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Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:02 PM

Man left baby in car for 8 hours (he's ok) outside work. Didn't realize until wife called

NY dad forgets baby in car for 8 hours on cold day


COLONIE, N.Y. (AP) — Authorities say a New York man who left his 1-year-old son in his car for eight hours in frigid weather only realized his mistake after a call from his wife.

Police in the Albany suburb of Colonie say the man forgot to drop off his son at day care and left the child strapped in the back seat of the car when he parked outside his office Thursday morning.

Officials say the man received a call from his wife at about 4 p.m. inquiring about their child. He called for an ambulance and the boy was checked out at a hospital and released. Police say the baby didn't suffer any injuries despite temperatures that didn't top 15 degrees.


Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/news/us/article/NY-dad-forgets-baby-in-car-for-8-hours-on-cold-day-4223057.php#ixzz2J1GQh6LU

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Reply Man left baby in car for 8 hours (he's ok) outside work. Didn't realize until wife called (Original post)
Liberal_in_LA Jan 2013 OP
srican69 Jan 2013 #1
Ed Suspicious Jan 2013 #3
yardwork Jan 2013 #35
Courtesy Flush Jan 2013 #83
yardwork Jan 2013 #94
treestar Jan 2013 #90
yardwork Jan 2013 #95
Logical Jan 2013 #50
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 #65
marybourg Jan 2013 #2
customerserviceguy Jan 2013 #34
Warpy Jan 2013 #4
seabeyond Jan 2013 #9
Warpy Jan 2013 #30
seabeyond Jan 2013 #31
alcibiades_mystery Jan 2013 #11
trotsky Jan 2013 #19
KittyWampus Jan 2013 #32
Logical Jan 2013 #51
alphafemale Jan 2013 #28
laundry_queen Jan 2013 #88
d_r Jan 2013 #53
Honeycombe8 Jan 2013 #71
Laura PourMeADrink Jan 2013 #87
abelenkpe Jan 2013 #5
LiberalEsto Jan 2013 #6
Lone_Star_Dem Jan 2013 #7
LiberalEsto Jan 2013 #8
Javaman Jan 2013 #21
Xithras Jan 2013 #61
Evasporque Jan 2013 #10
alcibiades_mystery Jan 2013 #12
Liberal_in_LA Jan 2013 #15
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #13
JanMichael Jan 2013 #16
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #17
JanMichael Jan 2013 #23
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #40
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 #68
KittyWampus Jan 2013 #37
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #41
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 #70
Logical Jan 2013 #52
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #57
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 #67
charlie and algernon Jan 2013 #14
trotsky Jan 2013 #20
JanMichael Jan 2013 #25
trotsky Jan 2013 #26
JanMichael Jan 2013 #49
Liberal_in_LA Jan 2013 #63
DollarBillHines Jan 2013 #62
Enrique Jan 2013 #18
Zoeisright Jan 2013 #22
Cha Jan 2013 #24
appleannie1 Jan 2013 #59
gollygee Jan 2013 #27
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #43
gollygee Jan 2013 #44
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #45
gollygee Jan 2013 #46
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #47
JanMichael Jan 2013 #48
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #55
Fumesucker Jan 2013 #60
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #64
Fumesucker Jan 2013 #92
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 #74
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #85
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 #73
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #86
ProudToBeBlueInRhody Jan 2013 #79
gollygee Jan 2013 #93
catbyte Jan 2013 #29
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 #76
Puzzledtraveller Jan 2013 #33
rickjliberal1946sef Jan 2013 #36
frylock Jan 2013 #42
jwirr Jan 2013 #38
Walk away Jan 2013 #56
LaydeeBug Jan 2013 #39
Walk away Jan 2013 #54
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #58
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 #77
MrMickeysMom Jan 2013 #84
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 #66
Odin2005 Jan 2013 #69
smokey nj Jan 2013 #75
Baitball Blogger Jan 2013 #72
NBachers Jan 2013 #78
marybourg Jan 2013 #80
The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2013 #81
benld74 Jan 2013 #82
treestar Jan 2013 #89
Brigid Jan 2013 #91

Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:03 PM

1. I feel bad for the baby ...for it has an asshole irresponsible dad ...

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Response to srican69 (Reply #1)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:11 PM

3. He is irresponsible, and I'm not looking to reward him for his choice to seek medical care, but you

know, sometimes stupid ship happens. "He called for an ambulance and the boy was checked out at a hospital and released." He could have probably not called the ambulance, but once he realized his mistake, I'm betting was mortified, but he sacked up and did the right thing. Nobody was worse for the wear and I'm betting it never happens again. I'm sure he's beating himself up more than we should be allowed to.

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Response to srican69 (Reply #1)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:02 PM

35. As a parent who once had infants, I can understand why these tragedies occur.

The babies are asleep in the back in their car seats. It would be very easy to forget that the baby is there. I know that this sounds odd, but it's true. People go on autopilot and do their usual routine, drive to work, forget to drop off the baby. They're silent. They're asleep.

It's very fortunate that this time it didn't end in tragedy. It always does on hot days. Every summer we read about these tragedies and every time the parents are blamed for being irresponsible. I suspect that many of the parents commit suicide.

Maybe some kind of alarm could be put in cars to warn people that a living being is in the car before they lock up.

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Response to yardwork (Reply #35)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:23 PM

83. Autopilot is the word I was thinking.

I've caught myself driving halfway to work on a weekend when I was supposed to be running an errand in the opposite direction.

My guess is that mom always takes the baby to day care, but couldn't on this day.

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Response to Courtesy Flush (Reply #83)

Sat Jan 26, 2013, 08:32 AM

94. Yes, that's it exactly.

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Response to yardwork (Reply #35)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:58 PM

90. Yes, or a campaign to always check for the kid or something

Some kind of reminder - cars these days have so many gadgets, surely something can be invented.

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Response to treestar (Reply #90)

Sat Jan 26, 2013, 08:34 AM

95. I agree, something could be invented and installed in all cars.

It would be worth it to save these lives. As long as people are determined to assume that the parents are irresponsible and that this could never happen to "normal" people, nothing will be done.

In a way the issue encapsulates what is wrong with our country. No empathy. No humanity. We're all cogs in the Wall Street machine. The strong trample the weak. Woe betide anybody who falls down. They'll be destroyed.

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Response to srican69 (Reply #1)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:00 PM

50. People make mistakes, Bet you do to. Sure he feels bad enough. n-t

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Response to srican69 (Reply #1)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:28 PM

65. He isn't an asshole

The prevalence of these incidents by very responsible people shows that.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:07 PM

2. Maybe the baby-in-the-back-seat rule

should be revisited.

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Response to marybourg (Reply #2)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:01 PM

34. Far more car accidents

than absent minded parental units. I believe the back seat rule protects many more lives than it risks.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:13 PM

4. I tend to cut parents of infants a lot of slack

because so many of them are up during the night with a screaming baby. I'm surprised more kids aren't left in cars, I've watched too many parents stumble through workdays on no sleep.

This kid was likely dressed in pounds of winter clothing and was fine, albeit hungry and with a full diaper.

It's summer that kills.

I doubt that no matter how exhausted he is, the dad isn't going to do this one again. In any case, the fact that he called the ambulance first and met them at the car shows he's a caring dad.

He was likely near comatose from lack of sleep.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #4)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:29 PM

9. i do too.

and i am a strong child advocate. and i do too.

there is a difference between this, and purposeful with intent.

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #9)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 05:52 PM

30. And real neglect, with the kid freezing to death

because the parents are in a bar and didn't bother to dress him properly for the weather. We get a few of those cases around here every winter.

This was just a frazzled new dad and there's nothing to see here, the baby was just fine because they had cared enough to bundle him up properly.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #30)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 05:56 PM

31. and my heart breaks, when everything isnt fine. a couple years ago,

a cousin who was an older parent. he and the mother waited years to have a baby. the baby, working on 2, was in the fenced front yard. the dad was taking off with dogs and was missing with them. the mother ran into the house to get a soda. 1-2 minutes. and... the gate was unhooked.

everything unusual happened in that 1-2 minutes. the father backed out thinking the baby was fenced in with mom. mom thinking gate locked. the father ran over his child.

he got out of truck to see what was up, and that is what he found.

horrible, horrible. and the end of the world for those two. just a do over of those couple of minutes.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #4)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:32 PM

11. It's so discouraging that these threads so often end up as monuments of (self)righteousness

I'm with you - with one of my babies having been just unmanagable scream-wise for several months, I always feel for these parents more than feel like chastising them - it's a "there but for the grace..etc...go I" sort of feeling.

Of course, I wouldn't presume to speak to the very special among us who couldn't even contemplate this happening to them, because they're so awesome. I'll leave the righteous elite to flog this poor guy down thread.

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Response to alcibiades_mystery (Reply #11)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 04:39 PM

19. +1000 n/t

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Response to alcibiades_mystery (Reply #11)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 05:58 PM

32. maybe it's a defense mechanism. We need to believe we'd never allow ourselves to make that mistake.

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Response to alcibiades_mystery (Reply #11)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:01 PM

51. So true. Many idiots on the DU act like they never could bever make a serious mistake. n-t

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Response to Warpy (Reply #4)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 05:45 PM

28. Me too. Have my own story.

When my kids were small...preschool daughter _ infant son. Their dad and I daily switched car seats between vehicles. He came in one night and just put the carseat in without fastening it. And in the morning I didn't check.

First turn of significance and the carseat tumbles over and the baby is upside down in the floorwell. His sister is having a fit. "You fallded my Brother! You falded my Brother!"

Carseat did its job and he was scratchless.

But I was still very pissed.

With modern technology there should be a way to prevent this sort of thing. Even not technology. A baby hasn't been dropped off. A call could be made.

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Response to alphafemale (Reply #28)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:52 PM

88. I've done that before.

My ex doesn't have his own carseat for our youngest and he'd want mine when he'd pick her up for his weekends. Knowing that if I made him buy one, he'd buy the cheapest piece of crap possible and install it incorrectly, I would install it and everything for him and then take it out when he came back. One time after he returned the kids, one of the kids needed something and I just placed the carseat where it normally goes and made a mental note to install it the next morning before I took her to daycare. The next morning was unusually hectic with multiple screaming kids (I have 4 total) and I drove my dd to her daycare and then I went to school. When I was getting my bags out of the back, I clipped the seat and it tumbled out of the vehicle. With horror, I realized I had been driving my dd around that morning with an uninstalled seat.

I've also forgotten to buckle her up occasionally, but usually she screams at me, now that she is old enough.

I remember having tiny, colicky babies and no sleep. I can only imagine how hard it would've been if I would've had to work full time and take them to daycare when they were that young....

I agree there should be some kind of verification system at daycares, just like at schools. I'm lucky enough to have a personal friendship with my daughter's daycare provider and she usually calls me if I'm a bit late, just to make sure.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #4)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:12 PM

53. I understand too

No sleep and on autopilot, thank goodness for a happy ending, so clos to a tradgedy. I can't imagine his pqnic when he realized.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #4)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:34 PM

71. I have dogs. I can see how this happens.

I love my dogs. I mean I LOVE my dogs. But the other night I was so tired from having worked really long hours, I nestled in bed to watch tv after work, after letting both dogs out and one dog back in - the other one wanted to stay outside because it was a pretty day. I accidentally and promptly dropped off to sleep. I woke up in the middle of the night, saw my one dog, and realized....where's Rosie? OMG. I'd left her out all afternoon, evening, and half the night!

Another time I drove up to my house after work and saw that I had left my front door wide open when I had left for work that morning! I had a glass storm door that was shut, but it doesn't lock, and the wooden door was open.

Of course a baby is much more important than dogs or a house, but I can see how this happens, since I've done similar things myself. Thank God the little fella was okay. I bet that man is just kicking himself and destroying himself with guilt...and they'll come up with a system for that to never happen again.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #4)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:44 PM

87. That sounds too much like common, rational thinking LOVE IT nt

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:18 PM

5. Phew!

Thank goodness he is OK.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:20 PM

6. Someone should invent a beeper

that goes off when you start exiting the vehicle and the car seat is still occupied.

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Response to Lone_Star_Dem (Reply #7)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:26 PM

8. Then they need to come up with a better one

Thanks for posting that.

If I so much as put a bag of groceries or a small (16 pounds) dog in the passenger seat of my car, the seatbelt beeper goes crazy. It should be possible to transfer that technology to a car seat.

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Response to LiberalEsto (Reply #6)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 04:57 PM

21. I had an idea for this a while back...

It would work with the alarm system in your car.

If you don't remove the child from the seat, the car doors won't lock.

I simple pressure trigger under the child keeps it armed and in sink with the alarm on the car.

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Response to LiberalEsto (Reply #6)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:30 PM

61. They were invented long ago. Nobody wants the liability.

It's impossible to build a piece of technology that is 100% reliable, and the first time one fails and a kid dies, the kids parents will OWN the company. If you build and market a technology with the specific promise that it will save forgotten babies from locked cars, and a baby dies because that technology fails to work, the liability would be staggering. The odds that ONE will eventually fail to work are pretty much 100%. A battery will fail. A baby bottle or leaky diaper will soak the electronics. Something, somewhere will eventually go wrong, and one will fail to work...and that kids parents will sue (and win).

No major manufacturer or retailer wants that liability. You CAN buy one from small companies over the Internet, but few people bother.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:30 PM

10. that would be one diaper I would regret....

for the rest of my life...

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:34 PM

12. Our daycare calls us when there's an unexplained absence

Usually by 10 o'clock.

Just sayin'...

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Response to alcibiades_mystery (Reply #12)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:50 PM

15. good backup support from the daycare

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:35 PM

13. Answers thus far are WAY too tame for this kind of nincompoopery!

Jesus H. Christ...

I wouldn't cut this man any slack at ALL. What a complete lunatic asshole!

NO ONE who is able to report to work can be so disconnected from their 1 year old child, that they would leave this situation without at least thinking about it within the next ten minutes. ARE YOU KIDDING?

I hope the wife documents this somewhere, cause summer's coming, baby!

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #13)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 04:18 PM

16. Interesting comment

Your attitude is addressed in depth in this article-- it was posted below.

It's eye opening.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/27/AR2009022701549_5.html?sid=ST2009030602446

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Response to JanMichael (Reply #16)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 04:31 PM

17. Well thanks for the article, but it does nothing to present any "reason" this happens...

Some things DO go out of your mind. But, the brain has an order of priority that is supposed to be functioning. The actions taken by any of the people in that article or this guys are not the result of a functional brain.

It may be a function of sleep deprivation, which is pathology.
It may be a function of post traumatic stress (same)
Also, result of pharmacology...

It is not a healthy functioning brain that lets this routine go unchecked. Uh-uh, now...

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #17)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 05:08 PM

23. so, you didn't read the entire article, did you

it addresses exactly what you are making fun of.

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Response to JanMichael (Reply #23)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:30 PM

40. I did read it...

practically every word... What's your point?

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #40)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:32 PM

68. The article explains what you are saying it doesn't

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #17)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:07 PM

37. you need to read the article. When we are stressed out/tired & routines are breached our higher

brain functions don't work properly.

This is a symptom of a society that is stressed out, over worked, over tired with not enough of a familial or social support systems for parents.

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Response to KittyWampus (Reply #37)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:31 PM

41. Yes... so....

That's a pathology, isn't it?

And yet, no one in the thread seemed to think so!

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #41)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:33 PM

70. There is a reason why courts don't convict parents who do this

Because there is no malicious intent

Because it wasn't done on purpose.

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #13)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:03 PM

52. LOL, I love all the perfect people here. I bet you are a joy to be around. n-t

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Response to Logical (Reply #52)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:18 PM

57. Actually, I am...

And I'm not perfect... surprise!

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #13)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:31 PM

67. It happens quite a bit, by very responsible people

Especially if the routine has been changed.

I'm glad it was winter and not summer, so there was a happy ending.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:36 PM

14. The Washington Post had a Pulitzer Prize Winning story on these kinds of incidents

Fatal Distraction: Forgetting a Child in the Backseat of a Car Is a Horrifying Mistake. Is It a Crime?

The defendant was an immense man, well over 300 pounds, but in the gravity of his sorrow and shame he seemed larger still. He hunched forward in the sturdy wooden armchair that barely contained him, sobbing softly into tissue after tissue, a leg bouncing nervously under the table. In the first pew of spectators sat his wife, looking stricken, absently twisting her wedding band. The room was a sepulcher. Witnesses spoke softly of events so painful that many lost their composure. When a hospital emergency room nurse described how the defendant had behaved after the police first brought him in, she wept. He was virtually catatonic, she remembered, his eyes shut tight, rocking back and forth, locked away in some unfathomable private torment. He would not speak at all for the longest time, not until the nurse sank down beside him and held his hand. It was only then that the patient began to open up, and what he said was that he didn't want any sedation, that he didn't deserve a respite from pain, that he wanted to feel it all, and then to die.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/27/AR2009022701549.html

You will cry several times while reading this article.

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Response to charlie and algernon (Reply #14)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 04:53 PM

20. Your warning was correct.

The agony these people suffered - just unimaginable.

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Response to trotsky (Reply #20)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 05:18 PM

25. Every single person responding to this post needs to read that article ALL the way

through. It was an eye opener for me; I am horrified, and saddened.

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Response to JanMichael (Reply #25)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 05:24 PM

26. Here is the snip that really drives it home:

Humans, Hickling said, have a fundamental need to create and maintain a narrative for their lives in which the universe is not implacable and heartless, that terrible things do not happen at random, and that catastrophe can be avoided if you are vigilant and responsible.

In hyperthermia cases, he believes, the parents are demonized for much the same reasons. "We are vulnerable, but we don't want to be reminded of that. We want to believe that the world is understandable and controllable and unthreatening, that if we follow the rules, we'll be okay. So, when this kind of thing happens to other people, we need to put them in a different category from us. We don't want to resemble them, and the fact that we might is too terrifying to deal with. So, they have to be monsters."

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Response to trotsky (Reply #26)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:00 PM

49. That's exactly the quote and part of the article

I was referring to above. God, those stories were just heart rending.

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Response to trotsky (Reply #26)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 08:32 PM

63. Yes, that's a good quote from the article.

accidents do happen.

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Response to JanMichael (Reply #25)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:53 PM

62. I agree

"eye opener" is right.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 04:34 PM

18. imagine that phone call

if it was me i might have fainted.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 05:07 PM

22. Sleep deprivation can mess with your brain.

Don't jump to conclusions about this. The guy isn't automatically an asshole.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 05:11 PM

24. Damn! I'm glad the baby is okay!

I used to live near Albany.. and 15 degrees? that's too damn cold.. baby must have been wrapped up pretty good.

How the hell could you forget your baby? It's too weird.

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Response to Cha (Reply #24)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:24 PM

59. It is easy. I remember jumping in a car with my convulsing infant in my arms. As my husband

started the car a neighbor's son stuck his head in the window and said "I will watch your little boy for you". I looked up and our 2 year old was standing on the porch. We had both forgotten him.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 05:26 PM

27. This was such a huge fear for me when I was younger

I'm forgetful and I could see me doing this. I started putting my purse in the back seat by the baby seat so I'd have to open that door.

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Response to gollygee (Reply #27)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:36 PM

43. Oh, my...

Forgetful is one thing... we all are.

At least, in the event you might fear, you've done something to make your thought routine better.

I think I understand what people mostly are saying here. All of us ARE capable of forgetting, but when it comes to the degree of what these articles put out to the public, this is a cry that something is terribly, terribly, terribly wrong.

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #43)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:38 PM

44. What do you think was terribly, terribly, terribly wrong? (Other than of course forgetting baby)

As you said forgetting the baby is a sign that something is terribly, terribly, terribly wrong - that means something else must have been wrong.

You get out of your routine and forget to do something. A sleeping baby in the back seat makes no noise. The fact that it is very important that you not forget the baby in the backseat doesn't mean you're more likely to not forget that than something that is not important. That's not how forgetfulness works.

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Response to gollygee (Reply #44)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:43 PM

45. Forgetting a baby is in the back seat of your car...

is not just "forgetful".... it's pathologically forgetful.

It means your brain doesn't function the way it should. When the brain is dysfunctional, I'm gonna bet it's a sick brain.

It could be sick due to a myriad of things that have mentioned here. Sleep deprivation is one, enormous stress is another, chemical mediation (who the hell knows whether some medication alters brain function, start with an EEG to figure that one), or a combination of these things.

It's not just "forgetfulness".

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #45)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:46 PM

46. No, it really is just forgetfulness

To forget something is unrelated to how important it is that you not forget it.

People like to think that there is something crazy or pathological going on because they hate to think it could happen to them, but this is something that could happen to anyone. My brain works the way it should, but I could very easily see myself forgetting this. I've forgotten enough other things that I absolutely could have kept a kid in the back of the car. And my brain is not dysfunctional or sick.

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Response to gollygee (Reply #46)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:55 PM

47. Thanks for the warning...

I disagree and unless you've got some based reason to say otherwise, I suggest you never travel with anyone who is defenseless.

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #47)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:58 PM

48. You are mighty cocky sounding

I hope you aren't that way in person; my experience has always been that the cockiest folks are the ones that have the worst time emotionally when something bad does happen to them. You are not immune from human mistakes.

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Response to JanMichael (Reply #48)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:16 PM

55. Look, I'm as apt to have this problem as you are. Maybe I'm not clear on this...

It's not cocky to stand your ground on what you think is right, if anything I'm being argumentative. So, if I argue that "forgetfulness" is all that happened in the situation where the guy leaves his 1 yr old in the car that long and doesn't remember not dropping him off at day care, I'm going to stand my ground on the argument that HIS forgetfulness not normal.

Sure, it could happen. The articles make it painfully obvious that it has. The fact that it DOES happen means to me that the degree of which one "forgets" was NOT a normal one, it was abnormal.

Please don't make this about me. I mean no harm. I'm capable of being cocky, but I wasn't trying to be here. I'm telling you and others that I don't think this "forgetfulness" is normal, I think it's pathological.

Pathological doesn't mean that it's never going to get better, it means that it had better get better, cause it ain't normal.

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #55)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:27 PM

60. Skinner had an interesting post in another thread a while back on the same thing..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002645828#post127


To the people in this thread who are pointing the finger:

If you have children, I think you might be wise to spend a little more time thinking on this tragedy.

I think it is safe to assume that this type of tragic accident is MORE likely to happen if a parent is absolutely certain it will not.

A little doubt, a little fear, a little uncertainty about whether this could happen to you might be the difference between life and death.

I, for one, am very glad I saw this thread. It has made me think about whether something like this could happen to me.

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #60)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:26 PM

64. And, I can agree on that being said...

Yet, to recognize that something is wrong at that point and most important to resolve is the best way to address it.

To be mindful that it could happen to you is related more to apprehension or fear, but to examine to see what can be done to avoid it altogether is the ultimate best you can do... because, doing what you can to avoid the misfiring of neurons across the synaptic cleft is better than simply realizing it can happen. It happens for a reason.

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #64)

Sat Jan 26, 2013, 03:07 AM

92. Here's a piece by someone who *almost* killed their child

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/another-child-dies-in-a-hot-car-and-gene-weingarten-asks-why-was-this-a-crime/2012/03/14/gIQAXm01ES_story.html

It was stifling hot on the summer morning 29 years ago when I almost murdered my daughter.

“Murder” is an unforgiving term for what nearly happened that day, but to prosecutors in Prince William County, it is appropriate. That was the charge they brought last year against Bristow veterinarianKaren Murphy, whose 2-year-old, Ryan, did not do what my 2-year-old, Molly, did on the day I almost killed her: wake up at the last minute and say something.

So I didn’t park and lock my car and head into my office that morning, as Murphy did last June 17. Instead, after steadying my nerves against the knowledge of what I’d almost done, I drove my daughter to day care, as I’d meant to do before I somehow — inexplicably, inexcusably — forgot that she was sitting in the back seat.

For her grievous mistake, Murphy faced a possible 40 years in prison on a charge of felony murder. Just before her trial this past week, as she quietly wept in court, the 41-year-old veterinarian was permitted to plead guilty to reduced charges of misdemeanor child neglect. She won’t go to prison. She won’t lose her medical license. All she faces is 400 hours of community service, six years of probation, and a lifetime of grief and shame that will sabotage joy whenever that emotion dares to surface. That is what happens in these cases. I know. I have studied them.

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #45)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:38 PM

74. Nope, nothing abnormal, and you could do it, too

All of us could. And, yes, you could. Saying you couldn't proves the point of the studies linked upthread.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #74)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:34 PM

85. I never said I couldn't

I'm sorry that a reasoned argument over memory, cognitive impairment makes you say things like that, but that doesn't mean that this is normal brain function.

And, for the umpteenth time, "all of us could" is in the vein of what I am saying.

That kind of memory lapse is not normal.

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #43)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:37 PM

73. The point is, nothing IS terribly, terribly wrong

The point is, any of us could do this. Even you. Your saying you wouldn't do this, proves the point of the studies linked above. ALL OF US could do this.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #73)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:40 PM

86. There is no argument there...

You perhaps did not read what I said.

To the contrary, I've been saying we all can do this, but TO do this is not normal cognitive function. Something is impairing the function of memory.

Maybe later you'll look into it, but stick to the facts, meanwhile.

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Response to gollygee (Reply #27)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:07 PM

79. So wait....

....you wouldn't have forgotten your purse, but you might have forgotten a baby?

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Response to ProudToBeBlueInRhody (Reply #79)

Sat Jan 26, 2013, 07:10 AM

93. My pass card for work was in my purse

so I wouldn't get in the building, and I'd have to go back to the car anyway.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 05:48 PM

29. That kid must have had an awesome coat & good boots!

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Response to catbyte (Reply #29)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:39 PM

76. It it was sunny, passive heat would have kept the car decently warm

Enough so, if the baby was all toasty in good clothes and boots, like you said.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:01 PM

33. If this had been in summer, likely a different ending.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:02 PM

36. Aw that poor baby

 

Thank god he's okay. Hope his monster of a dad is punished harshly for this.

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Response to rickjliberal1946sef (Reply #36)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:32 PM

42. his monster of a dad is no different than you or i..

ever forgotten your wallet or keys? this could just as easily happen to you, and you if you think you're immune, then you are gravely mistaken. read the article that's been posted in this thread before passing judgment.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:24 PM

38. Shades of the old days - there were many children left in cars years ago or at home alone. The laws

we have today make a real difference now. It was not uncommon to find children in the car outside a bar or other place that adults could go into but children were not allowed. The home alone was more often working mothers who could not afford day care or had none available.

Here in our area we have a child who was left in the car while she was gambling at a casino. No excuse for that.

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Response to jwirr (Reply #38)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:18 PM

56. That did not happen in this case. nt

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:27 PM

39. Read: Frazzled parent who works too many hours for too little pay bc of profit predators

does something unconscionable.

I can see how this would happen in today's "work three jobs while you're sick" environment.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:16 PM

54. Thank goodness everything is alright. I'm sure this poor man will punish himself...

for the rest of his life about it. Now that I'm in my fifties I am even more empathetic. I write everything down and count the dogs in and out of the house every time I open the door. Something like that could happen to anyone.

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Response to Walk away (Reply #54)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 07:21 PM

58. Yes, I agree...

Actually I was wrong with my first comment, "lunatic asshole" upthread. But, he was something else, and it was NOT normal, and now... my God, he'll be pretty guilty.

But, maybe he'll be put in the direction of finding out what the problem was and correct it. In a very strange way, it's a gift.

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #58)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:41 PM

77. There is no problem

As you keep being told in this thread, along with links to articles and studies.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #77)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:28 PM

84. What gives you the confidence of saying there is no problem with this kind of memory failure?

The only persons who "keep telling me" are those who think the articles support their ideology over this kind of thing.

I go with the only thing I can, which is a reasoned understanding, albeit non-physician, non-the-less physiologic level of what kind of cognitive impairment we can all have. Again, I named how stress, sleep deprivation and pharmaceutic industries can contribute to.

There is a problem.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:29 PM

66. If it was sunny, the car may have been decently warm

And, the baby was bundled up. He was probably more hungry and wet. Glad it ended well.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:32 PM

69. What idiot could forget their OWN BABY in a car?

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Response to Odin2005 (Reply #69)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:39 PM

75. It could happen to anyone.

Read this article. Seriously.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/27/AR2009022701549.html

The wealthy do, it turns out. And the poor, and the middle class. Parents of all ages and ethnicities do it. Mothers are just as likely to do it as fathers. It happens to the chronically absent-minded and to the fanatically organized, to the college-educated and to the marginally literate. In the last 10 years, it has happened to a dentist. A postal clerk. A social worker. A police officer. An accountant. A soldier. A paralegal. An electrician. A Protestant clergyman. A rabbinical student. A nurse. A construction worker. An assistant principal. It happened to a mental health counselor, a college professor and a pizza chef. It happened to a pediatrician. It happened to a rocket scientist.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:35 PM

72. Lucky.ass.parents.

That could have so gone the other way.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 09:55 PM

78. Just getting the baby up, fed, ready, out the door, strapped in; along with the other demands of the

day, can frazzle anyone. I drove off one morning with the baby strapped in the car and an expensive mattress cover on the roof. I got to my destination, and couldn't figure why I didn't find the mattress cover in the car.

I'm just glad I didn't put the baby on the roof and drive off.

Sometimes, a parent's resources are low, and they make mistakes. Usually, they aren't fatal. But we've all done it.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:17 PM

80. 70+ years ago, when I was a baby (and even when I had my babies)

it was usual to leave the occupied stroller or carriage outside the small New York city stores while you shopped. My mother used to tell the story of the neighbor whom my mother encountered in a store. The neighbor left the store at the same time as my mother, who unlocked my stroller wheels and wheeled me home, talking to the neighbor. When they got to their apartment house, the neighbor gasped in horror:"I left little (her baby) outside the store! They both ran back and found the baby fine, where she had been left.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:19 PM

81. The Washington Post article is very sad, but also very instructive.

It tells us that anybody can make a terrible mistake. Anybody.

I teach a college course in aviation safety, and we study, among other things, the "Swiss cheese" model mentioned in the article. And we also address the many things that can lead to a plane crash, and they are exactly the same things that caused these parents to forget their child was in the back seat: stress, fatigue, distractions, changes in routine. And we learn that most of the pilots involved in accidents were not incompetent, stupid people, but in most cases were smart, competent and well-trained, with no history of problems or incidents. Human factors in industrial safety have been studied carefully for at least 30 years, and it certainly appears that the same principles apply to the everyday lives of ordinary people as well.

In aviation and other industries, safety measures include technological safeguards and warning systems and the extensive use of checklists. These things are used because people are fallible; our brains don't always work the way they should no matter how hard they try.

So if you're tempted to cast stones at these parents, who must be suffering the torments of the damned, you'd better get off your high horse, because even if you don't think you could ever do something that awful, the fact is that you and I and everybody else really could.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:20 PM

82. What side of car was carseat in? - back passenger side or back driver side

Driver can SEE back passenger side but not behind them.
SO many times I see parents stopping at day care centers to drop their kids off. SO MANY of them open the back driver side door to unbuckle and get their child out on the drive side of the car! On street side no less.
THAT is wrong.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:57 PM

89. Thank the goddess it wasn't summer

That would have killed that poor kid.

At times as a non parent I think, how can people forget the baby? But it can happen if there is something out of routine.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Original post)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 10:59 PM

91. Two words: SLEEP DEPRIVATION.

Its effects can be devastating. There is a reason why it is a time-honored torture technique. I am not a parent, but I do know I have never heard the parent of a small child say they get enough sleep.

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