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Mon Jan 28, 2013, 06:31 PM

Arizona backs off on oath that would deny atheists right to graduate


Arizona is now backing off on a controversial bill that would require public high school students to recite an oath pleading allegiance to the Constitution in order to graduate.

As worded now, the bill has language that would, in effect, deny atheists or students of different faiths the right to graduate.

House Bill 2467, sponsored by freshman Arizona State Representative Bob Thorpe (R), would require high school students to take an oath to defend and support the Constitution.

The critical phrase comes toward the end of the oath: “So help me God.” ...................(more)

The complete piece is at: http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/1321095--arizona-backs-off-on-oath-that-would-deny-atheists-right-to-graduate



15 replies, 1623 views

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Arrow 15 replies Author Time Post
Reply Arizona backs off on oath that would deny atheists right to graduate (Original post)
marmar Jan 2013 OP
jberryhill Jan 2013 #1
RKP5637 Jan 2013 #2
reverend_tim Jan 2013 #8
immoderate Jan 2013 #3
aquart Jan 2013 #4
reverend_tim Jan 2013 #9
Demeter Jan 2013 #11
reverend_tim Jan 2013 #13
Demeter Jan 2013 #14
Lady Freedom Returns Jan 2013 #5
Sheepshank Jan 2013 #12
Demeter Jan 2013 #6
RKP5637 Jan 2013 #10
longship Jan 2013 #7
panzerfaust Jan 2013 #15

Response to marmar (Original post)

Mon Jan 28, 2013, 06:34 PM

1. That's not the only problem with that oath


That oath also refers to absence of coercion or mental reservation. Given that it is proposed to be required as a condition of graduation, that part of the oath cannot be truthfully stated either.

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Response to marmar (Original post)

Mon Jan 28, 2013, 06:36 PM

2. A hint of sanity in AZ ...

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Response to RKP5637 (Reply #2)

Tue Jan 29, 2013, 02:45 AM

8. only a small one

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Response to marmar (Original post)

Mon Jan 28, 2013, 06:38 PM

3. Hard to be free if you have to swear an oath.

Education is also free, right?

--imm

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Response to marmar (Original post)

Mon Jan 28, 2013, 06:43 PM

4. Do only insane people get elected in Arizona?

Why?

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Response to aquart (Reply #4)

Tue Jan 29, 2013, 02:47 AM

9. I blame the large retirement developments.

It may not be accurate but it makes me feel better.

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Response to reverend_tim (Reply #9)

Tue Jan 29, 2013, 11:29 AM

11. Why in God's name would ANYONE want to retire to Kansas?

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Response to Demeter (Reply #11)

Tue Jan 29, 2013, 02:36 PM

13. I do not know about Kansas, I thought we were talking about Arizona.

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Response to reverend_tim (Reply #13)

Tue Jan 29, 2013, 03:44 PM

14. I got lost in the conversation, sorry

I now understand what you said.

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Response to marmar (Original post)

Mon Jan 28, 2013, 06:51 PM

5. He better...

Keep this if that thing does pass.

“Since the day that this bill was introduced, I was planning on amending it to make the oath optional,” Thorpe told the Toronto Star in an email.


Besides that, it would be taken under purpose of evasion in a way anyway. If one must take this to graduate and they don't believe in what they say...

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Response to Lady Freedom Returns (Reply #5)

Tue Jan 29, 2013, 11:46 AM

12. Spending time and tax payer money on

writing, supporting, clarifying, hand wringing, causing distress, angst, and frustration, wasting bandwidth, discussion and arguments for an optional bill?

Good thing there is no real business to be accomplished *roll eyes*

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Response to marmar (Original post)

Mon Jan 28, 2013, 07:47 PM

6. Arizona is the New Kansas

unfortunately, the old Kansas is still alive and kicking, too....

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Response to Demeter (Reply #6)

Tue Jan 29, 2013, 09:55 AM

10. And Kansas thinks it's the new standard for all of the US. It's a F'ed up place ...

... Kansas will become a laboratory for Tea Party policy. Tax cuts, government restructuring, and new education initiatives are already being discussed in Tea Party circles, and they are likely to be part of the new Kansas program. Other issues important to social conservatives like abortion will also be addressed.

Via Meadia will be watching Kansas after the election to get some idea where the Tea Party would like to take the United States. We will also be looking to see how well these first experimental policy steps really work. And we certainly won’t be the only ones; other states and governors will be paying close attention to what happens in Kansas. If these experiments work, many of these changes may soon go national.


http://blogs.the-american-interest.com/wrm/2012/10/11/kansas-the-new-tea-party-laboratory/

There is another link wherein the republican/Koch Brothers KS regime states even more specifically this will be the recipe for all of the US. That states will flock to be just like Kansas, something like that. Sorry, can't find the link now, it always turns my stomach just looking at anything from Kansas.

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Response to marmar (Original post)

Mon Jan 28, 2013, 07:56 PM

7. The Jehovah Witness people would also be against this.

Since they won't even do the flag pledge. I am not religious but agree with them that these oaths are silly.

As a school teacher in CA I never once recited the pledge when it came over the PA. Somehow, my students never noticed that I never said it. As a government employee I was, of course, required to swear allegiance to the US Constitution. I had no problem with that oath.

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Response to marmar (Original post)

Tue Jan 29, 2013, 04:41 PM

15. I guess The World would be better off if we all were forced to swear an oath to this God

 


The caption under this image on the publishing site is "Look at these westerners, Killing Muslim Childeren in Africa as a Sport valuing"

I do not know if the above is posed/true ... given that it is found on what seems to be on a conservative Muslim blog - it may well be staged. However, given the history of White Imperialism in Africa, it cannot be dismissed out of hand. In any event, it is the sort of thing that many on the Christian right would support - though not most mainstream Christians.

However, it is not the mainstream Christians who are pushing Christian Dominionist views such as those reflected in the proposed Arizona law, and I do know that this next bit of news from - well, from KANSAS, MO - is true:



"At the time of Mrs. Deaton’s murder Mr. Moore {Who at Leader Deaton's order killed Mrs Deaton} was attending the International House of Prayer University, the educational arm of the International House of Prayer of Kansas City, an evangelical Christian group focused on missions and ‘preparing for the end times.’"

"Tyler Deaton was a 'division coordinator' on the administrative team of International House of Prayer ..."

Somehow, I do not think that forcing all to sworn allegiance to the God of IHOP and Abraham is going to make the world a better place.





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