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Wed Feb 6, 2013, 05:32 PM

President Obama is the Best President in My Lifetime.

I don't post here much anymore, but I do visit a lot. I've been here since early 2001 -- in our darkest days -- and I just want to say to all of you who have worked so hard, posted with such fury and wisdom, and who have put their hearts, sweat, money and time on the line all these years should be proud of themselves. Stand back and take a little of it all in. It is majestic. We've won a lot back that we had lost. I thank you for it all.

And I also want to say that, in my own eyes, President Barack Obama is now the best American President of my life time (and I am a very old and progressive activist Democrat). Of course, he is not a perfect man, but he is a really good man. And a historic President on so many dimensions.

Better than John Kennedy? Better than Lyndon Johnson? Better than Jimmy Carter? Better than Bill Clinton? Yes.

While JFK has always been my gold standard up until now, I can with confidence say that America has never been in better hands than it is today.

What's even better?

I know that the best from this man, Barack Obama, is yet to come. Just watch. And be proud.

Put him and FDR on Mount Rushmore.

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Arrow 172 replies Author Time Post
Reply President Obama is the Best President in My Lifetime. (Original post)
David Zephyr Feb 2013 OP
watercolors Feb 2013 #1
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #34
gcomeau Feb 2013 #2
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #35
gcomeau Feb 2013 #78
leveymg Feb 2013 #103
KoKo Feb 2013 #3
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #57
demwing Feb 2013 #58
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #59
hopemountain Feb 2013 #168
LineReply .
blkmusclmachine Feb 2013 #4
flamingdem Feb 2013 #5
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #36
quinnox Feb 2013 #6
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #42
xtraxritical Feb 2013 #135
Autumn Feb 2013 #7
840high Feb 2013 #13
tblue Feb 2013 #134
bigwillq Feb 2013 #17
Plucketeer Feb 2013 #118
magic59 Feb 2013 #8
Jamaal510 Feb 2013 #9
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #37
Sirveri Feb 2013 #76
tblue Feb 2013 #132
otohara Feb 2013 #92
milwaukeelib33 Feb 2013 #10
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #41
leftstreet Feb 2013 #11
forestpath Feb 2013 #15
Puzzledtraveller Feb 2013 #40
Doctor_J Feb 2013 #12
dionysus Feb 2013 #23
Tarheel_Dem Feb 2013 #131
Number23 Feb 2013 #143
Tarheel_Dem Feb 2013 #149
Number23 Feb 2013 #154
Number23 Feb 2013 #156
Tarheel_Dem Feb 2013 #159
Number23 Feb 2013 #162
Tarheel_Dem Feb 2013 #164
dionysus Feb 2013 #160
Tarheel_Dem Feb 2013 #165
dionysus Feb 2013 #171
Tarheel_Dem Feb 2013 #172
woo me with science Feb 2013 #28
Lizzie Poppet Feb 2013 #52
Beacool Feb 2013 #69
woo me with science Feb 2013 #70
OnyxCollie Feb 2013 #84
FredStembottom Feb 2013 #101
leftstreet Feb 2013 #110
KoKo Feb 2013 #120
tpsbmam Feb 2013 #129
bvar22 Feb 2013 #138
woo me with science Feb 2013 #157
bvar22 Feb 2013 #136
Catherina Feb 2013 #137
840high Feb 2013 #153
iamthebandfanman Feb 2013 #82
tpsbmam Feb 2013 #128
dsc Feb 2013 #14
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #38
freshwest Feb 2013 #72
EC Feb 2013 #16
AsahinaKimi Feb 2013 #20
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #45
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #43
DrewFlorida Feb 2013 #18
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #44
DrewFlorida Feb 2013 #60
riverbendviewgal Feb 2013 #19
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #46
Ian Iam Feb 2013 #21
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #48
dionysus Feb 2013 #22
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #49
juajen Feb 2013 #90
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #98
Starry Messenger Feb 2013 #24
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #50
Starry Messenger Feb 2013 #67
RainDog Feb 2013 #25
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #93
Cleita Feb 2013 #26
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #95
Whisp Feb 2013 #27
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #124
graham4anything Feb 2013 #29
madokie Feb 2013 #30
Politicub Feb 2013 #31
ismnotwasm Feb 2013 #32
sulphurdunn Feb 2013 #33
Boomerproud Feb 2013 #54
sulphurdunn Feb 2013 #62
Cha Feb 2013 #63
sulphurdunn Feb 2013 #77
MineralMan Feb 2013 #111
sulphurdunn Feb 2013 #146
JoePhilly Feb 2013 #39
Vattel Feb 2013 #47
AgingAmerican Feb 2013 #79
still_one Feb 2013 #51
JaneyVee Feb 2013 #53
madrchsod Feb 2013 #55
still_one Feb 2013 #56
alarimer Feb 2013 #61
Cha Feb 2013 #66
Son of Gob Feb 2013 #74
jazzimov Feb 2013 #64
WillyT Feb 2013 #65
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #100
Cha Feb 2013 #68
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #113
sheshe2 Feb 2013 #71
Rowdyboy Feb 2013 #73
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #127
Number23 Feb 2013 #145
ellisonz Feb 2013 #75
rivegauche Feb 2013 #80
Cracklin Charlie Feb 2013 #81
zentrum Feb 2013 #83
kudzu22 Feb 2013 #139
Coolest Ranger Feb 2013 #85
MineralMan Feb 2013 #86
zipplewrath Feb 2013 #97
MineralMan Feb 2013 #99
zipplewrath Feb 2013 #102
MineralMan Feb 2013 #104
zipplewrath Feb 2013 #105
MineralMan Feb 2013 #106
zipplewrath Feb 2013 #107
MineralMan Feb 2013 #116
zipplewrath Feb 2013 #117
David Zephyr Feb 2013 #112
MineralMan Feb 2013 #114
Lydia Leftcoast Feb 2013 #87
libodem Feb 2013 #88
RedstDem Feb 2013 #89
S.A.M Feb 2013 #91
Zorra Feb 2013 #94
ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #125
Zorra Feb 2013 #166
zipplewrath Feb 2013 #96
maddiemom Feb 2013 #121
maddiemom Feb 2013 #123
zipplewrath Feb 2013 #130
bvar22 Feb 2013 #141
Art_from_Ark Feb 2013 #158
maddiemom Feb 2013 #169
joeybee12 Feb 2013 #108
hue Feb 2013 #109
rhett o rick Feb 2013 #115
grantcart Feb 2013 #119
Greybnk48 Feb 2013 #122
ScreamingMeemie Feb 2013 #126
dembat Feb 2013 #133
Catherina Feb 2013 #140
OldDem2012 Feb 2013 #142
Number23 Feb 2013 #144
graham4anything Feb 2013 #151
apocalypsehow Feb 2013 #147
kentuck Feb 2013 #148
Loge23 Feb 2013 #152
Scurrilous Feb 2013 #150
YoungDemCA Feb 2013 #155
Yavin4 Feb 2013 #161
blackspade Feb 2013 #163
hopemountain Feb 2013 #167
Yavin4 Feb 2013 #170

Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 05:38 PM

1. I agree!I cast my first vote in 1954.

Work hard for JFK THOUGHT HE WAS GREAT. Clinton was very good also, but President Obama has my vote as being the best, & yes, history will say one of the greatest!

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Response to watercolors (Reply #1)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:40 PM

34. 1954!!!

Thanks for all your years of pushing and pulling and staying at it. Proud to know you.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 05:57 PM

2. Asuming continued upward trajectory of the economy through his second term...

...I think he has a very solid shot at eventually ending up cracking the top 10 in the all time presidents ranking. (Not by a lot... but #10 or even 9 seems doable. 8 might be a stretch...)

And yes, definitely top president in a long while.

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Response to gcomeau (Reply #2)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:43 PM

35. Who are your top ten now?

My top three are (in order):

1.) Abraham Lincoln
2.) Franklin Roosevelt
3.) Thomas Jefferson

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Response to David Zephyr (Reply #35)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 10:48 AM

78. I was actually referring to the aggregate on those periodic historian surveys...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_rankings_of_Presidents_of_the_United_States

But I'm generally in line with those figures, with a few notable exceptions (Reagan should not be as high as he is for example, and I would agree Jefferson belongs just above Washington not just below...)

On those rankings Dwight Eisenhower is currently 10... I can see a solid argument for Obama outranking him if the economy keeps improving through the next four years and we come out of his second term with him having passed health care reform, rebuilt the economy from the worst economic disaster since the Great Depression, gotten out of Iraq and, by then, Afghanistan, taken out Bin Laden, ended DADT, continued shrinking the *massive* deficit that got dumped on him... and all that leaving aside the whole first non white president detail and what accomplishing that took.

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Response to gcomeau (Reply #2)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:50 PM

103. Assuming we don't get another war.

LBJ was a very good President in many ways, if it hadn't been for Vietnam, a great President.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)


Response to KoKo (Reply #3)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:39 PM

57. You couldn't disagree more, so who is the best in your lifetime?

Which President in your lifetime was better than President Obama?

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Response to KoKo (Reply #3)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:47 PM

58. I have trouble cheering another face on Rushmore

because it's a thumb in the eye to the Sioux...but the first black President should be right there beside Lincoln.

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Response to demwing (Reply #58)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:54 PM

59. Fantastic avatar!

demwing, I like your post! Every word.

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Response to demwing (Reply #58)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 03:01 AM

168. please, no more presidents on rushmore

agreed.

yet, certainly, president obama is the right leader for our time and i hope he is memorialized somewhere along the capitol mall.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 06:47 PM

4. .

Uh, right.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 06:48 PM

5. Nice to hear from you!

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Response to flamingdem (Reply #5)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:45 PM

36. flamingdem!

OXOX

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 06:51 PM

6. I don't feel the same, far from it, but I respect your opinion

 

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Response to quinnox (Reply #6)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:58 PM

42. And I yours.

You are a very bright bulb and I hope that President Obama proves himself to you. If so, we all win, quinnox.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #6)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:16 PM

135. I've changed my thinking on the President, not the best ever, a big bait 'n switch.

 

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 07:01 PM

7. He's interesting and a nice man, but in my opinion he is not the

best President in my lifetime. I'm not optimistic that the best is yet to come.

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Response to Autumn (Reply #7)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 07:41 PM

13. I'm in my

70's. Agree with you.

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Response to 840high (Reply #13)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 04:00 PM

134. Me too. I really couldn't care less how he's ranked.

Too much compromise and too many drones to rate him as my #1. Maybe I don't even have a #1. I don't project my beliefs and my dearest wishes on him. I just see what he does and gauge him by that, rather than rank him against other presidents. I really couldn't care less how he's ranked, as long as he does what is right and good and Constitutional.

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Response to Autumn (Reply #7)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 07:59 PM

17. Who is the best in your lifetime?

Care to share?

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Response to Autumn (Reply #7)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:51 PM

118. I'm gonna be 68 next week.

Last edited Thu Feb 7, 2013, 04:10 PM - Edit history (1)

I confess I never really took an interest in politics until the 80s. And I then voted Republican. 30 years later, I AM paying attention and consider myself a progressive. Like many other progressives, I was mesmerized by the plainly stated, yet dynamic, ideas of a daring mullato senator from Illinois.

As a kid - a kid who liked art and rhyme - I was attracted to the "I LIKE IKE!" slogan. 60 years later, I find the objective honesty of that old war horse, inspirational. He warned us to be wary of the VERY predicament we're bound up in today - that is the threat of BIG money running the show. It's because of that very situation that we have guarantees every American can BUY health insurance instead of HAVE health care.
Sure - it's fine that gays and gals can now go fight those rich folks conflicts for them. It's only right that the two gals next door will be able to receive the fringe benefits of one another. It's great that we have a shiny, new CFPB - even if it is toothless.

But when our beloved, history-making leader kept on so many of Bush's henchmen as he took to the oval office - when he HIRES (and REhires) Wall St. to REGULATE Wall St. - there's something fundamentally wrong with that. He's not respecting the wishes of we the people - he's not even listening to numerous videos of his own pre-election proclamations. It's clear that he's been bought. Nice guy - certainly smart enough - but OWNED. And not by you and me.
Technically, he does represent people - this fact thanks to the Supreme Court's supreme fuck-up. But he's not responding to you and me people. People people.


EDIT TO ADD: Listen close to this RNN video from 15:40 til the end. http://www.democraticunderground.com/101797082


Most recently...... the crazy line between insanity and sanity has made me even less enamored with our Prez. When twenty murdered kids are a "tradgedy" in Newtown, yet "collateral damage" in some distant land - collateral damage on MY behalf, no less I rest my case.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 07:06 PM

8. Wow!

 

You must be real young! Ike was far more Liberal then Obama. I liked Ike.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 07:08 PM

9. There have only been 4 presidents in my lifetime;

Bush l, Clinton, Bush ll, and Obama. I'll have to agree that Obama is the best out of my lifetime too. The reason why Clinton comes in a close 2nd is because of the Telecommunications Act and DADT. I don't think he should've adapted those policies.

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Response to Jamaal510 (Reply #9)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:48 PM

37. No more Bushes!

Bill Clinton was something else. I was a delegate at the two national conventions when he was nominated. And I honor him. He governed the nation well. But, President Obama now has the edge with me, like you. And I'm a tough critic. Nice to know you.

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Response to Jamaal510 (Reply #9)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 04:51 AM

76. DADT was seen as a step forward during that era by many folks.

Things have changed quite a lot in twenty years, we went from legal workplace discrimination against gays in the workplace, to ignoring AIDS because it was a gay problem, to allowing gays to serve in the military so long as they kept it under wraps, to allowing them to serve openly. In retrospect it seems a mistake, but not at the time. Though I'm not much older than you since I grew up under Reagan and they were talking about drafting high school students to fight Hussein during Desert Storm on the evening news. I'll hold a place in my heart for Clinton because I got my first 'real' job under him and then watched the bubble burst and everything ran away from me.

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Response to Sirveri (Reply #76)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:55 PM

132. I wish more people understood that.

Clinton's reasoning behind DADT is much misunderstood. There were witch hunts and a ban against gays serving openly, as you noted. He tried to lift the ban and stop the witch hunts. He caught such heat for first just lifting the ban, and he was bullied by military brass (including Colin Powell), to whom he deferred since he had never served in the armed forces. DADT was a step forward at the time. It was a lifting of the ban with greater protection for gay people serving. Clinton deserves credit instead of scorn on this issue.

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Response to Jamaal510 (Reply #9)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:16 PM

92. Watching Al Gore Whine About Current TV -

he had a big old signing party when Clinton signed the Tele Act. The day after he signed it, Clear Channel bought the stations I worked for and the rest is history.

I'm with you.

Pomp and circumstance ruled at the signing into law of the Telecommunications Act of 1996. Held inside the rotunda of the Library of Congress, a bill-signing first, the ceremony featured an array of bipartisan legislators praising the comprehensive package. Newly appointed Speaker of the House Newt Gingrich heralded the act as a jobs and knowledge bill. Vice President Al Gore stressed how public interest was central to the telecommunications revolution. http://www.salon.com/2001/06/28/telecom_dereg/

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 07:14 PM

10. We worked for him, time for reciprocation

He is a great, historic president. I, and countless others went to the mat to see he was elected twice. Now, I expect a truly Progressive agenda pushed.

Things I expect to happen:

- Equal opportunity in the military regardless of race, gender, and sexual preference (partially achieved)
- DOMA fully repealed (in the works)
- End of all occupation overseas. Operations and military bases ceased. Troops come home (much to be desired- GUANTANAMO)
- Due process through a court of law for all humans (drone strikes? NO!!!)
- Slashing the war department budget
- Increased funding and expansion for public schools, social programs, shared infrastructure.
- Meaningful gun control (ban and buy-back programs for semi-automatic assault rifles)
- Monetary repercussions for states that refuse to implement the ACA
- Taxes on carbon to protect the environment (no Keystone XL pipe, no drilling on public land, carbon credit exchange)
- Support workers!!! Unions are under assault and it's time for the President to put his comfortable shoes on and support unions.
- Implement a FDR-style WPA to address unemployment and infrastructure needs. Fed Govt run and direct employer.
- Impose tariffs/trade restrictions to help American workers

Wheew!!!!

My demand list could go on....

But, is 8 years enough time?

Well, 4 years have gone by with less than I would expect. So, better get crackin' on the final 4. Let's see what can be done. No reason to hold back anymore. My hopes remain high.

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Response to milwaukeelib33 (Reply #10)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:57 PM

41. I like your list.

Think of what he faced the day he was sworn into office. Think of all he accomplished without the help of Congress.

I like your list. And I like your hope!

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 07:19 PM

11. Meh. He's not really a president, he's more like a CEO

How anyone could possibly compare/contrast him to JFK (or LBJ for that matter) is beyond me

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Response to leftstreet (Reply #11)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 07:46 PM

15. +1 Never thought of it that way before, will never think of him any other way again.

 

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Response to leftstreet (Reply #11)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:55 PM

40. That's what the office has become, if they aren't like that going in

they are soon after they take their seat in the oval office.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)


Response to Doctor_J (Reply #12)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:12 PM

23. your bitter tears are nectar to my soul...

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Response to dionysus (Reply #23)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:50 PM

131. Careful dion, the conspiracy tag team has arrived, and they brought friends!

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #131)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:11 PM

143. The sub-thread of half-literate hate directly below our posts truly says it all.

But the insults and hearty chuckles from the known haters on this site (who's number dwindle ever more so daily) are kicking the thread...

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Response to Number23 (Reply #143)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 07:05 PM

149. The dwindling numbers speak volumes. No one here, even the haters, believe that this is about....

drones. Drones, Soc Sec, Medicare are all proxies for Obama hate. It is, and has always been, about Obama. It doesn't matter what the topic is, whatever position Obama takes, they have to take the opposite, just on general principle.

The good news, however, is that they kept up the pressure for all of his first four years, to no avail. The Jill Stein/Roseanne/Gary Johnson/Rocky show got blown out of the water, which tells me America doesn't really give a shit what they're talking about. We're not listening to 'em, and they're even more pissed. They remind me of the gun nuts on the other side, who howl at the moon that "Obama's coming to take our guns". It's ridiculous.

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #149)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 08:32 PM

154. Well, as I said downthread there are lots of issues that I would have liked to have seen him handle

differently.

I am furious with him with the way he rolled over on Susan Rice. I am upset about the 16 year old that was killed by a drone attack, but I honestly have NO idea what this child was trying to do. What 16-year old leaves their home in the wee hours of the morning to go to Yemen to find a father which they admit they haven't seen in over 2 years? The only thing that makes sense is that he was planning on joining his father in jihad against this country. 16-year is a child only in Western cultures. In many developing countries, there are 16-year old breadwinners. The story does make me incredibly uneasy but I am waiting on more information.

The work he's done to save the economy and try to bring health care to people has endeared him to me. And his current emphasis on gun control has made me a bona fide FAN. The non-stop complainers, I honestly don't know what the hell they want or what they think their boring, knee-jerk and UN-F*CKING-ENDING complaining will do. And I have LOOOOONG since been past the point of caring.

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #149)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 08:38 PM

156. Forgot, these same folks hated Bill Clinton and always will. And he is more revered, more respected

and more beloved than ever.

You would think that if ANYTHING pointed out the utter impotence and lack of importance of the Obama/Dem establishment haters, it would be this. And yet here they are. Louder, shriller, smaller in numbers, and more impotent than ever.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #156)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 10:55 PM

159. We just had an election where 75% of Americans agree with the POTUS' use....

of drones, and a whopping 83% agree with targeted strikes of bad American actors abroad. Does anyone want to kill people? No, especially innocents. I understand your conflict re: the use of drones, but if it limits our military's exposure to attacks and loss of life, I'm all for it, with rigid oversight. I don't want any one person to be the sole arbitor of someone's guilt, but Congress gave that power, and they're the only ones who can take it away.

All that being said, I don't think the histrionics we're witnessing here do anything to further the debate, or change anyone's mind. That election I spoke of, you know the one where the Jill/Roseanne/Gary/Rocky Horror Show could barely garner 2% of the vote COMBINED? They were written off as nutjobs, and quite rightly so. What we're seeing is just a continuation of that lost battle, and a whole bunch of sour grapes.

I mean, didn't we know about the drone program on election day? Didn't we already know about the "kill list"? The answer is, of course, YES. And we gave this president a resounding & uncontested victory over his opponents.

Haters gonna hate! It's one of the primary symptoms of ODS.

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #159)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 11:38 PM

162. Not only 75% of Americans agree with the use of drones, 77% of LIBERAL DEMS do as well

'Liberals Love Drones Too' http://www.salon.com/2013/02/07/liberals_love_drones_too/

Which is why I when I read all of this bitter idiocy, the "Obama is no better than Bush" and "this goes against the Constitution" and other assorted foolishness, it really makes me wonder about the people that dwell like pigeons in a bell tower throughout DU-GD.

WHO ARE THESE PEOPLE?!!??! And when will they come to realize they don't even represent a majority of the fringe??

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Response to Number23 (Reply #162)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 12:39 AM

164. "they don't even represent a majority of the fringe??"



We've reached Alex Jones territory here. One side screaming that Obama's gonna take your guns away, and the other side declaring he's gonna drop a drone in downtown Kansas City.
And both sides screaming he's either trying to make Grandma eat catfood, or kill her off with healthcare reform.


Is there any wonder why the modern day liberal fringe is so ineffective? People think they're as nuts as the baggers, and unfortunately, the media tends to group "the left" into one big clump, when nothing could be further from the truth. Sadly, most of the public faces and voices of "the left" have the microphone, but thankfully they don't seem to move public opinion much, one way or the other.

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #149)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 11:06 PM

160. West\Manning 2016!!1!1





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Response to dionysus (Reply #160)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 12:41 AM

165. Not even in jest, dion! Not Even In Jest!!!!!

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Response to Tarheel_Dem (Reply #165)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 07:19 PM

171. he's comin' after ya!

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Response to dionysus (Reply #171)

Sat Feb 9, 2013, 04:08 PM

172. How about some warning, dion? Can u imagine waking up to that in the middle....

of the night? No wonder he has 3 or 4 ex wives.



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Response to Doctor_J (Reply #12)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:18 PM

28. It's quite a record, for sure,

for a very effective corporate Trojan Horse:


Corporate and bank-cozy appointments, over and over again
Bailouts and settlements for corrupt banks (with personal pressure from Obama to attorneys general to approve them),
Refusal to prosecute even huge, egregious examples of bank fraud (i.e, HSBC)
NDAA to allow indefinite detention,
"Kill lists" and claiming of the right to assassinate even American citizens without trial
Maintaining Guantanamo Bay and the Patriot Act,
Expansion of wars into several new countries
A renewed public support for the concept of preemptive war
Drone campaigns in multiple countries with whom we are not at war
Proliferation of military drones in our skies
Federal targeting of Occupy for surveillance and militarized response to peaceful protesters
Fighting all the way to the Supreme Court for warrantless surveillance
Fighting all the way to the Supreme Court for strip searches for any arrestee
Increase of media consolidation into the hands of corporate giants
Internet-censoring and privacy-violating measures like ACTA and the new CISPA-like executive order
Support for corporate groping and naked scanning of Americans seeking to travel
A new, massive spy center for warrantless access to Americans' phone calls, emails, and internet use
Support of legislation to legalize such spying
Militarized police departments, through federal grants
Marijuana users and medical marijuana clinics under assault,
Skyrocketing of the budget for prisons.
Supporting a bipartisan vote in Congress to gut more financial regulations.
Passionate speeches and press conferences promoting austerity for Americans, while the
Bush tax cuts were extended for billionaires.
Support for the payroll tax holiday, tying SS to the general fund
Support for the vicious chained CPI cut in Social Security and benefits for the disabled
Social security, Medicare, and Medicaid offered up as bargaining chips in budget negotiations, with no mention of cutting corporate welfare or the military budget
Multiple new free trade agreements, including The Trans-Pacific, otherwise known as "NAFTA on steroids."
Growth of the power of lobbyists to prevent government regulation of corporations.
Support of drilling, pipelines, and selling off portions of the Gulf of Mexico
Expansion of military support into Mali
Corporate education policy including high stakes corporate testing and closures of public schools

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #28)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:24 PM

52. Careful.

The fanboi cult is out for blood tonight.

Personally, Obama would only be my "best in my lifetime" president if I were twelve years old.

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Response to Lizzie Poppet (Reply #52)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 10:37 PM

69. Good one.

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Response to Lizzie Poppet (Reply #52)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 10:59 PM

70. They have to be out for blood tonight.

Last edited Mon Feb 11, 2013, 10:37 PM - Edit history (1)

and the out-of-the-blue adulation and superlatives are also imperative.

Yesterday we got news of perhaps the most chilling betrayal of our Constitution, our nation, and every single one of us that we have seen yet from this administration...and that is saying a lot. Our President has now claimed the right to murder any American, without need for evidence or due process. Of course DU erupted in horror. And of course the propaganda brigade had to get to work.

But look at what they are able to come up with in response.

These sorts of adulatory threads are remarkable not for the fawning line-up of concurring posts from the reliable few, but because they are so predictably empty of anything substantive. Always. Look down the posts. It's not like adoring FDR because of the New Deal, or Lincoln for holding the nation together. It's never based in any real substance at all. It can't be, because to talk about what this administration has actually *done* would blow a devastating hole into any claim to support the same values and principles as traditional Democrats.

Ask about the policies that justify this adoration, and you will get insults or anger, or perhaps the same few old standbys from years ago: Lily Ledbetter, opposition to DOMA, the (Heritage Foundation!) health insurance act. The defenders have absolutely nothing to even come *close* to counterbalancing the long, devastating. constantly expanding list of MAJOR right-wing, corporate, neocon, and police state policies that this administration has fought for and defended over the past four years. In all major policy areas....war, economics, education, energy and the environment, the drug wars, the police state....this administration has aggressively pursued policies that George Bush would be proud of.

NDAA/indefinite detention, the wars, the murderous drone campaigns in sovereign countries with which we are not at war, the deliberate targeting of children and first responders by our drones, the metastasizing surveillance state here at home, the militarization of police departments and targeting of dissent and whistleblowers, coordinated federal assaults on peaceful protesters and surveillance of Occupy, kill lists and claiming of the right to murder Americans without trial, spy centers and legislation to authorize the warrantless collection of our private information, support of internet control measures like ACTA, affirmations of pre-emptive cyber and military warfare, drilling, selling/privatizing our waters, building new pipelines, corporatizing our public schools, high stakes testing and school closures, supply-side tax policies, assaulting Social Security - first through tax policy and then by using it as a bargaining chip to get austerity budgets, support of the vicious chained CPI, advocating a raise in the Medicare age, passionate speeches promoting austerity for the people while extending the Bush tax cuts and then making most of them permanent, refusing to prosecute even blatantly corrupt bankers and twisting the arms of attorneys general for settlements, Wall Street cozy appointments including an SEC appointment directly involved in corruption, a ramped up war on marijuana while bankers go scott free, and expansion of our prison budget beyond anything we have seen in recent years.


And today was a biggie. So what can they do? Rally the troops. Make emotional bids for loyalty to Obama and to the Blue Team. There was also a thread today, out of the blue, to rally hatred for the Reds. It wasn't about any particular news item or recent event. It was simply a bid for the Two Minutes Hate. Because when a corporate-purchased/hijacked party must admit a betrayal of the people and the Constitution of the magnitude we saw today, it is imperative to the hijackers that our emotional loyalty to the Blue Team (and willingness to circle the wagons and defend *anything* it does) is fierce and reflexive and defensive enough to override our loyalty to the Constitution and the fundamental civil rights they are destroying before our eyes.




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Response to woo me with science (Reply #70)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 12:04 PM

84. +1 nt

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #70)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:45 PM

101. Applause!

Thank you, woo.

I may just copy and paste this posting of yours over and over into these ridiculous American Idol threads.

I was just sitting here thinking..... Why are the fan-club folks out in such number today?

Of course, party before constitution!

(I still think many are organized obfuscators. It's the only thing I can think that explains the spamming of this board with such cognitive dissonance)

On edit: The president ticks upward in my estimation every once in awhile - and I have always liked him personally. Obamacare will help my family directly, too. But As long as his admin. keeps going along with the anti-constitutional, scary , militarized police state stuff............

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #70)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:06 PM

110. +1

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #70)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:10 PM

120. +1...interesting insight...in last paragraph.

Obama urged us to "stop the namecalling" in his inauguration speech and yet there is post after post here posting RW stuff for no reason than to whip up hatred to point the finger "over there." Why do it when Obama said not to...unless what you say...which was interesting insight. Considering that Obama won...why post crap from the RW when we already heard enough during the almost two year primary unless it's to distract Progressive Democrats from their own issues that we hope that our second term elected Democratic President, whom we voted for, will listen to?

Quote from you:

"And today was a biggie. So what can they do? Rally the troops. Make emotional bids for loyalty to Obama and to the Blue Team. There was also a thread today, out of the blue, to rally hatred for the Reds. It wasn't about any particular news item or recent event. It was simply a bid for the Two Minutes Hate. Because when a corporate-purchased/hijacked party must admit a betrayal of the people and the Constitution of the magnitude we saw today, it is imperative to the hijackers that our emotional loyalty to the Blue Team (and willingness to circle the wagons and defend *anything* it does) is fierce and reflexive and defensive enough to override our loyalty to the Constitution and the fundamental civil rights they are destroying before our eyes."

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #70)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:39 PM

129. I'm thoroughly disgusted at the jury's hiding Doctor_J's post

WTF kind of censorship is that? It's bad enough that it was alerted but to have 4 DUers agreeing to hide that post is revolting.

Pure, unbridled censorship of a disagreeing opinion. Disgusting.

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Response to tpsbmam (Reply #129)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:22 PM

138. I am too.

That was uncalled for.
There was no ToS violation.

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Response to tpsbmam (Reply #129)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 09:49 PM

157. I was appalled by that, too.


Shameful for DU.

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #70)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:19 PM

136. !!!

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #70)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:21 PM

137. Rec'd n/t

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #70)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 07:57 PM

153. Rec.

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #28)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 11:31 AM

82. i thought congress

was keeping gitmo open?
i dont think there have been any 'new' detainees at gitmo since obama has been in office..

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Response to woo me with science (Reply #28)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:31 PM

128. wmws......you get my awesome post of the day award.....

and my thanks for laying it all out so well. ITA and my K&R goes to you!

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 07:45 PM

14. I don't think we can put anyone on Rushmore

too unstable. Probably a good thing, given that to get FDR we would have ended up with Reagan which would make me vomit.

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Response to dsc (Reply #14)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:52 PM

38. Mt. Rushmore can easily handle President Obama: He's really skinny.

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Response to David Zephyr (Reply #38)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 12:24 AM

72. Agree with that and your OP. I've been telling people BO is the best in my lifetime for a while now.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 07:57 PM

16. Totally agree.

Was just telling my daughter last week-end he should be on MT. Rushmore. Right next to Lincoln.

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Response to EC (Reply #16)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:10 PM

20. I also agree.

It seems a shame to only have him for just four more years. But I am sure the job is hectic as hell, and 8 years is certainly enough strain on one persons body.

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Response to AsahinaKimi (Reply #20)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:05 PM

45. I am beginning to believe that America has tipped...

finally to where the GOP as it is constituted is doomed. Every Democrat since Roosevelt made the country better.

I have lived long enough to finally see the demograhics in America change enough to where Democrats may have a long reign. And thereby, the People have more voice. Let's hope so.

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Response to EC (Reply #16)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:00 PM

43. Your daughter is a lucky girl.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:05 PM

18. My sentiments exactly, I am proud to call Obama my President!

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Response to DrewFlorida (Reply #18)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:01 PM

44. Great avatar.

DrewFlorida, Lincoln is my all-time favorite President. The real deal.

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Response to David Zephyr (Reply #44)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:54 PM

60. Mine too, but Obama is the first President in my lifetime who I have full faith and trust.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:10 PM

19. I agree

The best he is. I would love to see his face carved on my. Rushmore.

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Response to riverbendviewgal (Reply #19)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:06 PM

46. Indeed.

With his great beaming smile!!!

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:10 PM

21. Even greater than Reagan???

 


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Response to Ian Iam (Reply #21)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:08 PM

48. Ha!

You are funny. "Even greater than Reagan???" Imagine that!

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:11 PM

22. long time no see bud!

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Response to dionysus (Reply #22)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:08 PM

49. dionysus, you rule!

Love the Garcia, too.

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Response to David Zephyr (Reply #49)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:04 PM

90. Great to see you on here, David

Obama is such a natural. He is a great President, IMHO. I read more than I post, also.

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Response to juajen (Reply #90)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:38 PM

98. I really like your avatar, juajen.

The Arab Spring didn't just happen in a vaccum. President Obama and Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton nurtured that and helped it without the bravura and chest thumping of the Bush/Cheney days. These two brought respect world-wide back to our country when there was so little left.

And President Obama is now going to deliver Immigration Reform and bring 11+ million Americans (yes, they are Americans in my eyes) out of the shadows and into the bright sunshine of the nation they love so much they sacrificed it all to be here.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:14 PM

24. Nice to see you, David.

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Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #24)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:10 PM

50. I'll always adore you.

You have such a big heart and such a high sense of justice and fairness, so I must embarrass you here about it. Big brain and big heart. OXOX

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Response to David Zephyr (Reply #50)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 10:16 PM

67. Now I'm crying.

You are the biggest sweetie ever and you made my night. There aren't enough David Zephyrs in the world and I'll always hold a place in my heart for you, friend. xo

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:15 PM

25. k&r n/t

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Response to RainDog (Reply #25)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:29 PM

93. Thanks, RainDog.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:17 PM

26. I remember FDR. That's how old I am and I wish

President Obama would use him more as a role model than Lincoln.

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Response to Cleita (Reply #26)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:34 PM

95. FDR is a great role model.

President Obama walked into the White House with the worst economic collapse since the Great Depression and two unfunded wars...and a spiteful, vicious Republican Party that never gave him a moment's respite.

He rose to those challenges with very little help or appreciation. I do like his humility and quiet approach to governing. And I place FDR as America's second best President, only behind Lincoln.

I agree that FDR makes a great role model.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:18 PM

27. yes

There was no other like him and there may not be again.

I haven't lost faith in him for all this time because he is, like you say, a good man and I am fully confident that the difficult decisions he must make every day, is done by a good man.

He is an extraordinary person, unbelievably jammed packed with the most fantastic qualities a person can have.

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Response to Whisp (Reply #27)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:24 PM

124. I'm standing with him because I know the crowd that won't.

Thank you.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:21 PM

29. I currently put him at #4 alltime, after Lincoln/FDR/LBJ and right before Carter.

 

and the best is yet to come.

I also believe he will be nominated to the US Supreme Court in 2018, and that Michelle will run for senate in Illinois, then President in 2024.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:22 PM

30. I agree

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:25 PM

31. Easy to k&r!

And thumbs up on Mount Rushmore!

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:26 PM

32. Nice

k&R

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:38 PM

33. The last President

who wasn't a front man for capitalism was probably JFK, which is ironic and may explain why he met an untimely end. Obama is just a Third Way, Blue Dog corporatist who has barely even begun selling out the progressive movement. Brace yourselves folks.

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Response to sulphurdunn (Reply #33)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:29 PM

54. You have many examples to bolster your argument, that is true

I pray that he has his own epithany. I see a different man since the election (a better, clearer mindset) and I believe he is going to follow his own instincts from now on-he certainly hasn't been well-served by his advisors.

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Response to Boomerproud (Reply #54)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 10:00 PM

62. He picks his advisors.

He is the President. He is the one responsible for his decisions as much as you or I. His latest appointment is a former banker named Sally Jewell who specialized in making loans to oil companies before becoming CEO of REI. He nominated her as his choice for the next Secretary of the Interior, which should come as no surprise since his last Secretary was a cattle rancher. His entire cabinet and cadre of advisers remain a whos who of Wall Street personalities. Wishing he were something other than what he is will not change what he is. I wish it were otherwise.

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Response to sulphurdunn (Reply #33)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 10:13 PM

63. Your post shows how ignorant you are of President Obama's Accomplishments..

PBO has made Progress and he is Progressive.

You otoh just have talking points that don't mean anything.

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Response to Cha (Reply #63)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:57 AM

77. Please give me

a list of his accomplishments. Try to remember that insults are not arguments. That's ignorant.

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Response to sulphurdunn (Reply #77)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:07 PM

111. That list is widely available, right here on DU.

It's a long list, and growing. You might look it up. Here, it's generally referred to in a derogatory way as "The List," so you can probably find it by searching for that term. Have a good search.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #111)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:36 PM

146. So post it.

My opinion statement rebutted the opinion of the original post. I offered no evidence to support my position. The original poster said I was ignorant for not accepting his/her opinion, which he/she assumed was self-evident absent any facts to support it. Now you claim the evidence is "right here on DU". So show me. I'm certainly not going to research evidence to support your position. That's your job. I'll wait.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 08:53 PM

39. Agree.

Some Presidents get to govern in times of relative ease and peace. Obama has had no such luxury.

The mess he faced on day 1, foreign and domestic, was historic. Few President's have faced so much immediate crisis on day one.

He's been steady through out. Attacked as a domestic socialist, and foreign appeaser from the right, and attacked as a corporatist war-monger from the left ... from day 1.

And while history will find some flaws, and some missteps, those will be the exceptions, not the defining characteristics for Obama's 2 terms as President.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:07 PM

47. I'd have to go with Carter

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Response to Vattel (Reply #47)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 10:49 AM

79. Yep

Carter, Clinton, Obama, Johnson, Kennedy, Ike, Ford in that order. The others (Bushes, Reagan, Nixon) were all sociopaths and don't register. Ford is the last GOP president that gave a shit about anything.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:19 PM

51. I agree, voted since 1968

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:27 PM

53. Easily top 10 Prez of all time so far. And that top 10 list includes some exceptional company.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:29 PM

55. my lifetime? i`d say ike,then johnson.

time still has`t judged obama.

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Response to madrchsod (Reply #55)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:37 PM

56. With Medicare and civil rights good point. Those who went to Nam, maybe not

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 09:55 PM

61. Not by a long shot.

Not even a Democrat actually. Obeys no principles that I can see. The whole drone thing has blown it wide open for me. Unfortunately I voted for this POS twice and I really regret it.

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Response to alarimer (Reply #61)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 10:15 PM

66. Yeah, you should have voted for John McCain and Mitt Romney.

President Obama is an Excellent President.

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Response to alarimer (Reply #61)


Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 10:14 PM

64. AGREED! Nobody is perfect

and Obama has had a lot to fight against. But I think he has been the best President in my lifetime.

On a side-note, I think Carter has been the best ex-President. At least so far!

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 10:15 PM

65. Hey David...


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Response to WillyT (Reply #65)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:42 PM

100. Hey WillyT!

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 10:30 PM

68. Bless your heart, David Z..

I'm so glad you appreciate and understand what this President means for our Country at the time in History.

Who knows if they'll make room for him and FDR on Mt Rushmore but I'm just Grateful we've had him for the last four years and four more to come.

It's going to be a bumpy ride and a lot of activism to make sure we have his back too.. like he and VP Biden have ours!
h/t she



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Response to Cha (Reply #68)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:10 PM

113. It is blessed with Cha!

I don't have to fight as many battles anymore because you are here! Go Cha!

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Wed Feb 6, 2013, 11:20 PM

71. Heart and Soul, David.

He cares for the People!

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:21 AM

73. I was born early in the first Eisenhower term. Obama is the best in my life and I expect his

2nd term to be better than his 1st.

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Response to Rowdyboy (Reply #73)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:30 PM

127. Don't mess with the Rowdyboy! He's the man!

We are close in age I think. There's no real progressive like a Southern liberal, like you, because you are on the front line. I know. I grew up there on and off as a boy.

I'm happy you see it the same as me. In the aggregate, I just have to give it up to President Obama. He's done it and is doing it. Big hug.

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Response to Rowdyboy (Reply #73)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:23 PM

145. "I expect his 2nd term to be better than his 1st." Couldn't agree more

He seems more liberated. I think he'll only get even better.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:28 AM

75. woot

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 11:15 AM

80. *APPLAUSE*!!! Great post! I agree with everything you wrote. nt

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 11:28 AM

81. I am in total agreement with your opinion.

Obama is a rock-solid man, Rushmore or no Rushmore.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 11:55 AM

83. How is he any different from Clinton?

Both are moderate Republicans in their economic policies. LBJ was disastrous and tragic on foreign policy of course, but much braver on domestic policy than O is. O is the first Democratic President to utter the words "entitlement reform" in the same sentence. He's no FDR. You won't hear O talking fearlessly against "The Economic Royalists" as FDR did. O is more likely to hire them as advisors.

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Response to zentrum (Reply #83)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:25 PM

139. Well, Clinton had a good economy

and didn't have a kill list. Think I'm leaning toward Bill these days.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 12:06 PM

85. If I could rec your post 1000 times I would.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 12:08 PM

86. Prepare for the Deluge.

You'll need your umbrella and a slicker, for sure.

K&R

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #86)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:36 PM

97. Explain why

It'd been nice if he'd tried to back it up in anyway.

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Response to zipplewrath (Reply #97)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:40 PM

99. It is the poster's opinion about the President.

You may not share it, but it is the poster's opinion. Opinions do not necessarily need to be backed up.

As I look it appears that many agree with the poster's opinion. I'm sure some agree with yours, too.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #99)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:49 PM

102. Discussion forum

None the less it is a discussion forum and it makes it a tad easier to "discuss" if one will state some reasons for their opinions. It helps avoid the silliness.

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Response to zipplewrath (Reply #102)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:54 PM

104. Yes, it is, and there has been a good deal of

discussion in the thread. Still, DU is a place where a member can post an opinion as well.

Even an unsupported one.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #104)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:59 PM

105. Yes one can

One can post opinions. My comment was meant more about your posting and the "deluge". One CAN avoid some of it by actually posting some substance and content. Not all of course but if it is ones attempt to "avoid the deluge", content and substance can help alot.

Of course if one's intent is merely to CREATE the deluge.....

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Response to zipplewrath (Reply #105)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:02 PM

106. I believe you may be overanalyzing here.

Clearly, the post would generate a good deal of comment. That was the reason for my post. Nothing more than that.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #106)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:03 PM

107. And mine was "why"

Yes, clearly it woud generate a good deal of comment. My post was about why, and how it might be avoided. I get the sense that both of you didn't actually want to avoid it.

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Response to zipplewrath (Reply #107)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:21 PM

116. Do you get that "sense?"

In fact, I posted only one thing in this thread until you replied to it.

Why would the OP want to prevent comment? He wanted to state an opinion about President Obama. Almost 100 DU Recs later, the comment still stands at the top of the thread. Sometimes a guy just wants to post something positive about President Obama. I've done it, and so have many others. Sometimes a guy wants to post something negative about him. Many have done that, as well.

Since the post was just an opinion, I didn't see a lot of reason to join a discussion about that opinion. I share it, pretty much. So, I clicked the DU Rec button and posted my anticipation of some interesting replies. Does that form some sort of connection between me and the OP? Nope. I recognize the screen name, and have generally positive feelings about his past posts, although I doubt I could describe any of them without a search.

I have different feelings about other DUers, not so positive ones. That comes with the territory of a political discussion forum, since agreement isn't a requirement of membership.

I'm replying to you, because you replied to my short post. Now I will stop doing that. I have other things to do today. I don't see continuing this further as of any value to me.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #116)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:51 PM

117. It's not about comment

Why would the OP want to prevent comment?

It's about "deluge".

One can avoid what you described as "deluge" by posting some substance and content. That doesn't prevent comment, but it does help avoid the silliness of the "deluge".

Almost 100 DU Recs later, the comment still stands at the top of the thread.

And deluge is a great way to achieve that, which is what I sense was the larger purpose here, not discussion.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #86)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:09 PM

112. There's my guy!

Never stop posting. My eyesight is not so good anymore, so I can't spend a lot of time at monitors, but just a note here to tell you that I admire you and your tenacity and mind.

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Response to David Zephyr (Reply #112)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:10 PM

114. Wow! Thanks for that.

Don't worry 'bout me, though. I'll be here. Writing is what I do, and DU is where I'm doing it whenever I'm not being paid to do it. So, I'll be here, posting away. I'm sorry your vision is keeping you from posting as much, but I've always enjoyed your posts.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 12:11 PM

87. Sorry, David, I know people who have met him, and they say he's terrific in person, BUT...

No definition of "greatness" that I know about includes compromising from a position of weakness.

You're saying that he's "the greatest president in your lifetime," but you're offering NO supporting evidence. My college expository writing teacher would give you an F for that essay.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 12:34 PM

88. I love the guy

He has a tightrope to walk. The 'Military Industrial Complex' is alive and well and opperating in Washington DC. I think that an agenda has been set which even the POTUS has no control. He has to go along to get along.

That includes those Gawd awful prayer breakfasts, he has to go to. He is amazing.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 12:43 PM

89. I was born in 64

so my age rules out Kennedy, but I just can't agree with you..yet

luckily there's still time.

And sadly I must admit, I voted for Obama twice, once because mccain was just to damn hostile, and romney too damn...uh..um..all that sucks in the world!!



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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:07 PM

91. You may realize it now

but most historians wouldn't delare him the one of the best presidents in about 40 years

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:34 PM

94. Let's see...Nixon, Ford, Reagan, Bush, and Bush.

Obama may turn out to be the best President of my lifetime also, but that's no reason to paint a giant mural of him on the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel.

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Response to Zorra (Reply #94)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:26 PM

125. Were you in a coma when Carter was president?

...or having an out of body experience?

I'm just teasing...

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Response to ScreamingMeemie (Reply #125)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 02:47 AM

166. LOL ~ yeh, back then I was having more than a few

out of body experiences, but not enough of them to completely miss the Carter Presidency.

I thought President Carter was a good Prez, and I think if he had gotten a second term, this country would be much more evolved and on a much better course.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 01:35 PM

96. Hmmmm

Better than John Kennedy?

Yes, but Kennedy wasn't all that "good". Most of what people think about him tends to actually post date him. Unfair I know, but he started with the Bay of Pigs and finished with Vietnam. Amongst many in the Civil Rights movement, especially Ralph Abernathy, Kennedy wasn't all that impressive. And it was Bobby that was the brains behind the Cuban Missile Crisis. I still lament the loss of Bobby. I always like to believe he'd a been a great president.

Better than Lyndon Johnson?

Poor ole LBJ. He'd be the modern FDR if he'd just avoided 'Nam. Obama really can't hold a candle to his accomplishments, although he's managed to avoid the same scale of failures.

Better than Jimmy Carter?

Hard really to compare. One termer versus a two termer. I was no big Carter fan at all, but he was right about alot of things, even if he didn't seem to be able to actually do anything about them. His big accomplishment was the Peace Accords. The real affect of those is only now being realized.

Better than Bill Clinton? Yes.

'Bout the same really. Obama is the third and fourth term of the Clinton Admin. Spent the first term undoing some of it as well, including banking reform, DADT, and potentially DOMA. NAFTA is still hanging out there, as well as welfare "reform". Strangley, Obama got the Health Insurance Federalization passed that Clinton rejected. And Clinton managed to actually bring terrorists to trial, in international and US courts.

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Response to zipplewrath (Reply #96)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:16 PM

121. LBJ knew how to handle Congress and made good use of the Bully Pulpit

and sense of loss and outrage over JFK. Perhaps unfortunately, he also knew when to make an exit.

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Response to maddiemom (Reply #121)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:23 PM

123. Oh, and I'd love to have seen Lyndon take care of Mitch McConnell and the like

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Response to maddiemom (Reply #123)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:42 PM

130. I know what you mean

Admittedly it was a different time, but one does wonder what a skilled leader like LBJ could still accomplish with the current congress.

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Response to maddiemom (Reply #123)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:31 PM

141. He wouldn't have had to "take care of" Mitch McConnel.

He would have only had to "take care of" Joe Lieberman and and a couple of scumbag Blue Dog DEMOCRATS,
and he WOULD have done so quickly.

Can you IMAGINE Joe Lieberman standing up and telling LBJ,
NO! I'm NOT going to vote for Medicare?
LOL.
We would STILL be finding little pieces of Lieberman's ass from Texas to Connecticut!




Read Up on "The Johnson Treatment".
http://thejohnsonpost.blogspot.com/2009/08/johnson-treatment.html

"Johnson was the catalyst, the cajoler in chief. History records him as the nation's greatest legislative politician. In a great piece on the Daily Beast website, LBJ aide Tom Johnson, writes about how his old boss would have gotten a health care reform bill through the current congress. It's worth reading to understand the full impact of the "Johnson treatment" and how effective LBJ could be in winning votes for his legislation."

http://thejohnsonpost.blogspot.com/2009/08/johnson-treatment.html




The American People gave President Obama everything he needed to do what he promised during Campaign 2008.

White House support for Blanche Lincoln

"The Arkansas primary fight illuminates some unpleasant though vital truths about the Democratic establishment "
"So what did the Democratic Party establishment do when a Senator who allegedly impedes their agenda faced a primary challenger who would be more supportive of that agenda? They engaged in full-scale efforts to support Blanche Lincoln. Bill Clinton traveled to Arkansas to urge loyal Democrats to vote for her, bashing liberal groups for good measure. Obama recorded an ad for Lincoln which, among other things, were used to tell African-American primary voters that they should vote for her because she works for their interests. The entire Party infrastructure lent its support and resources to Lincoln — a Senator who supposedly prevents Democrats from doing all sorts of Wonderful, Progressive Things which they so wish they could do but just don’t have the votes for.

<snip>

What happened in this race also gives the lie to the insufferable excuse we’ve been hearing for the last 18 months from countless Obama defenders: namely, if the Senate doesn’t have 60 votes to pass good legislation, it’s not Obama’s fault because he has no leverage over these conservative Senators. It was always obvious what an absurd joke that claim was; the very idea of The Impotent, Helpless President, presiding over a vast government and party apparatus, was laughable. But now, in light of Arkansas, nobody should ever be willing to utter that again with a straight face. Back when Lincoln was threatening to filibuster health care if it included a public option, the White House could obviously have said to her: if you don’t support a public option, not only will we not support your re-election bid, but we’ll support a primary challenger against you. Obama’s support for Lincoln did not merely help; it was arguably decisive, as The Washington Post documented today:"

<much more>

http://www.salon.com/2010/06/10/lincoln_6/

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #141)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 09:58 PM

158. I'm not sure that Obama's support for Blanche Lincoln was decisive

since Bill Clinton had also campaigned for Lincoln in her primary race against Bill Halter. At any rate, it certainly didn't help her in the general election, where she earned the dubious distinction of being the *only* incumbent Democratic US Senator from Arkansas since Reconstruction to get an ass-whooping from a Republican challenger.

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #141)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:15 AM

169. Thanks! Great illustrative pictures. And you're right. If he'd handled "Dems"

like Lieberman in the first place...

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:04 PM

108. Best Republican President in my lifetime...

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:05 PM

109. Yes I completely agree! Everything considered (it's a different world today) He is the best!

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 02:18 PM

115. I will agree on social issues and give some credit on economic issues but

he rates a 'D' in the area of human rights. His continuation of the Bush policies on the Patriot Act, domestic spying, indefinite detention and now killer drones, have made the neocons ecstatic. Bolton is all over killer drones.

If a Democratic president wont back these issues back to reason, the Repukes sure wont. These clear assaults on our liberties is scary.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:00 PM

119. couldn't agree more. good to see you around again.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:17 PM

122. I'm with you David! n/t

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:27 PM

126. Jimmy Carter, hands down...

When I think of what could have been...

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 03:55 PM

133. President Obama is the best President of my Lifetime

I TOTALLY AGREE.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:29 PM

140. David, we've laughed together, we've cried together

but on this we part and it breaks my heart. I wish you well but I can only shake my head in sadness.

We haven't won back a thing. The banks got more money, criminals are still heading government agencies, more people are being killed in wars, we're still destabilizing Central and South America with our latest target being Bolivia, still destabilizing the Middle East, we're embarking on a war on Africa that will last decades in Cameron's own words and that's just the tip of off my the top of my angry head right now.

We've lost even more.

There's no way on earth I can be proud. If anything, I'm ashamed that the first Black President will go down in history as being on the side of the military industrial complex, the bankers, the corporations instead of being on the side of the homeless, the hungry and the terrorized.

I still love but not for this.



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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 05:46 PM

142. Agreed. And I've watched them all since JFK....

But, you and I both know that there is a segment of DUers who will NEVER be happy with ANY President no matter how well he or she performs. There is simply no pleasing them.


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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:19 PM

144. K&R I llike him alot, though I have to admit to loving Michelle more

There are many things I would prefer he'd have done differently. But overall, I am so incredibly proud of this president. And the fact that so many minorities, women, poor people ALL OVER THE WORLD have his back in such strong inescapable numbers makes me know that I am on the right side. I have lived and worked in enough places and made enough friends in enough cultures to know this for a fact.

He will be revered for many, many moons to come. I seriously doubt if the same things will be said about his incessant detractors.

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Response to Number23 (Reply #144)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 07:50 PM

151. Michelle46 in 2024 and 2028 after Hillary45 in 2016 and 2020.

 

Senate in 2018.
Possbily being VP n 2020
President 2024.

for the continuation of the Obama agenda

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:37 PM

147. Well said: I agree entirely.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 06:51 PM

148. It may be a little premature to make that pronouncement but...

I would agree that he inherited an awful mess and we have been able to recover with a minimal amount of pain, as a whole.

He has done a lot of good things but there are some areas where I disagree with his policies. I think the healthcare reform may turn out to be his major achievement? I thought it was a major payoff to the insurance companies but I may have been wrong?

Also, I think the massive payoffs to the big banks and Wall Street could have been better spent on the people or programs to help people. I think it gave those with the power even more leverage over working people and those without any leverage.

It is difficult to argue with the demise of Osama Bin Laden but I personally cannot defend the continued attacks, mostly with drones, into Pakistan or the expansion of our power into Africa. And I'm not sure that we have stopped the torture techniques that were initiated under the Bush Administration? We do know that Guantanamo is still in operation.

Both jobs and the stock market have recovered very nicely, under the circumstances. Many peoples' savings have been restored with the recovery of Wall Street.

Overall, I would say he has done a very good job in most areas.

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Response to kentuck (Reply #148)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 07:53 PM

152. +1

Well put - I would add that the ridiculously insane drug war still drags on as well with marijuana still inexplicably a Schedule 1 drug.
I am pleased with the President's vocal stand on civil rights for all Americans.
As noted above, hangover from the unfortunately named Patriot Act is still strongly present.
..and I agree with your assessment of the AHCA.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 07:42 PM

150. K & R

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 08:35 PM

155. Considering there have been only three other Presidents in my lifetime....

(Clinton and both George Bushes), that's really not saying much in my case.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Thu Feb 7, 2013, 11:36 PM

161. K&R

Recommended for truth.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 12:03 AM

163. Carter was best in my opinion.

After Obama's first term.
I'm waiting for Obama to 'wow' me.

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 02:57 AM

167. yes, he is the right man for the times

i shudder to think .....uh, no, not going there....

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Response to David Zephyr (Original post)

Fri Feb 8, 2013, 10:22 AM

170. K&R

All day. Every day.

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