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Thu Jan 31, 2013, 12:28 PM

Why Are Feminists So Angry?

. . .

Itís not that Iím angry. Iím exhausted. The war on reproductive health and autonomy feels absolutely never-ending. In 2011, there was a record number of anti-choice laws enacted across the states and in 2012, we saw more than forty new state laws restricting womenís access to abortion.

The restrictions ranged from TRAP laws and ultrasound mandates to waiting periods and mandatory counselingóall of which end up hurting the most marginalized women in the US by making legal medical care more costly and harder to get. So while Iím thrilled that weíre celebrating Roeís fortieth anniversaryóif women canít access abortion, then itís not really legal for all of us.

If the Hyde Amendment still exists, then Roe doesnít mean anything for the woman who canít afford care. And if one woman in Texas canít get the care she needs, then Roe isnít fulfilling its promise.

Iím exhausted thinking about the fact that Iím still fighting a battle that my mother marched for. That so many years later, weíre working so hard to hold onto the rights we already have, that creating a proactiveórather than defensiveóagenda seems like a pie-in-the-sky dream.

So itís not that Iím angry. Itís that Iím shocked. Shocked at the extreme lengths some legislators will go to to limit womenís reproductive freedom.


MORE...

http://www.thenation.com/blog/172524/why-are-feminists-so-angry#

_ _ _ _ _ _ _

Funny thing, it seems disempowerment and abuse breeds anger. And anyone who does not support white male land owner privilege & women as property is labeled ďtoo angryĒ: http://www.sevenbowie.com/2012/12/too-angry-for-what/

46 replies, 2794 views

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Arrow 46 replies Author Time Post
Reply Why Are Feminists So Angry? (Original post)
ProfessionalLeftist Jan 2013 OP
JaneyVee Jan 2013 #1
Taverner Jan 2013 #33
geek tragedy Jan 2013 #2
Hatchling Jan 2013 #4
seabeyond Jan 2013 #13
HangOnKids Jan 2013 #15
redstatebluegirl Jan 2013 #3
quinnox Jan 2013 #5
redqueen Jan 2013 #6
redqueen Jan 2013 #7
quinnox Jan 2013 #10
FSogol Jan 2013 #8
seabeyond Jan 2013 #14
quinnox Jan 2013 #16
seabeyond Jan 2013 #19
quinnox Jan 2013 #21
Sheldon Cooper Jan 2013 #17
quinnox Jan 2013 #20
Sheldon Cooper Jan 2013 #24
quinnox Jan 2013 #25
Sheldon Cooper Jan 2013 #29
seabeyond Jan 2013 #36
smirkymonkey Jan 2013 #41
seabeyond Jan 2013 #43
redqueen Jan 2013 #27
gollygee Jan 2013 #22
ananda Jan 2013 #9
smirkymonkey Jan 2013 #11
libodem Jan 2013 #12
jeff47 Jan 2013 #18
seabeyond Jan 2013 #23
demwing Jan 2013 #26
rjj621 Jan 2013 #28
gollygee Jan 2013 #30
jeff47 Jan 2013 #37
gollygee Jan 2013 #38
jeff47 Jan 2013 #42
Sheldon Cooper Jan 2013 #31
seabeyond Jan 2013 #39
patrice Jan 2013 #32
Taverner Jan 2013 #34
ProfessionalLeftist Jan 2013 #40
Fight2Win Jan 2013 #35
smirkymonkey Feb 2013 #44
CrispyQ Feb 2013 #45
ProfessionalLeftist Feb 2013 #46

Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 12:32 PM

1. Because we've been fighting an endless war on rights perpetuated by fundamentalists who just can't

seem to mind their own business.

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Response to JaneyVee (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:41 PM

33. +1000

 

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Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 12:33 PM

2. The real question is how do feminists avoid being pissed off 24/7. nt

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 12:46 PM

4. We do sleep sometimes.

so it's not actually 24/7. More like 16/7.

But yeah, it's hard not to be pissed off a lot.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 01:54 PM

13. two decades ago i asked exactly that question to one of my black friends, living in the area we do.

something had happened yet again....

i asked her, why arent you pissed 24/7. i would be.

back then, it looked like women and society as a whole was progressing nicely. we hadnt had the start of the backlash yet.

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Response to geek tragedy (Reply #2)


Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 12:45 PM

3. Those of us who marched with Gloria steinem

thought the worse was over and then this new Republican party came around trying to put us back to 1950. It is mind blowing!!!!!

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Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 12:50 PM

5. well, we know what the politically incorrect reasons

 

would be, the stereotypes painted are not flattering.

As to what I think, I don't know for sure why some feminists seem uptight and humorless and word-policey with a strong desire to control language, but it is an impression I have gotten from some of them. That said, there are some who definitely don't fit this mold, which is nice to see and refreshing when they speak up.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 12:54 PM

6. Allow me to try to explain.

All those issues you obviously consider so unimportant are the things which enable and maintain the idea held by so many that women are less than. Those ideas don't stand on their own, they are part of a pattern. And the effects manifest in a myriad of ways... loss of reproductive rights is only one.

To you, they're just words. Or jokes. But those ideas influence others.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 01:02 PM

7. Also, what do you mean by "politically incorrect reasons"? nt

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Response to redqueen (Reply #7)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 01:07 PM

10. you know, the ones that are used

 

as stereotypes of a feminists. Like they don't shave, they don't care about their appearance, so they are unattractive, they don't have a man in their life, they are full of anger for these reasons, etc etc. Everyone knows these stereotypes of a feminist, really. I think, that like all stereotypes, they are a broad brush and wrong needless to say, which is why I said what I thought and why I wasn't sure what the true reasons could be for some feminists seem to be so uptight and so on.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 01:04 PM

8. Quinnox says you all are ok as long as you don't get too uppity!

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Response to quinnox (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 01:56 PM

14. ya... cause we should really see a humor in those rape jokes or a thing to hit.

uptight and humorless b's that dont want men to call them sluts.

really quinnox? after all this time, really?

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #14)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:02 PM

16. come on sea, you are just putting words that I didn't say

 

I never said any of that, I simply said some feminists seem uptight and humorless and word policey, and that was my impression from some of them. As for you, I would say you have a good sense of humor, and so are not one of the ones I had in mind when making my observation.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #16)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:05 PM

19. ok. i appreciate the clarification. i love to laugh. that being said,

some feminists seem uptight and humorless and word policey


those three examples i gave you, rape jokes, calling a woman a b cause they do not like what is being said and "owning" slut and the male use of the word has been defended repeatedly, right here on du and it all fits in to what you say.

so, i am glad you clarified. but, surely you get why a person can interpret it as i do and not really about putting words in your mouth.

(i have laundry to get on. )

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #19)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:06 PM

21. yep, I think we understand each other

 

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Response to quinnox (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:02 PM

17. Word police?

Is someone upset because they can't call women b's and c's again? Cause that's what I think of every time anyone invokes the dreaded 'word police'.

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Response to Sheldon Cooper (Reply #17)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:05 PM

20. no, it goes way beyond that

 

trust me, you don't want to know. For a time, in the Meta forum, it was a new word discovered every week that was deemed outrage worthy and objectionable.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #20)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:09 PM

24. Well, words do have meanings.

And I try to respect a group when they say that specific words are offensive. And even if I still don't agree with them, I keep my mouth shut about it. My ego is not such that I have to fight for my right to say things that others tell me they are offended by, nor do I have to denigrate their concerns by snidely referring to them as the 'word police'.

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Response to Sheldon Cooper (Reply #24)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:18 PM

25. well, I'm obviously different than you

 

then. And that is OK. It isn't about ego, but freedom of expression. I happen to be a great believer in it. The word police title is very apt for some of the ones I have encountered, very much indeed.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #25)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:36 PM

29. But why do you feel the burning desire to have 'freedom of expression'

when you are told that something is offensive? Especially on what is billed as a liberal message board? Not being able to say offensive words on a website that should be a welcoming harbor for diversity is so far down on my list of things to be upset about. I can always just shrug, even roll my eyes, and move on to the next topic. I don't see how being scornful and denigrating to others is somehow a shining beacon for freedom of expression.

I think it really is all about ego. If I have the burning desire to express myself in offensive ways, there is always the Yahoo boards.

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Response to Sheldon Cooper (Reply #29)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:54 PM

36. my issue with people arguing freedom of speech, is they want to be able to say the offensive,

whether they feel it is funny or not, but what they do not want is others to have that freedom of expression calling them a piece of offensive shit. they demand that we are not supposed to be offended when they say something offensive. they demand that we lighten up and laugh with them when they are being demeaning or degrading to a group.

THAT is what does not make sense to me.

if a person is going to knowingly say something offensive, then at least have the guts to allow other people to think them what they do. and express it.

i have in laws that get to say whatever the fuck they want. they know they are being offensive. but... they get to say whatever.

when i do finally challenge them i get in trouble.

it is like, wait a minute. i am minding my own business. i have done nothing, to no one. you insult me. you expect me to allow you to insult me. then you demand i keep my mouth shut. and laugh. or be ok. or not take it personally.

i wasnt the one starting it. i didnt do anything.

like hell i will keep my mouth shut.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #36)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 09:06 PM

41. Thank you seabeyoud.

You make so much sense to me.

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Response to smirkymonkey (Reply #41)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 09:52 PM

43. ah ha.... to some

and not to others, lmao

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Response to Sheldon Cooper (Reply #24)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:29 PM

27. +1

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Response to quinnox (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:07 PM

22. "It's so refreshing when feminists do what men want

rather than have their own agenda."

That might be true but it isn't about you.

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Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 01:05 PM

9. Why shouldn't all of us be angry at ...

... the war on women?

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Response to ananda (Reply #9)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 01:23 PM

11. Thank YOU!

Briilliant.

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Response to ananda (Reply #9)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 01:39 PM

12. We should be

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Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:05 PM

18. Well, there's one minor consolation

The reason the anti-choice crowd has pushed through all those laws recently is that they're running out of time.

"The kids today" are far more pro-choice than their grandparents. And they're getting more and more power as they hit adulthood, while their grandparents are getting less and less as they shuffle off this mortal coil.

So the anti-choice people need to get laws passed NOW, as opposed to a decade ago where incremental progress was OK.

Doesn't mean today is pleasant, but it means that it will get better.

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Response to jeff47 (Reply #18)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:09 PM

23. good point. thank you for stating this obvious. lol, that i hadnt thought of.

very good point, and you might be right on with the aggressive attack.

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Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:27 PM

26. Are they? if so, it's probably because of misogyny

and a million other stupid things that men do to piss off and subjugate women.

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Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:33 PM

28. Many have every reason to be mad

but some want equality AND special treatment. I have a woman co-worker who is good at what she does (I'm in IT) but refuses to crawl under a desk to check cables because she wears either skirts or nice business clothes. She won't walk to one of our other locations nearby because she won't wear anything but high heels. She has a job she is good at but refuses to dress appropriately for the job demands and then refuses to take part in those responsibilities so someone else has to do it. When we correctly assume she will not be the one handling a particular issue because it will involve crawling under a desk she gets mad and assumes we didn't consider her because she's a woman. When it's pointed out that she isn't dressed for it as she has told us on many occasions she gets angry and says she can dress any way she likes because it's withing the company dress code. She wants equality but also special treatment.

Last year while going on a cruise we (girlfriend and I) were at the muster station (safety talk and location to go in the event of an emergency to get on the life boats) which is legally required for every passenger to attend. While waiting for the crew to round up passengers who didn't think they had to go people just stand around talking. My girlfriend was talking to a couple of other women around us and little chit chat about the ship, cruise, family, and jobs. It somehow turned into a discussion on equality with a fair amount of man bashing and jokes about men being dumb. I started thinking that if men shouldn't tell those jokes about women than they shouldn't tell them about men. I let it go because I thought some of the jokes were funny (I have no problem with jokes or commercials making fun of men, or anyone for that matter) and I had a few of my own I could tell anyway. Then the talk turned to the lifeboats in the event of a sinking, one of the same women who talked loudest about equality made the comment of being glad she was a woman because she gets on the boat with the kids first and all the dumb men can stay on the sinking ship. That's when I spoke up and said that she deserves equality but that also goes for the bad with the good and I expect to see her waiting in line with the rest of us for the life boats should the ship sink. I was called a sexist pig and a bastard when I said you can't demand equality and special treatment, otherwise it isn't equality to which my girlfriend agreed and then said something to the lady about being out of line by insulting me. That lady then accused my girlfriend and those like her of being part of the problem.

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Response to rjj621 (Reply #28)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:37 PM

30. Being a woman in the workforce is really tricky

If you don't wear skirts and heels, you might very well not be taken seriously at all, so you do feel a great deal of pressure to dress like that. But the clothing isn't practical, so you're limited. You're limited either way, and it's very frustrating. I don't think it's fair to call her struggles to meet the demands of the job AND the demands of living in the patriarchy "wanting special treatment."

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Response to gollygee (Reply #30)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 03:02 PM

37. Wouldn't a pantsuit work? Or blouse with slacks?

Seems to work as looking "professional" in the places I've worked.

Though to be fair, most of the employees in places I've worked were wearing jeans and t-shirts.

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Response to jeff47 (Reply #37)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 03:04 PM

38. This woman might be wearing that

He said, "Or nice business clothes." Even pantsuits get messed up more than golf clothes, like men wear. But if you wear golf shirts and khaki pants as a woman, you aren't taken seriously. You either wear impractical clothing, or you dress in a way where you don't get respect because you aren't decorative enough. It's frustrating.

Edited to add: and there might be a solution she hasn't found yet, but the issue is that he's reading this as her wanting special treatment, not her being in a tricky place. He's made an assumption that IMO is not fair.

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Response to gollygee (Reply #38)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 09:21 PM

42. We're not talking about crawling around in the mud

Worst that might happen is getting some dust on it. And a pair of khakis and a nice shirt is going to be more "decorative" than what he describes the menfolk wearing.

Not saying she isn't feeling pressure to dress up, but not being able to do her job is going to be worse than being a touch less formal.

ETA: If she had been told to "dress nice", then yes it's not fair.

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Response to rjj621 (Reply #28)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:38 PM

31. Well, in your first example, you have what is known as a management problem.

That is something that can be handled very quickly and efficiently with appropriate management. As for your second paragraph, it was long and sounded kinda whiney, frankly.

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Response to rjj621 (Reply #28)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 03:04 PM

39. the mangement should address the co worker. that simple. if she is not dressing to do her job,

then any good manager would let her know. if he.she has not, then he/she obviously has decided she is valued as an employee and that is not part of her job. that is what management is for. and to allow that kind of friction suggests it is not a good manager. not her problem. it is managements problem.

i have stood up to women who put women in their place. as a woman, i feel a responsibility to challenge this thinking always. just as i would with a man being a sexist. it is not ok in my book.

lifeboats. we have had a couple threads on this in our feminist forum. not a new argument for us. men bring it up a lot when they want to dismiss the feminists voice. i agree. those of both gender help. and those of both gender that get in the way, move over to the life boats. because it is a man does not mean he has the skills to help in an emergency situation. and the same applies to the woman. it does not mean she is not good in an emergency.

i do not know if i am buying the women calling you names. that is unacceptable just in civil interaction. that seems the story has gone too far, or there was a good amount of antagonistic behavior going on to cause that.

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Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:39 PM

32. No matter how authentically right one is, if you prioritize, or appear to prioritize, something that

you criticize in others, e.g. causing pain and insult, that is perceived as assuming a PRIVILEGE and it is not un-rational for the criticized to then discount the rational basis for your critique of them.

Dr. Martin Luther King was absolutely correct about non-violence and non-violence extends beyond the simply physical into emotional spectrums too. Yes there are an awful lot of delicate flowers out there, and that in itself appears quite suspicious so you also must not allow the disingenuous to jerk your chain, but that is avoidable, even, by at least not opening with insults and pain, so that it is more possible for the disingenuous to reveal the fact that they are indeed "concern trolls", before we attack someone who might just be kind of a newbie or naive and, thus, through our attack make enemies of them on the issue.

Questions are a good way to proceed, because they are more effective in revealing what is going on than (even authentically justified) pain and insults.

Not that just anger can never deal pain and insults, just that it should be done strategically instead of as a blanket response that could be invalid more often than not and thus lose potential collaboration ON THE ISSUE.

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Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:43 PM

34. No - why aren't they ANGRIER?

 

Seriously - Women's rights have taken a nosedive these past 10 years

IF that doesn't piss off every progressive and liberal, I don't know what will

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Response to Taverner (Reply #34)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 03:38 PM

40. +10000000000! n/t

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Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Thu Jan 31, 2013, 02:50 PM

35. because the corporate media is teaching the new generation that feminism

 

because the corporate media is teaching the new generations that feminism is about looking like an anorexic, dressing like a prostitute and sleeping with as many men as possible with no interest in a relationship.

I always thought feminism was about being appreciated for more than how we look, and equal respect and pay...but we haven't really advanced in that direction....

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Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Fri Feb 1, 2013, 12:45 AM

44. Good point.

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Response to ProfessionalLeftist (Original post)

Fri Feb 1, 2013, 11:30 AM

45. Because we're sick of men telling us what we can & can't do, like we're property.

So while Iím thrilled that weíre celebrating Roeís fortieth anniversaryóif women canít access abortion, then itís not really legal for all of us.

If the Hyde Amendment still exists, then Roe doesnít mean anything for the woman who canít afford care. And if one woman in Texas canít get the care she needs, then Roe isnít fulfilling its promise.




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Response to CrispyQ (Reply #45)

Fri Feb 1, 2013, 11:34 AM

46. It's still a pervasive attitude. Thus the insidious movement to relegate women...

...to sexual and reproductive slavery via rape culture and outlawing/restricting abortion and birth control. To the American Taliban, women are not human. They are breeding stock. Just like the negro women before the 13th amendment. Slaves.

Why are we angry? Our goddamned constitutional rights as human beings are constantly being hacked away at. It's more than justified.

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