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Sun Oct 13, 2013, 06:45 AM

IMF suggests nations tax the rich to lower deficits

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/10/11/international-monetary-fund-strongly-suggests-countries-tax-the-rich-to-fix-deficit/

Tax the rich and better target the multinationals: The IMF has set off shockwaves this week in Washington by suggesting countries fight budget deficits by raising taxes.

“We had to read it twice to be sure we had really understood it,” said Nicolas Mombrial, the head of Oxfam in Washington. “It’s rare that IMF proposals are so surprising.”

Guardian of financial orthodoxy, the International Monetary Fund, which is holding its annual meetings with the World Bank this week in the US capital, typically calls for nations in difficulty to slash public spending to reduce their deficits.

But in its Fiscal Monitor report, subtitled “Taxing Times”, the Fund advanced the idea of taxing the highest-income people and their assets to reinforce the legitimacy of spending cuts and fight against growing income inequalities.


The IMF is speaking out against the Republican Party. While in D.C.

44 replies, 1936 views

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Arrow 44 replies Author Time Post
Reply IMF suggests nations tax the rich to lower deficits (Original post)
RainDog Oct 2013 OP
Turbineguy Oct 2013 #1
Initech Oct 2013 #37
truebluegreen Oct 2013 #2
RKP5637 Oct 2013 #28
MarchemintotheSea Oct 2013 #3
leftyohiolib Oct 2013 #8
Cosmocat Oct 2013 #4
tecelote Oct 2013 #5
RKP5637 Oct 2013 #30
B Calm Oct 2013 #6
BillyRibs Oct 2013 #7
malaise Oct 2013 #9
yardwork Oct 2013 #10
RainDog Oct 2013 #13
yardwork Oct 2013 #16
RainDog Oct 2013 #20
YoungDemCA Oct 2013 #42
RainDog Oct 2013 #43
RKP5637 Oct 2013 #31
RainDog Oct 2013 #38
MH1 Oct 2013 #11
RainDog Oct 2013 #12
MH1 Oct 2013 #18
mountain grammy Oct 2013 #19
PETRUS Oct 2013 #14
RainDog Oct 2013 #15
PETRUS Oct 2013 #17
RainDog Oct 2013 #23
PETRUS Oct 2013 #26
RainDog Oct 2013 #27
MH1 Oct 2013 #22
PETRUS Oct 2013 #25
mountain grammy Oct 2013 #21
RainDog Oct 2013 #24
doc03 Oct 2013 #29
RainDog Oct 2013 #33
lonestarnot Oct 2013 #32
Uncle Joe Oct 2013 #34
RainDog Oct 2013 #35
Uncle Joe Oct 2013 #36
kentuck Oct 2013 #39
RainDog Oct 2013 #40
BluegrassStateBlues Oct 2013 #41
RainDog Oct 2013 #44

Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 06:56 AM

1. Teabaggers have a better plan

Destroy the world economy and deficits won't matter.

At least they think it's a better plan.

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Response to Turbineguy (Reply #1)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 05:36 PM

37. They're using the South Park underpants gnomes system of economics.

Step 1: destroy global economy.

Step 2: ????

Step 3: Profit

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 07:06 AM

2. well, well, well...

some of our children is learning!

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Response to truebluegreen (Reply #2)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 10:15 AM

28. +++ 1,000 +++ n/t

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 07:27 AM

3. Well it beats the past policies of Kill the Poor!

 

and the IMF will become a Marxist, Socialist Communist Organization in ......3.......2.......1.......

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Response to MarchemintotheSea (Reply #3)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 08:00 AM

8. you forgot kenyan muslim

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 07:32 AM

4. Uh ...

Not sure that advocating for the obvious will carry much weight in the conservative spin media.

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 07:46 AM

5. Hah!

They have come to realize that the poor and what's left of the middle class just don't have enough money to be concerned with.

They're turning on each other.

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Response to tecelote (Reply #5)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 10:24 AM

30. I think you're onto something. After the poor and middle class are carved out they will

have to start devouring the lower echelons of their own, and they will do that, their lower echelons of wealth will become the "new" poor and middle class to be decimated to enhance the wealth of the top dogs. They have no sense of loyalty, conscience or respect, not even for their own. They are fueled by greed, only the acquisition of $$$$$ counts, it is really a sickness and is destructive to a healthy society.

And, they destroyed the safeguards over the years, such as, a functioning progressive taxation system. They will eat their own, then finally, maybe, they will cave in and be gone ... and a healthy society will replace the ravages left after their gorging.


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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 07:51 AM

6. Well duh, we been saying it for years! Instead,

our republicans want to spank the low paid working people!

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 07:57 AM

7. Dear IMF,

 

YA THINK!?

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 08:02 AM

9. So then are they returning to Keynes

because it's been all Hayek and Friedman for the past 40 years.

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 08:03 AM

10. Wow! The IMF models must show that things are looking very dire.

Their data must be pretty scary. My guess is that they're seeing a future where countries fall apart due to economic insecurity. That's not good for rich people.

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Response to yardwork (Reply #10)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:19 AM

13. A strong middle class is the strongest indicator of a strong democracy

The U.S. has been losing its middle class since the 1980s.

http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/41421642?uid=2&uid=4&sid=21102767499123

Not to say the IMF cares about democracy, but the alternatives are all worse, so maybe the recent populist revolt from the right is stirring concerns about political instability in the U.S. because of a failure to address growing economic inequality.

There are lots of lessons from history about the damage to nations from economic crises.

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Response to RainDog (Reply #13)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:36 AM

16. Europe is worse off than the U.S. economically. Things are getting bad globally.

Plus the IMF probably acknowledges global climate change.

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Response to yardwork (Reply #16)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:46 AM

20. and austerity is to blame

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/oct/10/austerity-europe-debt-red-cross

the lesson, over and over again, is that cuts in a recession don't help - something Krugman wrote about extensively during the 2008 crisis - and he noted the stimulus wasn't sufficient. But when you consider what the administration was up against, it was what could be done.

But, obviously, it was not good to bail out the bankers and let the homeowners lose their homes...

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Response to RainDog (Reply #13)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 08:41 PM

42. "A strong democracy" is not a desired goal for the rich...

In fact, the rich have done an awful lot throughout history-whether in America or in other countries-to undermine democracy, or at least manipulate the democratic process for their own ends.

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Response to YoungDemCA (Reply #42)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 08:51 PM

43. "The rich" are not a monolith

just as the middle class is not (c.f. the tea baggers.)

c.f. The Roosevelt family, etc. etc. etc.

sometimes people recognize a crisis and respond.

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Response to yardwork (Reply #10)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 10:30 AM

31. That, is the path we are currently on, countries will definitely fall apart as

the financial destruction of the majority continues, it's just a matter of time, and what could replace them is a good guess. The IMF wants to ensure the wealthy elite survive as the top dogs.

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Response to RKP5637 (Reply #31)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 06:29 PM

38. In this case, the wealthy and the middle and lower classes are on the same side

because the suffering from an economic catastrophe that the Republican Party is offering will hurt ordinary people far more than it will hurt the wealthy.

And it is in such hard economic times that fascist movements gain strength (i.e. Golden Dawn and Ted's Cruzaders)

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 08:16 AM

11. Think it might have anything to do with their recently new Managing Director, Christine Lagarde?

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Response to MH1 (Reply #11)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:13 AM

12. she claims Adam Smith as her economic guru

...and she also told Greeks to pay their taxes.

so, who knows.

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Response to RainDog (Reply #12)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:43 AM

18. Adam Smith may not be as one-sided and shallow as conservatives make him out to be.

I know, shocking, isn't it? that conservatives mischaracterize a historic figure to play to their own positions.

Of course, I'm hardly an expert, but have been listening to some lectures about the history of economic thought lately, and the part about what Adam Smith really said was quite interesting.

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Response to RainDog (Reply #12)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:44 AM

19. She speaks out of both sides of her mouth, but at lease she sees two sides.

She actually acknowledges the poor exist! Big step for the IMF who helped create this mess.

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:25 AM

14. Don't go thinking the IMF are your friends. From the article:

"..the Fund advanced the idea of taxing the highest-income people and their assets to reinforce the legitimacy of spending cuts..."

We do not need deficit reduction, right now we need more public spending and higher deficits. The reason to tax the rich is because inequality is unhealthy.

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Response to PETRUS (Reply #14)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:32 AM

15. LOL.

No doubt.

The issue, however, seems to me to be the introduction of the idea of taxes on WEALTH, not just income, to offset inequality.

Republicans have simply refused to address the issue of increased revenue as a way to deal with deficits. They simply will not address the issue.

So, what's important about the statement, imo, is the idea that the spending cuts that Republicans insist upon, are not sufficient to deal with the fiscal issues at hand if someone actually cares about deficit reduction.

And what's important is this person is talking to the wealthy with this statement, in regard to the current Constitutional crisis here.

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Response to RainDog (Reply #15)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:39 AM

17. It's noteworthy for sure.

And I'm certainly not trying to pick on you, just pointing that bit out for everyone.

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Response to PETRUS (Reply #17)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:50 AM

23. what's so weird

about this moment is that the "usual suspects" among the elite are responding to the current pending economic crisis while the Republicans fiddle with their tea bags.

That's what happens when you have to appeal to extremists to maintain any political power at the federal level - and, it seems for the Republicans, when their dominance is threatened, they decide to just blow up the world, economically.

One thing this crisis has indicated it that Republicans are not the party of fiscal responsibility.

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Response to RainDog (Reply #23)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 10:02 AM

26. It is pretty weird.

I guess I'm more or less sympathetic to the "Koch brothers created a monster and lost control of it" explanation.

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Response to PETRUS (Reply #26)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 10:06 AM

27. I wonder what kind of shit they're getting

because I think the letter they issued - saying... hey, we didn't want the tea baggers to do what we said we wanted them to do - was in response to people with financial power saying, in effect, "we will fuck you up if you cause a worldwide depression" ...in so many words.

But they're just two of the most familiar faces.

Dick Armey is right in there, as is Jim DeMint of the Heritage Foundation (which, btw, backed "Obamacare" when it was "Romeycare".)

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Response to PETRUS (Reply #14)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:49 AM

22. "and fight against growing income inequalities." << also an important clause of the statement

There is the recognition that income inequality can be a problem.

While the IMF may still be problematic in many ways, this looks like a move in the right direction.

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Response to MH1 (Reply #22)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:59 AM

25. Sorta

A consequence of deficit reduction (and one we're living with right now) is unemployment and lost output. This hits middle and lower income people hardest, reduces their bargaining power, and leads to lower wages. It's contradictory to promote a policy of higher taxes on the rich for inequality reduction when it's paired with the idea of deficit reduction during a demand shortage involving mass unemployment.

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:47 AM

21. Oh no, she's French. Back to stupid "freedom fries."

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Response to mountain grammy (Reply #21)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 09:55 AM

24. LOL

if the Republicans don't stop the default, I doubt too many people will care about their bullshit grandstanding. They'll be too busy guarding their backs from all the people who want to wring their necks for being so inflexible.

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 10:18 AM

29. That will make the headlines at Faux won' t it? n/t

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Response to doc03 (Reply #29)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 05:10 PM

33. I wonder how this will be received on the news here

and how politicians will respond.

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 10:32 AM

32. Beware of IMF fuckwads.

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 05:15 PM

34. Kicked and recommended.

Thanks for the thread, RainDog.

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Response to Uncle Joe (Reply #34)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 05:31 PM

35. thanks Uncle Joe

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Response to RainDog (Reply #35)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 05:32 PM

36. ..

Peace to you, RainDog.

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 07:40 PM

39. Oh, that's non-negotiable!

Much more preferable to cut Social Security and Medicare and all those "entitlements".

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Response to kentuck (Reply #39)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 07:47 PM

40. and they're specifically talking about economic inequality

perpetuated by the last thirty-plus years of Reaganomics.

You know what's funny? Not funny ha-ha, but funny, ironic.

The Cruzaders are at the barricades yelling "tear down these walls" or some such racist dog whistling, pretending to be the gipper, pretending Obama is a commie bullshit, while the IMF is telling Republicans to tear down the wall of Reaganomics.

It's sort of like the moment that marks the death of a dreary ideology.

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Response to RainDog (Original post)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 07:53 PM

41. This political and economic climate makes for the damndest bedfellows.

 

Time to get some rubbers.

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Response to BluegrassStateBlues (Reply #41)

Sun Oct 13, 2013, 08:54 PM

44. Erasers?

Gardening boots?

maybe Europeans recognize the danger of a nascent fascist movement, even if Republicans don't.

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