Did anyone go to the New York Occupy protest?

[The Backlash Cometh]

First, the word "Occupy" is the hot word. Everything is Occupy. Even Occupy Christmas.

Now, second, there are some in the Republican party, who are not happy with their choices and have attempted to find out what the Occupy movement is all about. At least one friend from Florida, who is Republican and had dropped in to listen in on activities for the teapartiers to the presidential debates, actually flew up to find out what the Occupy movement was all about.

First, he noted that it didn't matter who he talked to, right or left, everyone is angry. He said that the tea partiers and the Occupy people both wanted accountability. But that as he talked to people in the Occupy movement, he couldn't pin down their cause. He left with the most extreme explanations and reached the conclusion that there were anarchists in the group. Can anyone confirm if that's true?

He seemed to believe that everyone's problem boils down to the leadership, because it's the leadership that makes the rules. Unfortunately, we were interrupted before I could explain that it was the 1%ers who were controlling the leadership.

[xchrom]

1. Really? Nt

[The Backlash Cometh]

2. I'm trying to understand it from a right-wingers point of view.

The Occupy force doesn't belong to any political group. It is feasible that there are anarchists in the midst and, unfortunately, my friend ran into them. Very unfortunate since he's very vocal and will tell this story many times over. He is getting politically active in the GOP in Florida.

[Zorra]

3. Oh, my; the bullshit cometh. I can explain this. I talked to my Fox News watching RW brother

in law.

He actually told me that he had gone down to the park before OLA got evicted, and talked to several people from Occupy Los Angeles.

He said that they were anarchists, and that Occupy was a totally anarchistic organization.

I tried to explain to him Martin Luther King's reasons for non-violent direct action as stated in his "Letters from a Birmingham Jail".

Before I could get a whole sentence out, he actually began ranting at me, redundantly and at length, about how he didn't believe in Martin Luther King, that he only believed in the Bible.

I said, well, then, I guess there's no point in continuing this conversation, is there?

BTW, is the new destroy-Occupy propaganda meme from the 1% that Occupy is a semi-RW organization, and actually has leadership, and that this leadership is the 1%?

As xchrom so eloquently and succinctly posted:

"Really?"

[The Backlash Cometh]

6. This is good to know, Zorra.

Thanks for the detail information. Because you took the time, I'll know how to direct my questions to him.

[Zorra]

11. In any disccussion of the GOP, I believe that we must first

consider that these are the primary candidates that the GOP fielded for the upcoming GOP primary.


And the Republican Senate minority leader and House majority leader.


Seriously, is further explanation really necessary?

Honestly, the anti-human being ideological platform and actions of the republican party necessarily eliminates almost all credibility, within the framework of political discourse at the very least, regarding the opinions of any member or supporter of the GOP. Anyone that supports the GOP is either more or less evil according to the standards of most societies, and/or simply a fool.

The GOP is based ideological fantasy, and is provably thoroughly steeped in corruption, and demonstrably practices deliberate widespread deception.

It's like the flat earth society of politics. How can republicans be taken seriously, except with regard to the lethal widespread collective damage that can be done by those that profess and support the GOP ideology?

The GOP is, in its very essence, the political arm of the 1%.

Good luck with your acquaintance. If you can sway him away from the dark side, it would be an honor for me to buy you a coffee or a beer.

[The Backlash Cometh]

12. He seems intent on debating.

We just haven't had the opportunity to sit and chat. His wife knows how much he loves to talk politics, so we're all going out somewhere for drinks and a dog fight.

[lunatica]

4. They are incapable of seeing past the politics and the politicians

I know a professor who is sympathetic to the Occupy movement but just doesn't understand why they don't do it through their votes and why they don't go Occupy the House and Senate. It's a total mystery to him. I've repeatedly tried to explain that the Occupy people are actually against those who buy and pay the politicians, and he'll even nod in my direction, only to come back with his same puzzled argument.

Trying to get people to understand the fundamental causes of corruption is not easy. It never occurs to them to understand why and how someone becomes corrupt, only that they are corrupt.

[The Backlash Cometh]

13. Nicely put.

He does seem intent on tackling the leadership, without any thought to the people who buy them.

[nadinbrzezinski]

5. Yes, there are anarchists in the group, a SMALL BUT VOCAL minority

there are Paulists (RUN), small and VOCAL minority.

Perhaps you should give him the Declaration from the General Assembly in New York.

Declaration of the Occupation of New York City

This document was accepted by the NYC General Assembly on September 29, 2011
Translations: French, Slovak, Spanish, German, Italian, Arabic, Portuguese [all translations »]
As we gather together in solidarity to express a feeling of mass injustice, we must not lose sight of what brought us together. We write so that all people who feel wronged by the corporate forces of the world can know that we are your allies.

As one people, united, we acknowledge the reality: that the future of the human race requires the cooperation of its members; that our system must protect our rights, and upon corruption of that system, it is up to the individuals to protect their own rights, and those of their neighbors; that a democratic government derives its just power from the people, but corporations do not seek consent to extract wealth from the people and the Earth; and that no true democracy is attainable when the process is determined by economic power. We come to you at a time when corporations, which place profit over people, self-interest over justice, and oppression over equality, run our governments. We have peaceably assembled here, as is our right, to let these facts be known.

They have taken our houses through an illegal foreclosure process, despite not having the original mortgage.
They have taken bailouts from taxpayers with impunity, and continue to give Executives exorbitant bonuses.
They have perpetuated inequality and discrimination in the workplace based on age, the color of one’s skin, sex, gender identity and sexual orientation.
They have poisoned the food supply through negligence, and undermined the farming system through monopolization.
They have profited off of the torture, confinement, and cruel treatment of countless animals, and actively hide these practices.
They have continuously sought to strip employees of the right to negotiate for better pay and safer working conditions.
They have held students hostage with tens of thousands of dollars of debt on education, which is itself a human right.
They have consistently outsourced labor and used that outsourcing as leverage to cut workers’ healthcare and pay.
They have influenced the courts to achieve the same rights as people, with none of the culpability or responsibility.
They have spent millions of dollars on legal teams that look for ways to get them out of contracts in regards to health insurance.
They have sold our privacy as a commodity.
They have used the military and police force to prevent freedom of the press.
They have deliberately declined to recall faulty products endangering lives in pursuit of profit.
They determine economic policy, despite the catastrophic failures their policies have produced and continue to produce.
They have donated large sums of money to politicians, who are responsible for regulating them.
They continue to block alternate forms of energy to keep us dependent on oil.
They continue to block generic forms of medicine that could save people’s lives or provide relief in order to protect investments that have already turned a substantial profit.
They have purposely covered up oil spills, accidents, faulty bookkeeping, and inactive ingredients in pursuit of profit.
They purposefully keep people misinformed and fearful through their control of the media.
They have accepted private contracts to murder prisoners even when presented with serious doubts about their guilt.
They have perpetuated colonialism at home and abroad.
They have participated in the torture and murder of innocent civilians overseas.
They continue to create weapons of mass destruction in order to receive government contracts.*
To the people of the world,

We, the New York City General Assembly occupying Wall Street in Liberty Square, urge you to assert your power.

Exercise your right to peaceably assemble; occupy public space; create a process to address the problems we face, and generate solutions accessible to everyone.

To all communities that take action and form groups in the spirit of direct democracy, we offer support, documentation, and all of the resources at our disposal.

Join us and make your voices heard!

*These grievances are not all-inclusive.

We also have a visual representation of this document from the Arts and Culture Group and the Call to Action Working Group. To download your own copy of this image as a jpeg (12.7 MB), click here, or for image inquiries e-mail [email protected].

[The Backlash Cometh]

7. Thank you!

We promised to debate the issue in the future, so this will come handy.

[PETRUS]

8. Late October my wife and I traveled to NYC and spent four days in Liberty Square

Occupy has correctly identified a big problem - maybe THE problem - class domination, i.e. we live in a society where a small fraction of the population (less than 1%, really) has most of the wealth and wields most of the power. Numerous specific problems (stagnant wages, a two-tiered justice system, wars of choice, environmental degradation, etc.) flow from this. There's plenty of room for debate about remedies. Occupy permits this, and encourages it. This is probably what's confusing your friend. Normally, the "public conversation" does not even allow for the admission of elite domination, and everyday citizens are not invited to the policy debate. This is usually the exclusive domain of think tanks, foundations, lobbyists, etc. and the corporate media.

nadinbrzezinski's post (The Declaration) should help clarify somewhat. There are a couple of other official statements (endorsed by the NY General Assembly). You can find them at nycga.net under the resources tab.

[The Backlash Cometh]

14. Thanks for the resource.

[randome]

9. If OWS and the Tea Party have anything in common, it is anger.

Unfortunately, it is anger directed at different targets.

[The Backlash Cometh]

15. I tried to explain this to him.

Even told him that Republican/Libertarians are so counterproductive. They are so anti-government, that they don't see the good that government can play in a community. It's funny to watch when you have Republicans taking over a board and they use the power of the pulpit to push forth economic development programs and their worst critics end up being Libertarians who fight them every step of the way! You can imagine what happens to zoning ordinances that might require a commercial building to aspire to be more than a strip mall!

Counterproductive, every step of the way.

[Puregonzo1188]

10. As opposed to the coherency of the tea party?

And yes, there are anarchist in the group. So what?

[The Backlash Cometh]

16. I just needed to know this, to prepare for a rebuttal.