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Thu Feb 7, 2013, 04:37 PM

Brennan is referring to torture as "mistakes" we (CIA) made.

Isn't that nice? Not torture we committed. Not war crimes we committed. Not federal crimes we committed. Not crimes against humanity we committed - mistakes.

Because, you know, everyone makes mistakes.


I'm watching the hearing on Brennan's confirmation.


http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/02/07/watch-live-brennans-confirmation-hearing/


ETA: Oh, now he's speaking on learning from our mistakes...because no one knew torture was illegal before now. No one knew torture was wrong before now. No one knew torture violated both federal and international law before now.

But we know now! Yay, us!




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Arrow 25 replies Author Time Post
Reply Brennan is referring to torture as "mistakes" we (CIA) made. (Original post)
Solly Mack Feb 2013 OP
global1 Feb 2013 #1
Solly Mack Feb 2013 #2
cthulu2016 Feb 2013 #3
Floyd_Gondolli Feb 2013 #10
Octafish Feb 2013 #4
Solly Mack Feb 2013 #5
Octafish Feb 2013 #18
kenny blankenship Feb 2013 #12
Octafish Feb 2013 #19
jsr Feb 2013 #6
Solly Mack Feb 2013 #8
TwilightGardener Feb 2013 #7
Solly Mack Feb 2013 #9
kenny blankenship Feb 2013 #11
forestpath Feb 2013 #13
Solly Mack Feb 2013 #17
Blue_In_AK Feb 2013 #14
Solly Mack Feb 2013 #15
Solly Mack Feb 2013 #16
Catherina Feb 2013 #20
Solly Mack Feb 2013 #21
Catherina Feb 2013 #22
Solly Mack Feb 2013 #23
KoKo Feb 2013 #24
Solly Mack Feb 2013 #25

Response to Solly Mack (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:07 PM

1. Give The Guy A Break As He Was Employed Then Under The Bush/Cheney Administration....

he said he didn't agree and would not use these techniques if confirmed. I must say I've been watching the proceedings and am impressed with his knowledge and responses. He appears to be well spoken and not intimidated by these Senators that are grilling him. I feel very comfortable with him representing this administration in this position.

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Response to global1 (Reply #1)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:08 PM

2. Give him a break? For being too cowardly to call torture torture?

I don't think so.

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Response to global1 (Reply #1)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:10 PM

3. A break like don't jail him, or a break like make him CIA head?

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Response to global1 (Reply #1)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:16 PM

10. I watched it as well

 

And have been somewhat impressed. It's interesting to hear him speak and compare that with what I've read on DU the last few days which basically has him being a cross between Idi Amin and Vlad the Impaler.

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Response to Solly Mack (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:10 PM

4. NPR refused to use the word, describing torture as "Enhanced Interrogation Techniques" ...

Straight out of 1984, Baby.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #4)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:11 PM

5. Because the US is busy pretending the government didn't commit war crimes.

And they have a lot of enablers toward that aim.

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Response to Solly Mack (Reply #5)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:46 PM

18. During Vietnam, my friends' big brothers turned us on to Steppenwolf...



Going by the way Washington works, it seems the same Monster is running the show.

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Response to Octafish (Reply #4)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:21 PM

12. Or 1942

the Nazis didn't call it torture either, but enhanced interrogation techniques.

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Response to kenny blankenship (Reply #12)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:50 PM

19. Seems like somebody or another brought that point up in Nuremberg.

But, the point is never mentioned anymore by Corporate McPravda.



Something else the press dares not mention:



America's Descent Into Darkness

Slouching Towards Nuremberg?

by MORRIS BERMAN
CounterPunch
July 25, 2012

Strange things are happening in the United States these days, and every day seems to bring additional scary news. The similarity to the erosion of civil liberties in Germany during the 1930s is a bit too close for comfort. Many will regard this statement as hyperbole, and, to some extent, it is. But let’s take a close look at what is going on before we dismiss the comparison out of hand.

SNIP...

It is no accident that Chris Hedges entitled a recent article “First They Come for the Muslims” (see below, Item IV). God forbid something like that might happen in the U.S., but the signs of a gradual slide towards Nuremberg, and concomitant citizen apathy, are very much present in the current political milieu. Let’s have a look at what has been going on in the decade since 9/11. I’m going to discuss the following topics:

I. The creation of a political climate in which the police are out of control, arbitrarily free to intimidate anyone for virtually anything

II. The persecution of whistleblowers, protesters, and dissenters

III. The dramatic expansion of the surveillance of American citizens on the part of the National Security Agency (NSA)

IV. The corruption of the judicial system by means of show trials of Muslim activists

V. The construction of political detention centers, also known as Communication Management Units (CMU’s)

VI. The shredding of the Bill of Rights by means of the National Defense Authorization Act

VII. Future scenarios: The “disappearing” of intellectual critics of the U.S. government?


SNIP...

VII. Future scenarios: The “disappearing” of intellectual critics of the U.S. government?

This leads me to my final point. The distinctive characteristic of American democracy, from 1776, was the protection of the individual and the preservation of individual rights. That no longer exists. Anyone is a potential terrorist now; anyone can be persecuted, prosecuted, and in effect, destroyed. Democracy is only possible if dissent is not only permitted, but also respected. This too is finished. What does this mean for someone such as myself?, is something I lay awake nights thinking about. I have published three books, and half a collection of essays, showing where we have gone wrong, predicting our eventual collapse—indeed, this repression is part of that collapse—and arguing that the U.S. no longer has a moral compass; that it is spiritually bankrupt. I run a blog that is anything but polite: it says the U.S. is finished; that it is essentially a corporate plutocracy, run by a gangster elite; that the American people are basically morons, with little more than fried rice in their heads; and that anyone with half a brain and the means to do so should emigrate before it’s too late. I’m not really a threat to the U.S. government, largely because I am not a political activist and because it’s not likely that more than 74 people out of 311 million regularly read my blog (it’s probably more like 24, in fact). But as the definition of terrorism widens in this country, what is to prevent the creation of a category known as “intellectual terrorism” from arising, and putting folks like myself in that category? What is to prevent the government from calling such activity a clear and present danger to national security? As must be obvious by now, the government can do anything it wants to; as in Nazi Germany, we now have a government of men, not of laws. Indeed, the “laws” are little more than a pretext for whatever the government wishes to do.

CONTINUED...

http://www.counterpunch.org/2012/07/25/slouching-towards-nuremberg/



Is this America when the place acts like its run by NAZIs with boatloads of money?


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Response to Solly Mack (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:11 PM

6. So technically it was worse than a clerical error

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Response to jsr (Reply #6)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:13 PM

8. Technically. I make mistakes all the time.

No one seems to get tortured when I do though.

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Response to Solly Mack (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:13 PM

7. Mistakes were made...

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Response to TwilightGardener (Reply #7)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:13 PM

9. Exactly the same.

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Response to Solly Mack (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:18 PM

11. The skunk doesn't change his stripes

Brennan wrote a paper back in his college days in which he concluded torture was probably justifiable. That was back when torture was considered absolutely taboo, and "something the Nazis did", the mark of the North Koreans, and other outlaw regimes. Later as an agent of the government Brennan tortured. He is a cheap thug.
His involvement in torture was no mistake, and odds are he'll find ways to use it again.

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Response to kenny blankenship (Reply #11)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:23 PM

13. +1

 

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Response to kenny blankenship (Reply #11)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:42 PM

17. He claims to have had "concerns" over "enhanced interrogation techniques".

"Concerns"...Snort.

Wasn't concerned enough to speak out publicly when it was going on. You don't just sit back and allow people to torture or be tortured. The right thing is to do something about it.

Here's one of his concerns:

"He expressed concern, according to these officials, that if details of the program became public, it would be CIA officers who would face criticism, rather than the politicians and lawyers who approved them."

Oh, my! He was concerned about CIA agents getting a bad rap for committing war crimes. But only if the knowledge ever became public.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/01/30/us-obama-nominations-brennan-idUSBRE90T07I20130130

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Response to Solly Mack (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:23 PM

14. I am really not in favor of this appointment. n/t

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Response to Blue_In_AK (Reply #14)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:33 PM

15. I'm not either. He'll be confirmed though.

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Response to Solly Mack (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:35 PM

16. Great...now the committee is making water-boarding jokes.

Last edited Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:08 PM - Edit history (1)

Nice.

It was Senator Richard Burr, Republican of North Carolina. Laughter heard.

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Response to Solly Mack (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:57 PM

20. How is he not in front of the ICC? What is this chilling charade? n/t

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Response to Catherina (Reply #20)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:00 PM

21. The United States is not a participant.

America's war criminals - and I do include those who in government who knew and remained silent - will never be held accountable.

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Response to Solly Mack (Reply #21)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:15 PM

22. The ICC should pick them up wherever the are

after all, that's what we do so we're apparently fine with the concept.

It torments me that justice won't be meted out to these criminals during our lifetime.

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Response to Catherina (Reply #22)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:19 PM

23. I am also tormented by it.

It overshadows everything (about my government and a good deal of my fellow citizens) for me.

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Response to Solly Mack (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:28 PM

24. He sure was "weak" in his answer about Waterboarding as Torture!

He was so worried about his answer though that he thought the "Middle Road" was what would get his Nomination to go through!

He actually "threw a bone" to CODE PINK addressing the "concerns" of those who disgreed with the Drone attacks.

This is a FIRST for an Obama or Bush appointee to even ACKNOWLEDGE that "some folks who VOTE here in USA...are VERY concerned about Drone Strikes, Collateral Damage, Targeting and how far it will go until it reaches the beautiful shores of the USA to be targeted against our Patriot Citizens that have gone back to insurrection since we freed ourselves from the Brits back in the 1700's!

So....Brennan was doing a "hand out of Peace" to the Code Pink and rest of us Progressive Dems while doing his "COVER" for how humble he is and how he "knows better than the rest of us because of his exhaulted background as a Terrorist Hunter."

Brennan just can't "REVEAL what HE KNOWS" because it's Secret and PROTECTS us from the "TERRIBLE THINGS...we Americans cannot deal with.

IMHO ...of what I watched and what I've read from sources that are certainly Progressive.. I don't go to RW Sites for MY NEWS or WAFFLING MEDIA....

Just saying....I think this is important.

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Response to KoKo (Reply #24)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:44 PM

25. Thank you for adding that!

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