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Fri Dec 9, 2011, 01:54 PM

Has everyone/anyone taken a look at the NEW border deal between the U.S. and Canada?

If not, I strongly suggest looking closely at it. It is being touted as the biggest deal since NAFTA and it IS. It goes far beyond mere ease of travel, etc, that one might expect. Our privacy is being invaded so corporations can save 16 billion (and that's just Canada's number) at the cost to the tax payers of ONE BILLION (again, this is just the Canadian cost, I have not seen what the cost to US taxpayers will pay for this boondoggle).

We, on both sides of the border, will have to check-in at both the US border control and the Canadian one on entering and leaving instead of just the one it is now. There will now be shared databases which both will have access to. The shared database on the Canadian side will be the RCMP one, I am going to assume it will be the Homeland Security database in the U.S. but have not seen that being said as yet.

Regulations governing health and personal care products, agriculture and food, transportation and the environment are going to be 'harmonized' which, imo, means lowered to the lowest common denominator.

snip

"These agreements represent the most significant step forward in Canada-U.S. co-operation since the North American Free Trade Agreement," Harper said in a statement Wednesday before a press conference in Washington, D.C. with U.S. President Barack Obama to announce the new "action plan."

snip

Consumer health products that have already been approved in the U.S. could get faster approval in Canada, with regulatory bodies sharing information and adjusting labelling standards to make it easier to market a product in both countries.

snip

Officials say it's not yet clear exactly what information will be shared about Canadian and U.S. citizens when they cross the shared border. Currently, no information is shared upon entry or exit.

snip

Canadian and U.S. officials picked out 29 points where the two countries can bring their rules closer together, in health and personal care products, agriculture and food, transportation and the environment. That could mean more products, including therapeutic and over-the-counter treatments, available in Canada because of easier approvals.

more

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/story/2011/12/07/pol-canada-us-border-perimeter.html

I have linked an article from Canada's perspective and even it doesn't go into the kind of detail and analysis I think is needed given the massive changes inherent in this deal.

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Reply Has everyone/anyone taken a look at the NEW border deal between the U.S. and Canada? (Original post)
Spazito Dec 2011 OP
dixiegrrrrl Dec 2011 #1
Spazito Dec 2011 #2
housewolf Dec 2011 #3
Spazito Dec 2011 #4
Sen. Walter Sobchak Dec 2011 #5
pampango Dec 2011 #6
Sen. Walter Sobchak Dec 2011 #8
Logical Dec 2011 #7

Response to Spazito (Original post)

Fri Dec 9, 2011, 07:10 PM

1. I remember they laughed when we talked about the North American Union plans

back in Shrub's early days.
Nope, people said, Canada and America would never give up their sovereignty and identity.

so, another layer of bureaucracy to make border crossings even more fun.
Right.

I am really getting the feeling that travel is being seriously discouraged.

I am getting the feeling that those who left this country before now will be considered the lucky ones, down the road.

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Response to dixiegrrrrl (Reply #1)

Fri Dec 9, 2011, 07:36 PM

2. Yes, it is very worrying, imo

The details go far beyond merely facilitating smoother movement through the borders and into 'harmonizing' regulations, etc, reducing one's right to privacy and trust in health and safety of products for the public on both sides of the border.

All of it being done with NO say by the public who will be most affected by the changes and, again imo, in a negative way.

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Response to Spazito (Original post)

Fri Dec 9, 2011, 10:01 PM

3. Wonder what that will mean about bringing Canadian prescriptions back in the US?

For those who travel over to get their prescriptions filled.


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Response to housewolf (Reply #3)

Fri Dec 9, 2011, 10:40 PM

4. From all I have been able to research on this deal...

and, as it relates to actual details there is very little, it is an unknown as to what it might mean re prescriptions. It might have no effect or a major one.

They have set up a Beyond the Border Working Group to do the "action plan" which is where some of the real detail might become known.

They have also set up a Regulatory Cooperation Council whose main goal is "to make it easier for Canadian and American firms to do business on both sides of the border, leading to more jobs and growth in both Canada and the United States, to drive benefits for our citizens. The Regulatory Cooperation Council is currently developing a joint action plan to align regulatory approaches in a range of sectors for both Canada and the United States." I suspect this is where the pharmaceutical companies will have their say on issues that would touch upon the purchase of drugs from Canada by Americans.

Here is a link to info about the Beyond the Border Working Group (bear in mind this is from the Canadian Government site but it does give some info)

http://www.borderactionplan-plandactionfrontalier.gc.ca/psec-scep/about-a_propos.aspx?lang=eng&view=d

Here's the link to the Regulatory Cooperation Council (again from the government site):

http://www.borderactionplan-plandactionfrontalier.gc.ca/psec-scep/regulatory_cooperation_council-conseil_cooperation_matiere_reglementation.aspx?view=d

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Response to Spazito (Original post)

Sun Dec 11, 2011, 03:33 AM

5. It doesn't go far enough

Border crossings for all US and Canadian citizens should be similar to the Nexus process, a full border inspection for crossing the Canada - US border is ridiculous. Since anyone who is a terrorist, criminal or smuggler of even minimal intelligence can slip over the border undetected.

The process for TN and L1 employment status and the Canadian equivalent should be minimized or simply eliminated. No particular purpose is served by placing barriers on cross-border employment between Canada and the US. Citizens of both countries should also be allowed to remain indefinitely in the other country as non-residents provided they have a place of residence.

Such an agreement should also eliminate protectionism in the telecommunications and airline industries between the two countries.

The Canada - US border is a technicality of geography that reflects nothing but an invisible line drawn by diplomats with muttonchops in 1818, the 49th Parallel was agreed upon because nobody wanted to pay for a proper survey of the rough boundary agreed upon prior to the War of 1812.

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Response to Sen. Walter Sobchak (Reply #5)

Sun Dec 11, 2011, 07:05 AM

6. Agreed but it would be even better if our border crossing resembled that between France and Germany.

If traditional enemies can make an open border work, there is no reason that traditional friends like Canada and the US can't make it work, too.

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Response to pampango (Reply #6)

Mon Dec 12, 2011, 02:56 PM

8. I don't think harmonized immigration and visa policies would be workable

but streamlined processing of North American's and permanent residents of either shouldn't present too much of a challenge if there were the political will for it.

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Response to Spazito (Original post)

Sun Dec 11, 2011, 07:22 AM

7. Interesting! n-t

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