either, but I would never ban it, or the method by which it's served.

This is just yet another example of Nanny State thinking.

Hey, here's a novel idea...why don't we let people make their own choices without The State dictating every aspect of their lives, right down to the size of their soda cup?

[blueamy66]

61. didn't grow up drinking much soda

but we always had kool aid and Hawaiin Punch in the fridge

I'm 45 now and weigh 130 at 5'11"....don't think it affected/effected (can't decide which one to use) my weight at all.

Anyway, I still don't get the appeal of soda. I'd rather have iced tea.

What is the point of my post?

[randome]

64. You're just Punch-drunk!

[blueamy66]

66. still drinking kool aid and Hawaiin Punch

holy crap....I'm addicted

good reply!

[ProdigalJunkMail]

62. Bloomberg will make loads of money for the movie concessions

guess you can't buy one large drink and share it any more. why the fuck doesn't he ban large popcorn? maybe he should ban steaks greater than 8 oz. let's make sure you can't buy a bag of chips with more than one serving in it...

this is fucking nanny state bullshit that actually proves what republicans say about democrats...use the power of gov't to do things is should NOT be doing.

what stupid fucking time to play this bullshit card...

sP

[DLevine]

74. I agree with you.

What rich people like Bloomberg will never understand is that poor people often buy the big soda to save money. They split the large one- much cheaper than buying separate drinks. I used to do that, although I no longer drink soda. In any case, it's not Bloomberg's job to tell people what they can and cannot buy. Give me a break.

[prefunk]

67. If people made rational and selfless decisions....

there would be no ridiculous legislation like this. San Francisco, while well intentioned, is missing the point. But at least they are doing SOMETHING.

[just1voice]

69. How about living in a country with torture camps?

Oops sorry, we're supposed to look ahead and forget all about the worst violation of human rights in U.S. history other that the confederacy which, btw, doesn't seem to bother many people either.

[Renew Deal]

73. Yes, it's true. Bloomberg and I support torture camps.

[CTyankee]

80. Oh, lordy. It is the End of Civilization as We Know it, for sure!

This is it, folks...kiss your ass goodbye. Civil liberties are destroyed and we as a free people are doomed...

[JVS]

75. Damned earworm

[ecstatic]

81. Didn't they ban McDonalds too

or was it just the happy meals? I'm more of a personal responsibility type when it comes to guilty pleasures--as long as your activity doesn't affect me (i.e., smoking).

[Bonobo]

82. I don't want to live in a society without a lick of common sense.

The only ones that benefit from those huge bug gulp monstrosities are the companies selling them.

There is NO consideration given to children's health.

Society must intervene for the needs of society.