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Fri Feb 15, 2013, 07:47 PM

How Did George W. Bush TRICK US Into A Full-Blown WAR?





'HUBRIS' - A MUST WATCH!!


How did our government trick us into starting a full-blown war?


Rachel Maddow points out the passing of the tenth anniversary of former President George W. Bush's State of the Union lie about Saddam Hussein seeking uranium from Africa, and alerts viewers to her upcoming documentary, "Hubris," to air Monday, 2/18 at 9 p.m. ET, that focuses on how the Iraq war was sold to the American people and whether we are in a position to stop it from ever happening again.

101 replies, 6682 views

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Reply How Did George W. Bush TRICK US Into A Full-Blown WAR? (Original post)
Segami Feb 2013 OP
riverbendviewgal Feb 2013 #1
Segami Feb 2013 #2
riverbendviewgal Feb 2013 #3
Segami Feb 2013 #7
malaise Feb 2013 #76
leveymg Feb 2013 #101
Graybeard Feb 2013 #4
think Feb 2013 #5
AntiFascist Feb 2013 #6
Jack Sprat Feb 2013 #8
think Feb 2013 #14
Brigid Feb 2013 #23
Jack Sprat Feb 2013 #26
southern_belle Feb 2013 #49
Blanks Feb 2013 #37
gateley Feb 2013 #54
alarimer Feb 2013 #92
---------- Feb 2013 #9
think Feb 2013 #11
amuse bouche Feb 2013 #34
ananda Feb 2013 #10
southern_belle Feb 2013 #51
laundry_queen Feb 2013 #73
TexasProgresive Feb 2013 #12
Jack Sprat Feb 2013 #20
TexasProgresive Feb 2013 #29
Jack Sprat Feb 2013 #36
gateley Feb 2013 #55
TexasProgresive Feb 2013 #70
gateley Feb 2013 #72
TheKentuckian Feb 2013 #84
gateley Feb 2013 #87
TheKentuckian Feb 2013 #97
gateley Feb 2013 #99
SalviaBlue Feb 2013 #79
rhett o rick Feb 2013 #13
MessiahRp Feb 2013 #67
rhett o rick Feb 2013 #71
Cali_Democrat Feb 2013 #15
TheProgressive Feb 2013 #16
riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #25
TheProgressive Feb 2013 #30
Earth_First Feb 2013 #17
rjdem1977_gg Feb 2013 #18
Kennah Feb 2013 #66
Brigid Feb 2013 #19
zbdent Feb 2013 #21
progressoid Feb 2013 #22
MichiganVote Feb 2013 #27
Moonwalk Feb 2013 #59
ProSense Feb 2013 #24
tabasco Feb 2013 #28
Jack Sprat Feb 2013 #40
Turbineguy Feb 2013 #31
Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #32
Heathen57 Feb 2013 #33
gateley Feb 2013 #57
MotherPetrie Feb 2013 #35
underpants Feb 2013 #48
MotherPetrie Feb 2013 #62
Cleita Feb 2013 #38
robinlynne Feb 2013 #39
libodem Feb 2013 #41
triplepoint Feb 2013 #42
mountain grammy Feb 2013 #43
OldDem2012 Feb 2013 #44
obama2terms Feb 2013 #45
madinmaryland Feb 2013 #46
JDPriestly Feb 2013 #47
Segami Feb 2013 #68
JDPriestly Feb 2013 #100
PufPuf23 Feb 2013 #50
Segami Feb 2013 #96
hibbing Feb 2013 #52
Third Doctor Feb 2013 #53
MADem Feb 2013 #56
blkmusclmachine Feb 2013 #58
JaneyVee Feb 2013 #60
Fumesucker Feb 2013 #61
felix_numinous Feb 2013 #63
Kath1 Feb 2013 #64
just1voice Feb 2013 #65
WinkyDink Feb 2013 #69
spanone Feb 2013 #74
RagAss Feb 2013 #75
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #77
brewens Feb 2013 #78
stevenleser Feb 2013 #80
upi402 Feb 2013 #81
stevenleser Feb 2013 #85
upi402 Feb 2013 #91
stevenleser Feb 2013 #93
1-Old-Man Feb 2013 #82
YoungDemCA Feb 2013 #83
Tierra_y_Libertad Feb 2013 #86
Dash87 Feb 2013 #88
Tierra_y_Libertad Feb 2013 #89
loudsue Feb 2013 #90
AndyA Feb 2013 #94
democrat2thecore Feb 2013 #95
Tierra_y_Libertad Feb 2013 #98

Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 07:50 PM

1. I will not miss her show for anything

It will be very interesting because Rachel produces facts not fairy tales.

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Response to riverbendviewgal (Reply #1)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 07:56 PM

2. The elephant shit is going to hit the fan with reTHUG heads exploding!!




Set your DVR, make yourself comfy and pass the corn...

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Response to Segami (Reply #2)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 07:59 PM

3. I don't have a DVR recorder...

but it will be somewhere on the net and my son may be able to catch it on line...she may have it on her website...like Frontline has their show.

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Response to riverbendviewgal (Reply #3)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:14 PM

7. Thats good also,.. anyway you can watch it is A-OK!

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Response to Segami (Reply #2)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:13 PM

76. I need a camera in the Cheney household

to watch him croak during this documentary. I'm glad the war criminal of a dick is still alive to see that he will never be forgiven for his crimes against humanity

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Response to malaise (Reply #76)

Sun Feb 17, 2013, 05:29 PM

101. It assumes that Bush-Cheney were more clever than they actually were, and the Dems who voted for war

more gullible.

Let's give credit where its due in both parties.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:00 PM

4. Every American should watch this.

Spread the word among your friends, family and neighbors.

Let them know it's that important.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:07 PM

5. "Hubris"

a most excellent title.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:12 PM

6. I hope she covers everything that La Repubblica dug up. n/t

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:15 PM

8. I wish I could see it. Rec anyway.

 

I reside in lower Alabama where Comcast and conservatives do not allow MSNBC coverage.

Many areas of America receive only newscasts and audio/visual transmissions which conform to the strict guidelines of the ruling plutocracy. Because the media outlets are corporations themselves and the instrument of corporate governance, it totally controls the output of information. There is zero possibility of free thought or a free press.

So I applaud you for being able to view this program and long for the freedoms that many like yourself can enjoy. For your sake, never take them for granted. Faith-healing is now replacing many former health practicioners down here. Doctors are forbidden to write prescriptions without threat of losing their practice. It is bad and getting worse all the time.

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Response to Jack Sprat (Reply #8)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:47 PM

14. Sorry to hear that.

Censorship sucks.

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Response to Jack Sprat (Reply #8)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:55 PM

23. Interesting.

I did not know that. Is there some way you can stream it on your computer or something? I'm sure somebody around here can help you with that.

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Response to Brigid (Reply #23)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:59 PM

26. Hopefully the following day.

 

I think MSNBC still shows free segments on their website of the previous day's programming. Hopefully, this special showing will be available the same way.

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Response to Jack Sprat (Reply #26)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:14 PM

49. +1

I hope so, so everyone can see it.

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Response to Jack Sprat (Reply #8)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:33 PM

37. Seriously, faith healing.

Somebody should do a documentary about that.

That's the scary thing.

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Response to Jack Sprat (Reply #8)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:24 PM

54. Hopefully it will be on the MSNBC site -- I'm so sorry for the censorship!

So Rachel is saying that this might cause heads to explode, but not those in Alabama, apparently -- people there won't be able to see it!

Thank God for the Internet.

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Response to Jack Sprat (Reply #8)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 02:56 PM

92. You can get video podcasts of her show from Itunes

It's the full show too. But I don't know about this special.

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Response to Segami (Original post)


Response to ---------- (Reply #9)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:34 PM

11. Welcome to DU



And I agree. Hans Blix would agree also:

http://berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2004/03/18_blix.shtml

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Response to ---------- (Reply #9)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:18 PM

34. Rachael did not get tricked.

As I recall she pulled off the road in her car and screamed

I knew the minute Bush was elected what he would do. I had a huge argument with a loved one who wanted to enlist. I warned him. You will be sent to Iraq. He said I was nuts

I wish

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:32 PM

10. He certainly did not trick many of us here.

...

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Response to ananda (Reply #10)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:16 PM

51. True! n/t

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Response to ananda (Reply #10)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:09 PM

73. That is very true! nt

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:38 PM

12. I knew plenty who believed the hurled propaganda

I never could get any of them to make a real case for what Iraq had to do with 911. I seem to remember that Bush ordered the UN inspectors out and then they said that Iraq threw them out. Meanwhile Iraq was bending over backwards letting the inspectors do their job- even destroying some short range missiles that had a range some 10% too long.

It was the big lie and many believed it.

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Response to TexasProgresive (Reply #12)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:52 PM

20. Would you agree?

 

This particular moment in American history was such a national travesty that all the governmental figures who played a part should still have to own up to their level of guilt in this episode. I would include that particular body of Congress which voted to give its' backing in the vote to proceed (every single aye vote from both parties). That Congress (108th) should be censored and held forever guilty of abuse of their office.

Even if none of the participants is tried or sentenced, I would simply like to see them admit their abuse of power and violations of national and international law.

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Response to Jack Sprat (Reply #20)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:02 PM

29. Sounds good to me

A national day of reflection and repentance.

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Response to TexasProgresive (Reply #29)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:21 PM

36. As for Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Rice/Powell

 

and the primetime players of the presidential cabinet, I would not expect them to ever willfully admit guilt. The proof of their failures and misleading conduct (such as the SOTU address) has been out in the open for years now, and they still refuse to face up to it. Because to admit to the guilt would subject them to both national and international trials for war crimes.

Which makes us all so upset that our Justice Dept and Dysfunctional Congress couldn't warrant the courage to place them on trial to begin with. The facts clear.

They concocted a war against another nation, which posed no threat to the USA and was cooperating with the United Nations to prove it. Yet, we attacked them for obvious profit and plunder that then resulted in widespread death.

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Response to TexasProgresive (Reply #12)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:29 PM

55. I believed it. Although I loathed Bush and his slimy pack, I think I was still feeling

vulnerable after 9/11 (hadn't learned at that point how their incompetance and HUBRIS had allowed that to occur). I wasn't paying attention to politics then and assumed they were leveling with us.

I'm glad I've learned since the, and have become more aware.

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Response to gateley (Reply #55)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 09:12 AM

70. As all of us do I remember every detail about that Tuesday morning.

I was in shock but the kind that allows one to go about business. I work for Verizon and knew that besides the destruction of property and life there must be massive damage to the telecommunications center in the financial heart of the country. So even though 2,000 miles away I went to work.

It wasn't until Thursday afternoon that the other shoe fell-literally it was a spare tire in the bed of my truck that fell over. It so startled me-I thought it was an explosion. I sat an shook with fear.

Now as to who I thought was responsible for this heinous act; my father was a psychologist who analysed the propaganda of Soviet and Latin American sources. He also had a gift for creating believable propaganda. Now some of his analytical gift rubbed off on me although I am weak at creating.

And so, I recognized the handiwork of propagandist- Although I believe that the phy-ops people of Dad's era would have taken everyone in, the Bush/Cheney team were quite good. They used the angst, anger and fear to get the drum beat going to war with an "enemy" of their choosing. The were helped by the fact that many Americans are ignorant of the issues, culture and geography of the world that lies outside their locale.

I don't blame my fellow citizens for supporting the war on Iraq- The blame lies with the neo-Con terrorists who slyly used truth mixed with lies to dupe the nation into acts of mass murder.

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Response to TexasProgresive (Reply #70)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 11:58 AM

72. For the reasons you cited, I also hold forgiveness for those in Congress who

supported the occupation -- they were being told the same things we were. Many learned more truths and changed their minds, regretting their votes, but by then they were over a barrel and felt they had to keep the support going in order to support the men and women they'd allowed to be sent into war.

I am horrified by the depths of evil and ugliness of those who propagated this. I honestly can't find words.

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Response to gateley (Reply #72)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 01:10 PM

84. Un-engaged, weak on history, apolitical common citizens I can kind of see

but folks elected to House and especially the Senate??? I don't see it Gateley. At some point dangerously ignorant or complicit become what it is.

This wasn't some crazy cloak and dagger stuff, a couple decades of common knowledge memories of related events, a rational understanding of how locked down Iraq was at the time that was again common knowledge, a little basic and openly disseminated knowledge of about seven decades of bipartisan policy in the area should have made the whole matter beyond dubious.

Sorry but I think there is little room to be tricked armed with what should be a basic knowledge level to even credibly run for higher office, much less win.

Certainly there is little you could have learned in hindsight that a Senator didn't know at the time.

It is very tempting to let such ineptitude or collusion (which is more likely) slide because if you don't the politics become daunting, scary, and damn difficult but it isn't really plausible these folks were tricked and if they were it isn't much better to be that ignorant at that high a level than being complicit, what is the difference in practical effect?

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Response to TheKentuckian (Reply #84)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 01:24 PM

87. Look at some of the people elected to Congress -- they're more clueless than

many of us! Hell, Palin (probably not a good example but far from the only one so stupid) was a potential VP and she thought Saddam was responsible for 9/11.

I think many of the smarter ones got a clue but as I said, if they voted against continued support, it was the troops who would be hurt the most.

I think Cheney, et al, were master manipulators, and ultimately we can ALL be manipulated. Some people in Congress were, some weren't. We weren't thinking straight then. I'm not excusing them, and I agree they need to be held to a higher standard because we ENTRUST ourselves to them, but they were probably frightened, too.

I don't think they ALL were complicit, but some certainly were. I even wonder how much the inner circle knew.

They frighten me.

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Response to gateley (Reply #87)

Sun Feb 17, 2013, 01:56 PM

97. Sure Palin is ignorant and for sale but we are talking Democrats here

Are we really electing folks just a bit better and smarter than Palin but subject to similar blind spots, just with a (D) next to their name and a more civil tone?

Does "viable" really mean empty headed/and or crooked, well resourced, connected, and mostly ready to swallow whatever company line comes down the pipe?

That is scary to me.

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Response to TheKentuckian (Reply #97)

Sun Feb 17, 2013, 04:57 PM

99. Ideally, no, but they're individuals too.

Power does weird things to one's soul.

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Response to TexasProgresive (Reply #70)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:32 PM

79. "Little did I realize we'd get a trifecta"

I said only if we were at war or had a national emergency or were in recession. Little did I realize we'd get the trifecta." —President George W. Bush

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:41 PM

13. I dont believe any liberals were "fooled". I am very passionate about this subject so

forgive my language in advance.

I am passionate about this because at the time I was going fucking crazy screaming at everything saying that every word out of that asshole's mouth was a lie. He couldnt even keep a straight face. How could anyone be fooled?

Tom Dashiell gave a excellent speech on all the reasons we shouldnt give the nitwit King the authority to kill, kill, kill. Then Dashiell got on his knees and paid homage to the idiot king. Tom Dashiell has blood on his hands.

One of my Democratic Senators decided to kiss Bush's feet and give him authority to kill hundreds of thousand children. I hope she has nightmares for that purely political decision. She is too smart to have been fooled. She has blood on her hands.

The evidence at the time was so bad that I believe that anyone fooled by the evidence is an idiot. Sorry, that's how I feel. How could anyone but a halfwit be fooled by Georgie W. Bush, the idiot king.

The ruling elite wont allow Georgie Porgie and Dickhead Cheney to be punished. So I hope they live a long life and be reminded every day of the children they murdered for political power and cash.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #13)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 05:31 AM

67. I agree with you. And world records were set with the protests in February 2003.

City to City, in the US and abroad, millions upon millions protested the war that hadn't happened yet. They never made their case to anyone other than the chicken hawks in Congress who cared more about political survival than the truth.

We knew their claims of WMDs were lies even when they were trying to sell the pu pu platter to the UN. We knew they had doctored intelligence with the yellow cake uranium before they ever went into war.

We've always been right on this shit. In fact if you look at Liberals as a whole on policy issues, I'd say we're right 90+% of the time which is why it's so fucking disgusting that we are so roundly ignored by the Washington Elite.

Rp

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Response to MessiahRp (Reply #67)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 11:00 AM

71. Without sounding to CT minded, the lesson to be learned is that those Democrats that

supported Bush WERE NOT FOOLED. They arent idiots and they have staff available to investigate. They supported the elite's program of imperialism.

And it was easy to be right about Bush and the neocons. They always lie.

i cant wait to see Dr. Maddow's show on Monday.

NGU

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:47 PM

15. Now what we need are some prosecutions. n/t

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:48 PM

16. I think very few in Congress were 'tricked'...

I think most/some Democrats were willing partners in this crime. All Republicans were on board - nothing like a war for them.

As far as citizens, a huge majority of Republicans just believe what they are told.

Thinking citizen Democrats knew better, while some believed what the news reported.

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Response to TheProgressive (Reply #16)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:57 PM

25. +1 and a belated welcome to DU nt

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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #25)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:07 PM

30. Thank you...!

Someday, I might break 500 posts....! <sniker>

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:49 PM

17. MILLIONS of us weren't... n/t

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:50 PM

18. That's easy

 

Many Americans are simply sheep. After all, they elected Bush twice, despite his complete lack of intelligence

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Response to rjdem1977_gg (Reply #18)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:29 AM

66. Small correction. He was perhaps elected the second time, but not the first.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:51 PM

19. They didn't trick me. And I wasn't alone.

But anyway, I will be watching Rachel's show.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:52 PM

21. One of the reasons why it makes me violently ill when RWers talk about "the slobbering

liberal media's coddling of Obama" ...

I don't know of any mainstream "liberally-biased media" that made ANY effort to say "Hey, Iraq doesn't have WMDs, Iraq/Saddam had NO ties to Osama bin Laden, Saddam didn't order the attack on the towers".

Not that any amount of truth would stop Bush from his war hard-on. The "liberally-biased (profit-driven) media" sure as hell knew that "war means ratings".

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:53 PM

22. I was not tricked.

I remember calling and writing my congressmen to tell them to NOT support the IWR.

Immediately after Powell's dog and pony show at the UN, we all saw the rebuttals that showed it was bullshit. But we (americans) wanted to kill somebody. 3/4 of America wanted it. Democrats included.

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Response to progressoid (Reply #22)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:59 PM

27. Same here. In a country where we sell a Twinkie as food, well, a war is an easy fix.

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Response to progressoid (Reply #22)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:59 PM

59. Bingo! Bush got away with the lie because we *wanted* to go to war with someone...

Americans felt like some they had to prove something after 9/11 and we would have swallowed any reason however flimsy to have that chance to do that. To march and show off our weapons and our big muscles and all. I remember all the waving flags, and parades and demands to "support our troops!' which was code for "shut-up, peacenik or be labeled unpatriotic!"

I remember being so damn depressed, sitting there trying, just trying to point out how STUPID an idea this was. How pointless--how much it would cost us. It was like I could see the future five years ahead so clearly--and damn if everything I saw didn't happen just as I saw it. Everyone saying we'd get all this "oil" to pay for it and be seen as liberators, etc., and I knew we'd end up in the hole and there would be no oil, and those that had hit us on 9/11 would get just what they wanted--a middle east that was more radical and on their side than on ours.

I could see it all, clear as clear. No one listened to me. All I got was "well, all these countries are with us...."

And that is another thing. All those other countries should not have gotten on board with us. If they'd refused and been skeptical, if they'd demanded we put-up or shut-up, we'd really have to have thought twice before going in, however "easy" a win this war seemed. They enabled us like someone enabling an alcoholic to get drunk.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:56 PM

24. How cute

Lying the country into war = "tricked"?

Remember the 16 bullshit words in the SOTU (post the IWR vote)

"The British Government has learned that Saddam Hussein recently sought significant quantities of uranium from Africa."

Bush's 16 words still hotly debated
http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/07/20/sprj.irq.wmd.investigation/

How Powerful Can 16 Words Be?
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/0720-09.htm

Here's the bullshit letter sent with the bullshit report.

March 18, 2003

Dear Mr. Speaker: (Dear Mr. President: )

Consistent with section 3(b) of the Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 2002 (Public Law 107-243), and based on information available to me, including that in the enclosed document, I determine that:

(1) reliance by the United States on further diplomatic and other peaceful means alone will neither (A) adequately protect the national security of the United States against the continuing threat posed by Iraq nor (B) likely lead to enforcement of all relevant United Nations Security Council resolutions regarding Iraq; and

(2) acting pursuant to the Constitution and Public Law 107-243 is consistent with the United States and other countries continuing to take the necessary actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations, or persons who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001.

Sincerely,

GEORGE W. BUSH

http://georgewbush-whitehouse.archives.gov/news/releases/2003/03/20030319-1.html

Bush lied the country into war. He pulled the trigger despite protest even from members of Congress. I remember Kerry and Kennedy jointly speaking out against action for weeks leading up to the moment Bush launched the war.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:00 PM

28. He had lots of help

from the corporate whore media.

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Response to tabasco (Reply #28)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:50 PM

40. That's because the

 

corporate whore media are corporations themselves. They sought to profit from the plunder of Iraq. I know we are discouraged from making comparisons to Hitler's Germany, but our American media replicates the Reich's Ministry of Propaganda in their actions every single day. Never more so than in that period, of course. For in that instance, they were spreading the Bush administration's contrived propaganda to go to war against another nation. It doesn't matter that Saddam Hussein wasn't a favorite ally. His nation was not conspiring to attack or harm the United States.

As to the American media, when do they ever report the actual news of the world anymore? Between long commentary from their corporate employees and invited biased and unqualified guests, who are invited there to formulate opinion in the viewer's mind. In a full day of alleged news, only 30 minutes of actual news is reported. Sometimes less than that. It is mostly commentary (propapanda) to persuade the viewer's of their national and international goals. Nevermind that those persuasive commentaries are designed to circumvent law and common sense, or that they are directly contrary to this nation's national conscience and good, they are delivering the company's propaganda non-stop, wall to wall, 24 hours a day, 365 days a year.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:07 PM

31. He had a lot of help.

And they are still at large too.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:10 PM

32. Not tricked but we don't have to be tricked

for it to happen again.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:17 PM

33. I'm looking forward to it

Rachel keeps saying that this documentary might make some waves, and I really hope that it does.

The majority of the Bush II administration, along with the President and VP should already be in the Hague for war crimes. When Obama pardoned them, I realized that we would never see justice done for the Iraqi people.

Even though it won't make a difference in our broken justice system, I hope this show will cause those who still defend that war to take a second look.

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Response to Heathen57 (Reply #33)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:33 PM

57. The problem is that it's on MSNBC -- it's primarily us that watch it. But with social

media and what I'm sure will be a compelling and fascinating presentation, I'm hopeful this will get outside of OUR bubble and make it into the masses.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:21 PM

35. He didn't trick me. Knew he was full of shit and lying about WMD's.

 

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Response to MotherPetrie (Reply #35)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:12 PM

48. Neither did he trick 250,000 on October 26 2002

Last edited Sat Feb 16, 2013, 08:31 AM - Edit history (1)

we marched in DC because we KNEW there were no WMD

Then on Feb 14th ( I think it was) 2003 - the largest demonstration EVER took place across the planet and 10-14 MILLION people said DON'T DO THIS

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Response to underpants (Reply #48)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 11:15 PM

62. Yup! And it enrages me that he suffered not a single real consequence for his criminality.

 

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:37 PM

38. My memory says we weren't tricked but ignored. No one wanted war except Bush/Cheney

and all the companies who would make becoup bucks as outlined in the website Project for a New American Century. We, the unwashed masses, couldn't stop them.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:47 PM

39. us?

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 09:57 PM

41. OMG

That sounds good.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:04 PM

42. rePIGs STILL Believe Iraq Had WMDs

 

and that they moved most, if not ALL of them to Syria just before we attacked them....10 yrs ago today. Imagine that! And that's their explanation as to why WMDs haven't as yet been found in Iraq. I so fucking hate these fuckers!

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:04 PM

43. I never agreed with invading Iraq and neither did anyone else I knew who

was a liberal Dem like myself. My husband, not as liberal, thought it was a made up war, illegal and immoral.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:05 PM

44. I told anyone who would listen that Bush was lying to get us into a war with Iraq,....

....I told them there were no WMDs in Iraq, that Saddam and Osama did not get along, and finally, that there were no Iraqi hijackers present on 9/11.

And then I asked them, "So tell me, why does it look like we're going to war?"

Sadly, 90% of the people I talked with thought I was delusional.

I wonder what those people are thinking today?

The NeoCons tricked the people who mattered into pursuing a war with Iraq, but there were quite a few of us who weren't fooled.

On behalf of all of those people of all nationalities who have died in Iraq, I hope those decision-makers regret what they did for the rest of their lives.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:06 PM

45. This is so ironic

I was just thinking the same thing. I was on a phone with a friend of mine and clip of GWB lying his ass off about WMD came on. I couldn't talk when I saw it, because I was like how could we have believed this?

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:06 PM

46. SERIOUSLY??? The Presidential Daily Brief of August 6, 2001. nt

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:06 PM

47. Is there supposed to be a video link in the OP?

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Response to JDPriestly (Reply #47)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 08:21 AM

68. The video posted is a teaser for Mondays showing of ' HUBRIS '

a documentary that will air Monday, 2/18 at 9 p.m. ET

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Response to JDPriestly (Reply #47)

Sun Feb 17, 2013, 05:18 PM

100. For some reason I could not link to a video.

That happens to me sometimes.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:14 PM

50. There is no statute of limitations on murder or war crimes.

Then is past and now and the future is what matters.

There is no filibuster or super majority needed for prosecution; what is required is will and integrity of those that We the People hire for our leadership.

I agree with Maddow and believed at the time we were being lied to and doing hugely morally wrong actions against other nations, other innocent people, the American People, and what the United States of America truly is at its core.

I don't and will not excuse current leadership for not having the basic humanity and integrity to be fair and just even if I have no better choice but to vote for them. No excuses.

There is so much corruption, greed, and lack of kind empathy in our society that in my 60s I am personsally having a difficult time accepting humanity as a whole as anything but a blight.

One goes out every day and sees glimpses of beauty, kindness, and love but in the big picture not what could be but what should be just is not happening.

It is far past time for de-militarization and social justice and time for the predators and those that enable the predators to be prosecuted and removed from general society for their crimes against humanity, the natural world and God/Goddesses if so inclined of whatever flavor.

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Response to PufPuf23 (Reply #50)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 11:20 PM

96. Scratch Euro-speaking engagements off the list for Bush.

He better stick with his oil painting and stay home with Laura.

After Monday hopefully, there will be calls for an independent investigation.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:23 PM

52. all the money you made will never buy back your soul

Hi,
Lot of good posts in this thread. Ten years later republicans still think it was the right thing to do. I wonder what the results of a poll taken today would be of the American people asking why the war started, I am afraid that a lot would still say because Iraq attacked NYC.

Peace

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:23 PM

53. I never supported the Iraq war.

At the time I supported destroying Alqueda and their support but I saw that Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 and did not pose a direct or imminent threat to the US. Saddam didn't even have a competent Air Force or a large two ocean navy on top of no WMD. We still have people here in this country that still believes fighting in Iraq was protecting out freedoms and that's pure brainwashing. Plus there was no real proof that Saddam was associated with Bin Laden which means....

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:30 PM

56. Three little words...Nahn Wun Wun.

Watch Lois Griffin do it (some kid recorded this off his tee vee, but you get the idea):

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 10:46 PM

58. Many did not realize the vast dishonesty of that Administration,

even before 9/11.

They had their agenda, and a bought-out media more than willing to peddle their lies.

And now BHO wants to fly 30,000 armed drones over US cities.

Yeah, they think they can fool us again.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 11:01 PM

60. Easy: FEAR. Using fear to prey is GOP strong suit.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 11:06 PM

61. By means of a conspiracy

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 11:51 PM

63. The millions of anti war demonstrators

were not fucking tricked, we were ignored. Tricked my ass.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:00 AM

64. Many of us were not tricked.

I'll always be proud that I joined thousands of other Americans in DC to demonstrate against the war before it began. Bush started beating his war drum when he had that megaphone in New York on the rubble after 9/11. He wanted to whip the country up for war. He lied, lied and lied. Iraq's WMD, which didn't exist, had nothing to do with 9/11. He wanted to be a "war president." He thought it would be over quickly and easily and the troops would be hailed as saviors by the people of Iraq. He thought he would benefit politically. He was wrong. I am very angry to this day that he has not been held accountable for all the death, maiming, destruction and sorrow he caused. In a later anti-war demonstration I attended, Jane Fonda used that very word in her excellent speech - "hubris." Very good title for the program.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:25 AM

65. It's called a conspiracy to commit war, propaganda and treason

 

It wasn't a "trick". It doesn't matter what it was though, nobody will be held accountable for all the crimes involved.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 08:23 AM

69. LIES, PERJURY, AND TREASON: Cheney; Bush; Rice; Powell; Rumsfeld; Wolfowitz; FOX.

NO "yellow cake."
NO "WMD."
NO "mobile biological weapons laboratory."
NO 9/11 involvement of Saddam Hussein.

My personal favorite, the one LIE that was SO BIZARRE, SO EASILY DISPROVEN YET WAS NOT BY OUR MEDIA, as to beggar belief:
Saddam Hussein was unwilling to let the inspectors go in to determine whether or not the U.N. resolutions were being upheld."
—President George W. Bush
Dec. 1, 2008

http://www.unknownnews.org/inspectors.html

Then there was Condi's brazen attempt to claim ignorance of a method of attack for which we were not only planning, but a SIMULATION OF which WE WERE ALSO CONDUCTING ON SEPTEMBER 11, 2011, UNDER CHENEY'S WATCH.

Finally, there was HER STAGGERING ADMISSION of INCOMPETENCE OR WORSE:



HERE is that August 6, 2001, PDB's transcript:
http://articles.cnn.com/2004-04-10/politics/august6.memo_1_bin-conduct-terrorist-attacks-abu-zubaydah?_s=PM:ALLPOLITICS

The day after he received the memo, “Bush seemed carefree as he spoke about the books he was reading, the work he was doing on his nearby ranch, his love of hot-weather jogging, his golf game and his 55th birthday,” the Washington Post noted.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:10 PM

74. he took advantage of american's fears after 911......bu$h* & cheney should be in prison.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:12 PM

75. He didn't fool my ass....

Nor did Powell lying his ass off in front of the U.N.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:18 PM

77. They got tricked into an occupation, not a war.

Americans love war when it means us gunning down a bunch of dark skinned foreigners. Americans hate the idea of sacrificing our blood and treasure to clean up the messes we make.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:26 PM

78. I remember "Mission Accomplished" day vividly. First this link to what "Tweety"

and some others thought. I like to post that as a reminder every once in awhile. Matthews gushes over how wonderful his President is.

http://mediamatters.org/research/2006/04/27/mission-accomplished-a-look-back-at-the-medias/135513

I said nyet so fast. Give it five years or so and we'll see if this can be called a success at all. I was way off. Five years wasn't near long enough and I'm not sure you can make that call even yet. Of course if you're one of the ones the war was fought for, you can declare it an overwhelming success! I think they made at least a few million off of every one of our guys they murdered over there.

Then there was a Republican acquaintance at our local Eagles Lodge. I'm not sure he cared about any of the lies at all. He was just glad we were doing it to go after the oil. He said, "I'm a Roman. I'm talking empire. I say we just take it!" Of course by "we" he didn't really mean we. He didn't join up, though he was young enough. As far as the oil doing us any good, we see how much that helped us.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:40 PM

80. I think Rachel will not only blow the lid off the Bush admin, she will show many in this thread why

they are wrong.

The vast majority of the world believed there was a strong chance Iraq had WMD through 2002. The only thing that definitively changed that was the reports of the UN Weapons Inspectors. Those didn't start to be issued until the end of 2002, beginning of 2003. Because they did not arrive in Iraq until the end of November 2002 after IWR and UN Sec Res 1441.

IWR and UN Sec Res 1441 were efforts to get the inspectors back into Iraq to do their jobs. As soon as they did, we began to see that there were no WMD in Iraq, but the Bush admin continued to press for war.

It is revisionist history to suggest that the Democrats in the House and Senate who voted for IWR were bad or complicit or any other term one would ascribe.

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Response to stevenleser (Reply #80)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:44 PM

81. Powell even duped Franken

So, yes - good people can be fooled easily, even smart people can be swayed with great propaganda.

That's why we need actual news media back. Yet they cut the only liberal radio from liberal Portland & Seattle markets. So it goes.

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Response to upi402 (Reply #81)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 01:12 PM

85. Syria voted for UN Sec Res 1441 as did China, Russia, France, Norway, Mexico, Bulgaria, Mauritania,

etc. It was a unanimous vote of the Security Council. They all thought that Iraq likely had WMD. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Security_Council_Resolution_1441

You can see in that list of countries several that would happily tell the United States to jump in a lake if they disagreed or had the slightest inkling of duplicity or deception by the Bush administration.

That doesnt even capture the story. Virtually the entire world was behind getting the UN Weapons Inspectors back into Iraq because they did not trust Saddam Hussein, and with good reason.

I think the "Wow, aren't we who weren't fooled great people" crowd are mostly folks who don't support any military action and are suspicious of all of them and who happily attack the majority of Democrats on any suggestion that they aren't pure Liberals or Progressives regardless of the evidence to the contrary.

Your points are good ones though.

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Response to stevenleser (Reply #85)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 02:43 PM

91. Some Dems are supported by the military industrial complex

Others are spineless cowards who go along. And not all in the Democratic Party are Democrats - they merely supplant actual Dems.

We should never be naive about politics and power, and those drawn to it.

Others were truly fooled, however, like myself. I was worried when Noam was opposed to it, that I was being duped. I bought into the appeasers in WW2 argument, along with Sadam's cruel nature and past actions. Then came Powell... who shit on his uniform for his masters.

Yep, I'd like to see some people held accountable. Go Rachel & Co.!

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Response to upi402 (Reply #91)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 02:59 PM

93. We will have to agree to disagree. I see no evidence of a MIC that influences events or votes.

I realize it was Eisenhower who said it and I have even talked in person to his granddaughter about it (Susan). I am not convinced that such an entity exists.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 12:55 PM

82. He did it exactly the same way Hitler invaded Poland, massive propaganda and a falsified enemy

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 01:06 PM

83. He didn't trick "us."

The United States military/industrial war machine does what it pleases, the public be damned.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 01:12 PM

86. Erect bogeyman, wave flag, sing God Bless America, send in the killers. Works every time.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 01:24 PM

88. The "tricked" meme is a deflection of responsibility only because the war failed.

It was used by almost everybody who didn't want to be blamed for voting for the war. Had Iraq gone smoothly, the same group of people would have bragged how they stood up for America by voting for the "totally justified" war.

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Response to Dash87 (Reply #88)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 01:31 PM

89. Yep. And, the "everyone else did it" is a rationalization used by teens and politicians.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 01:43 PM

90. Woah!! She already knows that heads are exploding over this, or she wouldn't

have said that. I won't be surprised if NBC pulls the show before it airs.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 04:21 PM

94. Bush didn't trick anyone into war, he LIED to start the war

I hope heads roll after this special airs, it sure seems like they expect it to stir things up. Fine with me, way past time some accountability was served up to the criminals responsible for the war.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sat Feb 16, 2013, 04:25 PM

95. The same way Poppy tricked us into the Gulf War in '91

Ask April Glaspie. That was an absolute atrocity.

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Response to Segami (Original post)

Sun Feb 17, 2013, 01:58 PM

98. Let us not forget the "Tonkin Resolution".

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