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Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:24 PM

For The Record: Snowden Gave Classified US Intel to the Chinese. It is a fact.

Ever since this first happened I have gotten the "oh yeah, prove it" response from the Snowdenistas whenever I mentioned it. I got tired of posting it for every low information (that didn't validate their point of view) DUr that claimed I was making shit up. Apparently I have only one more free visit to the paper's site and people are STILL going "oh yeah prove it." So instead of posting it individually for everyone who's google button broke off:

EXCLUSIVE: NSA targeted China's Tsinghua University in extensive hacking attacks, says Snowden

Tsinghua University, widely regarded as the mainland’s top education and research institute, was the target of extensive hacking by US spies this year
Tsinghua University in Beijing, widely regarded as the mainland’s top education and research institute, was the target of extensive hacking by US spies this year, according to information leaked by Edward Snowden.

It is not known how many times the prestigious university has been attacked by the NSA but details shown to the Post by Snowden reveal that one of the most recent breaches was this January.

The information also showed that the attacks on Tsinghua University were intensive and concerted efforts. In one single day of January, at least 63 computers and servers in Tsinghua University have been hacked by the NSA.

http://www.scmp.com/news/china/article/1266892/exclusive-nsa-targeted-chinas-tsinghua-university-extensive-hacking?page=all

There it is. Snowden went to China and gave a Chinese newspaper the individual servers the US is hacking in China.

202 replies, 5401 views

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Arrow 202 replies Author Time Post
Reply For The Record: Snowden Gave Classified US Intel to the Chinese. It is a fact. (Original post)
arely staircase Apr 2014 OP
Tarheel_Dem Apr 2014 #1
arely staircase Apr 2014 #3
Tarheel_Dem Apr 2014 #41
BillZBubb Apr 2014 #127
elias7 Apr 2014 #131
Tarheel_Dem Apr 2014 #163
Ikonoklast Apr 2014 #200
billhicks76 Apr 2014 #48
840high Apr 2014 #72
reACTIONary Apr 2014 #112
BillZBubb Apr 2014 #114
reACTIONary Apr 2014 #118
GoneFishin Apr 2014 #141
reACTIONary Apr 2014 #144
GoneFishin Apr 2014 #154
billhicks76 Apr 2014 #126
reACTIONary Apr 2014 #135
billhicks76 Apr 2014 #138
reACTIONary Apr 2014 #152
BillZBubb Apr 2014 #113
reACTIONary Apr 2014 #128
BillZBubb Apr 2014 #132
reACTIONary Apr 2014 #143
billhicks76 Apr 2014 #129
BillZBubb Apr 2014 #134
billhicks76 Apr 2014 #137
billhicks76 Apr 2014 #142
jazzimov Apr 2014 #196
billhicks76 Apr 2014 #199
Tarheel_Dem Apr 2014 #162
billhicks76 Apr 2014 #169
Scootaloo Apr 2014 #179
Cha Apr 2014 #136
billhicks76 Apr 2014 #168
sheshe2 Apr 2014 #201
oldhippie Apr 2014 #202
Cali_Democrat Apr 2014 #2
arely staircase Apr 2014 #4
flamingdem Apr 2014 #102
reACTIONary Apr 2014 #116
grasswire Apr 2014 #5
arely staircase Apr 2014 #8
pnwmom Apr 2014 #11
arely staircase Apr 2014 #14
grasswire Apr 2014 #17
pnwmom Apr 2014 #20
Aerows Apr 2014 #73
Aerows Apr 2014 #33
closeupready Apr 2014 #49
Aerows Apr 2014 #174
closeupready Apr 2014 #194
Aerows Apr 2014 #195
truedelphi Apr 2014 #6
MohRokTah Apr 2014 #7
Aerows Apr 2014 #34
MohRokTah Apr 2014 #38
Aerows Apr 2014 #42
MohRokTah Apr 2014 #43
Aerows Apr 2014 #67
MohRokTah Apr 2014 #75
Aerows Apr 2014 #77
MohRokTah Apr 2014 #81
SunSeeker Apr 2014 #120
Number23 Apr 2014 #171
SunSeeker Apr 2014 #186
DisgustipatedinCA Apr 2014 #172
Aerows Apr 2014 #177
treestar Apr 2014 #71
arely staircase Apr 2014 #10
treestar Apr 2014 #68
SidDithers Apr 2014 #9
Peacetrain Apr 2014 #12
pnwmom Apr 2014 #13
bvar22 Apr 2014 #15
arely staircase Apr 2014 #16
bvar22 Apr 2014 #18
msanthrope Apr 2014 #24
Otelo Apr 2014 #40
SidDithers Apr 2014 #99
arely staircase Apr 2014 #21
bvar22 Apr 2014 #25
arely staircase Apr 2014 #27
elias49 Apr 2014 #63
bvar22 Apr 2014 #76
arely staircase Apr 2014 #185
Soylent Brice Apr 2014 #46
Logical Apr 2014 #101
Mojorabbit Apr 2014 #155
arely staircase Apr 2014 #158
Mojorabbit Apr 2014 #159
arely staircase Apr 2014 #160
msanthrope Apr 2014 #19
TheKentuckian Apr 2014 #197
msanthrope Apr 2014 #198
Aerows Apr 2014 #36
Otelo Apr 2014 #22
Helen Borg Apr 2014 #23
arely staircase Apr 2014 #26
on point Apr 2014 #28
arely staircase Apr 2014 #29
Soylent Brice Apr 2014 #30
arely staircase Apr 2014 #31
Hekate Apr 2014 #35
arely staircase Apr 2014 #58
elias49 Apr 2014 #70
Control-Z Apr 2014 #150
bravenak Apr 2014 #181
Soylent Brice Apr 2014 #44
Hekate Apr 2014 #32
DeSwiss Apr 2014 #37
Vashta Nerada Apr 2014 #39
arely staircase Apr 2014 #51
marmar Apr 2014 #45
Soylent Brice Apr 2014 #47
bvar22 Apr 2014 #88
DisgustipatedinCA Apr 2014 #175
Thinkingabout Apr 2014 #50
Aerows Apr 2014 #52
Thinkingabout Apr 2014 #66
bowens43 Apr 2014 #53
AgingAmerican Apr 2014 #54
Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2014 #55
Aerows Apr 2014 #60
Sarah Ibarruri Apr 2014 #83
Aerows Apr 2014 #56
cantbeserious Apr 2014 #57
arely staircase Apr 2014 #59
cantbeserious Apr 2014 #61
arely staircase Apr 2014 #62
cantbeserious Apr 2014 #64
arely staircase Apr 2014 #69
cantbeserious Apr 2014 #79
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cantbeserious Apr 2014 #87
arely staircase Apr 2014 #90
cantbeserious Apr 2014 #95
arely staircase Apr 2014 #100
cantbeserious Apr 2014 #104
arely staircase Apr 2014 #105
cantbeserious Apr 2014 #106
GeorgeGist Apr 2014 #164
arely staircase Apr 2014 #167
treestar Apr 2014 #65
Hissyspit Apr 2014 #85
treestar Apr 2014 #94
BillZBubb Apr 2014 #125
treestar Apr 2014 #145
Sunlei Apr 2014 #74
arely staircase Apr 2014 #80
MohRokTah Apr 2014 #92
840high Apr 2014 #78
gratuitous Apr 2014 #84
Cha Apr 2014 #86
treestar Apr 2014 #96
jtuck004 Apr 2014 #89
harun Apr 2014 #91
arely staircase Apr 2014 #97
harun Apr 2014 #170
arely staircase Apr 2014 #184
closeupready Apr 2014 #192
Erich Bloodaxe BSN Apr 2014 #93
creeksneakers2 Apr 2014 #110
Drew Richards Apr 2014 #98
arely staircase Apr 2014 #103
Drew Richards Apr 2014 #107
arely staircase Apr 2014 #108
Drew Richards Apr 2014 #109
Drew Richards Apr 2014 #111
arely staircase Apr 2014 #119
Drew Richards Apr 2014 #123
arely staircase Apr 2014 #124
Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #115
arely staircase Apr 2014 #122
Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #133
treestar Apr 2014 #146
Democracyinkind Apr 2014 #151
SoapBox Apr 2014 #117
BillZBubb Apr 2014 #121
Drew Richards Apr 2014 #130
DisgustipatedinCA Apr 2014 #182
Drew Richards Apr 2014 #183
WHEN CRABS ROAR Apr 2014 #139
BillZBubb Apr 2014 #156
cthulu2016 Apr 2014 #140
Nobel_Twaddle_III Apr 2014 #147
arely staircase Apr 2014 #149
Tierra_y_Libertad Apr 2014 #148
elias49 Apr 2014 #153
BillZBubb Apr 2014 #157
arely staircase Apr 2014 #161
Fumesucker Apr 2014 #165
arely staircase Apr 2014 #166
Aerows Apr 2014 #173
gcomeau Apr 2014 #176
Aerows Apr 2014 #178
whatchamacallit Apr 2014 #180
Aerows Apr 2014 #187
arely staircase Apr 2014 #189
Aerows Apr 2014 #190
arely staircase Apr 2014 #193
LineReply K
Cha Apr 2014 #188
JEB Apr 2014 #191

Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:31 PM

1. Yes he did!

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #1)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:34 PM

3. Someone in another thread actually said this wasn't legit because it is

supposedly a Murdoch paper. I shit you not. It probably is, but Snowden gave them an interview! I guess they just made up all those quotes and Snowden never called bullshit on them because you know...

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #3)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:53 PM

41. They're peddling really hard these days because Comrade Snowie's approval sucks here.

And it continues to slide. The PR campaign, so far, is a BUST!

Huffpo: "Americans Might Not Support Edward Snowden, But They Support Disclosing Programs"

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/04/01/edward-snowden-support_n_5071938.html

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #41)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:23 PM

127. Another Tail Gunner Joe fan I see.

Nothing liking labeling someone "Comrade" to attack your target. Joe McCarthy would be proud.

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #41)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:27 PM

131. Comrade?

You know Russia is no longer a socialist state. Maybe you shouldn't date yourself.

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Response to elias7 (Reply #131)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 01:16 AM

163. Who the fuck knows what kind of state "The New Russia" is today?

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #163)

Tue Apr 29, 2014, 08:28 PM

200. Snowden should love it in modern Russia. Libertarian paradise.

If you get screwed by an Oligarch, it was your fault.

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #1)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:06 PM

48. Dumbest Thread Ever

And pathetic comments too. How about focusing on the real traitors instead of sucking up to the human filth that spy on and blackmail their own people.

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Response to billhicks76 (Reply #48)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:27 PM

72. ...^ that

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Response to billhicks76 (Reply #48)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:08 PM

112. I live in the Washington, DC area...

... in fact, not that very far from Ft. Meade. Not less than a few of the so called "human filth" you degenerate are among my friends and neighbors. Although I don't work in signals intelligence, a few of the folks I work with have in the past or have family members who do.

They are not traitors. They are not blackmailers. And when they do spy on American citizens it is done in accordance with due process and for good reason.

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Response to reACTIONary (Reply #112)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:11 PM

114. Your defense of the indefensible is laughable.

They are spying on Americans WITHOUT DUE PROCESS. The Snowden revelations clearly prove that. And the reasons the NSA put forth are NOT GOOD. They are BS.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #114)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:13 PM

118. Reasonable people may disagree...

... in fact, I'd go so far as to say reasonable people WOULD disagree.

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Response to reACTIONary (Reply #118)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:50 PM

141. Glad that you know some of the good guys. They are anecdotal though. Indefensible

activities are being paid for with our own tax dollars, and then lied about.

Glad to hear there are still some good, law abiding players though.

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Response to GoneFishin (Reply #141)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 09:00 PM

144. The activites of the NSA...

... are all authorized by law and are conducted under oversight from all three branches of government. The are not indefensible, rather, they are indispensable.

They are, of course, largely secret activities and thus they cannot be talked about and disclosed in the same frank manner that other government activities are. But secrecy is necessary.

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Response to reACTIONary (Reply #144)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 10:46 PM

154. Total nonsense. Been down that road. Agree to disagree. Good evening. nt

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Response to reACTIONary (Reply #112)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:22 PM

126. Not According To Russ Tice

Yes it's wrong of me to paint with such a broad brush, label an entire group or make such blanket statements. I've met good people in those agencies too. But there were also "good" people in the German government during the Nazi rise and many serial killers are quite polite. So what. The fact is many of these people have blood on their hands and feed a corrupt institution. Your arguments could be used to defend and deplorable government that spies on its own people. 911 was very effective in turning us into scared little sheep.

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Response to billhicks76 (Reply #126)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:33 PM

135. The United States government...

... is not Nazi Germany and my friends, I assure you, are neither serial killers nor war criminals. Corrupt institutions are made up of corrupt individuals, and that does not describe the more than a few people I have known who have worked for the NSA.

My argument certainly could be used to defend our government's signals intelligent programs, including those aspects that occasionally are used against American citizens for legitimate security purposes.

I don't go so far, however, as to claim that they are all quite polite. On the contrary, several of them have been known to be rude!

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Response to reACTIONary (Reply #135)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:41 PM

138. Was Just Speaking Hyperbolically To Make A Point

There are good people there though...you are correct. Snowden was one of them. So is Russ Tice who was fairly high level and said he was mostly asked to tap our politicians, journalists and judges phones and email to build dossiers on them for "leverage" purposes which is a nice way of saying blackmail.

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Response to billhicks76 (Reply #138)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 09:42 PM

152. Since you mentioned him twice...

... I pulled up the Russ Tice dossier. Looking it over, I was not impressed.

My opinion is that we should be careful about hyperbole on the inter-webz. It isn't always easy to recognize in that context, and there actually are people who will get carried away by it and end up believing it.

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Response to billhicks76 (Reply #48)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:08 PM

113. Right on the MONEY!

The apologists for the Government Snooping State blame the messenger and ignore the message.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #113)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:23 PM

128. Then again, some of them may be

... blaming the messenger FOR the message. He did, after all, undermine our national security.

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Response to reACTIONary (Reply #128)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:27 PM

132. What a laugh.

Snowden didn't undermine our national security. He embarrassed the national security apparatus. Too bad the government didn't treat him as a whistleblower from the start and forced him to reside in foreign lands.

BTW, your name seems to perfectly fit your politics.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #132)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:52 PM

143. Sez you...

... many others, some with the knowledge to asses the damage, would disagree. And have.

“Make no mistake: We are going to be dealing with the fallout from that for all of your careers, and the impact that that has had on our national security will reverberate for decades,” Michael Daniel, special assistant to the president for cyber security, told Naval Academy midshipmen. Snowden compromised sensitive “accesses” used by the National Security Agency to conduct electronic spying, along with “techniques and tools that are no longer available to us,” Daniel said, without elaborating.


BTW, my politics are liberal, democratic, and progressive. I just don't believe that democracy is a suicide pact.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #113)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:25 PM

129. Good Money In Defending NSA

Anyone need a job? NSA and military contractors are paying good money for online opinion "management". If you like to blog or comment online they are hiring. Paid for with your tax dollars.

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Response to billhicks76 (Reply #129)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:31 PM

134. You may have a good point.

I have to admit I am stumped at how people on a supposedly liberal site could fight so hard to kill the messenger rather than deal with the message.

Maybe some are paid to do so.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #134)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:36 PM

137. New York Times and The New Yorker

They already write about it. There is a cyber war going on and it's all about opinion management and propaganda. Stratfor, Carlyle Group, KBR and BoozeAllen are major players and they are subcontracted with OUR tax dollars. These people are borderline evil.

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Response to billhicks76 (Reply #129)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:50 PM

142. Good Report On Bill Moyers

Discussing anonymous online commenting and how negative comments give readers polarizing opinions even if they have no idea of the facts of an article. It makes sense for those being written about or the power structures they enjoy to pay people to influence those articles with predetermined comments. Corporations do it all the time when there are articles about their products. The military, intelligence agencies and federal law enforcement use these methods...usually subcontracted and outsourced.

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Response to billhicks76 (Reply #129)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 11:44 PM

196. Are you implying something? nt

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Response to jazzimov (Reply #196)

Tue Apr 29, 2014, 06:33 PM

199. Not With You But Yes It Exists Here Too

It's much like the phony online, sock-puppet profiles that the New York Times and The New Yorker exposed. They are run by paid military contractor employees outsourced by such agencies as the US military, NSA, republican PACs, corporations and foreign governments that want to improve their image and " MANAGE" public opinion. One person often manages up to 100 fake profiles a day, littering the web and news sites with its " comments". Even if this manager quits, gets fired or promoted the next manager steps in and resumes using those profiles which means even though they are fake they can have thousands of comments attributed to their name because they exist in cyberspace and never die or have their account terminated....they, in fact, usually have more comments in their historical profiles because they are quite active daily because it's a job to them. The worst offender is Strafor but firms like KBR, Booze Allen, and the old Blackwater are heavily engaged. HuffPost had commenters exposed but it's the price of having the gift if the internet I suppose. We just need to be educated, aware and vigilant. Anyone who can't face facts is being naive. This us the way the world works...when money is involved people and corporations do what's in their own interests.

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Response to billhicks76 (Reply #48)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 01:11 AM

162. It wasn't until you piped up.

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #162)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 08:58 PM

169. I don't use pipes

But the fact is NSA is a just a massive blackmail machine since 2002 against politicians, judges, generals and journalists. Read high level NSA analyst Russ Tice's interviews. There aren't enough terrorists to keep tem occupied anyway. As reported, the rest of their time is spent pursuing low level drug offenders for the DEA's Special Operations Division. The Drug War cash cow became unpopular with the people so they just rebranded it into the war on terror. There is a lot of money at stake in this mess which is why, as reported by the New York Times and New Yorker, these agencies are paying outsourced military contractors loads of money to blog and comment on sites like this with paid for, sockpuppet, fake profiles to "MANAGE" public opinion. That's why we need to keep up the good fight but also ignore the rabid ones out here that sound like they grew up in The FoxNews Womb.

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Response to billhicks76 (Reply #48)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:48 PM

179. Well, because to about seven very loud DU'ers...

It's only reason if it makes a Democrat look bad. everything else is a "divisive tactic" that we should "put behind us."

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #1)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:35 PM

136. Eddie also gave classified US intel to al qaeda..



More Snowden leaks - and this time Al Qaeda is the surveillance target (+video)

".. But what caught my eye in one of the unredacted slides was the mention of Al Qaeda in Iraq being a particular target of the NSA's efforts. The slide reads: "Visual Communicator – Free application that combines Instant Messaging, Photo-Messaging, and Push2Talk capabilities on a mobile platform. VC used on GPRS or 3G networks." The next five words were what the Times tried and failed to redact: "heavily used in AQI Mosul Network."

The aim as described in the documents is to target mobile phone apps that can give away a target's physical location. The utility of this in tracking terrorists hardly needs to be stated. The document describes a program focusing on clear security interests – Al Qaeda in Iraq, now calling itself Al Qaeda in Iraq and the Levant (ISIS) – killed thousands in Iraq during the US-led war there and continues to carry out suicide bombings and attacks on civilians there on a weekly basis. ISIS is also deeply involved in the civil war in Syria, and the groups ties to Al Qaeda make it an obvious security concern for the US.."


snip//

"..But his claim that "none of this has anything to do with terrorism" is not reasonable. That's pure nonsense -- as is his attempt to suggest that any revelations of eavesdropping techniques can't do any harm because terrorists already know all about it. Terrorists may know that the US is trying to spy on them as best it can (just as Germany and France know that). But knowing the precise method is another thing altogether."

MOre..
http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Security-Watch/Backchannels/2014/0130/More-Snowden-leaks-and-this-time-Al-Qaeda-is-the-surveillance-target-video

Never quite made it to Ecuador..

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Response to Cha (Reply #136)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 08:50 PM

168. Hahaha

You get paid for this crap? You belong on Faux News. I guess we have to put with disinfo like this when we talk negatively about the very computer adept NSA. I've seen your posts before and they are simply outrageous.

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Response to billhicks76 (Reply #168)

Tue Apr 29, 2014, 08:43 PM

201. So you just accused Cha of being a paid poster on DU? eom

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Response to sheshe2 (Reply #201)


Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:33 PM

2. Snowden says he's defending the constitution...

....yet lately he's only been revealing US espionage activities against other countries. These activities certainly are not unconstitutional. Intelligence agencies were setup for these activities.

As if China doesn't spy on the US....

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Response to Cali_Democrat (Reply #2)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:37 PM

4. and he has boxes in his garage!

just thought I'd get that one out of the way for them.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #4)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:49 PM

102. Yes, that and the Authoritareenz on DU are working for the Gubmint

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Response to flamingdem (Reply #102)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:11 PM

116. Worse than the Gubmint...

... the National Endowment for Democracy! They are the ones behind all those human rights film festivals in Ukraine!

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:44 PM

5. So you equate a right-wing newspaper with "the Chinese"?

Oh wait. You waffled.

"For the Record: Snowden Gave Classified U.S. Intel to the Chinese. It is a fact"

then...

"There it is. Snowden went to China and gave a Chinese newspaper the individual servers the US is hacking in China."

So you have copped to the second, and abandoned the first?

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Response to grasswire (Reply #5)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:50 PM

8. you have a good point

I doubt the Chinese government even read the Chinese newspaper in which Edward Snowden announced what Chinese government servers the NSA hacks - given when he was in China trying to get asylum from the Chinese government.

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Response to grasswire (Reply #5)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:53 PM

11. So the Chinese government people can't read the newspapers in their own country?

And it would never control them, right?

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #11)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:57 PM

14. well it was in English

and they probably weren't interested in what Snowden was saying even if any of them could read English.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #11)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:01 PM

17. whooosh

You missed the point.

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Response to grasswire (Reply #17)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:08 PM

20. No,I got your point. Just thought it was very naive. n/t

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #20)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:27 PM

73. Funny how the word "naive"

seems to substitute for "Not agreeing with your narrative anymore."

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Response to grasswire (Reply #5)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:39 PM

33. If there was a document

written in Sanskrit that tangentially allied Snowden with a cannibal tribe in a remote New Guinea mountain, it would be worthy of literary scholarship. "Snowden supports eating relatives" it would read.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #33)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:08 PM

49. But, of course. Beneficiaries of the military-industrial complex, fat from feasting

on all the lucrative government defense contracts, have deployed that attack strategy now for many moons. Not sure how effective it has been.

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Response to closeupready (Reply #49)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:40 PM

174. It has gotten so ridiculous

You just have to wonder.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #174)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 11:32 PM

194. I just think they are wasting their time here. This is a small website,

with habitues who are hardcore news junkies and liberals, not really mainstream people, and most people don't search google for links to discussions about current events. But you know, I guess as long as they are throwing their money away, I'm fine with righties trolling our boards, lol.

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Response to closeupready (Reply #194)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 11:37 PM

195. Since I have actually dedicated my time

in service to this tiny board, I'm sure I am deemed a "righty". How dare I question the establishment in DC! I'm OK with it, and I encourage them to bring it on.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:45 PM

6. And who exactly did this revelation harm?

That would be the more pertinent point.

It is hardly as if this revelation contained the USA's nuke launch codes, the way your headline makes it seem.

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Response to truedelphi (Reply #6)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:47 PM

7. I take it from your comment you are privy to all NSA and CIA operations globally.

Otherwise, you have no clue who may or may not hae been harmed by the release of the intel.

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Response to MohRokTah (Reply #7)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:42 PM

34. I take it from yours

You aren't, and are just providing the rah rah squad.

"Harmed by the release of this "intel" "

What you actually mean is "OMG someone might be politically harmed by this intel".

You have to be kidding me.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #34)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:45 PM

38. You're DAMNED straight I cheerlead the NSA spying on other nations. THAT'S THEIR JOB!

And operatives can be harmed by disclosure of international intelligence gathering. Once methods are disclosed, people get hurt.

Had Edward Snowden done nothing other than release the information about domestic surveillance, I'd cheerlead him. HE didn't. He crossed the fucking line and that makes him nothing less than a traitor.

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Response to MohRokTah (Reply #38)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:55 PM

42. MohRokTah

Would you like a bag of hair, sir, or you do prefer the box of rocks?

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Response to Aerows (Reply #42)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:55 PM

43. And now when left with no valid argument, you resort to ad hominems and baiting. eom

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Response to MohRokTah (Reply #43)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:25 PM

67. Would you like a transparent bag or a tranparent box? n/t

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Response to Aerows (Reply #67)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:28 PM

75. So you believe in a black and white world, like fundies?

NSA spying on Chinese = carrying out the purpose for their existence.

NSA spying on citizens domestically = unconstitutional

Snowden ratting out NSA spying on citizens domestically = good move, BRAVO.

Snowden revealing operational specifics on ongoing spying efforts directed at other nations = TREASON.

I can walk and chew bubblegum at the same time. Can you?

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Response to MohRokTah (Reply #75)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:30 PM

77. Please continue to profess

These Ideals of yours are amazing. I want to hear more.

Can I subscribe to your newsletter?

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Response to Aerows (Reply #77)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:31 PM

81. And again, you resort to ad hominems and baiting.

Apparently, you aren't capable of nuance.

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Response to MohRokTah (Reply #81)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:14 PM

120. Nor fact-based argument. nt

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Response to SunSeeker (Reply #120)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:02 PM

171. Or wit.

Unless it's totally unintentional. See the "Obama's mom worked for the CIA" thread from a few weeks ago. There aren't enough and in the world for that bit of nonsense.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #171)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 10:52 PM

186. Glad I missed that thread.

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Response to MohRokTah (Reply #38)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:32 PM

172. Did you know that when our spy apparatus went full time in the years after WW2...

...that one of the first things we did was to overthrow a peaceful country that liked us and wasn't in bed with the Soviet Union? True, this was the CIA under Allen Dulles--the NSA wasn't around yet. I'm not particularly tying my post to Snowden, but I am reminding all to be careful about what you support. The United States doesn't always operate with honor, decency, or honesty--there are a few hundred other examples that help to make the same point.

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Response to DisgustipatedinCA (Reply #172)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:44 PM

177. "Obama is the President of the United States

that means I do not give a shit, he is President and I do not give a good goddamn what he does in our name because he is President."

It's a sorry argument, but that seems to be what it has degenerated to.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #34)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:27 PM

71. No, it could harm actual US citizens

Unless you think we have no right to defend ourselves? You really think other countries are pussy cats?

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Response to truedelphi (Reply #6)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:53 PM

10. yeah I am sure the US was just looking at people's grades on the Chinese university server

nothing related to arms control or Chinese hacking of our own computers. nah. they were just sitting around the NSA rolling on the floor laughing at sophomores who flunked biology.

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Response to truedelphi (Reply #6)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:25 PM

68. It could easily have an effect on US-Chinese relations

Why did Comrade Eddie wish to harm those? That has nothing to do with allegedly unconstitutional collection of metadata with a warrant.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:51 PM

9. DU rec...nt

Sid

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:54 PM

12. You lap dog you!!

sorry.. someone in another thread is saying people who question Snowden's tactics are lapdogs for Obama.. I just could not resist

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:54 PM

13. Thanks for the reminder. nt

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:58 PM

15. For the Record...YOU got it wrong again.

Did you READ the article YOU cited?
"It is not known how many times the prestigious university has been attacked by the NSA but details shown to the Post by Snowden reveal that one of the most recent breaches was this January."



How can you miss something in plain Black & White?
It is right there in the 2nd paragraph, fer gawds sake.
You really should read the stuff before you link to it.
That will save you from future embarrassments, like today.

Snowden gave this information to "The Post",
NOT the Chinese Government.
The editorial Board at The Post decided to publish it.

Your claim that Snowden gave this information to the Chinese is now OFFICIALLY DEBUNKED.
...though that fact that old arely staircase has once again posted BOGUS information to DU
will not matter to some.

On Edit:
http://www.scmp.com/news/china/article/1266892/exclusive-nsa-targeted-chinas-tsinghua-university-extensive-hacking?page=all
The Link YOU provided above so that everyone reading this thread can easily verify for themselves that you posted and easily disprovable FALSE claim.


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Response to bvar22 (Reply #15)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 05:59 PM

16. lol

but nice use of the CAPS LOCK FUNCTION AS ALWAYS

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #16)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:01 PM

18. You dodged the point...You posted BOGUS claims.

...as usual.

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #18)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:18 PM

24. you seem extremely confused about a point of law....

The law simply does not care how Edward Snowdon made intelligence available to the Chinese government.

The fact that it was made available either through a newspaper or through other means is a crime.

You seem to be confused about the fact that just because he went and talked to a reporter this somehow made it some type of arm's length third party transactions and therefore was not a violation of the law.... you are incorrect.

Take a look at the Daniel Ellsberg prosecution.... it didn't matter that he went to newspapers.

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #18)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:47 PM

40. Is the Washington Post writer a traitor?

 

Or is it not fun to do that?

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Response to Otelo (Reply #40)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:46 PM

99. Welcome to DU...



Sid

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #16)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:08 PM

21. uh ok

63 computers and servers in Tsinghua University in Beijing

and

Chinese University of Hong Kong

and

focusing much attention on so-called “network backbones”,

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #21)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:21 PM

25. Did you READ the atricle YOU linked to, arley?

Apparently not,
because it states in clear, English print,
right there in the 2nd Paragraph that Snowden gave the information to The Post.

So your claim that "Snowden Gave Classified US Intel to the Chinese" is absolutely DEBUNKED ...again.


BTW: That is exactly what legitimate Whistle Blowers do.
They pass the information to accredited Media Outlets,
and their editorial boards decided what to publish.

BTW2: I'm is favor of letting foreign universities KNOW that the NSA is hacking their computers.
You DO know that China is a MFN Ally?



*Rampant Government Secrecy and Democracy can not co-exist.

*Persecution of Whistle Blowers and Democracy can not co-exist.

*Government surveillance of the citizenry and Democracy can not co-exist.

*Secret Laws and Democracy can not co-exist.

*Secret Courts and Democracy can not-co-exist.

*Our Democracy depends on an informed electorate.

You either believe in Democracy, and government accountable TO The People,
or you don't.
It IS that simple.




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Response to bvar22 (Reply #25)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:24 PM

27. name's arely

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #27)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:23 PM

63. Start saying Edward Snowden and maybe

everybody (who cares) will get your name spot on!

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #27)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:29 PM

76. Annnnnd......There we have it.

ALL you got are funny photos and BOGUS claims.

If you have any integrity,
you could go back and Edit your OP so that it reflects the truth,
and not bogus figments of your fevered imagination.


Another FAIL.
The information in the linked article
contradicts the claims made by the OP.

SEE!
I got funny pix too!

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #76)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 10:25 PM

185. actually your funniest pic is in post 25 nt

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #25)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:03 PM

46. Don't waste your time with them.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #16)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:48 PM

101. Hmmm, considering you did not counter his points at all makes me think they are correct. nt

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #16)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 12:30 AM

155. Your thread is now over despite the rolling on the floor smilie. nt

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Response to Mojorabbit (Reply #155)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 12:38 AM

158. what?

what a strange post.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #158)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 12:39 AM

159. Your op has been debunked. :) nt

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Response to Mojorabbit (Reply #159)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 12:42 AM

160. nope

it has not

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #15)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:08 PM

19. Because the Chinese government doesn't read the newspaper? Your illogical

assertion that this has somehow been debunked makes no sense.

If I steal classified intelligence regarding covert surveillance of another government.... and I make it available to that government... it is a crime. Understand that the law does not care how you made it available.

Thats what you seem to be missing in this analysis..... The law simply does not care how he made this intelligence available. It's still a crime.

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #19)

Tue Apr 22, 2014, 12:35 AM

197. They have no less access to the Washington Post.

With this logic if anyone ever releases classified information to the press they have then given classified information to the Chinese, who we are not at war with and in fact have very close ties.
In fact, they enjoy most favored nation status so they cannot be reasonably defined as an enemy. I'm pretty sure we weren't borrowing from Hitler.

The foaming at the mouth is silly.

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Response to TheKentuckian (Reply #197)

Tue Apr 22, 2014, 06:05 AM

198. Ok....to your first assertion, yes. It matters not to whom or how it is disseminated....

As to your second assertion...Jonathan Pollard.

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #15)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:43 PM

36. No, reading the article

doesn't support the narrative that there is a vast conspiracy to undermine President Obama

Because Snowden showed that there have been violations since ... President Bush did them, too.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:09 PM

22. Great analysis on the constitutionality of NSA programs

 

Kudos.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:18 PM

23. oh yeah, prove it!

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Response to Helen Borg (Reply #23)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:22 PM

26. well played nt

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:28 PM

28. Actually he gave it to the American People. The other countries just read it too.

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Response to on point (Reply #28)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:33 PM

29. hey I wouldn't be surprised if someone tried to argue that for real nt

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:35 PM

30. for the record...




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Response to Soylent Brice (Reply #30)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:37 PM

31. I know, right

we shouldn't be keeping secrets from the Chinese. that's just wrong.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #31)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:43 PM

35. Or from Putin, either.

I mean, how can we live with ourselves.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Now having said that, for the record I would like to state that the US has an awful lot of housecleaning to do in our own intel community. Our hands are not clean.

But that does not mean we just give away the store to nations that are -- and again I repeat myself for the umpteenth time -- Not Our Friends. If you believe they are, I have a big purple dinosaur for you to spend the rest of your life watching on teevee.

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Response to Hekate (Reply #35)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:19 PM

58. I agree with your point about our intel community

I even give snowden credit for getting the ball rolling to end metadata collection. but he also committed espionage for the Chinese and is now doing Russian propaganda. he could have been a hero but he chose another path.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #58)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:26 PM

70. That's "Snowden" with a capital "S"

just saying

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Response to elias49 (Reply #70)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 09:35 PM

150. Seriously? (nt)

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Response to elias49 (Reply #70)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:50 PM

181. I like it with a lower case S.

snowden. Like that. Just sayin'.
Or cheese faced twit. My fave. Just sayin'.
Or putins werkzeug. Thats a good one.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #31)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:57 PM

44. derp.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:37 PM

32. KnR Good luck. It's just barely possible that he is the most naive person who ever got entangled....

...in global politics.

But that beggars the imagination.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:45 PM

37. You're missing the whole damned point. And that's a fact. n/t

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 06:46 PM

39. I heard Snowden once went to the bathroom and DIDN'T WASH HIS HANDS!!!

 

That monster!

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Response to Vashta Nerada (Reply #39)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:13 PM

51. and had boxes in his garage!

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:02 PM

45. The Pulitzer voters have clearly ruffled some feathers around here.


It's kind of amusing, in a tragicomic way.


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Response to marmar (Reply #45)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:03 PM

47. this^

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Response to marmar (Reply #45)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:37 PM

88. Well, That Pulitzer certainly provoked a regular Two Minutes of HATE from the NSA protectors.



They ARE on the Wrong. Side. of. History,
and many of them now KNOW that
but don't have the ego strength to admit it.

Their desperation has gotten embarrassing, like THIS thread
where the linked article contradicts the claim made by the OP.
How Pathetic.


You will know them by their WORKS.

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #88)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:41 PM

175. HE DIDNT WIN THE PULITZER!!!!1!!!111!

at least that's what I kept reading in GD last week. Apparently there are those who think the Post's and Guardian's gardening sections or puzzle pages get credit for breaking the NSA story.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:13 PM

50. If i had not committed any crimes (like espionage or theft), I would never have left

The US, would stay and prove the "false charges" are wrong. But on the other hand I would have tried to peddle my take to other countries.

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Response to Thinkingabout (Reply #50)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:15 PM

52. If I thought I could get a legal trial

being held in humane conditions and then getting tried for my "crimes" I'd agree with you.

If I thought I'd be sent to a hell hole never to be heard from again? Hell no, I'd take whatever asylum I could get while revealing misconduct by the government.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #52)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:24 PM

66. Perhaps it would be best not to make the choice to commit crimes in which would

Cause one to be put in a hell hole to never be heard from again. It would be a legal trial, there is not a need to have an illegal trial, they have evidence. Bring him back and see who.is wrong.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:15 PM

53. so?

I assume you are trying to make some kind of point but I have no idea what it is.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:16 PM

54. Domestic US spying is still sleazy and uncalled for

No amount of smearing the messenger makes it otherwise.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:17 PM

55. The NSA, like the CIA, has always been incredibly corrupt, inept, and respects no laws at all

Even reading over what wikipedia says about the NSA is terrifying:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Security_Agency

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Response to Sarah Ibarruri (Reply #55)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:20 PM

60. It just makes them angry

like the emotional toddlers they are that people realize that all they know is "throw poo at opponent to make my poo look more strong".

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Response to Aerows (Reply #60)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:33 PM

83. True. Meantime, they're doing lots of harm. They've been doing harm since forever, and nobody

ever puts them under some sort of control.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:18 PM

56. He revealed crimes and misconduct

He reasonably discerned that he would be prosecuted for revealing crimes.

If that is your idea of a spy, then your idea of a patriot is one I do not adhere to.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:19 PM

57. Telling The Chinese That They Are Being Attacked Is Not The Same As Collected Intelligence Information

eom

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Response to cantbeserious (Reply #57)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:20 PM

59. he told them how we spy on them

that is espionage.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #59)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:22 PM

61. He Told The World How The USA Is Spying On All Countries - That Is Whistle Blowing

eom

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Response to cantbeserious (Reply #61)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:22 PM

62. no it isn't nt

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #62)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:24 PM

64. Only In Your World - Most Of Us Are Grateful To Know How Corrupt The US Government Has Become

eom

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Response to cantbeserious (Reply #64)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:26 PM

69. do you disaprove of all US spying?

if not, what spying is legit?

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #69)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:30 PM

79. Many Disapprove What The NSA Has Become After 9/11 - Authorized By George Bush And Justified By John Yoo

eom

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Response to cantbeserious (Reply #79)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:32 PM

82. gotcha but what kind of spying should the US be doing? if any nt

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #82)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:37 PM

87. You Gotcha Nothing

eom

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Response to cantbeserious (Reply #87)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:39 PM

90. so nothing. we should never spy on anyone ever

wow

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #90)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:44 PM

95. Ah The Rhetorical Putting Words In Others Mouths Approach

eom

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Response to cantbeserious (Reply #95)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:46 PM

100. I asked you what spying we should do and you wrote "nothing"

I am not putting words in you mouth.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #100)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:50 PM

104. How Deep Down This NonSense Rabbit Hole Do You Want To Go - I Have Eternity - Do You

eom

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Response to cantbeserious (Reply #104)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:52 PM

105. what? nt

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #105)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:52 PM

106. Right - What?

eom

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #82)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 05:06 AM

164. You spy on your neighbors?

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Response to GeorgeGist (Reply #164)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 07:47 AM

167. no, but then I am not a nation state nor being spied on myself

other than that, great analogy

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:24 PM

65. What happens at that University that could have an effect on national security of the US

is another interesting question. True, why did Comrade Eddie reveal that? It's not "spying on Americans."

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Response to treestar (Reply #65)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:35 PM

85. "Comrade Eddie"

That is so ugly. Brings to mind the ugliest of tactics from all the ignorant far right-wingers throughout my 50 years of living in the United States. And you don't have a clue, or do you?

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Response to Hissyspit (Reply #85)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:43 PM

94. Meh, I think it's funny

I do not attribute all the hullabaloo you seem to attribute. He's a public figure. By his own choice. We're not calling him a commie. Just pointing out that he's a Russian now.

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Response to treestar (Reply #65)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:21 PM

125. Channeling McCarthy won't win you any arguments here.

Odd that you would choose to use a tried and true right wing tactic to smear someone. Or maybe it isn't so odd.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #125)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 09:05 PM

145. Don't worry about it

Nobody cares if Eddie is a communist nowadays. We realize he's a libertarian. We are just teasing him that he's Russian now.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:28 PM

74. He did not go to China. He shared the files with the POST.One of the media Snowden shared info with

NSA is so flush with billions of OUR Federal money. The contracted businesses probably have their thousands of 'for profit' contractor employees 'hacking' into any computer they can get into.

Who the heck knows, those 'for profit' contractors probably paid bonus pay, by the number of hacked computers.

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Response to Sunlei (Reply #74)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:31 PM

80. he didn't go to China? nt

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #80)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:40 PM

92. Kinda weird since everybody everywhere reported he went to China.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:30 PM

78. Unrec for misleading headline.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:34 PM

84. George W. Bush gave the Chinese and the Russians one of our spy planes

But nobody seems to remember that.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:37 PM

86. Thanks for the Record of history, arely. They're getting sick of

"comrade eddie"? What's sickening is ignoring the facts of comrade eddie to pump up the little putin puppet.

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Response to Cha (Reply #86)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:44 PM

96. It's amazing how bothered they are by that

And how they think we'll feel bad about it? They should recognize that pity for comrade eddie is not something that's going to convince us.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:38 PM

89. For the record, Mi$$ RobMe and others of his ilk sold the Chinese our jobs. For profit. And of the

two, I think Snowden did far less harm to the non-paranoid among us, the private equity folks much more. Info spilled about security postures in IT is dated, by definition, and begins to lose value and diminish as soon as it is revealed - at least it does anywhere that security is really a concern.

On the other hand,the damage done by the .001 %ers continues to hurt people, leaving many of them, and their children, little more than the opportunity to be serfs for their entire life.

I'd still rather have Snowden as a co-worker or neighbor.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:39 PM

91. He gave info to a newspaper. Like the Chinese don't already know their servers are being hacked.

Who cares?

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Response to harun (Reply #91)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:45 PM

97. all old news huh? nothing to see here huh?

I'm sure they know we are trying. Thanks to Comrade Eddie they know we could do it successfully and what specific servers we were getting in to.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #97)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 08:59 PM

170. The 1950's called, they want their red scare name calling back. (n/t)

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Response to harun (Reply #170)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 10:21 PM

184. the 40s called, they want Tokyo Rose back nt

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #184)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 11:28 PM

192. The 1930's called, they want their whatever back.

Your turn.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:42 PM

93. Good for him.

The fact that our government is hacking universities, no matter in what country they exist, is shameful.

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Response to Erich Bloodaxe BSN (Reply #93)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:05 PM

110. It wasn't just a university

There were other activities there, including a communication system through which lots of other things could be hacked.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:46 PM

98. What the... Let me shove a little reality to your myopic view...most people know by now what I do

For a living...

For the record I am a backbone engineer and voice provisioner...

Your article that you cite as Gospel is, to be kind, a one sided piece of crap snowden hit piece.

While it does mention the fact that Tsinghua is one of the "primary" backbone nodes in China's internet it completely fails to mention that for YEARS this University has been identified as the largest concentrated list of IP's that have been hacking our entire Nations and others Nations networks, government AND civilian...hell many of my customers have them completely blacklisted for years now...they are that fucking bad...its a University with entire floors full of student hackers working loosely for the state...

With that glaring omission I have to ask WTF is your agenda in posting this piece of shit hit piece?


Never mind I really don't give a ....

Whether Snowden is a hero or villain I will let history sort it out....kinda like Jimmy Carter...i'm sure there are many that used to say he was a terrible president until you then look at his record and then he turns out to be in the top 20 best of all times...and truly a gentleman and true statesman.

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Response to Drew Richards (Reply #98)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:49 PM

103. sounds like a place we should have been hacking

too bad Snowden told them we had cracked it.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #103)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:54 PM

107. I see what you did there bravo!...i agree but then again they already knew we are fighting back so

Is there really that much harm? All his report to the post did is make it more public knowledge?

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Response to Drew Richards (Reply #107)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:57 PM

108. There is a difference between them knowing we are trying and knowing we are succeeding. nt

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #103)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 07:59 PM

109. You know the whole Cyber Command we built that everyone is upset about because the DIA has

It looks to the untrained eye like the bridge of the enterprise?

We created those in direct retaliation to the increased attacks and...the design is actually the most efficient design there is for a NOC/Threat Assessment Center...and I have been in quite a few...

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #103)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:07 PM

111. Again that would only be true if you pre-supposed they are stupid and dont know they have been

Hacked...

Unless you're an agent neither of us can say for sure what they already know. Again I think you see it as more damning and critical a disclosure than I.

But hey we are all entitled to our own opinions...good deal.

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Response to Drew Richards (Reply #111)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:13 PM

119. well, regardless of which of us is right...and I will admitt you seem to know a lot more about

systems than I do. but the fact we have been successful at hacking those servers was classified. snowden had no right to go to a foreign country and publicly announce it. and unlike the domestic phone metadata, there is no whistleblower/ethical justification.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #119)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:18 PM

123. I totally understand how you feel...now let me blow your mind...

What if...just what if...this is all a Psyops game and all the information he is divulging is antiquated, non-essential or false...but we may never be told...because that's exactly how psyops succeeds?

LOL just something twisty to think about...

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Response to Drew Richards (Reply #123)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:20 PM

124. I considered that in the early days. Could still be true. Unlikely, but now out of the question. nt

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:11 PM

115. No shit, Sherlock...

So you've actually proven that Snowden told a Chinese newspaper that the US counterhacked Tsinghua University, which has been known as a base of Chinese hacking operations against american cyber-infrastructure ever since it installed its first dial-up modem?

The Chinese must have been shocked! SHOCKED, I tell you. If it weren't for Snowden, they would never have suspected that such a thing was possible! And MULTIPLE SERVERS!!! Who could have conceived of such a thing! Snowden is the Moriarty of traitors, no doubt!!1!11!!

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Response to Democracyinkind (Reply #115)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:18 PM

122. so what was the point of telling them about it? nt

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #122)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:30 PM

133. He was telling it to the Post, hence the audience was you, me and our Chinese equivalents.

Snowden seems to think that there's a need to inform the world that those who hack are hacked back... It seems to be a pet peeve of him, as evidenced by the whole Russian episode.

It's no coincidence that he started with the Tsinghua information last summer, as Tsinghua was much discussed as a perpetrator of cyberattacks against "US interests". It was a matter of setting the record straight, that it's a cat and mouse game rather than a tale of lions and lambs. Personally, I found the idea that this needed to be pointed out ridiculous, but the last year on DU - with multiple such threads as this one - has disabused me of that notion.

I find your logic quite amusing - the way you use "them" to mingle the press and government - following it would have the curious unintended consequence of revealing the fact that Snowden is actually sharing his info with the NSA when he talks to western media. Ponder that

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Response to Democracyinkind (Reply #133)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 09:06 PM

146. Well if you tell the press you tell the Chinese government

along with everyone else. This line of attack is illogical, as is the crying about us calling poor Eddie "comrade." Proves what he has done has become more and more obviously indefensible.

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Response to treestar (Reply #146)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 09:39 PM

151. Yes! Exactly!!

And everytime he talks to western media he's actually telling the NSA!

Moriarty indeed.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:12 PM

117. Whatever Comrade Snowden did...

The lying weasel should have his ass in the slammer.

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Response to SoapBox (Reply #117)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:18 PM

121. So now it's the McCarthy-ite "Comrade" ad hominem

Real nice on a place called "Democratic Underground". I would expect that sort of reactionary drivel on a right wing site. After all, to them McCarthy using that tactic was splendid.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #121)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:27 PM

130. Nyet comrade! We need no stinking McCarthy...we have the arts de politic of MAO-MAO


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Response to Drew Richards (Reply #130)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:51 PM

182. This begs the question: which Mao?

Is this the cat responsible for the Mao-Mao Uprising, or the one in China responsible for the Clumpable Revolution?

Which leads to the further question...who IS The MAO Inhibitor?

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Response to DisgustipatedinCA (Reply #182)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:59 PM

183. LOL OMG that was good...Grumpy kitty says there is only one MAO...

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:47 PM

139. As I read all these comments, one thing becomes clear

All of the red white and blue conditioning seems to have worked.

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Response to WHEN CRABS ROAR (Reply #139)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 12:30 AM

156. Sadly true...

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 08:50 PM

140. WTF are you on about? For The Record: Snowden Gave Classified US Intel to Newspaper Readers

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 09:17 PM

147. He should have incorperated first, Then he would only be looking at a fine.

.
Loral was accused of transferring technology to China in 1996. The incident arose as a result of an investigation into the launch failure of Intelsat 708, a Space Systems/Loral–built satellite. In a 2002 agreement with the State Department and Department of Justice the company agreed to pay $20 million in fines to settle the matter and to improve its compliance procedures. In the agreement Loral officials neither admitted nor denied the government's charges, but Loral executives acknowledged "the nature and seriousness of the offenses alleged by the department in the draft charging letter, including the risk of harm to the security and foreign policy interests of the United States", and stated that they wished to make amends through the payment of restitution. Schwartz subsequently released a statement accepting "full responsibility for the matter" and portrayed the incident as an error by a single Loral employee

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Response to Nobel_Twaddle_III (Reply #147)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 09:32 PM

149. +1 nt

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 09:21 PM

148. My heart bleeds for the poor, beleaguered, NSA and CIA.

Just like it used to bleed for the KGB and Stasi.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Sun Apr 20, 2014, 09:51 PM

153. I love how all these Edward Snowden hate threads

seem to end badly. But keep trying by all means. You don't seem to have anything else to do.

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Response to elias49 (Reply #153)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 12:36 AM

157. It is certainly hard to understand the motivation of the Snowden attackers.

Some have suggested they are paid agents. I don't know about that but I definitely wouldn't put it past the national security apparatus. Making the discussion about Snowden and not the crimes of the ever expanding police state appears to be an effective strategy.

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Response to BillZBubb (Reply #157)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 12:44 AM

161. because the only thing being discussed on DU

you have a point.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 06:59 AM

165. Emmanuel really is getting under your skin

You're even starting to sound (a little bit) like him.

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #165)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 07:45 AM

166. ...

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:35 PM

173. For the record

You are either an NSA insider to have such knowledge or ......... I'll leave you to determine that one since you can get evidence out of thin air.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #173)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:43 PM

176. Or...

...they're able to read a newspaper. In which said data was published.

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Response to gcomeau (Reply #176)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:45 PM

178. In China

I guess now RT is going to be en vogue if it slanders whistleblowers.

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 09:49 PM

180. HAIL HYDRA!

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 10:54 PM

187. If that is your source

you need better material.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #187)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 11:14 PM

189. my source is snowden

I will grant you that he isn't credible. But he did give an interview and say those things. Maybe he is adouble agent and feeding the chinese bullshit for the NSA.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #189)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 11:16 PM

190. I have a question

What does "arely" mean? I've always wondered that. "arely staircase".

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Response to Aerows (Reply #190)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 11:31 PM

193. it is the name the agency gave me nt

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 11:12 PM

188. K

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Response to arely staircase (Original post)

Mon Apr 21, 2014, 11:26 PM

191. At least he didn't give them our jobs.

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