Ben Franklin, whistleblowing leaker of government secrets

[friendly_iconoclast]

http://boingboing.net/2013/12/27/ben-franklin-whistleblowing-l.html

Ben Franklin, whistleblowing leaker of government secrets

Cory Doctorow at 12:00 pm Fri, Dec 27, 2013
Benjamin Franklin was a leaker of government secrets, who circulated intercepted letters from the colonial lieutenant governor of Massachusetts Bay to the British government. The letters detailed a scheme to take away colonists' legally guaranteed freedoms "by degrees" and called for more troops to keep order during the process. After the letters were published, Franklin admitted to leaking them, but refused to give up his source. The crown called it "thievery and dishonor" and he was fired from his postmaster general gig (thankfully, there was no Espionage Act on the books at the time).

http://harryblutstein.com/history/wikileaks/

The Treason of Benjamin Franklin
April 6, 2012

Stop me if you’ve heard this before. A public figure receives a cache of leaked government documents whose contents is so explosive that it will embarrass the government, incite insurgents and encourage them to attack government officials. It could even bring on a war. The person leaking these documents is quickly identified and dealt with by authorities, but more of this later.

Who could I be writing about? Perhaps Bradley Manning, the US army soldier, who was arrested in May 2010 in Iraq on suspicion of having passed on restricted material? Or it could be Julian Assange, who published over 250,000 on his website Wikileaks of US diplomatic cables, the largest set of restricted documents ever leaked to the public? And when might I be writing about? Possibly April 5, 2010, when WikiLeaks posted on its site the Iraq video, titled ‘Collateral Murder’. It showed U.S. Army Apache helicopter air strikes in an eastern district of Baghdad in July 2007, which killed two staffers for Reuters and a dozen or more others. This was followed by a flood of classified documents from diplomatic and military sources that has rocked the US Administration, embarrassed it allies and encouraged the enemies of the US. And finally, what about holding those responsible for the leaks to account? Well, Bradley Manning is in a military jail awaiting court-martial proceedings. He faces 22 charges including “aiding the enemy,” which can carry the death sentence. Julian Assange is holed up in England, fighting the Swedish government, who are trying to extradite him so they question him about a sexual assault. At the same time, the US government has convened a Grand Jury, which has met in secret to determine whether the leaks have breached the Espionage Act of 1917. There is every reason to believe that Grand Jury has prepared charges against Assange, and the US government will start extradition proceeding as soon as he arrives in Sweden, where they judge they have a better chance of success than in Great Britain. If convinced, Assange could be executed.

The case I’m referring to has nothing to do with WikiLeaks, Assange or Manning. Called the Hutchinson Letters Affair, it began in December, 1772 when Benjamin Franklin, who was in England at the time, anonymously received a packet of thirteen letters. They were reports by Thomas Hutchinson, the lieutenant governor of the Province of Massachusetts Bay, to Thomas Whately, a leading member of the British government. In the letters, Hutchinson made some damning comments about colonial rights. Even more provocative, Hutchinson recommended that popular government be taken away from the colonists “by degrees”, and that there should be “abridgement of what are called English liberties”. Specifically, he argued that all colonial government posts should be made independent of the provincial assemblies. Finally, he urged his superiors to send more troops to Boston to keep American rebels under control.

Understanding the inflammatory nature of these letters, Franklin circulated the letters to his American friends and colleagues but on the condition that they not be published. Clearly in the public interest, at least from the point-of-view of American revolutionaries, the letters were published, in defiance of Franklin’s request, in the Boston Gazette in June of 1773....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hutchinson_Letters_Affair


Standing by for the inevitable "But that was different !"...

[babylonsister]

1. Haha, and THIS is why I love DU! Thanks! nt

[Savannahmann]

2. Waiting for the Authoritarians and the Cheerleaders to demand

Immediate removal of Ben from the $100 bill.

[KittyWampus]

3. Please, you would have been one of the purity patriots calling Franklin a traitor...

Franklin played England and France against each other… he was one of the first American "triangulators".

He also dragged his feet on the issue of independence from England.

And yes, there were some of the guys at home bad-mouthing Franklin for not being resolute enough.

From the tone of your juvenile name-calling, it's almost certain you'd have been one of them.

[MannyGoldstein]

5. Playing England and France against each other is just like

playing Social Security recipients off against the 1%.

And Franklin was an outspoken critic of the Crown for years prior to the Revolution.

Ratfuckingly yours,

Manny

[Phlem]

6. +1000000

-p

[ConservativeDemocrat]

9. Another juvenile response...

..as typical. And devoid in logic, as is typical as well.

Franklin was indeed not just a critic, but an outright traitor to the British Crown, which means your comparing Snowden to Franklin is essentially calling Snowden a traitor to the United States. Not that I particularly disagree, but presumably that's not what you really mean to argue.

- C.D. Proud Member of the Reality Based Community

[friendly_iconoclast]

11. Would you include Daniel Ellsberg in there, too?

[ConservativeDemocrat]

14. It's not me making the comparison. It's you.

So maybe you should answer your own question. Just as Ben Franklin was clearly a traitor to the British Crown, Snowden is a traitor to the U.S. Was Ellsberg?

To help you make up your mind, please note that unlike Snowden, Ellsberg turned himself in publicly. He didn't flee to the Soviet Union. Also, the documents he revealed illegally were mere analyses of the Vietnam war and our chances of success, not things that could be used by our enemies in an actionable way.

There is absolutely no question that Snowden's revealing the methods and specifics of what the NSA tracks to try to catch terrorist communications, Snowden has warned terrorists away from certain things they might otherwise have thought safe. He also seems to be spending most of his time trying to damage U.S. relations with foreign countries, revealing details of completely legal signal intelligence programs.

So I think you maybe should give Ellsberg a pass, unlike the treasonous Snowden. But I'm not sure you will, as logic clearly isn't your strong suit.

- C.D. Proud Member of the Reality Based Community

[friendly_iconoclast]

22. You elide his revelation of illegal activities by the NSA against American citizens

S'okay- most other NSA apologists do as well

Let's also not forget another item that would still obtain even if you were right
and I was wrong:

NSA's piss-poor operational security

I'd point out that it was NSA's lackadaisical approach to security
that enabled him to find all this stuff and smuggle it out.
Which brings up a thought that should have all of us losing sleep:

What if Snowden isn't the only one out there?

Someone (or someones) less inclined to seek publicity? I strongly suspect that even if one or more
additional "Snowdens" are discovered, the original Snowden will
still be held responsible. Easier to maintain the public image than
take difficult steps to improve security...

[Union Scribe]

16. You guys are really hung up

on thinking you're adults and everyone who disagrees with you is a child. It's a rather, well, childish thing to keep insisting.

[friendly_iconoclast]

24. We at DU are blessed with only the most sensible woodchucks...

[MannyGoldstein]

4. Franklin was also a Socialist

He started the US Post Office.

[Savannahmann]

7. I remember the story about that

He used a counter to measure the number of turns a wagon wheel would make between all the towns, and then set the routes up in the most efficient manner. As scientific a manner as was possible in the time.

I'd go into his letters from France, where he described the art works there. But now he's a traitor and shall be expunged from the record of our History.

[Rex]

18. +1

A wonderful Socialist.

[iamthebandfanman]

8. So where does it say Franklin

gave up secrets to other nations ?

cause, all I see is him whistle blowing for the American people and their rights... which if that had been all snowden had done, would be more than perfectly fine...
nothing about traveling to Russia and telling them secrets about the colonies.. no running to china and letting them know some too.. then sending out letters to other foreign nations letting them in on some secrets about them too..

[friendly_iconoclast]

10. It's not about Franklin OR Snowden, it's about disclosing government malfeasance.

[friendly_iconoclast]

12. I suspect Snowden has lots on the Russians and Chinese, as well

Why do you think he's still breathing?

[sabrina 1]

19. Franklin did much worse than that. In case you forgot, or didn't know, America was ruled

by the British at that time, and people like Franklin were LOYAL to 'his' King until the inequities being heaped on the colony became so unacceptable they committed HIGH TREASON by plotting to overturn the King and replace him with a new, secular government.

What Snowden has done pales by comparison, all he wants is for our Government to abide by the law of the land.

[VanillaRhapsody]

27. This hits the trifecta...

first he was compared to Thomas Jefferson, then earlier today George Washington and now Ben Franklin...

How ridic!

[friendly_iconoclast]

29. Franklin and Snowden both leaked government secrets

It's a perfectly good analogy...

[VanillaRhapsody]

31. Oh HELL no it is not...

Franklin didn't run like a coward and hide behind Putin!

That's just more ridiculousness!

[friendly_iconoclast]

38. Personally, I don't give a rat's ass about Snowden one way or the other

What I care about is what he revealed. I found the Franklin tidbit to be a good way to
twit the cult of anti-personality-and so it turned out to be.

The near-aneurysm displayed by several posters shows the perspicacity of that...

[VanillaRhapsody]

39. oh yes you do. Denial is not a river in Egypt.

because you are insulting the Founding Fathers with this drivel.

and now you just admitted you were trolling other DU'ers to "twit the cult..." as you said.

Have you no shame at all? Good Day Sir!

[friendly_iconoclast]

41. Quod erat demonstrandum...

I'll be here if you're ever in a mood to discuss what Snowden leaked, as opposed to the
man himself.

[VanillaRhapsody]

43. then why are you so defensive for him?

[friendly_iconoclast]

49. You conflate support for the act with support for the actor

Of course, it *must* be about Snowden for certain posters
- that way, discussion of his revelations can be avoided

[VanillaRhapsody]

50. No in fact I do not...have you been reading DU these last few months or is this your first day here?

The Fandom for Snowden around here is constant. He is apparently not to be criticized by some here. As of this thread he has been compared to 3 Founding Fathers....


Tell me that isn't hilarious?

I am waiting for him to be compared to Jesus or Mother Tereasa any day now.

[friendly_iconoclast]

51. For all I know, the guy burns kittens alive and wants to be Feliks Dzerzhinsky

It doesn't matter- making it all about Snowden enables the steering of the conversation
away from what he revealed and towards a discussion of personality

[VanillaRhapsody]

52. It DOES matter....he apparently walks on water. THAT is what this thread was about...

or did you not read the OP?

[friendly_iconoclast]

53. Not to me, he doesn't. I point out a case of situational ethics.

Franklin reveals secrets of the government he worked for, revealing acts against the
populace and undoubtedly helping its great rival France- but is now a
hero because his side (ours) won.

Snowden reveals secrets of the government he worked for, revealing acts against the populace
and possibly (it remains unproven) helping its great rivals.

[VanillaRhapsody]

54. Baloney...NO Comparison! And by the way....I thought you said it wasn't about Snowden

you cannot have it both ways...either it is or it isnt.

Ben Franklin is laughing his ass off from the grave at the mere notion. Someone above who apparently knows an awful lot about Franklin pointed out why you are wrong about him!

Besides...Franklin didn't run like a coward did he?

By the way...Franklin and the other Founding Fathers were actual Traitors to the Crown of England...

Aren't you therefore admitting that Snowden is a Traitor by just making the comparison?

[friendly_iconoclast]

55. Revealing the *domestic* surveillance was necessary and I'm glad Snowden did it.

For those upset about that, all I can say is: Fuck the NSA, its apologists/shills and the horses they rode
in on. Such techniques were wrong when they were called Project SHAMROCK, and they
are just as wrong in the 21st century

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_SHAMROCK

https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2005/12/project_shamroc.html

Twenty years ago, Senator Frank Church warned of the dangers of letting the NSA get involved in domestic intelligence gathering. He said that the "potential to violate the privacy of Americans is unmatched by any other intelligence agency." If the resources of the NSA were ever used domestically, "no American would have any privacy left.... There would be no place to hide.... We must see to it that this agency and all agencies that possess this technology operate within the law and under proper supervision, so that we never cross over that abyss. That is an abyss from which there is no return."

https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2005/12/project_shamroc.html

If you want to read and store the communications of Americans, go to court and get a warrant
(and yes, it was always possible to get a retroactive warrant claiming exigent circumstances)

[VanillaRhapsody]

57. Just who are you calling "apologists"?

anyone who opposes what Snowden did (which is criminal by the way).

You cannot separate the two thoughts apparently which is why the term "fanboys of Snowden" was created.

He has been laughably compared to 3 Founding Fathers so far....

still waiting for one to compare him to Jesus....as he does apparently "walk on water"

[friendly_iconoclast]

58. Approval of some of his acts is not giving him a character reference

He should have kept schtum about the foreign intelligence, and I'm pretty certain he has
probably revealed just enough to the Russians and Chinese for them to want
him to stay alive and healthy. The US government isn't the only one with a
dead man's switch to worry about...

[VanillaRhapsody]

59. Well now we can add Rosa Parks to the list

along with 3 Founding Fathers....


Can Jesus be far behind?

[joshcryer]

33. Not just that, but the whole US was founded to stop inequality crap.

The US was founded so that rich white men could have their say, we didn't even get suffrage for hundreds of years, we were still using slaves for decades, equal voting rights weren't enjoyable until the past 50 years or so, and we're still fighting for equal representation.

Christ.

[VanillaRhapsody]

34. and your point is? Some countries DO NOT have a method to change laws...

we do.

Christ..yourself.

[joshcryer]

36. What? I was agreeing with you.

But let's not kid ourselves that the founding fathers were these great people who wanted a perfectly liberal society. Franklin, this harbinger of "freedom and equality" like Snowden was a damn slaver. For 20 years he profited off of the slave trade. It wasn't until the end of his life he changed his tune but he never publicly came out against slaving.

The hyperbole is outright diabolical.

Yes, the US was the first lasting democracy, and yes Washington shook world philosophy when, at the time Kings ruled the day, he stepped down. Shockingly. A man giving up all power. But we must condition this on the social policy of the times. The founding fathers had their flaws and the biggest flaw wasn't that they were for absolute equality. It is not wrong to admit this.

It is wrong to revise history, compare Snowden to the founding fathers, and, hilariously, act as if they have anything in common whatsoever.

[VanillaRhapsody]

37. Okay thanks Sorry I misunderstood you at first..

that is exactly what I was trying to say.

The comparison is ridiculous and shows the level of desperation those that support this coward has sunk to.

[riderinthestorm]

25. Please provide proof that Snowden gave secrets to foreign governments. Thanks nt

[VanillaRhapsody]

32. Has he provided it to you?

please provide evidence that providing it to you is NOT also providing it to foreign governments...

Or else he has provided nothing to no one!

[friendly_iconoclast]

13. Just as predicted, the marmota have shown up with sensible advice...

Last edited Sat Dec 28, 2013, 08:03 PM - Edit history (1)

[sabrina 1]

15. But he broke the law!! He didn't do it the 'right way'. He WAS a traitor.

And for the record, it was not only NOT different to what Snowden, Manning, Tice, Binney et al did, it was WORSE.

HE ended up plotting to overthrow the King. Not just expose corruption which is entirely different.

That is pure treason. And certainy was at the time. Good thing they won, or we would be singing 'God Save the Queen' and pointing to the FFs as some of the most treasonous monsters in history.

[VanillaRhapsody]

28. not was IS

Last edited Sun Dec 29, 2013, 04:27 PM - Edit history (1)

and you forgot coward...which he also is!

[treestar]

17. This is not the least bit similar, because Franklin was part of a revolution

He knew he could be hung as a traitor and took that risk for freedom from Britain. He would not have released any information to the world in general - he was fighting for America to exist. He didn't want them published, obviously, as that would alert the British.

This one is a true fail. I know the Snowy fans think they have something here, but they don't. The difference is obvious. Eddie didn't stay here to help found a new nation FFS.

[sabrina 1]

20. You're right, Franklin committed outright treason. Snowden exposed corruption in the government

with the intention of having the Government end it.

There is simply no comparison to Whistle Blowing and blatant treason.

Good thing they won or their lives would have been very short and they would be viewed by US as the most monstrous traitors in history and we would all be pledging allegience to the Crown.

[friendly_iconoclast]

23. Ever notice that the marmota *never* want to discuss the illegal stuff...

...Snowden revealed?

[sabrina 1]

26. Yes, I have noticed that. It's all about distraction because to discuss the actual illegalities,

the expansion of the policies we opposed so strongly under Bush, is probably too difficult for them to even try to defend. They tried the 'this is old news' routine but that didn't work. Even the president has had to admit that some of his statements in the beginning, were wrong.

For Americans nothing should matter except the fact that since 9/11 many in our Government have taken advantage of that tragedy in order to suppress and destroy the Constitutional Rights of the American people.

[VanillaRhapsody]

35. Notice how some people cannot seperate Snowden FROM the NSA story?

I have. Yet these same folks will say "it's not ABOUT Snowden"? I have....

blather blather blather....We love Snowden he is our hero...blather blather blather..

[sabrina 1]

40. It has become way, way more than Snowden, if it ever was about him. Was it about Binney, Manning,

Ellsberg, Tice et al? So many Whistle Blowers over the past decade. Why do you think that people have risked their careers to become Whistle Blowers, some of them long time career military personnnel who could have retired in great comfort? Maybe they cared about their country?

Surely you do not support what Bush/Cheney were doing to this country? Most of the early Whistle Blowers were originally Bush supporters, but when they witnessed what they were doing to this country they chose to try to protect it rather than remain silent and simply retire in comfort. Most of them suffered greatly and back then, WE, Democrats applauded them for speaking out.

What happened? We are still talking about Bush policies which at one time Democrats were outraged by. When did Democrats STOP being outraged by Bush policies and violations of our Constitutional Rights? I must have missed something because I still oppose all of Bush's crimes against the people.

[friendly_iconoclast]

42. There are Straussians in the current administration and Democratic Party

Last edited Mon Dec 30, 2013, 03:22 PM - Edit history (1)

They naturally hate Snowden.

Striking at the "bad" (i.e. Reagan/Bush/Cheney) Straussian faction was marginally acceptable.
Hurting the "good" Straussians is beyond the pale, however.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/11782920

So why does searching behind the throne feel so necessary to so many? Notes on the Straussian in US

... Shulsky received his doctorate from the University of Chicago studying under Strauss, who attracted a cult following of neocons with his theories about politics and human nature. Shadia Drury, author of several books on Straussian political philosophy, said that Leo Strauss believed that "truth is not salutary, but dangerous, and even destructive to society--any society." ...

According to Shulsky and Schmitt, for the United States to operate with good intelligence, it should stop being a naïve player in a very cruel world. Given that adversaries aim to deceive, these two Straussian intelligence analysts warned that astute intelligence experts "can rarely be confident of the solidity of the foundations on which they are building; they must be open to the possibility that their evidence is misleading." Hence, effective intelligence should rely more on analysis of the intentions of adversaries rather than on details and uncertainties.

In her book Leo Strauss and the American Right, Shadia Drury elaborates on Strauss' view that a political aristocracy must necessarily manipulate the masses for their own good. The Straussian worldview, according to Drury, contends that "perpetual deception of the citizens by those in power is critical because they need to be led, and they need strong rulers to tell them what's good for them."...

- Leo Strauss and Intelligence Strategy
http://www.rightweb.irc-online.org/articles/display/Leo_Strauss_and_Intelligence_Strategy

[sabrina 1]

45. I almost forgot where they got their 'philosophy' from. Ledeen, Cheney et al. Leo Strauss

And Maciavelli. They are psychopaths, all of them and they have infested this Government.

I remember reading about Strauss a while ago, thanks for the reminder.

[VanillaRhapsody]

44. Funny....everytime his name is brought up...there you are!

but it's not about him right? Yet you defend his honor on and on and on...just like I described. Even when compared to not one but 3 Founding Fathers now!

No one can ever criticize him in your eyes....but its not about him...yeah right!

Still waiting for someone to compare him to Ghandi or Jesus and watch you try to defend THAT comparison!

[sabrina 1]

46. Massive spying on the American people, a complete violation of the Constitution and thankfully now

the matter has finally reached a REAL COURT, rather than the 'secret court' we have an actual SANE opinion on the unconstitutionality of the NSA violations of the rights of the American people.

You don't seem to want to talk about that for some reason.

'every time his name comes up' you resort to OLD right wing talking points. Why is that?

Snowden is a hero! So is Manning, Binney and every other Whistle Blower who had the guts to stand up for their country.

[VanillaRhapsody]

47. blah blah blah...Not about Snowden....blah blah blah.

Hero worship at its finest.

the difference in Snowden's case....he is a turn-coat coward hiding behind Putin comrade now!

and I don't see Manning being compared to any Founding Fathers lately. The comparison is a disgrace.

When someone compares Snowden to Ghandi or Mandela...will you defend that too? How about Jesus or Muhammed?

[Brickbat]

21. Also a kickass five-and-dime store, back in the day.

[Lars39]

30. One of my favorite stores :-)

[Rex]

48. Notice who is absent from this thread?

Authoritarians make America suck!

[woo me with science]

56. K&R