HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » I'm a favorite uncle to s...
Introducing Discussionist: A new forum by the creators of DU

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 07:41 AM

I'm a favorite uncle to several nephews, of whom I have manhandled quite easily

Last edited Sun Jul 7, 2013, 08:14 AM - Edit history (1)

Just a little guy horse-play, of course, with most of them in their late teens and even early twenties.

I'm a grown ass man and these kids are skinny ass teens... And let me tell you, there is no way that any of them could best me in horseplay, even if they tried.

It's about upper body strength as any grown man knows... A teenager can't compete in that area with a grown up.

They can outrun me, they might even outlast me in the stamina department, but you can best damn sure believe that I'd make them submit to my initial strength and adult authority before it ever got to that point.

Which, for me, seems like a bunch of complete horseshit when Z. said that Martin was beating the crap out of him to the point where his life was in danger and he had to shoot.

What kind of grown man, in his thirties mind you, would say that a skinny kid had beat the shit out of him to the point where his life was in danger?

A man who wants people to believe his bullshit excuse for shooting and killing that kid of course.


108 replies, 7500 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 108 replies Author Time Post
Reply I'm a favorite uncle to several nephews, of whom I have manhandled quite easily (Original post)
MrScorpio Jul 2013 OP
In_The_Wind Jul 2013 #1
Bonobo Jul 2013 #2
yardwork Jul 2013 #3
backwoodsbob Jul 2013 #4
graham4anything Jul 2013 #5
bravenak Jul 2013 #6
Skittles Jul 2013 #106
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #7
LukeFL Jul 2013 #47
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #49
Voice for Peace Jul 2013 #105
brush Jul 2013 #8
Orrex Jul 2013 #11
Threedifferentones Jul 2013 #24
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #32
Hoyt Jul 2013 #70
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #73
Hoyt Jul 2013 #75
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #81
Hoyt Jul 2013 #68
NoOneMan Jul 2013 #102
HereSince1628 Jul 2013 #9
nenagh Jul 2013 #10
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #12
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #13
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #15
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #34
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #43
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #48
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #54
Kencorburn Jul 2013 #60
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #62
Hoyt Jul 2013 #71
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #76
Hoyt Jul 2013 #80
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #86
Hoyt Jul 2013 #87
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #89
Hoyt Jul 2013 #91
daybranch Jul 2013 #38
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #41
onpatrol98 Jul 2013 #61
warrior1 Jul 2013 #14
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #19
warrior1 Jul 2013 #21
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #26
warrior1 Jul 2013 #29
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #39
WovenGems Jul 2013 #64
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #65
WovenGems Jul 2013 #72
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #78
Ilsa Jul 2013 #16
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #17
NoGOPZone Jul 2013 #22
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #23
NoGOPZone Jul 2013 #25
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #28
NoGOPZone Jul 2013 #31
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #35
NoGOPZone Jul 2013 #37
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #40
Voice for Peace Jul 2013 #97
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #103
Voice for Peace Jul 2013 #104
targetpractice Jul 2013 #42
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #45
Threedifferentones Jul 2013 #27
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #36
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #44
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #51
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #52
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #55
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #56
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #58
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #63
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #66
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #69
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #82
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #107
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #108
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #67
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #57
Hoyt Jul 2013 #74
Boom Sound 416 Jul 2013 #84
mountain grammy Jul 2013 #18
NaturalHigh Jul 2013 #20
mountain grammy Jul 2013 #30
ananda Jul 2013 #33
HipChick Jul 2013 #46
Frustratedlady Jul 2013 #50
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #53
Frustratedlady Jul 2013 #59
Hoyt Jul 2013 #77
grok Jul 2013 #79
Hoyt Jul 2013 #83
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #85
etherealtruth Jul 2013 #88
grok Jul 2013 #92
etherealtruth Jul 2013 #96
grok Jul 2013 #99
etherealtruth Jul 2013 #100
yardwork Jul 2013 #95
ileus Jul 2013 #90
Hoyt Jul 2013 #93
ileus Jul 2013 #101
MrScorpio Jul 2013 #98
doc03 Jul 2013 #94

Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 07:47 AM

1. Kicked & Recommended

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 07:50 AM

2. Yes, it is true.

The upper body strength is no comparison.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 07:51 AM

3. George Zimmerman is a lying cowardly murderer/nt.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 07:55 AM

4. I guess that's why most boxers are in their thirties or forties

oh wait...they aren't

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #4)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 08:01 AM

5. IF zimmy (the cold blooded killer who killed a teenager) was packing a bowling ball...

 

Trayvon Martin would be alive today.

zimmy guilty of 1st degree murder, though only being charged with 2nd. May he be found guilty and get the max sentence with
zero parole.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to graham4anything (Reply #5)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 08:03 AM

6. Amen!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to graham4anything (Reply #5)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 05:22 PM

106. oh come on, graham

try to look at it from the view of a gun-humping racist coward!!! Then you would understand and go easier on him!!!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #4)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 08:05 AM

7. I'm not talking about boxing

I wouldn't punch any of my nephews ever in a million years... And they better damn sure not try to punch me.

I'm talking about grasping and grappling, which would depend mostly on upper body and arm strength, not punching power.

How in the hell was Martin supposed to out grapple Z. to the where the kid had the upper hand for anything more than a split second?

And then there was Z's bullshit that he was about to pass out from having his head repeated bashed in, but he still had the presence of mind to draw his weapon and shoot Martin square in his chest.

None of that makes any sense at all. Z's narrative stinks to high heaven.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #7)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:08 AM

47. Sounds like you are a great uncle. You

Are an being an important male figure to your nephews. Today's boys lack this and is in part the reason so many young boys get on trouble, drop school and end up in jail.

You are doing society goodby being involved in your nephews life.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to LukeFL (Reply #47)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:20 AM

49. Like I said, I'm their favorite. nt

Last edited Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:09 AM - Edit history (1)

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #7)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 02:49 PM

105. Mr. Scorpio, Zimmerman was handicapped, unable to grapple

because from the moment he exited his car,
he had to keep one hand on his gun, just in
case he might need it. My humble theory.

This put him at a disadvantage for fistfighting
and wrestling, keeping his balance, breaking his
own fall (so as not to hit his head on the concrete)
or getting the upper hand, etc.

Can't do that stuff one-handed very well.
I wager 97% of his attention was on his
gun, and keeping his hand there.



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #4)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 08:10 AM

8. Zimmy was 28 at the time

Even more proof the zimmy is a lying sack of shit as that is the age when adults reach their physical prime. And one more thing, zimmerman was the one taking intensive MMA training, not Martin.

Anything else?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #4)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 08:26 AM

11. Good point--people tend to forget that Trayvon was a professional boxer

oh wait...he wasn't

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #4)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:28 AM

24. They also are not in their freaking teens.

Plenty of fighters do very well in their 30s, and George Foreman became heavyweight champ again at age 45. On the other hand, there has never been a teenage world champ in any major fighting sport, and as a minor Martin would of course not have been legally allowed to fight adult men.

Having said all that, just because men naturally get stronger as they enter their twenties does not mean a teenager could not beat a grown man. Instead it means that any given male will be more powerful in his 20s and 30s that in his teens, unless of course he trained during his teens but not as an adult.

Still, the OP's point is well taken by me. Zimmerman had a substantial edge in weight and presumably strength, and is now reported to have been taking "MMA" training more than once a week. He also picked the fight, which is why he clearly should go to jail.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Threedifferentones (Reply #24)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:34 AM

32. Actually, Wilfredo Benitez became a world champion when he was 17.

He went on to become a three-time champion.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #32)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:15 AM

70. When fighting other folks his same weight, and without a gun, and refereed

with rules, etc. Now put Benitez in with George Foreman, and we might be close to a comparison.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Hoyt (Reply #70)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:20 AM

73. Not denying that.

Just refuting what a poster said about no teenager ever being a world champion. Actually, there have been a few that were eighteen, too.

Trivia, that's all. Not actually comparing them to this case.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #73)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:27 AM

75. Good, because there is no comparison.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Hoyt (Reply #75)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:36 AM

81. Yeah, I figured that out on my own, Hoyt.

No, I wasn't comparing Trayvon Martin to Wilfredo Benitez. I'll also assume that you're not really comparing George Zimmerman to George Foreman. As I mentioned, it was trivia in response to another poster.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #4)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:10 AM

68. Not many are 17, and they have weight divisions for a reason.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to backwoodsbob (Reply #4)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 01:12 PM

102. In the UFC, how many teens are there compared to 30 yo grapplers?

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 08:12 AM

9. While I think your point is generally true, I'm not sure it matters

Physical attributes, attitude, skill, etc overlap msking the relevant specifics more important than generalities...

IMO, the pieces of Zimmerman's cherry-picked fight scenario just don't fit together very well. There is much missing, and that's because the person who could reveal what is missing is dead.

One thing is certainly true...dead teens, like dead men, tell no tales.

As was said regarding this trial, it is about 2 people who fought to the death. One is a victim, and one is a liar.



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 08:13 AM

10. Who practised MMA 3 times a week for 3 hours each session but George Zimmerman...

Thankfully, George's medical providers kept accurate medical records and that the witness remembered George specifying MMA, 3hours x 3x weekly.

Even if George lied about the time he spent training, that was what he said.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 08:58 AM

12. So no teenager can overpower an adult?

Come on now. You know that's not true. No offense, but you and your nephews really have nothing to do with this, and horseplay does not equal a real-life situation. Anger and adrenaline change everything.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #12)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:02 AM

13. It would have to be a hellavah teen to take on and best the MMA trained, well armed Z

Somehow, I doubt if Martin could have been that teen.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #13)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:11 AM

15. Regardless of the time that Zimmerman spent training...

he seems like a wimp to me. Again, a training situation, when nobody is out to hurt his opponent, is totally different from a real-life situation when somebody is angry and meaning to inflict harm.

As Jack Dempsey once said (and I'm paraphrasing), "everyone has a plan until he gets punched in the nose." If Martin attacked Zimmerman, there is still an argument to be made for self defense.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #15)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:39 AM

34. Dempsey?

I thought Mike Tyson said that. Well, whatever.

Besides, I really don't think that Z's surprise attack story by Martin holds any water.

Merely for the fact that it was Z who made the conscious effort to track down Martin, who didn't want anything to do with Z in the first place.

Z definitely wanted Martin to stick around because he called the police and would be just a matter of time before they showed up. That would have given Z all the more reason for him to attempt to physically detain Martin. Had Martin EVEN got a first punch thrown in, that, more likely than not would have been as a response to Z physically grabbing Martin.

Why would any person who had a way to escape, suddenly turn back on their stalker to attack them while that stalker was in the midst of stalking them? Are we to believe that Z suddenly became the stalked once he encountered Martin, who then made the first physical contact upon Z?

There was no question that each of them still had the presence of mind to engage in a struggle. Everyone knows that there no bushes for Martin to surprise Z from. Which then arrives us at the point I tried to make about grown man upper body strength in a struggle versus a skinny teen.

Martin committed no crime before Z began stalking him with his gun...

Why do Z defenders avoid any notion that it was Martin who had right to defend himself from someone tracking him down and cornering him for no damn good reason at all?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #34)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:04 AM

43. Tyson probably said it too, but Dempsey said it first, before the Carpentier fight.

If you're a boxing fan, read Dempsey's biography by Randy Roberts. Great read, and very in-depth. Roberts also wrote a good biography of Jack Johnson.

Since Martin had apparently gotten away from Zimmerman at some point (Zimmerman: "these assholes always get away"), I don't think it's fair to say that Martin had no way to escape. As for who attacked whom, I don't claim to know exactly what happened. Neither does anyone else, though, except Zimmerman and Martin, and Martin can't talk. At some point, though, Martin obviously punched Zimmerman. It's up to the jury to figure it out as well as they can now.

Regardless of what happened or how the jury finds, I think it is a long shot that Zimmerman will be convicted at this point because of the incompetent presentation of the state's case. Rachel Jeantel and Dr. Bao (sp?), two of the state's star witnesses, were absolute disasters.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #43)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:19 AM

48. Joe Louis was my great uncle

He was once quoted in saying about one of his opponents that, "He could run, but he can't hide."

Which, of course, plays into your excellent point of Martin not being able to hide...

AS it was Z who was the active pursuer, in as much as there was a subsequent struggle, which of the two do you believe had all the more reason to make the initial physical engagement with the other... The pursuer or the pursued?

One was armed and with a state of mind to drive an engagement, while the other never wanted any encounter to begin with, of course. Remember, that Z had absolutely no good reason to go on the chase to begin with.

Such a scenario would dictate that the pursuer who was the one who initiated active engagement, with the intention of physically detaining Martin until the police arrived.

Even if Martin threw a punch at Z, he would have to had been in close enough proximity to make contact before the ensuing struggle. Proximity, again, that one desired and the other had not.

Which of the two would have more of a right of self defense in that case?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #48)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:31 AM

54. Really? I read his biography too, a couple of times.

When I was a history teacher, I always talked about his service in World War 2. "We will do our part, and we will win, because we are on God's side" is one of my favorite quotes from Joe Louis (or anyone else, for that matter). The way that his promoters and financial managers took advantage of him was disgraceful, as was the way the IRS treated him after he had donated so much money to the Army and Navy Relief Funds.

Like I said, it's up to the jury to sort it out now. We'll see what the defense has to say this week.

Edited for spelling.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #15)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:45 AM

60. but...

Zimmerman's explanation of the "sneak attack" has been proven false by the phone records. TM was still on the phone with Jeantel at the time Zimmerman claimed he was ambushed.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Kencorburn (Reply #60)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:50 AM

62. I guess I haven't followed it closely enough...

to hear about a sneak attack. If that's the case, I would think it would hurt Zimmerman's credibility with the jury.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #15)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:17 AM

71. And what does Martin seem like to you, the big bad bogeyman?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Hoyt (Reply #71)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:27 AM

76. It doesn't matter what Martin seems like to me.

At this point, it only matters what the jury thinks he seemed like to Zimmerman.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #76)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:35 AM

80. Hopefully jury knows Zman pegged Trayvon as "suspicious" and a threat out of bigotry/hatred.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Hoyt (Reply #80)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:43 AM

86. How do you know this?

Granted, I haven't followed all of the testimony, but nothing I've heard implies any racial motive on Zimmerman's part. Martin was actually the one who used a racial epithet, according to Rachel Jeantel, who was a prosecution witness. Somehow I doubt that any defense witnesses are going to tell the jury that Zimmerman is a racist.

Whatever you may believe you know, all that matters at this point is what the jury believes.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #86)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:49 AM

87. "Creepy cracker" is an apt description of Zimmy, and many supporting him.

I grew up surrounded by Crackers and gun lovers.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Hoyt (Reply #87)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:54 AM

89. Okay then.

That post pretty much tells me all I need to know about you. Thanks for clearing that up.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #89)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:13 PM

91. As do your posts.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #13)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:48 AM

38. Neither you nor I know

Both men and boys act differently in fearful situations at different times. Many times we confuse the reaction to fear and the desire for self preservation or the anger that results from a perceived threat or slight to be bravery and often it just is not the case. I do not know what happened here. I fault Zimmerman for not doing as instructed by the police dispatcher, but I do not believbe he set out to kill the young person. I hate to say man or boy as It creates an image in either case and I do not know which image is appropriate. As to whether a MMA trained, gun toting adult with superior upper body strngth could be overwhelmed by a person of approximately 6 foot height and 160 pounds, I would say it is possible especially with surprise. As to who was overwhelmed and losing the fight, Zimmermans broken nose and injuries to the back of his head certainly are more convincing than the bruises on Trayvon's hands. In fact if this Zimmerman is as well trained and so tough via that training as some would have us believe , where are the bruises on Martin and why did Zimmerman let himself get head injuries and the broken nose.
I understand the lust for the racism of the past and today, but we should not let cognitive dissonance become the chief characteristic exhibited in these posts. .
If I believe Zimmerman guilty of 2nd degree murder I have to believe he set out to kill Martin, that Martin was just defending himself etc. That forces me to see Zimmerman as a killer who is either psychopath or a total racist wanting to kill blacks. That case has not been made by the prosecution although they wish ti incite our emotions to jump to those conclusions.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to daybranch (Reply #38)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:00 AM

41. The fact is that it was Z who wanted to find and detain Martin and he was armed while doing

He was quite willing to use the weapon on Martin, did he not?

Now, I'm not disputing that there was a fight... But it's quite obviously to anyone who listened to Z's phone call with the dispatcher that it was his angry state of mind which set this entire chain of events into motion, which logically extends to him actively seeking and making the first physical contact with Martin, who was attempting to elude his unknown pursuer.

Now whether or not Z's a crazed killer or not, I don't think that it's the case. But, it's quite clear that he was an angry and fearful man who actively armed himself with a loaded weapon and had the presence of mind to fire it on the unarmed person that he had absolutely no reason to pursue in the first place, which in turn, killed that person.

None of that is in dispute.

I mean... Who's the real victim here?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #41)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:45 AM

61. It seems simple enough to me...

In bizarro world and America, one can pick a fight and then kill the opponent, IF you're in danger of losing the fight. It's the Wild, Wild, West. And, that rule applies to everyone EXCEPT your nephews and my sons.

To top it off, the aggressor with the gun will be defended by some republicans and democrats. It will not surprise me at all if Zimmerman gets off.

He did what a lot more would like to do. Walk around with a gun and kill young black men who they don't recognize walking through their neighborhoods. It's called being proactive.

Trayvon was the real victim.

Zimmerman is a murderer. He viciously shot and murdered an unarmed teenager who was walking home from a 7-11. And, every time he left home with a chambered firearm, he was hoping for the opportunity to shoot someone. He finally got his chance. Trayvon had no chance for survival.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #12)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:02 AM

14. read post number 10

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to warrior1 (Reply #14)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:21 AM

19. I read it and responded in Post 15.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #19)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:23 AM

21. what you would think it Trayvon was your son?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to warrior1 (Reply #21)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:29 AM

26. I would want revenge.

Not justice - revenge. That's why we have trials, though, to apply the law and seek justice.

Of course I understand the anger and grief of the Martin family. I'm not really a big Zimmerman defender, either. Personally, I think he's a douchebag wanna-be cop. That doesn't deprive him of the right to assert self defense, though.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #26)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:32 AM

29. I see this boiling down to this

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to warrior1 (Reply #29)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:49 AM

39. That Trayvon Martin was 17?

Nobody disputes that. I don't think anybody disputes, either, that 17-year-old kids sometimes do stupid things, especially when angry. I think there is a legitimate argument for self defense.

It's up to the jury now. Since I have no personal stake in this and haven't heard all the testimony, I'll accept the jury's decision one way or the other. For a lot of people, though, either Zimmerman's defenders or Martin's defenders, I doubt if the jury decision will settle it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #39)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:52 AM

64. Whoa!

If there were a "legitimate" argument for self defense Zimmerman wouldn't be looking at murder 2. Florida does have that silly "stand your ground" law. And stand your ground does not mean to go hunting which is what Zimmerman did.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WovenGems (Reply #64)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:59 AM

65. Zimmerman isn't asserting the Stand Your Ground law.

He's claiming that he was defending himself from an assault by Martin. Regardless of what he has been charged with, it's up to the jury to decide whether or not his claim is legitimate.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #65)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:19 AM

72. Open Season

If the jury decides that it is cool to stalk, pick a fight then shoot then a big old can of worms just saw daylight. Lethal defense can't include putting ones self in harms way. We don't like vigilantes and we really don't like the ones that kill the wrong guy.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to WovenGems (Reply #72)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:32 AM

78. What we do or don't like is irrelevant to this case now.

What matters is whether the jury believes that Zimmerman acted in malice or self defense.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:16 AM

16. Add to that the Z was educated in Mixed Martial Arts. nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:19 AM

17. Are you and your nephews the same size?

Because it seems like Martin had a some size on Zimmerman.

And while it seems Z's story has plenty of holes in it, he did take a shot to the nose at some point which is pretty disorientating in a fight. A fight of rage, not horseplay.

I agree with you that men are generally stronger than boys, but twenty something's are not boys and just maybe your nephews are letting their uncle win a little.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #17)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:23 AM

22. zimmerman outweighed martin nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NoGOPZone (Reply #22)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:28 AM

23. At the time of the shooting?

I don't think so, plus Z is 5'8" or so. TM is 6' I believe.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #23)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:29 AM

25. Yes, so unfortunately your thought is not correct. nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NoGOPZone (Reply #25)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:31 AM

28. Please explain

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #28)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:33 AM

31. what's to explain? zimmerman was heavier, and you've overestimated martin's height

the autopsy listed him as 5' 11''

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NoGOPZone (Reply #31)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:42 AM

35. Ok

I don't Zim's weight at the time of the shooting but he looked pretty skinny to me in the police department hallways.

Who knows.

I bet this was the first real fight Zimmerman had ever been in. It's probably why he over reacted.

Maybe as a requirement of carrying a concealed weapon you should have your ass whipped at least once.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #35)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:47 AM

37. Who knows? Anyone who willing to find the correct answer

Martin was 158 lb at the autopsy. Zimmerman was 185 when arrested.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NoGOPZone (Reply #37)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:59 AM

40. There you go

So we know GZ had about 30 pounds on Martin. We know Martin had some reach on GZ. We know GZ took a shot to the nose at some point. We know GZ had some sort of martial arts training (but I think we all know had he not been armed he would not have got out of the car. He drew his confidence from a holster).

Did GZ get any shots in?

From all of this what do we know...and that's the problem with this whole trial

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #40)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:33 PM

97. Martin taking a shot at Z's nose is not KNOWN, it is merely asserted by Z

yeah, GZ got a shot in.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Voice for Peace (Reply #97)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 02:32 PM

103. Z had a busted nose

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #103)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 02:39 PM

104. not even confirmed that it was busted, and it looked fine a few days later.

Maybe it was, maybe not.
If it was busted, maybe because he hit himself in the nose with his gun.
Maybe he was punched.
We only have his word, no proof.
The poster had said "we know" but we do not know.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #35)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:01 AM

42. Martin was 5'11 and 158 lbs and Zimmerman was 5'8" and 200 lbs on Feb 26 2012...

…according to the police and medical examiner reports. Also, Zimmerman's personal physician's assistant stated that he weighed 204 lbs. the day after the shooting.

http://media.miamiherald.com/smedia/2012/07/03/15/01/2uxIe.So.56.pdf

Zimmerman lost weight and weighed 185 lbs when he was arrested on April 11, 2012.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to targetpractice (Reply #42)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:07 AM

45. Noted

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #23)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:31 AM

27. Absolutely at the time of the shooting GZ was heavier.

TM was taller I believe but not very thick and certainly not well muscled. GZ also claimed to have been practicing "MMA" often in his free time.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #17)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:44 AM

36. They're all about my height of even taller

But they're all skinnier, but I'm much thicker

Just to let you know

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #36)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:06 AM

44. So you horseplay

With "boys" who are smaller than you and you win. Shocker.

You also have more experience than them. And I will bet so did TM. That's no knock on Martin. He probably had to defend himself from time to time. I'm betting GZ has never been in a real fight before and that's why he overreacted.

I'll say it again. You should have to get your ass kicked before you get a conceal permit.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #44)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:23 AM

51. Wasn't Zimmerman arrested for assaulting a cop? nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #51)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:26 AM

52. I don't know?

Did he have prior arrests. I thought he as trying to become a cop. He had applied in VA and FL

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #52)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:31 AM

55. Yeah, he was arrested and the charges were eventually vacated

Probably because his daddy's a judge.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #55)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:33 AM

56. How old was he

I doubt because daddy was a judge but daddy dropped some coin on a lawyer. These days if you have a record it's probably because all you had was the public defenders office

Any info online about the arrest

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink



Response to MrScorpio (Reply #58)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:51 AM

63. No conviction?

It seems it was not a case of expungement but no conviction. That doesn't prove he didn't do of course but there is no proof he did.

If anything it might prove he's an asshole, but thank god that's not a crime. We'd all have a record by just living long enough.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #63)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:05 AM

66. Well, he certainly was no saint

And spite of the lack of a conviction, it speaks to his potential for committing violent behavior.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #66)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:13 AM

69. That's a dangerous slope

One I'm sure you would not want applied to yourself.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #69)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:38 AM

82. Well, I've never been arrested...

Much less even accused of committing domestic assault or having any kind of record with my name on it in regards to such a matter.

I've never armed myself with any weapon, other than having one issued to me for training purposes while in the military.

I've never fancied myself as any kind of MMA trainee.

No one could ever accuse me of being aggressive.

I've never called 911 multiple times in any given period of time.

No one have ever accused me of having a "short temper."

I don't "Snap."

I've never hit a woman.

There's not one person on this planet who could ever accuse me of pursuing perfectly innocent people for no reason at all while armed.

I don't see any reason to frequently profile any young Black males who happen to be walking through my neighborhood, minding their own business.

I've never made up stories of people who had jumped up out of non-existent bushes to cold-cock me for no apparent reason in order to justify a struggle that I've had with someone in order for me to use that as an excuse for shooting and killing them.

I'm not on trial currently for undisputedly shooting and killing that another person.

So, what "slope" are you talking about?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #82)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:58 PM

107. I'm not disputing

- Patterns lead to behavior

- That people who look for trouble generally find it.

- Other people have been plain unlucky and bad things happen for a stretch.

- Some are bad all the time but only get caught once or never at all.



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #107)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:13 PM

108. Well, Zimmerman has been an active seeker of trouble for a good part of his life...

And because of that, an innocent life was lost.

It's not like no one could have seen it coming.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #58)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:07 AM

67. The Virginia officer

Testified that he was turned down by the police dept because of low credit score not because he had been arrested to felony assault on a PO

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #55)


Response to Boom Sound 416 (Reply #17)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:25 AM

74. You need to go back and review facts, and not rely on your impression of scary black kid found

/portrayed on right wing sites, FOX, free republic, and worse.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Hoyt (Reply #74)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:39 AM

84. Please explain

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:20 AM

18. Of course! It's cold blooded murder of a child. A 2nd degree conviction

will send a message to all the would be, wanna be cops prowling the subdivisions and condo complexes of Florida and elsewhere that stand your ground does not mean pursue and kill. Seeing this terrible law in action should be enough for repeal wherever it exists. Really, if a kid looks at you cross eyed and you feel "threatened" you can shoot to kill, just as long as it's not a white kid.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to mountain grammy (Reply #18)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:22 AM

20. What law is that? Self defense?

You know that Zimmerman is not asserting a "Stand Your Ground" defense, right?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to NaturalHigh (Reply #20)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:33 AM

30. Oh yes, but the original self defense argument did use the stand your ground law

which goes beyond self defense. I believe it was the stand your ground law that prevented any charges or even the slightest investigation into in the shooter when Trayvon was murdered. The police drug tested the victim but not the shooter, but then the victim was also black, which is the real heart of this case.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 09:35 AM

33. I can see your point, and ..

I also think that there's a lot about Z's story that
doesn't ring true.

Furthermore, I think the media and others have
confused the issue. We may never know the full
truth.

I don't think Z should be convicted of first degree
murder. But he should get some years for that
murder, at least for manslaughter.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:08 AM

46. Because ZM is a..

damn,dutty,liar...

ttp://

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:23 AM

50. Bottom line, what did anyone think Trayvon would do?

Stand there and take the abuse from Zimmerman? Zimmerman was undoubtedly egging Martin on just enough to give him an excuse to shoot. He was Zimmerman's prey for the day. He was itchin' to shoot him.

Pretty sad that all Martin had were his fists and an iced tea container.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Frustratedlady (Reply #50)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:30 AM

53. I think that the angry Z grabbed Martin first, Martin resisted and the struggled ensued

Last edited Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:08 AM - Edit history (1)

Before Z pulled his gun, shooting a screaming Martin.

Martin was chased from start to finish before that and never wanted any contact with Z whatsoever.

Martin had done nothing wrong before realizing that he was being chased down by a complete stranger who was intent on using any means of detaining him until the police arrived.

Thus Z armed himself with a loaded weapon, which he had every intent on using while chasing Martin down.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Reply #53)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 10:45 AM

59. I agree. Zimmerman was stalking for excitement.

If, by hook or by crook, he had the opportunity to use his precious gun, he'd take it. He was told not to follow, so if he did, he's the aggressor, not Martin.

They never should have let him go the first night.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Frustratedlady (Reply #50)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:31 AM

77. ±1. That is what black kids are still expected to do by some. Heck, there are still "crackers"

who think it is an affront for a black person to look them in the eye.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:33 AM

79. teens are SOOO harmless

 

wouldn't hurt a fly...







Thousands of such videos. Mostly live. Seems to be the in thing among teens nowadays.



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to grok (Reply #79)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:39 AM

83. But Trayvon was not, and your post is disgusting.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to grok (Reply #79)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:41 AM

85. Which one of these is a video of Trayvon Martin committing an act of violence? nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to grok (Reply #79)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 11:52 AM

88. From a quick scan of your disgusting video clips

... is your point that "non-white" teens are violent (without provocation or cause) ? Males are violent (without provocation or cause)?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to etherealtruth (Reply #88)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:14 PM

92. Videos showing otherwise are hard to find

 

Perhaps some folk find it "shameful" to record and others find it something to be proud of. Or maybe not.

Nonetheless it is possible, and i did find one.

It didn't go well for the attacker either.



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to grok (Reply #92)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:30 PM

96. Do you see how the videos misrepresent youth ...

.. or non-white male youth?

Are there violent non-white male teens? Of, course there are. Are there violent white female teens ... again, of course there are.

One can give a particular impression by choosing specific examples. I have NEVER searched for videos of this nature and can't imagine that I ever will .. but can you understand how a collection of video clips, such as yours, (hopefully, unintentionally) propagates the stereotype of the "violent non-white male"?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to etherealtruth (Reply #96)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:47 PM

99. The point of the small video montage

 

has nothing to do with race. Just that kids can be very violent nowadays and often think nothing of documenting. I think it comes and goes in historical cycles. Anybody is welcome to post somebody of a white teen doing something nasty to an adult. but they will be searching for something specific about race that i did not do.

I put up the first videos i found. Should I have made a massive effort to favor one race or another?

I think THAT would be racist.

BTW, i am non-white.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to grok (Reply #99)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:50 PM

100. I am truly sorry that you feel that way

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to grok (Reply #79)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:19 PM

95. We already know from your posts that you think all black teens are dangerous.

You agree with what Zimmerman did. You think that he had a right to kill a black teenager just because.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:09 PM

90. Why do you have a favorite nephew?

Why the favoritism?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ileus (Reply #90)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:15 PM

93. I guess you don't have a favorite gun in your massive "collection?"

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Hoyt (Reply #93)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:52 PM

101. tee hee hee...you said massive.

What does a favorite gun have to do with favorite Niece or Nephew?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to ileus (Reply #90)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:38 PM

98. I love them all equally

And all of my nieces too.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MrScorpio (Original post)

Sun Jul 7, 2013, 12:18 PM

94. That may be in your case but I know teenagers that can bench 300 pounds, I

couldn't do that at any time in my life. I am 65 and work out on a regular basis. Something I have noticed is a persons appearance
many times is deceiving. Myself I don't have thick wrists or big arms and I can best 90% of the guys my age that are built like a bull.
I worked with a one of those skinny wiry guys in the steel mill that could beat any guy in the department in arm wrestling. I know one skinny guy with chicken
legs that can do 800 pounds on the leg press. Not saying Taryvon Martin was one of those but I wouldn't say he wasn't either.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread