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Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:18 AM

Fuck Christopher Dorner and anyone who sympathizes with him.

Amazing that a known MURDERER gets sympathy and understanding around here.

I guess maybe Osama and Eric Rudolph and Scott Roeder should also be treated with sympathy and understanding by DU standards.

145 replies, 12270 views

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Reply Fuck Christopher Dorner and anyone who sympathizes with him. (Original post)
geek tragedy Feb 2013 OP
Evergreen Emerald Feb 2013 #1
JoeBlowToo Feb 2013 #8
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #12
JoeBlowToo Feb 2013 #30
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #33
SkyDaddy7 Feb 2013 #55
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #112
Downtown Hound Feb 2013 #124
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #125
samsingh Feb 2013 #64
iandhr Feb 2013 #67
samsingh Feb 2013 #69
0rganism Feb 2013 #85
Ed Suspicious Feb 2013 #70
sammy27932003 Feb 2013 #132
Junkdrawer Feb 2013 #2
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #5
Junkdrawer Feb 2013 #17
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #20
ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #22
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #26
ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #29
randome Feb 2013 #3
KharmaTrain Feb 2013 #37
RandiFan1290 Feb 2013 #4
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #7
RandiFan1290 Feb 2013 #116
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #117
RandiFan1290 Feb 2013 #118
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #120
RandiFan1290 Feb 2013 #123
RandiFan1290 Feb 2013 #134
HappyMe Feb 2013 #6
SidDithers Feb 2013 #9
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #15
pintobean Feb 2013 #31
great white snark Feb 2013 #66
Cha Feb 2013 #127
cali Feb 2013 #10
NNN0LHI Feb 2013 #11
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #13
ripcord Feb 2013 #14
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #18
cali Feb 2013 #16
Bonobo Feb 2013 #19
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #21
caseymoz Feb 2013 #71
cali Feb 2013 #23
Bonobo Feb 2013 #27
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #34
Bonobo Feb 2013 #38
LWolf Feb 2013 #24
ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #25
Democracyinkind Feb 2013 #28
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #36
Democracyinkind Feb 2013 #39
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #42
Cha Feb 2013 #128
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #130
Sunlei Feb 2013 #32
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #44
bemildred Feb 2013 #35
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #41
bemildred Feb 2013 #52
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #73
Nuclear Unicorn Feb 2013 #141
redgreenandblue Feb 2013 #40
lunatica Feb 2013 #43
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #46
Bradical79 Feb 2013 #57
dtc83jr Feb 2013 #45
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #47
justiceischeap Feb 2013 #48
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #49
justiceischeap Feb 2013 #50
pipi_k Feb 2013 #62
Dreamer Tatum Feb 2013 #94
justiceischeap Feb 2013 #103
randome Feb 2013 #104
polly7 Feb 2013 #109
Yavin4 Feb 2013 #51
nebenaube Feb 2013 #53
Highway61 Feb 2013 #54
MynameisBlarney Feb 2013 #56
plethoro Feb 2013 #59
plethoro Feb 2013 #58
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #75
plethoro Feb 2013 #78
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #79
Dreamer Tatum Feb 2013 #92
nxylas Feb 2013 #60
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #110
nxylas Feb 2013 #133
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #139
nxylas Feb 2013 #140
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #144
iandhr Feb 2013 #61
quinnox Feb 2013 #63
cali Feb 2013 #68
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #74
quinnox Feb 2013 #76
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #77
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #80
quinnox Feb 2013 #81
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #87
samsingh Feb 2013 #65
caseymoz Feb 2013 #72
plethoro Feb 2013 #82
randome Feb 2013 #86
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #91
plethoro Feb 2013 #98
randome Feb 2013 #111
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #119
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #90
Nye Bevan Feb 2013 #83
The Straight Story Feb 2013 #84
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #88
The Straight Story Feb 2013 #93
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #95
The Straight Story Feb 2013 #97
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #99
cali Feb 2013 #89
The Straight Story Feb 2013 #96
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #101
cali Feb 2013 #113
Nuclear Unicorn Feb 2013 #143
plethoro Feb 2013 #100
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #108
Fantastic Anarchist Feb 2013 #135
Taverner Feb 2013 #102
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #105
dkf Feb 2013 #106
WinkyDink Feb 2013 #107
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #114
Fantastic Anarchist Feb 2013 #136
MicaelS Feb 2013 #115
kestrel91316 Feb 2013 #121
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #122
Fantastic Anarchist Feb 2013 #138
robertkdem1965_h89 Feb 2013 #126
Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #129
Scurrilous Feb 2013 #131
Dorian Gray Feb 2013 #137
Mr Dixon Feb 2013 #142
geek tragedy Feb 2013 #145

Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:21 AM

1. I agree. He killed a young couple.

A daughter and her husband--family of a man who represented him during the disciplinary hearing.

Anything he had to say--is moot at this point. He is a murderer.

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Response to Evergreen Emerald (Reply #1)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:24 AM

8. Well, let's string him up already...who needs a trial?

 

O heck, it was actually two newspaper delivery ladies that got shot up. Ooops!

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Response to JoeBlowToo (Reply #8)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:32 AM

12. He admitted to the murders. But, let's buy him a DU heart instead.

After all, he hates the LAPD, which makes him cool apparently.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #12)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:52 AM

30. Naw, let's smoke him with a Predator drone...

 

oops! That was your house they blew up....sorry!

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Response to JoeBlowToo (Reply #30)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:07 AM

33. They are using unarmed drones with thermal cameras.

For some irrational reason, this has many people freaking out like the Freepers did regarding black helicopters in the 1990's.

The paranoid right and paranoid left are more similar than either would like to admit.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #33)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:25 AM

55. Totally agree with you but...

Even though Dorner is literally a mad man on a murder spree what set him off is a very real problem not only within the LAPD but in most law enforcement agencies nationwide!! I would never defend what this person is doing but let us not forget what the source of the problem is.

Like this...
News Clip:


Police Video...
&feature=player_embedded

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Response to SkyDaddy7 (Reply #55)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:46 PM

112. No one knows why Dorner turned into a killer.

Certainly not here.

They've never met him, talked to him, or interacted with him. They don't know anyone who has done so. They don't know his psychological profile, his history of mental health, his life history, etc.

It is all speculation.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #112)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:13 PM

124. Let's just pretend for one moment that Dorner DID snap because of LAPD corruption?

Would that, hypothetically, make him at least deserving of some sympathy by you, even if you don't agree with his actions? And if not, how much abuse by the police do you expect people to endure before they are allowed to "snap?"

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Response to Downtown Hound (Reply #124)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:23 PM

125. Before the killings, absolutely.

When he starts murdering people because he has a grudge against their father, I am incapable of sympathy for him on any level.

This guy was not beaten, not tortured, not raped or molested. He was fired.

Nobody is allowed to 'snap' by murdering innocent human beings. Under any circumstances.

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Response to Evergreen Emerald (Reply #1)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:45 AM

64. i agree completely. He's confessed and there is no room for error

he should be executed.

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Response to samsingh (Reply #64)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:52 AM

67. I doubt he will allow himself to be taken alive.

We are talking about someone who is seriously mentally ill.

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Response to iandhr (Reply #67)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:16 PM

85. that's something he & the LAPD probably agree on

the chances of Dorner being taken alive fall somewhere between miniscule and non-existent.

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Response to samsingh (Reply #64)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:03 AM

70. Eye for an eye mother fucker! You confessed. Execution! You people are kind of sick. I thought

dems weren't in favor of the death penalty?

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Response to samsingh (Reply #64)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:11 PM

132. When and where did he confess?

This man has not been arrested.This man may not have shot anyone.You would believe hearsay of what the #LAPD say is wrong.The lapd have shot 65 bullets at civilians since Friday on two or three occasions.I pray the citizens don't get shot.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:21 AM

2. by DU standards?????????????? Didn't know Skinner was a Dorner fan.

link?

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Response to Junkdrawer (Reply #2)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:23 AM

5. Check out the love letter to him on the "greatest" page plus the squeals of outrage

over using an UNARMED drone with a camera to catch him.

Because his privacy rights are thus being violated.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #5)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:37 AM

17. Love letter? Link?

I know it's hard for you to see this, but questioning the LAPD is not a Dorner love letter.

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Response to Junkdrawer (Reply #17)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:41 AM

20. Apologism for his murder is not necessary to condemn the LAPD.

Sorry 29 DUers can't grasp that.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022346579

Because you know, he's the real victim here, according to that post, and isn't really that different than other victims of oppression, other than that quibble of mass murdering sprees.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #20)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:43 AM

22. I see a whole lot of people, in that thread, taking the opposing viewpoint.

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #22)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:47 AM

26. They're outnumbered by pro-murder crap like this:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=post&forum=1002&pid=2347002

He has actual supporters here--those who justify what he did.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #26)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:51 AM

29. I perused the pros v. the cons in that thread--

I think the supporters are far outnumbered. I think it's ridiculous that anyone would support him as part of the case against the LAPD, but I think it's more a few vocal disruptors than a growing population.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:21 AM

3. If people can't change the system using 'Occupy'...

...they want to at least feel that the faults in the system are so egregious as to make killers out of decent human beings.

And then there's the whole 'drone' issue. Someone else said it best: drones are the new black helicopters comin' to getcha!

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Response to randome (Reply #3)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:11 AM

37. The Confluence Of Agendas...

nuance is not one of DU's greater assets these days...

Cheers...

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:22 AM

4. lol

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Response to RandiFan1290 (Reply #4)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:24 AM

7. Look there's pro-murderer apologia on the Greatest page.

28 recs and counting chiming in their sympathy and understanding for a mass murderer.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #7)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:52 PM

116. 10 years ago y'all were calling me a Saddam lover

So bring it on. Not afraid of the smear brigade.

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Response to RandiFan1290 (Reply #116)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:52 PM

117. What are your thoughts on Dorner? nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #117)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:53 PM

118. I hope he's caught alive

and he gets his day in court.

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Response to RandiFan1290 (Reply #118)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:55 PM

120. Do you think any of the shootings were justified, if it turns

out that his admission to conducting them turns out to be accurate?

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #120)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:57 PM

123. nope. nt

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Response to RandiFan1290 (Reply #123)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 08:01 AM

134. I must have passed the test

and I've shown the proper enthusiasm....

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:24 AM

6. Thank you.

He's a fucking murderer. No sympathy or understanding from me.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:27 AM

9. DU rec...

And the 'how do we know Obama didn't stage this?' post was the icing on the crazy cake.

Sid

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #9)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:34 AM

15. Lots of DUers no different than the Eric Roeder fans in the anti choice movement.

Their moral objection to murder and desire to hold murderers accountable evaporates if they share a common target of hatred with the murderer.

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #9)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:54 AM

31. +1. It's a shame

Zalatix isn't still around to add to the cop hating crazy talk.

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Response to SidDithers (Reply #9)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:49 AM

66. Sad thing is I wasn't surprised to see a post like that.

That crazy cake is covered with hypocrisy frosting.

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Response to great white snark (Reply #66)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:24 PM

127. Exactly, snark.. the Hypocrisy

is thick.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:28 AM

10. It seems that a lot of people around here can't

separate Dorner from the past current wrongdoing of the LAPD.

It's lame.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:31 AM

11. If the OP were worded correctly bet you could could find sympathy for Timothy McVeigh here

Betcha.

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Response to NNN0LHI (Reply #11)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:32 AM

13. Just like people suggesting Obama staged this getting 0-6 jury votes from

their fellow pro-terrorist whack jobs.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:33 AM

14. He punched a recruit in the chest

While he was serving as a trainer, he was part of what is wrong with LAPD.

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Response to ripcord (Reply #14)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:37 AM

18. But he's killing LAPD cops now, which makes him part of the solution

according to the DU Greatest Page.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:37 AM

16. here's what bothers me most about the sympathizers and "understanders"

that he wants to make people suffer as much as possible is detailed in his "manifesto". and that's sick, sick shit.

The guy pre-excuses any vile shit he's going to do. He's a narcissistic, cruel murderer. And if you can read with comprehension, that is fucking crystal clear .

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:41 AM

19. Takes a lot of courage to speak out against a mass-murderer.

You're a brave man to take such a bold stand, geek.

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Response to Bonobo (Reply #19)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:42 AM

21. Dorner's sympathizers are more vocal than his detractors here.

My favorite was the nutjob who blamed Obama for staging Dorner's murders, and had a jury give a 0-6 pass.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #21)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:09 AM

71. Well, it does sound harmlessly stupid.


Just sayin'.

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Response to Bonobo (Reply #19)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:44 AM

23. Did the OP claim it took courage? No?

What's with the silly snide comment? There are lots of DUers equivocating, excusing, justifying and defending Dorner. I also find that revolting.

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Response to cali (Reply #23)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:48 AM

27. I punch back when I am punched.

'Nuff said.

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Response to Bonobo (Reply #27)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:08 AM

34. I was addressing Dorner sympathizers. That you took that as a personal

attack against yourself does raise an inference.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #34)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:16 AM

38. Meta thread, geek. nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:45 AM

24. I don't sympathize with him.

I'd like to see the clusterfuck surrounding him end. Catch him, and let us move on. To be honest, I don't find his "story" so compelling that I want to argue about him all day; he's garnering more time and attention than he's worth, imo.

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Response to LWolf (Reply #24)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:46 AM

25. Agreed.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:49 AM

28. We're do you see anyone sympathizing with him?

Today's witch hunt, brought to you by Pepsodent.

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Response to Democracyinkind (Reply #28)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:10 AM

36. 29 and counting. Here's a particularly loathsome example:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=post&forum=1002&pid=2347002

Note also that posts claiming that Obama staged these killings and framed Dorner are getting unanimous "leave it alone" votes from DU juries.

Which shows the jury pool is infested by trolls, or even worse, people who believe that shit.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #36)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:16 AM

39. Okay. That is quite shocking indeed.

It reads like a troll though - can't see post count on iphone...

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Response to Democracyinkind (Reply #39)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:19 AM

42. Problem is, so many trolls make it hard to tell where the trolls end and the

plain old execrable begins.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #36)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:30 PM

128. Is that

at the end implying that the OP is smoking crack?

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Response to Cha (Reply #128)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 07:14 PM

130. They're smoking the tombstone weed. nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:56 AM

32. no sympathy for LAPD and the lax gun loopholes- they created Dorner in their own image n/t

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Response to Sunlei (Reply #32)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:19 AM

44. How about the murder victims? Or the murderer himself? nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:08 AM

35. Yeah, who gives a crap about catching him?

Fuck him an his motives, we don't need to know anything about him.

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Response to bemildred (Reply #35)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:18 AM

41. Well, given the squealing about drones with thermal cameras being used to

find him, very doubtful that the pleas to understand where he is coming from are rooted in a desire to see him captured, but rather are rooted in ideology much like the Randall Terry crowd refused to condemn Scott Roeder.

The parallels in language are striking.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #41)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:31 AM

52. That's all horseshit, we still need to understand his thinking if we want to catch him.

I can guarantee you the people hunting his ass care about his feelings.

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Response to bemildred (Reply #52)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:29 AM

73. This is a political discussion board, not a criminology/police work board.

And, again, if people were really concerned with catching the guy, the whining about a remote control airplane with thermal cameras and no weapons wouldn't have occurred.

Not sure what cause is advanced by being associated with a mass murderer.

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Response to bemildred (Reply #35)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:39 AM

141. "Fuck him an his motives" -- That sounds about right.

I'm not interested in his motives anymore than I'm interested in the motives of Eric Rudolf or Tim McVeigh or the Unabomber -- the list goes on.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:16 AM

40. Chris Kyle had a lot of supporters here too.

For each and every flavor of killer, there will be those who romanticize their actions. Seems almost like a law of nature.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:19 AM

43. You're confusing understanding with sympathy

They aren't the same thing. Understanding simply means you get what's going on. It's the use of rationality and logic. Sympathy is an emotion.



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Response to lunatica (Reply #43)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:22 AM

46. Except the desire to 'understand' comes from those who already believe

they understand why he killed, and are sympathetic to large portions of it.

Dead giveaway: when people say "I don't condone what he did." Spitting on a sidewalk is the kind of behavior one doesn't condone. Mass murder is an act that requires a stronger repudiation.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #46)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:31 AM

57. I don't understand that statement

"Except the desire to 'understand' comes from those who already believe they understand why he killed, and are sympathetic to large portions of it"

This doesn't make a lot of sense to me.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)


Response to dtc83jr (Reply #45)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:23 AM

47. Enjoy your brief stay here and eternity in Hell if it exists. nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:24 AM

48. Some of us are capable of seeing things from other viewpoints

Do I agree with what Dorner is doing, am I cheering him on? Hell, no! But, I can understand how people can be pushed over the edge. I can see why Osama Bin Laden would want to attack the US. Do I agree with him doing so or did I cheer him on? Hell, no! Doesn't mean I can't see things from their viewpoint. So, yeah, I guess fuck me for being able to see grey.

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Response to justiceischeap (Reply #48)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:26 AM

49. You understand bin Laden's radical Islamism and desire to create a global caliphate

while purging the world of infidels? Or do you believe he was Chomsky with a beard?

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #49)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:29 AM

50. I see that he grew tired of seeing the US

inserting itself into international affairs (that some argue right here on DU, that we don't belong). I can see why a country or individual would want to strike out at the US. Do I condone or agree, no, I don't but I can see how that would drive someone to the point of madness. I can see how the lack of mental healthcare and easy access to guns are creating mass shooters too. I can see why Iran wants nuclear weapons, everyone else has them. Do I want them to have them, nope, sure don't.

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Response to justiceischeap (Reply #48)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:41 AM

62. Same...

here.

Understanding why someone did something doesn't equate to condoning what he did.

Unfortunately, it often involves being able to deal with lots of conflicting/opposing thoughts at the same time.

Black and white thinkers think gray area people do it on purpose (maybe just to piss them off?). I can assure them we don't. It makes my head hurt when it happens.



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Response to justiceischeap (Reply #48)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:25 PM

94. Tell me how you feel about Eric Rudolph, then.

Wait, I bet I already know the answer.

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Response to Dreamer Tatum (Reply #94)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:39 PM

103. I don't feel anything for him, just like I don't feel anything for

Dorner or Bin Laden. This has nothing to do with feelings. I simply stated I don't see things in black and white. Seeing things in shades of grey doesn't mean I agree with horrendous atrocities, it just means I see where people can justify what they do. Yes, I can see how Rudolph could use his religious beliefs to justify what he did. Doesn't mean I agree with those beliefs. Anyone can justify something, and sometimes you can see why they justify it. Again, doesn't mean you agree or condone.

I'll use a real life example... my father was horribly abused as a child. In turn he abused me as a child--however, he didn't abuse me nearly as badly as his father abused him. I can see where he learned his behavior from, I can see why he lashed out with violence instead of words (though he can be very verbally abusive too). Does this mean I think I deserved the abuse I got from him? It sure doesn't. As a matter of fact, I've yet to forgive him but I can see the why of what he did without agreeing or condoning.

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Response to justiceischeap (Reply #103)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:41 PM

104. Good points.

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Response to justiceischeap (Reply #103)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:43 PM

109. And there it is. +1000. nt.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:31 AM

51. There was no other way that Dorner could expose the LAPD other than killing people.

It's not like there's some sort of mass communication medium for him to post his evidence against the LAPD. It's not like there are places to post audio, video, and documents regarding bad behavior by the LAPD. It's not like there are radio, TV, ipodcasts, etc. where he can bring his message. It's not like there aren't civil libertarian groups, legal aid societies, criminal defense lawyers, and other attorney groups that he could go to with his case.

Nope. There's none of that. The only way was to kill people.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 09:56 AM

53. due process

 

We have an alledged killer being pursued by a known corrupt police force. I'll wait for the facts in a trial thank you.

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Response to nebenaube (Reply #53)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:18 AM

54. Thank you

Ahh...the voice of reason

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:30 AM

56. I'm no fan of Dorner

but the LAPD is worse as far as I'm concerned.

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Response to MynameisBlarney (Reply #56)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:37 AM

59. By leagues....nft

 

dddddddddddd

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:34 AM

58. Sorry, I'm an Innocent Until Proven Guilty Person. You

 

apparently are not. Sign of the times...

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Response to plethoro (Reply #58)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:32 AM

75. So, you think Cheney isn't guilty of war crimes then?

Neither would be Bybee, Woo, Bush, Rove, Addington etc.

Heck. Mussolini and Ceaucesceau were never convicted. How dare we pass judgment on them.

Same with Osama, right?

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #75)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:56 AM

78. Cheney's guilt or innocence has very little to do with Dorner's

 

guilt or innocence. But I would want Cheney to be tried just as I would want Dorner to be tried to determine guilt or innocence. That is the system that I live under. Determinative guilt by mob is not something that interests me. Cheney snapped at birth. Dorner snapped by continued duress at the hands of the master of duress. I can give compassion and understanding to that, particularly as I personally know about the corruption of LAPD and their leader in corruption Randal Quan. Dorner is either dead now or will be shorty. The pound of flesh enjoyed by some will be no where near the resultant cleansing effects on the LAPD produced by Dorner's martrydom. Meanwhile, I'll continue to support Dorner if that support results in the dismantling of the LA Pig Department. Thank you for your time.

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Response to plethoro (Reply #78)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:02 PM

79. So, you know "Dorner snapped by continued duress at the hands

of the master of duress" earning your compassion, but you don't know that he killed anyone, thus avoiding any condemnation on your part. Very curious how you take as definitive evidence that makes you sympathize with him but feel entitled to ignore any evidence that would require a decent human being to condemn his actions.
I'll continue to support Dorner if that support results in the dismantling of the LA Pig Department.


Quite plainly, you are a cheerleader for mass murder if the person shares your ideology. Go sit next to Randall Terry and the bin Laden fan club.

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Response to plethoro (Reply #78)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:24 PM

92. Perfect example of why our system of jurisprudence is how it is.

So people like you aren't allowed to run things: "snapped at birth?" "Continued duress?"

So glad adults are in charge.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:40 AM

60. First they come for the murderers

What, did you think the use of predator drones on American citizens was going to BEGIN with some schmuck with an unauthorized opinion on the benefits of totalitarian capitalism?

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Response to nxylas (Reply #60)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:44 PM

110. is this sarcasm or profound stupidity?

First they come for the murderers


Yes, first they start putting the murderers in jail. Poor Dorner is having his constitutional rights violated by a thermal camera!

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #110)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 07:54 AM

133. Not sarcasm, maybe hyperbole

I was trying to illustrate the whole boiling frog principle of the thing. Of course they're going to start with someone like a domestic terrorist, whose constitutional rights no-one much cares about. Gradually, they start using drones to investigate less severe crimes until eventually, you can't take a leak without a surveillance drone watching you. But I suspect DU won't start to get outraged until a drone is used in a pot bust, by which time they'll be too well-entrenched to do anything about them.

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Response to nxylas (Reply #133)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 09:04 AM

139. How would an unarmed drone taking pictures in a forest for a fugitive

violate that fugitive's rights more than helicopters or police dogs?

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #139)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 06:50 AM

140. On a case-by-case basis, it wouldn't

I'm looking at the bigger picture here. Presumably, drones are set to replace police dogs and helicopters because they help to create a more efficient surveillance state. That ought to worry anyone with a concern for civil liberties, but I'm sure the sensible woodchucks will continue to assure us that everything will be OK as long as there is a Democrat in the White House.

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Response to nxylas (Reply #140)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 08:47 AM

144. No, just not buying the black helicopter-style paranoia.

Same argument about drones could have been made about helicopters, and airplanes, and hot air balloons as the super scary technology.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:41 AM

61. He is a murder.

And a very mentally disturbed man who is armed. I can't believe people actually gets sympathy.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:42 AM

63. You are assuming he is guilty

 

You know, that is kind of the point of having a trial. To determine his guilt or innocence. But I understand in this age of drone killings, with no trials, why you would get confused and forget about that little detail. Its called the 6th amendment to the constitution:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sixth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

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Response to quinnox (Reply #63)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:53 AM

68. there's considerable evidence (like his own words) that he is a murderer. Andthe point

of a trial is not to push people into not coming to their own conclusions or discussing guilt or innocence.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #63)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:31 AM

74. His admission that he killed people isn't good enough for you.

Who do you blame instead--Obama? The Mossad?

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #74)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:36 AM

76. nevertheless, yes I prefer trials before executions are done

 

I urge you to read that link to the 6th amendment to the US constitution, it might prove illuminating for you. I won't bother to reply to your ridiculous question though, except to ask why you didn't include asking me if I'm also a communist as well.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #76)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:40 AM

77. So, why are authorities conducting a manhunt for an innocent man?

I mean, if it's wrong to conclude he's guilty on a message board, why do they have the right to expend public resources trying to catch him?

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Response to quinnox (Reply #76)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:03 PM

80. One of your fellow "give him the benefit of the doubt"

folks let his true feelings show and outed himself as a supporter of the guy who thinks of him as a victim, not a criminal.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2351296

Vile.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #80)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:11 PM

81. That post has nothing to do with me,

 

I don't know what your problem is, but I suggest a chill pill.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #81)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:17 PM

87. Point being, there are open sympathizers and supporters of Dorner here,

and the "he's innnocent until proven guilty" and the "the man has a point" and "the dronez are a violation of his privacy rights" and the "we need to understand him" and "well, I don't necessarily condone what he did" and the "for all we know, this was staged by the government" all reflect a disturbing sympathy for a man who is known only because he has murdered several innocent people.

Not everyone who says those things is a closet Dorner fan or experiences a vicarious thrill in seeing him gun down police, but there are too many to whom that description justly applies.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:46 AM

65. no sympathy from me

i'm in favor of capital punishment for cases like this

i reserve my sympathy for victims and not their abusers/killers

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 11:28 AM

72. Geek, I think they see it like a Hollywood movie.


That's where they're exposed to killers. They don't have a grasp on the reality of this. I mean they imagine the music, the camera angles, dialog, all showing this guy is a tragic character while nobody in the story can understand him (since they lack all the music, don't hear all the dialog and don't have the camera angles).

Yes, I'm understanding the people who understand Dorner.

I'd first tell them that they're making up the script, and it doesn't meet reality. I would then say imagine if they were in the movie and not just watching it, how would they see this guy, then? Moreover, just because they found the villains in the LAPD doesn't mean that they have a hero with Dorner. Even a flawed, tragic one.

Other than that, it's hard for me to get worked up angry over so stupid a mistake.

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Response to caseymoz (Reply #72)


Response to plethoro (Reply #82)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:17 PM

86. Well, the first 2 people he murdered had nothing to do with the LAPD.

Maybe he's just as bad a shot as they are?

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Response to randome (Reply #86)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:24 PM

91. Note that Dorner "redeems himself" in that poster's eyes by killing cops.

Not sure I've seen such an open endorsement of murder before.

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Response to randome (Reply #86)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:30 PM

98. The first two people Dorner ALLEGEDLY shot were Monica Quan and

 

her husband. Monica Quan was the daughter of Randal Quan, the LAPD commander who officiated at Dorner's hearing over his charge that Training Officer Teresa Evans beat up a homeless man while handcuffed. This is what caused Dorner to snap. So you are wrong about the first two people he "murdered" had nothing to do with LAPD. I wish you mystery writers would get your facts straight.

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Response to plethoro (Reply #98)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:45 PM

111. So what about the LAPD commander's grandchildren? His mother-in-law? His sister-in-law?

Do they have anything to do with the LAPD? I don't consider relatives of people someone hates to be legitimate targets of that hate. Or murder.

And have you really not seen my other posts on this subject?
Dorner made his allegations about Teresa Evans 2 fucking weeks after they allegedly occurred. He made the allegations the day AFTER Evans asked for him to be reassigned.

What about this timing does NOT imply 'payback' to Evans instead of a legitimate search for the truth?

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Response to plethoro (Reply #98)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:54 PM

119. "This is what caused Dorner to snap."

How do you know this, but not know he killed people after he snapped?

Now you're implying that Ms. Quan somehow had it coming or was a legitimate target because of who her father was.

Sick.

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Response to plethoro (Reply #82)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:21 PM

90. Thanks for outing yourself as a cheerleader for people who murder cops

and basketball coaches.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:14 PM

83. I hope the murdering scumbag gets life without parole (nt)

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:15 PM

84. Now if he had used a drone to kill people, then we could get behind him

Especially if he said, without any proof needed of course, those people he killed were in league with terrorists.

It is only murder when an individual does it.

When and organization (police/govt) do it, well it is just business.

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Response to The Straight Story (Reply #84)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:20 PM

88. Ah, the old "Dorner is the moral equivalent of Obama" post.

Hadn't seen that one yet.

Thanks for adding to the catalog of people looking to downplay or excuse his actions and the rhetorical devices they use.

Of course, it's possible you don't think Obama's use of drones to target members of al Qaeda are the same as Dorner's murder of Monica Quan, in which case your post is disingenuous.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #88)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:24 PM

93. Ha!

Not downplaying or excusing HIS actions - just pointing out that people who condemn him should do the same across the board.

Yemen was asked by us to cover up drone strikes that killed innocent people.

We have knowingly killed innocents if they were around people who were not, guilt and execution by association.

As long as someone condemns both they are being consistent.

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Response to The Straight Story (Reply #93)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:27 PM

95. Sure, if Obama targeted someone for a drone strike knowing full

well that they were a basketball coach, Yemeni law enforcement officer, or other civilian with no known ties to an organization engaged in armed attacks against the US, I'd call for his impeachment and extradition to the Hague.

A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of small minds.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #95)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:29 PM

97. So if dorner just opened up fire at cops and hit civilians

even when only one cop was around and a bunch of civilians were, that would be ok?

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Response to The Straight Story (Reply #97)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:31 PM

99. No, because murdering cops is a crime.

Under international law, police officers are considered civilians. Ergo, the IDF isn't allowed to treat Palestinian police as armed combatants when it decides who to bomb.

Unless you're one of those that think that bin Laden had the same legal status as a Riverside police officer, the comparison is nonsense.

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Response to The Straight Story (Reply #84)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:21 PM

89. Some of us have no problem condemning the use of drones

by the government, Police corruption and malfeasance, AND Dorner. That should be a no brainer, hon.

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Response to cali (Reply #89)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:28 PM

96. Not talking about the some, like me, who do

Just about the ones who get all upset over people having a sympathy to a cause someone has even if they do not like their methods.

Many can be sympathetic to Dorner's plight that led him down this path while condemning his actions.

But then, I have also learned here that Dorner did not do this or have any real reason, guns did it - so his manifesto, etc, things leading up to the shootings are really non-issues, just like with Adam Lanza (a person so few talked about directly because he didn't leave behind any real writings, so it was 'blame the guns').

Maybe, possibly, some folks will start looking at the real causes behind violence and not what someone uses - and then we can start to address the real issues.

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Response to The Straight Story (Reply #96)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:35 PM

101. Except that the game that is played is people say "he was clearly

victimized by a corrupt system" but then turn around and say "innocent until proven guilty" as if that's relevant outside a court of law.

They KNOW he's a victim and is fighting corruption, but that whole shooting spree thing is beyond their powers of knowledge, even given his written admission to it.

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Response to The Straight Story (Reply #96)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:48 PM

113. except we don't know anything about his "plight"

you are jumping to conclusions. Not that we all aren't, but there really is no substantive evidence about whether his claims are true.

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Response to The Straight Story (Reply #96)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:52 AM

143. Dorner doesn't have a "plight;" he had a labor dispute and he became a brutal killer

who deliberately targeted the relatives of those who bore a grudge againstin order to cause as much pain as possible. That's a sadist. That's cruel. That'snot acting out over some "plight." He's no better than a wife-beater who abuses his family because of his employment frustrations; only Dorner is a murderer who attacked other people's families.

Firing Dorner was part of the house-cleaning his apologists pretend they demand.

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Response to The Straight Story (Reply #84)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:34 PM

100. Do you a see a bifurcation here on

 

DU between those who believe in our judicial system deciding guilt or innocence of a person and those who do not? I do. And this case is not the first time.

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Response to plethoro (Reply #100)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:43 PM

108. No, you are a cheerleader for people who kill cops, as evidenced

by your posts in this thread, including one hidden by a 6-0 vote.

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Response to The Straight Story (Reply #84)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 08:14 AM

135. ^^^This^^^

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:36 PM

102. You are confusing "analyzing and understanding" with "support"

 

Re-read these entries in the dictionary and get back to me

Otherwise, sit down and stop talking about things you don't know anything about


Thank you

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Response to Taverner (Reply #102)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:41 PM

105. No, there are several such statements of open support:

We'll probably never know for sure (about Dorner's guilt).

Dorner will be dead without a trial.

His truck and everything in it was burned to a cinder.

The department collecting evidence and hunting him down is the same one that burned him for being a whistle-blower.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2347729

I am in a different movie than you. In my movie the alleged villian Dorner redeems himself by

ridding the countryside of the real villain, the LA Pig Department. I recognize the concept of "a greater good". To you that concept is simply a theatric device. But, then, I have been in a few movies. You probably have not.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2351408

Determinative guilt by mob is not something that interests me. Cheney snapped at birth. Dorner snapped by continued duress at the hands of the master of duress. I can give compassion and understanding to that, particularly as I personally know about the corruption of LAPD and their leader in corruption Randal Quan. Dorner is either dead now or will be shorty. The pound of flesh enjoyed by some will be no where near the resultant cleansing effects on the LAPD produced by Dorner's martrydom. Meanwhile, I'll continue to support Dorner if that support results in the dismantling of the LA Pig Department. Thank you for your time.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2351296



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Response to Taverner (Reply #102)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:42 PM

106. Analyzing and understanding Dorner requires a mental health angle.

 

The guy isn't normal so a correct analysis requires an understanding of how personality disorders can distort his perceptions. Adding paranoia and delusional thinking to the possible mix may be necessary.

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Response to Taverner (Reply #102)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:42 PM

107. Maybe the ambiguity of "understanding" ought be replaced by "surmising."

"Understand" connotes seeing the LOGIC of something. Moreover, it also connotes oftentimes an empathy.

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #107)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:49 PM

114. Moreover, this is Fristing. People performing complex analyses

on the psychology of a killer, all based on media reports.

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Response to Taverner (Reply #102)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 08:17 AM

136. Interesting thread, eh, Taverner?

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:49 PM

115. I think some of these people believe Dorner is

"Speaking truth to power" or some such similar bullshit, and in their minds that justifies any act.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:55 PM

121. I don't see anybody sympathizing with his murderous rampage. I DO see people who

aren't willing to write off some of his complaints about LAPD merely because he IS a murderer. I would be one of those.

I DON'T sympathize with LAPD. They were more than happy to try to murder innocent civilian women in their rush to execute Dorner without due process.

I want due process for Dorner. Don't confuse that with sympathizing with him.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #121)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 12:56 PM

122. Someone got a post hidden because he said the shooting rampage

"redeemed" Dorner because he included cops.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #122)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 08:23 AM

138. Because one person said something you didn't like, we are all to be condemned.

All lumped together?

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 05:30 PM

126. Right on brother

 

Dorner is a vile piece of garbage. Nothing can justify his horrible crimes. Hope he rots in prison for a long, long time.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 06:31 PM

129. I agree, we want to be a party that supports victims, but victims we often mislabel IMO.

It was the same with the Kansas City Chief player.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Mon Feb 11, 2013, 08:37 PM

131. Agreed.

@#$% that POS.

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Tue Feb 12, 2013, 08:18 AM

137. Have to agree

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Response to geek tragedy (Original post)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 07:50 AM

142. REALLY?

Way over the top

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Response to Mr Dixon (Reply #142)

Wed Feb 13, 2013, 08:50 AM

145. Had someone lambaste me for being okay with Dorner being

"Executed for daring to look wrong at 'Murca."

Also, at least two PPRs for Dorner's cheerleaders so far.

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