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Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:35 PM

Check In IF You Found All The Religious Crapola Disappointing

Because I sure did.

170 replies, 6668 views

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Arrow 170 replies Author Time Post
Reply Check In IF You Found All The Religious Crapola Disappointing (Original post)
stopbush Jan 2013 OP
The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2013 #1
Politicub Jan 2013 #2
RKP5637 Jan 2013 #9
union_maid Jan 2013 #17
Still Sensible Jan 2013 #6
Comrade_McKenzie Jan 2013 #7
RKP5637 Jan 2013 #13
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #108
RebelOne Jan 2013 #45
liberalmuse Jan 2013 #81
condoleeza Jan 2013 #127
Hekate Jan 2013 #137
RKP5637 Jan 2013 #3
Flashmann Jan 2013 #4
JoePhilly Jan 2013 #28
agracie Jan 2013 #56
GoneOffShore Jan 2013 #74
JoePhilly Jan 2013 #84
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #109
riderinthestorm Jan 2013 #5
RC Jan 2013 #34
riderinthestorm Jan 2013 #40
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #111
riderinthestorm Jan 2013 #124
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #110
Egalitarian Thug Jan 2013 #163
Brickbat Jan 2013 #8
phleshdef Jan 2013 #10
peace13 Jan 2013 #57
phleshdef Jan 2013 #61
glowy Jan 2013 #102
phleshdef Jan 2013 #107
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #114
Union Scribe Jan 2013 #131
Lars39 Jan 2013 #11
backwoodsbob Jan 2013 #12
Guy Whitey Corngood Jan 2013 #14
lonestarnot Jan 2013 #15
cynatnite Jan 2013 #16
Guy Whitey Corngood Jan 2013 #20
forestpath Jan 2013 #18
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #87
forestpath Jan 2013 #90
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #115
Jeff In Milwaukee Jan 2013 #151
Third Doctor Jan 2013 #19
yortsed snacilbuper Jan 2013 #21
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #89
NYC Liberal Jan 2013 #22
Duckhunter935 Jan 2013 #23
arely staircase Jan 2013 #24
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #25
Coyotl Jan 2013 #29
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #83
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #117
MessiahRp Jan 2013 #140
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #144
lindysalsagal Jan 2013 #31
AlbertCat Jan 2013 #80
lindysalsagal Jan 2013 #26
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #78
Coyotl Jan 2013 #27
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #86
Coyotl Jan 2013 #100
JoePhilly Jan 2013 #30
Taverner Jan 2013 #32
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #119
GoCubsGo Jan 2013 #33
Buzz Clik Jan 2013 #35
MineralMan Jan 2013 #43
Iggo Jan 2013 #36
nadinbrzezinski Jan 2013 #37
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #85
nadinbrzezinski Jan 2013 #93
Art_from_Ark Jan 2013 #136
Raine Jan 2013 #38
longship Jan 2013 #39
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #47
longship Jan 2013 #50
Bake Jan 2013 #105
longship Jan 2013 #129
MineralMan Jan 2013 #41
Arugula Latte Jan 2013 #42
AzDar Jan 2013 #44
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #46
riderinthestorm Jan 2013 #49
LanternWaste Jan 2013 #71
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #120
longship Jan 2013 #132
zappaman Jan 2013 #48
RebelOne Jan 2013 #160
hack89 Jan 2013 #51
Dawson Leery Jan 2013 #52
ScreamingMeemie Jan 2013 #53
HappyMe Jan 2013 #54
swayne Jan 2013 #55
LiberalElite Jan 2013 #67
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #121
Union Scribe Jan 2013 #133
Walk away Jan 2013 #58
slackmaster Jan 2013 #59
bvar22 Jan 2013 #60
riderinthestorm Jan 2013 #62
WinkyDink Jan 2013 #91
Number23 Jan 2013 #99
Richard D Jan 2013 #63
LiberalElite Jan 2013 #64
backscatter712 Jan 2013 #65
pnwmom Jan 2013 #66
robinlynne Jan 2013 #68
PerpetuallyDazed Jan 2013 #69
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #122
onenote Jan 2013 #70
progressoid Jan 2013 #142
onenote Jan 2013 #143
progressoid Jan 2013 #148
onenote Jan 2013 #149
iandhr Jan 2013 #72
adieu Jan 2013 #73
LWolf Jan 2013 #75
vduhr Jan 2013 #76
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #123
Spitfire of ATJ Jan 2013 #77
Speck Tater Jan 2013 #79
whatchamacallit Jan 2013 #82
treestar Jan 2013 #88
DavidDvorkin Jan 2013 #92
Lady Freedom Returns Jan 2013 #94
cordelia Jan 2013 #95
davidthegnome Jan 2013 #96
Skittles Jan 2013 #97
tularetom Jan 2013 #98
allGoodThings Jan 2013 #101
ann--- Jan 2013 #103
moondust Jan 2013 #104
NBachers Jan 2013 #106
Fumesucker Jan 2013 #113
Pisces Jan 2013 #112
Egalitarian Thug Jan 2013 #153
Pisces Jan 2013 #166
Egalitarian Thug Jan 2013 #167
Pisces Jan 2013 #170
Whisp Jan 2013 #116
Tikki Jan 2013 #118
Egalitarian Thug Jan 2013 #125
Union Scribe Jan 2013 #134
Egalitarian Thug Jan 2013 #146
kwassa Jan 2013 #147
onenote Jan 2013 #154
Egalitarian Thug Jan 2013 #162
onenote Jan 2013 #150
Egalitarian Thug Jan 2013 #152
onenote Jan 2013 #155
Egalitarian Thug Jan 2013 #156
onenote Jan 2013 #158
Egalitarian Thug Jan 2013 #161
ZombieHorde Jan 2013 #126
A HERETIC I AM Jan 2013 #128
RedCappedBandit Jan 2013 #130
JoeyT Jan 2013 #135
quinnox Jan 2013 #138
cali Jan 2013 #139
HappyMe Jan 2013 #141
quinnox Jan 2013 #145
mike_c Jan 2013 #157
onenote Jan 2013 #159
TheManInTheMac Jan 2013 #164
rainlillie Jan 2013 #169
rainlillie Jan 2013 #165
lanlady Jan 2013 #168

Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:36 PM

1. Speaking as a nonbeliever,

it didn't bother me at all.

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #1)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:37 PM

2. Same here. Today is for everyone.



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Response to Politicub (Reply #2)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:39 PM

9. Yeah, I wrote it off to part of the process ... as you said, "Today is for everyone." n/t

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Response to RKP5637 (Reply #9)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:42 PM

17. Me three

Didn't bother me. It was inclusive sort of religious stuff, too. But it is part of the process. Not going anywhere any time soon.

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #1)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:38 PM

6. Agreed. It is what it is. n/t

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #1)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:38 PM

7. Same. I felt the entire event was all-inclusive. nt

 

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Response to Comrade_McKenzie (Reply #7)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:40 PM

13. +++ 1,000 +++ n/t

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Response to Comrade_McKenzie (Reply #7)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 08:54 PM

108. EXACTLY. All-inclusive and nondenominational, and minimally religious.

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #1)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:35 PM

45. Ditto that. n/t

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #1)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:37 PM

81. Speaking as an atheist - me neither.

I tune it out.

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #1)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 10:04 PM

127. Nonbeliever here too, it's part of the territory, unfortunately

today wasn't anywhere near as obnoxious as I've seen in the past.

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #1)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 02:00 AM

137. I felt neither excluded nor disrespected. Public civic rituals always include a nod to God.

And today we had the most joyous gladsome public civic ritual in the catalog of public civic rituals: the second Inauguration of President Obama.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:37 PM

3. I get tired of it ... it seems to be a given part of the pomp and circumstance, I

wrote it off to that ...

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:38 PM

4. Didn't bother me

It soothes the torch and pitchfork bearing villagers......

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Response to Flashmann (Reply #4)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:09 PM

28. Actually, I think it drives them even crazier ...

to hear the atheist Muslim bad Christian Obama steal their God.

So given that it drives them nuts ... I'm all for it.

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Response to JoePhilly (Reply #28)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:31 PM

56. <snort>

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Response to JoePhilly (Reply #28)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:22 PM

74. I'm with you Joe.

It bothers the god-botherers and so that's fine with me.

Someday we'll be able to have public ceremonies without the mumbo-jumbo and the obligatory "God bless America".

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Response to GoneOffShore (Reply #74)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:39 PM

84. And I will add ...

Some very nice Americans appreciate the references to God. They pray positive prayers for America.

Then there are the nut jobs who hate him with a rare intensity. They're going nuts today. And I love it.

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Response to JoePhilly (Reply #28)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 08:55 PM

109. Excellent point, and I am with you all the way with that.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:38 PM

5. I really wish there wasn't such a heavy emphasis as well.



It feels as though the inauguration is turning into a religious test and not a secular ceremonial transfer of power (or renewal as this 2nd inauguration was today).





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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #5)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:18 PM

34. For having a "secular" government, we sure do wallow in a lot of religion at public political events

 

Even our money is unconstitutional.

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Response to RC (Reply #34)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:29 PM

40. Yup. I understand the pandering and religious stuff must be included to appease the believers

but truthfully its something that more Americans SHOULD be concerned about imho.

It doesn't bother me to the point of making an OP about it but if someone points it out, I'm entirely comfortable supporting their view.

We'll see another round of this when graduation season comes - believers who think us unbelievers should simply shut up and endure prayers at school events because its not a big deal.

It is really. But alas, no one's gonna take on this sacred cow. Literally.

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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #40)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:00 PM

111. Religion is on the decline in the US, contrary to what the christofascists would have us believe.

Eventually there won't be enough people who give a shit to keep the old traditions of public prayer going.

I know I certainly don't do anything to support or encourage it. I also don't cause a public scene over it.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #111)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:38 PM

124. Expressing an opinion on a private discussion board is "causing a public scene"? Really Kestrel?

All righty. I guess you've made yourself perfectly clear.

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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #5)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 08:57 PM

110. Well it doesn't violate our constitution. Not sure how it is in your country.

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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #5)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 04:22 PM

163. In the beginning we adopted Columbia to serve this purpose. The secular embodiment

 

of the U.S. Unfortunately, pandering to voter prejudice has always proven an effective means to office.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:38 PM

8. I always find it tiresome.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:39 PM

10. I don't give 2 shits.

I'm not a believer. But this country is definitely a country of believers. The vast majority of people in this country are religious. That's just the way it is. I accept it and move on. Its not like anyone is trying to force me to be something I'm not.

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Response to phleshdef (Reply #10)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:31 PM

57. If by religious you mean Christian...

I don't think they are the majority at this time.

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Response to peace13 (Reply #57)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:41 PM

61. Untrue. 73% of Americans identify as Christian.

But by religious, I meant people of faith in general, not just Christians.

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Response to phleshdef (Reply #61)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 07:41 PM

102. I really doubt that

 

a lot of people go to church, but they are just going through the motions

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Response to glowy (Reply #102)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 08:45 PM

107. If someone says they consider themselves a Christian, I just take their word for it.

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Response to glowy (Reply #102)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:02 PM

114. That would be me. I attend about once every 3 or 4 years, and mostly for Christmas music or Easter

decorations, lol. I do like to see different styles of religious services out of cultural curiosity.

I'd like to go to a Catholic Mass, for instance. Because it's such a quaint and ancient custom.

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Response to glowy (Reply #102)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 12:10 AM

131. So how do you quantify such percentages

if you're just going to call one group liars to fit your pre-conceived notions?

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:39 PM

11. I have to admit there was a lot of it,

But I think there was a reason for it. I think he's trying to reign in the fundies. Just my theory, but I think he's trying to defang them a bit.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:40 PM

12. every inauguration in history

has had religious overtones.It is what it is...didn't bother me

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:41 PM

14. I could've done without it but, it was a strong, powerful speech. nt

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:41 PM

15. What religious crapola?

Did you go to Church?

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:41 PM

16. I don't like the emphasis on it, but it wasn't overly bothersome. n/t

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Response to cynatnite (Reply #16)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:42 PM

20. Yup, pretty much. nt

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:42 PM

18. K&R Religion has no place in government - EVER.

 

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Response to forestpath (Reply #18)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:43 PM

87. Get over it. It's on our CURRENCY.

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #87)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:50 PM

90. And it shouldn't be. GET OVER IT YOURSELF.

 

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Response to forestpath (Reply #18)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:03 PM

115. No governing went on today. This was a glorified coming-out party.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #115)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 01:43 PM

151. Let's face it. It's an ecumenical church service.

Invocation. Benediction. Couple of hymns. The POTUS delivering the sermon.

It is what it is.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:42 PM

19. I didn't mind it.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:42 PM

21. god, protect me from your followers!

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Response to yortsed snacilbuper (Reply #21)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:46 PM

89. Irony:

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 12:43 PM

22. It was practically nothing compared to past ones.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:05 PM

23. no bother to me

To each his own and I know that I will not push my non-belief on others however I will not stop their belief from being observed. This is for all people.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:07 PM

24. if you had ever seen a presidential inaugural before you would have known what to expect

and therefore couldn't have been disappointed.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:07 PM

25. Oh, RILLY? You must have been "disappoint[ed]" every 4 years, then.

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #25)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:11 PM

29. Every day that Congress is in session is another afront to the Constitution when a prayer is said

The United States was created during the Age of Enlightenment and we seem to have been going backwards since then on the religious separation front.

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Response to Coyotl (Reply #29)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:39 PM

83. I know all about the Enlightenment and Deism, having taught some British history.

I ALSO know that these complaints today are RIDICULOUS in their IGNORING American tradition and EXPECTING that Obama somehow OFFEND the MAJORITY of Americans by going full-bore secular.

AND I strongly suspect that some are by, how to say this, non-fans of Obama.

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #83)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:05 PM

117. Careful with that type of thinking. You'll get in trouble like I did.

The coordinated attacks on "too much religion at this inauguration" seemed pretty obvious to me.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #117)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 09:52 AM

140. ^^ Oh Noes. The Religious people are being persecuted again! ^^

Give me a break. Catered to at every turn during election season, in Congress, by the Media and local businesses. There's a reason that America stays so Christian... a massive propaganda campaign has been waged for centuries here. So when a few atheists or non-believers call out the idiocy of pushing religion during government events or in government policy despite the forefathers' strong attempts at Separation of Church and State, you need to stop whining and crying about victimization. Christians are the LEAST victimized group in this country. They control EVERYTHING. In our previous Presidential Election, our candidates felt the need to go to a fucking church with fundie Rick Warren and pronounce who loved God MORE.

And you might be able to write off yesterday as a one off, if they didn't open every day in Congress with a Prayer, if Washington didn't push for prayer in schools or want public money to fund Christian Private Schools or if their Department of Defense wasn't allowing weapons manufacturers to put bible verses on weapons used against Muslims or if they weren't indoctrinating soldiers into Christianity in the military ranks....

So yes, this was one event but it was a microcosm of the rest of the situation here in America.

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Response to MessiahRp (Reply #140)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 11:26 AM

144. I am completely opposed to all the things you list

but I am NOT opposed to nondenominational invocations and benedictions at a celebratory function full of centuries of tradition.

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #25)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:13 PM

31. Until the 1950's, during McCarthyism, we weren't one nation under god.

So, yeah, people who are able to live without the magic crutch/ giant daddy in the sky/ group mania are disappointed every time we have to endure other people's religious posturing.

Every chance they get, they try to shove an imaginary god down our throats, all while conducting wars and starving the poor and refusing health care to the poor....

It's all window dressing, and we tire of it.

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Response to lindysalsagal (Reply #31)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:36 PM

80. Until the 1950's,

Excellent post! My thoughts as well.

Mainly.... who wants a government that depends on the supernatural for help???? No one. Not even the religious. It's just more "you can't have morals/good judgement without religion" BS.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:09 PM

26. He more than made up for it with the really inclusive benediction, IMHO

It would have been the next impeachable scandal had he erased all the religious traditions. More important fires to put out.

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Response to lindysalsagal (Reply #26)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:35 PM

78. So which is it, then?

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:09 PM

27. Disappointing would be an understatement. It is a scandal of Constitutional proportions

and the irrepentant pandering to the religiously deluded is contrary to the founding ideals of the nation.

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Response to Coyotl (Reply #27)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:41 PM

86. Did you post this in January, 2001?

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #86)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 07:35 PM

100. You can't imagine what I spewed on Junta day.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:11 PM

30. I demand equal time every year at Thanksgiving after my father-in-law

says grace.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:14 PM

32. As an Atheist....

 

And a Positive Atheist at that...

I have no problem with it. The President is a Christian, and I respect that.

Not the beliefs behind it, but I respect his right to practice and will stand in solidarity with ANYONE who shows empathy

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Response to Taverner (Reply #32)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:08 PM

119. THANK YOU.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:16 PM

33. Yes, and I thinking that during the ceremony.

I wish for the day when this kind of thing is irrelevant. We're inaugurating a president, not a pope.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:19 PM

35. No.

You need to rethink your avatar.

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Response to Buzz Clik (Reply #35)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:32 PM

43. +1

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:19 PM

36. I'm tired of it in general...

...but some of this ceremonial shit...well, you just gotta let it slide.

There's another thread somewhere on DU where someone posted that they changed the channel when Battle Hymn Of The Republic came on. Like they weren't going to change the channel when the holy-joe said his prayer, or when The Prez put his hand on the bible, and "so help me god", and "god bless America", and everything else that's part of the show.

So yeah, I'm tired of it. I don't like it. I'm sure as hell disappointed that we as a culture haven't progressed beyond this childish hocus-pocus. But we is where we is, kids.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:21 PM

37. Point to one inauguration in US history without any of this

You mean you can't...

The us is the most religious advanced economy. And I say this as somebody who does not believe in God.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #37)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:40 PM

85. The multiple posts of gripes are verging on the disingenuous, for me.

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #85)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 04:05 PM

93. I might agree that I'd prefer a 100% secular ceremony

But this is not the place to pick a fight. Hell, how many of these folks realize there is an invocation at the begining of business in every level of government? They are sincere, remove them from insert city council here...start there.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #37)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 01:54 AM

136. Thomas Jefferson's First Inaugural Address

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:25 PM

38. Nope, didn't bother me. I was focused on the history & beauty of it. nt

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:26 PM

39. I found it off-putting and exclusionary.

In a most disgusting way. I know Barack Obama is religious, and that's fine with me. But the inauguration is a civil ceremony, not a freaking church service. There is absolutely no need for all these prayers. They just did another before the luncheon under the Capital Rotundra.

It's all crapola. If people want to pray, they are free to do so. But it does not belong in these strictly civil proceedings.

And I don't give a shit whether Washington had a prayer or not. That would have made him wrong as well. Thomas Paine is rolling in his grave.

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Response to longship (Reply #39)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:43 PM

47. The civil, legal ceremony was YESTERDAY. This was a public

celebration and there is NO obligation to omit spiritual matters.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #47)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:22 PM

50. Do you mean...

...that it would been inappropriate to frame the inaugural in such religiosity if it hadn't been that January 20, 2013 was a Sunday? Which was the sole reason why Barack Obama was administered an oath Sunday, and on Monday.

His presidency ended at midnight Sunday, January 20, 2013. If he had not taken the oath officially on that date, the US would not have a president until he took the oath today. That is why when inaugural day, January 20, is on a Sunday the president is officially inaugurated that day, and then the public inauguration is a mere symbolic echo.

The most important questions here might very well be:

1. What's wrong with inaugurating a president on Sunday? Especially since it is going to be inevitably wrapped in such disgusting religiosity?

2. What would Jewish citizens think if the inauguration was on Saturday? I ask this question with tongue in cheek. Since Christians are the ones who make the first day of the week the seventh day of the week. Maybe the majority of this country is Christian, but this is by no measure a Christian country.

There is nothing in the US Constitution that forbids the oath of office happening on Sunday. The fact that Barack Obama, and other presidents before him, took the actual oath on that day speaks volumes.

If I were elected president and my inaugural day fell on a Sunday, that is the day I would do the public ceremony.

Fuck this Sunday exclusion. It's just a day of the week, like every other. For many, there is no difference, even many religious people.

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Response to longship (Reply #39)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 08:20 PM

105. You're wrong. Inauguration Day is the High Holy Day of our "civil religion"

Always has been. It never has been a "strictly civil proceeding." Sorry that disgusts you, but that's the way it is.

Bake

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Response to Bake (Reply #105)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 11:59 PM

129. Gees Louise! I am not buying that. nt

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:30 PM

41. I've been an atheist since 1965, and it didn't bother me.

Every inauguration includes some religious references. Why? Because Christianity is the dominant religion in this country. Why should anyone be surprised.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:31 PM

42. Yep. To quote Dieter: Religious ones, "your story has become tiresome."

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:35 PM

44. I'm always hopeful that at some point our country will be able to shake off these binding chains...

of superstition and divisiveness.

We'll be better for it.


Someday.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:42 PM

46. Please explain how this particular inauguration was ANY different in this regard

from any OTHER presidential inauguration. I'll be waiting for your detailed response.

I bet you never cared when it was Bush and his overtly Christian and discriminatory/exclusionary claptrap, either.

This was a very typical inaugural ceremony. I didn't smell anything denominational.

But thanks for promoting this falsehood. Enjoy that paycheck, too!

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #46)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:13 PM

49. I can't speak for the OP but this one's not any different. Therein lies the problem.

Religion shouldn't be a part of a secular transfer of power (or a reaffirmation of power as is the case of a second term).

This isn't about a comparison contest. Its just an observation that its tiresome that it has to have this much religiosity at all. For either party.

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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #49)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:12 PM

71. Symbolism should divest itself of symbolism.

"Religion shouldn't be a part of a secular transfer of power (or a reaffirmation of power as is the case of a second term)."

Ie., Symbolism should divest itself of symbolism. The imaginary should deny the imaginary. Many wholly make-believe constructs (politics and economics) should never recognize the existence of other make-believe constructs (religion) because that would be silly/exclusionary/too imaginary...

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Response to riderinthestorm (Reply #49)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:13 PM

120. This was not a secular transfer of power. That happened yesterday.

Today was a coming out party of sorts.

I refuse to get my panties in a wad over this. Virtually nobody bitched when Bush declared this a Christian nation on more than one occasion. THAT was a problem

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #120)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 12:14 AM

132. The only reason there was an oath yesterday was that it was Sunday!

And that was the day his term ended and the public inaugural ceremony is not held on Sunday because it is the freaking Christian sabbath.

So much for your argument.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 01:43 PM

48. As an aetheist

I couldn't care less.

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Response to zappaman (Reply #48)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 03:26 PM

160. Atheist here also and I could also care less.

To each his/her own and whatever floats their boat.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:24 PM

51. Nope - thought it was very appropriate. nt

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:24 PM

52. At least the evangelical kooks were not invited to this one.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:27 PM

53. If this is all you have to worry about today...well then...

Yay for you. Your life must be super awesome.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:27 PM

54. So, no comment about the President's speech.

Just complaining.

Have you never, ever watched an inauguration before.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:30 PM

55. I don't see anyone "establishing" religion. Let's not become "kooks" like the right wingers.

 

We'll suck one this issue as much as they do on others if we started acting and talking sh*t on this.


Leave it alone. We (progressives) can't win this fight to destroy religion, any more than religion can destroy government.

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Response to swayne (Reply #55)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:05 PM

67. What "fight to destroy religion"?

Now, that sounds like a right wing sound bite. I'm not out to destroy religion, it just annoys me to hear so many prayerful references to it in what is a SECULAR country.

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Response to LiberalElite (Reply #67)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:14 PM

121. Thank you for your concern.

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Response to LiberalElite (Reply #67)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 12:15 AM

133. So they can have their religion

as long as it's in a basement and never ever mentioned in public. The Obamas should have a priest hole in the White House, lol. I don't know what dictionary some of you are using, or what Constitution you're looking at, but you have absolutely zero right to live free of other people's--including the President's--references to their religion.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:35 PM

58. My dream on MLK day is that religion will someday be abolished from our....

government. It has no place and it is offensive and dangerous to celebrate a "christian", "muslim" or "jewish" agenda. Until that day finally comes I'll just have to take the slap in the face that my fellow Americans feel free to deal me.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:36 PM

59. It's the President's prerogative.

 

Complain to him about it if you feel strongly enough to bother.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:39 PM

60. I remember JFK's inagural address in 1961.

the "ask not what your country can do for you--ask what you can do for your country" speech.

I was 10 years old at the time,
and couldn't recall any god, deity, religion, or churches being mentioned at all.
So I looked up the text of the speech,
and found that I was wrong.
JFK DID mention "god" 3 times.

Mention #1, in paragraph 1:
"For I have sworn before you and Almighty God the same solemn oath our forbears prescribed nearly a century and three-quarters ago.


Mention #2, in paragraph 2:
"And yet the same revolutionary beliefs for which our forebears fought are still at issue around the globe--the belief that the rights of man come not from the generosity of the state but from the hand of God.


Mention #3, in the closing sentence:
"With a good conscience our only sure reward, with history the final judge of our deeds, let us go forth to lead the land we love, asking His blessing and His help, but knowing that here on earth God's work must truly be our own."


I wouldn't call that speech full of "Religious Crapola"
In fact, THAT speech was about as Non-Religious as it is possible to get.

Those in this thread insisting that ALL inaugurals are a God/Religion Love Fest,
really should go read JFK's Inaugural Address.

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2011/0120/JFK-s-1961-inaugural-address-The-text



You will know them by their WORKS,
not by their rhetoric, promises, or excuses.
Solidarity99!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #60)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:48 PM

62. I'm actually amused bvar. Its not more or less religious imho from past inaugurals.

So those who are positing that it is, or isn't, are amusing to me. I don't see anyone really making that argument though.

What SOME DUers are saying is that its a shame that there has to be (or is already included) so much religiosity at all. That it should be a secular transfer of power and that the demonstrable religious aspects should be left off.

Its definitely very low on the scale of things to complain about today. Its just DU doing its thing. All in all, it was a lovely ceremony. I thoroughly enjoyed watching it. President Obama's speech completely rocked - it was everything I wished it would be.

Looking forward to a great next four years. Thanks for the JFK references. I loved them.





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Response to bvar22 (Reply #60)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:50 PM

91. You really needed to research more (I was 10, also):

January 20, 1961 inaugural of John F. Kennedy
--Invocation by His Eminence Cardinal Richard Cushing - Catholic
--Prayer by His Eminence Iakovos, Greek Orthodox
--Prayer by Rev. Dr. John Barclay, pastor of the Central Christian Church of Austin, Texas
--Benediction by Rabbi Nelson Glueck - Jewish

1961 - John F. Kennedy attended the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass at Holy Trinity Church.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prayers_at_United_States_presidential_inaugurations

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #91)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 05:56 PM

99. Thread winner.



Wow. That's gonna leave a mark.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 02:58 PM

63. Not so much disappointing . . .

. . . as much as dated and unnecessary.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:00 PM

64. me too eom

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:01 PM

65. I am glad Obama's inauguration people sent that anti-gay fundie packing...

and replaced him with a pastor with a decently positive message.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:01 PM

66. I loved it when the orthodox Archbishop said this was the greatest honor of his life.

So, no, I'm not disappointed.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:07 PM

68. I noticed Jesus was very present. didn't think anyone else would notice.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:08 PM

69. I found it disappointing because it's always expected...

and no one yet has exhibited the braveness to buck tradition. I suspect things will be better in another generation or so.

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Response to PerpetuallyDazed (Reply #69)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:18 PM

122. Obama in particular has to tread very carefully here, what with the constant

FALSE accusation of being a muslim. He knows he would be unwise to give the christofascists any ammunition against him in that regard. And going secular would make them go ballistic (probably literally).

Nothing Obama or any other person in the inauguration said did anything harmful to nonreligious Americans.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:12 PM

70. yeah, all this religious "crapola" on the birthday of Reverend Martin Luther King, Jr.

The nerve.

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Response to onenote (Reply #70)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 11:16 AM

142. Seems to me this was an inauguration.

But if we are talking about MLK Day, isn't that a celebration of his civil rights leadership rather than his faith?

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Response to progressoid (Reply #142)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 11:23 AM

143. If you know anything about Reverend King

you know that his faith was inseparable from his civil rights leadership, as was the faith of many others (and not just Christians) that fought for civil rights.

Which is why the antipathy and, in many cases, outright hostitlity, shown on DU to people of faith is so boneheaded.

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Response to onenote (Reply #143)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 01:31 PM

148. So that's what we were celebrating yesterday?

Faith?

There's another boneheaded idea that a lot of Americans have - a separation between church and state.

oh well.

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Response to progressoid (Reply #148)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 01:39 PM

149. we were celebrating two things: the inauguration of a president and the life of great man

And that great man happened to be a man of faith, a minister of his church whose life was informed by and guided by his religious beliefs.

And nothing in the Constitution requires us to sweep under a rug the fact that he was a man of faith. Unless of course you think it was a violation of church and state to even make the birthday of a minister a federal holiday.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:15 PM

72. The Battle Hymn of the Republic is an American classic.

The fact that a hero of the civil rights movement did the invocation and a very progressive minister did the benidiction I thought was great.

And I consider myself to agnostic.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:18 PM

73. Being an atheist

Of course!

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:25 PM

75. A little.

It's exclusive, not inclusive.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:31 PM

76. Not at all.

I'm Agnostic, but it's part of the ceremony. What I found annoying was the poetry.

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Response to vduhr (Reply #76)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:20 PM

123. I don't really care much for either Kelly Clarkson or Beyonce. They both annoyed me far more

than any gratuitous, rote reference to God.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:34 PM

77. To me, it was about like this....



It's all part of the show.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:36 PM

79. Why would I be disappointed in something that lets me feel superior?

 

Every chance to smile condescendingly upon our inferiors should be treasured, not regretted.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:39 PM

82. Obviously, separation of church and state isn't important

when we're in power.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 03:43 PM

88. I expected it, so there is no way to be disappointed

I do think even religious people need to recognize that the government is secular and that the government never mentioning God is a good thing, in recognition that it is secular and that if the government never mentions religion, then religion is safe from the government. They fail to understand that their very religious freedom is based upon the fact the government does not recognize their religion either.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 04:02 PM

92. It was more than disappointing. It was obnoxious.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 04:10 PM

94. It is part of the traditions.

It is like England having a bunch of Ravens at the Tower of London.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 04:11 PM

95. Not in the least.

Been a part of the ritual for a long time and will be for a long, long time to come.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 04:11 PM

96. I found it remarkably irrelevant

But I'm checking in anyway, because I find the outrage ridiculous. Just thought I'd drop by to say amen, you know? Amen.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 05:30 PM

97. so used to it I just tune it out

accept that great majority of the world cannot live in the real world without believing in whatever it takes to help them live in the real world

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 05:52 PM

98. Didn't bother me because I did not watch it

I knew there was no place I could watch without getting pissed off. Not necessarily with the religious stuff although that was part of it. What's worse is the politicizing and labeling of every aspect of the ceremony. "Liberals" will like a certain statement but "conservatives" will object to it. Or vice versa. As if every issue and everybody can be pigeonholed into a neat little category.

I sure as hell was not going to watch on Fox or CNN and I knew MSNBC would have that drooling idiot Chris Matthews on so that was out too.

It was the first warm day we've had in about a month so I spent the day outside pruning, irrigating and getting our vegetable garden ready for planting.

Seems I missed an inspiring speech from the president but I'm sure he'll make more of them.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 07:36 PM

101. I do too.

It isn't necessary

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 07:46 PM

103. So did I and

I'm a student of Buddhism. All that seems like "fakery" to me and is certainly not needed at a GOVERNMENT sponsored event like an inauguration. I think an appropriate "moment of silence" at the ceremony and at lunch would have been enough for people of ALL faiths (or non-faith) to think for one moment what this event really means in a democracy. And, to silently wish/pray for our president and other elected officials to be responsive to ALL its citizens in the coming 4 years.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 08:10 PM

104. I think some people feel more comfortable

just hearing those holding temporal power acknowledge that they are not God, that there is a higher power than themselves--even if they don't believe it.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 08:24 PM

106. Jesus Christ will you give it a fuckin' rest?

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Response to NBachers (Reply #106)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:02 PM

113. Yeah, that's pretty much what the OP wants, give Jesus Christ a rest He's all worn out n/t

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:01 PM

112. Get over yourself!! 80% of this country which Obama represents is religious!!

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Response to Pisces (Reply #112)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 01:59 PM

153. Yeah, fuck those one out five Americans!

 


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Response to Egalitarian Thug (Reply #153)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 06:16 PM

166. Close your ears when the prayer part comes. I am not religious and somehow found it ok to listen

during the prayer.

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Response to Pisces (Reply #166)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 07:29 PM

167. I don't really care one way or the other, but I find the utter lack of empathy astonishing.

 

This is the equivalent of our government talking about any minority being subhuman, beneath consideration. Sure it went on for decades for them as well, and just like the atheists, they were expected to shut up and take it because they're a small minority.

It's times like this that I really think the world would be far better off without humans.

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Response to Egalitarian Thug (Reply #167)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 08:13 PM

170. Wrong, Obama has always mentioned nonbelievers. You are trying to make an issue of a non issue.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:04 PM

116. I didn't notice. I tune out all that religious crapola. n/t

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:08 PM

118. It just feeds to a different crowd...

It's kinda like when Wall Street talks about pork-bellies..

But, whatever...doesn't change my non believer World a bit...



Tikki



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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:38 PM

125. The American Taliban, and by that I mean all of the desperately wishful that devote so much of their

 

lives trying to appease a fantasy-daddy, is destroying this nation.

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Response to Egalitarian Thug (Reply #125)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 12:15 AM

134. Obama = Taliban. Good contribution dude. nt

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Response to Union Scribe (Reply #134)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 11:56 AM

146. Delusion is delusion, who it is that holds the delusion doesn't matter.

 

If you honestly believe in the existence of some omnipotent, invisible sky-daddy that is capable of make everything better, then relying on this fantasy being to do so becomes a viable possibility, and that is not a good thing. It allows for both inaction when action is required and abdication of responsibility, neither trait has any place in governance.

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Response to Egalitarian Thug (Reply #146)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 12:19 PM

147. Whatever. Can I hook you up to the live feed of the presidential prayer service happening now at

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Response to kwassa (Reply #147)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 02:07 PM

154. No thanks. Not interested.

Not bothered by it either. It also doesn't bother me if and when the president goes to church on Sunday or if he says grace before eating meals. That's his prerogative.

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Response to kwassa (Reply #147)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 03:35 PM

162. Whatever, no. n/t

 

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Response to Egalitarian Thug (Reply #146)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 01:41 PM

150. And yet it was exactly that: an honest belief in some "omnipotent sky daddy" that enabled and

inspired Martin Luther King to become the great leader of the civil rights movement. And why so many other great leaders of the civil rights movement came out of religious traditions. Explain that "inaction" thing to me again.

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Response to onenote (Reply #150)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 01:57 PM

152. You give credit where none exists and proceed from that false premise.

 

Your reply states that these people's actions were due to their religiosity without any evidence that those people would not have taken those actions without it.

It credits religion with the good done by people, but ignores the bad things done in the name of religion, which is typical of the religiously deluded. Good things are due to God, bad things are the fault of someone/thing else.

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Response to Egalitarian Thug (Reply #152)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 02:09 PM

155. Now you're just embarassing yourself.

Not sure why you are so quick to show off how little you know about Dr. King, but that's your choice. If you would like to actually learn more about him and how important religion was to his civil rights activism, I suggest you read up on Howard Thurman, the book Jesus and the Disinherited, and Dr. King.

For the record, I'm not a Christian, and never have been.
Also for the record, good things are done by religious people and bad things are done religous people. Sometimes religion, or that person's understanding of religion, is very influential in why they do good things and sometimes its very influential in why they do bad things. And of course, not being a religious person doesn't make you a good person or a bad person either.

In Dr. King's case, it was undeniably an important positive influence despite your apparent wish to ignore that facet of his life.

And finally, for the record, I don't think that Dr. King would have had the same influence and impact had he not presented his views from the perspective of a minister. Churches were at the heart of the civil rights movement because churches were at the heart of the African-American community.

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Response to onenote (Reply #155)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 02:20 PM

156. So, you have no argument and resort to insult. Again, typical.

 


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Response to Egalitarian Thug (Reply #156)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 02:47 PM

158. Sorry if you feel insulted. But you are pretending to know things you don't know about Dr. King.

Last edited Tue Jan 22, 2013, 03:37 PM - Edit history (1)

Might Dr. King have been a great civil rights leader without being a minister? Maybe. Certainly not impossible. But the point isn't that he might have achieved great things without being directly inspired by his religious faith. The point is that he WAS directly inspired by his religious faith and thus it is an important part of who he is and what he accomplished.

I have many friends that were first inspired to get involved in politics by John F. Kennedy. Might they have gotten involved anyway? Of course. But that doesn't change the fact that they were inspired by JFK and that his inspiration plays a large part in who they are and what they think about government service and it would be presenting a less than full picture of their lives to pretend otherwise.

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Response to onenote (Reply #158)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 03:34 PM

161. I'm not insulted at all, but that was clearly your intent.

 

You are still trying to argue that same false premise.

MLK's leadership and speaking skills were what enabled him to what he did.

I think that, judging by his background and his own words, we can be pretty sure that he would credit his faith with his achievements, but that credit doesn't alter the reality that it was he, the man, that did those things, not some phantom wielding his magical wand from on high. Now, why not wonder how many other potential MLKs didn't achieve what he did years earlier because their faith lead them to leave it up to God?

My point was twofold and remains. The absence of belief in a myth does not preclude accomplishment, but it does open the possibility of either relying on that myth to take the necessary actions or for abdicating responsibility for actions taken and that's the problem with this mass delusion that increasingly blurs the line between faith and government.

We have, more now than ever before, an enormous population that believes in the literal existence of a delusion, and further, they believe that we must place the future of our nation and probably the world into the non-existent hands of these delusions. Pandering to insanity is a bad idea and not that long ago almost everybody understood this.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 09:47 PM

126. I didn't watch it, so it didn't bother me in the slightest. nt

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Mon Jan 21, 2013, 10:10 PM

128. Listening to it on the radio..

While working/driving today, I caught only snippets. If I didn't know better, I would have thought I had a religious station tuned instead of NPR.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 12:06 AM

130. It simply does not belong in government.

We need laws based on science and reason, not myth and superstition.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 01:02 AM

135. Meh.

Had he not sprinkled his speech with at least SOME references to religious stuff, many people would have lost their minds. Given all the stuff we're trying to accomplish, I think in his shoes I might have tossed some in too, just to keep the resistance from our own side to a minimum, and I'm an atheist.

I would think that to find it disappointing I would have to have assumed it wasn't going to be there in the first place, which is a mighty big assumption.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 06:41 AM

138. I didn't see any of it, and skipped it on purpose but

 

it sounds like it was almost a church service in the preaching and religious stuff. That would have been very off-putting to me.

The main reason, is it perpetuates the notion that "GOD favors the United States" and "We are the country GOD backs" This is something I have a huge problem with, because it goes hand in hand with jingoism and hyper-patriotism and leads people to think no matter what, our country is doing the right thing and we are always noble in our actions. I see this attitude a lot, even on DU.

Especially when we have morally bankrupt policies of assassinating anyone in the world we choose to, and the innocent victims that are killed is just considered unfortunate collateral damage. Moral bankruptcy should not be backed up and sanctioned by supposed divine approval.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #138)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 06:44 AM

139. lol. you didn't see it or hear it but of course you don't let that little tiny detail

stop you from pontificating.

I do so love the stench of hypocrisy emanating from thee.

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Response to quinnox (Reply #138)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 09:59 AM

141. Why, if you didn't see it,

are you commenting on it? Why are you even here?

I would suggest you look to the other side of the aisle for true moral bankruptcy.

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Response to HappyMe (Reply #141)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 11:27 AM

145. I can piece together what it was like from reading various posts on DU

 

Kind of like I don't need to go see some stupid torture porn horror movie to know I will hate it, I can tell just by reading the reviews.

It doesn't take a Sherlock Holmes to figure some things out like this really.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 02:34 PM

157. skipped it altogether but I despise religous claptrap....

When the praying and praising invisible friends starts, I stop paying attention.

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Response to mike_c (Reply #157)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 02:57 PM

159. So you've never listened to Dr. King's entire I Have A Dream Speech

Or his Drum Major Instict sermon, or his Eulogy for the Martyred Children of Birmingham AL.

Good for you??

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 04:24 PM

164. I didn't pay any attention to it but, given all the outrage caused by it,

I'm delighted. Love seeing people offended, disgusted, or otherwise disgusted by stupid shit they don't even believe in.

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Response to TheManInTheMac (Reply #164)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 07:54 PM

169. I agree. You know what's funny.. Is some folks on the right

bitch if he doesn't put God in, and Some folks on the left bitch if he does put God in. Unbelievable!

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 04:25 PM

165. Typical is rather boring.

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Response to stopbush (Original post)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 07:38 PM

168. all the more reason...

... to hope we'll have an atheist president in our lifetime.

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