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Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:41 PM

 

Sorry, but I cannot support Dorner,

Despite writing a left leaning manifesto, despite bringing to light justifiable complaints about the LAPD, the fact remains he killed three people.

If you want to be a true hero, you don't kill people to make your point. You go public, you speak out, you write of wrongs. You don't kill people to make your point.

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Reply Sorry, but I cannot support Dorner, (Original post)
MadHound Feb 2013 OP
pitbullgirl1965 Feb 2013 #1
rightsideout Feb 2013 #2
Historic NY Feb 2013 #15
LAGC Feb 2013 #109
Baclava Feb 2013 #35
arely staircase Feb 2013 #40
tblue37 Feb 2013 #53
Renew Deal Feb 2013 #3
MadHound Feb 2013 #4
Renew Deal Feb 2013 #7
Luminous Animal Feb 2013 #25
libtodeath Feb 2013 #38
BainsBane Feb 2013 #108
tkmorris Feb 2013 #83
mimi85 Feb 2013 #116
rightsideout Feb 2013 #19
geomon666 Feb 2013 #21
The Velveteen Ocelot Feb 2013 #5
BlueStater Feb 2013 #6
bvar22 Feb 2013 #44
Smarmie Doofus Feb 2013 #102
DevonRex Feb 2013 #115
bvar22 Feb 2013 #118
LisaL Feb 2013 #59
freshwest Feb 2013 #105
DollarBillHines Feb 2013 #71
Permanut Feb 2013 #8
mike_c Feb 2013 #9
Lionessa Feb 2013 #14
JI7 Feb 2013 #22
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #27
JI7 Feb 2013 #29
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #33
tblue37 Feb 2013 #56
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #72
tblue37 Feb 2013 #73
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #76
tblue37 Feb 2013 #98
southernyankeebelle Feb 2013 #99
mike_c Feb 2013 #45
dkf Feb 2013 #64
bklyncowgirl Feb 2013 #51
frylock Feb 2013 #10
coalition_unwilling Feb 2013 #24
Iggo Feb 2013 #62
Lionessa Feb 2013 #11
Trajan Feb 2013 #12
Cali_Democrat Feb 2013 #13
ljm2002 Feb 2013 #16
Still Sensible Feb 2013 #17
KG Feb 2013 #18
zappaman Feb 2013 #20
Junkdrawer Feb 2013 #23
Warpy Feb 2013 #26
LisaL Feb 2013 #28
Warpy Feb 2013 #43
LisaL Feb 2013 #57
Warpy Feb 2013 #60
coalition_unwilling Feb 2013 #95
JI7 Feb 2013 #31
Kalidurga Feb 2013 #30
JI7 Feb 2013 #32
Kalidurga Feb 2013 #36
FarCenter Feb 2013 #34
underpants Feb 2013 #37
theKed Feb 2013 #39
JI7 Feb 2013 #42
flamingdem Feb 2013 #50
LisaL Feb 2013 #54
HangOnKids Feb 2013 #65
LisaL Feb 2013 #67
mokawanis Feb 2013 #41
Zoeisright Feb 2013 #46
DaveJ Feb 2013 #47
Fire Walk With Me Feb 2013 #48
flamingdem Feb 2013 #49
Incitatus Feb 2013 #58
flamingdem Feb 2013 #69
tama Feb 2013 #80
flamingdem Feb 2013 #82
tama Feb 2013 #87
tama Feb 2013 #79
Incitatus Feb 2013 #94
liberalmuse Feb 2013 #52
Coolest Ranger Feb 2013 #55
DeadEyeDyck Feb 2013 #61
DirkGently Feb 2013 #63
liberal_at_heart Feb 2013 #66
MattBaggins Feb 2013 #68
tama Feb 2013 #85
flamingdem Feb 2013 #70
shanti Feb 2013 #74
slackmaster Feb 2013 #75
indie9197 Feb 2013 #77
Zax2me Feb 2013 #78
randome Feb 2013 #81
tama Feb 2013 #88
msanthrope Feb 2013 #89
tama Feb 2013 #91
msanthrope Feb 2013 #93
applegrove Feb 2013 #84
Chathamization Feb 2013 #86
NCTraveler Feb 2013 #92
Herlong Feb 2013 #97
bvar22 Feb 2013 #104
DevonRex Feb 2013 #114
Fantastic Anarchist Feb 2013 #110
JDPriestly Feb 2013 #90
Herlong Feb 2013 #96
aandegoons Feb 2013 #100
DonCoquixote Feb 2013 #101
DinahMoeHum Feb 2013 #103
freshwest Feb 2013 #106
Taverner Feb 2013 #107
BellaLuna Feb 2013 #111
otohara Feb 2013 #112
Festivito Feb 2013 #113
robertkdem1965_h89 Feb 2013 #117

Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:44 PM

1. Agree. I'm not a fan of the police but

you don't kill people.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:45 PM

2. He seems to have become a folk hero of sorts.

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Response to rightsideout (Reply #2)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:56 PM

15. You mean like Ted Kaczynski........the guy is raging...

perhaps roid rage from the size of his St. Bernard head...

He's a fucking coward.......in the end he'll stick that 40 in his mouth.

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Response to Historic NY (Reply #15)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 01:03 PM

109. I doubt it.

He won't go down without taking at least a few more cops with him.

The man is on a mission.

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Response to rightsideout (Reply #2)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 07:02 PM

35. If he really wanted to be a folk hero and not just another red smear on the daily news...

he would disappear and become another Eric Rudolph.

the bomber that ran for 5 years till he was caught....that's a LOT of sleepless nights for the LAPD targets

maybe that is his plan, who knows

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Response to Baclava (Reply #35)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 07:14 PM

40. i doubt this guy has the survivalist skills rudolph (or the unibomber) had

ruduolph, as a right wing militia survivalist type was able to go to ground in the wilderness. the unibomber was unknown for much of his escapades. i bet this guy's story will end soon, and not well for him.

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Response to arely staircase (Reply #40)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:37 PM

53. Rudolph also had a lot of RWers and fundies helping him. nt

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:45 PM

3. This needed to be stated?

You considered supporting a mass murdering lunatic?

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #3)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:47 PM

4. Apparently so,

 

Since some folks, both here and in the real world, are idolizing him.

No, I never considered supporting him, but with only three people killed, I wouldn't term him a "mass" murderer. I leave that term for somebody like the OKC bomber.

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Response to MadHound (Reply #4)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:51 PM

7. I guess I'm behind on this issue

I knew he was still on the loose. I didn't know he became a cult hero for the wanna be anarchists.

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Response to MadHound (Reply #4)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:36 PM

25. I don't suppose you have a link to these idolizing posts...

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Response to Luminous Animal (Reply #25)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 07:09 PM

38. This,I dont support what he has done for a second but that does not mean we as a society

should just ignore the things that led him there.
I have not seen anyone idolizing him.

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Response to Luminous Animal (Reply #25)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 01:03 PM

108. apparently there are some Facebook pages

supporting him, or so I've read.

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Response to MadHound (Reply #4)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 11:03 PM

83. That's an accusation one shouldn't make lightly

Who exactly is it here that is "idolizing" (your words) him? Further, if you cannot show that this is true the only responsible thing is to delete that brash comment immediately.

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Response to MadHound (Reply #4)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 11:25 PM

116. ONLY three people??

Seriously?

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Response to Renew Deal (Reply #3)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:20 PM

19. Umm

Did I say I supported him?

There were comments on this board yesterday of people supporting the guy. I'm only repeating what I observed.

Boy, people jump to conclusions here. Geez!

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Response to rightsideout (Reply #19)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:22 PM

21. I'm glad I missed those supportive comments

Because that's absolutely disgusting.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:48 PM

5. He's a criminal who killed innocent people. I have no sympathy for him at all.

However fucked up the LAPD is - and it does appear to be very seriously fucked up - that does not justify murdering people - nothing less than acts of terrorism. I hope they catch him, preferably alive (but I wouldn't grieve if he wound up dead), before he hurts anyone else.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:48 PM

6. He killed an innocent woman just because she happened to be the daughter of one of his enemies.

Fuck the murdering piece of shit.

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Response to BlueStater (Reply #6)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 07:32 PM

44. Did he use a drone,

because, if so,
then it is A-OK!

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #44)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 09:27 AM

102. 2-shay. n't

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #44)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 10:47 PM

115. Ah, i didn't notice this one before.

Was this the first time you compared Corner to President Obama? I did see the one at the bottom of the thread. I won't go looking for more elsewhere. I hope you've thought better of the comparison, though. It's really troubling. As in I can't believe you actually said that twice.

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Response to DevonRex (Reply #115)

Sun Feb 10, 2013, 01:06 PM

118. Gosh...Sounds like you want to target me for a Drone Strike for disloyatly.

My post wasn't about President Obama.
I didn't mention his name.
I didn't even refer to him obliquely.

I WAS referring to the blood thirsty crows at DU who support the Drone War
and secret Death Panels.

It is NOT about The Person.
It IS about The Policy.

Historically, in countries where devotion to a Person or loyalty to a Political Party was given a higher priority than commitment to Good Policy, the results have NOT been good.

I do NOT understand this devotion to a person on DU.
It is something alien to me and my long experience as a Loyal Liberal Democrat.
I was taught to Question Authority, and Think for Myself.
Most Democrats of my generation were taught the same,
and I will continue to do so.

I OPPOSE the expansion of the powers of a Unitary Executive,
secret Death Panels, and execution without due process,
NOT because I hate Obama, as you and yours want to believe,
but because I cherish our democracy,
and, after witnessing the failure in Vietnam,
I know that a strategy of Kill-Them-All has ZERO chance of success.

I don't believe you, or any of the others frantically and belligerently defending this new expansion of Presidential Powers, would have supported it if George Bush were still president.



You will know them by their WORKS,
not by their rhetoric, promises, or excuses.
Solidarity99!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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Response to BlueStater (Reply #6)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:47 PM

59. The guy whose daughter Dorner is accused of killing was Dorner's lawyer.

He was representing Dorner, but apparently Dorner blames him for losing the case.
So Dorner didn't even allegedly go after people who actually harmed him (at least in his view), but after a girl he didn't even know, just because she is the daughter of his lawyer.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #59)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 12:59 PM

105. I think that some are unfortunately confusing their opinion of LAPD with the act here:



She and her fiance were murdered, just a young couple, not responsible for what Dorner alleges was done wrong. The only defense I have heard is that he does not admit to doing it. That would be the only defense possible.

No cause or justice is served by killing the families of those who you consider to have wronged you or anyone else. That's going for bloodline killing, which is how mass murders start. I've tried to grasp those who think there is a bigger cause going on here.

There are going to be some defining moments here at DU. One poster has been banned by Skinner over this.

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Response to BlueStater (Reply #6)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:27 PM

71. That fact, alone...

makes me hope that he either bleeds out, real slow, or spends the rest of his life in the general population.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:51 PM

8. Classic example of going postal..

Frustration pushed beyond the breaking point. I've felt that anger and frustration while being treated unfairly on the job, but not to the breaking point, and never with the idea that something like this would result in a satisfactory conclusion.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:52 PM

9. says volumes about the reputation of the LAPD, doesn't it...?

When someone begins doing harm to people the rest of us largely despise but feel powerless against, it takes on a Robin Hood sort of quality.

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Response to mike_c (Reply #9)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:54 PM

14. Sorry but starting with the daughter and her fiancee who were NOT largely despised...

 

blows a complete hole it that concept. I can empathize but in no way is he Robin Hood or a hero of any sort.

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Response to mike_c (Reply #9)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:24 PM

22. why didn't he go to a police station adn start shooting there ? why the basketball coach and her

boyfriend ?

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Response to JI7 (Reply #22)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:46 PM

27. Revenge. How would you feel if you worked with a guy that shot your daughter?

 

He had some issues but in know way murdering people solves those issues he had. He was worried about his good name well he needs to forget that. However, second, third look needs to be looked into with that police department.

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #27)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:48 PM

29. did the Father of the coach he killed shoot his daughter ?

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Response to JI7 (Reply #29)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:52 PM

33. I don't know who you are talking about. I am just responding to the question. He

 

killed a couple and I think one of the two is related to an officer (or captain) at the police station. I don't know much about any of the people. I thought I read that much. But a question was asked and I answered it. I think revenge.

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #33)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:40 PM

56. Your post makes it sound as though Dorner sought revenge because the father of the coach had killed

Dorner's daughter.

That is what the other poster was responding to in his post.

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #56)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:28 PM

72. Listen I don't know who was killed. I don't know anything about about a coach killing

 

Doner's daughter. I didn't know he was married. The last I read his ex wife went on Facebook and told girls to watch out for him because he was a physco. She said they got married and after a month that was it for her. She said he was paranoid. The couple am talking about the daughter and her boyfriend was a revenge murder against the girl's dad who was a captain at the police station Doner worked at.

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #72)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:57 PM

73. This is the post you responded to—and your response:

Other Post:
“why didn't he go to a police station adn start shooting there ? why the basketball coach and her
boyfriend?”


You responded:
“ “Revenge. How would you feel if you worked with a guy that shot your daughter?”


Your response makes it sound as though Dorner wanted revenge because he felt angry that someone shot his daughter.
Dorner has no family, no daughter. He shot the other cop’s daughter.

But your phrasing was very confusing. It made it sound like Dorner’s desire for revenge was because someone had shot his daughter. THAT confusion is what the poster was responding to in your post.

The only reason I responded is that you couldn't figure out why the other poster had said what he said. I was just trying to translate so you could see what he was responding to in your post. I teach college English. I am almost compulsive when it comes to trying to decipher language for other people. I was just trying to help clear things up.

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #73)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:16 PM

76. Thank you for clearing it up. I was answering the question. I was assuming this

 

couple was the one they were talking about. I thought she was the captain's daughter who was Doner's boss at the police station. That is why I said revenge.

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #76)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 03:16 AM

98. But it was Dorner who was after revenge, not the father of the murdered girl.

The father of the girl Dorner killed was the guy who unsuccessfully represented Dorner in his appeal of his firing.

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #98)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 08:46 AM

99. I know that is what I was trying to say.

 

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Response to JI7 (Reply #22)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:08 PM

45. is that a rhetorical question or are you really addressing it to me?

I have no clue. Perhaps I should clarify-- my comment was meant as an observation about social reactions, not a defense of violence.

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Response to mike_c (Reply #45)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:09 PM

64. I'm sure Dorner would find it completely unacceptable

 

If Quan went to Dorner's mother's house and shot her.

The guy has a personality disorder where there are only rules for others.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #22)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:26 PM

51. I agree

Shoot the bastard who done you wrong, OK maybe I could understand that--not agree with it, mind you, but I could understand it. Shoot his DAUGHTER? Someone who as far as we know did nothing to him--sorry this guy is not a hero.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:52 PM

10. who's asking anyone to support him?

is it too much to ask that people review the actual story and perhaps offer some empathy for someone with PTSD that has clearly snapped? or will that too besmirch the good name of drone kill list underground?

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Response to frylock (Reply #10)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:34 PM

24. Welcome to DU Logic where, if you don't immediately drop to your knees and

 

start fellating the LAPD (along with all the LA media whores who do it), you are guilty of cheering on a cop killer.

IOW, if you don't support the LAPD 100%, by golly that must mean you support Dorner.

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Response to coalition_unwilling (Reply #24)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:05 PM

62. Fuck the po-lice.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:52 PM

11. In no way do I see anyone supporting him. Just trying to understand which has caused some

 

empathy towards him. Big difference.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:52 PM

12. This thread implies that someone here is idolizing him

It's this true?

please post links to those posts where he is idolized

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 05:53 PM

13. Good. I don't know anyone who is "supporting Dorner"

here or anywhere else.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:02 PM

16. It reminds me of Ted Kaczinski (sp?)...

...who had an environmental manifesto that sounded pretty good... but then when you realized he was sending bombs and killing people, well it just kind of made the whole thing feel wrong.

Regardless of whether Dorner's story in his manifesto is correct or not, what he has done / is doing is simply wrong. And that means that he has ensured no one will listen to his story.

As you said: you don't kill people to make your point.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:17 PM

17. I've only seen one post that treats him

as a 'hero.' I am aware there are some at other places on the web idolizing him.

I think what most somewhat sympathetic posts are indicating that his message about LAPD corruption should not be dismissed despite the unforgivable actions he is taking.

Regardless he must be stopped. He seems to expect and want to be a martyr... He is odds-on to get his wish.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:19 PM

18. I see what you did there...

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:21 PM

20. I don't think that is something you have to apologize for!

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:29 PM

23. I see you support corruption in the LAPD....

That is every bit as fair as your OP.

It's possible to investigate his LAPD charges and condemn his horrific crimes at the same time.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:44 PM

26. Support him? No.

Murdering that young couple just because the woman was a former chief's daughter made him insupportable.

However, I hope now that he's gone to ground, it's with a decent journalist and I hope he's spilling his guts about what happened to him.

You know by what happened to the two women delivering newspapers that the LAPD wants him executed before he talks to anyone. I just hope they don't get their wish this time.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #26)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:47 PM

28. He already "spilled his guts" in his manifesto.

And a decent journalist would call 911 if he tries to make contact.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #28)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 07:24 PM

43. That "manifesto" was rambling and disjointed

a decent journalist would be able to zero in on incidents and ask all the right questions to nail things down more firmly, organize them, and get them ready for investigation.

Because he's not a decent writer (not to mention nuts, hence the rambling), the whole thing is going to be easy for the LAPD to sweep under the rug as the ramblings of a madman.

This is why I hope he's spilling his guts, if not to a journalist then to a lawyer who'd also ask the right questions. That police department is tied with NYC's finest in the corruption department. It would be good to see either one of them exposed and cleaned up.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #43)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:41 PM

57. Oh give me a break.

The guy is accused of killing 3 people. Do you think anyone is going to be interested in investigating on whether he was fired fairly or not? It's not like he is going to get his job back.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #57)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:54 PM

60. Someone might be interested in blowing the lid

off a lot of heavy corruption at the LAPD.

Interested enough to ask him questions for a couple of days before they try to figure out how to turn him in some way he'll live through.

As I said, I don't support him, at all. I just think he might have some interesting things to say and it's obvious his fellow boys on the force are very interested in shutting him up fast.

Take a look at the back of the newspaper ladies' truck for proof of that.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #43)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 12:24 AM

95. Based on how the first Ramparts scandal got pretty much swept under the rug, save

 

for picking off the low-lying fruit, I'm not holding my breath that this will lead to the LAPD being 'exposed' and 'cleaned up.'

An unpleasant truth for many of us on the left is that many people in LA, while feeling and expressing a generalized hostility to the LAPD, don't give enough of a shit to see to it that real reforms happen.

Hence, LAPD sent 1500 goons in to break up the Occupy Los Angeles camp of some 300 souls, in the process trampling under foot the U.S. Constitution and California State Constitutions just as surely as they trampled the tents under foot. Did anyone other than Occupiers say one word in opposition? No, hell no. I rest my case.

I wonder whether we will ever know whether Dorner watched what happened when Occupy Los Angeles remained non-violent to the bitter end and drew his own inferences about the bitter fruits of non-violence with regard to the LAPD.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #26)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:50 PM

31. so why didn't they kill him in all the years since he was fired ?

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:49 PM

30. His manifesto makes his actions worse IMO...

If he was truly left leaning he wouldn't murder people. Being left leaning means having compassion. It seems at one point he had this. I don't know where it went, but he lost it when he murdered innocent people.

We don't need a murderer to push a left leaning agenda. In fact this probably would hurt the cause much more than help it. If he was a teabagger type, I am sure many would say that it is something about his agenda that makes him a murdering maniac.

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Response to Kalidurga (Reply #30)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:51 PM

32. i see it as an excuse, like that sister of the rapist/killer in Iraq

who tried to excuse what he did by saying how we should have never gone there and other shit to try to take the blame away from her brother.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #32)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 07:04 PM

36. Yes, it's an excuse all right.

There is absolutely no justification for him murdering innocent people. I can understand his motives, but never his actions. I am sure he was in all kinds of turmoil and what not. I am also positive the LAPD is corrupt and it might even be worse than he says it is. But, this is a text book example of the wrong way to expose an injustice.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 06:56 PM

34. It's your right to rage against society for wrongs that you feel are intolerable.

It's society's right to shoot you down like the mad dog you are.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 07:06 PM

37. Why would you? I see now why talk radio has been reporting on this to the dashboard believers

I haven't read the "manifesto" but I see that they are trying to paint his as the typical left winger.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 07:10 PM

39. I think we need to make sure

to realise there is a difference between supporting him, idolizing him, and simply understanding him. While the acts committed are unforgivable, it is possible to understand the circumstances that led to this - a combination of mistreatment, mental illness, and others - and learn from it.

Or, you know, just toss him in the wastebin. Whatevs.

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Response to theKed (Reply #39)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 07:19 PM

42. in his case i think he was just selfish , and using known issues with the LAPD as an excuse

i think he just wants to shoot and kill people. that's why he joined the military and probably never had a chance to kill anyone. maybe he is upset he never got to kill anyone in his time at LAPD .

and the first ones he shoots are the cops daughter and boyfriend ? not even the cops themselves.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #42)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:24 PM

50. And he wants to die eventually, suicide by cop for sure

He admits to struggling with depression, he maybe also be bipolar

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Response to JI7 (Reply #42)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:40 PM

54. The girl he is accused of killing is the daughter of retired cop turned lawyer who was defending him

in his trials against LAPD. I don't think he ever even met the girl, and she certainly did nothing to him.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #54)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:11 PM

65. I would bet Dorner knew the girl

Cops are fraternal, they know the families of their squadron mates. Dorner worked directly with Randy Quan. Just like in a military squad the families often hang out with each other, many of the spouses are friends, and they know each others children. My feeling is that Dorner knew the Quan family, and he knew this was the most egregious thing he could do to Randy's family.

I agree that the girl never did anything to Dorner, but I don't think that means he didn't know her.

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Response to HangOnKids (Reply #65)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:13 PM

67. Quan was retired. He was Dorner's lawyer. I don't think Dorner hang out with his family.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 07:17 PM

41. I must have missed the comments that showed support for Dorner

I didn't see any here on DU. I did see some comments that pointed out how corrupt the LAPD is. I also read some comments that appeared to be making the case that some of the points in the manifesto were accurate and true (I don't know. I haven't read it), and it seemed to me that those statements angered people who then blasted the commenters as somehow glorifying Dorner's violent crimes.

In other words, saying "Dorner's exposing the vile corruption of the LAPD. Some of the material in the manifesto is true" is NOT the same thing as saying "Dorner was justified in committing his violent crimes."

I have a hard time believing anyone would endorse his violent actions. If those kind of comments are being made on DU the people making them deserve the push-back and criticisms they're sure to get.


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Response to mokawanis (Reply #41)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:14 PM

46. There was one that was raving about how good a guy he was for

returning money he found as a teenager.

There was no criticism of that murderer in the post; it was disgusting.

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Response to mokawanis (Reply #41)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:20 PM

47. Good point

People are too often afraid to say things, just because they might be misinterpreted. I believe in political correctness in actions, but when words are minced to such a degree one can say hardly anything, that's going too far.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:22 PM

48. In 2011 he sued LAPD regarding brutality he'd witnessed. LAPD said there was no brutality and fired

 

him.

http://tvfishbowl.com/christopher-dorner-vs-lapd-legal-transcripts/

I don't know what's occurred to him in the meantime. You don't have to support or apologize about him to say FUCK LAPD.


Mojo Man ‏@StillCeejay

lol wait, so in trying to hunt this ex cop the LAPD are hurting innocent people, which is what this guy claimed in the first place?! looool.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:23 PM

49. He's mentally ill

Maybe manic depressive

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Response to flamingdem (Reply #49)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:44 PM

58. And it appears he's smart and highly trained.

I wouldn't want to be LAPD right now. I hope it ends without anymore bloodshed, but I don't see that happening.

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Response to Incitatus (Reply #58)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:21 PM

69. It's like a video game to him with his shoulder launched weapon and the

rest of the items to wreak havoc.

Whew not a good scene at all.

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Response to flamingdem (Reply #69)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:54 PM

80. Like

 

Joysticking a drone to make a "bug splat" in some Otheristan?

Nope, in that sense, it's not like a video game to him.

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Response to tama (Reply #80)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:59 PM

82. I mean that in his head it's a game

but reality is going to treat him differently.

He might be changing his mind about this plan about now..

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Response to flamingdem (Reply #82)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 11:14 PM

87. Sure

 

maybe you do live in his head and know what it's like there, I don't. I just see him playing the same "game" as soldiers and combatants do in Iraq, Afganistan etc.

Sure, we can call it all just "game", but when I play similar FPS game over Internet with just bits and pixels moving, no blood is spilled and nobody really dies. But maybe you mean that in his head it's a game because this is happening in America, in his personal war against other Americans, and not in some Otheristan against Others?

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Response to Incitatus (Reply #58)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:50 PM

79. LAPD is very afraid

 

and when afraid people act stupid - spraying two vans with bullets and injuring people is more stupid than any professional law enforcement agency can be allowed.

The "support" he's getting on FB and elsewhere is much less support for him, but much more about distrust and hostility against LAPD. And short list of reasons for that:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Los_Angeles_Police_Department#Controversy

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Response to tama (Reply #79)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 11:55 PM

94. Something needs to be done. LA may be worse than many other places

but it's a pervasive problem throughout the whole country. I know someone in the middle of a suit against a department in FL for a disgusting abuse of power and a few other people involved in incidents who weren't able to seek recourse.

I read Dorner's manifesto. Some cops are no better than the thugs they arrest. I just wish this guy didn't bring their family members into this.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:30 PM

52. He's made some good points, is even intelligent, BUT...

killing people in cold blood is not the answer. I will never support that, even though I agree with "some" of his manifesto. It could be the conditioning with "Rambo" movies and the like. It could be that some of what he says makes sense. When it comes right down to it, not much, though. When I first saw his picture, I couldn't believe this man would be capable of murder. He does not look like your prototypical killer. Once he killed that girl and her fiance, he went over to the dark side.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:40 PM

55. I just hope he doesn't kill any more people

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 08:57 PM

61. How clear is it that he committed the murders?

I have not followed the story that close. I can't help but think of the movie "Shooter" where very powerful people frame a man to stop him from talking, and other reasons.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:05 PM

63. Which is why we should get behind facts, not people.

It sounds like the man is disturbed. Quite likely in the clinical sense.

It appears that he murdered people in cold blood and has promised to do more.

It ALSO appears he may have been an LAPD whistleblower.

And it is CERTAIN that LAPD has been pumping random lead into the citizenry in their zeal to kill this guy.


People aren't all one thing. We can't deduce facts by deciding who we do or do not like.

It is possible, for example, that a crazed murderer who must be stopped was unfairly railroaded out of a job for whistle-blowing and is now sought by LAPD not to be brought to justice, but to be executed.

Not saying that's the case, but we seem to have this silly belief that we get to the truth by deciding that someone is an all-purpose bad guy and fitting all the surrounding facts to that purpose.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:11 PM

66. He could have sued or gone to the media. Killing is inexcusable.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:16 PM

68. Yeah the whole bit of killing entire families

negates everything he might have had to say. No amount of perceived injustice excuses that level of hate. No need to kill anyone to get his point across.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #68)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 11:07 PM

85. Negates?

 

He's military dude with that weird military macho code of honor, all about his "name". US military threatens and kills family members and entire families as normal procedure in Iraq, Afganistan and elsewhere, Obama killed by a drone an American 16 year old son of American "enemy combatant". He declares a personal war against LAPD and follows the tactics he learned in military, including psyops of threatening, and as is assumed also killing, family members. And judging from the response of hysterical spraying of two vans, he has succeeded in making LAPD very afraid and afraid is stupid.

He's product of US military and imperialistic wars against civilian populations. If he's unethical, so is also the US government.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 09:23 PM

70. I saw a dead ringer for Dorner stopped in West LA with three cop cars with lights on

and this look a like was sitting on the curb as they were checking his car.

He seemed calm. That had to be related, why else 3 cop cars on one stop?

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Response to flamingdem (Reply #70)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:05 PM

74. i really feel for

large, bald, black men in LA right about now. probably a good time to lay low. i remember when LEO was looking for richard ramirez. my ex husband was pulled over because he supposedly looked like him (he didn't).

here's hoping they find dorner and soon!

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:10 PM

75. A violent mentally ill left-leaning wacko is every bit as dangerous to society...

 

...as a violent mentally ill right-leaning wacko.

If you want to be a true hero, you don't kill people to make your point. You go public, you speak out, you write of wrongs. You don't kill people to make your point.

Christopher Dorner may have had a legitimate beef, but his methods are unsound.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)


Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:39 PM

78. Nor do the people he murdered.

 

They have no voice now.
I don't expect their families are going to give voice to his 'fight'.
So - who is going to stand up and take Dorner's side since they cannot?

Appears there are a few takers.
Sick.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:57 PM

81. No need to apologize for not supporting a murderer of innocent people.

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Response to randome (Reply #81)


Response to tama (Reply #88)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 11:28 PM

89. Your post seems rather incoherent. Care to expand? nt

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Response to msanthrope (Reply #89)


Response to tama (Reply #91)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 11:36 PM

93. My, we are in quite a fettle tonight! Obama is a "king?" Let's see--on a thread

about a ex-cop running loose with guns, you've managed to bring up drones and the President. Can Julian Assange be far behind?

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 11:05 PM

84. I was shocked when it looked like some people supported him.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 11:13 PM

86. The manifesto is centrist, not left leaning

He says that Clinton is his favorite president, but says that George H.W. Bush is his second favorite. He praises Hillary Clinton, but also praises Chris Christie. He praises Jon Stewart, but also Dennis Miller. He criticizes Wayne LaPierre, but also says that Piers Morgan shouldn't advocate for gun control because he has an accent. Etc., etc. The manifesto isn't left leaning at all, it's just not right leaning.

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Response to Chathamization (Reply #86)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 11:35 PM

92. Didn't vote in the last election because his man....

John Huntsman lost in the primary.

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Response to Chathamization (Reply #86)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 12:38 AM

97. Why should people take him at his word? Innocent people are dead.

 

I personally do not care about his manifesto. I think he's one big dookie.

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Response to Chathamization (Reply #86)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 12:53 PM

104. "Cenrtist" IS "Right Leaning" in today's "New Democrat" Paradigm.

The "Center" has lurched waaay to the political Right over the last 25 years.
So have the "Centrists" who follow dutifully along without question.

At one time, I was a Mainstream-Center FDR/LBJ Democrat.
NOW, I am labeled a "Fringe Leftist".
I haven't changed.

When Reagan's policies and political positioning is to the LEFT of our current Party Leadership, then we have a problem.

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #104)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 10:39 PM

114. I see you are comparing President Obama's ideology to Dorner's.

Fail.

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Response to Chathamization (Reply #86)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 04:00 PM

110. Thank you. It seems others haven't read the manifesto.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 11:29 PM

90. Agree. His killing people has just made things worse for those who deal with police officers.

Again, would he have killed these people if he hadn't had a gun? Certainly it would have been physically possible for him to use some other means to kill, but would he have been as likely to do it? To what extent are guns the problem? To what extent could these rampages be stopped if we did something about the guns?

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 12:26 AM

96. I'm forced to listen to the Sean Hannity show on a daily basis because co-workers enjoy his show.

 

Last edited Fri Feb 15, 2013, 02:17 AM - Edit history (3)

As Sean Hannity reports, this proves something he must breathlessly report after the obligatory statements about the Muslim Brother hood and how Obama is a Marxist. And there you go. It's not about getting to the bottom of it. It's about breathlessly reporting about how bad people who are not republicans are. Americans, all of us, want this guy in jail, that's the God's honest truth.


Happy Valentines Day ya'll.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 08:57 AM

100. Well if he was a pitbull you would.

Of course no one but the extremist would ever support killers.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 09:12 AM

101. true

"If you want to be a true hero, you don't kill people to make your point. You go public, you speak out, you write of wrongs. You don't kill people to make your point. "

Sadly, when you read a Ted Rall, a Derrick Jannsen, or any number of activists, you will see that they want to ignore that fact."

To quote Nietzche :"Beware of those who have a desire to punish" as they have an anger that will eventually attack an innocent.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 09:30 AM

103. Terrorism: humane concerns inhumanly expressed.

Seems Dorner fits that definition to a tee.

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Response to DinahMoeHum (Reply #103)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 01:01 PM

106. I'd never seen that definition before. Thanks.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 01:02 PM

107. I don't support him; but I want him to talk

 

He's not a hero, he's a murderer who kills innocent people

But he knows what's going on at the LAPD and he can be a witness

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 04:08 PM

111. What is it with the posts here assuming he is being supported?

Are people really supporting his actions of the last week or so?

Granted, I haven't read every post here but I would think it's obvious his rampage is not ok with a civilized society.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 04:17 PM

112. I Thought That Was A Given

fuck that guy!

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 07:59 PM

113. Those suggestions were already done. And, we do kill to make a point.

Look at our wars. That's how we train people to solve problems. That's how we trained him. All or nothing at all.

The judicial system could not let him continue in the space of doubt between not being able to prove an allegation and their inability to prove the allegation was false. Win all or nothing.

He could not find that speaking-out venue that would have given him outlet he needed.

We train him to kill. We set him out to kill and even to deal with the killing of innocents in order to achieve some goal. It's so easy to say that it just isn't so... You don't kill people to make your point. As though that training just isn't so. But, we know it is so, don't we. That's the real reason why that word sorry is employed at the start of the post.

No, I don't support what he is doing -- not for the reasons you posted -- but, I also do not support our own inaction, my own included, for allowing our system to become so untenable.

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Response to MadHound (Original post)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 11:37 PM

117. Murderers are not to be praised, period.

 

I hope this sick psycho is caught ASAP. He deserves to rot in prison.

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