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Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:21 AM

"If Trayvon Had Only Answered In an Appropriate Manner There Would have Been No Problem"

Last edited Tue Apr 3, 2012, 08:26 PM - Edit history (8)

On Anderson Cooper 360 yesterday, I heard an interview that I had to search for on the internet and listen to several times to believe what I was hearing.

VIDEO: http://www.examiner.com/unsolved-cases-in-national/anderson-cooper-interviews-friend-of-trayvon-martin-s-killer-video

Cooper asked Taaffe to describe Zimmerman. He said, “George Zimmerman was a very congenial, amiable admirable person. He was very very kind to everyone in our community and I really appreciated and so did the rest of our residents that he stepped up and took over the position as neighborhood watch captain to ensure the safety of all the residents in our community.”

When asked if he was aware Zimmerman was armed with a gun, Taaffe said, “I was extremely shocked to the fact that he was carrying a gun, yes.”

Asked what shocked him most, Taaffe said, “The lethal weapon, it wasn’t George. As I said, he was a very congenial, amiable man. The use of a lethal weapon, a deadly lethal weapon, as the 9 millimeter that he used was very shocking to me. It didn’t fit the person.”

Cooper asked Taaffe to describe his neighborhood and to discuss if there had been burglaries. Taaffe said, “I have lived at Twin Lakes since 2006, July 2006. In the last 15 months, we have experienced 8 burglaries. One, which was perpetrated during the daylight hours. Most, the majority of the perpetrators, were young, black males.”

When asked to reflect on what’s happened, Taaffe said, “This was a perfect storm. You had a neighborhood that was experiencing extremely high tension and anxiety and with the burglaries we, pardon my phrase, we were a Defcon-5." Cooper brought up the topic of race because so many people have said they consider Zimmerman a racist and that Martin was shot because he was black.

When asked if he believes race played a factor in Trayvon’s death Taaffe said, “Absolutely not.” When asked why he felt so strongly he said, “George is not a racist. He was just performing his duties as watch captain. Whether it be African American, Latino, Asian, or white, he would’ve done the same thing. He would have approached the person and asked him 'What’s your business here?' and if he had just answered him in an appropriate manner, 'I’m just here visiting. My mother’s house is around the corner,' and be upfront and truthful, there wouldn’t be any problem.”



This is, without a doubt, the most shocking and reprehensible thing I have heard said to date about this case. Why Anderson did NOT followup on these outrageous statements, I cannot imagine. But this man CLEARLY is putting the blame on this murderered young man for his own death.

I wonder how many more in that community feel the same way. Evidently, the police there feel the same.

Absolutely outrageous.

Taafe was also quoted in an article as saying that after the housing crisis they had been forced to "rent to low-lifes and gangsters."

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/17/v-fullstory/2700249/shooter-of-trayvon-martin-a-habitual.html

Latest Taafe comment to MSNBC:

Taafe: "George was no Rambo. He was a caring person. It is really sad he has already been convincted by the public media and already sentenced to the gas chamber."

MSNBC: "Do you think he had anger issues?"

Taafe: "I think he had "Fed Up Issues. I think he was Mad as Hell and he wasn't going to take it anymore."

UPDATE: 4/3/2012: "You plant corn, you get corn." Taaffe back on TV, grilled by Soledad O'Brien: http://cnnpressroom.blogs.cnn.com/2012/04/03/zimmerman-neighbor-fmr-neighborhood-watch-captain-prior-burglaries-were-by-young-black-males-if-you-plant-corn-you-get-corn/


(Also posted at Daily Kos)




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Reply "If Trayvon Had Only Answered In an Appropriate Manner There Would have Been No Problem" (Original post)
K Gardner Mar 2012 OP
phantom power Mar 2012 #1
K Gardner Mar 2012 #2
Taverner Mar 2012 #166
K Gardner Mar 2012 #184
HockeyMom Mar 2012 #3
K Gardner Mar 2012 #6
LineLineLineReply .
Go Vols Mar 2012 #61
K Gardner Mar 2012 #81
Fawke Em Mar 2012 #123
K Gardner Mar 2012 #183
Brigid Mar 2012 #71
HockeyMom Mar 2012 #134
Wait Wut Mar 2012 #154
obamanut2012 Mar 2012 #261
L0oniX Mar 2012 #49
nanabugg Mar 2012 #56
got root Mar 2012 #141
COLGATE4 Mar 2012 #162
L0oniX Mar 2012 #204
JonLP24 Mar 2012 #227
Hell Hath No Fury Mar 2012 #74
L0oniX Mar 2012 #206
got root Mar 2012 #77
L0oniX Mar 2012 #205
BeHereNow Mar 2012 #234
groundloop Mar 2012 #103
renate Mar 2012 #148
K Gardner Mar 2012 #150
COLGATE4 Mar 2012 #163
L0oniX Mar 2012 #203
AnotherDreamWeaver Mar 2012 #109
patrice Mar 2012 #194
AnotherDreamWeaver Mar 2012 #199
patrice Mar 2012 #207
obamanut2012 Mar 2012 #262
L0oniX Mar 2012 #201
AnotherDreamWeaver Mar 2012 #219
Honeycombe8 Mar 2012 #211
xtraxritical Mar 2012 #114
L0oniX Mar 2012 #202
Honeycombe8 Mar 2012 #213
obamanut2012 Mar 2012 #263
LanternWaste Mar 2012 #236
ret5hd Mar 2012 #4
Ecumenist Mar 2012 #19
lose the pain body Mar 2012 #26
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yardwork Mar 2012 #11
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K Gardner Mar 2012 #78
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spanone Mar 2012 #17
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marble falls Mar 2012 #84
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Blue_Tires Mar 2012 #174
The Magistrate Mar 2012 #20
lose the pain body Mar 2012 #29
Hell Hath No Fury Mar 2012 #31
lose the pain body Mar 2012 #34
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patrice Mar 2012 #237
The Magistrate Mar 2012 #60
patrice Mar 2012 #144
The Magistrate Mar 2012 #155
patrice Mar 2012 #160
patrice Mar 2012 #161
The Magistrate Mar 2012 #170
patrice Mar 2012 #186
MattBaggins Mar 2012 #70
AnotherDreamWeaver Mar 2012 #96
patrice Mar 2012 #159
AnotherDreamWeaver Mar 2012 #187
patrice Mar 2012 #188
patrice Mar 2012 #197
AnotherDreamWeaver Mar 2012 #200
patrice Mar 2012 #208
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patrice Mar 2012 #217
Logical Mar 2012 #120
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d_r Mar 2012 #129
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samsingh Mar 2012 #21
Wellstone ruled Mar 2012 #24
K Gardner Mar 2012 #27
L0oniX Mar 2012 #25
WinkyDink Mar 2012 #52
patrice Mar 2012 #243
Hell Hath No Fury Mar 2012 #30
K Gardner Mar 2012 #33
Hell Hath No Fury Mar 2012 #55
lose the pain body Mar 2012 #32
K Gardner Mar 2012 #39
lose the pain body Mar 2012 #46
ceile Mar 2012 #41
Hell Hath No Fury Mar 2012 #42
lose the pain body Mar 2012 #48
ceile Mar 2012 #53
uppityperson Mar 2012 #63
K Gardner Mar 2012 #67
Hell Hath No Fury Mar 2012 #80
im in you ur in me Mar 2012 #226
Paladin Mar 2012 #83
ceile Mar 2012 #85
frylock Mar 2012 #97
noiretextatique Mar 2012 #245
K Gardner Mar 2012 #65
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sabrina 1 Mar 2012 #112
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noiretextatique Mar 2012 #241
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K Gardner Mar 2012 #93
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qanda Mar 2012 #181
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sendero Mar 2012 #101
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Fawke Em Mar 2012 #121
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K Gardner Mar 2012 #210
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Art_from_Ark Mar 2012 #216
Xipe Totec Mar 2012 #127
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Hell Hath No Fury Mar 2012 #132
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backscatter712 Mar 2012 #139
patrice Mar 2012 #145
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K Gardner Mar 2012 #152
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vaberella Mar 2012 #167
surrealAmerican Mar 2012 #172
WI_DEM Mar 2012 #173
K Gardner Mar 2012 #182
devilgrrl Mar 2012 #176
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patrice Mar 2012 #189
K Gardner Mar 2012 #193
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arely staircase Mar 2012 #190
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guitar man Mar 2012 #195
shadegrown tofu Mar 2012 #252
guitar man Mar 2012 #258
6000eliot Mar 2012 #222
Dawson Leery Mar 2012 #254
Rex Mar 2012 #255
loyalsister Mar 2012 #257
baldguy Mar 2012 #265
K Gardner Mar 2012 #267
Catherina Apr 2012 #268

Response to K Gardner (Original post)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:23 AM

1. existing while black

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Response to phantom power (Reply #1)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:25 AM

2. I'm trying to find a transcript, if not, I'll try to transcribe it

word-for-word.

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Response to phantom power (Reply #1)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 04:26 PM

166. Exactamundo nt

 

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Response to phantom power (Reply #1)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 05:21 PM

184. It actually begs the question.. what does THIS guy know and what did

Zimmerman tell him? Why hasn't he been questioned?

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Response to K Gardner (Original post)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:27 AM

3. This is what so scares me about living in Florida and the ease with which people can carry a gun

You just don't know WHO you will meet who will armed. Do you expect everyone in this state to carry a gun for self-defenese? I really, really do NOT LIKE that concept. It is one thing keep a gun INSIDE YOUR OWN HOME for your own protection. People walking around the streets with a gun? I don't like that one.

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Response to HockeyMom (Reply #3)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:29 AM

6. We have the same law in Tennessee - and legislatures keep easing

restrictions. We had one proposed a while back to allow people to carry guns in bars.

Boy howdy.

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Response to K Gardner (Reply #6)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:26 PM

61. .

Its been legal to carry a pistol into a bar here(Tenn) for about 18 months.

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Response to Go Vols (Reply #61)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:40 PM

81. LOL.. I guess I wasn't looking when that one passed :-) Thanks. n/t

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Response to Go Vols (Reply #61)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 01:47 PM

123. Go Vols!

Knoxville-native and UT grad here.

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Response to Fawke Em (Reply #123)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 05:20 PM

183. Me too, Fawke !

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Response to K Gardner (Reply #6)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:33 PM

71. Guns in bars.

Now what could possibly go wrong?

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Response to Brigid (Reply #71)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 02:10 PM

134. Yeah, drunks and guns

Great combination.

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Response to Brigid (Reply #71)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 03:41 PM

154. Legal in Arizona.

But, you have to promise not to drink.

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Response to Brigid (Reply #71)

Sun Mar 25, 2012, 08:39 AM

261. You are not allowed to drink while carrying

In states that allow handguns in bars. It is a felony that WILL result in your going to prison. I know that in my CCW permit class, we were told that even touching an alcoholic drink (ie passing it to someone else, etc.) was breaking the law.

I do have a problem with people who want laws passed allowing weapons onto college campuses and in college dorms.

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Response to HockeyMom (Reply #3)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:20 PM

49. I carry everyday and everywhere I am allowed to in Florida. Even my store has a gun.

We just had a robbery a few stores down from ours. I expect that there are many who carry and am not surprised when I meet anyone who says they do. I reject the idea that everyone else who carries should be punished or condemned or put down because some asshole misused his right to carry. He clearly violated the training that one gets or should get before getting a permit to carry. You can not provoke a confrontation and then shoot someone because they came back at you. That sheriff should be fired and there should be charges brought up. Which charges I don't know but I would think negligent homicide at the least is in order. I resent the blanket anti gun angst. About 50% of DU members have a gun or guns. Police also misuse their guns. Do you feel uncomfortable when you are close to them? Oh yea they are trained more ...well that's a matter of who spends how much time at the range and takes on other training. I am a security guard. If anything the training courses one has to complete to receive a cwp should be more extensive with more law enforcement oversight. No one should take the right to carry lightly. No one should be trying to confront others so as to be able to use their gun.

Oh yea and ...if I were in a 711 and you were there at the counter and robber with a gun came in ...I would shoot him.

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #49)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:24 PM

56. Or you would get us all killed while trying to go for your gun? nt

 

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Response to nanabugg (Reply #56)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 04:10 PM

162. Or, as a good friend ex-correctional officer

and ex-deputy sheriff once said to me, "he'd take that gun out of your hand and shove it up..." before you knew what was happening. Good luck then, Rambo.

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Response to nanabugg (Reply #56)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 07:57 PM

204. ...or the robber would shoot all the witnesses ...and the store clerk.

Have you even seen someone on meth?

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #204)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 10:20 AM

227. I have

As with someone under the influence of any powerful drug, anything can pop off(so I'm not disputing you--just felt like answering the question you asked someone else). In my experience, in most cases they're cowards. In general(from my experience) when they steal something, they do it when someone isn't looking and if someone is, they take off to avoid a beat down. Two-faced, lie to get what they want rather than be upfront like a real bad ass. Now if someone is generally a violent person sober, that stuff is a scary combination. Just talking about run-of-the-mill users.

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #49)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:34 PM

74. I don't trust ANYONE with a gun. Period.

Cop, you, my own Mom -- a gun can be pointed right at me as easily as a "bad guy". I do not trust anyone who is so insecure they feel the need to carry all the time -- I have them in the family and they are some of the biggest idiots I know.

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Response to Hell Hath No Fury (Reply #74)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 08:00 PM

206. Actually ...someone with a knife is more dangerous.

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #49)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:37 PM

77. Sad life

 

To need to carry daily is just one more sign of a sick society, IMHO.

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Response to got root (Reply #77)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 07:59 PM

205. Maybe you could help by working with the religious right on that "sick society".

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Response to got root (Reply #77)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 03:34 PM

234. Sad yes, realistic? YES, HELL YES.

This IS a sick society and anyone who thinks otherwise
is in a state of dangerous delusion.

To carry in this society is self preservation IMO.
A realistic comprehension of just HOW sick our
society is and being prepared to deal with it should it
appear at your door.

Case in point:
This past Christmas there was a news story about a young mother
who shot and killed a man who kicked in her door.

Background details- her husband had recently died of cancer, within
days of Christmas as I recall. Shortly after the funeral a man
appeared in her yard saying he had been a friend of her husband
and wanted to stop by and offer his condolences.
She didn't buy it and quickly retreated back into her house.

A week later, as she sat at home with her newborn infant, she heard
men outside her house trying the windows and doors.
She called 9-11.
She asked the dispatcher what her rights were should the
men succeed in breaking into her house before the police got there.
The dispatcher told her, if they come through the door- shoot them.
They did and she did. She killed the original "visitor" with a single shotgun
blast.
I can just imagine what those men had in mind and I am damned glad
she had a shotgun to protect herself and her baby.

This is a very sick society and I fully comprehend the reasons
people feel the need to be able to protect themselves.

BHN

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #49)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 01:07 PM

103. I bet you've never experienced being robbed at gunpoint

I have. I was extremely pissed off after it happened, so pissed off in fact that I took off after the dude in my car with the intention of running his ass over. After about 3 seconds of that craziness it dawned on me that he had a gun and I didn't. After a little more reflecting it was apparent to me that if I did have a gun I'd probably have gotten myself shot, as it was I was out 50 bucks. Unless you've ever been in the situation you can't begin to understand how hard it is to control your emotion and act intelligently. Maybe if you have as much constant training as cops you might come out the winner without getting innocent bystanders hurt, but not with just the cursory training most people have.

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Response to groundloop (Reply #103)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 03:05 PM

148. this is a really useful insight

It's easy to think about how one would respond in a situation like that, because the adrenaline isn't flowing and the brain is working normally. I think somebody with a LOT of training could probably respond in a way we'd all like to think we would, but without a ton of practice I would think the gun hand would be wobbly... even getting the gun out of the holster would be difficult.

It's a lot like calling 911; in theory, it's as easy as pie, but in an emergency situation your hands are trembling, you can't find the phone quickly, your brain can't form words, etc etc.

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Response to groundloop (Reply #103)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 03:25 PM

150. Excellent post.. and sorry that happened to you. n/t

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Response to groundloop (Reply #103)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 04:12 PM

163. K&R. Best and most honest answer yet

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Response to groundloop (Reply #103)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 07:56 PM

203. You can bet all you want.

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #49)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 01:15 PM

109. 'That sheriff should be fired..." ??? Zimmerman wasn't a sheriff

He appears to just be a volunteer, who appointed himself to the job. I have not heard of any real "employment" Zimmerman has, or had. But I too believe he should be arrested. Aggravated assault and murder works for me.

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Response to AnotherDreamWeaver (Reply #109)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 06:33 PM

194. So, HOW exactly does that work? If it wasn't his employment ... ? He just starts showing up in a

neighborhood in which he does not live . . . ?

Very strange.

How does he pay for his vehicle? gas? weapon? Cash, under-the-table?

I do not understand.

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Response to patrice (Reply #194)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 07:43 PM

199. I read he had lived in the area, but left after the incident.

Now I just read he had been in college: http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002457727

He was just a 'volunteer' though, and the neighborhood wasn't registered with the state Neighborhood Watch Association was the report.

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Response to AnotherDreamWeaver (Reply #199)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 08:12 PM

207. There are so many questions. I wonder if, as you say, "the area" = the gated-community in which his

crime occurred, or was the gated-community only one part of the larger area of which he WAS a member.

Trying to understand this gated-community aspect here. That usually implies money and I don't associate Z. with money, so did he or did he not live where the crime occurred. Trying to understand WHAT put him there to threaten, and potentially murder, other citizens. Even if it isn't money, I'm just having a hard time understanding how anyone just completely independently starts hanging out at all hours, with a gun, in an area that is worried about that sort of thing, and is not one's residence. How long did he do this? Did he actually apprehend other for real criminals there, anywhere? How many?

Z. did this completely by himself, no feedback, no validation, no other involvement, no support of any kind? Really?

Doesn't add up.

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Response to patrice (Reply #207)

Sun Mar 25, 2012, 08:47 AM

262. Gated communities don't equal money

Some gated communities are for the very rich, but most are for regular middle class and bluecollar folks. You generally just have a barcode decal on your car that's read by a scanner, or a card swipe. Some have a main gate with security that allows certain people in, and some just have a gate or two where your visitors, UPS, etc. punch in a code.

HOA fees are usually a few hundred to a $1,500 a year, and pay for things like trash pickup, security, a pool and clubhouse, etc.

Zimmerman declared himself a neighborhood watch, but he wasn't an official one, which are trained and registered with law enforcement. Even residents of the community complained about him.

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Response to AnotherDreamWeaver (Reply #109)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 07:54 PM

201. I never said Zimmerman was a sheriff.

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #201)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 09:32 PM

219. OK, well, the police chief took leave or something,

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Response to AnotherDreamWeaver (Reply #109)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 08:40 PM

211. I think he means the police chief. nt

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #49)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 01:34 PM

114. Oh yeah! Have you ever heard from anyone that carried a gun

 

that was NOT a responsible gun owner? What a bunch of bullshit.

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Response to xtraxritical (Reply #114)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 07:55 PM

202. Yes I have ...and the bull shit is all yours.

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #49)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 08:47 PM

213. I don't have a carry license, but I have a gun. I'm from Louisiana...

and was sort of raised around guns. It's like being raised in an area where it rains a lot: you learn to respect wet roads. When you're raised around guns, you learn to respect them and realize what they are for, how they should be used, etc.

Others who are not raised that way may not understand this viewpoint of guns. I've pulled a gun on a guy trying to break into my apartment. Had I not had that gun,no telling what would've happened. It's an equalizer, for a woman, who is a sitting duck for any man who decides to do her harm.

I get your point and totally agree. I wouldn't make a long car trip w/o a gun. It's a jungle out there, whether we like it or not. It seems pretty normal to me for normal households to have guns for protection. Of course, they need to learn how to use them.

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Response to Honeycombe8 (Reply #213)

Sun Mar 25, 2012, 08:52 AM

263. I agree with you

If you are raised with them and around them, especially in a household where you are taught gun safety and respect for what the guns can do, it's just part of your life. I do understand how people not raised with them feel differently.

I have a CCW permit, and that loaded 9 mm in always tucked between my seat and the center console thing when I drive alone on the interstate. Too many women have gone missing.

Zimmerman had no respect for his weapon and what it could do, nor for his responsibilities as a gun owner. How he ever got a CCW after hitting a LEO is beyond me.

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Response to L0oniX (Reply #49)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 04:12 PM

236. We often play the hero in our imaginations.

We often play the hero in our imaginations. It's human nature to see ourselves in the best possible light, and to validate ourselves though fictional scenarios-- it's human nature. And sometimes we even believe ourselves...

Thank goodness our imaginations are where it usually stops, else these Zimmerman stories would be increasing exponentially.

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Response to K Gardner (Original post)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:27 AM

4. Translation: If he hadn't got all uppity.

We have NO responsibility to answer ANY questions from random people while walking down the street. Even if it's a cop we only have limited responsibility.

And zimm wasn't no cop.

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Response to ret5hd (Reply #4)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:36 AM

19. EXACTLY what I said downthread, Ret5HD.

E.X.A.C.T.L.Y!

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Response to ret5hd (Reply #4)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:04 PM

26. Are you Black?

 

Would you honestly tell that to your child, if so? I would tell my child that you never know who's gonna do what and so it's best to be respectful to others, even though they might not be talking to you in a l polilte manner.

(By the way, this even applies to criminals who try to steal something from you. As my bf says: "whoever has the gun is the boss." )

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Response to ret5hd (Reply #4)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 03:49 PM

157. Yeah, what right does a Zimmerman-type have to ask why we are walking

down the sidewalk minding our own business?

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Response to indepat (Reply #157)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 05:03 PM

178. None. No right whatsoever to ask.

Last time I checked, this was America and not Communist China.

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Response to K Gardner (Original post)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:28 AM

5. DefCon 5 was the LOWEST defense condition and it = situation normal.

WTF?

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Response to HereSince1628 (Reply #5)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:30 AM

8. Evidently the neighbor didn't know his Defcon Numbers.. but he

sure knew that his good friend George Zimmerman would never have done anything like this unless the kid was at fault (for walking while black).

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Response to K Gardner (Reply #8)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 01:18 PM

110. most of us know Defcon numbers from the movie "War Games"

The movie got the order wrong, made Defcon 5 the highest level, and Defcon 1 was normal.

To be fair to the moviemakers though, it does make more sense that way.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #110)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 02:14 PM

137. I believe there's actually a law that says movies actually have to change stuff like that around

Military uniforms, for example, can be very close to the real thing but not quite. There always has to be something on them that's not quite right to differentiate it from the real thing.

DefCon levels for example, well, they can show the DefCon system but not the correct order of defense states.

At least this is what my roommate, who was in the Navy for eight years, told me.

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Response to Downtown Hound (Reply #137)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 01:15 AM

220. Well on the DVD, the commentary from the producers

said that they just got it wrong. Perhaps it was more highly classified at the time, so they could not find out.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #110)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 03:36 PM

153. It was a basically a count-down to nuclear war...

It think it's interesting that you see counting up as more sensible.

Maybe that suggests we aren't so prone to worrying about countdowns to war.

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Response to HereSince1628 (Reply #153)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 01:21 AM

221. I hate that phrase though

before the Iraq war, CBS news began every broadcast with "Countdown to war".

Well, a countdown is inevitable, inexorable. So CBS news spents months basically telling their viewers "We are going to goto war with Iraq. It's only a matter of time."

For me, it just stands to reason that Defcon 3 would be a higher level of alert than Defcon 1, and that when things got more serious, you would raise the level.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #221)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 08:05 AM

223. It's interesting to me how number sequences can be seen...

I understand how a bigger number can represent more and so a bigger/increasing number seems more serious.

I also understand how a smaller number can represent less and a smaller/decreasing number means a smaller distance or time from some thing.

The choice of what to use to represent a circumstance is a choice. Everyone concerned would quickly understand which illusion was in play. During the coldwar lots of things were 'countdown' including the Union of Concerned Scientists clock. Many of the guys in my unit had countdown calendars to the day they got to return home from participation in that little scuff-up in Vietnam.

Was that because that generation was conditioned to countdowns in NASA's space program or something else?



Re the Iraq War, considering Cheney's influence and desires, the march to war with Iraq probably WAS inevitable.

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Response to HereSince1628 (Reply #223)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 01:20 PM

229. war with Iraq probably was inevitable

but a media framing like that only helps to make it more so. Myself, I went to an anti-war rally hoping to stop the war.

I would say that two other things were true, besides the truth that "Bush is probably going to order the invasion of Iraq".

It was also true that
1. We did not have to do it.
and
2. We should not have done it.

Maybe if CBS news had started each broadcast with "Countdown to Impeachment" they could have made that happen instead.

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Response to hfojvt (Reply #229)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 02:04 PM

230. I'm sure that's one countdown I would have favored.

I totally agree with both 1 and 2.

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Response to K Gardner (Original post)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:30 AM

7. I certainly wouldn't want to live in an area where I am subject spot interrogation....

.....by random people who really have no business or authority to question me.

And I rather doubt most people would be comfortable with a stranger coming up to them and essentially saying "Halt! State your name and your business here!"

That includes anyone who says "If he had just answered in an appropriate manner....".

From my viewpoint, an "appropriate response" as a free citizen to such an inquiry is "None of god-damned business!"

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Response to Liberal Veteran (Reply #7)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:31 AM

13. Bingo. Also, some reports say Zimmerman wasn't even part of the

neighborhood watch. This guy says he was "captain" of it, or head of it.

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Response to K Gardner (Reply #13)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 04:30 PM

168. Yeah apparently it was confirmed. He was self-appointed but not on the team. n/t

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Response to Liberal Veteran (Reply #7)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 01:03 PM

99. Who watches the Watchmen?




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Response to Liberal Veteran (Reply #7)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 01:44 PM

119. actually I sorta gave the same answer to a cop back in 1986

It was 2 a.m. and I had an upset stomach. So I walked half a mile or so to the grocery store which was open 24/7 and bought some soda. Threw up again in the gutter on my way home. Three blocks later I notice I am being followed by a slow moving vehicle. Kinda relieved when it turned out to be the police and not some thugs looking to jump me. Unfortunately, it turned out to be a thug with a badge. Oh, he got all high and mighty when I asked him "why?" when he asked for ID.

What can I say, it was too close to 1984 and I never heard of any law that says you need ID to walk on the streets, even at 2 a.m.

Still, I am not gonna start a fight with somebody who asks a question or two, or even with somebody who grabs my arm. I apologized to the cop to keep him from beating me up, but still wish I had gotten his badge number. Who knows though, he may have beaten me up if I had asked for it.

Funny thing is, about 9 out of 10 people I have told this story to, took the side of the cop. And these people are supposed to be MY friends.

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Response to Liberal Veteran (Reply #7)

Sun Mar 25, 2012, 08:56 AM

264. The only person you have to answer to is law enforcement

I would never give my ID to a security guard, either. I would ask them, politely, to call a police officer.

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Response to K Gardner (Original post)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:30 AM

9. If those friggin gated communities want...

people watching then they should put their money where their mouths are and hire real security, imho.

Why should anyone have to answer anything to a friggin person who has no legal authority?

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Response to Little Star (Reply #9)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:51 PM

89. A civil suit for wrongful death against the gated community may be in order.

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Response to kiranon (Reply #89)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:56 PM

92. Good thought!

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Response to K Gardner (Original post)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:30 AM

10. Yeah, he should have said "yassuh, massa I's sorry"

Mr Taffe sounds just like another scared bigot.

Did you really expect Anderson Cooper, or anybody else on CNN, to challenge this idiot?

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Response to tularetom (Reply #10)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:32 AM

14. +1 n/t

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Response to tularetom (Reply #10)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 11:33 AM

15. +2 (we need like buttons for comments) n/t

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Response to tularetom (Reply #10)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:06 PM

28. What about his school suspension?

 

His parents are mum on why he had been suspended. Maybe there is something in between "yes suh massa" and lack of cooperation? (By the way, don't you DARE turn this into something where I defend Zimmerman. I am simply addressing YOUR over-the-top remark.)

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Response to lose the pain body (Reply #28)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:10 PM

35. What does his school suspension have to do with getting shot? n/t

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Response to ceile (Reply #35)


Response to lose the pain body (Reply #37)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:15 PM

44. And again- nothing to do with him getting shot. n/t

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Response to lose the pain body (Reply #37)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:27 PM

64. You are not going to like this but your comment is in fact a text book example of racism

Under what basis, can you look at someone, and ascertain whether they are or are not an "angel", unless you are racially profiling them?

Where he was walking was not in fact a true gated community, he was on a public transit path and he is not required to answer to any civilian as to what he was doing.

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Response to ceile (Reply #35)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:20 PM

50. Well, you see

kids who are suspended for being tardy aren't allowed to be out on the street buying candy and ice tea from the local store

Interesting that Zimmerdick was allowed to have a gun permit with his assault record....

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Response to lose the pain body (Reply #28)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:25 PM

57. He was suspended for being late to school too many times

Stupid policy.

Trayvon — who was known as "Tray" or "Slimm" — played youth football during his early teens and helped his father coach Little League baseball, said Fulton, whose sister, Sybrina Fulton, is Trayvon's mother.

Trayvon was under a five-day suspension when he was shot that Sunday night, but Kypriss said it was due to tardiness and not misbehavior.

"Trayvon was not a violent or dangerous child. He was not known for misbehaving," the teacher said. "He was suspended because he was late too many times."

More: http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-03-17/news/os-trayvon-martin-shooting-tensions-20120317_1_shooting-death-english-teacher-uncle







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Response to csziggy (Reply #57)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 12:49 PM

88. And this has always struck me as a stupid policy.

So a kid is repeatedly tardy to class, missing out on minutes of instruction and his punishment is to be forced to miss even more DAYS of school.

Saturday school or afterschool detention would have been a better consequence.

Thank you for pointing out that this young man was not a behavioral problem as some may have believed.

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Response to Tatiana (Reply #88)

Thu Mar 22, 2012, 01:02 PM

98. From what I've read this was a really good kid

And he will be missed by his teachers and classmates.

I read somewhere (but didn't try to find the source) that Trayvon's mother drove him to school and it was because of her being late that made him tardy. He was an A and B student - a better punishment would have been for him to tutor other kids or some other constructive project.

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Response to Tatiana (Reply #88)

Fri Mar 23, 2012, 03:17 PM

231. Free public education malls, open 8a - 8p, 365. Cradle to grave free education.

Just FUND them then teach those who show up.

Fuck the factory/profit "education" model.

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Response to csziggy (Reply #57)

Sat Mar 24, 2012, 12:15 PM

247. WRONG! Even his own father said something completely different.

 

His mother said that. His father said he had been suspended for ten days for being in an "unauthorized area" yet would not elaborate. To be suspended that long either involves something violent (which his father denies), stealing (his father says no)...But why not clear it up? One other possibility is graffiti.

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Response to rainy day woman 69 (Reply #247)

Sat Mar 24, 2012, 01:25 PM

249. His father was not the custodial parent and may not have known the exact reason

"He was extremely creative," said Michelle Kypriss, Trayvon's English teacher at Dr. Michael M. Krop Senior High School in Miami. "He just loved building things. He really was intrigued by how things worked."

She described Trayvon, a junior, as an A and B student who majored in cheerfulness.

<SNIP>

Trayvon was under a five-day suspension when he was shot that Sunday night, but Kypriss said it was due to tardiness and not misbehavior.

"Trayvon was not a violent or dangerous child. He was not known for misbehaving," the teacher said. "He was suspended because he was late too many times."
http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-03-17/news/os-trayvon-martin-shooting-tension-20120317_1_shooting-death-english-teacher-uncle

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Response to csziggy (Reply #249)

Sat Mar 24, 2012, 02:40 PM

253. That article's a week old, m'dear!

 

I will post the Miami-Herald one, which contradicts the mother's claim that it was her fault that he was tardy, and that it had nothing to do with tardies at all. Ten-day suspension for being in an unauthorized area and the father won't elaborate. Why? Because it would make Trayvon look bad? Because the lawyer might have said that they cannot allow anything contrary to the image they project of him. I think it's a mistake. If Zimmerman is guilty, then you don't need to make Tray perfect to have Zimmerman indicted.

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/22/2708960/trayvon-martin-a-typical-teen.html

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Response to shadegrown tofu (Reply #253)

Sat Mar 24, 2012, 03:34 PM

256. I'll believe the quote from the teacher at the school

Again, the father is not the custodial parent. He may not have the full story.

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Response to rainy day woman 69 (Reply #247)

Sat Mar 24, 2012, 01:48 PM

250. You created an account just to revive this thread and slam a murdered child?

Enjoy your stay.

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