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Fri Jan 11, 2013, 12:22 AM

Purity Culture Is Rape Culture

This THE best article explaining #rapeculture.

https://prospect.org/article/purity-culture-rape-culture

Purity Culture Is Rape Culture

E.J. Graff

January 4, 2013

The shocking assault in India reveals that rape isn't about sex—it's about controlling women's lives.
(...)
Since Susan Brownmiller first wrote Against Our Will—the landmark feminist reconceptualization of rape—feminists have worked on clarifying the fact that rape is less about sex than it is about rage and power. Too many people still conceive of rape as a man’s overwhelming urge to enjoy the body of a woman who has provoked him by being attractive and within reach. As is true in many “traditional” cultures, much of India still imagines that the violation was one against her chastity, as Aswini Anburajan writes at Buzzfeed. But conceiving it as primarily a sexual violation places the burden on women to protect their bodies’ purity. It means that the question that gets asked is this one: Why was she out so late at night, provoking men into rage by being openly female?

But seen from a woman's own point of view, rape is quite different: It's punishment for daring to exist as an independent being, for one's own purposes, not for others' use. Sexual assault is a form of brutalization based, quite simply, on the idea that women have no place in the world except the place that a man assigns them—and that men should be free to patrol women’s lives, threatening them if they dare step into view. It is fully in keeping with bride-burnings, acid attacks, street harassment, and sex-selective abortions that delete women before they are born.

I’ve now read a number of commentaries exposing India’s, particularly New Delhi’s, culture of street violence against women. The most memorable, by Sonia Faleiro in The New York Times, talks about the fear that was instilled in her during her 24 years living in Delhi:

As a teenager, I learned to protect myself. I never stood alone if I could help it, and I walked quickly, crossing my arms over my chest, refusing to make eye contact or smile. I cleaved through crowds shoulder-first, and avoided leaving the house after dark except in a private car. …
(...)


48 replies, 3864 views

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Arrow 48 replies Author Time Post
Reply Purity Culture Is Rape Culture (Original post)
Why Syzygy Jan 2013 OP
niyad Jan 2013 #1
Why Syzygy Jan 2013 #3
niyad Jan 2013 #23
liberal_at_heart Jan 2013 #2
Why Syzygy Jan 2013 #4
Why Syzygy Jan 2013 #5
Hekate Jan 2013 #6
liberal_at_heart Jan 2013 #11
liberal_at_heart Jan 2013 #10
niyad Jan 2013 #22
Quantess Jan 2013 #32
Why Syzygy Jan 2013 #39
LittleBlue Jan 2013 #7
Kurovski Jan 2013 #9
Lydia Leftcoast Jan 2013 #12
LittleBlue Jan 2013 #15
loose wheel Jan 2013 #21
Why Syzygy Jan 2013 #14
LittleBlue Jan 2013 #17
Why Syzygy Jan 2013 #18
LittleBlue Jan 2013 #20
niyad Jan 2013 #24
Hatchling Jan 2013 #29
seabeyond Jan 2013 #34
Hatchling Jan 2013 #41
duffyduff Jan 2013 #43
niyad Jan 2013 #45
Why Syzygy Jan 2013 #47
niyad Jan 2013 #48
Why Syzygy Jan 2013 #31
seabeyond Jan 2013 #35
niyad Jan 2013 #33
Why Syzygy Jan 2013 #40
Tsiyu Jan 2013 #38
duffyduff Jan 2013 #42
niyad Jan 2013 #46
gollygee Jan 2013 #25
redqueen Jan 2013 #44
Kurovski Jan 2013 #8
SunSeeker Jan 2013 #13
Why Syzygy Jan 2013 #16
loudsue Jan 2013 #19
JustAnotherGen Jan 2013 #26
Guy Whitey Corngood Jan 2013 #27
Dash87 Jan 2013 #28
seabeyond Jan 2013 #36
Blue Owl Jan 2013 #30
Larrymoe Curlyshemp Jan 2013 #37

Response to Why Syzygy (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 12:36 AM

1. k and r for this most excellent post

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Response to niyad (Reply #1)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 12:56 AM

3. thanks for that..

I love your signature quote.

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Response to Why Syzygy (Reply #3)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 11:15 AM

23. thank you. SBA has always been one of my sheroes.

During IWY in houston in '77, one of the speakers announced herself, "susan b anthony", and, even though we knew, of course, it wasn't THE SBA--there was a gasp. It was some great-niece, a truly remarkable woman equally dedicated to the cause.

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Response to Why Syzygy (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 12:42 AM

2. I agree

It really creeps me out the way some of these fundies pretend to have such love and respect for their spouses and yet can breed a culture of either you do what God and I tell you to do or you deserve whatever you get. It is absolutely used as a method of control. It's a big problem in Africa as well as India right now. It's a problem all over the world. We must fight it.

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Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #2)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 12:59 AM

4. They love them

as long as they behave themselves and act like the property they are supposed to be.

It is worldwide. It is second only to income disparity in my list of 'what must be done'.

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Response to Why Syzygy (Reply #5)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 01:22 AM

6. Bruises

>shudder<

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Response to Hekate (Reply #6)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 01:41 AM

11. I agree

They make me cringe too.

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Response to Why Syzygy (Reply #5)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 01:40 AM

10. brilliant way to illustrate the way societies view women

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Response to Why Syzygy (Reply #5)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 11:12 AM

22. that picture says it all.

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Response to Why Syzygy (Reply #5)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 07:19 PM

32. The same judgements apply to fat legs (no text)

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Response to Quantess (Reply #32)

Sat Jan 12, 2013, 03:11 AM

39. I don't know what you mean?

Share?

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Response to Why Syzygy (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 01:30 AM

7. How do we know that all instances of rape are about power and control rather than lust?

I've heard this mentioned many times and yet have never seen a scientific proof.

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #7)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 01:39 AM

9. Even if it begins in lust, it is still about having the power to MAKE you have sex

against your will. It's a desire to control your body.

If it were lust chiefly as motivation, who would bruise and tear open a person?

It's always power and control. That's what makes it rape.

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #7)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 01:50 AM

12. If it were only about lust, why do men who have wives and/or girlfriends rape?

Why do children and women who are not attractive get raped? Why do women in countries where burqas are the norm get raped?

It's an aggravated form of the same mentality that causes groups of men (always groups) to make lewd remarks to women passing by. I once had a car full of teenage boys drive slowly past me and a group of other women (ages 50s to 70s) and make crude suggestions. Were they really lusting for us? I...don't...think...so.

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Response to Lydia Leftcoast (Reply #12)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 02:00 AM

15. Not sure, that's why I asked

There could be a lot of reasons why men rape. I'm just curious if it's ever been proven that rape is about power rather than lust, or if it's just been repeated so often that it's become a truism.

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #15)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 06:43 AM

21. Psychological studies of men incarcerated for rape...

 

...show that there is a direct link between the man intending to dominate the victims he intends to rape, whether they are male or female. (Jeffrey Dahmer being an (rather extreme but well known) example of a man that raped other men.)

It might be hard to nail down exactly who or what exactly the man may be lashing out against, but psychologically he feels a need to dominate women (or other men) to cover for the inadequacies in his own psyche. This is also why violent rapists tend to be serial (as in the won't just rape once), and their crimes tend to escalate unless they are caught.

What happened in India is different in that while those men were rapists, they didn't just want to instill fear in her, they wanted to instill fear in the entire populace that didn't think just like them. They wanted women to fear being out alone. They wanted men to fear allowing women out alone.

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #7)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 01:58 AM

14. Lust

can be done alone. And when it's directed at another human being who says, "no", STOPS!

I'm going to do some more research to see if I can find a better answer. The only thing I've come across so far is unacceptable, since it is using the Bible to defend their position. THAT position just strengthens the points of the article I posted.

Meanwhile, read the entire article. It is well written and easy to read. You might change your mind before I find any "scientific" evidence to support the claim.

I'm so glad you didn't ask, Is there any scientific proof that when a woman says, "no", she means "no"?

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Response to Why Syzygy (Reply #14)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 02:06 AM

17. Just to be clear

I don't think it's necessary to prove that rape isn't about lust, suggesting if it is, women hold some responsibility for their own rape.

It's like saying a rich person should not display their wealth because if they are robbed, they are responsible for their own robbery. And then a group of people try to prove that robbing the rich is about power rather than desire to take their wealth.

I could see a man raping a woman he desires sexually if she will not consent, but that doesn't mean she is responsible even if he lusted after her.

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #17)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 02:30 AM

18. You were clear.

Your excuses are just like all the other rape apologists. Blaming the victim (women hold some responsibility for their own rape.) didn't begin with you. It's age old. I ask you to consider if it's "lust" or the woman is to blame, why are women in countries who enforce Burka attire raped? Not even safe in a BURKA? What must a woman do to prevent "lust"?

Since you rephrased your question, I'm not going to look for any opinions about "scientific" fact. All you need to excuse rape is to believe that somehow the woman is at fault. Hardly scientific level attitude.

Just because someone is cooking food doesn’t mean you’re entitled to eat it.
Just because a banker is counting money doesn’t mean you’re being given free money.
Just because a person is naked doesn’t mean you’re entitled to f*ck them.
You are not entitled to someone else’s body just because it’s exposed.
search: "Still not asking for it".

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Response to Why Syzygy (Reply #18)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 04:28 AM

20. You can lust after something that isn't revealed

Last edited Fri Jan 11, 2013, 05:20 AM - Edit history (1)

I find that women who wear more clothing can often be more attractive than women who wear less. That doesn't mean that every rape has nothing to do with lust. Why must every rape be attributable to the same thing? It is conceivable that rapes could be due to many things, lust and power being among them.

But that's not really the point, is it? Attributing a rape to lust does not infer that the blame is upon the woman. I do not understand why an attempt to examine all possible motives for a rapist, even if they do not imply any logical responsibility upon the woman, as "rape apology". And to avoid the label "rape apologist", we must reject that any rape could be about lust and must accept that every rape is about power and control.

If you can support the latter assertion with science, then it can be accepted. But if this is about ideology and coming to an unsupported conclusion (rape must be about power) to head off a separate illogical belief (the victim shares responsibility for their rape), then it cannot be accepted.

I would imagine that rape can probably involved power, lust, hatred, or sadistic motivations, or even a mix of these depending on the rapist. If lust is not a component of rape, then why are women age 16-24 are four times more likely to be raped than any other population group. That after all is when a woman is most desirable (or biologically, fertile) in their lifetime.

You should know that tossing the rape apologist accusation around in so casual a manner debases its meaning.

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #20)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 11:38 AM

24. may one enquire why it is so important for you to insist that rape must be about lust rather than

power and control? I am really trying to understand, and I do not.

you might try reading this letter, ostensibly from a rapist, about why he rapes:

http://whatever.scalzi.com/2012/10/25/a-fan-letter-to-certain-conservative-politicians/

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Response to niyad (Reply #24)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 12:49 PM

29. I wonder why he thinks men have so little control over their lust.

Do they think men are animals that can't control themselves. That is a sad commentary that he prefers his "lust" theory over the concept of power and control.

I prefer the latter, because it idicates some people have a severe charactor flaw/ disorder and to the other which indicates men have no control at all of themselves.

His "lust" theory is an example of pure misadry, IMO

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Response to Hatchling (Reply #29)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 08:25 PM

34. cause the male lust is oh so powerful over female lust, that it requires they rape? nt

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Response to seabeyond (Reply #34)

Sat Jan 12, 2013, 01:16 PM

41. Exactly.

I was a scrawny, straggly 10 year old whose socks wouldn't stay up. Yeah, I was such an object of lust my rapist couldn't help himself. Such bullshit!

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Response to niyad (Reply #24)

Sat Jan 12, 2013, 03:06 PM

43. That post is satirical, which is quite obvious. n/t

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Response to duffyduff (Reply #43)

Sat Jan 12, 2013, 08:54 PM

45. to which post are you referring? the one to which I was replying, or the one to which I linked?

If it is the one to which I linked, there is nothing SATIRICAL about it (despite the use of the phrase "ostensibly written by a rapist", in case you missed that)

that letter was a clear explanation of the rapist mentality. nothing satirical about that, just as there is nothing satirical about rape itself.

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Response to niyad (Reply #45)

Sun Jan 13, 2013, 02:33 PM

47. To be fair ..

The writer does indicate it as "satire".

Caveats begin here. Read before posting.

1. For those of you who didn’t figure it out earlier, this is satire. However, just because it is satire, does not mean it’s intended to be funny.

2. I recognize this is going to be offensive to many people, for many different reasons. I felt the point I wanted to make was best made this way. I accept that there will be criticism.


Even so, it's honest and representative of reality. The comments indicate that many still don't get it. They are still arguing for the right of men to control a woman's body.

I wonder about men who defend rapists. Is it because they can't bring themselves to believe another man could be so brutal? Or is it more about the level of control over women being just so irresistible to even them. They can't bring themselves to do it, or maybe they HAVE. So a blanket condemnation of women is a convenient way for them to excuse all men, especially themselves, for being childish, lazy and misogynist (I want to change that word which has become almost void of meaning to women HATER)?

A point worth mention is that the 'legislators' who vote against woman at every opportunity are just as guilty as if they had personally raped. We should bring that point home in the state houses so no one can ever again BLAME the woman.

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Response to Why Syzygy (Reply #47)

Sun Jan 13, 2013, 06:03 PM

48. yes, I know that it was written as satire, but, thanks to the writer's skill, caught the mentality

perfectly.

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #20)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 07:02 PM

31. I regret ..

that I replied while I was still a bit angry. However, when anyone excuses rape with (possible) "lust", that is a rape apologist.

The first time I came face to face with an apologist (woman blamer) was a few weeks ago on facebook. A woman holding a poster which asked, why does her college have courses for women to "avoid rape", instead of courses teaching men how "not to rape". A man suggested that it was "easier" to teach women how to avoid it! I came unglued. In the OP article it describes a woman's life as she lives in a male dominated and sexists society. She was constantly on alert. Doing everything she could to avoid rape. And all this from the time she was a little girl. Even little girls are taught that they must control their looks and behavior to AVOID RAPE! Should it be that way? Should women live in fear that someone will find her so irresistible that she will be assaulted? I don't think so. I vowed to be front and center in the obscene #rapeculture.

The same argument turned up days later. One man on my "friends" list was arguing that women are 'asking for it', and need a protective man. He went on to say that the woman holding the "slutwalk" poster probably had a man to protect her, but then she ran her mouth (his words) and so she got raped. And there was also a Muslim woman in the convo who claims that if Western women acted more like Muslim women, we would be safer. Of course that's a lie. And disgusting. I was able to control myself better; but I un-friended the creep and told off the woman.

After those occasions, we heard about the Indian woman who was murdered because she was not deemed a "respected lady" (as her killers and their lawyer claim to this day). And then Steubenville.

Now you show up on this thread to assert the exact same idea. Somehow, avoiding "lust", a woman can control the actions of men. It's pathetic. We also have the case where a woman was fired because her boss got a woody when he was around her. That is a perfect example of blaming women for a man's thoughts or actions. Women are NOT RESPONSIBLE for the actions of anyone, especially not men who she may or may not know.

Why don't you produce some scientific study to prove that rape is about sex. I grew up in the last years of innocence (even though they call it "free love". In those days men didn't think just because they got hard they had to 'have it'. Most men still have this understanding of their own bodies. They don't have to fire someone, or assault a woman just because his willy is in the right condition. They are those who don't feel it's okay for them to use their body to overpower and assault the body of someone weaker. That makes them criminals and a menace to a sane society. Other men or women who excuse this lapse in sane behavior share some of the guilt for trying to make violence acceptable.

So you wait for your "PROOF" that women are somehow responsible. Meanwhile, stay out of the company of all women. Gods forbid you find yourself with one who is 'asking for it' (by triggering your lust).

eta: I considered changing "willy" to "penis". However, since someone who blames another for their feelings or actions is not behaving as a mature man, "willy" is appropriate.

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Response to Why Syzygy (Reply #31)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 08:29 PM

35. +1. nt

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #20)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 07:38 PM

33. about the "tossing the rape apologist accusation around in so casual a manner debases its

Last edited Sat Jan 12, 2013, 10:34 AM - Edit history (1)

meaning"

around here, at least, it is not "tossed around casually"--it is used whenever someone seems to be defending rape, trying to make it appear something lesser than the heinous evil it is, or dismisses it (as did the poster whose comment about steubenville was "it was blown way out of proportion). Quite frankly, having seen some of the discussions here and elsewhere, I think the term is not used often enough.

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Response to niyad (Reply #33)

Sat Jan 12, 2013, 03:36 AM

40. DU

I don't hang out a lot at DU. Personal reasons, which I don't need to get into. I haven't been involved in a lot of the debate. I HAVE seen people get banned by MIRT for being a "misogynist". That gives some hope. But looking around today I see that the term, "feminist" takes a beating. Since it is very hard to imagine that DU members are in favor of denying human rights to ANYONE, I might conclude that disrespect to feminists is strictly a gender issue. Why else would anyone object to the same human rights for every human? I don't get it. To me, it is directly connected to the #rapeculture. In other settings I've asked .. so it's okay to rape a feminist? And even, .. so it's okay to rape a "slut"? Yes, I'm a FEMINIST! It goes with the coming of age in my generation. The only people who disparaged feminists were doing so in an attempt to keep the status quo, and make sure women did not have equal rights. We had to fight many battles. It didn't start with us. It just got rolling a little bit, and took up the battles of the brave women who came before us. It's a Sisyphus boulder. But I'm sure not going to give up because there are males who might be intimidated by a woman, and feel free to mock those of us who think women deserve to be protected from violence and prejudice.

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #20)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 09:04 PM

38. Look at the Nodianos tape

he wasn't gushing about his lust for the victim of the gang rape in Steubenville.

He was bragging about how "dead" she was, and making horribly humiliating comments about her.

Lust didn't have one thing to do with that rape. It was revenge because the victim broke up with one of the football players.

"No b*&@h breaks up with me!" is not foreplay, nor does it indicate desire for anything else but revenge and control.










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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #20)

Sat Jan 12, 2013, 03:00 PM

42. I can't believe I am reading this.

This is like reading George Gilder.

Men just can't help themselves, and it's up to women to "civilize" them.

Excuse me while I puke.

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Response to duffyduff (Reply #42)

Sat Jan 12, 2013, 09:14 PM

46. to which post are you referring, because nothing in post #20 talks about women civilizing men.

perhaps you should read it again.

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #7)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 11:40 AM

25. Whose lust doesn't die when the other person is crying and trying to get away?

Someone who is lusting after control more than the victim.

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Response to LittleBlue (Reply #7)

Sat Jan 12, 2013, 03:10 PM

44. They're not. That's a comforting lie.

Most rapes are about a certain type of man's beliefs that his "needs" come before anything else. (Pay attention to how many people here on DU insist that men have a NEED to use women for sex, in all the discussions about prostitution. You will even see the argument that allowing men to pay women to put up with sex reduces the incidence of rape.)

They aren't brutal stranger rapes. They're males forcing their dates/friends/employees/relatives/etc to submit to rape (sex). Getting them drunk so they can rape with them. Coercing them into 'consenting'. Because they want SEX.

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Response to Why Syzygy (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 01:35 AM

8. The core of world religions, the non-spiritual, earthly, physical core is decaying.

Thousands of years of thought and human control in regard to the sexes and sexuality (most specifically) are beginning to capsize. that boat will no longer float.

The idea of woman in the world as seen through religion has to be confronted and challenged. Religion will change, or it will die.

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Response to Why Syzygy (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 01:56 AM

13. "rape is...punishment for daring to exist as an independent being."

So true. Excellent post.

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Response to SunSeeker (Reply #13)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 02:05 AM

16. I agree :)

It is by far the best of anything I've read so far. The feedback from other venues where I've posted has been very supportive, and that tells me many 'get it'.

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Response to Why Syzygy (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 03:03 AM

19. Wow. That is an incredibly good article, and says it all.

She nails it.

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Response to Why Syzygy (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 12:08 PM

26. Fabulous Article!

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Response to Why Syzygy (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 12:14 PM

27. K & R. nt

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Response to Why Syzygy (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 12:23 PM

28. Rape is used to keep women in place (under men).

Notice that a woman is only a "slut" or "whore" if she does something a man doesn't want her to do?

Rape is a method of control. It's used to terrorize women into being "quiet and subordinate."

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Response to Dash87 (Reply #28)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 08:30 PM

36. thank you. yes. nt

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Response to Why Syzygy (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 03:18 PM

30. Just kick 'em in the Purity Balls

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Response to Why Syzygy (Original post)

Fri Jan 11, 2013, 08:44 PM

37. Us Menfolk Need to be Protected from Our Own Urges!

 



Rec

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