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Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:28 PM

Does anyone really think the Pope's resignation is about anything other than child abuse?

I don't.

65 replies, 3064 views

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Reply Does anyone really think the Pope's resignation is about anything other than child abuse? (Original post)
garybeck Feb 2013 OP
NightWatcher Feb 2013 #1
Drale Feb 2013 #14
onehandle Feb 2013 #2
garybeck Feb 2013 #8
yellowcanine Feb 2013 #27
yellowcanine Feb 2013 #26
Jackpine Radical Feb 2013 #55
WinkyDink Feb 2013 #3
duffyduff Feb 2013 #4
JaneyVee Feb 2013 #9
yellowcanine Feb 2013 #30
garybeck Feb 2013 #19
SomethingFishy Feb 2013 #35
proud2BlibKansan Feb 2013 #22
backscatter712 Feb 2013 #41
Zoeisright Feb 2013 #42
morningfog Feb 2013 #62
proud2BlibKansan Feb 2013 #5
garybeck Feb 2013 #15
proud2BlibKansan Feb 2013 #49
el_bryanto Feb 2013 #6
garybeck Feb 2013 #12
el_bryanto Feb 2013 #17
OregonBlue Feb 2013 #7
we can do it Feb 2013 #10
randome Feb 2013 #11
HERVEPA Feb 2013 #29
randome Feb 2013 #13
Recursion Feb 2013 #16
garybeck Feb 2013 #24
yellowcanine Feb 2013 #31
lovuian Feb 2013 #18
Taverner Feb 2013 #20
MicaelS Feb 2013 #21
Cleita Feb 2013 #23
JVS Feb 2013 #25
yellowcanine Feb 2013 #32
JVS Feb 2013 #37
yellowcanine Feb 2013 #39
garybeck Feb 2013 #56
DonCoquixote Feb 2013 #28
cali Feb 2013 #33
morningfog Feb 2013 #63
niyad Feb 2013 #34
garybeck Feb 2013 #57
niyad Feb 2013 #60
Kalidurga Feb 2013 #36
librechik Feb 2013 #38
lynne Feb 2013 #40
backscatter712 Feb 2013 #45
LeftInTX Feb 2013 #43
backscatter712 Feb 2013 #44
Demo_Chris Feb 2013 #46
mainer Feb 2013 #47
LibertyLover Feb 2013 #48
LiberalAndProud Feb 2013 #50
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #51
hedgehog Feb 2013 #52
hrmjustin Feb 2013 #53
Zen Democrat Feb 2013 #54
kiva Feb 2013 #58
SmileyRose Feb 2013 #65
treestar Feb 2013 #59
Zoeisright Feb 2013 #61
SmileyRose Feb 2013 #64

Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:29 PM

1. He couldn't take another Lent without chocolate

And that pushed him over the edge?

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Response to NightWatcher (Reply #1)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:36 PM

14. I personally think he's telling the truth

He's resigning because of the stress and old age. But the Stress is coming from the constant scandals, denial of rights and more and more people turning against the Church and the Pope. Its has to be stressful knowing you are helping to kill the Church which you have served most of your life.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:32 PM

2. Those cases started long before him and will continue long after him. So, I don't. nt

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Response to onehandle (Reply #2)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:34 PM

8. it's not about when it started or ended. it's about personal involvement.

he was personally involved in the coverup.

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Response to garybeck (Reply #8)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:48 PM

27. Yes. See Cardinal Law in particular.

Only blindness induced by misplaced loyalty to the Catholic Church could prevent seeing the connection.

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Response to onehandle (Reply #2)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:45 PM

26. And many of the cases played out while Ratzinger was Prefect of the

Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith. As such he clearly had a role in providing the disgraced Cardinal Law with a cushy ceremonial position at the Vatican in 2004. There was even talk at the time of Ratzinger's elevation to Pope that it was a way to keep a lid on the Cardinal Law situation - as Pope it would be harder to raise questions about his role in the protection of Cardinal Law. So I do think there is a connection. Ratzinger is up to his neck in the pedophile scandal.

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Response to yellowcanine (Reply #26)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 03:00 PM

55. Probably not true: "Ratzinger is up to his neck in the pedophile scandal."

His involvement may not rise above his midsection.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:33 PM

3. IF it is other than health, he must be getting pushed out, so watch who's NEXT.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:33 PM

4. Yeah. His health.

The RCC is a huge church; the child abuse scandals have NOTHING to do with this.

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Response to duffyduff (Reply #4)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:34 PM

9. Are you really sure? He is the Inquisition.

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Response to JaneyVee (Reply #9)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:56 PM

30. Yep - he knew what was going on and played a DIRECT role in the Cardinal Law coverup.

There can be no question about that. Ratzinger basically whisked Law out of Boston and gave him sanctuary in the Vatican as a way of putting him beyond the reach of U.S. prosecutors and victims seeking answers.

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Response to duffyduff (Reply #4)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:37 PM

19. other popes have been a lot more sick and frail than this and they stayed on until the end. n/t

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Response to garybeck (Reply #19)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 01:13 PM

35. Yup.. The last Pope was barely coherent at most of his final appearances..

Something else going on here.

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Response to duffyduff (Reply #4)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:40 PM

22. He was the point person in Rome in charge of this

before he became pope.

I think there has to be a connection between the pedophile scandal and his resignation. Seems very obvious to me.

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Response to duffyduff (Reply #4)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 01:59 PM

41. LOL! Popes have stayed in office through illness and died in the saddle for centuries.

John Paul II was the classic example - he was ailing for years, spend more of his final days in the hospital than not, and died of an extended illness in office.

Maladict's the first pope to resign in centuries.

Though I'm wondering if the real reason for his resignation is actually the financial scandal - he was caught with his hand in the cookie jar.

That would be a dark and depressing statement about the Roman Catholic Church and society in general - that while the church's systemic problems with priests RAPING CHILDREN wasn't enough to unseat him (even though Maladict himself was complicit in the Church's efforts to cover for these pedophile priests), messing with the money was.

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Response to duffyduff (Reply #4)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:00 PM

42. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA!!

And unicorns are playing in your back yard, right?

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Response to duffyduff (Reply #4)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:46 PM

62. Riiiiight. Bucking 600 years of history has nothing to do with pedophile cover ups.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:33 PM

5. No doubt in my mind.

I was shocked when he was named pope.

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Response to proud2BlibKansan (Reply #5)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:36 PM

15. do you think that perhaps

he was named pope in part because so many people owed him favors for his participation in covering up child abuse?

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Response to garybeck (Reply #15)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:30 PM

49. I don't know.

I suppose that's a possibility.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:34 PM

6. He could just be old.

But if it happens one figures there will be a big story in the next few months.

Bryant

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Response to el_bryanto (Reply #6)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:35 PM

12. every other pope since the 1400's has been "old" and didn't resign.

n/t

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Response to garybeck (Reply #12)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:37 PM

17. I'm just saying I don't think the existence of the scandal is enough for him to retire

The scandal has been around a few years now. I think . . . maybe there's a story coming out.

Bryant

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:34 PM

7. I read somewhere last Friday that the latest investigation includes the Pope. He was aware of the

problems and complicit in moving priests rather than defrocking them.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:34 PM

10. I don't either poop dracula is just plain creepy.

I wouldn't be surprised if he was guilty of child molestation as well.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:35 PM

11. He's resigning to spend more time with his family.

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Response to randome (Reply #11)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:50 PM

29. Perfect!

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:36 PM

13. He's resigning to run as chairman of the Tea Party.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:36 PM

16. Yes. I don't think there's any evidence the See is terribly concerned about that

I think he's getting sick.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #16)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:41 PM

24. Popes don't normally resign because they're "getting sick."

if you don't see evidence that the pope is concerned, look around some more. there are lawsuits all over the place. he's been specifically named in several of them.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #16)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 01:00 PM

31. First Pope to resign since the 1400s. It is not because he is sick.

Popes serve until they die. It has generally been a lifetime appointment. They don't resign unless there is pressure coming from somewhere for them to resign.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:37 PM

18. I think it is about Money laundering too

and the Vatican Bank

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:39 PM

20. I usually don't side with the Pope, but I think he retired for the reasons he said

 

At his age, I don't blame him

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:39 PM

21. "Anything other"? Yes, I do.

I think the man is gravely ill. Child abuse might be part of it, but I wouldn't be surprised to find out he has a terminal illness, or maybe he has been diagnosed with Alzheimers.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:40 PM

23. I think he's getting pushed out.

It's either leave or get killed. I do believe that Popes get assassinated when they make the rest of the clergy look bad, and the pedophile scandal really makes them look bad.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:44 PM

25. I do. He is ill and they cannot afford another long term feeble pope like JPII who did nothing to..

address problems like the child abuse scandal. I think that he is hoping to prevent the papacy from being in a Brezhnev-Andropov-Chernenko type leadership problem.

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Response to JVS (Reply #25)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 01:03 PM

32. JPII did nothing to address the pedophile scandal because Ratzinger was actively directing the

coverup. His elevation to Pope was compensation for services rendered. I truly believe that.

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Response to yellowcanine (Reply #32)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 01:34 PM

37. Are you saying JPII knew nothing from 1979 to 2005?

Because if you believe that I have a bridge to sell you.

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Response to JVS (Reply #37)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 01:40 PM

39. Not what I said. Look again. NT

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Response to yellowcanine (Reply #32)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:59 PM

56. I agree Ratzinger was elevated for his services of covering up. n't

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:48 PM

28. Hell no

The fact is, Johann Ratzinberger was named and documented as one of the people who personally protected pederasts.There is a great documentary making the rounds in HBO "mea maxima Culpa" that speels it out in clear detail.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 01:06 PM

33. There are other plausible possibilities: Alzheimer's, for instance.

He's 85 years old.

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Response to cali (Reply #33)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:47 PM

63. Never stopped any other geriatric popes. Not for 600 years.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 01:10 PM

34. certainly his resignation right after the release of that 12,000 page report is interesting.

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Response to niyad (Reply #34)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 07:00 PM

57. got a link to that report? certainly not a coincidence. n/t

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Response to garybeck (Reply #57)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:42 PM

60. google "12,000 page report on church pedophilia scandal"

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 01:19 PM

36. If they say it's not about the child abuse...

It's about the child abuse.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 01:37 PM

38. he's resigning to spend more time with

his altar boys

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 01:43 PM

40. Don't think child abuse has anything to do with it -

- as that was going on long before he became Pope. I think it has to do with his age and health. Can't be an easy job and kudo's to him for breaking with tradition and standing down when he knows he can no longer do the job.

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Response to lynne (Reply #40)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:04 PM

45. He wasn't up to dying in the saddle like all of his predecessors for centuries?

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:02 PM

43. Why is he resigning during Lent?

Health problems can wait till after Easter.....


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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:04 PM

44. It may have been the financial scandal, not the child-molestation scandal.

My theory would be a dark and depressing statement about the Church and society in general.

Maladict might have gotten away with covering for priests that were raping children...

...but when he was caught stealing or defrauding money from powerful people and organizations, that did him in.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:20 PM

46. Abuse scandal of some kind

I think they know something involving this jackal is about to go public and they don't want it to be the current Pope that's named.

Just a guess of course.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:25 PM

47. Is the timing related to THIS?

This documentary has JUST premiered on HBO, and it pretty much points the finger at Ratzinger as being directly involved with suppressing all info about priests abusing children. The timing is interesting.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mea_Maxima_Culpa:_Silence_in_the_House_of_God

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:27 PM

48. While I think the child abuse scandal is part

of the reason, it is not, in my opinion, the only reason. Popes have survived scandals before and, the Prophecy of St. Malachi not withstanding, popes in the future will survive them as well. Nor do I think that Ratty Boy feels much institutional or personal remorse over the pedophile priests. However, the brouhaha that has resulted from the abuse and the Church's response to it has caused a great deal of stress among the ranks, including Benny. Given his age and his obviously indifferent state of health, I think he is telling the truth - that physically he is no longer up to the demands of the job.

Several posters have said that basically being pope is for life. In the past, I would have agreed with them and been somewhat shocked by this news. However, the demands of the papacy in the late 20th and now the 21st centuries have increased to the point to where the shoes of the fisherman require a younger, more able bodied successor to St. Peter. By way of example, for popes prior to Paul VI, travel did not mean jetting all over the world. Prior to Paul, papal travel meant staying in Europe. Sure Pius XII visited London in 1908 and was papal nuncio in Germany during the 20s, but even so, traveling was different and going by train or ship was slower, with less wear and tear on the body. Heck, it wasn't until Paul VI that a pope visited the US. Papal travel these days means long trips overseas with lots of hours on airplanes, and no matter how well-appointed the plane is, that type of travel takes a toll and the older the traveler is, the higher that toll is.

Having said all that, I also suspect that there are major health issues involved - possibly dementia or Alzheimer's - and neither Benny nor the Church officials want an aged and senile pope being photographed, filmed or recorded. They remember only too well J2P2's last days, which were not pretty.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:30 PM

50. I do think it is about something else.

Maybe the timing is just coincidental. If the pope did not know about Tedeschi's shady dealings, perhaps he should have.

http://www.gazzettadelsud.it/news/english/32836/Rome-prosecutors-open-probe-into-MPS-financial-scandal.htm

Rome, January 31 - Rome prosecutors said Thursday that they have opened a probe into the financial scandal at troubled Italian bank Monte dei Paschi di Siena (MPS).

...

MPS was thrown in crisis last week when it emerged that a shady series of derivative and structured finance deals produced losses of 720 million euros.

...

The former head of the Vatican bank, Ettore Gotti Tedeschi, was questioned on Thursday by prosecutors investigating suspect operations at MPS. The prosecutors wanted to talk to Gotti Tedeschi about MPS's nine-billion-euro acquisition of Antonveneta in 2008 from Spanish bank Santander. Gotti Tedeschi was in charge of Santander's operations in Italy before becoming president of the Vatican Bank, the Institute for Religious Works (IOR), in 2009. The IOR's board ousted him from that post last year.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:33 PM

51. Funny you should say that because that is what I thought.

 

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:40 PM

52. I think there is a huge amount of behind the scene plotting and

intrigue involved with this. I don't think the child abuse scandals is even on the radar with this one.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:48 PM

53. I think it was his age, because the Vatican does not care what people think of the scandal.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 02:53 PM

54. I wonder if this has something to do with the Pope's butler releasing documents.

Otherwise, it has to be the coverup of pedophiles in the church. For the reasons given - old age and ill health - it's simply not believable.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:31 PM

58. Personally I think he was nothing but a placeholder.

John Paul II was an immensely popular pope and none of the major contenders looked anywhere near as beloved by Catholics. So put in Benedict for a few years - he was one of the oldest popes to take office, so even if he didn't resign he'd be gone soon; besides, Benedict is/was such an ass that whoever follows him will be popular just by comparison.

So, Benedict got to be pope; the College of Cardinals got to pick another pope, which has got to be pretty exciting; and people will be happy with Pope NotBenedict...win/win.

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Response to kiva (Reply #58)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:54 PM

65. very good point

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:00 PM

59. Why?

Is there anyone who would possibly obtain the position of Pope who you would consider innocent in that matter?

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:44 PM

61. Nope. Not even a little bit.

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Response to garybeck (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:52 PM

64. I think it's about money.

Donations dropped like a rock when they put pope pedophile in. Plus whispers of shenanigans in the Vatican money wise started day 1. He's being forced out. We'll know by whom when they pick the next one.

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