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Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:08 PM

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This message was self-deleted by its author (In Truth We Trust) on Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:52 AM. When the original post in a discussion thread is self-deleted, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.

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Reply This message was self-deleted by its author (Original post)
In Truth We Trust Jan 2013 OP
immoderate Jan 2013 #1
In Truth We Trust Jan 2013 #6
ZombieHorde Jan 2013 #2
Walk away Jan 2013 #10
Glassunion Jan 2013 #12
MrSlayer Jan 2013 #3
In Truth We Trust Jan 2013 #9
ProgressiveProfessor Jan 2013 #13
In Truth We Trust Jan 2013 #15
MrSlayer Jan 2013 #25
Bjorn Against Jan 2013 #27
Glassunion Jan 2013 #4
LeftyMom Jan 2013 #5
Kalidurga Jan 2013 #7
In Truth We Trust Jan 2013 #17
Kalidurga Jan 2013 #19
In Truth We Trust Jan 2013 #24
Kalidurga Jan 2013 #26
Walk away Jan 2013 #8
Motown_Johnny Jan 2013 #11
In Truth We Trust Jan 2013 #14
nadinbrzezinski Jan 2013 #16
rrneck Jan 2013 #18
In Truth We Trust Jan 2013 #21
rrneck Jan 2013 #22
datasuspect Jan 2013 #20
backscatter712 Jan 2013 #23
In Truth We Trust Jan 2013 #28
Nye Bevan Jan 2013 #29
cthulu2016 Jan 2013 #30

Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:17 PM

1. Mental health care and victim support should be shouldered by gamers...

and movie goers? Why not sushi lovers and ballroom dancers?

--imm

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Response to immoderate (Reply #1)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:23 PM

6. Not soley funded by such a tax but hell yes a violence tax should be levied on producers of said

violence as a supplement to the already too low funding in those area's. It would also make a societal value statement and curb albeit very little, some of the pervasive violence in our "entertainment industry".

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:20 PM

2. I advocate for a gratuitous tax on country music.

The money will go towards commercials making fun of people who are country music enthusiasts.

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Response to ZombieHorde (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:33 PM

10. Except for George Strait. nt

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Response to ZombieHorde (Reply #2)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:40 PM

12. Is Johnny Cash considered country?

If so then we have a problem.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:20 PM

3. Why?

 

What do movies and video games have to do with mental health or victims of whatever?

Who decides when the level of violence becomes gratuitous enough to tax?

As much as the gun nuts have lost their collective minds over simple safety measures, so too has the other side lost it in other ways.

If you want to tax something, tax guns and ammo. It costs enough to go to a movie or buy a game as it is.

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Response to MrSlayer (Reply #3)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:31 PM

9. Violent movies and 1st person shooter games have been directly linked to mass murderers. I totally

agree with your last point re taxing guns and ammo after regulating and banning assault weapons and absurd 30-100 round clips.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Reply #9)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:45 PM

13. Isn't that an NRA talking point?

I saw it called that here on DU

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Response to ProgressiveProfessor (Reply #13)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:50 PM

15. What are you referring to;where I stated we should BAN assault weapons and regulate the gun industry

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Reply #9)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:22 AM

25. I've yet to see a direct link between games or movies to mass killings.

 

And I don't buy it. Movies, games, D&D and Heavy Metal are not to blame for what maniacal idiots do any more than the Beatles should be blamed for how Charles Manson interpreted the White Album.

Nope. Not buying.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Reply #9)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:30 AM

27. Violent movies and video games are linked to the large majority of Americans.

Even most people who don't play games watch a violent movie on occasion. Finding out a killer played video games is like finding out a killer watched television, it is a stretch to say because a killer played games the games caused the killings.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:22 PM

4. Sweet!

We can call it the "Art has no place in our society" tax.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:23 PM

5. I advocate a tax on overly simplistic OPs.

As part of my pilot program you're going to need to Paypal me a quarter.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:24 PM

7. Good luck with your thought policing.

We should tax meat as well because producing meat causes a lot of environmental destruction. And then we can put a higher tax on sugar because it makes people sick and that causes higher medical bills. Then you can put a higher tax on porn because it can cause men to treat women like objects rather than people and it leads to violence against women. Oh, and put a really high tax on reality shows, because they dumb down this country.

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Response to Kalidurga (Reply #7)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:55 PM

17. I don't know that I would chacterize a tax on gratuitous violence as thought policing. You're free

produce but it will cost you to do so with earmarks to those directly affected or potentially affected. We social engineer with every tax. I repeat; every tax is a social engineering.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Reply #17)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:02 AM

19. No duh every tax is social engineering.

Why do you think I called this thought policing?

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Response to Kalidurga (Reply #19)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:19 AM

24. You are right to the degree that in essensce it is a tax on a gratuitous form of violence/expression

however it is NOT thought police in the sense that there would be a prohibition of it. It is a societal value judgment much like cigarette taxation. We know cigarettes are harmful and are responsible for more deaths in this country than guns but they are not banned. They are taxed extensively though. So you are free to produce violent media just like you can smoke too; you're just going to pay a gratuitous violence tax on it.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Reply #24)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:24 AM

26. We should tax meat a lot higher then...

since that is gratuitous violence that actually ends in something dying.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:31 PM

8. I have never heard of someone picking up a violent movie and ...

beating someone with it. I guess it happens but I think a lot more people use guns to kill and maim.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:36 PM

11. and tax "Hot Wheels" to pay for traffic accidents...

makes sense to me!





They have the same movies and games in Japan, Canada and the UK. They can't be the problem because if they were then those countries would have the same problem we do. They don't.

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Response to Motown_Johnny (Reply #11)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:47 PM

14. I am NOT saying this is a solution to the whole problem. Naturally the ease of access and

pervasiveness of guns is the problem-of course. I am suggesting that a society that values human life should not look like what is reflected in gratuitously violent media/gaming. Is it really acceptable that by the time a child matures he/she will have been exposed to tens of thousands of acts of violence on tv, in movies, and from 1st person shooter games.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Reply #14)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:54 PM

16. Of course Canada has lots of guns.

Oh wait...they also got like for real...LICENSING.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 11:59 PM

18. Great idea!

So would the tax be waived if the motivations of those doing violence are noble or the violence justified and unavoidable?

How would you measure this violence? Is plowing a field of weeds doing violence to them? Or would you go strictly by body count? Of course if you only taxed the body count, how would you tax movies like Saw that specialize in violent torture? Of course if you include every type of violence known to man, how would you tax implied violence? You know, when the camera cuts away from the action, but the viewer is left to imagine what happens. The violence is still in their head, so I guess you would have to find a way to measure what they imagined to tax it. The IRS will love that.

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Response to rrneck (Reply #18)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:08 AM

21. I think "Gratuitous " could be fairly easily defined by most reasonable people. I believe you drew

some good distinctions in your questions.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Reply #21)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:11 AM

22. You can't quantify content to tax it.

It ain't doable. It's not the violence, or even the quantity of violence, but why it occurs and why people expose themselves to it.

They tried to outlaw porn and look what happened.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:02 AM

20. they should put a gratuitous tax on traditional blues or jimmie rodgers yodeling music

 

ol' jimmie was always fixin to ice a rounder, buying rounds of ball, and otherwise being a son of a gun.

skip james wanted to shoot crow jane just to see her fall.

etc.

this shit is getting more and more absurd by the minute around here.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:18 AM

23. So how do you define "gratuitous" violence?

We've had this argument for decades over stuff like pornography, erotic novels & the like - what's the difference between Real Art (TM) and "gratuitious sex" or "gratuitous violence", or stuff that "appeals to a pruient interest"?

Gonna tax movie depictions of scenes from the Bible? Because the Bible has a lot of stories of insane violence & nasty sex! How about Shakespeare! The Bard got pretty bawdy at times, and Hamlet gratuitously killed a few people in his quest for vengeance.

We have a First Amendment in this country. Taxing creative content based on the type of content will not pass Constitutional muster.

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Response to backscatter712 (Reply #23)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:45 AM

28. I began to respond to your post with comments left below but after really thinking about the full

implications of your last paragraph I find myself in full agreement Backscatter. My proposition is wrong for the reason you mentioned. Thank you.

I was just thinking that it would be possible to draw reasonable definitions and oversight without infringing upon peoples rights under the First Amendment by invoking something much like the "Fire in a crowded theater" stipulation. That said I believe you are right regarding that point ultimately and I would be the last person to advocate eliminating or restricting free speech honestly. I just feel as I stated above to another poster that you can allow for creative expression without restriction on content but still apply a reasonable tax but in reality that wouldn't be fair and could be abused.

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Response to In Truth We Trust (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:45 AM

29. Why not on books too? (nt)

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Response to Nye Bevan (Reply #29)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:52 AM

30. And thoughts... that's where the real money is

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