HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » Guns aren't toys and ther...
Introducing Discussionist: A new forum by the creators of DU

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 08:02 PM

Guns aren't toys and there shouldn't be toy guns, nor children's games with guns or shooting

It's pretty simple really.

Maybe my family had it right after all. As a kid, dressed up as a cowboy, I wasn't allowed to use or have toy guns as part of the costume. This was the 70's, in the aftermath of Vietnam and shortly before my congressman was assassinated in Guyana and two leaders in the city I went to school in were assassinated one week later. Perfectly or not, my deprivation of even the symbol of a gun was in service to the lessons of non-violence learned sometimes as a sad legacy of a parent who lost heroes in the 1960's (she later said to me that "it seemed like anyone good would be shot and killed").

Oh and a few years later, my neighbor was a Palestinian kid my age. We played "war" constantly, which involved running around and pretending, with our hands, to shoot each other. I was completely unaware of what was going on in the Middle East in the early 1980's when we did this, or of the ironic parallel.

And so I did without guns, well, up and to a point. And yes, even though I made believe, the thing that stuck with me more was not being allowed to have the toy gun.

Then as a teenager, I got to shoot guns, and up into my 20's, got to shoot for fun, for target practice, then I pretty much stopped because I didn't want to put lead into the environment (this was the early 90's). I have shot since, but rarely.

Guns added little to my childhood, but the lessons of not having them for the most important parts have stayed with me all my life.

Guns aren't toys. They shouldn't be. Guns have their place and purpose, and no, I don't hate them. But I see a lot of people who are getting covered by the media these days, and there are lots of adults who clearly think of their guns as toys, of sorts.

Guns aren't toys. There should be a new generation that is taught never to think of them that way. And no, it won't be perfect, but it sure is worth trying.

34 replies, 2806 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 34 replies Author Time Post
Reply Guns aren't toys and there shouldn't be toy guns, nor children's games with guns or shooting (Original post)
CreekDog Jan 2013 OP
Travis_0004 Jan 2013 #1
spin Jan 2013 #2
Sherman A1 Jan 2013 #3
DirkGently Jan 2013 #4
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 #10
Whisp Jan 2013 #16
EarthWindFire Jan 2013 #5
CreekDog Jan 2013 #6
EarthWindFire Jan 2013 #7
snooper2 Jan 2013 #8
obamanut2012 Jan 2013 #9
actslikeacarrot Jan 2013 #11
CreekDog Jan 2013 #13
friendly_iconoclast Jan 2013 #15
CreekDog Jan 2013 #17
friendly_iconoclast Jan 2013 #18
sadbear Jan 2013 #12
bighart Jan 2013 #14
onenote Jan 2013 #22
bighart Jan 2013 #28
metalbot Jan 2013 #19
lumberjack_jeff Jan 2013 #20
CreekDog Jan 2013 #29
KittyWampus Jan 2013 #21
Paladin Jan 2013 #23
JHB Jan 2013 #31
Motown_Johnny Jan 2013 #24
zappaman Jan 2013 #25
marions ghost Jan 2013 #26
Dpm12 Jan 2013 #27
appleannie1 Jan 2013 #30
Erose999 Jan 2013 #32
sadbear Jan 2013 #33
Erose999 Jan 2013 #34

Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 08:12 PM

1. As somebody who grew up playing duck hunt, I strongly disagree with this idea.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 08:16 PM

2. You make some valid points. ...

Still I hope you are not suggesting banning toy guns. Education may change views but bans rarely accomplish anything positive and often have unintended consequences.

I have often felt that we would live in a more healthy society if our movies showed more sex and less violence. We seem to view showing sexual activity between consenting adults as somewhat obscene but showing the blood spatter from a head shot as acceptable and normal. Is it any wonder that we live in a violent society?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 08:22 PM

3. I had toy guns as a kid

played cops & robbers, war and wild west stuff, later played wargames both miniatures, board games and even went out with a WWII re-enactment group as a judge (got to ride the tank and a M3 Scout Car).

I do not now, nor have I ever owned a gun nor do I want one in my home.

Everyone and every circumstance is different.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 08:37 PM

4. My father wouldn't allow toy guns to be pointed at him.

No "bang bang, you're dead hahaha" for him. Not me, not anyone else's kid. He'd make them stop right in front of their parents. I came to agree with him.

Part of his point was that you don't always know, in an instant, whether the "gun" pointed at you is a toy. He was insistent with me never to allow anyone to point a real gun in my direction, even if it was "unloaded." Sound advice, that.

The other part, I think is there is just something obscene about a little child pointing a pretend weapon and demanding you pretend to be "killed."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to DirkGently (Reply #4)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 10:57 AM

10. Same in my family

Except we weren't allowed to have toy guns, period. I grew up in a home with guns, and am a gun owner.

I see nothing wrong with adult-level video games that involve shooting, but am against toy guns.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #10)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 01:25 PM

16. I agree with you on that.

 

Before we ask ourselves what Harm toy guns and violent games do to children we should ask what Good they do.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Thu Jan 17, 2013, 08:45 PM

5. There

 

Is absolutely nothing wrong with Toy guns

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to EarthWindFire (Reply #5)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 10:47 AM

6. i'm saying there is

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Reply #6)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 10:49 AM

7. thanks

 

for your opinion

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 10:50 AM

8. Wack-a-mole machines need to go as well...

unnecessary violence...

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 10:53 AM

9. I agree there shouldn't be toy guns

We weren't allowed to have them as children, because my parents believe guns aren't toys.

My father had long guns while I was growing up, kept in a safe.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 10:57 AM

11. is there any evidence...

...out there that children who play with toy guns are more likely to grow up and use a gun in a crime? If not this will do nothing but make my arsenal of nerf guns collectors items, if yes then maybe its worth a shot, but not sure how it would be legally implemented. Sounds more like a parenting thing.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to actslikeacarrot (Reply #11)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 12:50 PM

13. Guns as toys being a bad idea doesn't need a scientific study to confirm

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Reply #13)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 01:22 PM

15. Why not?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to friendly_iconoclast (Reply #15)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 01:39 PM

17. going by your logic, then maybe they shouldn't be toys until a study confirms they are safe

now?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Reply #17)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 01:48 PM

18. I asked why your proposed ban "...doesn't need a scientific study", as you put it.

You have not told us why. When anyone imples that "It should should take it on faith", we
should rightly be suspicious.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 10:57 AM

12. I think today's kids should play with what I played with:

Toy six shooters, and toy six shooters only.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 01:05 PM

14. What about water guns and toy bows and arrows?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to bighart (Reply #14)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 02:09 PM

22. or fingers (as pretend handguns) or sticks (as pretend rifles)

I grew up in a home where there were no guns, and where my parents didn't buy me any toy guns . But when someone gave me a cap pistol as a birthday present, they didn't take it away either. And I had water guns as a child. I had friends that not only had toy guns, but also had at a fairly young age air rifles/pellet guns/bb guns that, in a phrase made common in a certain holiday movie, could "put your eye out." None of those friends currently have guns in their homes (even though one was a member of our high school rifle team).

Where would you draw the line: anything that resembles a gun? a toy that shoots a projectile, like a nerf gun or a water gun? a toy that makes a sound like a gun (cap gun).

By the way, I'm a staunch supporter of gun control (and devoted a portion of my professional career to providing pro bono legal suppport to a prominent gun control organization.) But I have no problem with water guns (including super soakers) and bubble guns or other toys that resemble guns provided that they can't themselves cause phyical harm. And while I was a conscientious objector during the Vietnam War, I have no problem with people buying "toy soldiers" for their children if that's what they want to do.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to onenote (Reply #22)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 02:46 PM

28. I agree with you

Not a gun owner but due to where I live almost all of my friends own guns, most several. I support reasonable gun control that will actually make a difference and believe a comprehensive view and approach would have the biggest impact. I am a 1st person shooter game player but have no need or desire to actually own a gun.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 01:59 PM

19. I don't allow my daughter any toy guns, including squirt guns

I've got real guns in my home (including "evil black rifles"). My daughter has proper respect for those firearms. I'm choosing to not even slightly blur the line between "toy" and "firearm".

However, that's a personal choice, and not something that I would want forced on anyone.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 02:03 PM

20. To most young boys, all objects are either toy cars, toy swords or toy guns.

And the toy cars will be used as recklessly and in immature fashion as the toy swords.

My eldest son grew up without any guns in the house, toy or otherwise (unless you count banannas), and as a grownup is now *this close* to being what I would describe as a gun nut.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to lumberjack_jeff (Reply #20)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 02:53 PM

29. bullying used to be a fact of life too, but we are trying to stop it

and at least teach kids that it's wrong to do.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 02:05 PM

21. Interesting> you don't mention actual banning, yet posters imply that. Are you speaking about a ban?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 02:12 PM

23. My Problem Isn't With Actual Kids, PLaying With Actual Toy Guns.


My problem is with alleged adults, playing with for-real guns as if they are mere toys. And believe me, there's plenty of that sort of dangerous attitude out there.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Paladin (Reply #23)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 03:10 PM

31. +1

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 02:17 PM

24. Kids will pretend sticks are guns, or brooms.. or anything else.

I had toy guns as a kid. As a "tween" my friends and I even went out and bought crappy little BB pistols that shot plastic BBs and ran around shooting each other (Kinda like what paint-ball is now).

I had GI Joes a little plastic army men and just about anything else you can think of that was a toy gun or toy gun related.

I have never owned a real gun and have no desire to ever do so. I am in favor of stricter gun laws. Everything you think will be caused by playing with guns is the opposite of my personal experience.

If you deny toy guns to kids they will just want them even more. That type of fascination is more of a threat than allowing a healthy outlet for their curiosity.


Kids will play with toy guns no matter what. Even if it is a broomstick or a broken branch. Deal with it.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 02:27 PM

25. Wow.

Just about every kid I knew had a toy gun.
So far, not one of those kids has shot anyone later in life.

To each his own.
You can't legislate parenting.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 02:27 PM

26. These days

it's harder to argue that toy guns are OK. I don't think I would over-react if kids played with imaginary guns, but I don't agree with giving them replicas. Too much implication of graduating to the real thing. Definitely would not let kids watch violent movies where killers are glamorized and heroic.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 02:41 PM

27. Violence

What's wrong with watching films or playing video games with guns? No one really does stuff anymore because they saw it in media. You kill someone it's because you did it, not because a video game made you

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 03:05 PM

30. I never allowed my kids to have toy guns or BB guns. When they were old enough to hunt

with us we took them for gun safety classes and made sure they followed the rules at home and in the woods. And the number one rule was NEVER point a gun at a person whether you think it is loaded or not and never shoot at noise. Always have a visual of your target before aiming.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to CreekDog (Original post)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 04:27 PM

32. I once brought a toy dart gun (the old suction cup darts) to 1st grade for show and tell. It was

1986 before the days of "zero tolerance". Well my friend snatched it away from me and shot the teacher with it, and the little suction cup dart hit her right in the forehead. She snatched us both up by the ears (literally) and took us to the principal's office. I got a spanking, and if I remember right my friend got a spanking and detention a few days. "Detention" then was they would move your desk into the copy room facing the wall for the day.

I remember I was a little snot when I was a kid. I loved guns and my heroes were Chuck Norris and Reagan. The first day I got a BB gun my friends and I were shooting each other with them. Also, unsurprisingly, I wasn't very well liked amongst the other kids in the neighborhood. LOL

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Erose999 (Reply #32)

Fri Jan 18, 2013, 04:30 PM

33. Like this?



Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to sadbear (Reply #33)

Tue Jan 22, 2013, 10:42 AM

34. It happened pretty much like that. The kid grabbed it from my hand, waited for the techer to turn


around, and then right in the forehead. She was not amused.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread