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Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:12 PM

Before we get too wrapped up in this Ann Romney flap...

...it might be worth thinking about what my mom, and a lot of moms, probably believe for good reason:

Being a mother is incredibly hard work that lasts a lifetime. There is no retirement age.

After all the crap dumped on women by the GOP over the last few months (years/decades/generations), jumping on this train also strikes me as a particularly bad idea.

Rosen has apologized for her remarks. Might be for the best if we all drop this subject and get back to the real work at hand.

(/2 cents)

44 replies, 3881 views

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Arrow 44 replies Author Time Post
Reply Before we get too wrapped up in this Ann Romney flap... (Original post)
WilliamPitt Apr 2012 OP
Bluerthanblue Apr 2012 #1
Raven Apr 2012 #2
bigtree Apr 2012 #3
katsy Apr 2012 #4
Johonny Apr 2012 #8
angel823 Apr 2012 #11
EFerrari Apr 2012 #5
sinkingfeeling Apr 2012 #6
Ship of Fools Apr 2012 #44
jwirr Apr 2012 #7
Champion Jack Apr 2012 #9
WCGreen Apr 2012 #10
LanternWaste Apr 2012 #12
One of the 99 Apr 2012 #13
SpencerShay Apr 2012 #14
WilliamPitt Apr 2012 #16
truebrit71 Apr 2012 #17
WilliamPitt Apr 2012 #18
truebrit71 Apr 2012 #35
truebrit71 Apr 2012 #15
opihimoimoi Apr 2012 #22
WilliamPitt Apr 2012 #23
truebrit71 Apr 2012 #37
The Magistrate Apr 2012 #19
WilliamPitt Apr 2012 #20
KharmaTrain Apr 2012 #21
Kaleva Apr 2012 #24
Demit Apr 2012 #25
JoePhilly Apr 2012 #42
spanone Apr 2012 #26
ctaylors6 Apr 2012 #27
ingac70 Apr 2012 #28
polichick Apr 2012 #29
Avalux Apr 2012 #30
sulphurdunn Apr 2012 #31
joeybee12 Apr 2012 #32
Marrah_G Apr 2012 #33
Proud Liberal Dem Apr 2012 #34
nadinbrzezinski Apr 2012 #36
surrealAmerican Apr 2012 #38
Typical NYC Lib Apr 2012 #39
Mimosa Apr 2012 #40
Canuckistanian Apr 2012 #41
eridani Apr 2012 #43

Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:22 PM

1. I agree Will

While Ann Romney's version of 'full time mother' is nothing like anyone I've ever met in terms of financial privlige and outside help-
Being a full-time parent isn't something I think we should denegrate, or de-value.

If one is fortunate enough to be able to make that choice, I fully support their decision.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:30 PM

2. I agree, Will, and I think the better

approach to take is to say to Republicans: We should strive to give all mothers and fathers in America the choice that Ann Romney had which was to stay home and raise their family.

Sad that Ann Romney didn't say something like that.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:31 PM

3. we?

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:32 PM

4. Okay. I agree.

But as a mom of 11 year old twins, let me vent for just one moment:

I would like to have an occasional maid to come in and clean my house. Especially after my kids and their friends have had vacation, which we spend here at home because of finances. That's a blast. The bloodshed devine (LOL).

I would love to drive my kids to every wonderful adventure/activity that will help them become worldly, well-rounded people (not to mention the fact it would keep them from mischief). My daughter so loves horses but who can afford such luxuries right now? Those wonderful activities aren't just great for the kids but also helps those lucky moms who can afford these hobbies.

I am okay with my lot in life. But no one, especially not ms. romney can tell me she worked hard too. No bloody way can she compare herself to me. And I'm speaking as someone who knows one of ms. romney's wealthy "stay-at-home mom" friends and these women do NOT over stress. They are NOT stay-at-home moms as most people imagine. They have $$concierges$$ for their kids.

Okay. I'll be nice from now on. As long as people don't compare ME as a "stay-at-home" mom with HER and all her people-in-waiting.

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Response to katsy (Reply #4)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:40 PM

8. I agree

I no way do I see this as a winner issue for the Romneys or the Democrats. I think most working moms and even families where the mom does not work understand the economic differences between themselves and Ann Romney. More to the point, a lot of women would argue if they had the economic support of Ann Romney they would have been able to work etc... The sound bite I have a job motherhood works well until you see all the working moms out there like for instance the first lady. Hey Hillary came out and clarified she wasn't knocking mothers and you know what in no way did I think she was. I got her point. I think most moms would too. If course it is a misstatement that is easy to spin and spin the right must because they go nothing.

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Response to katsy (Reply #4)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:45 PM

11. I'm with you Katsy

I too, agree with Will, but here's the thing - I am a single mother and I have all the mothering responsibilities that Anne Romney has, with no paid or unpaid assistance (spouse) at home, and I have a full-time job.

Wouldn't trade my lot with anyone, either, becaues I am lucky to have a good job - just thought it is worth mentioning since I know there are a lot of women in my position.

Rosen didn't do a great job making her point, but I do understanding the point she was trying to make.

Angel in Texas

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:33 PM

5. Good call. n/t

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:34 PM

6. I agree and fully believe that Rosen simply mis-spoke by leaving

out three words: 'outside the home'.

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Response to sinkingfeeling (Reply #6)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 07:07 AM

44. that's exactly what I thought, too, when I heard it..

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:39 PM

7. Rosen should have emphasised the point that as a stay at home mother Anne had a choice while

many of us do not. To me that is the point that counts.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:41 PM

9. Spot on ,as usual

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:44 PM

10. Spot On Will!!!!!

KR

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:47 PM

12. This particular brouhaha should have a very short shelf-life

This particular brouhaha should have a very short shelf-life-- Rosen, as you said, apologized, and her affiliation with Obama or the collective left is, at best indirect and minimal.

I shook the Magic Eight Ball and it came back with "by Monday, this will be forgotten..."

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:49 PM

13. To be fair

Rosen never said a word about Ann Romney's parenting. It was Ann Romney who put it in that context.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 03:49 PM

14. Spare Me.

 

Hillary Rosen's comment wasn't about stay-at-home moms, AT ALL. The point that Hillary Rosen was trying to make is that Ann Romney doesn't have a clue what about what the average struggling working-class woman has to deal with, especially in a bad economy. And, because of that, Ann Romney is not qualified to be a spokesperson for such matters. Ann Romney doesn't understand what it means to struggle financially, because she is rich, therefore, she is lucky that she had the choice to never have to earn a paycheck in her life. Spare me the, "being a mom is full-time job," bullshit.

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Response to SpencerShay (Reply #14)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 04:09 PM

16. Spare me the, "being a mom is full-time job," bullshit.

Wow.

Must have been a fun upbringing.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Reply #16)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 04:12 PM

17. Sorry Will, but do you REALLY think this women who married into tremendous wealth..

..was a "full-time mom" or do you think it is more likely that there were nannies and maids to help with the knitty-gritty..?

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Response to truebrit71 (Reply #17)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 04:15 PM

18. I think motherhood is about more than wiping mouths and changing diapers

And I'm more than willing to give a mother the benefit of the doubt.

I also think this is a shit issue for Democrats at a time when we have the GOP on the ropes over a variety of far more important women's issues than the question of how hard Ann Romney worked as a full-time mother.

Stoke your outrage as you will. I see this as a baited hook, and I'm not biting.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Reply #18)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 06:43 PM

35. "shit issue" or not, Hillary Rosen wasn't wrong...

...and she shouldn't have apologized...

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 04:00 PM

15. 1) Rosen shouldn't have apologized because she was 100% spot on..and 2)

Anne Rmoney is welcome to kiss either or both of my butt cheeks with her "I chose to be a stay-at-home mom" bullshit...

That was Rosen's entire point...Mrs Rmoney HASN'T had a real job, and therefore has NO FUCKING CLUE what working mothers have to go through...

She is a spoiled, rich b*tch and nothing more...Jeebus Aitch on a bike, even Lt AWOL's wife worked as a librarian at one point in her life...

Anne Rmoney had a CHOICE about whether she had a job or not, for the vast majority of mothers in this country, there is no choice other than work or starve...

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Response to truebrit71 (Reply #15)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 04:40 PM

22. + 10000 :o)

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Response to truebrit71 (Reply #15)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 04:42 PM

23. Not to turn into a Help & Meta clown, but...

"b*tch" is still obnoxious and unnecessary even with the asterisk.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Reply #23)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 06:47 PM

37. ..hmmmm

...i think it's neither, but I'd rather discuss the topic, yes?

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 04:15 PM

19. But Let Us Be Clear, Sir: As Everyone Habitually Uses The Word, She Has Not Worked a Day In Her Life

She has not answered to a boss with a paycheck on the line; she has not sweated to get on time to a place she would far rather not be because it had to be done to pay the rent and feed the kids; she has never sweated out the time till a break lets you sit down or use the toilet: She has never worked a day in her life, she knows NOTHING!!!!

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Response to The Magistrate (Reply #19)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 04:17 PM

20. See post #18

and cheers to you, sir.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 04:27 PM

21. Rosen Walked Into A Trap...

Willard has been hiding under Mrs. Rmoney's skirt for a while and I know there are Democratic women chomping to get at her but this wasn't the way to do it. The fact we saw such a quick shitstorm happen shows that the rushpublicans were ready for someone to take a bite at the Mrs. and Rosen took the bait.

The questions that should be asked are about how many "domestics" does she employ or has she. Find out if she knows that's the price of a gallon of milk...questions a "working mom" always knows. Parenting is a full time job...and its a political loser to diminish that this lady did raise 5 sons...but I think it's fair game to find out how she raised them.

Eventually Mittens has to come out from under the Mrs. skirt...we shouldn't give him any reason to keep hiding there. C'mon Willard...put on the man pants!

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 04:43 PM

24. I agree. I think it'd be a loser of an issue to fight on.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 05:04 PM

25. If being a mother is incredibly hard work, imagine what it's like to be a mother in the workforce.

The Republicans are misrepresenting what Rosen said. Deliberately misunderstanding the context, seizing on a sentence out of context & distorting its meaning. It sounds like you are buying into it, WilliamPitt.

Ann Romney never had to pull down a paycheck. Never. Rosen was right to point out that she couldn't possibly know what it's like.

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Response to Demit (Reply #25)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 09:19 PM

42. That's the correct angle to take.

Plus, lots of women would love to have the choice to stay home. But they can't, their family needs 2 pay checks.

And with the GP plans to kills Social Security, and Medicare ... you have to wonder how a 65 year old woman who was a stay at home mom survives in the GOP wonderland of the future.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 05:05 PM

26. k&r...

rosen gave them a gift. stupidly.

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Response to spanone (Reply #26)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 05:24 PM

27. +1

There are a million ways she could have responded that would have not been inflammatory at all. Pointed out that ann romney doesn't understand economic struggle. To me, this was a big honking gaffe.

It's an election year, and there's just no upside to saying that a full-time homemaker hasn't "worked" a day in her life. Anyone who already wouldn't vote for Mitt because of his wealth won't change his/her mind with this discussion. And comments like this may generate sympathy or some other kind of warm feeling for Ann and/or Mitt. It may turn out those uber conservative "traditional value" who weren't too happy about Mitt, who they perceive as not conservative enough.

While one could agree with Hilary Rosen's major underlying point, her choice of words was just a big huge error IMHO

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 05:25 PM

28. Hilary Rosen is wrong -

Ann Romney can totally relate to all working women with five homes and a huge staff of servants.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 05:32 PM

29. I'm torn: stay-at-home parenting IS a job, AND not many parents...

...have that choice anymore.

Maybe it would be best to acknowledge the importance of parenting while pointing out that Republican policies have taken the stay-at-home option away for most mothers and fathers.


Edited so as not to sound sexist.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 05:35 PM

30. The argument is not whether or not being a stay at home mom is hard work.

It's having an incredibly wealthy stay at home mom declare she made a choice, and failing to understand most of us don't have a choice.

Yes, being a stay at home mom is hard work, but its harder being a single mom working outside of the home, taking care of children and worrying about making ends meet from one paycheck to the next.

I never had a choice and I've had to do it all myself. Forgive me if I can't quite forgive Ann for being so callous.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 05:48 PM

31. Conservatives in general

and republicans in particular have always ridiculed the proposition that staying home to raise children is an economic activity. Therefore, the statement that Ms. Romney has never worked a day in her life is accurate according to conservative definitions of what constitutes "work," and Ms. Romney is either naive or disingenuous. Regardless, Ms. Rosen's statement is, by republican definition, accurate. She should not have been pressured to apologize for speaking truth to hypocrisy. I hope this is not a continuation of the Democratic Party's trend of making apologies for having hit amoral hypocrites like the Romneys and their lackeys with pillows.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 05:49 PM

32. I think you could argue Ann Romney didn't even do work raising her kids BUT

It's a no-win situation in politics because arguments don't matter, sound bites do.

And by not doing work, I mean the maids and nannys did it all for her.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 05:52 PM

33. you might be right

because I don't have much to say about Mrs. Mittens that doesn't involve cuss words and shooting laser beams out of my eyes.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 06:01 PM

34. Faux outrage from the Republicans

is as certain as the sun rising every day. I heard about this last night and figured that it would be all over the news today and the Republicans and their allies would be in full-blown "outrage" mode all day long. I am owed a Coke. That being said, in regards to the OP, you are exactly correct. The Republicans knew they fumbled badly yesterday and jumped all over Rosen's comment for an attempted recovery. It will, however, by no means change the Republican war on caterpillars.....er.....women. Rosen's comments won't suddenly erase the existence of reams of legislation nationwide attacking abortion rights, birth control, Planned Parenthood, and everything else that they are doing to humiliate women, etc. Plus, now that Ann Romney is out there saying that she believes in "freedom of choice" for women, we can now expect her and/or the Romney campaign to have to repudiate every piece of anti-choice legislation that pops up wherever instigated by Republicans.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 06:44 PM

36. Agreed

Why I have not said a damn thing about it

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 07:19 PM

38. I think the point here is that ...

... for her, staying at home was not a trade off. It did not mean what it does for a middle-class family: a smaller house, less expensive food, fewer or no vacations, no help with cleaning or babysitting, no private schools, second-hand clothes, etc.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 07:24 PM

39. Right on

 

Rec

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 08:31 PM

40. Thanks for the good sense.

Pitt, I think some of the youngsters don't realise two of the best first ladies, Eleanor Roosevelt and Jacqueline Kennedy, also enjoyed the ease of wealth.

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Thu Apr 12, 2012, 09:13 PM

41. I didn't see the traction in it

And it's best not to go there.

Make the GOP the anti-woman party (because they are).

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Response to WilliamPitt (Original post)

Fri Apr 13, 2012, 05:19 AM

43. Ordering maids and nannies around is neither work, nor being a mother n/t

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