The outright hate for the President on DU is disgusting

[DainBramaged]

This discussion thread was locked as off-topic by cyberswede (a host of the General Discussion forum).

You'd think Bush was still in charge.


Disgusting.


You hate the President, take it to where they love hate, not here.


I'm convinced the paid Kochk Brothers supporters are to blame.


But then there's the basic haters who have popped up recently.


"Ooooh I don't trust him, he lied to us, yada yada yada."

Tighten your britches up folks it's gonna be a bumpy ride.


You folks need a hobby with so much free time.

[Liberal Veteran]

1. While I can understand some of the anger, it has made DU almost unreadable lately.

If there is going to be anger, it should be channel productively and not turn us into a circular firing squad.

[JDPriestly]

55. How do you channel anger productively when Obama proposes cuts

to Social Security and every program that keeps low-income people above water then meets with a covey of bankers IN THE WHITE HOUSE, a place that the rest of us have to line up to see and in which we do not get to speak to the president.

Of course, there is anger.

Don't tell people who stood in front of supermarkets, made endless phone calls, passed out flyers, attended meetings with long-winded boring speakers -- all to get the Obama re-elected in order to protect our social system that provides at least a basic living standard to most Americans -- and then are told that, no, Obama is recommending the chained CPI which will impose the hardship that the banks caused on poor Americans, veterans and seniors.

We've called the White House, our senators, our congressional representatives. Nothing does any good.

I am personally offended by the people on DU who are willing to defend the chained CPI and the president who has included it in his budget. Notably, the Republicans did not include the chained CPI in their original budget.

I smell a deal between Obama and Boehner and it stinks.

I figure it went down something like this?

Boehner: We Republicans will not allow you to spend a cent until you pay off the debt unless you propose "entitlement cuts."

Obama: Look, Boehner, you put the cuts in your budget and get it through Congress and I'll sign the bill.

Boehner: No. If you want to be able to continue to have money to spend on anything other than the military and paying off the debt, you have to go first on cutting "entitlements."

I suspect it took a lot more maneuvering and lies and backslapping and beers (or breakfast bacon) than that, but that's more or less how it went.

And Obama and his nerdy staff fell for it.

Was that Obama's only choice? Was he trapped?

No, not at all. Obama should have turned to the American people directly at that point and spoken also through his surrogates.

He should have put a huge presidential podium spotlight on the Republican "offer" or "suggestion" or "threat," as you like it and then called on the American people to appeal to Congress to raise corporate taxes and lower congressional pay and fire a few congressional aides (get our members of Congress to study legislation instead of their rolodexes for a change) just to show good faith and to fight against the chained CPI.

[SammyWinstonJack]

65. +1.

[lobezen]

79. +1

[840high]

91. +1

[awoke_in_2003]

109. "Falling for it" implies they were duped...

I don't think they were- they know exactly what they are doing and don't give a rat's ass.

[RKP5637]

184. They are part of the problem, but many democrats don't want to recognize that ...

[99Forever]

115. I'm with Woo.

100%

[patrice]

151. Ask him/her how many innocent people s/he's willing to see dead to protect his/her version

of the Constitution; I have asked woo that question several times and have never received an answer.

The Constitution has become a false god to some people to receive blood sacrifices through the 2nd amendment and that includes the PRIVILEGE of completely unregulated private assault weapons markets/PROFITS in the world's poor countries, in order to avoid that big bad bugaboo the U.N. and its attempts at treaties to control those weapons. Alienation from the U.N. negates any chance we might have to get that organization to reform - AND - thus obviates any changes in the IMF, the source of Disaster Capitalism around the world, which makes those same poor countries fertile ground for assault weapons freelancers and, thus, drone programs.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022193033

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022471642

All of that woo woo concern for the poor only extends as far as certain versions of a Constitution, written by a bunch of wealthy white guys for the express purpose of aggrandizing their wealth and didn't even recognize the rights of slaves or women, not to mention the rights of American Indians to live.

Yeah, the poor rank real high with Woo, just as long as they agree that the "tree" of what some people call "liberty" SHOULD be watered with OTHER people's blood.

Go ahead and ask him/her. How many dead people, who tend to be POOR, are too many to "protect" the 2nd Amendment.

[woo me with science]

176. I think you wrote my name by mistake.

I agree with JDPriestly's post 100 percent, but it wasn't mine.

[MissDeeds]

121. +1

[AndyA]

132. +1

There's no excuse for a Democratic President--who ran on a platform that middle Americans, the elderly, and the impoverished--had already suffered enough, then turns around a few months later and puts the screws to them.

Don't expect fellow Democrats to digest this rancid crap.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

147. "I smell a deal between Obama and Boehner"

No kidding.

Problem is Boehner can't make deals. There's nobody at the wheel of the GOP clown car.

[avaistheone1]

177. +1

[woo me with science]

181. Agree 100 percent.

Perhaps the greatest overarching betrayal of this administration has been their transformation of what used to be considered merely right-wing or Republican talking points into a bipartisan national narrative. That's true in virtually every area of economic policy now, and we'll be fighting to reverse the damage for years to come.

[L0oniX]

183. +1 ...I think it's called "the bully pulpit". n/t

[RKP5637]

186. +1, n/t

[marions ghost]

191. +1

Sad.

[shanti]

197. +1

you got it..

[kickysnana]

200. +1

[Lady Freedom Returns]

208. ::::::::::::

[appacom]

87. Agree. This newby is losing that loving feeling.

[AverageJoe90]

171. I agree with that 100%. n/t

[ananda]

2. Sorry, I don't follow.

I see disappointment, outrage, and sometimes hate for his actions and policies... but not hate for the man himself or his office.

[OnionPatch]

34. That was my first thought.

I really haven't seen a lot of vitriol. Mostly disappointment and anger.

Its sad that some people can't handle any criticism of their favorite politician. As for me, I like the guy and always have (heck i rode on the damn Obama float in our town parade!) but I'm so angry at him now I could scream. I'm glad others are angry as well. We don't get anywhere by being complacent fools.

[cvoogt]

42. I value thoughtful support over blind faith

and I think most here do too. I think much of the disappointment is warranted, yet I also know that signifies a deep-down hope that things may improve. Cue such memes as '3D chess' and about a giant bluff. I for one don't hate him - I like him - a LOT. I just HATE some of the policies. Not the same thing. How'd it go .. "love the sinner, not the sin"?

[IrishAyes]

44. We don't get anywhere by acting like Repugs either

[OnionPatch]

49. Tell that to the president.

Cutting Social Security is what Repugs want.

[IrishAyes]

59. Thank you, I do tell him

And I seek out anti-chained-cpi petitions to sign. You know, there are more than 2 choices here, blind faith or antagonism. There's a third and better: don't pass final judgment until we see how this plays out. As I've often said, you might very well be in for a pleasant surprise, and then we'll all owe President Obama a big thank you letter for saving us from the Repugs AND ourselves.

[OnionPatch]

63. Well I hope you're right

But I don't go on blind faith. I have to take what he says at face value. He offered chained CPI, I have to assume he thinks its ok.

[IrishAyes]

70. Face value

is shallow, simplistic and self-defeating. We're fighting the forces of evil, and these times call for hard measures. If President Obama helps the GOP box itself in so it implodes or explodes, I don't care which - it will be worth the anxiety we've suffered along the way. He's not stupid, and he plays the long game. Let's try to see and remember that.

[OnionPatch]

103. Sorry if its simplistic but

No one's contacted me to let me in on the strategy yet. As a constituent, I respond based on what my representatives tell me. I might hope they have some secret effective strategy in place, but I'm sure not going to count on it.

[atreides1]

164. But

What if you're wrong?

[SammyWinstonJack]

77. bazinga! Guess that is hard to grasp for those who think we

are just hatin' for no good reason. These cuts he proposed were because the repugs asked for them.

[OnionPatch]

137. It's disgusting.

The GOP are only in the majority in congress because they gerryrigged their districts. And the president wants to please them instead of the majority of Americans?

If he is so willing to concede now, I shudder to think what he'd be offering if we were truly in the minority.

[RKP5637]

193. The solution with this administration often seems to be caving in and offering up more

people for sacrifice to appease the republican gods.

[shireen]

61. you're right

i don't hate Pres. Obama. I like him. But I don't idolize him with blind adoration like some people at DU. If he's doing something against our best interests, I will call him out on it. I'll also support him when he does the right thing, like being in favor of marriage equality. It's all about policy.

[cartach]

83. Calling him on it

is one thing and something I wholeheartedly agree with. But I'm getting a little tired of the tantrums, hate mongering and fuck this and fuck that. Sounds like a bunch of juvenile delinquents who've just learned how to swear and want to outdo others or adults afflicted with Tourettes Syndrome. Maybe it's the Tea Party wing of the Democratic Party in action,losers and whiners.

[Jamastiene]

98. Exactly!

I don't hate him. He has done quite a bit of good too. But, when he is doing something that is an incredibly bad idea, I can't help but mention that I do not like that certain policy.

[PennsylvaniaMatt]

84. When people insinuate...

That President Obama is intentionally trying to hurt seniors or low-income Americans, or that he is no better than the Republicans, that is hate.

[IrishAyes]

92. You pegged it, brother.

[appacom]

97. Thank you, Matt

[still_one]

134. BS. A seat during a the ACA wasn't given to a public option why was that?

[LWolf]

142. You apparently have no idea what hate is. nt

[Skittles]

94. CORRECT

[JoePhilly]

3. When nothing happens ...

the outrage will subside like it has each and every time so far in the last 4 years.

And then it will pop back up in a couple weeks. Then go away. Then pop up, then go away.

The pattern will probably repeat all the way through Hillary's 2nd term.

[TheKentuckian]

9. It could have stopped before it started.

When the TeaPubliKlan co-sponsors dropped off their own binding deficit commission, the President could have let sleeping dogs lie while beating the living shit out of them for doing so. Instead he has revived the whole thing over and over and it sounds like you expect him to take another whack at it and pretty soon.

The President DEMANDS the reactions. He absolutely insists on it so cry to him. He could stop pursuing this but doesn't and you're right, he probably won't. He'll be back with some more old bullshit as soon as he can.

[Arcanetrance]

18. All the way to hillarys second term. A bit presumptuous don't you think

[JDPriestly]

67. Hillary will not be elected. I assure you of that.

The chained CPI will follow here throughout the campaign.

In fact, no one close to Obama will get elected in 2016 after this. Whether this passes or not, grassroots Democrats, the kind who attend every meeting, every convention, etc. don't like this any more than the average Joe on the street.

This will not be forgotten. Obama picked on everybody at once with this one. Veterans, everybody.

And on top of it he is doing gun reform. I'm all for gun reform bills, but it's a bit much for Obama to have offended people on the right and the lefty at the same time. No politician can afford to do that.

I don't think so.

[DhhD]

167. I remember hearing Bill Clinton and Paul Ryan talking about cutting SS behind a curtain at a meeting

http://americablog.com/2012/05/pete-petersen-hosts-bill-clinton-paul-ryan-simpson-van-hollen-to-discuss-social-security-compromise

[DhhD]

188. Video made at the meeting.

http://videocafe.crooksandliars.com/heather/clinton-ryan-backstage-peterson-foundatio

[RKP5637]

196. Here, where I live, he's turning D's and R's against him ... the R's that voted for him in 2012

believing he would stick up for SS and Medicare. For many D's it cumulative ... Some say this will blow over and be forgotten by 2014/2016. I don't know. A lot of people outside of DU are really pissed.

[Skittles]

95. in the meantime, America keeps going more and more off track

[treestar]

182. Yes. Some of these posters have been "betrayed" so many times

it's a wonder they are still Democrats at all. You'd think they'd be long gone to third parties by now. How many times do they need to be betrayed before they give up?

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. I don't hate POTUS

I am not surprised either. I did not expect much better.

Lesser of two evils.

I cover boards and city councils, hence my cynicism is off the scale though

Politics is not for the faint of heart.

[LeftInTX]

23. Politics is not for the faint of heart

^^^ ^^^

This is a truly accurate statement.

[Bluenorthwest]

5. I stand with the Unions, and support their opposition to the proposed cuts.

Richard Trumka:
"A president’s budget is more than just numbers. It is a profoundly moral document. We believe cutting Social Security benefits and shifting costs to Medicare beneficiaries—while exempting corporate America from shared sacrifice—is wrong and indefensible. Last November, working Americans voted for jobs and growth, not for budget austerity and benefit cuts. We urge the President to drop these cuts and build support for investing in jobs."

[myrna minx]

6. I don't hate the President. In fact, if I ever met him, I'm sure I'd really like him.

I voted for him twice. I think he's faced obstacles that no other President has had to face with a vicious opposition party. I am, however bewildered and disappointed and honestly, after watching Axlerod on Rachel Maddow quite, upset that he proposed chained CPI in his budget. I think it's a dangerous precedent and was a total mistake. I think it will backfire harshly on the Dems. Disagreeing with the President's policy isn't the same as hating.

[liberalhistorian]

7. Well, you know, the purity police on our side

are just as annoying and damaging as they are on the other side. Too many progressives are never satisfied with any advances or passed legislation unless it's 100% what they want, not getting that that will never happen in politics, ever. Too many are "all or nothing", without realizing that you can't have it all, so that if you demand it you'll often get nothing. I am just as disappointed as a lot of progressives in what is going on lately, but I'm also realistic. And too many don't understand that the president cannot just wave a magic wand and everything he wants will happen. He's not a dictator or king.

[ZombieHorde]

15. You're completely misrepresenting the anger and dissappointment here on DU.

I don't know if this is intentional on your part or if you really just don't understand what you are reading.

[IrishAyes]

47. So he's either stupid or lying?

Maybe he's just right, did that ever occur to you?

[ZombieHorde]

76. OK.

Too many progressives are never satisfied with any advances or passed legislation unless it's 100% what they want,

Please link the posts that say this.

Too many are "all or nothing", without realizing that you can't have it all, so that if you demand it you'll often get nothing.

People who have legitimate concerns about their ability to purchase their necessities are not displaying "all or nothing" thinking. They just want to get by.

And too many don't understand that the president cannot just wave a magic wand and everything he wants will happen.

I have not seen any post that claims President Obama needs a magic want to not propose chained cpi. If there are posts like that here, then please link the posts that say this.

He's not a dictator or king.

Please link the posts that say this.

[IrishAyes]

88. How about you just do your own homework?

Read and remember. I'm here to reason with you, but not to spoon feed you. Your post is antagonistic and belligerent. Don't you think I've learned the futility of dealing with that mindset?

[ZombieHorde]

106. The post I was replying to was antagonistic and belligerent to those who are concerned about their

Social Security benefits.

How about you just do your own homework?

I won't look for those posts because they don't exist. The post I replied to invented arguments and then stated why they are silly. The post was arguing against itself, and in no way reflected anyone's actual position. That is both very rude and very fallacious.

[JDPriestly]

73. It's not a matter of expecting Obama to work a magic trick.

It's a matter of expecting him to stand for the basic tenets of the Democratic Party and human rights and jobs.

He's weak on all of these issues. He did not show this face until after he won re-election. And it's not a pretty face.

He is still a guy with a great smile, a beautiful voice who at least seems to really care about people.

But that does not feed people. It doesn't provide for our veterans or for seniors. It doesn't insure our privacy. It doesn't insure our constitutional right to a trial and habeas corpus when accused of a crime. It does not help our economy. In fact it will seriously harm it.

Being a great guy is just not enough.

Everybody likes him as a human being. Most of us worked hard to get him re-elected. But chained CPI -- cutting Social Security is the latest in a series of horrible policy proposals from the Obama administration. It's piling up. And now we are completely frustrated. Seems all our work, all our effort is for absolutely nothing.

If anything is disillusioning, it is having someone you volunteer for during many hours that you could spend doing something else, turn against you as Obama has.

If you really are a liberal historian, you may have seen historical precedents for this. It isn't good to betray your base, to turn against those who have worked for you loyally and without pay. Obama owes us all a huge, huge, huge apology and some changes in his fundamental policies.

[Armstead]

180. That's pretty much it

[appacom]

105. I fear the purity police more than the right wing nuts

They should take full responsibility for the losses of the 2010 election, all that bitchin' instead of getting out the vote.

[IrishAyes]

140. Amen to that.

[AgingAmerican]

162. Your flogging a dead strawman

N/t

[treestar]

187. Know what else it shows too is disregard for the rest of the voters

They are right and entitled to get what they want, and the fact the voters didn't choose politicians that are progressive enough to get what they want in majorities in Congress is something they take out on the President and the moderates. They are just yelling at us because not enough of them are elected. At a time when 48% were willing to put Sarah Palin a heartbeat away from the Oval Office, we are supposed to get the Congresses to pass progressive items. How? They won't change their minds.

[woo me with science]

192. You can't parody the absurdity of that charge.

Democrats have not changed. The party did, when corporatists bought in, and in, and in...

It would be interesting to have a time machine to go back to DU in 2003 or so, and tell people that we would have a Democratic President in 2013, now into his second term of fighting hard for:

NDAA/indefinite detention, "Kill Lists," torture and rendition, settlements for corrupt banks, privatization and corporatization of public schools, Race to the Top and high stakes testing, selling off Gulf of Mexico for drilling, support for Trans-Pacific free trade agreement, implementation of massive surveillance of American citizens, brutal and coordinated crackdowns on peaceful protesters, arguing at the Supreme Court for warrantless surveillance and strip searches for any arrestee, escalating drone wars on civilians in sovereign countries with which we are not at war, new policies of targeting children and first responders in drone campaigns, awarding medals for remote drone attacks, refusal to prosecute war crimes, refusal to prosecute LIBOR and major corrupt banks, pressure on attorneys general for settlements for corrupt banks, advocacy of austerity budgets and repeated use SS and Medicare as bargaining chips in budget negotiations, tying of SS to the general fund with payroll tax holiday, support of TSA naked scanning and groping, escalation of the war on marijuana, appointment of private prison executive to head the US Marshal's office and subsequent massive escalation of federal contracts for private prisons, etc., etc., etc..

And now a FORMAL PROPOSAL for the despicable, unconscionable, Social Security-slashing chained CPI.

[arcane1]

203. Hey, you keep your facts out of this!

[TheCowsCameHome]

8. I voted for him twice, and now

I expect him to vote for me. (on this senior's issue)

[RKP5637]

195. Yep!!! n/t

[The Link]

10. Nice hissy fit.

[quinnox]

11. look Dain, some of us don't hate him, but are just disgusted by these GOP-lite recent proposals

And probably most duers feel this when they are expressing their disappointment. It doesn't have to mean they hate the guy. Obama is a very charismatic, likable, and brilliant individual. I honestly think it would take a special effort to try and hate him.

[IrishAyes]

50. More than liking the President,

.... we need to try to understand and appreciate the chess game at which he excels. W/o repeating all the reasons for believing this is a bluff, let me remind all of you that he's said himself it isn't the budget he wants, he knows it's DOA in the House AND most importantly, the Senate. Do you think President Obama, Pelosi, Reid, Biden and others have all taken leave of their senses? Maybe one at a time, given human nature, but not en masse. I'll grant this is a big risk because of the public's automatic and expected (perhaps desired for some reaon) reaction.

Yes, let's raise our voices against the chained CPI; I certainly do so myself. But don't throw the baby out with the bath water. Wait and see - I'll wager the day comes when you'll thank him. I certainly wouldn't want to challenge him to three-dimensional chess. (or basketball for that matter; I'm only 5' tall!)

[LWolf]

148. I'm sick of the fucking "chess game" meme.

It's hauled out every damned time a Democrat does something Republican friendly.

And the gullible are left waiting for the checkmate, which is either doesn't happen at all, or happens to us.

[femmocrat]

173. +! nt

[arcane1]

205. If "he knows it's DOA in the House AND most importantly, the Senate" then why propose it?

[Dreamer Tatum]

12. There is no outright hate for Obama on DU.

You need to mature a little and learn to distinguish hate from disappointment, dismay, disagreement, and other
lesser emotions.

Good luck.

[IrishAyes]

68. And maybe YOU should ponder

The difference between hate and betrayal - our own. Does it never occur to anyone what we owe President Obama? Not blind faith, granted - but let's give the man a little credit for ethics and bold strategy in dangerous times.

[UnrepentantLiberal]

74. That's good.

What do we owe Obama?

[SammyWinstonJack]

96. I'd be interested in hearing that reply as well.

[UnrepentantLiberal]

102. That blew by fanatic and is overtaking scary.

[IrishAyes]

107. Look it up yourself

I lack the time or inclination to replow that field constantly for those with shorter memories than my own. You know the list - don't pretend otherwise. It isn't becoming.

[Skittles]

113. LOLOL

I LITERALLY LAUGHED OUT LOUD

[UnrepentantLiberal]

116. Oh, the big wall-o-blue-links?

[Union Scribe]

127. ILWU is opposed to CCPI.

Thought you might be interested in that, given your sig.

[IrishAyes]

138. Have you missed EVERYTHING I've posted?

Right now my fingers are sore from typing the same thing over and over. I'll bet Harry's laughing his head off at what fools some people are making of themselves. He was smart enough to appreciate the art of the bluff. As for actual Republicans - a lot of you have no room to fling that odious charge at President Obama. It's fine and necessary to put on a great show of true outrage against policies, because the President needs to be able to shrug his shoulders at Boehner and say, "Look, they're rioting over this. I can't do a thing with them."

Man, I'd love to play poker with some of you, especially the teabagger plants and trolls. Either that or sell you a bridge.

[Bluenorthwest]

175. If you think it is a bluff, why are you tipping the hand?

If you are in a room and your friend is playing poker, if you can see he's bluffing do you run around the room saying 'my friend is bluffing' or do you try to help him sell that bluff?
What I am saying is that your actions indicate that you do not in fact think it is a bluff, you just want to say that because it's all you have left.

[appacom]

111. Thank you very, very much.

[Hell Hath No Fury]

161. We've been walking this road -

here at DU a little longer than you. Since 2008 we have heard ALL of the standard excuses for Obama and his bad policies, including those you offer.

As someone once said: Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice...

And I don't owe Obama SHIT. He owes the American people to the right thing -- like they elected him to do.

[markpkessinger]

13. I don't hate the President . . .

. . . and have supported him on many issues. I happen to believe his position on chained CPI, however, is absolutely a moral travesty, and I refuse to buy into any defense of it. Sometimes even the best of people can get it horribly, horribly wrong. I think you need to stop equating vigorous disagreement with specific policy proposals with hatred for the person proposing them.

[sabrina 1]

14. What a disgusting OP and I thought it was against the rules here to attack DUers in GD?? I have

seen NO hate here on DU from anyone who is doing what Democrats are supposed to do, oppose policies that are harmful to the people.

If you don't want to see disagreement with this president, then tell him to start acting like a Democrat.

Disgusting garbage, no better than demanding loyalty oaths as was done on FR imho.

[Rex]

16. Some people are pining for META

and this is what we get imo.

[zeemike]

25. You are ether with us, or your against us.

You must love him or you hate him...
Where have we heard this all before?...

[TransitJohn]

28. Bush

We heard this under the last administration.

[jsr]

118. Bingo!

Same old shit. Disgusting.

[L0oniX]

178. LMAO yea like Grover loyalty oaths. n/t

[Fantastic Anarchist]

17. Massive straw man.

Talk about free time lifting all those bails of straw.

[cthulu2016]

19. I don't hate Obama. I do, however, hate YOU. Learn the difference.

[IrishAyes]

78. Oh, aren't you special!

We should all listen to you castigating someone else who's really just calling for unity in perilous times. Or can we only qualify as 'good' Democrats by holding our noses in the air as if our feet smell? Dain has just as much right (and probably more room) to speak his mind as anyone else does.

But why am I wasting my time talking to someone who does what he accuses another of doing? What's that called, now... oh right, I remember. HYPOCRITE

[Cleita]

20. Nobody hates him. I still like him as a person. I'm disappointed

in his actions and I believe I speak for the majority of DUers. I hated Bush and Cheney and I still do. I couldn't have those same feelings for this President.

[boilerbabe]

21. you are right about one thing, you WOULD think Bush was still in charge with some of the

heinous crap coming from this admin! :O

[Walk away]

22. Don't worry Drain. Remember when they hated Toyota?

There were a few weeks here that Toyota was more hated than Hitler and Hannity put together. This too shall pass and the same folks will be off pillorying Hillary Clinton.

[JDPriestly]

81. Yes. Because Hillary is even more of a Republican lite than is Obama.

So far, Hillary hasn't said a word about the chained CPI.

She wrote a book "It Takes a Village." It's on my shelf right now.

But she is silent when it comes to the chained CPI or proposing increased taxes for corporations.

Elizabeth Warren would be a far, far, far better candidate. She speaks the people's language and understands us far better than Hillary who has spent too many years fundraising in the sumptuous mansions with the power elite.

[Walk away]

120. Ah yes. Elizabeth Warren who managed to win a Senare seat in one of the....

bluest states in the nation and hasn't actually done anything yet. She would make a great candidate. I say run her in the primary against Hillary and see how she does.

[duffyduff]

157. No evidence she is a Republican and isn't far right like Obama. Obama is a puppet.

It's a bogus argument to say she would have been worse.

It's tough for ANY politician to be worse than Barack Obama.


I don't look for Clinton to get anywhere in 2016. She would not be a puppet.

I look for somebody like Cory Booker or Andrew Cuomo, both of them puppets for right-wing interests, being force fed on the American voter.

[carolinayellowdog]

24. Hate speech truly abounds lately; have seen the word "hate" hundreds of times

all used by defenders of CPI projecting onto people who have not been using the hate word in their criticisms thereof

[markpkessinger]

29. +1

[TransitJohn]

26. The outright sycophancy and hero worship of the President on DU is disgusting.

This is fun.

[OnyxCollie]

30. +1. nt

[IrishAyes]

131. So if we support President Obama or at least call for watchful optimism,

That makes us hero worshippers? And those trashing him are the intelligent, sober core of the party? If that's what you mean, how is your behavior above the false charges you so blithely sling at us?

[LWolf]

152. No.

If you support President Obama or at least call for watchful optimism, that is your pov. It's the pov of others that the "outright sycophancy and hero worship" displayed by some is "disgusting;" or, more importantly, harmful to the overall health and welfare of the party and the nation.

[JEB]

27. Its not him I hate, but

rather the policy of cutting SS and the austerity that I hate. Its the kind of crap I'd expect from Rmoney or the other pukes, not President Obama.

[Whisp]

31. It's pretty well the same crowd

that comes in gangbusters and then takes on new membership from the less informed that are easily taken in and believe the BullCrap.

Same Old on almost every issue for more than 4 years now.

Then they will slink away into crickety silence when The Truth comes out and it's not near what their hyperactive anti-Obama imaginations wanted.

[JDPriestly]

86. What did you say about new membership? Check me out.

And many who are posting anti-chained CPI have been members longer than I have.

[Whisp]

117. I think you missed my 'leaders of the pack' point

vrroom vrroom

[JDPriestly]

146. Who in the world are you talking about?

I'm not exactly a follower on this one.

[Whisp]

150. I can't name names, but you know that.

who who who whooooo

[IrishAyes]

143. Can't wait.

[RebelOne]

32. I do not hate Obama,

and I will withhold my opinion until I see what happens to my SS and Medicare benefits.

[russspeakeasy]

33. I suggest a nap. A drink and another nap.

[Apophis]

35. People aren't allowed to question his policies?

This OP is disgusting.

[RKP5637]

202. +1, n/t

[randome]

36. Some of the more ardent haters have been among us for a while now.

They think Obama -and Democrats- are no different from Republicans.
They think Obama is a bloodthirsty vampire because of his use of drones.
They think Obama is a corporatist who deliberately destroyed 'Occupy'.

And some of them, I think, are hardened against the world because of the failure of Occupy. They never got over that and have turned their frustration against the Democratic party.

[lamp_shade]

53. Most of them only crawl out of the bushes for the piss-and-moan sessions. n/t

[IrishAyes]

149. That's a good one!

Thanks.

[FSogol]

198. True, true! n/t

[wyldwolf]

37. I'm a major Obama supporter. Many of the haters hoped he would be the great progressive messiah.

Newsflash - he isn't because there is no such thing.

[beachgirl2365]

38. NO... What is really disgusting is.............

The President's complete apathy and contempt for the American people.. !!!!!

[randome]

43. Right. 'Apathy and contempt'?

Pushing for gay rights.
Pushing for gun control.
Covering pre-existing medical conditions.
Covering contraception.
Expanding Medicaid coverage.
Pushing for equitable taxation.
Pushing for immigration reform.
Violence Against Women Act.
Lily Ledbetter Act.

Obama is not perfect but 'apathy and contempt' is a wild mis-reading of reality.

[Whisp]

45. uh?

Did you find a crack in the baseboards?

[L0oniX]

39. I don't see hate for him ...I see disapproval of what he is doing.

I have not seen anyone here say they "hate" him. He's really pissed me off for bringing SS to the table. Basically I feel he has lied to me ...but we all live with lies everyday. It's in our national nature to lie. Does that burger ever look like the one in the ad? That doesn't mean I hate Booger King. I think people are stupid to eat the crap Booger King calls food ....doesn't mean I hate those people. "hate"? Whatever. pffft

[JDPriestly]

108. How you feel about Social Security cuts depends on where you are on the spectrum of

your working life. I happen to be on the other side of the end of it. I volunteer a lot and volunteered for the Obama campaign.

I took care of him. He is not taking care of me.

It's like getting a cut in pay. Generally bosses don't cut your pay because they know it hurts your morale. In particular cutting employees' pay hurts morale if the boss increases his own pay in order to cut the pay of the employees.

Basically, that is what corporate America has done. Only they gave themselves and their CEOs the pay and tax cuts first and only now are coming to collect from us employees.

So maybe that makes it clear to working people why we who are older are just furious about this betrayal of us when we need support the most.

We worked our entire lives knowing the baby boomers were a huge generation. We were warned about the stress on Social Security and Medicare that would mean. We were told we had to pay a higher percentage of our pay for our Social Security than our parents had.

We trusted. We paid. We supported the increased cuts in our paychecks. And now Obama is cutting our benefits.

We have been betrayed. There is no question.

[scarletwoman]

190. Well said! Although I'm not retired yet (I'm 63), SS will be my ONLY retirement income.

It makes me feel literally ill to think that a DEMOCRAT is willing to fuck with it.

I was born into a Democratic family, I've voted for Democrats my entire voting life. And THIS is what I get?

We have been betrayed. There is no question.

Exactly.

[Cha]

110. Well, I have I've seen "hate" and vicious bully abuse directed at posters who

dare to speak up for the President. Course, both my examples got hidden by a Jury. Nice to know they were recognized as the out of control raging hate that it was.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2644685

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2657941

[L0oniX]

174. Speaking up for the POTUS is not the same as speaking up about any SS cuts being on the table. n/t

DU has been way over board with the hate for a long time ...it's acceptable to demonize and hate anyone who is a Republican, their ways and ideas. They might as well say the only good Republican is a dead one. Even though I hate their ideas and policies and ways ...I don't hate them as human beings. I'd have to hate my own mother and I am not going to do that.

[IrishAyes]

40. Good for You!

Yes, I've noticed the trolls. Often they pose as disappointed former Obama supporters, trying to gain cred. It doesn't take more than one brain cell to spot them. (I'm not saying there are no genuine disappointed supporters, but those especially need to buck up.)

Thank you for kicking troll butts so wonderfully; I also appreciate those who've helped me understand the budget situation better, because I don't claim to come automatically fully loaded with all needed info. What I can offer is a true heart, and I think it's about time that I wrote President Obama another snail mail letter on real stationery. I'll post it on the BOG when I do, but first I've got to make it to my bank box and pull out a copy of the first one I sent a couple years ago and share it.

[Warpy]

41. Honey, the hate is for a BAD POLICY

I think you'd be hard pressed to find anyone around here who hated the man.

[carolinayellowdog]

54. less than six months ago we were united in support

this "you never loved him and are outside infiltrators" crap is ridiculous

[Warpy]

58. Exactly. He'd still have a place at my fantasy dinner party

but the legislation he's considering is unnecessary and cruel.

[JDPriestly]

46. Obama is destroying the Democratic Party.

What a foolish thing to do.

I have talked to other Democrats from utterly dedicated party stalwarts to skeptics. Everybody agrees that Obama should not have offered the chained CPI cuts. It was a huge mistake.

Obama needs to apologize big time.

No I do not trust Obama. Yes I feel he lied to me just like Bush lied to me.

[Mkap]

48. Some disagreements

I do have my disargreements with the president mainly the use of drones and allowing the corrupt banks that stole from the american people off the hook. I have always been slightly to the left of the mainstream democrat party

Am i however overall happy with the president, absolutely

Back when Bush was in office in 2008 i couldn't find a job, granted i was just out of college but still it shouldn't be so bad that US army is the only search results on monster.com. I was driving a 97 ford escort and living at home with mom.

Now today...i make 30K a year, i drive my dream car a 2011 Chevy camaro, i live in a modest apartment, and although i still have loans im finicially indepedent from my parents. To answer Mitt Romney, yes i am better off then i was four years ago

So is obama doing well with the economy?...IMO...YES!

But im not selfish their are other things i like that Obama as lead the charge in..

Equal pay for woman!
Healthcare reform!
an exit to both Iraq and Afghanistan!
outreach to muslims worldwide!
Student loans held in check!
Disaster relief for Hurricane Sandy!
Universal head start!

[Union Scribe]

51. Another hit and run?

Weak.

[Rex]

52. The outright hate for the Professional Left on DU is disgusting.

Yawn...

[7horses]

56. Well...

It is not hate. What if Bush had proposed these budget cuts? Would you have said nothing? Wrong is wrong. I cannot be silent becuse the wrong is done by a Democrat. If Mr. Obama had not made the promised not to make cuts, and explained that they were needed that would be another story.

[WillyT]

57. "You folks need a hobby with so much free time." - You Forgot The Sarcasm Thingy...

Otherwise this is one hell of a broad-brush call-out of many DUers who I'd have to surmise...

According to the OP... are either retired... or unemployed...

Ironic, no?

"You folks need a hobby with so much free time."

And so far... it's a hit and run post.

[cbrer]

69. Right On WillyT

My first thought Preeeecisely!

The skill with which our Plutocratic leaders and their bought and paid for servants have decimated the employment scene in America leaves us with plenty O spare time.

Bastards.

[ljm2002]

60. If someone promises they will never cut Social Security...

...when they are campaigning, and then they turn around and propose using the Chained CPI (which amounts to a cut, no matter how much the spinners want us to think otherwise)... well then those of us who are paying attention are likely to call out that campaign promise as a lie.

Sorry you find that annoying. But you are totally mischaracterizing it when you you call it "outright hate for the President".

When someone disagrees on a policy issue, when they see their own Democratic President proposing something that the Republicans want rather than proposing progressive Democratic ideas, that is NOT the same thing as expressing hate.

Please consider the difference. Because you are basically calling out many long time DUers who disagree with President Obama on this issue and accusing them of being Obama haters. And that is just wrong.

[Bradical79]

62. Well, that's a stupid response -nt

[cbrer]

64. Bull...Shit

You are assigning an emotional reaction to a person that obscures, obfuscates, blurs, and misses the bigger point.

Most of the people here have a Liberal/Progressive point of view for a reason. With education and an open mind, comes enlightenment to more or less of a degree for individuals.

To see yet another politician abandon these principles, and actually propose works in the opposite direction points to an abandonment of the overall platform for which the Party stands.

Another step backwards.

Another inch further sunk into the slime of Plutocracy. Something, BTW, that our forebears sacrificed mightily to avoid.

And you think it can all be reduced to a "I hate you"?

Think again.

[woo me with science]

206. Well said.

And excellent sigline.

[rurallib]

66. One of the differences between repubs and Dems is that we do not

follow our leaders like sheep. When they do wrong, they get called out for it.
This is the way a democracy should work.
i don't believe anything I read on DU came to the point of people "hating" Obama. But this was truly an unexpected move that made many of us who had heard the president state time and again that "SS would not be on the table." Then with no provocation, he put it on the table.

Now even if he backs off his offer, he has made the Democrats the party that wants to mess with SS and Medicare. When the Repubs were on the verge of a true ass-kicking in 2014, he gave them the best lifeline he could.

Hate Obama? Far from it. Willing to tell truth to power? Absolutely. And he fucked this one up good.

Personally, I think you all those of us who have questioned Obama an apology for saying we "hate" him.

Sadly recent politics has taken away much of the flexibility people once had. Now we are expected to follow blindly else we give the opponent a hand. I won't ever follow blindly.
Obama knew how damaging this would be or he would have pushed it during the campaign.

[Moses2SandyKoufax]

71. If Bush proposed cutting SS, waged a drone war, rattled sabres, and assassinated an American citizen

could you imagine what the reaction would be?

[forestpath]

153. +1

[randome]

75. Posters taking this one mis-step and then saying.,,

...there is no difference between the parties. Or that Obama shows 'apathy and contempt' for us completely ignores the things he has delivered and is fighting for.

Saying he is only a tool of the corporatocracy -if that's not 'hate', it's the next best thing.

[Union Scribe]

93. ...except it isn't one mis-step anymore

At some point I have to look at a slew of bad ideas and conclude something overall about his ideas and what he's about. He isn't a new president anymore, and this is far from the first serious problem with his policies. I'm not saying he's all bad, but I can't excuse these things as the exceptions at this point. The pattern is far too advanced for that.

[randome]

104. What about the good ideas in my post #43?

Which I could just copy and paste here:
Pushing for gay rights.
Pushing for gun control.
Covering pre-existing medical conditions.
Covering contraception.
Expanding Medicaid coverage.
Pushing for equitable taxation.
Pushing for immigration reform.
Violence Against Women Act.
Lily Ledbetter Act.

I think, on balance, Obama has been a net positive.

[Union Scribe]

122. Yes and on top of that

I credit him with helping our auto industry (despite some qualms about strategy). There are also pretty major negatives, though, which lead me to the opposite conclusion: that he has been a net disappointment.

[randome]

126. As long as we both acknowledge the pluses and minuses...

...coming to a different conclusion is cool.

[Union Scribe]

128. Aye.

Peace, randome.

[Fearless]

72. You don't get it.

[Skittles]

100. they get it

they simply choose to place the blame where it does not belong - that is less painful

[TheProgressive]

80. Hate is not a word one uses in politics...

As an American and as a human, I will always voice my
opinion, especially if it is contrary to my beliefs. And
it does not matter who the politician is.

[santamargarita]

82. DU is not trying to screw up SSI and I've noticed...

disgust and disappointment not hate!

[randome]

114. SSI is not the same as Social Security.

Just because I once worked for the SSA.

[UnrepentantLiberal]

85. Looks like you got over your fear of DU3.

[Chef Eric]

89. Leave President Obama alllllooooooooone!!!!

[limpyhobbler]

119. LOL

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

90. In a democracy, the public is responsible to hold their public servants accountable.

Even when they're Democrats.

[SamReynolds]

99. There is too much hatred on this site for Obama.

And women aren't treated well here either, even by other women.
I'm done with this place.

[randome]

124. You haven't been here long enough to leave!

Check the rules!

[In Truth We Trust]

101. Apologist! I suggest you find another hobby. Perhaps a reality based hobby.

[grammiepammie]

112. Hated for Obama

I feel the same way. Have always read DU, but lately have been thinking of not going on at all. Too much hated for our President. He is trying to do the best that he can with every obstacle being thrown at him.

[99Forever]

123. What utter nonsense.

Unless of course, you are saying that his shitty policies ARE him.

If that's what you are saying, well then buddy, I suggest you get used to it, 'cuz we ain't goin' away and we ain't goin' silent. Beyond that, I have no other advise.

[limpyhobbler]

125. You should link to some examples of the rampant hatred.

It's so bad you had to start a thread whining about DU? There must be tons of examples of hatred you could link to.

[still_one]

129. So sorry that progressives do not walk lock n step like the repukes. During the Vietnam

War under both Johnson and Nixon people who were against it were marginalized

The same accusation were thrown around because progressives were not happy that the public option was at the ACA table

Maybe you should understand what means to disagree with the administration and hate is

No one that I know wishes ill to the administration, but you can be sure no one is going to sit and say yes sir if a policy hurts them

[secondvariety]

130. I don't hate the President.

But I expected he'd be a tougher negotiator.

[world wide wally]

133. There are consequences for all our actions. The President made his calculations and decided

this was important enough to him to deal with any consequences that followed. He certainly can't be surprised by the reactions after the promises me made during the campaign, so now let him deal with it like everyone else has to deal with their own consequences.

I don't think people "hate" him, but i do think they are angry and feel betrayed.
But surely he knew this was coming.

I don't get it either.

[DCBob]

135. Hate or disdain or anger.. whateve it is, its simply going make the situation worse.

If we dont stand together the Repukes will just get stronger. Its very troubling indeed.

[AgingAmerican]

166. Disappointment

Not hate. Not disdain. Not anger.

Disappointment

[Bryn]

136. I didn't want to worry yet until I saw this link

directly from Social Security website. Look at their plan. It discusses about reducing COLA and CPI. It sucks because I get SS and can barely get by as it is right now. This is an attack on seniors, veterans & disabled. Food prices are raising through the roof already. Lettuce here used to be 99 cents. It's now 2.49. My fave tea bags is now 2.69 per box..it was 1.23.

http://www.ssa.gov/oact/solvency/provisions/cola.html


I say TAX THE RICH ALREADY! CUT DOWN MILITARY INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX. Throw bankers to jail. Enough is enough.

[LWolf]

139. I think that's a mischaracterization.

One can be critical, can disagree, can be appalled or offended by someone without "hate."

You are using "hate" and "hater" as a word to throw at people who don't agree with you. That's intellectually dishonest. In my opinion.

Why not just say that you think nobody at DU should be able to criticize a Democratic president no matter what he or she says or does, and be done with it? DU can become an impotent echo chamber that never confronts the real issues head-on.

You don't need to mischaracterize dissent as "hate."

[MFM008]

141. gimme a break

perhaps if your life depended on some of these programs you would get it. Im one cut away from being homeless.
Yes, some cuts could be made but why not CUTS to the stuff rich guys and corps get? Like Carville said on morning Joke, The Prez goes in to buy a 25 thousand dollar car and wont leave until he bargains the guy up to 26 thousand. Lets just wait and see before we get all President Obama hating, If I hated him I wouldnt have given 300.00 to his campaign instead of buying food. If you think you hate because you criticize something your wrong. Your with them when they are right and NOT when they break a promise.

[Chisox08]

144. I don't hate Obama

I hate bad policy. You have to separate the man from the policy. Offering to make cuts to Social Security was a stupid move on his part. It pissed off the Democratic base and gave the Republicons something they can beat Democrats over the head with in 2014.

[lbrtbell]

145. The outright hate for the elderly and disabled on DU is disgusting

You'd think Bush was still in charge.

Disgusting.

You hate the elderly and disabled, take it to where they love hate, not here. Worshipping Obama is more important than whether people live or die.

I'm convinced the paid Koch Brothers supporters are to blame.

But then there's the basic haters who have popped up recently.

"Ooooh they're picking on him, he would never lie to us, yada yada yada."

Tighten your wallets up, old folks, it's gonna be a bumpy ride.

You folks need a hobby with so much free time. Unfortunately, you won't be able to afford a hobby, but who cares!

[duffyduff]

154. People are finally realizing the mask has come off of him

If you want to call it hate, so be it.

You are living in a fantasy world.

[DainBramaged]

160. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

How's that sharp stick in your eye feel?


The mask you say?

[spanone]

155. k&r...

[gateley]

156. Disappointment, anger, bewilderment, a sense of betrayal are NOT hate.

I LOVE the guy and for the most part pretty much see why he does some things (whether or not I think he did the right thing). But when he does something that makes me angry, that doesn't mean I HATE him, it just means I'm mad at him.

Adults can be angry with someone but still think highly of them. Why is it either or?

You disagree, so you HATE?

I don't agree and think you're really wrong.

[AgingAmerican]

158. Define hate

The only hatred I see on this website is for "libruls' from the 'boiled frog' wing of the party

[damnedifIknow]

159. I think it's deeper than just this issue

People are disappointed in many of the carrry over policies of the Bush administration and this issue is just the straw that broke the camel's back in my opinion. It was like a volcano ready to blow and it finally blew.

[Logical]

163. Nice hit and run! n-t

[Loudestlib]

165. +1

The only things that I have seen that were passed were all things that for the most part I support. The biggest overhaul and expansion of our medical system in 60 years. Closed the doughnut hole in medicare. Millions of Americans got money back from their health insurance plans. The draw down of the war. Treating the terrorist like criminals. It's a long list of things we have needed / wanted for sometime. I'm willing to be patience and see were this is going. These are my benefits on the line as well and I trust him enough to see how this is played out.

[Gman]

168. They'll label you as not being liberal enough or

not a Democrat.

It is disgusting here these days.

[DainBramaged]

172. After 44 years voting Democratic with Hubert Humphrey being one of my childhood heroes

No way the haters can brand me as not being Liberal enough.

If being Liberal is hating those who don't pass the purity test, then we're nothing more than Republicans with pearls....

[sulphurdunn]

169. It sounds like

being invited to leave a church congregation for heresy.

[bvar22]

179. The President proposed cuts to Social Security.

[font size=3]"You'd think Bush was still in charge. "

"Disgusting. "[/font]

I can't believe there is ANYONE on a Democratic Website who is NOT furious.

[font size=3]"I'm convinced the paid Kochk (sic) Brothers supporters are to blame. "[/font]

Social Security IS the Cornerstone of the Democratic Party (or used to be).
It is NOT a Bargaining Chip in the big Money Game.
Before Obama, it was the untouchable 3rd Rail.
That is gone forever.
No Republican could have ever done that.

If Bush had proposed these cuts to Social Security,
YOU would be outraged too.
It is about THE POLICY,
not the person.

I LIKE President Obama.
Like most other Democrats, I am angry and feel betrayed at the decision to offer up cuts to Social Security.
SEE the DIFFERENCE?




[font size=1]I knew that we Seniors would be sacrificed under the greed of the Republicans and fought hard for you twice. You gave us hope again and I love you for that. So, I am still in shock that you would even consider selling us out. Please, PLEASE say it isn’t so.[/font]




[font size=1]If I wanted drastic cuts to Social Security benefits, I would have voted for Republicans.[/font]

Many, MANY more angry and disappointed loyal Democrats here:
http://savesocialsecurity.tumblr.com/

---bvar22
a mainstream New Deal FDR Working Class Democratic activist for over 46 years.
I STAND with these loyal Democrats.

[Nevernose]

185. My values haven't changed since the election

At least one of President Obama's has, and I think I have a right to be pissed about it.

[Armstead]

189. Disappointment and frustration and anger is not hate

[marions ghost]

194. Right

--it's "holding his feet to the fire" WHICH IS our job.

[CountAllVotes]

199. +1,000

"The President is merely the most important among a large number of public servants. He should be supported or opposed exactly to the degree which is warranted by his good conduct or bad conduct, his efficiency or inefficiency in rendering loyal, able, and disinterested service to the Nation as a whole. Therefore it is absolutely necessary that there should be full liberty to tell the truth about his acts, and this means that it is exactly necessary to blame him when he does wrong as to praise him when he does right. Any other attitude in an American citizen is both base and servile. To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public. Nothing but the truth should be spoken about him or any one else. But it is even more important to tell the truth, pleasant or unpleasant, about him than about any one else."

"Roosevelt in the Kansas City Star", 149
May 7, 1918

[KoKo]

204. Agree and it's hurtful and cruel to call other DU'ers "Haters"

If the OP had mentioned some Freeper Troll's post ...it would be different. But, I took this as a blanket statement against fellow DU'ers who were shocked over Obama's trying to put "Chained CPI of Social Security" that would hurt so many Americans who paid into SS all those years as a bargaining chip in there for Repugs to vote for in their budget negotiations. Obama put an FDR/New Deal Plan up for Grabs for the Repugs. It deserved Outrage here on DU!

It was a CALL OUT to FELLOW DU'ers....and I've always liked DB...but, this was below the bar...trash of good people here on DU.

[CountAllVotes]

211. you are right

It is indeed harmful and abusive. Time to alert on this POS thread!

[KoKo]

201. DB...Feel sad to see this here from you....

Remember when we did "Occupy DU2... I think you are calling ME a HATER...

I think that's a very low thing for your to do....to your fellow DU'ers who may have a different opinion about our President's Policies than you do.

I do believe in Freedom of Speech ...and think you must also as a Democrat and an American.

But, this post is Cruel and Hurtful.

Just saying from a former DU-2 Occupier there for Months with you .
KoKo

[ucrdem]

209. I think his point is that you can oppose the policy without hating the president.

It takes some sorting-out but they're different things. The policy can stink, and this one sure smells fully, but that doesn't mean Obama is a Manchurian candidate letting his inner Reagan fly, or was a fraud all along who hates low earners etc.

I don't know exactly why C-CPI appears in his budget proposal, or whether he personally supports it, but the chances are good that it's a least-bad option and one not expected to see the light of day. But even if it becomes law, that still doesn't mean Obama is a GOP stooge; it means he got behind a bad policy. Not the first time, or last, but the big picture and his 08-12 record show he's on the right side of most legislation and ideological issues.

[Number23]

207. K&R People posting shit from damn near two years ago

Which of course in the current climate of panic and foolishness goes straight to the top of the Greatest Page.

The unending, INCESSANT panic over one issue at the expense of ALL OTHERS. And the panickers are the ones running around insulting the president's supporters and calling them "fools" while acting 100 times worse than any 'fool' could ever act.

This place is bad a hell of a lot more often than it's good. The diminished quality of the conversations and the diminished number of posters and posts prove that. But the last few days it has been EXTRA thick and special stupid around here.

Admins need to break out a couple of brooms and dust pans and clean this place the hell up.

[Phillip McCleod]

210. what do you expect? ..

..

the baby boomers are nearing retirement age!

the sky is falling!

[cyberswede]

212. Locking.

I'm sorry, DainBramaged, but this is a Meta topic.