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Thu Feb 14, 2013, 06:32 AM

Inside the Military Rape Cult

http://www.alternet.org/gender/inside-military-rape-cult

In many ways, what happened to Petty Officer Second Class Rebecca Blumer after she was roofied and raped by three Army officers she met in a bar not far from base was far worse than the attack itself. Her superiors became more intent on prosecuting her for D.U.I. than on finding out what really happened to this promising young intelligence analyst. What’s worse is that her brutal story, recounted in riveting detail by journalist Sabrina Rubin Erdely in this month’s Rolling Stone magazine, is far from uncommon. The military, as films like The Invisible War and Erdely’s article show, has a rape problem of epidemic proportions. It is estimated that one in three military women are raped by fellow troops, twice the number of their civilian counterparts. One survivor of multiple rapes quoted in Erdely’s article calls the military a “giant rape cult.” In 2010, the DoD found that 19,000 service members were sexually assaulted. Of those a paltry 3,100, or 13.5 percent, were reported, and of those only 17 percent were prosecuted. All too often, attackers receive a slap on the wrist while their victims lose their careers and their futures, sometimes falling into homelessness, despair and suicidal thoughts.

I recently spoke with Erdely about her article, and was surprised to find that despite the horrific experiences of Blumer and other military rape victims, there might just be a glimmer of hope at the end of a long dark road spanning Tailhook, Lackland Air Force, Aberdeen and probably many sexual assault scandals that have never come to light.

Janet Allon: What drew you to the topic of sexual assault in the military?

Sabrina Rubin Erdely: I’ve written a lot on the subject of sexual assault in general, and have long been interested in the way these cases are handled and the way they are perceived by society. In both military sexual assault and civilian sexual assault, there are these rape myths that get in the way of survivors reporting these crimes.

Rape myths are at the heart of sexual assault and how it is handled, but these problems are magnified in the military. The military’s rape epidemic is magnified by military culture.

31 replies, 3104 views

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Arrow 31 replies Author Time Post
Reply Inside the Military Rape Cult (Original post)
xchrom Feb 2013 OP
davidpdx Feb 2013 #1
Luna Fortuna Feb 2013 #29
davidpdx Feb 2013 #31
vlyons Feb 2013 #2
Kolesar Feb 2013 #3
vlyons Feb 2013 #18
OldDem2012 Feb 2013 #11
el_bryanto Feb 2013 #13
OldDem2012 Feb 2013 #14
seabeyond Feb 2013 #16
seabeyond Feb 2013 #15
uppityperson Feb 2013 #30
el_bryanto Feb 2013 #4
unhappycamper Feb 2013 #5
el_bryanto Feb 2013 #9
seabeyond Feb 2013 #10
el_bryanto Feb 2013 #12
mopinko Feb 2013 #19
seabeyond Feb 2013 #21
mopinko Feb 2013 #22
seabeyond Feb 2013 #23
mopinko Feb 2013 #24
seabeyond Feb 2013 #20
seabeyond Feb 2013 #6
Ilsa Feb 2013 #7
LiberalLoner Feb 2013 #17
Ilsa Feb 2013 #25
LiberalLoner Feb 2013 #26
Ilsa Feb 2013 #27
bullwinkle428 Feb 2013 #8
L0oniX Feb 2013 #28

Response to xchrom (Original post)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 06:59 AM

1. One of my classmates who is working on a doctorate

is writing her dissertation on rape in the military. She has been in the Navy for over 20 years. The dissertation will probably be finished in late 2014 or early 2015. I would guess there is probably plenty of other studies out there about it.

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Response to davidpdx (Reply #1)

Mon Feb 18, 2013, 09:59 PM

29. Is your classmate

an enlisted woman, Chief or Senior Chief? I filled out a survey for a senior enlisted sailor in China Lake, CA; she was getting her doctorate and also studying military sexual assault. I was in the Marine Corps at the time.

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Response to Luna Fortuna (Reply #29)

Tue Feb 19, 2013, 06:21 AM

31. No, she's on the right coast

She's an E-7 Chief Hospital Corpsman in the Navy. Was the person you filled yours out getting her doctorate in business or psychology?

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Response to xchrom (Original post)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 08:09 AM

2. What are the 3 myths about rape?

Please explain. Links also please. thanks

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Response to vlyons (Reply #2)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 08:36 AM

3. "These" myths, not "three" myths

The article does not say anything about "three myths"

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Response to Kolesar (Reply #3)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:17 AM

18. sorry my glasses broke yerterday

I'm squinting up a storm

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Response to vlyons (Reply #2)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:02 AM

11. The writer didn't specify the number of rape myths, but try this....

List of RAPE MYTHS
Sociology of Rape
University of Minnesota Duluth
http://www.d.umn.edu/cla/faculty/jhamlin/3925/myths.html

Rape myths are beliefs about sexual assault that wrought with problems. Some myths are just completely and blatantly untrue. What often happens is that beliefs surrounding circumstances, situations, and characteristics of individuals connected to rape are applied to all cases and situations uncritically. Myths exist for many historic reasons which include inherited structural conditions, gender role expectations, and the fundamental exercise of power in a patriarchal society. The best way to approach rape myths are to confront them honestly and frankly. Don't deny their existence and don't dismiss one ungrounded statement with another.

Confronting rape myths sociologically means looking at the data and reevaluating knowledge in the face of social facts. What follows are a list of rape myths and the facts that bring those rape conceptions into question. They are not always conclusive but provide the ground work for continued research.

Myth: Rape is sex.

Fact: Rape is experienced by the victims as an act of violence. It is a life-threatening experience. One out of every eight adult women has been a victim of forcible rape. (National Victim Center and Crime Victims Research and Treatment Center, 1992) While sexual attraction may be influential, power, control and anger are the primary motives. Most rapists have access to a sexual partner. Gratification comes from gaining power and control and discharging anger. This gratification is only temporary, so the rapist seeks another victim.

Myth: Women incite men to rape.

Fact: Research has found that the vast majority of rapes are planned. Rape is the responsibility of the rapist alone. Women, children and men of every age, physical type and demeanor are raped. Opportunity is the most important factor determining when a given rapist will rape.

Myth: There is a "right way" to respond to a rape situation.

Fact:Since rape is life-threatening and each rapist has his own pattern, the best thing a victim can do is follow her instincts and observe any cues from the rapist. If the victim escapes alive she has done the right thing.

Myth:A victim should be discouraged from dwelling on the rape. She should "forget it".

Fact: This advice generally comes from people who are more concerned with their own feelings than the victim's. All victims should be offered the opportunity to talk about the assault with those personally close to them and knowledgeable professionals. Victims who are not allowed to talk about the rape have a much more difficult time recovering form it.

Myth:Support from family members is essential to the victim's recovery.

Fact: A Victim Services study found that emotional and practical support offered by family and friends does not necessarily speed the recovery of rape victims. However, when the people that a victim relies on behave in un supportive or negative ways, the victim faces a longer, more difficult recovery process. These negative behaviors include worrying more about oneself that the victim, blaming the victim, withdrawing from the victim or behaving in a hostile manner, and attaching a stigma to the rape and demanding secrecy from the victim.

Myth:Rape trauma syndrome is a transient problem. Most healthy people will return to a normal state of functioning within a year.

Fact: Surviving a rape can lead a woman to a better understanding of her own strength, but rape is a life changing experience. Rape has a devastating effect on the mental health of victims, with nearly one-third (31%) of all rape victims developing Rape-related Post-traumatic Stress Disorder (RR-PTSD) some time in their lifetimes. More than one in ten rape victims currently suffer from RR-PTSD. (National Victim Center and Crime Victims Research and Treatment Center)

Myth: Rapists are non-white. Rapists are lower class. Rapists are "Criminal types".

Fact: Rapists that fit the myth are more likely to be prosecuted but a rapist can be anyone: doctor, policeman, clergyman, social worker or corporate president.

Myth: Men can't be raped.

Fact: There were approximately 20,000 sexual assaults of males ages 12 and over in the United States in 1991. (Bureau of Justice statistics, 1992)

Myth: Incest is rare.

Fact: Incest is common and happens in every community. An estimated 77% of reported sexual abusers are parents (57% of the total being natural parents), 16% are other relatives, and 6% are non-related. In addition, males are reported to be the abusers in 60 to 95% of cases. (Thoringer, School Psychology Review, 17 (4):614-636)

Myth: Sexual assaults are rare deviations and affect few people. After all, no one I know has been raped.

Fact: Sexual assaults are very common. Most likely, someone close to you has been profoundly affected by sexual assault. Not only are victims reluctant to discuss their assaults but many succeed in totally blocking the assault from conscious memory. However, the trauma remains and may come to the surface at another crisis or when the opportunity to discuss it with a sympathetic person arises. An estimated 155,000 women were raped each year between 1973 and 1987. (U.S. Department of Justice, 1991)

Myth: Women often make false reports of rape.

Fact: According to FBI crime statistics, during the 1990s around 8 percent. The “unfounded” rate, or percentage of complaints determined through investigation to be false, is higher for forcible rape than for any other Index crime. Eight percent of forcible rape complaints in 1996 were “unfounded,” while the average for all Index crimes was 2 percent.

Myth: You can tell a rapist by the way he looks.

Fact: Rapists are not physically identifiable. They may appear friendly, normal, and non-threatening. Many are young, married and have children. Rapist types and traits however can be categorized.

Myth: Women fantasize about being raped.

Fact: No woman fantasizes about being raped. Fantasies about aggressive sex may be controlled and turned off if they become threatening. In rape, the victim is unable to control the violence and stop it.

Myth: A man can't rape his wife.

Fact: Many states now have laws against rape in marriage. The idea that a man can't rape his wife suggests married women do not have the same right to safety as do unmarried women. Most battered women have experienced some form of sexual abuse within their marriage. It is also known that estranged or ex-spouses sometimes use rape as a form of retaliation.

Myth: Only "bad" women get raped.

Fact: No other crime victim is looked upon with the degree of suspicion and doubt as a victim of rape. Although there are numerous reasons why society has cast blame on the victims of rape, a major reason found in studies is that of a feeling of self protection. If one believes that the victim was responsible because she put herself in an unsafe position, such as being out late at night, drinking alcohol, dressing in a certain way, or "leading on" the rapist, then we are able to feel safer because "we wouldn't do those things." But, the basic fact remains that without consent, no means no, no matter what the situation or circumstances.

Myth: Rape is just unwanted sex and isn't really a violent crime.

Fact: Rape is a lot more than an unwanted sex act, it is a violent crime. Many rapists carry a weapon and threaten the victim with violence or death.

Myth: Rape only occurs outside and at night.

Fact: Rape can and does occur anytime and anyplace. Many rapes occur during the day and in the victims' homes.

Myth: Sexual assault is an impulsive, spontaneous act.

Fact: Most rapes are carefully planned by the rapist. A rapist will rape again and again, usually in the same area of town and in the same way.

Myth: Sexual assault usually occurs between strangers.

Fact: By some estimates, over 70% of rape victims know their attackers. The rapist may be a relative, friend, co-worker, date or other acquaintance.

Myth: Rape only happens to young attractive women.

Fact: Rape can and does strike anyone at anytime. Age, social class, ethnic group and has no bearing on the person a rapist chooses to attack. Research data clearly proves that a way a woman dresses and / or acts does not influence the rapists choice of victims. His decision to rape is based on how easily he perceives his target can be intimidated. Rapists are looking for available and vulnerable targets. Statistics were obtained from various sources including the study Rape in America, 1992, National Victim Center, The Federal Bureau of Investigations and the National Crime Survey.

Myth: Rape is a crime of passion.

Fact: Rape is an act of VIOLENCE, not passion. it is an attempt to hurt and humiliate, using sex as the weapon.

Myth: Most rapes occur as a "spur of the moment" act in a dark alley by a stranger.

Fact: Rape often occurs in one's home - be it apartment, house or dormitory. Very often the rapist is known by the victim in some way and the rape is carefully planned.

Myth:Most rapists only rape one time.

FACT Most rapists rape again, and again, and again - until caught.

Myth: Only certain kinds of people get raped. It cannot happen to me.

FACT: Rapists act without considering their victim's physical appearance, dress, age, race, gender, or social status. Assailants seek out victims who they perceive to be vulnerable. The Orange County Rape Crisis Center has worked with victims from infancy to ninety-two years of age and from all racial and socioeconomic backgrounds.

Myth: Only women and gay men get raped.

FACT The vast majority of male rape victims, as well as their rapists, are heterosexual.Male rape victims now represent 8% of the primary victims served by the Orange County Rape Crisis Center. Rapists are motivated by the desire to have power and control over another person, not by sexual attraction. Male rape is not homosexual rape. Many male victims do not report the assault because they fear further humiliation.

Myth: Rape is an impulsive, uncontrollable act of sexual gratification. Most rape are spontaneous acts of passion where the assailant cannot control him/herself.

FACT Rape is a premeditated act of violence, not a spontaneous act of passion. 71% of rapes are planned in advance. 60% of convicted rapists were married or had regular sexual partners at the time of the assault. Men can control their sexual impulses. The vast majority of rapists are motivated by power, anger, and control, not sexual gratification.

Myth: No woman or man can be raped against her or his will. Any person could prevent rape if he or she really wanted to.

FACT In 1991, 14% of the rapes reported to the Orange County Rape Crisis Center involved the use of a weapon. 74% involved physical force and/or threats of force. Women are often physically weaker than men and are not taught to defend themselves or to be physically aggressive. Furthermore, some women are not willing to hurt another person, especially if the offender is someone they know.

Myth: Most rapes occur when people are out alone at night. If people stay at home, then they will be safer.

FACT 44% of rapes reported to the Orange County Rape Crisis Center in 1991 occurred in the victim's home.

Myth: Rapists are strangers. If people avoid strangers, then they will not be raped.

FACT In 60% of the rapes reported to the Orange County Rape Crisis Center in 1991, the rapist was known to the victim. 7% of the assailants were family members of the victim. These statistics reflect only reported rapes. Assaults by assailants the victim knows are often not reported so the statistics do not reflect the actual numbers of acquaintance rapes.

Myth: If the assailant, victim, or both are drunk, the assailant cannot be charged with rape.

FACT Forcing sex on someone who is too drunk to give consent is second degree rape in North Carolina. Rape is a crime. People who commit crimes while under the influence of alcohol or drugs are not considered free from guilt.

Myth: Most rapes involve black men and white women.

FACT 77% of the rapes reported to the Orange County Rape Crisis Center in 1991 involved persons of the same race.

Myth: Rapists are abnormal perverts; only sick or insane men are rapists.

FACT In a study of 1300 convicted offenders, few were diagnosed as mentally or emotionally ill. Most were well-adjusted but had a greater tendency to express their anger through violence and rage.

Myth: Rape is a minor crime affecting only a few women.

FACT It is estimated that 1 in 8 women will be raped in her lifetime. Because of low reporting rates, it is not known how many adult men are assaulted. It is also estimated that 1 out of every 4 girls, and 1 out of every 8 boys are sexually assaulted in some way before they reach adulthood. Rape is the most frequently committed violent crime in this country.

Myth: Women frequently cry rape; false reporting of rape is common.

FACT The FBI reports that only 2% of rapes reports are given falsely. This is the same report rate for other felonies.

Myth: Most rapes occur on the street, by strangers, or by a few crazy men.

FACT Over 50% of reported rapes occur in the home. 80% of sexual assaults reported by college age women and adult women were perpetrated by close friends or family members. There is no common profile of a rapist. Rapes are committed by people from all economic levels, all races, all occupations. A rapist can be your doctor, your boss, your clergyman, your superintendent, your partner, your lover, your friend or your date.

Myth: You cannot be assaulted against your will.

FACT Assailants overpower their victims with the threat of violence or with actual violence. Especially in cases of acquaintance rape or incest, an assailant often uses the victim's trust in him to isolate her.

Myth: Women secretly enjoy being raped.

FACT No woman/ man/ child enjoys being raped. It is a brutal intrusion on the mind, body and spirit that can have lasting trauma.

Myth: It is impossible for a husband to sexually assault his wife.

FACT Regardless of marital or social relationship, if a woman does not consent to sexual activity, she is being sexually assaulted. In fact, 14% of women are victims of rape committed by their husband.

Myth: If a person doesn't "fight back" she/he wasn't really raped.

FACT Rape is potentially life-threatening. Whatever a person does to survive the assault is the appropriate action.

Myth: A person who has really been assaulted will be hysterical.

FACT: Survivors exhibit a spectrum of emotional responses to assault: calm, hysteria, laughter, anger, apathy, shock. Each survivor copes with the trauma of the assault in a different way.

Myth: Women "ask for it" by their dress or actions.

FACT Rapists look for victims they perceive as vulnerable, not women who dress in a particular way. Assuming that women provoke attacks by where they are or the way they dress is victim-blaming. No person, whatever their behaviour, "deserves" to be raped.

Myth: Women "cry" rape.

FACT Only two percent of reported rape and related sex offences are false (which is approximately the same rate of false reports for other crimes). Although many cases are dropped because of insufficient evidence for conviction, this should not be confused with false reporting.

Myth: Gang rape is rare.

FACT: In 43% of all reported cases, more than one assailant was involved.

Myth: Women who are drunk are willing to engage in any kind of sexual activity.

FACT The fact that a woman has been drinking does not imply consent. Alcohol and drugs can render a woman incapable of consent.

Myth: Only young, pretty women are assaulted.

FACT Survivors range in age from infancy to old age, and their appearance is seldom a consideration. Assailants often choose victims who seem most vulnerable to attack: old persons, children, physically or emotionally disabled persons, substance abusers and street persons. Men are also attacked.

Myth: It is impossible to sexually assault a man.

FACT Men fall victim for the same reasons as women: they are overwhelmed by threats or acts of physical and emotional violence. Also, most sexual assaults that involve a male victim are gang assaults.

Myth: As long as children remember to stay away from strangers, they are in no danger of being assaulted.

FACT Sadly, children are usually assaulted by acquaintances; a family member or other caretaking adult. Children are usually coerced into sexual activity by their assailant, and are manipulated into silence by the assailant's threats and/or promises, as well as their own feelings of guilt.

Myth: Most rapes involve black men raping white women.

FACT The majority of rapes are same race; womewhere around 3 to 4% are not same race.


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Response to OldDem2012 (Reply #11)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:09 AM

13. That is a useful list - well worth reading - but someone should take an edit bat to it.

Good information, but would be even better consolidated and organized.

Bryant

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Response to el_bryanto (Reply #13)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:13 AM

14. Well, gosh...I'll be sure to let the writer know about those shortcomings. nt.

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Response to el_bryanto (Reply #13)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:16 AM

16. yes. agree. a lot of repeat saying the same thing. nt

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Response to OldDem2012 (Reply #11)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:16 AM

15. ]Myth: Rapists are non-white. Rapists are lower class. Rapists are "Criminal types".

Myth: Rapists are non-white. Rapists are lower class. Rapists are "Criminal types".

Fact: Rapists that fit the myth are more likely to be prosecuted but a rapist can be anyone: doctor, policeman, clergyman, social worker or corporate president.

Myth: Rapists are abnormal perverts; only sick or insane men are rapists.

FACT In a study of 1300 convicted offenders, few were diagnosed as mentally or emotionally ill. Most were well-adjusted but had a greater tendency to express their anger through violence and rage.


this is important one. a lot of the rapes, like 87% are date rapes. you know, the average joe. we have to get beyong the thought of it only being the "bad" man.


Myth: Women often make false reports of rape.

Fact: According to FBI crime statistics, during the 1990s around 8 percent. The “unfounded” rate, or percentage of complaints determined through investigation to be false, is higher for forcible rape than for any other Index crime. Eight percent of forcible rape complaints in 1996 were “unfounded,” while the average for all Index crimes was 2 percent.


Myth: Women frequently cry rape; false reporting of rape is common.

FACT The FBI reports that only 2% of rapes reports are given falsely. This is the same report rate for other felonies.


this is not quite correct. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_accusation_of_rape . unfounded is not the same as false rape. both u.s. and UK have found that false claim is between 2%-3%.

FBI statistics
FBI reports consistently put the number of "unfounded" rape accusations around 8%. The average rate of unfounded reports for Index crimes is 2%. However, "unfounded" is not synonymous with false allegation. Bruce Gross of the Forensic Examiner's says that:
This statistic is almost meaningless, as many of the jurisdictions from which the FBI collects data on crime use different definitions of, or criteria for, "unfounded." That is, a report of rape might be classified as unfounded (rather than as forcible rape) if the alleged victim did not try to fight off the suspect, if the alleged perpetrator did not use physical force or a weapon of some sort, if the alleged victim did not sustain any physical injuries, or if the alleged victim and the accused had a prior sexual relationship. Similarly, a report might be deemed unfounded if there is no physical evidence or too many inconsistencies between the accuser's statement and what evidence does exist. As such, although some unfounded cases of rape may be false or fabricated, not all unfounded cases are false.
British Home Office study (2005)
A 2005 study, "A gap or a chasm? Attrition in reported rape cases" was the largest and most rigorous study to date commissioned by the British Home Office on UK rape crime, from the initial reporting of a rape through to legal prosecutions. The study was based on 2,643 sexual assault cases (Kelly, Lovett, and Regan, 2005). Of these, 8% were classified by the police department as false reports.
The researchers noted that some of these classifications were based simply on the personal judgments of the police investigators and were made in violation of official criteria for establishing a false allegation. Closer analysis of this category applying the Home Office counting rules for establishing a false allegation and excluding cases where the application of the cases where confirmation of the designation was uncertain reduced the percentage of false reports to 3%. The researchers concluded that "one cannot take all police designations at face value" and that "here is an over-estimation of the scale of false allegations by both police officers and prosecutors." Moreover, they added:
The interviews with police officers and complainants’ responses show that despite the focus on victim care, a culture of suspicion remains within the police, even amongst some of those who are specialists in rape investigations. There is also a tendency to conflate false allegations with retractions and withdrawals, as if in all such cases no sexual assault occurred. This reproduces an investigative culture in which elements that might permit a designation of a false complaint are emphasised (later sections reveal how this also feeds into withdrawals and designation of ‘insufficient evidence’), at the expense of a careful investigation, in which the evidence collected is evaluated.


this is important because MRA promotes that false claim is between 45-75%. which is absurd. but, to many men are going with this.


Myth: Women fantasize about being raped.

Fact: No woman fantasizes about being raped. Fantasies about aggressive sex may be controlled and turned off if they become threatening. In rape, the victim is unable to control the violence and stop it.


this is the one we have been hearing on du the last couple months. how are the menz suppose to know if the woman really wants to be raped.


good post. thank you. i am keeping this

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Response to OldDem2012 (Reply #11)

Mon Feb 18, 2013, 10:12 PM

30. Thank you for posting that list. There are many myths and they are all wrong.

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Response to xchrom (Original post)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 08:49 AM

4. Can Rape Culture be disentangled from Military Culture? nt

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Response to unhappycamper (Reply #5)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 09:58 AM

9. Obviously it's a prevelent issue in the military

and a national disgrace. But i guess my question would be how do you fix it. Or can it be fixed?

Bryant

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Response to el_bryanto (Reply #9)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:01 AM

10. commanders take it seriously, prosecute and keep a hard line with their troops.

it would work. it would not eliminate all, but it would certainly create a drop.

just as in society as a whole. and we do not do it.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #10)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:05 AM

12. It just frusterates me because there is a level to this conversation that I don't get

I feel fairly confident that If I went up to most men I know - including myself - and said "What do yu think about rape?" the bulk would describe it as terrible. You'd get one or two guys that would talk about false rape accusations. Perhaps that's just because I am a liberal and so they can guess how I feel about rape and tell me what I want to hear?

Rape should make you angry; the concept of rape should make you angry. It shouldn't be a gender issue (it is, but it shouldn't be), it should just make you angry that anybody would treat another person that way.

Bryant

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Response to el_bryanto (Reply #12)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:24 AM

19. evolutionary psychology would tell you that rape is real the reward for the soldier

scattering his seeds widely instead of settling down at home, and without trusting his tribe to take care of his offspring, the root of hero worship. i think this is the number one reason a lot of people hate the theory.
but it isn't an apologia, it is a clue to the origins, and perhaps a clue to the elimination. understanding is always the place to start.
so, till the whole christian soldiers bit dies off, prolly hopeless. when we can say- ok brothers, we aren't apes any more. you have a wife back home. you have kids back home. we will take care of them.
maybe we should let them leave a sperm sample on ice, and promise to give a full military pension to anyone willing to carry it.
i dunno.
really, only ending war will end this shit. i honestly believe that, completely unconsciously, it is about replicating your dna before you died. cuz that is all it is about for all of us, passing on that little packet.

time to fucking evolve.

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Response to mopinko (Reply #19)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:25 AM

21. evo psych picked up the "spread the seed" from religion. hmmmmm. nt

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #21)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 11:01 AM

22. really?

spreading the seed is what evo psych is based on. crick and watson and darwin and all.

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Response to mopinko (Reply #22)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 12:15 PM

23. yes. so lets think this thru. animals and cavemen do/did not have the ability to recognize

sticking the penis into the vagina, letting go of sperm, sperm swimming up vaginal canal into uterus and connecting with an egg would result in a baby 9 months later.

can we at least agree to that.

we have our today thinking capability and subject it to the beginning of time. that will never work.

there could not have been the knowledge and understanding how to "spread seed" and what the outcome would have been. so why do we give it to them as if they innately KNEW that sperm to egg = baby.

the urge for sex? sure.

the urge to mate.... absolutely.

the need to spread the seed? religion and this science picked it up for the basis of their guess work.

oh.... and women have no urges for sex, only men, so the men say.... until not.

and they want only one and they want to be emotionally connected, and they want the man to be much older, not in his sexual prime when he is likely to have the healthiest baby and easiest to impregnate.



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Response to seabeyond (Reply #23)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 03:23 PM

24. animals have no idea what they are doing, and yet they do it anyway.

not just the act of mating, but the act of gaining weight, building a nest, finding a den. building a damn beehive.
so why would we need conscious thought? once we achieve conscious thought, we often say things we believe to be true, but at the same time undermine or deny them with our behavior. hence soldiers believing themselves to be fighting for a principle, when in fact they are fighting to feed the greed of those above them.
our dna whispers in our ears our whole life. we intelligent animals just coat it with a thick layer of rationalization the pretense of free will.

of course, there are differences. some never even mate, some wrap it in gold and ermine.
some soldiers find a girl, fall in love and take her home. imho, males sticking around to help rear their children, solid pair bonds, solid families, was a great leap in human evolution. but those without the resources for that will be no less driven to pass that packet on. they will use other ways. dare i say more primitive ways, whether crude or violent or deceitful.

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Response to el_bryanto (Reply #12)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:24 AM

20. then if we see it in tv we should be angry and not use it as entertainment. but, especially today,

we use rape as a source of entertainment everywhere.

a movie. a woman is drunk. vomits. scene cuts to them in bed. he is fuckin a woman that is unconscious. he stops to think about the right/wrong in raping an unconscious woman. she wakes for a second and slurs.... whydya stop. and passes out again. then he continues to fuck an unconscious woman.

this was for a laugh.

same in animal house.

generals daughter, a gritty tale of gang rape and the effects it had on her life. when she is reinacting the scene to get her father to understand she is staked on the ground. she is doing this heartfelt plea to her father how she was effected by gang rape. all the while, the camera has totally sexualized her. naked, staked. her body oiled. the camera at shots of body posed to titillate. that was glorifying a scene that should have held horror. totally took away from what she was saying.

entertainment.

we have men on du question what is rape exactly. you know. there are women that fantasize about rape, so if they are raped, that is not really rape.

we have people defend the dks, polanski (not rape rape), assange.

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Response to xchrom (Original post)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 09:23 AM

6. we were recently told by a man rape has dropped 85% so we can all sigh a relief, celebrate the 85%

drop in rape over the last 25 yrs and no longer discuss the issue.

my mind has a tough time wrapping around this. 1 in 3 women raped in military and college today. so that would have been what? 1 in 1.5, 1 in 2 women raped in the 80's.

i feel so much ..... better.

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Response to xchrom (Original post)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 09:40 AM

7. The boys club has to punish women who want to join

by raping them until they no longer want to serve.

When I was a younger woman, I considered applying for OCS twice. I wouldn't do under these circumstances. I think I'd stand a better chance on the streets than with a garrison of rapists and their enablers.

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Response to Ilsa (Reply #7)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:17 AM

17. Bingo - you hit the nail on the head here. That is EXACTLY what is going on. As a former Army

Officer who got raped by a fellow LT, I learned that painful lesson first hand.

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Response to LiberalLoner (Reply #17)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 06:36 PM

25. I'm so sorry.

I'm wishing you could have permanently maimed him in the course of the crime.

Yeah, I have old issues that pop up.

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Response to Ilsa (Reply #25)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 08:30 AM

26. LOL unfortunately no....

I was so confused, I blamed myself for the attack. I just was in such shock and kind of shut down. It's hard to explain. It took me years before I could "open the box up" and think about what happened to me. I had pushed it down in my mind so I could just do my job as a soldier and not be distracted by feelings.

But I know what you mean about old issues popping up. Stuff you push down, doesn't want to stay pushed down. ((((HUGS)))) hoping for better for the new generation coming after us.

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Response to LiberalLoner (Reply #26)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 12:08 PM

27. Yes, women are taught

That they are to blame for "making themselves vulnerable" or "too attractive", whatever excuse they come up with. Hang in there; I've learned that the stuff doesn't stay suppressed without a cost.

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Response to xchrom (Original post)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 09:44 AM

8. Of course, this was completely ignored in the confirmation hearing for

the new Sec. of Defense by all of Repuke Senatorial assclowns.

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Response to xchrom (Original post)

Fri Feb 15, 2013, 12:18 PM

28. The military ...the real rape gang gorilla in the room! n/t

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