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Tue Feb 18, 2014, 03:54 PM

Posting T&A threads helps to create a hostile environment for women here.

Perhaps we should just put a little effort into making DU more inclusive rather than just another boys club.


(re Kate Upton's breasts go to outer space or whatever the fuck that crap was.)

762 replies, 26084 views

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Reply Posting T&A threads helps to create a hostile environment for women here. (Original post)
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Response to Warren Stupidity (Original post)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 03:56 PM

1. Thank you

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Response to JustAnotherGen (Reply #1)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 08:48 AM

610. ^this^ +1000

I always suspected that there are quite a few actual ADULT males on this board.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Original post)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 03:56 PM

2. Agreed. Thank you. nt

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Original post)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 03:57 PM

3. Bollocks.

But thanks for playing.

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Response to truebrit71 (Reply #3)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:03 PM

9. So I guess we'll put you in the "DU should be just another boys club. And I'm a progressive"

cognitive dissonance category.

Cause those two things are mutually exclusive, in case you were unaware.

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Response to Squinch (Reply #9)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:14 PM

22. You have to repress your male hormonal urges

in order to be a progressive, otherwise you are suffering from cognitive dissonance!

Thanks for that gem!

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #22)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:18 PM

28. there is no 'male hormonal urge' to post bikini pics at political discussion board.

just like there is no 'hormonal urge' to put up nudie calendars at one's office at the workplace.

that's called 'sense of entitlement'

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #28)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:28 PM

42. Thank you.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #28)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:33 PM

57. Yes. Thank you.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #28)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 05:09 PM

149. Amen, sick of that "we can't help it, it's in our blood" excuse

It is obviously a mere excuse, as so many men don't act that way.

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Response to treestar (Reply #149)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 05:11 PM

153. it's men who think they're martrys for having to respect women's opinions nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #153)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:58 PM

331. +1000% n/m

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Response to treestar (Reply #149)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 05:25 PM

190. Well, you know. "Boys will be boys," and "bonobos do it, so men must too."

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Response to treestar (Reply #149)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:01 PM

336. It can be helped

But it can't be repressed.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #336)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:15 PM

362. CAN'T be repressed?

you must have a lot of trouble out in public.

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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #362)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:19 PM

484. ...

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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #362)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:30 PM

494. ROFL! I loved that answer. nt

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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #362)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 11:37 PM

563. This.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #336)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 04:57 AM

599. The urge to post certain photos cannot be suppressed? LOL!

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #28)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 05:41 PM

220. +1000. nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #28)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:43 PM

313. Very much so.

Thanks.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #28)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:55 PM

327. Gawd, yes. That's exactly what it is. Thank you. nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #28)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:59 PM

333. It's called 'testosterone'

It makes men attracted to, and attractive to, heterosexual women. It drives men to make fools of themselves. It is what it is.

But of course you will never, ever admit that.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #333)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:53 PM

410. No, it's called 'bullshitogen.'

As in, no hormone makes a man go to a liberal political discussion board, then open another window or tab, and search for "blonde in bikini with big boobs", copy the URL, and then post that URL at the political discussion board.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #410)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:06 PM

422. As I said

You will never accept it.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #422)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:09 PM

424. Because it's unscientific magical thinking and inherently misandrist. nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #424)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:26 PM

438. Indeed

...those unscientific hormones!

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #422)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:04 PM

469. Nor should we!

Wallpaper your bedroom with it.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #422)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 12:19 AM

706. Accept what? I'm a heterosexual man, I have a perfectly healthy libido, yet I don't feel the need

to post cheesecake photos in GD! And hell, I admit it, I even posted in that "hot celebrity" thread over in the Men's Group, but at least that was an arguably appropriate venue.

To be honest, indiscriminately spamming the board with bikini photos strikes me as being a lot like watching porn at work, i.e. this is not the place for such things. Would you watch porn at work? Somehow I doubt it...

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Response to nomorenomore08 (Reply #706)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 12:56 AM

714. Your are lecturing me about bikini pictures on a forum?

Err, um.....whatever floats your boat dude..!!

lol

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #714)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 01:31 AM

718. Weren't you just defending your presumed right to post such photos over others' objections?

Really, I like the same kind of stuff you do, I just realize that GD isn't the right venue for it.

But you don't seem to fathom that all anyone is asking for is a little courtesy and discretion. You don't have to repress your natural urges, unless it's that hard for you to refrain from slobbering all over every discussion board you frequent. But honestly I give you more credit than that.

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Response to nomorenomore08 (Reply #718)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 02:06 AM

731. No

I have never argued a desire or right to post bikini pictures, anywhere, ever. That is a strawman. I do, however, believe that running around with ones hair on fire over it for a week solid, is wildly out of proportion to the issue. Don't you agree?

Then BOOM! You drop out of the sky - telling me off about the evils of bikini pictures on internet forums while spewing venom.

Oh, happy day!







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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #731)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 02:20 AM

736. The discussion was about the appropriateness of posting certain images in GD.

I don't see anything "evil" about cheesecake photos - that in itself is a strawman - but it seems you interpret a simple request for discretion as an attempt to repress male heterosexuality, which is such a wild leap in logic I can't even follow it.

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Response to nomorenomore08 (Reply #736)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 02:33 AM

744. I have already clarified that

The op doesn't try to repress anything. Some people who comment may, but the OP doesn't.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #744)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 02:39 AM

746. Okay. I still don't really see what you were objecting to in the first place, but we'll agree

to disagree I guess...

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #333)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:59 PM

415. There is big difference between

having a relatively healthy sexual relationship with a woman and posting boob pics on political boards. I like to fuck, but I don't post pics of it here on DU. There is a time and place for sex. If you want to make a statement by going against sexual cultural norms, then go have sex in a church or something.

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Response to ZombieHorde (Reply #415)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:13 PM

478. +1 nt

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Response to ZombieHorde (Reply #415)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:18 PM

483. hahaha oh you're too funny nt

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #333)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:35 PM

496. Well, I'm very attracted to men, but should I make a fool of myself? Hmm.. nt

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Response to Sarah Ibarruri (Reply #496)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 12:28 PM

634. Well, it's one way to get the point across

I certainly did it over and over back in my dating days.

I think my wife saw my persistence as cute or something.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #634)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 07:55 PM

682. Well, here's a head-up for ya Aging, if I were looking for a guy to date...

the LAST guy I'd ever look at would be someone who buys porn, soft porn, any porn, and spends his life with his tongue hanging out of his mouth ogling females. That's like him wearing a neon sign labeling him this: "LOSER LOSER LOSER."

Just sayin'

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Response to Sarah Ibarruri (Reply #682)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 09:42 PM

689. Um, ok

Not sure why you feel a need to say that, but whatever floats your boat.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #333)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 12:06 AM

569. Surprise, I like to fuck too!

But there are posters here (plenty of them, male and female) that have said posting and/or drooling over borderline softcore porn or metaphorically waving one's dick around in the main forums tends to make them uncomfortable and creates a hostile environment.

No one's demanding you chop your dick off or stop fantasizing about sex. That's just a stupid strawman. Some people around here are getting pretty fucking tired with certain men's sense of entitlement, that they have some God-given right by virtue of their dick to drool over celebrities or make stupid uncomfortable sexist jokes and then demand no one be offended by it.

The stupid reactionary "help help I'm being repressed!" when they're confronted with it is just fucking petty.

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #569)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 12:48 PM

638. Actually they are demanding that

And of course asking a girl out on a date is sexual harassment, didn't ya know? And guys looking at pretty girls? How dare they 'ogle' without permission! It's almost rape! And bikini pictures - PORN!!

They definitely wish to repress, they just lack the power to do so....so they run around with their hair on fire instead. I find it amusing how perplexed some of them seem to be over something so basic to humans.



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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #638)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 12:56 PM

640. Asking a woman out on a date is not sexual harassment.

Trying to hit on a woman on the subway, walking down the street, at Starbucks, in line at the grocery store, or anywhere else when she's clearly not interested or just going about her business is violating her personal space and probably making her uncomfortable. That's when it's harassment.

Trying to call all instances of asking a woman out on a date as sexual harassment is just a strawman erected by people who see their entitlement to act like creeps wherever and whenever they like under attack by the people they're harming.

Outside of the religious right and the extreme fringes of feminism (none of which is represented here), no one is trying to take away your right to masturbate to pictures of women. All they're asking is that you keep that shit to yourself and not make other people uncomfortable.

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #640)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 09:52 PM

690. You said it better than I could've! lol Definitely yes. nt

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Response to NuclearDem (Reply #640)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 12:23 AM

707. "All they're asking is that you keep that shit to yourself and not make other people uncomfortable."

YES! WHY IS IT SO FUCKING HARD???

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #638)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 02:03 PM

651. Wow. That is truly pathetic.

Who says asking a woman out on a date is sexual harassment?

So then you must think that because you shouldn't curse when teaching kindergartners that you can't tell them to behave? Because you shouldn't punch someone in the face you're not allowed to disagree with them? Because it would not be appropriate to walk naked down the street you believe you can't ever wear shorts outside?

That's the leap your logic just took.

If you really think that treating women with respect and consideration is repressing you then you really must enjoy being a rude a-hole all the time. That's what you're arguing in favor of, acting like an ass to women.



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Response to cui bono (Reply #651)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 09:55 PM

691. It is extremely pathetic

And your tainted reaction/perception to what I said is a perfect example of it.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #333)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 05:00 AM

600. Again, we are talking about posting photos,

not about having sex or wanting to have sex.


There is no biological drive to post photos.

Please stop making excuses.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #333)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 10:34 AM

621. At least you admit that men have to make themselves attractive to women somehow

Let me guess. It's by being a good provider.

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Response to treestar (Reply #621)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 12:25 PM

633. Working out in the gym does the trick

My wife makes a lot more money than I do. Keep trying!

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #333)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 10:35 AM

622. So, you just have to fuck in church?

See a pretty woman, and you just have to rip her clothes off right then?

No? You mean you do actually have self-control?

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #28)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:13 PM

358. +++++++++

thank you geek tragedy.

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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #358)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 11:06 AM

626. Completely off topic

But what is the deal with that cat? My cat can't stop watching it. He keeps standing on my keyboard.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #28)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 04:50 AM

598. Thank you. A perfect response.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #22)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:21 PM

30. Or if nothing else, balance those urges

"You have to repress your male hormonal urges..."

Or if nothing else, simply balance those urges with common decency and simple respect for other people.. which is not really very difficult at all for anyone of good will.

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #30)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:57 PM

114. Yes.

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #30)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:15 PM

285. Which ...

Or if nothing else, simply balance those urges with common decency and simple respect for other people.. which is not really very difficult at all for anyone of good will.


would put one in the "progressive" camp.

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #285)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:44 PM

314. +1

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #30)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:04 PM

343. This is the first

...sane response I have seen all day!

Thanks!

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #30)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:20 PM

371. +1

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #30)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:51 PM

407. Had she had been wearing overalls

would it have been decent?

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #30)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 05:02 AM

602. No hormonal urge causes posting on the internet.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #22)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:21 PM

32. So your male hormonal urges must be satisfied in a political discussion board by posting

T&A threads, and belittling women? That's some pretty dumb ass male hormones.

Though I suppose you must have photos of T&A on a political discussion board and belittle women because that's what the bonobos do.

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Response to Squinch (Reply #32)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 05:45 PM

232. The bonobo arguments kills me...

because male bonobos engage in "sword play" then does that mean that when I see my boss we should go all Three Musketeers?

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #232)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 05:47 PM

237. Yes. Yes it does. Because bonobos.



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Response to Squinch (Reply #237)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 05:49 PM

239. Work is about to get freaky...

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #239)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 05:51 PM

245. .



You keep us posted on that, you hear?

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Response to Squinch (Reply #245)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:06 PM

270. I'll try...

but I will probably not be able to pay my internet bill if I do that. Not all of us are as progressive as some Brits

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #270)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:12 PM

278. You're killing me!

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Response to Squinch (Reply #278)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:14 PM

281. But I haven't

unsheathed my sword yet.

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #281)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:19 PM

291. .....

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Response to awoke_in_2003 (Reply #232)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 12:26 AM

708. Okay, now that's fucking funny!

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Response to Squinch (Reply #32)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:51 PM

320. I have posted no "t&a threads" nor have I belittled women on DU

So the answer is no.



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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #320)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:05 PM

344. But when I disagreed with a poster who said

"Bollocks" to the OP, which in turn, said "T&A creates a hostile environment," you said that I was requiring men to violate their natural hormonal urges.

Your statement, and the antecedents it referred to, suggests support for the idea that men must naturally have access to T&A threads, or their natural impulses are being squashed.

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Response to Squinch (Reply #344)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:14 PM

361. The post I replied to

Implied that only repressed males are progressive.

To which I stated otherwise.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #361)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:26 PM

375. The post you replied to said:

"So I guess we'll put you in the "DU should be just another boys club. And I'm a progressive" cognitive dissonance category.

Cause those two things are mutually exclusive, in case you were unaware.


If you read in that some statement that said that "only repressed males are progressive," you need to rethink your assumptions.

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Response to Squinch (Reply #375)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:31 PM

381. To which I stated otherwise

You can be both a man, testosterone and all (boys club), and a progressive.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #381)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:34 PM

385. Nice try. Unless you seriously don't know what a boy's club is. But parse on!

But I am guessing you are fully aware that a boys club excludes women.

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Response to Squinch (Reply #385)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:25 PM

437. This

is devolving into drama.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #437)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:33 PM

444. Actually, I believe we call it a corner.

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Response to Squinch (Reply #444)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:34 PM

446. Call it what you will.

nt

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Response to Squinch (Reply #444)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:22 PM

488. For the win. -n/t

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Response to Squinch (Reply #444)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:44 PM

502. Strawman

is a more accurate term

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #502)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:46 PM

505. Snork!

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #502)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 12:29 AM

709. And your initial argument on this thread wasn't a big honkin' strawman in itself???

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Response to Squinch (Reply #444)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 07:47 AM

753. Ha! Destruction!





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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #320)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:24 PM

374. I've seen you reply mockingly to women when they say that crap is demeaning.

You use the "It's the male hormone biological imperative." pseudo-argument.

You shut down and speak antagonistically to people, put words in their mouth, willfully misinterpret….even when the post you're replying to wasn't combative. Just different from YOUR opinion. I've seen you behave this way. Repeatedly.


Common decency (and real, mature manhood) is behaving properly around other people….not demanding your "right" to wave your equipment around publicly.

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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #374)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:28 PM

378. I have never used the "It's the male hormone biological imperative." pseudo-argument

I have only stated that it is natural for men to like and be attracted to women, and visa-versa. Many take issue with this fact. Some people just do not approve of heterosexual relations period. That is their problem.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #378)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:38 PM

389. that's bullshit. You're doing this very thing all over this thread.

what a load….calling anyone who disagrees with you a person who "do not approve of heterosexual relations period." Misrepresenting your support of T&A on demand, regardless of how it makes women feel, as so-called natural male/female attraction.

In other words, you want the right to throw repellant innuendo all over here, but nobody better call you on it.

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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #389)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:43 PM

394. I have never said

"anyone who disagrees with me is a person who "do not approve of heterosexual relations period."

There are, however, certain people who do wish to repress heterosexual relations, and they are a very, very tiny minority.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #394)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:53 PM

409. "anyone who disagrees with me is a person who "do not approve of heterosexual relations period."

was your implication.

As I said, misrepresentation, putting words in other people's mouths. Selective understanding. Defensive squirming. Denying your own actions.


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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #409)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:22 PM

435. Nope

Thats your wishful fantasy. I have already clarified my position on that, thank you.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #435)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:26 PM

439. OK. Denial denial denial.

Everyone else here sees you clearly, though.





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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #439)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:32 PM

443. More drama

nt

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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #439)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:37 PM

449. Not everyone, thank you.

But I like the kitty gifs.

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Response to GoneOffShore (Reply #449)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:41 PM

453. oh you like the kitty gifs? I'm surprised.

you seem more like the skull-head-wearing-a-hat-with-a-bloody-kitchen-knife-clenched-in-its-teeth kind of guy.

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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #453)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:58 PM

465. Thank you, Blanche for trying to work some sensibility into this thread.

It's hopeless. These dickheads are thoroughly entrenched in their own little dickhead world.

I like your kitty gif, too!!!!

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Response to japple (Reply #465)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:26 PM

491. thanks japple :) I'm trying!

for what it's worth…


yeah….. angry people interested in trolling certainly don't want to discuss issues in an honest, give-and-take dialogue.

Juries often give a pass to the sexist trolls…they hide behind wordplay, and too many juries don't look closely at the whole conversation. They also alert on women whom they've riled up, and juries simplistically react to the that, instead of examining the conversation as a whole.

Also, there's no one facilitating the jury, as a judge would. No one reminding them, for example, that ugly provocation is what's under scrutiny, not frustrated responses trying to defend the denigrated group.





argh!

thank you! It's hilarious, isn't it?

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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #453)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 10:14 PM

520. Kitty's are tasty.

JOKING

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Response to GoneOffShore (Reply #520)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 10:25 PM

524. that's "kitties"

the plural of "kitty" is "kitties". The contraction of "kitty" and "is" is "kitty's", as in "the kitty's not holding a bloody knife clenched between her teeth".

The possessive of "kitty" is "kitty's", as in "the kitty's knife is not clenched between her teeth". Or, "the kitty's hat is being worn by a skull-guy. With a knife clenched between his teeth".

not joking.

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Response to BlancheSplanchnik (Reply #524)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 10:39 PM

530. Oh ah?

Never been too good with the a-pos-trophe-s.

Besides, I've had 4 glasses of wine, an electric brownie and I was up until 3AM and then only got 4 hours sleep.

And I lived in England for 10 years. I get confused with the spilling and grandmeres.

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Response to GoneOffShore (Reply #530)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 10:42 PM

534. well, you're dealing with a grammar nazi here.

but I'll grant lenience…for a brownie. quid pro quo, you know. *snarfle*

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #394)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:18 PM

429. people who wish to repress heterosexual relations are a tiny minority?

 

Which tiny minority would you be referring to?

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Response to RBStevens (Reply #429)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:04 PM

470. Lets just say

some are living on a planet where they do not know, or understand, or WANT to understand, how sex and sexuality work.

That be the tiny minority of which I speak.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #394)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 11:15 PM

553. And they have nothing to do with the people who disagree with you.

You have been using false equivalency left and right.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #378)


Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #378)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 12:31 AM

710. "Some people just do not approve of heterosexual relations period."

You show me one person on here who actually thinks like that. Some of our most "militant" feminist posters have husbands and boyfriends, hell, some of them are men!

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Response to nomorenomore08 (Reply #710)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 12:48 AM

712. Callouts are against the rules

nt

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #712)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 01:30 AM

717. It's just a jury system now. With what they've been leaving lately you'd be safe

So, come on, then. Who here is against heterosexual relations?

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #22)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:30 PM

45. No, no, no...you have to first apologize for being male...

....and THEN repress your male urges silly...

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Response to truebrit71 (Reply #45)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:37 PM

62. there is no 'male urge' to post bikini pics on a political discussion board

please stop acting like showing respect is too big of a burden for us men to bear--you make us look like whiny adolescents

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #62)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:43 PM

74. +1

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #62)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:47 PM

89. "look like"? it seems that mostly, that's what we are.

arrested development.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #89)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:50 PM

97. well, there is that 'hormonal urge' to engage in adolescent self-pity but

somehow most of us manage to rise above on occasion

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #62)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:26 PM

377. Perfect response.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #62)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:02 PM

468. If I still had hearts, you would have gotten them all,

for your outstanding comments in this thread.

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Response to CrispyQ (Reply #468)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:10 PM

477. aw shucks nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #62)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 10:46 PM

536. +1.

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Response to truebrit71 (Reply #45)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:30 PM

441. You repress your male urge to pee in public, right?

This is just one more urge to restrict to the proper place.

Why would you apologize for being a male?

And you only need to apologize for being a jerk if you behave like one.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #441)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:45 PM

504. lol Okay, this one made me laugh so hard, I couldn't repress *my* urge to go pee! nt

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #441)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 02:10 PM

759. I have to admit that I have, at times, failed to repress that urge.

Comes with being over 60. Never trust a fart, never pass up a chance to pee.

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Response to truebrit71 (Reply #45)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:33 PM

445. Because men are evil

and all.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #445)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:47 PM

507. Lib men are very nice. It's right wingers that are evil.

A handful of lib men need a bit of tweaking though.

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Response to Sarah Ibarruri (Reply #507)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 11:26 PM

556. Ding, ding, ding!

We have a winner!

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #556)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 08:00 PM

683. But REAL lib men do not post degrade women to other women

But I think you already knew that.

Now, right wingers who sign on to DU pretending to be lib, then begin to post all kinds of sh*t to degrade women - those are not lib, and I think you knew that already as well.

Yeah?

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Response to Sarah Ibarruri (Reply #683)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 10:07 PM

692. And REAL lib women don't post to degrade men

Ad nauseum, either, as you probably already know.

Else right wing this, or that, or the other...as you probably already know also...whatever point you are trying to make...bloobity blah and all that rot....

Yeah?

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #692)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 10:14 PM

695. I see. So women who protest degradation of women are bad, right?

I think our conversation is just about over.

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Response to Sarah Ibarruri (Reply #695)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 10:33 PM

699. Only when they feel

...that the only way they can do so is by degrading men in the process. Otherwise, I have no problem with it. If you can make a point without trying to be insulting, your point will be well taken. Otherwise, your point will not be well taken.

You see, life is a two way street. We cant spew insults expecting kindness in return. What you give, you get back. What comes around, goes around.









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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #699)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 12:02 AM

704. Degrading men? Asking them to quit the display of ogling and bs is degrading????

Excuse me??? Look, stop talking to me if you're going to be pigheaded, and pretend that people being abused by you are abusing you if they DARE to protest. Bye.

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Response to Sarah Ibarruri (Reply #704)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 12:45 AM

711. Good luck getting men to stop looking at pretty women

Seriously, I wish you all the best in your quest.

Adios

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #711)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 10:27 AM

756. Stop being deceptive. No one asked you to wear blinders. We merely asked you to have some respect

It's not respectful to lower women to the status of a piece of meat.

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Response to Sarah Ibarruri (Reply #756)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 12:49 PM

758. I have never "lowered women to the status of a piece of meat"

If anyone has, it's you guys.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #445)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 11:23 PM

554. Have you thought about working with a therapist?

Self-loathing can be very destructive. The more I read certain posts, the more I am certain that a psychological projection is in place, and renders one unable to have a clear perspective on how one really feels, and what others are actually saying.

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Response to WCLinolVir (Reply #554)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 11:29 PM

559. Do you suffer from self loathing?

Have you thought about working with a therapist? Your level of psychological projection/judgement based upon misinterpretation of internet posts is somewhat perplexing. A good therapist might be able to help you work through that....

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #559)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 12:00 AM

567. I'm not the one who feels suppressed.

I'm not the one with post after post about my gender and how my hormones are driving my urges instead of owning and taking responsibility for my social behavior. And please, don't give me those sad excuses, the ones you keep giving yourself.

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Response to WCLinolVir (Reply #567)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 12:06 AM

570. Neither am I

So what's your point besides a crude attempt at insult?

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Response to WCLinolVir (Reply #567)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 12:44 AM

581. Oh, one more thing

I have made no excuses for my behavior either, because that 'social behavior' doesn't exist with me. Nor am I acting on any hormone driven urges, nor have I stated as much. You just made all of that up. You live in a fantasy world.

Please don't give sad excuses for these things you just made up, just get help.

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Response to truebrit71 (Reply #45)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:40 PM

500. I thought it was the women who had to apologize...

... for objecting to having our gender be treated like a piece of meat. It's just not polite!

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #22)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:42 PM

72. Yes repress. People should repress. Can you imagine if we all ran around wearing our hormonal

urges on our sleeves? It would make for a pretty aggressive society and a charged atmosphere for those who are not welcoming our hormonal advances. Repressing urges in required in civilized society. I repress even in my own household. I might have the hormonal urge to take my wife in the living-room while watching the Posebowl parade, but my kids sitting on the couch might not appreciate how free I am with my unrepressed desires. Repress, suppress, don't press, just act like a decent person in public. Too much to ask?

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Response to Ed Suspicious (Reply #72)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 05:30 PM

203. just act like a decent person in public. Too much to ask?

It seems for many men, yes. I wonder how they would feel if they were always being bombarded with photos of men's penis bulge and tight ass? Would it eventually start to make them think that women objectify them this way, or that they aren't attractive if they don't look like that?

The point you make is important and that is that this is a public place, so people should behave as if they were in a public place. The anonymity of the nets makes it very easy for people to not treat others with respect, and not treat topics as if there were women viewing them too.

It happens on many forums and I find it sad. I'm not easily offended. I understand that men will do this when alone with other men. I just find it sad that men don't see the difference between a boy's only crowd, and a forum that includes all kinds of women.

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Response to Ed Suspicious (Reply #72)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:03 PM

341. We should repress, yes

But I find it amusing how others will tie themselves in knots trying to repress us. Particularly those who don't like men to begin with.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #341)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:32 PM

383. That's a stretch of an assumption to

say that women automatically don't like men, if they are uncomfortable with their bodies being exploited.

Actually that and the majority of your comments are patronizing, condescending and lies - about males and their urges. Seems you need to protect yourself against us macho women trying to repress poor you. Or to defend some inappropriate behavior?


Boo.

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Response to Isoldeblue (Reply #383)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:36 PM

387. It is a stretch

"that women automatically don't like men" because it was never said. Nothing in your screed has anything remotely to do with my point, or reality.

Strawman fail

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #387)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:40 PM

391. Then why say it, as if it were fact?

"Particularly those who don't like men to begin with. "

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Response to Isoldeblue (Reply #391)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:44 PM

396. Because

A very tiny minority do not like men, period.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #396)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:51 PM

405. True and for good reason for some...

But you threw that accusation out in this discussion, when that is not what the topic is about. And you know that.

But you the man! Hoo boy! Oh yea! What a man!!

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Response to Isoldeblue (Reply #405)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 08:43 PM

455. For whatever reason

it is true, yes...just as you say.


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Response to Isoldeblue (Reply #383)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 11:27 PM

557. Mommeeee.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #22)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:43 PM

75. Unless you've got serious demetia, you already are

Controlling your urge to do lots of things, including literal and metaphorical maturbation in public spaces. Are you saying you can't? Or that you just have not enough respect for other people?

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Response to bettyellen (Reply #75)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:07 PM

349. Controlling is necessary

repressing to the point of asexuality is another thing entirely.


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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #349)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 03:21 AM

591. asexual because you are being asked not to post T&A shots in a political forum?

that's asking you to be "asexual"?

Is expecting you not to masturbate in public controlling you and making you asexual?

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Response to VanillaRhapsody (Reply #591)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 03:29 AM

593. I have never posted a T and A shot in a political forum

There are those here who believe asking a woman out on a date is sexual harassment. Or they get bent out of shape if someone mentions opening a car door for their wife. Or freak out if a guy looks at a pretty girl. That is what I am talking about.

Masturbating in public? WTF? Wow, you are dirty minded.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #593)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 06:33 AM

607. Wow, you really don't see nuances, do you.

Asking a woman out on a date can be harassment - if, for example, it happens at 4 a.m. in an elevator after the woman has said several times in public that she does not want to date. And a guy looking at a pretty girl can most certainly be sexual harassment, if it isn't so much glancing as leering, or if, for example, it is accompanied by a cheerful "Are you dirty?" Sound innocuous? Not when it is immediately followed by a "Because if you're dirty, I can start groping you at once, but if you're a prude, I'll sweet talk you into it!" At a bus stop at 11 p.m. on a Saturday night. That isn't sexual harassment?

However, seeing how you have deliberately refused to even think of how it feels for women that t&a pictures are posted right in the middle of a political discussion board, I don't expect you to feel inclined to listen to women's perspectives of those 'innocent' actions you describe - which is really the gist of it. You refuse to acknowledge that what women feel and say have any merit, because your pleasures are more important. How very progressive of you.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #22)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 04:51 PM

102. So are you telling me that you walk around with a boner all day trying to fuck every woman in sight?

Or do you repress your male hormonal urges at work and in restaurants and at the supermarket and...

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Response to cui bono (Reply #102)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:18 PM

290. hey ...

maybe you hit on something there ...

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Response to 1StrongBlackMan (Reply #290)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:40 PM

307. As long as he doesn't hit on me!...


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Response to cui bono (Reply #307)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 06:47 PM

316. From the Arm Chair Psychologist file ...

those that obsess about something are doing so because they lack the ability to carry it out.

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Response to cui bono (Reply #102)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:16 PM

366. No

I stated that you don't have to be a sexually repressed male to be progressive.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #366)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 07:19 PM

369. No one is arguing that. n/t

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Response to cui bono (Reply #369)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:06 PM

472. He provides an endless supply of straw man arguments, doesn't he? nt

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #472)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 09:47 PM

506. List a few

nt

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #506)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 10:01 PM

514. The post I responded to was replying to one:

"I stated that you don't have to be a sexually repressed male to be progressive."


Since no one on this thread or on the SI thread is suggesting that "you . . . have to be a sexually repressed male to be progressive," making that statement, which strongly implies that the complaints about the SI cover thread are saying that "you . . . have to be a sexually repressed male to be progressive" is a straw man argument.

You pretend that people who criticize the posting of such images on DU are suggesting that "you . . . have to be a sexually repressed male to be progressive," and since it would be monumentally stupid to say that one must "be a sexually repressed male to be progressive," pretending to reject a stupid argument that no one is making is the very essence of a straw man argument.

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #514)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 10:11 PM

517. You are referring to the "mutually exclusive" post?

Where I was responding to a strawman that said being 'in the boys club' and being 'progressive' are mutually exclusive AKA cannot exist together?

Hmmmmm, what would that be implying? It implies that you must be a sexually repressed male else you can't be a progressive.

Nice try, perhaps you can take another shot at it?

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #517)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 10:23 PM

523. As I said, I was responding to the post responding to your post that

I quoted directly in my the post you just now responded to.

That post was perhaps a repost of some part of your earlier post, but I quoted that post specifically and identified it specifically.

About the phrase "boys' club": that phrase has a specific meaning. It does not refer to men in general, but only to men who use their position of privilege to exclude and denigrate women.

The chauvinistic male characters on a show like Mad Men are men in a "boys' club." That is why it is not possible to be a "boys' club" kind of guy and at the same time a progressive man.

To not be in the "boys' club" does not mean that a man is sexually repressed. It just means that he doesn't join the sort of male group behavior symbolized by an image of boys in a treehouse or clubhouse with a sign that announces NO GIRLS ALLOWED!!

*(In fact, the image of boys in their treehouse or clubhouse with the sign that says NO GIRLS ALLOWED!! is precisely where the phrase "boys' club" comes from in these discussions of gender politics. The whole idea of a "boys' club" is that girls have cooties and should not be allowed to play.)

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #523)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 10:45 PM

535. You are really streeeetttching

Boys in treehouses? Denigration of women? lololol

How about a group of men that when together act like boys; joking around and goofing around with each other?

Your interpretation is entirely self serving and is itself a strawman argument of your own creation.

Try again?


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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #535)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 11:13 PM

552. NOT a stretch; NOT my "own creation" at all:

Look at how many references I can find in just a few minutes in which other people use the term to refer to the exclusionary aspect of "boys' club" (as well as to the idea of a treehouse or a clubhouse with a "NO GIRLS ALLOWED!!" sign). In fact, I included just such a clubhouse "no girls allowed" sign at the end of my post for your edification. I am going to go through my references and bold a lot of the phrases to help you see them, since I don't trust you to look at the references with an honest intention to understand.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_boy_network
An old boy network, or society (also old boys' club), can refer to social and business connections among former pupils of male-only private schools. British public school students were traditionally called "boys", thus graduated students are "old boys".

This can apply to the network between the graduates of a single school, also known as an old boy society and similar to an alumni association. It can also mean a network of social and business connections among the alumni of various prestigious schools. In popular language, old boy network or old boy society has come to be used in reference to the preservation of social elites in general.


http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=boys%20club
a term for an club that only allows men into their group. often used as a way to get away from their wives/girlfriends and hang out with other like-minded individuals.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20061224195449AA2xZXI
QUESTION:
What's the meaning of "old boys' club" in the paragraph below?

"The world today is not just an old boys' club. It is a vastly more intergrated, more diverse place than it was even a generation ago. Nowhere is that diversity more apparent than in the business world...."

ANSWER:
The 'old boys' club' refers to people in a group, such as a company, or job, that have been around forever, and exclude others from benefits, conversations, etc.

http://www.cyberspaceorbit.com/kentadvice.htm
Nazis= an extension of some kinda weird Chiporee Chipmunk Treehouse Boys' Club.

http://technorati.com/women/article/the-augusta-boys-club-no-girls/

http://pragprog.com/.../2009.../shady-illuminations‎
It sounds like the origin story for a Batman villain. ... No Girls Allowed ... So the boys' club thinking is correct: if you let girls into the clubhouse, they will change everything.

http://idkmybffvodka.tumblr.com/post/67392648667/i-am-not-the-other-woman-i-am-another-voice
Women in comics are still in a boys club. A clubhouse with a sign on the door saying “no girls allowed”.

www.askmen.com/top.../top-10-male-dominated-industries.html‎
A male-dominated industry is like an unofficial boys' club with a “no girls allowed” sign on the front door.

www.giraffeboards.com › The Giraffe Boards › Main › General Blah Blah‎
... of the 'No Girls Allowed Treehouse Clubhouse' of grade school days


http://biker-wear.biker-crossroads.com/Boys-Clubhouse.html‎



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Response to tblue37 (Reply #552)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 11:25 PM

555. I told you what the term 'boys club' means to me.

"no girls allowed!" your interpretation sounds like something from the third grade lol "girls are icky!!: lololol.

Still waiting for those promised strawmen

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #555)

Tue Feb 18, 2014, 11:35 PM

562. Already gave it to you. The fact that you refuse to understand plain

English and recognize a valid example is your problem. I bet other people on this thread would immediately recognize the example I gave as a straw man argument, and the "boys' club" reference as valid.

Just because you want a phrase to mean something, that doesn't mean that is what it actually means. The commonly agreed upon definition is the one that is relevant in a discussion.

When a poster said that you couldn't be part of a "boys' club" while at the same time being a progressive man, you insisted that was not true, and that anyone who said such a thing was claiming that only sexually repressed men could be progressive.

But the poster's statement doesn't mean you must be sexually repressed in order to be progressive (which is just your straw man argument against her statement), because being in a boys' club is not about being male (nor is it about normal sexual expression). It refers refers only to excluding and oppressing women, as my many examples demonstrate.

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #562)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 02:49 AM

589. Your version of what I was talking about

Has nothing to do with what I was talking about.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #589)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 05:39 AM

605. I understand you now. You do not argue in good faith. nt

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #555)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 03:23 AM

592. You are seriously going to pretend you don't really know what the "Boys Club" is?

serious????

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Response to VanillaRhapsody (Reply #592)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 03:33 AM

594. There is no DU 'Boys Club'

It is made up. It doesn't exist.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #594)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 03:59 AM

596. I didn't think so either....until I started reading things sai on threads since SI Swimsuit came out

boy have MY eyes been opened!

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Response to VanillaRhapsody (Reply #596)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 04:01 AM

597. The whole SI thing

was blown way out of proportion.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #597)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 02:14 PM

652. No, it wasn't.

And the fact that you keep arguing in favor of acting like an asshole to women proves it. And I have found out that the SI thread was only the tip of the iceberg. I can't believe the rampant misogyny that is allowed on DU. It's horrendous.

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Response to cui bono (Reply #652)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 02:18 PM

654. Yes it was

How many threads, 10 or 12? It was blown way out of proportion. I have never argued in favor of 'acting like an asshole to women' either. You just made that up.

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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #654)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 02:25 PM

655. No it wasn't. Unless you are completely unaware of the objectification of women in society

and that this is supposed to be a progressive board that treats everyone as equals.

Glad to hear you are not arguing in favor of acting like an asshole to women. So then you agree with the OP. What are you arguing about in here then? And why do you say the SI thread was blown out of proportion if you aren't arguing in favor of disrespecting women?

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Response to cui bono (Reply #655)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 03:02 PM

666. The first "SI thread"

Was fine. The next five SI threads rehashed the same themes over and over and went nowhere. The next 5 or 6 SI threads devolved into infighting and insults. It all eventually becomes like a dog chasing it's tail.

Men objectify women. Women objectify men. Men objectify themselves. Women objectify themselves. Lesbians objectify other lesbians. Gay men objectify other gay men. Feminists objectify women. Objectification will always be with us. Perhaps feminists should start objectifying men....in the name of equality. All we can ever hope to achieve is a happy medium among cat herd of humanity.

I have never argued 'in favor of disrespecting women', though you keep insinuating that I have. Have you ever argued in favor of disrespecting men? It's all so simple, yet all so complicated!

Isn't life wonderful!!







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Response to AgingAmerican (Reply #666)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 04:13 PM

667. I disagree with you about the first SI thread if that's the one that announced the cover

and posted it in the OP.

And to lump all objectification together is to disregard the societal problem that it is for women. Men are the ones in power. They make more than women for the same work. They are not oppressed as women are. There are not laws being made by women to invade a man's body with an instrument, to force men to be an incubator with legs.

To say everyone objectifies everyone is akin to saying there are black racists. So what? That doesn't change the fact that it's blacks who are oppressed in this country and that that is the real issue, not white oppression.

I'm glad that you don't want to argue in favor of disrespecting women. I would ask that you reconsider whether or not that SI thread was disrespectful to women since as you can see, many women feel it is. And if you don't understand why they feel that way, I would ask that you not participate in it in order to show respect and consideration to women as a whole on a political discussion board.

Basically my request is just that you and others show consideration even if you don't get what the problem is.

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Response to cui bono (Reply #667)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 07:01 PM

674. Would you object to a gay DUer posting a picture of two men kissing? Some people would, so

should this behavior be discouraged because it bothers a few? Do people have a right to not be offended on a progressive board?

What about pictures of people eating meat - surely this is terribly offensive to vegans, but does that give them the right to demand that it stop?

I agree with the poster who felt that the whole SI cover issue was an overreaction.

When I see things I don't like, I just ignore them.

And further, this issue goes far beyond posting pictures on a message board. There is a very vocal group that seems to be demanding that people not view such material even in the privacy of their own homes. They argue that the very existence of such material and the prurient viewing of it harms women. But again, there are quite a few people who, ould argue that the very existence of gay man kissing is harmful.

I say, get over it. There is no civil right to traipse through life un-offended at every turn.

All thought police can kiss my ass.

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Response to Flatulo (Reply #674)

Wed Feb 19, 2014, 10:15 PM

696. That's not the same thing. It's not just about it bothering someone, it's about a societal problem.

I think a more apt analogy would be is it okay to show a pic of discriminating against gays and cheering it on. And no, that would not be okay.

There is a societal problem with objectifying women that has dire results. It's about seeing women as less than a human being, as a piece of meat. The argument I made and saw others make is that it is inappropriate to ogle women on a political board, much as it would be in the workplace. Would you put up that cover in your office and then remark out loud which one of those models you wanted when everyone could hear you? I doubt it. I could care less what you do in your own home, though I may debate whether or not it is beneficial or harmful to society. People discuss spanking as well, circumcision, there are a lot of personal choices that are discussed. It's not about the choice you make at home, it's about the choice to throw it in women's faces in public.

There's nothing about this situation that has anything to do with controlling thoughts. I don't really know how you ended up there.

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Response to cui bono (Reply #696)

Thu Feb 20, 2014, 12:05 AM

705. No, I would not display that in the workplace. But there's a tradeoff to be made. Censuring

someone for posting a swimsuit pic on the internet is silly, IMO. I do understand that many people are concerned about objectification of women, but really, any picture depicting anyone in a flattering way can be used for prurient purposes. I find that professional women dressed in conservative business suits really does it for me.

And if the workplace is going to be the standard by which we measure the appropriateness of posts, then I would submit that F-bombs are also inappropriate. This would leave some people, myself includes, nearly speechless. For example, Redqueen (this isn't a a callout, just a factual observation) uses the F word quite liberally. If I were a Mormon, I might find this to be horribly offensive.

Skinner has to make certain tradeoffs - he has to balance the right of some members to not be offended (a right that I maintain doesn't exist), versus making DU a place where people can post all sorts of ideas, many of them truly terrible, without fear of being censured. Debated, yes - but censured, no.

My remark about thought control was in regards to recent posts in HoF encouraging people to consciously alter their thought patterns in order to make objectification impossible. Ick. Thoughtcrime.

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