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zappaman

(20,606 posts)
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 05:11 PM Jan 2015

Why Hitchcock’s horrifying film on the Holocaust was never shown

Two women drag an emaciated female corpse along the ground, its head bouncing on the dirt. When they reach a large pit, they stop, give the naked body a quick tug backward to pick up momentum, then hurl it into the hole. The corpse, which looks like a skeleton covered in a thin film of skin, flops onto a mound of decomposing bodies.

The scene, shot at the Bergen-Belsen concentration camp at the end of World War II, might never have been seen by the public had a decommissioned film, boasting Alfred Hitchcock as a supervising director and British film pioneer Sidney Bernstein as producer, not been resurrected. Authorized in the spring of 1945 by the Allied forces, German Concentration Camps Factual Survey captured the monstrous realities found during the liberation of Nazi death camps, including Bergen-Belsen, Dachau and Auschwitz.

Yet by August of that year, the film was shelved by British authorities. Everything—reels of footage, the script, the cameramen’s notes—was boxed up and buried in the archives of the Imperial War Museums (IWM) in London. A new HBO documentary, Night Will Fall (January 26), directed by André Singer and narrated by Helena Bonham Carter and Jasper Britton, tells the story of how, 70 years later, this lost film came back to life.

-snip-

With grace and masterful storytelling, Night Will Fall reveals the carnage the Allied troops found in the concentration camps and reminds us of just how powerful bearing witness can be. The film is a poignant, potent addition to the canon of Holocaust history. As Bernstein said in an interview in 1984, “My instructions were to film everything which would prove one day that this had actually happened. It’d be a lesson to all mankind as well. As to the Germans, for whom the film that we were putting together was designed…it would be the evidence we could show them…. I wanted to prove that they had seen it, so there was evidence, because I guessed rightly, and most people would deny that it happened.”

more at
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/01/why-hitchcocks-horrifying-film-on-the-holocaust-was-never-shown/

67 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Why Hitchcock’s horrifying film on the Holocaust was never shown (Original Post) zappaman Jan 2015 OP
Huge K & R !!! - Thank You !!! WillyT Jan 2015 #1
K&R Pooka Fey Jan 2015 #2
My father was in a detail that was first in annabanana Jan 2015 #3
My uncle also MarianJack Jan 2015 #7
That reminds me of the scene in the 'Big Red One" Dyedinthewoolliberal Jan 2015 #15
That's a very under-rated movie. zappaman Jan 2015 #21
Yes, a very under rated movei. MarianJack Jan 2015 #24
All of Samuel Fullers movies are like that, very realistic, the Big Red One was based on ChosenUnWisely Jan 2015 #41
Doesn't Lee Marvin hand Mark Hammel another clip? Thor_MN Jan 2015 #46
Yes winstars Jan 2015 #48
I fear we are no longer Enthusiast Jan 2015 #35
Sadly,... MarianJack Jan 2015 #38
If you haven't already done so, chervilant Jan 2015 #45
"...they don't defeat Nazis by becoming Nazis," Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it. jtuck004 Jan 2015 #42
I remember hearing this also... MarianJack Jan 2015 #44
Many people, today, have never met a Jewish person. Behind the Aegis Jan 2015 #56
My father, who is a survivor, explained that reality was different for those liberated by the stevenleser Jan 2015 #61
iAwww,... MarianJack Jan 2015 #63
My father was mostly in camps around the Riga Lativa area, transported there from Hamburg stevenleser Jan 2015 #64
My dad also. Tansy_Gold Jan 2015 #29
My parents were agingdem Jan 2015 #34
Awesome story! Enthusiast Jan 2015 #36
One of my uncles, my Father' brother, was in Germany at the end. olegramps Jan 2015 #50
K&R for more visibility. nt Mnemosyne Jan 2015 #4
I've been on a Hitchcock marathon of late zappaman Jan 2015 #5
There is only one reason some deny the holocaust randr Jan 2015 #6
A Hard fucking reality....Agreed busterbrown Jan 2015 #14
And many, many of them live in the United States. Hissyspit Jan 2015 #30
That is just a fact. Enthusiast Jan 2015 #37
Not just this nation. It is terrible that they are among us, but realize that this level of MH1 Jan 2015 #47
That's why I question the choice of Hitchcock as director nxylas Jan 2015 #39
The Holocaust revisionists and deniers have plenty of ammunition in their lunacy gun. zappaman Jan 2015 #52
You are spot on with that comment. Behind the Aegis Jan 2015 #55
Even on DU, we have those who have no problem linking to zappaman Jan 2015 #59
Kick and R. BeanMusical Jan 2015 #8
K&R! burrowowl Jan 2015 #9
Wow. ananda Jan 2015 #10
k&r... spanone Jan 2015 #11
K&R. JDPriestly Jan 2015 #12
K&R. Never, ever forget. Paladin Jan 2015 #13
And Again... WillyT Jan 2015 #16
knr Douglas Carpenter Jan 2015 #17
I watched it. It will stay with you forever. babydollhead Jan 2015 #18
Thanks for posting. I don't have cable so don't get HBO (where the movie KingCharlemagne Jan 2015 #19
I'm sure it will show up somewhere after the initial airing. zappaman Jan 2015 #20
If you have not already seen it, I would also recommend French director Alain Resnais' KingCharlemagne Jan 2015 #22
Oh wow yeah. zappaman Jan 2015 #23
I saw that almost 50 years ago in high school. It is still with me. DamnYankeeInHouston Jan 2015 #49
Link Action_Patrol Jan 2015 #25
Thank you for the link! n/t RKP5637 Jan 2015 #26
Thanks! zappaman Jan 2015 #27
Thanks for this. Bookmarking for viewing tomorrow. - nt KingCharlemagne Jan 2015 #28
Thank you. The whole time I 840high Jan 2015 #33
Thanks for the link CountAllVotes Jan 2015 #53
Thank you. Bobbie Jo Jan 2015 #57
I suspect this link won't be viewable outside the UK, but here's the Channel 4 page for the new one muriel_volestrangler Jan 2015 #60
Much obliged. Will try to take a look later today (Firefox is acting hinky with it right now) - nt KingCharlemagne Jan 2015 #62
Senator Prescott Bush (R-CT) had financial dealings w/Nazi bankers. Hope that film escapes the vault blkmusclmachine Jan 2015 #31
What film is that? N/t zappaman Jan 2015 #32
In 1958 when I was 8 years old and was living in Munich hobbit709 Jan 2015 #40
A very graphic documentary - on TV in late '60's bread_and_roses Jan 2015 #43
If you google Ohrdruf Concentration Camp JustAnotherGen Jan 2015 #51
You continue to astound me in the straightforwardness of your remarks. Behind the Aegis Jan 2015 #54
I saw above you asked - how could people challenge it - the existence JustAnotherGen Jan 2015 #58
Anything to do with the Holocaust to this day still make me cry. William769 Jan 2015 #65
I have no doubt it will be a tough watch. n/t zappaman Jan 2015 #66
Kick since this airs tonight on HBO. n/t zappaman Jan 2015 #67

annabanana

(52,791 posts)
3. My father was in a detail that was first in
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 05:42 PM
Jan 2015

to one of the camps. That is all he ever told us about it. I know he would leave the room whenever a documentary we were watching touched on it.

MarianJack

(10,237 posts)
7. My uncle also
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 07:03 PM
Jan 2015

He was the top Sgt. of his outfit. Many of his men had approached him asking if they could just shoot any of the German soldiers they'd captured. He explained to them that they don't defeat Nazis by becoming Nazis, that the American GIs were among the good guys in that war and that it would terrify the Jewish inmates if they did start shooting Germans. What he did NOT tell them was that it was all he could do to not put HIS Thompson on single fire and shoot every German he saw.

PEACE!

Dyedinthewoolliberal

(15,546 posts)
15. That reminds me of the scene in the 'Big Red One"
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 08:01 PM
Jan 2015

toward the end where they liberate a camp and one of the guys loses it and shoots a German soldier about 10 times. The shots echo through the scene as there are 4-5 seconds between each one. Very chilling.........

MarianJack

(10,237 posts)
24. Yes, a very under rated movei.
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 11:05 PM
Jan 2015

If I recall, I think that soldier is a pretty Star Wars Mark Hammill.

BTW, my uncle lived until the mid 90s. I often heard men who'd served with him (many of whom lived in the same neighborhood) address him as "Top" even 40+ years after the war. For many reasons, he was a great man!

PEACE!

 

ChosenUnWisely

(588 posts)
41. All of Samuel Fullers movies are like that, very realistic, the Big Red One was based on
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 07:37 AM
Jan 2015

his experiences in the Army and yes he did liberate a concentration camp as did participate in all the battles in the movie.

IMHO his best war movie was 'The Steel Helmet'.

His most interesting movie, which was banned, was 'White Dog'.

For those who are interested check out the documentary 'The Typewriter, the Rifle & the Movie Camera' by Quentin Tarantino, it documents his life and his influence on him, Tarantino, and many others in film, which may surprise some who are not familiar with Fuller.



chervilant

(8,267 posts)
45. If you haven't already done so,
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 11:22 AM
Jan 2015

I recommend that you read The American Age, by Walter LaFeber. I took an elective in graduate school for which this book was the primary resource. I read the entire book the first weekend I had it, and I was so angry I had to put it down several times and march around my living room, raging at the hubris of the "policy makers" of this Nation of Bleak Hypocrisy we call the "United States" (and, so few of us get the irony...).

 

jtuck004

(15,882 posts)
42. "...they don't defeat Nazis by becoming Nazis," Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 09:51 AM
Jan 2015

Last edited Sun Jan 18, 2015, 12:08 PM - Edit history (1)

And in our case, apparently, sometimes when we don't forget it.

My neighbor, died recently at 90 something, was a paratrooper, several drops into Europe, fought in several battles. Broke his ankle and snuck out a window of the hospital when they tried to admit him, so he wouldn't have to leave his unit behind to fight. The battle he went to from there was the Bulge.

I remember him telling me that a fair number of enemy soldiers, and more than a few townspeople were shot in the highly emotional aftermath of those discoveries.

MarianJack

(10,237 posts)
44. I remember hearing this also...
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 10:55 AM
Jan 2015

...and my uncle REALLY wanted to shoot the Germans. His unit was made up of mostly neighborhood guys who'd newer seen Jewish people in their lives. They did, however, recognize inhuman horror when they saw it!

PEACE!

Behind the Aegis

(53,921 posts)
56. Many people, today, have never met a Jewish person.
Mon Jan 19, 2015, 02:30 AM
Jan 2015

I can't tell you the number of times I was someone's "first" (and not in the fun way!). Even after moving back to OK, I was 40, and I met this person at the pet store and we were chatting, and something came up about Christmas, and I said I was Jewish. "Oh, so you celebrate Jewish Christmas (Chanukah)." I briefly explained why it wasn't the Jewish Christmas. The conversation shortly after, "you don't look like a Jew."

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
61. My father, who is a survivor, explained that reality was different for those liberated by the
Sun Jan 25, 2015, 12:00 PM
Jan 2015

Russians. The Russians, who had suffered terribly as a country at the hands of the Nazis with 1/3rd plus of their country occupied and millions killed, were in no mood for playing the role of the nice guys. They gave the former inmates a few meals to give them some strength and then let them do as they pleased to their former captors.

Many Nazis who had been in charge only a few hours before were literally torn to pieces by the former inmates.

MarianJack

(10,237 posts)
63. iAwww,...
Sun Jan 25, 2015, 02:40 PM
Jan 2015

...poor Nazi bastards!

Where was your father? My great uncle Felix, who was my step-mother's uncle, was a survivor of (I think) Treblinka. I only met him once when I was 8. I remember the numbers tattooed on his forearm and how he would freeze up when he heard the police sirens. He lived in LA and their sirens sounded a lot like the ones that the Gestapo used. Almost 52 years later, the memory still chills me.

Thank you for sharing.

PEACE!

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
64. My father was mostly in camps around the Riga Lativa area, transported there from Hamburg
Sun Jan 25, 2015, 02:49 PM
Jan 2015

The stub for his testimony in the Spielberg project is here--> http://vhaonline.usc.edu/viewingPage.aspx?testimonyID=42543&returnIndex=3

It just requires a free registration

Tansy_Gold

(17,847 posts)
29. My dad also.
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 12:00 AM
Jan 2015

He wouldn't leave the room when it was on tv, but he would not talk about it. Not ever. In spring 1945 he was 19 years old.

agingdem

(7,805 posts)
34. My parents were
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 01:49 AM
Jan 2015

Holocaust survivors... my father lost his parents and two sisters...he and his 4 brothers survived..my mother was the sole survivor of her family of 6..every time a documentary was on television she would get as close as she could to the screen looking for her parents, sisters, and brothers...

olegramps

(8,200 posts)
50. One of my uncles, my Father' brother, was in Germany at the end.
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 01:47 PM
Jan 2015

He said that the rarest thing to find in Germany after the war was anyone who claimed to have been a Nazi. When asked about what they thought happened to all the Jews they must have seen herded into cattle cars, not one acknowledged that it happened. They were in complete denial of how they sanctioned it by their silence. It is a complete fabrication that anti-Semitics were restricted to Germany. Many people as a result of centuries of hatred spread by Christians and demagogues had been instilled with prejudice in regard to Jews.

zappaman

(20,606 posts)
5. I've been on a Hitchcock marathon of late
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 06:53 PM
Jan 2015

And had never heard of this.
Will have to watch it although it likely won't be easy.

randr

(12,409 posts)
6. There is only one reason some deny the holocaust
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 06:58 PM
Jan 2015

That is because, given the chance, they would do the same.

busterbrown

(8,515 posts)
14. A Hard fucking reality....Agreed
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 07:54 PM
Jan 2015

Many in this country would gladly play this horrendous terrifying game..

I really believe that..

Enthusiast

(50,983 posts)
37. That is just a fact.
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 02:27 AM
Jan 2015

The far right in this nation are as Nazi as the historical Nazis. No question about it. We better recognize this as a nation, and very soon.

MH1

(17,573 posts)
47. Not just this nation. It is terrible that they are among us, but realize that this level of
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 01:01 PM
Jan 2015

depravity, is not confined to one nation, race, or time.

We certainly need to resist it here. But what should we do when we see it occur in other countries? What determines if and when the U.S. and or the international community steps in?

There were people at the time who were against the U.S. entering WWII. Some people even today seem to think we should have taken a different course. Certainly not all the choices made by leaders of the US at that time were best - and in future situations they will not be either. But should we have not intervened at all? Should we have intervened sooner?

I'm just raising these points because these are questions that need to be answered, in terms of how we confront this kind of evil.

nxylas

(6,440 posts)
39. That's why I question the choice of Hitchcock as director
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 07:34 AM
Jan 2015

It seems to be handing ammunition to the Holocaust deniers to use a director who was primarily associated with fictional films rather than documentaries. It's not that big a deal, I'm sure that they would say that it was all done with special effects whoever had directed it. I just don't like the idea of making it easier for them.

zappaman

(20,606 posts)
52. The Holocaust revisionists and deniers have plenty of ammunition in their lunacy gun.
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 02:27 PM
Jan 2015

One more doesn't make that much of a difference to their addled beliefs.

Behind the Aegis

(53,921 posts)
55. You are spot on with that comment.
Mon Jan 19, 2015, 02:26 AM
Jan 2015

What is really frightening is the number of people who have never learned about the Holocaust, or even worse, never heard of it! More and more people are now challenging the veracity of the Holocaust, and it is increasing.

ananda

(28,835 posts)
10. Wow.
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 07:26 PM
Jan 2015

I have seen documentary footage of camp liberation, and it was harrowing
and horrifying.

I don't know who filmed it though.

 

KingCharlemagne

(7,908 posts)
19. Thanks for posting. I don't have cable so don't get HBO (where the movie
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 09:44 PM
Jan 2015

about Hitchcock's documentary will air later this month), but I hope at some point to see it. Will the Hitchcock documentary itself now also be released?

zappaman

(20,606 posts)
20. I'm sure it will show up somewhere after the initial airing.
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 10:02 PM
Jan 2015

I would love to see another documentary on Hitchcock.
The blu ray of NORTH BY NORTHWEST has an excellent one, but failed to mention this...

 

KingCharlemagne

(7,908 posts)
22. If you have not already seen it, I would also recommend French director Alain Resnais'
Sat Jan 17, 2015, 10:10 PM
Jan 2015

documentary Night and Fog (NIcht und Nebel). It's been quite awhile since I last saw it, but it has stayed with me all these years.

muriel_volestrangler

(101,271 posts)
60. I suspect this link won't be viewable outside the UK, but here's the Channel 4 page for the new one
Sun Jan 25, 2015, 11:53 AM
Jan 2015

(ie 'Night Will Fall', the new documentary which tells the story of the other one, with some clips, and present-day interviews with survivors and soldiers):

http://www.channel4.com/programmes/holocaust-night-will-fall/on-demand

hobbit709

(41,694 posts)
40. In 1958 when I was 8 years old and was living in Munich
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 07:35 AM
Jan 2015

we went to Dachau. I was too young to understand what all had happened there but there was a feel about the place that set me on edge.

bread_and_roses

(6,335 posts)
43. A very graphic documentary - on TV in late '60's
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 10:52 AM
Jan 2015

I saw a very graphic documentary on the Concentration Camps in late '60's - possibly '70 - just know I was in my very late teens. It was on television - my mother, brother and I watched it.

It was very graphic documentary footage - the piles of bodies, living skeletons ... by the end we were all just shaking - it was devastating. I have no idea its title or anything else about it. But watching it was on of the experiences that have informed and shaped my worldview, my politics & economics, my understanding of humanity ever since.

JustAnotherGen

(31,781 posts)
51. If you google Ohrdruf Concentration Camp
Sun Jan 18, 2015, 02:02 PM
Jan 2015

You can see my mom's dad in pics with Eisenhower.

He didn't hesitate to take his teenage daughter and wife to the March on Washington.

He didn't blink an eye when my mom brought my dad home - all he saw was glorious Army Green.

He then warned my Green Beret dad - there will come a day when you become a pacifist.


He was right about a lot of things after Ohrdruf.

JustAnotherGen

(31,781 posts)
58. I saw above you asked - how could people challenge it - the existence
Mon Jan 19, 2015, 05:56 AM
Jan 2015




How could they?


That's Ohrdruf. To the far right of the gallows is a reporter for The Stars and Stripes. To the left of Eisehower I can see someone who loved me very much. You don't see his gun - in that picture - but his job was to protect Dwight.

Even when confronted with what they had done - the people denied it. You will never see the long shot pictures of the citizens bring marched through the camp. The ones with American soldiers pointing guns at them.

15/20 years later one of the young men in that picture would come to view his own country as capable of that - in particular to black Americans. It could happen here - it could happen anywhere. Cambodia, the Kurds, Kosovo, Rwanda, Sudan . . . Who's next? And those are just since the very very REAL holocaust. That's not including the decimation of the Native population in the Western Hemisphere.
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