HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » As A Vietnam Vet I Can Sa...
Introducing Discussionist: A new forum by the creators of DU

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 10:01 AM

As A Vietnam Vet I Can Say It Is A Waste To Risk Your Life In The Military For A GOP Run Govt.

Last edited Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:37 AM - Edit history (2)

The GOP coddles the billionaires and millionaires while poor and middle class men and women die in wars to essentially protect them. Meanwhile these same veterans come back to be offered a shitty job by Walmart so they can take advantage of any federal tax credit. IT IS AN ABSOLUTELY GODAMNED INSULT TO VETERANS SERVICE. WALMART IS A FASCIST AND RACIST COMPANY THAT SHOULD BE SHUT DOWN COMPLETELY.

As for me I will never stand "with a Republican"in a pledge to the flag. I hate them that much. There are NO moderate Republicans left in the party.

Addendum -- It does not matter if the military is an all volunteer force that is straw dog argument. We still need to fund care for these people. They are taking extraordinary risks even if they volunteer. The volunteer for argument is BULLSHIT and a right wing talking point. Many people end up in the military because they end up with no other viable choice from their point of view.

Service ---- !st Cav Division Co B 1-5 RVN 11-67 to 11-68

38 replies, 2469 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 38 replies Author Time Post
Reply As A Vietnam Vet I Can Say It Is A Waste To Risk Your Life In The Military For A GOP Run Govt. (Original post)
TheMastersNemesis Jan 2013 OP
Scuba Jan 2013 #1
Segami Jan 2013 #2
octoberlib Jan 2013 #26
Squaredeal Jan 2013 #28
amuse bouche Jan 2013 #29
Zoeisright Jan 2013 #35
nadinbrzezinski Jan 2013 #37
Squaredeal Jan 2013 #30
madville Jan 2013 #3
JDPriestly Jan 2013 #6
madville Jan 2013 #19
JDPriestly Jan 2013 #32
Zoeisright Jan 2013 #36
Squaredeal Jan 2013 #25
unhappycamper Jan 2013 #14
madokie Jan 2013 #4
Glorfindel Jan 2013 #5
TheMastersNemesis Jan 2013 #8
MattSh Jan 2013 #7
TheMastersNemesis Jan 2013 #10
nick of time Jan 2013 #9
riverbendviewgal Jan 2013 #11
Tikki Jan 2013 #12
cliffordu Jan 2013 #13
Dustlawyer Jan 2013 #15
lonestarnot Jan 2013 #17
raouldukelives Jan 2013 #16
haele Jan 2013 #21
Victor_c3 Jan 2013 #24
raouldukelives Jan 2013 #34
Victor_c3 Jan 2013 #38
G_j Jan 2013 #18
jerseyjack Jan 2013 #20
malthaussen Jan 2013 #22
leftyohiolib Jan 2013 #23
grahamhgreen Jan 2013 #27
indepat Jan 2013 #31
moondust Jan 2013 #33

Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 10:09 AM

1. This Viet vet agrees.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 10:20 AM

2. ReTHUGS have been running this stale CON Game forever.

Sacrifice & Die for 'OUR' causes so we can reap the rewards. As for you......WELL......



Republicans Seek To Cut Benefits for Disabled Veterans - 2011


Remember Michele Bachmanns’s attempted $4 billion cut from disabled veterans compensation? Well, “they’re ba-ack…” Except this time they are looking to cut away at our VA healthcare.

Republican Paul Ryan and the House of Representatives are looking to end VA healthcare benefits for disabled veterans – that’s for over 1.3 million veterans who are Priority 7 & 8. These veterans are the least disabled veterans using the system, usually with disability ratings of 0 percent or no service-connected disability.

According to the Congressional Budget Office “Option 35,” the cuts would leave 130,000 veterans with no healthcare alternative. This means veterans with conditions not recognized by the VA, like certain diseases from Agent Orange exposure, would have to pay for healthcare out of pocket if they had not other service connected disability.

Currently, the VA spends over $4 billion yearly on benefits for disabled veterans to treat them, despite co-pays intended to offset the expense. Ryan’s cuts are intended to save $6 billion off the VA’s tab and $62 billion over the next 10 years. Instead of merely increasing the co-pay or taxing Wall Street, Congress wants to just cut your benefits out, all together.

Disabled American Veterans (DAV) is fighting the across the board cut because many of the veterans in question have come to rely on VA healthcare over the years. In times when healthcare costs are astronomical, these veterans will go without the care they were promised, if the proposal becomes law. DAV voiced additional concerns that this attempt is just the start of a gradual and specifically focused erosion of veterans’ benefits.

Sweet sweetness. What chaps my hide the most is that the reason for the cuts is to reduce the U.S. budget deficit. All the while, two-thirds of major American corporations didn’t pay taxes this year after receiving bailout money and reporting record profits as a result. GE only paid up after receiving a great deal of negative press.

These corporations and the executives who run them benefit a great deal from our American system: U.S. Military, Roads and Railways, the Judicial System, Education for workers and the like. So, they get high profits and protection while we get …?

Let’s not forget that without our military, corporations wouldn’t be able to set up shop in so many countries internationally. Without tax dollars, the U.S. could not pay for the government contracts awarded to GE, Textron, Google, etc. Yet, they pay a very limited amount in taxes and provide fewer jobs than promised via Reagonomics.

It appears this is more of a “Trickle-On Economics” rather than Trickle-Down. I think when Warren Buffett said he should be paying more taxes, I finally woke up to what he meant. Those who benefit the most from a system of government should pay a fair share of the profits they earned. Meanwhile, companies like Google take advantage of tax loopholes only very wealthy corporations can take advantage of while small businesses get hit disproportionately to cover military spending and similar programs.

Now, the House of Representatives has decided to propose cuts to benefits for disabled veterans while supporting a third war in a country most of us could not even find on a map two months ago (if the proposed cuts went through).

Don’t believe the headlines. These cuts are just an attempt to split the oyster shell in half to steal the pearl. Once 1.3 million bodies get cut out of the VA system, politicians will have an easier time justifying further cuts to VA programs.

Suddenly, the comprehensive health care you once received will be reduced to occasional physicals and virtual appointments via computer. Count on it.

And don’t think the politicians will stop until they gut the whole system. Many of them call benefits like Social Security and VA Disability “Entitlements.” Rather, VA healthcare is really just a cost of doing business. You break it; you buy it. Wall Street and Corporate America need to pony up their share and keep their mitts off our hard earned benefits.

Vote on whether or not veterans should shoulder the burden for deficit reductions.

Update: the cuts discussed above did not make the “markup.” Once the topic was run up the flagpole, public outcry caused the House to go back to the drawing board. Instead, the House cut spending for the US Court of Appeals for Veterans Claims by half of the requested funds from the White House.

This court is one of the last resorts for veterans’ disability appeals. Meanwhile, they did allow funding for the VA to police the hand washing of its employees using RFID technology. So while veterans may not get the care they need or the disability rating they deserve, VA employees will not have pee on their hands.

At least the government contractor responsible for implementing the system will get paid.


https://www.disabledveterans.org/2011/04/16/republicans-seek-to-cut-1-3-million-veterans/

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Segami (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 12:50 PM

26. What a disgrace. nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Segami (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 12:55 PM

28. Some vets are malingerers

A lot of taxpayer money is being spent on some vets who are not disabled, which means those deserving vets bear the brunt of the pressure to reduce costs.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Squaredeal (Reply #28)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:04 PM

29. Do tell

how and how many are running scams. How much ill gotten funds do they acquire?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Squaredeal (Reply #28)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:54 PM

35. And you know this how, sparky?

Sounds like a straw man argument and a repuke lie to me.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Squaredeal (Reply #28)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 04:01 PM

37. And you know this how?

Lovely talking point, RW talking point to be exact. I suspect you got no idea how difficult is to get those disability payments, including folks with obvious disabilities.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Segami (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:12 PM

30. Those who are injured should not be cut

Just cut out the malingerers to pay for it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 10:21 AM

3. It's an all volunteer force

I would agree with your statement if we didn't have an all volunteer armed forces. The members are there by choice and there isn't a GOP run military now or on the horizon.

Regardless of the Administration, I mean they pretty much train for and conduct the same missions. The government presents the same bogeymen, protects the same interests mostly (oil, Israel, etc).

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to madville (Reply #3)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:24 AM

6. What do you mean?

What do you think that soldiers volunteer for?

I think they volunteer on the understanding that we as a people will take care of them if they are injured in any way or suffer while defending us.

Do you think they volunteer to be jobless and unable to pay for the healthcare they need because of injuries or illness they suffered while in service?

Enlistees join up on the understanding that while taxpayers may not pay them a whole lot while they serve, taxpayers will pick up the tab for healthcare related to their service or injuries incurred during their service, education costs, housing loans and help when they need jobs. That is generally part of the deal, part of the contract and understanding when they sign up.

My husband is a veteran. Amazing how many Republicans these days not only never served themselves but don't even know enough veterans to understand how it works.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to JDPriestly (Reply #6)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:57 AM

19. I'm a veteran as well

What of those things you mentioned is the government not honoring? I've received decent healthcare from the military and through Tricare, tuition assistance and the GI Bill paid for my college degree, I've gotten a VA loan for a house and I actually got my current civilian job partly due to my veterans preference in the hiring process (injured veterans get a higher preference as well).

The military is currently one of the best paying blue collar jobs and has great benefits. When I left active duty as an E-6 I was netting $4000 a month including allowances and after taxes and deductions. That's equivalent to about $80,000 a year when you consider all the benefits available.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to madville (Reply #19)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:56 PM

32. I was responding to a post stating that Republicans want to cut the medical benefits

for veterans -- for disabilities also.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to madville (Reply #19)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:57 PM

36. Oh really.

Then why are there so many homeless vets? Why is the suicide rate for vets now higher than combat deaths? Half a million soldiers have suffered brain injury in Iraq and Afghanistan, and fucking repukes are cutting research into those injuries. Mental health for veterans is a joke.

Making it all worse, of course, is that fact that Bush/Cheney/Rove/Powell lied this country into the Iraq war and failed to protect us on 9/11 so the Afghanistan war is their fault too. ANY soldier, "even" a volunteer, is owed the dignity of fighting in a war that is justified.

What about that can't you understand?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to JDPriestly (Reply #6)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 12:49 PM

25. Didn't enlist for the benefits

There are many reasons why I enlisted at 18, in 1968, but the benefits wasn't one of them. Actually, there were very few for serving.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to madville (Reply #3)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:37 AM

14. It is an all volunteer force because of Vietnam.

The Vietnam adventure proved draftees get pissed at a) getting drafted and b) taking an involuntary Vietnam 'vacation'. The military decided to spend more money for fresh meat and avoid pissed off newly-drafted conscripts, hence the All Volunteer Force.

The ability to issue waivers meant that folks with criminal records could join the military - military gangs in Germany (2005). Waivers also meant lowering standards on metal health, hence all the discharges for 'personality defects'.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 10:23 AM

4. This old Vietnam Vet agrees with you

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 10:30 AM

5. As your fellow Vietnam veteran, I agree with you

one hundred percent.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Glorfindel (Reply #5)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:30 AM

8. What The GOP Is Doing Makes Me Furious. If GOP Politicians Were Ever Taken Hostage I Would Consider

letting them rescue themselves. I certainly would not be inclined to rescue the bigoted bastards. I follow what is happening to vets and the GOP is royally screwing and raping them over benefits.

The GOP even wants to take the military retirement and turn it into a 401K program.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:28 AM

7. Now that the Dems are in charge, I guess it's no longer a waste...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to MattSh (Reply #7)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:31 AM

10. I Would Serve Under Any Democratic Govt.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:30 AM

9. Another Viet Vet that agrees with you.

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to nick of time (Reply #9)


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:35 AM

12. With you 100%...



Mr. Tikki... U.S. Army Vietnam Era Vet

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:37 AM

13. This old Vietnam vet agrees

And just because a dog is long in the tooth don't mean he cannot bite.

They might want to think about this a little more.....

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:43 AM

15. What I have trouble understanding is why there are so many

Republicans in the active military? Can't they see they are being used and abused by the GOP?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Dustlawyer (Reply #15)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:46 AM

17. Because they can't get a job ripping people off somewhere and they could become a hero, and killing

humans is sport for many.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:46 AM

16. I've yet to meet a volunteer. Most of the ones I know had to apply. A few were turned down.

It's a good job with benefits. That is why they apply.
Heck, I'd apply if I thought I would be doing something in service to my country and its Constitution, not the corporations and the worlds wealthy.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to raouldukelives (Reply #16)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 12:36 PM

21. Sometimes it's the only job with benefits in their area.

After the initial 9-11 rah-rah (which really only lasted about two years) that drove most of the applicants to the military over the last decade, a majority of the enlistees did so because of the lack of openings in what would normally be entry jobs in the private sector for young people.
When young people can't afford graduate school level training and middle aged workers are increasingly being laid off to "cut labor costs" (their jobs going overseas or going automated as still is the case now) - and government isn't hiring for infrastructure improvement - the military is still one of the few options open to those young potential workers. They don't have to compete with the increasing number of experianced, dependable (because they've got overwhelming bills to pay and families to support) and qualified (or overqualified) 50-year olds when they enlist.

It used to be called the poverty draft. Now, it's not just the poor youth that have few options.

Haele

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to raouldukelives (Reply #16)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 12:48 PM

24. I joined in 1997

I grew up in a republican leaning household and I saw what the government was doing with our military deployments during my childhood. As an 11 year old kid, I watched the first gulf war unfold and believed and followed it on TV. I saw the US involvement in the Balkans and in Haiti. I believed that the US military was a tool being used by our military to make the world a better place. I honestly felt that we had learned the lessons of Vietnam and would never entangle ourselves in a conflict like that again. I joined the army believing that I'd be contributing to make the world a better and safer place.

In 1998 I received an Army ROTC Scholarship and earned a degree in chemistry. I graduated in May 2002 and I volunteered to be an Infantry Office (I don't know what I was thinking). In 2004, I found myself spending 13 months in Iraq as an Infantry Platoon Leader and I saw first hand what war is all about and what our foreign policy means to the people who it is inflicted upon. That experience turned me HARD to the left with my ideals.

I started writing this with a specific intent of where I wanted my message to go, but I've lost my focus on where I was going with this. My head is kind of off in a different place today as today is one of those solemn anniversaries of one of those shitty sort of circumstances I experienced in the war. There are a couple of dates that are significant to me and this happens to be one of them.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Victor_c3 (Reply #24)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 03:53 PM

34. Sometimes we have to experience things firsthand before we can learn.

It can be a rude awakening. The only thing we can know for sure is what we ourselves do. In our hearts & our minds. You yourself are the only tool you need to make the world a better place. Our choices, and our reactions to our choices, define who we are.
You are a better person today because of your experiences and your reaction to them. When something is felt that you instinctively know is inherently wrong, only an unfeeling libertarian could continue in the charade.
I'm glad to be on your side. We still have time to make the world a better place.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to raouldukelives (Reply #34)

Fri Jan 25, 2013, 06:55 PM

38. I'm doing a lot better today

I have a lot of "ups" and "downs". Not that I was overwhelmed with a feeling of grief, I just get very spacey for a lack of a better term and find that I can't focus or deal with anything at times. (I do get a lot of help from the VA, in case you care to know.)

Thanks for your words and I couldn't agree with you more. The war helped to push me to the left and made me a lot more gentle of a person (the complete opposite of what happened to the character of Rambo). Having children really made me give a damn about trying to make the world around me a better place. Now, if I actually had some time to do something other than take care of my young family (both of my daughters are 2 and 4 years old), I'd be doing a lot more activist and volunteer work.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 11:49 AM

18. K&R

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 12:14 PM

20. General Smedley Butler: "War Is A Racket."

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 12:36 PM

22. It has ever been thus, as Kipling knew:

Tommy

I WENT into a public 'ouse to get a pint o'beer,
The publican 'e up an' sez, ``We serve no red-coats here.''
The girls be'ind the bar they laughed an' giggled fit to die,
I outs into the street again an' to myself sez I:

O it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' ``Tommy, go away'';
But it's ``Thank you, Mister Atkins,'' when the band begins to play,
The band begins to play, my boys, the band begins to play,
O it's ``Thank you, Mr. Atkins,'' when the band begins to play.

I went into a theatre as sober as could be,
They gave a drunk civilian room, but 'adn't none for me;
They sent me to the gallery or round the music 'alls,
But when it comes to fightin', Lord! they'll shove me in the stalls!

For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' ``Tommy, wait outside'';
But it's ``Special train for Atkins'' when the trooper's on the tide,
The troopship's on the tide, my boys, the troopship's on the tide,
O it's ``Special train for Atkins'' when the trooper's on the tide.

Yes, makin' mock o' uniforms that guard you while you sleep
Is cheaper than them uniforms, an' they're starvation cheap;
An' hustlin' drunken soldiers when they're goin' large a bit
Is five times better business than paradin' in full kit.

Then it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' ``Tommy how's yer soul?''
But it's ``Thin red line of 'eroes'' when the drums begin to roll,
The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
O it's ``Thin red line of 'eroes'' when the drums begin to roll.

We aren't no thin red 'eroes, nor we aren't no blackguards too,
But single men in barricks, most remarkable like you;
An' if sometimes our conduck isn't all your fancy paints:
Why, single men in barricks don't grow into plaster saints;

While it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an ``Tommy, fall be'ind,''
But it's ``Please to walk in front, sir,'' when there's trouble in the wind,
There's trouble in the wind, my boys, there's trouble in the wind,
O it's ``Please to walk in front, sir,'' when there's trouble in the wind.

You talk o' better food for us, an' schools, an' fires an' all:
We'll wait for extry rations if you treat us rational.
Don't mess about the cook-room slops, but prove it to our face
The Widow's Uniform is not the soldier-man's disgrace.

For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' ``Chuck him out, the brute!''
But it's ``Saviour of 'is country,'' when the guns begin to shoot;
Yes it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' anything you please;
But Tommy ain't a bloomin' fool--you bet that Tommy sees!


-- Mal

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 12:36 PM

23. It Is A Waste To Risk Your Life In The Military

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 12:54 PM

27. Agreed. Might say the same about any of our wars for proifit. After all, the oath is

"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic..."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 01:21 PM

31. Are you gonna' tell us what you really think of Walmart with the bark off?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Thu Jan 24, 2013, 02:35 PM

33. Been thinking the same thing.

Election rigging is the last straw. Corrupt scoundrels unworthy of the sacrifices made to "protect and defend." I hope they aren't so confused as to seriously expect many to come forward to "protect and defend" their little gerrymandered fascist dictatorship.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread