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Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:15 PM

Pregnant Texas teen files suit against parents in abortion feud

From msnbc.com:

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/02/13/16949097-pregnant-texas-teen-files-suit-against-parents-in-abortion-feud?lite

The parents of a 16 year old teen girl are supposedly trying to force her to get an abortion. The teen's anti-abortion lawyers (Texas Center for Defense of Life, an anti-abortion, "pro-life" advocacy group) is using Roe v. Wade of all things to argue the teen's right to proceed with the pregnancy!!

If an anti-abortion group uses pro-choice laws and precedents to win this case, then this admission that women may exercise choice should completely incapacitate any and all future effort to criminalize and otherwise restrict abortion and other reproductive rights.

174 replies, 9744 views

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Arrow 174 replies Author Time Post
Reply Pregnant Texas teen files suit against parents in abortion feud (Original post)
SpankMe Feb 2013 OP
Sheldon Cooper Feb 2013 #1
Sekhmets Daughter Feb 2013 #2
bluestateguy Feb 2013 #3
freshwest Feb 2013 #59
CTyankee Feb 2013 #164
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #107
bluestateguy Feb 2013 #111
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #158
marshall Feb 2013 #153
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #156
leftynyc Feb 2013 #160
theHandpuppet Feb 2013 #161
leftynyc Feb 2013 #163
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #165
leftynyc Feb 2013 #166
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #167
leftynyc Feb 2013 #168
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #169
leftynyc Feb 2013 #172
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #173
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #174
Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #4
ck4829 Feb 2013 #5
marybourg Feb 2013 #10
leftynyc Feb 2013 #14
marybourg Feb 2013 #16
Fantastic Anarchist Feb 2013 #53
kestrel91316 Feb 2013 #98
KarenS Feb 2013 #103
Selatius Feb 2013 #154
leftynyc Feb 2013 #159
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #18
leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #15
riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #17
HappyMe Feb 2013 #21
marybourg Feb 2013 #24
HappyMe Feb 2013 #41
ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #43
Marrah_G Feb 2013 #49
Arkansas Granny Feb 2013 #62
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #67
LiberalAndProud Feb 2013 #70
Sheldon Cooper Feb 2013 #74
ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #76
Sheldon Cooper Feb 2013 #79
get the red out Feb 2013 #124
ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #125
riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #127
NCTraveler Feb 2013 #51
Xithras Feb 2013 #52
bluestateguy Feb 2013 #60
Iggo Feb 2013 #69
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #72
LittleBlue Feb 2013 #171
Zoeisright Feb 2013 #97
xxqqqzme Feb 2013 #102
treestar Feb 2013 #116
get the red out Feb 2013 #123
JI7 Feb 2013 #130
leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #11
Marrah_G Feb 2013 #50
KittyWampus Feb 2013 #63
leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #66
ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #82
HappyMe Feb 2013 #90
HockeyMom Feb 2013 #106
riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #110
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #117
riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #118
HockeyMom Feb 2013 #119
kestrel91316 Feb 2013 #108
azurnoir Feb 2013 #115
tblue Feb 2013 #92
Marrah_G Feb 2013 #95
tblue Feb 2013 #138
Marrah_G Feb 2013 #141
tblue Feb 2013 #148
Marrah_G Feb 2013 #149
Auntie Bush Feb 2013 #58
JaneyVee Feb 2013 #6
HappyMe Feb 2013 #7
dipsydoodle Feb 2013 #19
SaveAmerica Feb 2013 #8
Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #12
MadrasT Feb 2013 #9
snooper2 Feb 2013 #20
leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #22
snooper2 Feb 2013 #23
leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #27
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #29
leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #33
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #36
leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #73
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #77
riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #86
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #89
riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #96
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #99
riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #109
avebury Feb 2013 #145
juajen Feb 2013 #134
snooper2 Feb 2013 #30
leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #37
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #42
leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #57
joeybee12 Feb 2013 #32
snooper2 Feb 2013 #35
joeybee12 Feb 2013 #38
snooper2 Feb 2013 #39
joeybee12 Feb 2013 #40
Hell Hath No Fury Feb 2013 #31
Marrah_G Feb 2013 #13
leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #26
BlueCaliDem Feb 2013 #44
leftyohiolib Feb 2013 #68
queenjane Feb 2013 #88
ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #46
HappyMe Feb 2013 #56
Mariana Feb 2013 #71
HappyMe Feb 2013 #80
Mariana Feb 2013 #105
phylny Feb 2013 #150
kestrel91316 Feb 2013 #112
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #64
marybourg Feb 2013 #81
ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #84
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #85
leftynyc Feb 2013 #162
Marrah_G Feb 2013 #47
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #48
marybourg Feb 2013 #83
Marrah_G Feb 2013 #93
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #94
kestrel91316 Feb 2013 #114
marybourg Feb 2013 #120
riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #126
kestrel91316 Feb 2013 #128
riderinthestorm Feb 2013 #137
Marrah_G Feb 2013 #142
Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #55
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #61
Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #65
2ndAmForComputers Feb 2013 #25
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #28
Archae Feb 2013 #34
progressoid Feb 2013 #45
Dreamer Tatum Feb 2013 #54
NYC Liberal Feb 2013 #75
Dash87 Feb 2013 #78
Proud Liberal Dem Feb 2013 #87
aikoaiko Feb 2013 #91
davidn3600 Feb 2013 #100
loyalsister Feb 2013 #101
azurnoir Feb 2013 #104
Egalitarian Thug Feb 2013 #121
azurnoir Feb 2013 #132
Egalitarian Thug Feb 2013 #136
kiranon Feb 2013 #131
azurnoir Feb 2013 #135
treestar Feb 2013 #113
LeftInTX Feb 2013 #122
Politicalboi Feb 2013 #129
riqster Feb 2013 #133
avebury Feb 2013 #139
Marrah_G Feb 2013 #143
avebury Feb 2013 #147
Le Taz Hot Feb 2013 #140
Marrah_G Feb 2013 #144
Le Taz Hot Feb 2013 #146
joshcryer Feb 2013 #151
Le Taz Hot Feb 2013 #152
joshcryer Feb 2013 #155
Le Taz Hot Feb 2013 #157
LittleBlue Feb 2013 #170

Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:17 PM

1. I am hoping that your last sentence proves correct.

That would be a good thing.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:21 PM

2. In a rational world

your conclusion would be correct. However, there is nothing rational in the world of the anti-choice crowd

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:22 PM

3. It is her body and her choice

And that also includes the choice to go through with the pregnancy.

This happens more often than people realize. Often it is commitment phobic boyfriend who demands that his girlfriend get an abortion, while she wants to have the child.

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Response to bluestateguy (Reply #3)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:57 PM

59. Husbands also insist. One example, woman takes pill for many years to not have a child as they work.

They wanted all the material matters in place, really, too many in my opinion. They then decided after eighteen years of the pill, to have a child. She proceeds to miscarry five times in a row. Each time, she is given a D & C afterward. By this time events have occurred to put them in a less prosperous financial setting.

She again becomes pregnant and the doctor tells her the chances are good this time that she will be able to go to term. But they have moved into his mother's home for an indefinite stay because of her health and their continued financial problems. He says she will have an abortion or the marriage is over as they can't take care of the child. The stress is such that she rents an apartment and plans to have the child alone, but then changes her mind and remains in the marriage of 25 years.

She resented it, although they are still married. She had more health problems and had a hysterectomy. They continued their marriage for financial reasons. He's on disability and she's nearly disabled. They have since gone bat shit listening to Glenn Beck. Thinking back, they were off for years, just wasn't as notable as now.

That was an example of the truth of what you say when you note that the men are the ones often insisting on terminating pregnancy. Others have insisted on the woman coming to term and still leave her with a child and no support. There are forced choices in either direction, but in the end, it is the woman's choice by law - or at least it once was.

People have different ideas about when and in what circumstance they should become parents. Although some people have no plan at all. This girl is putting a lot on her family for the choice that she alone made to have unprotected sex. With any choice in life, particularly this one, comes huge responsibility and consequences and more choices will have to be made.

While I agree fully that it is her body and her choice, I'm unsure why she can take the parents to court on this issue. She can move out and be a single mother but they aren't required to care for her or the child and I think that is what the suit is trying to force them to do since she lives at home. And they said she is being put up to doing this by a group.

Her child will become one of the poster kids in the 'forced birth' debate just as those conceived by rape have been used to muddy the issue. With that side, all they have is 'person hood.' What is being argued is that women having abortions are being oppressed by others to do so, making forced choices to have abortions.

As to those who choose without pressure from others, they say those women are mentally ill. Some GOP say rape victims who want to abort is proof that they are emotionally unstable and should be prevented from making the choice to abort due to mental incapacity.

This is not going to help pro-choice.

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Response to freshwest (Reply #59)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 08:42 AM

164. I know of a case where this type of thing happened in a very LIBERAL marriage.

The wife of a co-worker told me she thought abortion was murder and I was astonished because they were working for a progressive cause. It turns out that her husband had pressured her into having an abortion when she had an unplanned pregnancy. She wanted to keep the pregnancy and have the baby but was afraid that he would leave her and their other child so she had the abortion. She is the only woman I know who bitterly regretted her abortion. This was back in the late 70s...I often wondered if that marriage lasted. I rather doubt that it did....it was a clear case of how important a woman's right to choose is.

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Response to bluestateguy (Reply #3)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:27 PM

107. I am pro-choice. If this girl wants to keep her baby then she should be able to. However,

 

the girls parents shouldn't be in a position to support the child. I would tell the daddy of the baby you helped make this baby therefore you help provide for this baby.

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #107)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:33 PM

111. I agree with you in principle

Although if this father is just some 16-17 year old kid, there may not be much that he will realistically be able to do, save for whatever wages come from flipping burgers.

Usually in such situations the "father" dumps the girl, and makes so little money that it is not worthwhile to come after him for money. And then of course, the girl's family ends up shouldering much of the financial burden.

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Response to bluestateguy (Reply #111)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 09:24 PM

158. That is sad. My son had a child out of wedlock and eventually married the girl. He

 

is a better father then she is a mother. They are having some martial problems. I don't know if they are going to make it. She left last friday took her son from a previous relationship and left the 7 yr old daughter with daddy. He has heard from her threw text messages and she is mad at me and even her mother because we told her the kids need to come first. My son started a new job in management and he has to go to different stores. She encouraged him to move up. She is a little nutty. Also I know at least 2 guys that work with my husband who have custody of their child. The mother's walked out on them never to look back. So it's not all guys are bad. My son is a loving daddy. He is teaching her to cook (because her mother doesn't like to cook).

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #107)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 09:08 PM

153. She doesn't necessarily want to keep it

She wants to give birth to it (at which point, it will be her or him).

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Response to marshall (Reply #153)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 09:18 PM

156. If she wants to give it up for adoption that is fine. However, her parents should be responsible

 

for raising this child.

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #156)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 07:34 AM

160. Why are her parents responsible?

The pregnant girl is responsible for this child and while it's her decision to make, nobody else should have the responsibliity of raising him/her.

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Response to leftynyc (Reply #160)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 07:43 AM

161. Totally agree

Don't the parents get a choice, too? Though they will probably end up with the responsibility anyway if this girl decides to keep the baby.

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Response to theHandpuppet (Reply #161)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 08:11 AM

163. That's their choice

Meanwhile, I wouldn't mind if the group that was behind this lawsuit put their big girl panties on and explain who they think is responsible for the care of this child. Are they going to provide anything other than judgement?

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Response to leftynyc (Reply #160)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:01 AM

165. Because a 16 yr old is usually still in school and I know that the girls parents always

 

get stuck raising a child. Those are facts. I know at least 2 girls that have gotten pregnant and the girls were still in school and the guys were still in school. One of the guys didn't even care about the child. One of the child mother lives at home with her own mother and baby. The mother is already struggling with a 12 yr old at home who needs care because the child is handicapped. She has to feed, wash, change the child's diapers, go to work and now there is another child in the house. The child mother's is out of school and living at home with her daughter. The other girl was alittle more responsible in that after high school she did go to work. But has bounced from place to place. She lived at for awhile but moved out becaue she was able to do what she wanted to do. The boy's family was more responsible after she had to take him to court. She didn't really want the child to go to the boy's house but in the end the boy's family loved the child and wanted to do the right thing and love him. He is now 12 and goes back and forth. I just wish kids would realize 5 minutes of pleasure can bring you such hard ships in life if you aren't prepared. The girls family always ends up have to pick up the slack raising the child.

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #165)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 10:30 AM

166. That's their choice

Once she is 18, they have no responsibility towards their children and are under no obligation to help at all. Perhaps these irresponsible children would think twice about unzipping their pants and use some birth control if they knew the responsibility was all theirs. This particular girl is being led around by the nose by people who don't have her best interest at heart and will drop her like a rock once the child is born.

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Response to leftynyc (Reply #166)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 12:34 PM

167. I wasn't talking about 18 yr old. Am talking about 16 yr old who are most likely still

 

in school. By the way in our rural town the high school allows girls to continue their education and bring their babies at the school where they take them to an area where the babies are taken care of.

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #167)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 12:40 PM

168. I'm wondering if she realizes

that once that child is 2 years old, her parents' responsibility ends. Has she said whether she plans on raising this child or if adoption is an option? Does she just expect her parents to clean up her mess?

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Response to leftynyc (Reply #168)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 02:53 PM

169. I don't know. But good parents will likely take up the slack.

 

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #169)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 03:56 PM

172. That wouldn't teach her a lesson

That's just like all the rich parents that bail their little darlings out of whatever jam they get into. You don't learn responsibility that way.

I'm not a parent but I'm going to ask my twin what she would do under these circumstances. Mind you, she took her 17 (now 18) year old daughter to the gynecologist to get her on the pill when daughter confided she was thinking of becoming sexually active with her boyfriend. But accidents do happen and no birth control is 100% so I'm going to put it to her in those terms.

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Response to leftynyc (Reply #172)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 05:22 PM

173. Well your twin is wise to do that. But you are talking about innocent baby who didn't

 

ask to be born. Yes accidents happen. In a perfect world 15, 16, 17 and yes even older people shouldn't be have sex outside of marriage. But this is what is going on today. I remember back in 1967 when there was a girl in my graduating class was pregnant and she finished out the year. It was pretty shocking at the time. Back then girls were ostracized for having babies out of wedlock. Today there is no shame. But I have evolved where if my daughter who was at least 20 would tell me that she wants to have sex then I would run to the doctor and make sure she takes birth control. Parents need to stop thinking our kids aren't experiencing sex. We need to have that conversation with our daughters especially because they come home pregnant. However, I believe we need to make sure our sons know their responsibilities also. If you are going to dance around that bed you better be prepared to pay the fiddler. As a parent I will make my son step up to that plate. However, 7 years ago when he was 25 he got his girlfriend pregnant and he stepped up to the plate and he turned out to be a great dad. She is a little daddy's girl. He is a better dad then the mother is. Even his child's grandmother on her side realize he is a great dad.

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Response to leftynyc (Reply #168)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 05:25 PM

174. Let me ask you this. What if it were your grandchild? Could you give it up?

 

I sure couldn't.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:23 PM

4. My brother went through this with his girlfriend

She was 16 turning 17 and hew was 18 I believe and her parents made her terminate the pregnancy. My brother works very hard, he has the best work ethic of anyone I know he is now 23 and he would have been the one young man who would have supported her and child. I know that's not always the case and what she had to go through was no lite decision but I was witness to the very unfair and often mean ways her parents treated her until she relented.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:23 PM

5. She should be allowed to have this baby if she wants

It's all about choice.

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Response to ck4829 (Reply #5)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:35 PM

10. And who will support the baby? And new mother?

Provide a roof over their heads? Babysit- probably reluctantly- while young mother goes to school, looks for a job, goes to work in a dead end job? Have their plans for retirement and travel destroyed? Phooey!!

In some states there are mechanisms for declaring emancipation from one's parents. If she is old enough to care for a baby, she's old enough to be fully responsible for herself and the baby, seeking help where she can find it, just as she did in getting help from the anti-abortion crowd in taking her parents to court, instead of working through it with them.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:38 PM

14. She could give the child up for adoption

As long as the choice is hers, nobody else should have a thing to say about it.

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Response to leftynyc (Reply #14)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:40 PM

16. And what if she doesn't want to do that either?

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Response to marybourg (Reply #16)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:41 PM

53. It's her choice, marybourg!

What part of that do you not get? Being pro-choice sometimes isn't all that convenient. But it's hers to make. Consistency in being pro-choice is what separates us from the reactionary crowd.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #16)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:13 PM

98. She needs to put on her big girl pants and support that child herself. If she can't,

and the father isn't forthcoming with child support, then CPS steps in and baby goes to foster care (unless the parents are willing to support mom and baby).

Actions have consequences. If she is old enough to be a parent by choice, then she is old enough to learn that lesson.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #98)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:19 PM

103. Yes, yes, and yes. n/t

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #98)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 09:10 PM

154. +1 nt

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Response to marybourg (Reply #16)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 07:30 AM

159. Then she's going to grow up - very fast

If she thinks she's capable of caring for, feeding, housing and educating a child, she should do it.

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Response to leftynyc (Reply #14)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:42 PM

18. exactly. judgment is what the right does. We fight for freedom not judgment.

She could give the baby up for adoption. She could keep the baby, get government support, get her own place, get a job, go to college. That is what government help is suppose to be there for. We are not suppose to judge. We are suppose to help.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)


Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:41 PM

17. You have valid points but they still all go with the pregnant teen's CHOICE. nt

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:56 PM

21. Valid points.

But the right to choose is the right to choose. You can disagree with her choice, but it's still her choice.

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Response to HappyMe (Reply #21)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:01 PM

24. I wasn't disagreeing with her choice. I was

pointing out that because she's still a minor, living under her parents' support, her actions will affect their lives profoundly.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #24)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:20 PM

41. Forcing her to have an abortion she

doesn't want will effect the daughter in a profound way, and her relationship with her parents. Putting myself in this girl's shoes, I can honestly say that this would ruin my trust in and respect for my parents.

We either have the right to choose or we don't.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #24)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:23 PM

43. This is not going to be a popular opinion but I believe it is my job to raise

my children to know the consequences of teen pregnancy (I have two children--one is no longer a teenager). Given that I am responsible for them, I am also responsible for the consequences of perhaps not providing enough information for them to not make the decision that will "affect my life profoundly." (<<<that's a bit tongue-in-cheek there) It's the job I signed on for from the moment they were conceived.

Why is it that we pledge to support our spouses through sickness and health...and not our children, who surely need us more?

Abortion, Adoption, or unexpected grandchild--that's what I accepted when I first made my own choice.

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #43)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:30 PM

49. ^exactly this

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #43)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:01 PM

62. Good response. This is what I decided when my 16 yo daughter told me she was pregnant.

She made the decision, I made the doctor's appointment and the baby (now a grown man) was much loved by the whole family.

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Response to Arkansas Granny (Reply #62)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:10 PM

67. that's the way it should be. I'm glad you have such love in your life.

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #43)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:19 PM

70. I agree with you, popular opinion or not.

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #43)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:32 PM

74. I did not make a distinct choice to raise my unwed teenage daughter's child

at the moment she was conceived. I think that's a real stretch - accidents can still happen no matter how much you try to be a good parent. I would be very unhappy if she found herself unwed and pregnant and expecting me to raise her child. Very unhappy.

But, in a million years I would never force her to have an abortion. I have a relative who forced his 16-year old daughter to have an abortion and the relationship was permanently destroyed. And I do mean permanently - I don't think they've had any contact in the past 25 years and that's not likely to change.

It's a tough situation all around.

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Response to Sheldon Cooper (Reply #74)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:35 PM

76. I'm talking about the choice of the parent to have the child (who later ends up pregnant)

We don't get to decide what troubles we're willing to help our children through. It's why I believe it's my responsibility to educate my children.

I had my daughter at 19 (I was living at home). My parents weren't happy about it, but they didn't have children just for the good times. They helped me. Nowhere in my post did I say parents should be expected to raise a surprise grandchild; I'm saying they should love and support their children through good times, bad times, and tough decisions.

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #76)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:40 PM

79. The poster you were replying to was speaking from that angle.

Forgive me if I extrapolated.

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #43)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:20 PM

124. But

That should apply to the parents of the baby's father as well. The girl always gets the blame, and it is always HER parents alone that didn't teach her correctly. The parents of the young man have the same responsibility.

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Response to get the red out (Reply #124)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:22 PM

125. I totally agree. It's why I caution my 14-year-old son quite often.

Be smart, be safe, or you'll be walking that path alongside her.

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Response to get the red out (Reply #124)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:24 PM

127. +1. Absolutely nt

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:34 PM

51. "And who will support the baby? And new mother?"

There is no litmus test for having a child.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:38 PM

52. You can't allow "social concerns" to outweigh an individuals right to self-determination

Yes, all of those things would have to be dealt with, but it's still her choice to make. If she wants to keep the kid, she can do so.

My own teenagers were well aware of my rule on this. If any of them got pregnant as teenagers, their college funds would be liquidated and spent on short term job-training, setting up an apartment, etc. Choosing to have a child is choosing to become an adult, as as adults, they would be responsible for themselves. I would not support them financially, and would not act as a free daycare center. It's a bit harsh, but so is real life and parenthood.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:57 PM

60. Those are certainly all fair questions

But pro-choice means just that: her choice to have the baby must be treated with equal worth as her choice to abort.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:14 PM

69. I will, with my tax dollars.

And gladly.

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Response to Iggo (Reply #69)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:28 PM

72. me too. gladly.

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Response to Iggo (Reply #69)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 02:57 PM

171. Me too.

When I think about how my tax dollars are used to kill in wars, it warms me to think some of it goes to providing a home and food for a family. I'd rather spend it on that than give it to Lockheed Martin.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:10 PM

97. Taxpayers. Moral taxpayers, that is.

In a civilized society. Like EU countries. NOT this country, because of people like YOU.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:16 PM

102. One thing we know for certain

she will get no support or assistance from the state of Texas, once that baby is born.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:40 PM

116. These things are not at issue

She has the right to keep the baby.

Once we force abortions, we really will have abandoned the choice concept.

By your argument we should force birth in good circumstances.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:17 PM

123. The choice is hers BUT

You are absolutely right, her parents should be able to opt out of bringing this child up. They have as much right to live as they wish as she does. They should not be expected to provide for the baby's needs.

AND if they should end up having to provide, the boy and his parents should as well. There shouldn't be any of the she works at McDonalds and her parents babysit but he goes off to college and his parents get to brag on what a great future he has while the girl has none at all.

This is yet another example of why sex education and access to birth control is so important.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:30 PM

130. not sure what welfare laws are if you are a minor living with parents

but i guess they have the right to kick her out at 18 if it's that much of an issue for them.

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Response to ck4829 (Reply #5)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:36 PM

11. what about a 16 y.o.s choice to drink alchohol, drive a car own a firearm

should 16 y.o.s have those choices, what about a 12 y.o. or 9

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Response to leftyohiolib (Reply #11)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:31 PM

50. It is HER body

Her choice. If the parents don't want to deal with the reality of that there are programs and people out there that will help.

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Response to Marrah_G (Reply #50)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:01 PM

63. Then it is entirely incumbent upon this young girl to divorce herself legally from her parents.

She wants to make the choice for herself, then she should be self-supporting or find people willing to support her and her newborn.

I would think her lawyers would be more concerned with extricating her from her parents' control. Problem solved.

I will have to read more about what her lawyers are trying to do.

It is not appropriate for parents to be forced to support a pregnant teenager.

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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #63)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:10 PM

66. i said the same thing and was called a republican for it

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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #63)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:45 PM

82. So, we should only have children for the good times?

Got it. We shouldn't bear any culpability.

No commitment to our kids if they're going to get in trouble. Perfect.

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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #63)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:01 PM

90. So, just toss her out?

Only be parents when things are all sunshine and rainbows?

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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #63)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:25 PM

106. I agree with you there

Her choice to have the baby, then her choice, and obligation to either adopt out, or find a way to support herself and chil . Her parents shouldn't be under the obligation to support or raise her choices.

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Response to HockeyMom (Reply #106)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:32 PM

110. Her parents shouldn't be responsible, but they are, legally til this girl is 18 yrs old. nt

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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #110)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:41 PM

117. so does that mean if she rode a bicycle without a helmet they could say

we're not paying for your hospital bill because you didn't wear your helmet? I agree that legally they are responsible. I have known parents that have abducated that responsibility but the fact remains that legal responsibility does remain and I think it should be their legal responsibility. Until your child is of legal age to get a job and get an apartment then you are responsible for them like it or not. The parents themselves signed up for that when they had her. If you don't want all the possible scenarios that come with being a parent then don't have children.

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Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #117)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:48 PM

118. I've already said downthread and upthread I agree with you. nt

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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #110)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:53 PM

119. Unless she is declared Emancipated Minor

Might be a case for that if she chooses to have the baby over her parents objections. Any attorney could give more advice on this than me.

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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #63)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:29 PM

108. The parents bear part of the responsibility for this pregnancy, IMHO,

since it's a pretty safe bet that they didn't teach their daughter about the importance of birth control.

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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #63)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:40 PM

115. she doesn't live with her parents it said as much in the article

and did not when she became pregnant and there is even more than that the antiabortion group is worried that her parents might 'mickey' her with RU486

The pregnant young woman has lived with her grandparents for the past seven months, the court document states, and is nine weeks pregnant.


and
The plaintiff’s mother "invited the paternal grandparents to a bar for further discussion, where she suggested that she might slip R.E.K. an abortion pill through deception," according to the petition.


the whole think has a rodent aroma IMO

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Response to Marrah_G (Reply #50)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:07 PM

92. I am not disagreeing

but I am just posing a question that comes to me based on this discussion:

16 is practically adult.

What if the girl was 12?

What if she was 10?

I don't know the right answer. I know what I would hope I'd do (let the girl keep the baby if she wanted it), but is the answer different based on the age of the pregnant minor? Just askin'.

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Response to tblue (Reply #92)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:10 PM

95. It is not about a 10 year old, it is about a 16 year old

It is her choice, her body.

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Response to Marrah_G (Reply #95)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:21 PM

138. I know that.

If you don't want to answer, that's okay. But I realize that. That's why I asked.

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Response to tblue (Reply #138)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:32 PM

141. When you force a young woman to do something like this you create great harm

Even if the intention is good. That girl will not be 16 for very long. She will live forever with the fact that her parents took something very dear and irreplaceable from her.

My birth mother was 16 when she was forced to give up a child that she very much wanted. It has haunted her for her entire life. Her relationship with her parents was never the same. She has suffered emotionally for almost 60 years because her choices were taken from her. All because her mother thought she knew best.

It is this young woman's body and no one elses. If she wants this child it is her right to choose to give birth. If her parents don't want to be burdened with a grandchild then the state can help find this young woman other living arrangements.

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Response to Marrah_G (Reply #141)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 08:39 PM

148. Of course. Marra_G. I am NOT saying force this woman to do anything.

Please don't put words in my mouth. I'm just wondering, since the parents obviously have to live with her decision, at what point is it the pregnant woman's decision? I don't have a daughter, but I was somebody's daughter. If I'd gotten pregnant at age 10 or 12 or 14 or 16, my parents would have had a major change to their lives based on my choice. Clearly this woman's parents are impacted in financial ways, at the very least. That's all I am saying. Do not assume I am siding against the young woman. I am not and never would.


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Response to tblue (Reply #148)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 08:45 PM

149. Oh good... I'm sorry that I misjudged what you were saying

I read the article though, and frankly it doesn't seem like her parents will be effected at all. I hope the girl has a good life no matter what she decides, it seems like up until now it hasn't been ideal.

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Response to ck4829 (Reply #5)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:56 PM

58. + 100

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:24 PM

6. Her body her choice.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:26 PM

7. I think it's wrong of the girl's

parents to try to force her to have an abortion. You can choose to have the baby, or you can choose to have an abortion. Nobody should be able to choose for you. Her body, her choice.

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Response to HappyMe (Reply #7)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:43 PM

19. If you search elsewhere in your media you will find

her father denies the claim and believes his daughter has been put up for this lawsuit.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:27 PM

8. This is the point I've always tried to make - that choice thing works both ways!!

I don't want anyone to tell me I can only have *this many* children, and I don't want anyone else to be told how many kids to have. Or that they can't take care of their lives how they want to.

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Response to SaveAmerica (Reply #8)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:37 PM

12. hear, hear!

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:35 PM

9. Good for her.

"CHOICE" MEANS THE PREGNANT WOMAN GETS TO DECIDE AND NOBODY ELSE.

Making someone get an abortion who wants to have the baby is just as horrible as forcing someone to have a baby who wants an abortion.

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #9)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:48 PM

20. when does a girl become a woman

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Response to snooper2 (Reply #20)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:59 PM

22. you'd have to define woman - just so not to be sexist. the same can be said about boy to man

excpt you'd have to define man

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Response to leftyohiolib (Reply #22)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:00 PM

23. that's what laws are for right?

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Response to snooper2 (Reply #23)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:06 PM

27. im not sure what you mean. the law says you're not really able to make your own decisions

untill you're 18 - laws kind of define men/womyn that way - but other than that i dont know any laws that dfine -

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Response to leftyohiolib (Reply #27)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:08 PM

29. 16 and 17 year olds get jobs, get apartments, and even get tried as adults if they commit

murder. It happens all the time.

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Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #29)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:12 PM

33. they get jobs with workers permits (or have they been done away with)

charging someone as an adult doesnt mean they are considered adults that's why they are charged "as" adults not just charged.

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Response to leftyohiolib (Reply #33)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:16 PM

36. I have friends who have had babies at 17 and have gone out on their own

I know it can be done and is done. I've seen it happen.

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Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #36)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:31 PM

73. ok but that's not what we're talking about

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Response to leftyohiolib (Reply #73)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:36 PM

77. If her parents don't want to help raise the child they can tell her to get out

Then she can get government help and get out on her own.

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Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #77)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:55 PM

86. Actually that's not true. Parents are legally responsible for minor children til they are 18 yrs old

The daughter has a legal case that her parents must support her (housing, clothing and feeding her) until she's a legal adult.

The parents in this case will be responsible for the teen (and I presume their grandchild) until she's 18 but even then there are laws about "kicking" a teenager out of the house (I believe they then fall under tenant/landlord laws then).

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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #86)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:56 PM

89. It happens everyday. I know friends who have been kicked out for being pregnant.

Just because it is against the law doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

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Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #89)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:10 PM

96. I understand. But if this child is already seeking legal redress against her parents,

she'll certainly be savvy enough (or be coached) about what her parents owe her in continuing support.

Most teens don't know they even have legal recourse so they simply acquiesce (or they are so furious when things do get to that point that they don't care).

But that doesn't diminish the fact that these parents are legally responsible for caring for, maintaining, and supporting this teen (and her child) until the girl is 18 years old.

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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #96)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:13 PM

99. Maybe. Maybe not. All she is doing right now is suing for the right to have the child.

All she is doing right now is trying to stop her parents from forcing her to have an abortion.

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Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #99)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:30 PM

109. Doesn't change the law - the parents are responsible for this girl.

Don't get me wrong. I don't agree with the parents' actions at all however it doesn't change their legal responsibilities here. (I firmly believe the girl has the right to make her own choices).

I would guess this girl - or those whose agendas are behind this - will be using every legal angle she/they can (and rightfully so) on this case.



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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #109)


Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #36)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:38 PM

134. Yep, and I know one who had a baby at nineteen, and

is now living on her own; but, her Mom has full responsibility for her baby, and has since his birth. I am sure her Mom did not think she would be raising a child at her age. I am also acquainted with a Mom who had a total of nine children, none of whom she raised. She had three sets of twins. Every one of her children were taken from her except for the last one. She was addicted to drugs, alcohol, and, birth control, evidently. I am sure the former Mom gets help with raising her child from us, and the latter, well, everybody is taking care of those. The children have all sorts of problems; none of which make them eligible for any kind of help for their mental problems.

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Response to leftyohiolib (Reply #27)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:08 PM

30. So when can a 14-15-16-17 year old decide she wants an abortion

or doesn't want an abortion and do so without intervention from parents or courts?

That's why this case exists right?

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Response to snooper2 (Reply #30)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:16 PM

37. when she's out of the nest and on her own, paying her own bills -

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Response to leftyohiolib (Reply #37)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:20 PM

42. sorry but that sounds like republican talk to me

I was 18 when I got married and had a baby. My husband and I received government help, he went to school, got a good job, and then we got off of government help. Liberals are suppose to want to help, not judge.

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Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #42)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:52 PM

57. your situation is not the situation being discussed

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Response to snooper2 (Reply #23)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:10 PM

32. You do realize you are arguing for parents to deny a 16-year-old the

right to get an abortion by taking the parents side in this case, don't you?

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Response to joeybee12 (Reply #32)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:14 PM

35. I haven't taken any side in this case...

Is a 16 year old competent to make a decision to keep a potential human or abort a potential human?

how about a 13 year old, 15 year old?


Also, if you had read the OP it says the parents are wanting her to get an abortion----

Edit-fixed error


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Response to snooper2 (Reply #35)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:17 PM

38. I realize that...but if you say she has no right to decide to keep the child;

conversely, she has no right to not keep the child...it works both ways.

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Response to joeybee12 (Reply #38)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:18 PM

39. of course....

I see a bunch of posts in this thread saying---


HER BODY HER CHOICE!!!

not really that black and white of an issue though is it LOL...Mantras sound cool though

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Response to snooper2 (Reply #39)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:20 PM

40. There's lots to consider...and terminating a preganncy is not

the same as going through with it...however, if you deny one you're hard pressed to justify denying the other.

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Response to MadrasT (Reply #9)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:10 PM

31. +1

The only correct response for anyone who is truly pro-choice.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 12:38 PM

13. She should be able to make her own choice

It is her own body.

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Response to Marrah_G (Reply #13)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:02 PM

26. but she is not ON her own and HER decision will affect and involve everyone around her

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Response to leftyohiolib (Reply #26)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:25 PM

44. Some people here seem to forget that very important fact: she is not alone on her own

but she relies heavily on her parents' (not ultra-lefty pro-choice without limits DUers) for her daily needs. Common sense seems to evaporate with some people around here when it comes to this issue.

I'm quite simple with this as a parent. If my daughter goes this far to defy her parents' wishes to have the baby when we believe it would be best, based on her lifestyle and as a dependent of ours, that she terminates the pregnancy, then OUT of the house she goes. Let's see how long it would take for her to regain her common sense. With huge life decisions like this, comes equally huge responsibilities.

On the other hand, if that anti-abortion group is willing to put up this much funds in order to get that unborn born to brag to their misinformed flock, well, then they should sign an affidavit stating they will take full financial responsibility and care for both the mother and child until the child is 21.

It's easy to claim anti-abortion or unregulated "pro-choice" for someone you don't have to support financially. But then reality sets in because babies ain't cheap and raising a child ain't easy. That's where the rubber meets the road and you'd be surprised how many would then drop the girl and her baby like a hot potato, and run.

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Response to BlueCaliDem (Reply #44)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:12 PM

68. agreed

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Response to BlueCaliDem (Reply #44)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:55 PM

88. Agreed! I know many women who are raising their grandchildren.

Often the bio parents are teens and/or on drugs and/or in prison. These women's lives are on indefinate hold, their finances destroyed, their plans derailed. Every single one I know who is doing this, and there are many, love their grandchildren, but they had zero say in something that has profoundly changed their lives.

I'm pro-choice to the extent that the individual's choice affects them. Once you expect others to bear the brunt for YOUR choices, it's a different situation.

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Response to leftyohiolib (Reply #26)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:26 PM

46. As I said upthread--then perhaps her parents should reconsider their own choice to have a child.

We sign on for the long haul--no matter what comes.


We don't get to pick and choose the crises we're going to deal with.

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #46)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:51 PM

56. I agree 100%.

I think that her mom should have had a frank talk with the daughter about her sexual activity before the girl got pregnant.

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Response to HappyMe (Reply #56)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:27 PM

71. You don't know that mom (and dad) didn't do that.

Sometimes children refuse to listen to their parents' advice. Sometimes children deliberately defy their parents. It's possible this child got pregnant on purpose. It happens.

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Response to Mariana (Reply #71)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:41 PM

80. A frank talk about the

fact that the daughter plans to have sex should have included a trip to the gynecologist for an exam and birth control pills.

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Response to HappyMe (Reply #80)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:24 PM

105. And what if during a frank talk

the child insisted she was not having sex and had no intention of doing so? Then what? Assume she's lying and put her on BC anyway?

I don't know if these parents were negligent, maybe they were. But they could have done everything right and the kid could still end up pregnant. As I said, it's possible she got pregnant on purpose. It happens.

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Response to Mariana (Reply #105)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 08:54 PM

150. Exactly!

Boy, it's as though every guy and gal who end up getting pregnant had NO idea about birth control, were NEVER told a thing about it from anyone, and had sex having NO idea a baby could happen!

I agree with the posters who say that the female has the final say, but let me tell you the reality I see where I live.

I provide early intervention services, so I'm in a lot of homes of young parents and young kids. The vast majority of kids I serve are in households with one parent, usually the mother. Dad is either one of many fathers, or not around. Mom has no job, pubic housing or assistance for housing, food stamps (EBT), WIC, and the child has Medicaid. The child I see may or may not be the only child. Mom knows she can't support one child because she doesn't have a job, and Dad just lost his job, or maybe never had one, or perhaps is incarcerated, so there's no money coming in. Mom obviously knows that she got pregnant because she didn't use birth control, she knows that she needs public assistance to keep going, but whoops!

Pregnant again.

Too bad her parents didn't have a frank talk with her.

My dilemma is that I'm a bleeding heart liberal, but even I get a little sick of the lack of personal responsibility after a while.

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Response to HappyMe (Reply #80)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:35 PM

112. + 5 brazillion

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #46)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:04 PM

64. +1

When a kid goes outside not wearing a helmet, rides a bicycle, gets hit by a car and then has a huge hospital bill do the parents say,"Well, you should have been wearing your helmet. We're not paying for your hospital bill."? No. You are exactly right. Until they are able to get out on their own, we as the parents are responsible for their actions whether we like it or not. Now, if they want to be jerks about it, they could tell her to get out. Then she could get government help and get out on her own. I have friends that were kicked out of their parents home for getting pregnant. They had no choice but to do it on their own. It was very, very, very difficult, but they did it.

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #46)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:45 PM

81. But we deal with them-since we are the adults- we

are not required by law or common sense to abdicate our responsibilities and let 16 year olds make decisions "that will profoundly affect OUR lives as well".

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Response to marybourg (Reply #81)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:47 PM

84. Sorry, but I didn't have my kids only for the stress-free moments.

You lost me. And I am disturbed that so many would so quickly shirk this responsibility to our kids.

From upthread:
It is my job to make sure my children to know the consequences of teen pregnancy (I have two children--one is no longer a teenager). Given that I am responsible for them, I am also responsible for the consequences of perhaps not providing enough information for them to not make the decision that will "affect my life profoundly." (<<<that's a bit tongue-in-cheek there) It's the job I signed on for from the moment they were conceived.

Why is it that we pledge to support our spouses through sickness and health...and not our children, who surely need us more?

Abortion, Adoption, or unexpected grandchild--that's what I accepted when I first made my own choice.


***Those who are not willing to do that should not have children themselves because they are not mature enough for that responsibility.

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #84)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:53 PM

85. my dad still helps all of us whenever we need help

You never stop being a parent.

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Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #85)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 07:51 AM

162. And that's his choice

My dad (may he rest in peace) was the same. But neither yours or mine were under any legal or obligation to help out. We lucked out. Plenty of parents feel once the child is 18, or has graduated high school or college that their job is done. And legally, they are right.

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Response to leftyohiolib (Reply #26)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:28 PM

47. That doesn't matter

Her body, her choice.

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Response to Marrah_G (Reply #47)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:29 PM

48. I agree 100%.

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Response to Marrah_G (Reply #47)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:46 PM

83. That doesn't MATTER? How many people are you prepared to support for 21 years without

you having consented to do so?

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Response to marybourg (Reply #83)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:09 PM

93. It is HER choice, HER body, HER choice!

If her parents don't like it then social services can find her other arrangements.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #83)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:09 PM

94. I gladly pay taxes to help people in these exact situations

and what is with this until they are 21 crap? Do you think that all people who use social services abuse the privilege and stay on it until their child is 21? Because I know from first hand experience that is wrong. My husband and I used Medicaid and WIC for two years when we had our child. Then we got off of it when we had enough money to stand on our own. Assuming that someone who would need social services would need it until their child is 21 is just insulting.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #83)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:36 PM

114. I think you mean 18 years. Once 18, no one has any obligation to him/her anymore.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #114)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:54 PM

120. Varies by state.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #120)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:23 PM

126. It does. In TX however, where this case is, it's 18 years old. Other states its 21 yrs old. nt

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Response to marybourg (Reply #120)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:24 PM

128. There are states where one is NOT legally an adult at 18??? Do tell - link, please.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #128)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 06:05 PM

137. Here's one link that deals with illegal behavior - Nebraska parents are responsible til 19 yrs old

Mississippi has laws that keep parents responsible til they are 21 for certain offenses. Indiana has it that there's no age stipulation - its "child living with parents" period.

There are other charts documenting the different states' statutes on legal responsibilities for children on support payments (which can differ by state), financial obligations for college costs etc.

Its not at all cut and dried and easily found by google.

http://www.mwl-law.com/CM/Resources/Parental-Responsibility-Chart.pdf



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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #114)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:33 PM

142. Actually it would be less then two years

The girl is 16, in less then two years she will be a legal adult and her parents will have NO obligation to do anything.

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Response to leftyohiolib (Reply #26)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:43 PM

55. She may be eligible for assistance

I have many clients who have made or are making a choice to go through with their pregnancy. In nearly every case I am able to get them medicaid assistance and SNAP. Even in her situation as a minor living at home she may very well be eilgible for medicaid at least, as the parents income is prorated and not counted in full. I am happy that I can help women who are facing these difficult choices. Just something to consider.

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Response to Puzzledtraveller (Reply #55)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:58 PM

61. thank you for the service you provide

I was a young parent and I really appreciated the help I received. We were on Medicaid and WIC until we could get on our feet. It was great to have the choice to start a family even if we were not financially ready at the time. Now, I have two beautiful children, a wonderful husband and a great life. We are again at a time in our life due to disability that we need government help until we can get back on our feet. It is a comforting and reassuring feeling to know help is there when you need it.

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Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #61)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:09 PM

65. Thank you too.

I often say that we need to see more of how the programs that are available really do help peope rather than focus on the few who misuse the system. There is fraud to be certain. I have had to file claims many times. But the programs are essential. Even the often vocal anti-government assistance crowd should be happy because of the assistance I can help families receive, many women may have decided to choose to go through with their pregnancies. We just hired a new a caseworker on my unit who was once on TANF, she used the services to help get started going to school, get child care, and find work and now she completed her education and is working right next to me.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:01 PM

25. An excellent case of "be careful what you wish for" for the anti-choicers.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:06 PM

28. good for her. How can you force someone to have an abortion?

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:12 PM

34. This setup smells.

We've seen how much "pro-life" groups will lie for their cause.

So the girl may be their willing (and paid) patsy.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:25 PM

45. So the anti-abortion group is pro-choice.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 01:42 PM

54. Her body, her choice. That is what Pro-CHOICE means. nt

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:32 PM

75. It is HER choice, just as it would be if she wanted an abortion and her parents opposed it.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:37 PM

78. Her body, her choice. The situation or group helping her

shouldn't matter.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 02:55 PM

87. I have to concur that she should be able to choose whether or not

I would be interested to find out if the rumors about not actually being forced to have an abortion are true and/or whether this anti-choice group is using her for their own ends. It is quite interesting to point out, however, that most anti-choice groups are, well, against choice if they don't approve of the choice and they also believe that parental authority over their children should never be undermined by government or anybody else (hence their unremitting opposition to ratifying the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child). I happen to concur with their position in this matter, particularly since undermining a minor's right to choose could have some negative repercussions when it comes to underage victims of rape and incest. After all, that has been one of our main objections to parental notification laws, right?

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:04 PM

91. All legal theories are convenient.


But yes what say is true.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:15 PM

100. Right to choose also means she can choose to have the child

Unless you suggest we should get into the business of forced abortions.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:15 PM

101. I have based arguments on this exact scenario against parental notification

Anytime a woman has to notify or ask permission- her choice, whatever it may be, is gone. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. I think very few pro-lifers could imagine such a scenario.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:21 PM

104. Three very very telling snips from the article that lead me to believe this is BS+

"We were asking the judge to stop them physically forcing her to have an abortion," the plaintiff’s attorney Stephen Casey told Click2Houston.com. “They cannot drag her to get an abortion, force an abortion on our client.”


first off NO abortion clinic would preform a procedure on a 16 year old that was coerced

The pregnant young woman has lived with her grandparents for the past seven months, the court document states, and is nine weeks pregnant.


she doesn't even live with her parents !!!!!

The plaintiff’s mother "invited the paternal grandparents to a bar for further discussion, where she suggested that she might slip R.E.K. an abortion pill through deception," according to the petition.


now we're getting to the nitty gritty the claims that RU 486 will be used on the sly is oh so telling IMO

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Response to azurnoir (Reply #104)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:56 PM

121. That's what I got reading this. Completely fabricated bullshit from the anti-choice scum.

 

They really, really hate RU486 because it removes the mechanism to force women to comply with their delusions.

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Response to Egalitarian Thug (Reply #121)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:34 PM

132. yep and it sounds as if perhaps the anti-choicers

might be capitalizing on some bad blood between her and her parents after all she hasn't been living with her Grandparents for no reason

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Response to azurnoir (Reply #132)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 05:55 PM

136. Exactly. The republicans and their Corporate Dem allies favorite division issue. n/t

 

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Response to azurnoir (Reply #104)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:34 PM

131. Pro Choice means it is her choice. But, supporting the child is

another matter. Check back in a year and see how it worked out. Adoption, with birth father, job, back in school, living on welfare - who knows. Hope 16 year old doesn't have the maturity of a 10 year old and is capable of taking care of a baby. I have known mature 16 year olds and immature 30 year olds. It all depends.

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Response to kiranon (Reply #131)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 05:19 PM

135. sounds more like it'll fall on her Grandparents

that is who she is and was living with when she became pregnant, OtOH I have known of parents or in case parent who did try to prssure their kid into having an abortion in this case however the kid was 14 and being raised bya single Mom, she did have the baby and kept it, guess who wound up raising it though

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 03:36 PM

113. They can't

parents can refuse consent for an abortion. They can force the birth. But they can't force an abortion.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:07 PM

122. I smell total BS

She would have to give her own consent for the procedure. No way in hell would they perform an abortion without the mom's consent.


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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:28 PM

129. I wonder if her parents

Were against contraception?

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 04:35 PM

133. Our 17-year old daughter got pregnant

We supported her choice and now have a lovely granddaughter. Our daughter went to Prom and graduation pregnant, and totally owned responsibility for her actions.

Now she is a single mother, working and going to college. We are very proud of her.

Moral of the story? Don't assume that reaching the magic age of 18 instantly makes you a nature adult; or that being less than that age renders you incapable of making good choices.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:30 PM

139. The girl does not need an abortion as much as she

needs to be fixed. She is reported to have already had 4 abortions and she is only 16. Something is seriously wrong with this picture.


http://houston.cbslocal.com/2013/02/13/teenage-girl-suing-parents-because-they-are-trying-to-force-her-to-get-abortion/

“Denise informed them that R.E.K. having the baby was the biggest mistake of her life, that Denise had already had four abortions, and it was the right thing to do in this situation,” the complaint states, according to Courthouse News Service.

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Response to avebury (Reply #139)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:38 PM

143. Denise is the 16 year old girl's mother, not the 16 year old herself

So the girl's mother had 4 abortions and says that having her own child was the biggest mistake of her life.... now she is trying to force her own daughter to have and abortion.

Sounds like this poor girl's biggest problem is having shitty parents.

The girl does not even live with them, she lives with her boyfriend.

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Response to Marrah_G (Reply #143)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:57 PM

147. If the girl decides to give the baby up

for adoption perhaps the girl and her parents will eventually heal their relationship. If she chooses to keep the baby then perhaps the she and her parents should go to the courts and have her legally emancipated. If the parents are that angry with their daughter it is hardly a good situation to force all the parties to be together. The girl may find out that being a single parent at such a young age without a good education or job is very tough. I am a big believer that some people need to learn life lessons the hard way.

My step-son was dating a young girl who virtually moved into our house. I did not find out until I came back from a short trip out of town that this girl actually had a 18 month old daughter (one of the neighbors told me). My first question - who the heck is taking care of this child while her mother has virtually moved into my house? I also had become aware that she had a drug charge pending in the courts. I didn't even think twice about picking up the phone and calling Child Protective Services. I told them what was going on and asked them to please make sure that this child was being adequately cared for. I believe that the child was taken away from the mother.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:31 PM

140. I have to laugh at the responses in this thread.

All of a sudden it's "pro-choice means exactly that" but when Michelle Dugger was pregnant with her 20th child, there were demands, on this board, that her tubes be tied and she not be "allowed" to have any more children. I and a FEW others defended her right to have that 20th child but I was amazed at the anti-choice responses on a so-called "liberal" board. (Tragically, she miscarried later.)

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Response to Le Taz Hot (Reply #140)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:39 PM

144. I defend the right to choose

Sometimes I might think those choices are irresponsible (octomom) but choice is choice is choice.

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Response to Marrah_G (Reply #144)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:46 PM

146. I'm just constantly amazed

at how the goalposts so often change here, depending upon, well, so many factors. The negative, anti-choice reactions on the Dugger thread, no doubt, had to do with her religious affiliation. The arguments for forced sterilization included not only religious affiliation but included issues of overpopulation, uneven division of labor in their household, overpopulation, environmental concerns and the charge that the Duggers are tax cheats. My argument, of course, is that pro choice is pro choice and that all of those other issues are extraneous to the basic premise.

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Response to Le Taz Hot (Reply #140)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 08:54 PM

151. I do not think those people advocated legal action toward Dugger.

They were stating their opinion.

In this case, if the story is even true and not a fabrication from the anti-choice crowd, this would be a legal argument.

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #151)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 09:04 PM

152. Actually, they advocated

forced sterilization. So much for pro choice.

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Response to Le Taz Hot (Reply #152)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 09:17 PM

155. If that is so that is unfortunate.

I do remember people saying "she needs to get her tubes tied!" which is just a personal opinion.

I don't recall anyone saying "we need to pass a law that forces people to have only so many kids and be sterilized."

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Response to joshcryer (Reply #155)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 09:22 PM

157. That personal opinion

is an anti-choice opinion. That would be my point.

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Response to SpankMe (Original post)

Thu Feb 14, 2013, 02:54 PM

170. It's her body, her choice. Period

That's the way I think about it no matter what. The alternative of forced abortion is unthinkable.

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