How did England get moved so far to the right?

[brentspeak]

It's understandable why Scotland wants to get the hell away from conservative English politicians. Yet another a$$hat Tory is the Prime Minister. Today's Labour party is like the DLC. You would think that after Margaret Thatcher took a wrecking ball to the UK, they'd say 'never again' to the right-wing. But it keeps going -- kind of like how we here in the US keep electing Republicans and corporate Democrats to screw us over and over again.

[House of Roberts]

1. Because

hanging on in quiet desperation is the English way.

[Skittles]

14. run rabbit run

[LittleBlue]

2. Labour is finished if Yes wins today

UKIP might actually emerge as the party in power. And it might do that even if the union is preserved. Which is an astonishing rightward shift.

Why? Because New Labour failed. It pushed wars and didn't defend the working class properly. New Labour was a proponent of neoliberal economic and trade policy.

[hifiguy]

8. Thatcherism-lite combined with truckling to The Little Chimp.

Just like the DLC's version of the Democratic Party. Dumbasses.

[LittleBlue]

13. Yep. Which is depressing

We are rarely beaten. Usually we beat ourselves.

[muriel_volestrangler]

16. No, UKIP will not be the party in power

http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/blog/archives/8986

Latest UK-wide poll: CON 33%(+2), LAB 35%(-3), LDEM 10%(-2), UKIP 9%(-1), GRN 7%(+3) (changes from a month earlier)
or: http://ukpollingreport.co.uk/blog/archives/8985
CON 33%, LAB 33%, LDEM 9%, UKIP 14%, GRN 6%
CON 34%, LAB 35%, LDEM 9%, UKIP 13%, GRN 3%

[whatthehey]

34. They won't, but will be different from that

These are UK wide data. England is roughly 10 times the population of Scotland so won't be hugely different but will shift. About half the "other" 8% is SNP which we can assume will almost entirely go with Scotland. That UKIP bloc is LIKELY (haven't seen data would like to if anyone can find it) mostly England so will grow a bit even with no more shifts. But the big shift will be Lab-Con. 40 of Lab's 257 MPs are in Scotland - far higher than population ratio. A Scotland-less UK may very well embolden English rightwingers to vote their true feelings rather than support the (to them) wishy-washy Conservatives once Labour is no serious electoral threat, much like Greens in CA have less qualms about risking a Rep takeover. That won't push UKIP to 326 any time soon but I can certainly see them getting seats.

[muriel_volestrangler]

36. They may get some seats (they'll get the Clacton by-election next month, almost certainly)

but if they are emboldened, that will split the right wing vote. UKIP candidates are almost all profoundly damaged human beings, who look ridiculous under scrutiny - the kind of people you just can't trust to run anything. I think their best chances will be with a few refugees from the Tories.

It now looks very unlikely that independence will happen (YouGov have released an internet poll they did with 1800 people who had voted, and reckon 54% No, 46% Yes), so it doesn't look like Labour has to worry about a mass loss of MPs after all. The Tories and UKIP would have to go into a formal election coalition, agreeing not to stand against each other, to counter Labour, and I don't think that will happen.

[mmonk]

3. Thatcher.

[Peregrine]

4. Immigration

US is not the only country where the right cries about an immigration crisis. Most of Europe does as well. US doesn't have a monopoly on racism. One of the major Tory drum beats is the rapidly increasing Muslim population, which includes a substantial group of radicalized Islamists.

Tories peddle fear, fear, fear just as much as the Republicans.

[snooper2]

7. Bingo, And the fucking fundies aren't helping anything - Xtians and Muslims alike

Over the last year a quasi-religious turf war has sprung up on the streets of London. Young radicalised Muslim patrols are enforcing Shariah law in the capital. In reaction, far right Christian Patrols are also taking the law into their own hands.

Since the Woolwich killing, anti-Muslim rhetoric as been at an all time high, and the right-wing Christian Patrols are only exacerbating the rising tensions.

These two marginalised but potentially dangerous London subcultures believe that society has failed their communities enough that they are now taking to the streets to implement or defend their ways of life, according to their opposing politicised and religious ideologies.

The irony being that while their shared aggressive approach has resulted in media coverage and media panic, they ultimately are responsible for and justify each other's existence.

Alex Miller meets the leaders and footsoldiers in Britain's holy street patrols, the Anjem Choudary's followers Muslim Patrol and Paul Golding of Britain First's Christian Patrol, in the same area he lives and works, to find out just how effective their operations are, and how genuine their belief is in the battle for East London's streets.

Anjem Choudary wants to turn Buckingham Palace into a mosque, impose Sharia law in the UK, and destroy the porn, gambling, and alcohol industries.

[hifiguy]

9. If that's what you want

then go the fuck home, Choudary. "When in Rome do as the Romans do" remains sage advice.

[CJCRANE]

15. IMO the divisions are deliberately nurtured.

It's something you find with conservative policies everywhere: they exacerbate the problems they pretend to be fighting against.

Keep the people divided and fighting each other and they get distracted from the 1%ers ripping them off.

Choudary looks like a classic example of protected opposition to me.

[DFW]

23. In much of Europe, it's like that

The left has inadvertently (I hope) given the radical right a free ride in the name of "tolerance" for the views of immigrants, even when those views are loudly expressed by a tiny oppressive minority, and nurture fear and flight to the radical right. It doesn't matter how few the really dangerous ones are. If there is just one nasty incident or some big demonstration calling for violence and the TV cameras are there, the far right gets a free recruitment commercial. In England, where a whole town closed its eyes to a Pakistani-run ring of rapists of very young girls who profited when it finally came to light? Hint--not the British Left.

This is the European version of Cheneybush milking 9/11 for Republican votes, saying we needed them to protect us from terrrrists, therefore "shut up and let us invade Iraq," never mind that one had nothing to do with the other. At first, it worked for them, too. Later on the nation woke up, but Halliburton and friends had run off with the cash by then, so what did they care?

[muriel_volestrangler]

19. Worth pointing out that no-one is 'enforcing Shariah law in the capital'

There are a few youths going around, shouting at people in the street. That is not 'enforcing' anything, whether they're Muslim or Christian. It's a small religious gang movement - but they're not armed. They are insignificant.

Choudary is, foremost, a parasite - he says the most outrageous thing possible, to get publicity, and, he hopes, some money from a nutter with more money than sense. You can look him up on DU, for the publicity stunts he's pulled in the past. It's possible he does believe what he says, but he's no more representative of Muslims than the Westboro Baptist Church of Christians.

[Dawson Leery]

10. The English countryside needs immigrants and development.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/8686049/English-countryside-under-threat.html

That is the only way to civilize them.

[KamaAina]

18. "Civilize them?"

[ChisolmTrailDem]

21. I believe the same phenomenon is occurring in Australia. A lot of racism agianst Asians there. nt

[Quayblue]

41. +1

[sibelian]

5. Triangulation.

There's a hardcore of immovable right wing in the South of England. Labour needs to chip away at them to get in. It'll get worse with Scottish independence.

[Nye Bevan]

6. The UK is governed by a coalition of the Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats. (nt)

[msongs]

11. it moving so far to the right is good for American democrats its good enuff for the brits nt

[Iggo]

12. Same as we did? War without end?

[n2doc]

17. ...

[muriel_volestrangler]

22. Hah - Murdoch supports Scottish independence

or was doing so, until the polls looked like they wouldn't go to 'Yes' after all:

Scottish independence: Rupert Murdoch could play kingmaker with 'Scottish Sun' leaning Yes
All eyes on Rupert Murdoch over the Sun's Scottish independence stance
Will he, won't he back Yes? Rupert Murdoch tours Scotland
Scottish independence: Sun pushes back Page 3 for Yes ad
Scottish independence: Murdoch and the Sun pull back from backing yes vote

Alex Salmond hails ‘remarkable’ Rupert Murdoch

[n2doc]

24. Divide and Conquer n/t

[Cleita]

25. I'm sure there is something in it for him.

That Orc doesn't give a fig about the Scots.

[MohRokTah]

28. It would give the Tories control for decades.

Scotland keeps the UK moved leftward. Without Scotland, the Tories will rule supreme.

[Cleita]

33. But why would Murdoch care about Tories?

Supposedly he's an American citizen.

[MohRokTah]

35. He wants global domination by the right. eom

[Cleita]

20. Rupert Murdoch?

Just a guess, but since much of our move to the right has a lot to do with Fox News here, I think, in spite of his fall from grace in the UK, he had and probably still has a lot of influence in the RW propaganda spread ther.

[MohRokTah]

26. If you think it's bad now, wait and see what happens if Scotland votes for independence!

Right now, the Tories need the Liberal Democrats for a coalition government.

If Scotland votes for Independence, the Tories will control the government for the next two generations with no need for a coalition.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

27. for the same reason as this country, racism. nt

[Major Hogwash]

29. Two words -- Tony Blair

Bush's lap dog.

[intaglio]

30. The reason for england being right wing 4 words

Anthony Charles Lynton Blair

[JI7]

31. you think Gordon Brown was like the DLC ?

[JI7]

32. Republicans in the US would get more support if they were more like the Tories

[Feral Child]

37. They're our colony

and do our bidding.

[mr blur]

38. Thatcher. Blair. Murdoch.

Thatcher was an evil hag who sold into private hands various public services and a lot of social housing. Blair was never a left-winger. I remember when he stood for leadership of the Labour Party, those of us who didn't vote for him know he was a "Tory In A Red Tie". And, lurking behind every government from Thatcher onwards: Rupert Murdoch.

In return for the support of his trashy tabloid newspapers (and The Times) and Sky, he obtained certain...indulgences from Labour and Tory governments - we were kept out of the Euro for example because Blair was reminded that Rupert wasn't in favour of it. Gordon Brown was told that Rupert was in favour of free-market activity and lo and behold, bits of the NHS went out to private services. If you think I'm making this up, I recommend "Hack Attack: How the truth caught up with Rupert Murdoch" by Nick Davies.

This country's for sale and the right-wingers have the money.

[sadoldgirl]

39. Thatcher and Reagan

did it for both countries. Murdoch just used both situations.

[DeadLetterOffice]

40. "moved" implies it didn't used to be right-leany

I know little about English political history before Thatcher -- did it in fact used to be less right-leany?

[JI7]

43. maybe we can ask all the people from all those countries they owned

[Zorra]

42. The same way the US did. The 1% bought the media and the government. nt