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Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:21 PM

"we arenít nominating Chuck Hagel to be Israelís Secretary of Defense, but our own"

Some Republicans are already freaking out over the potential nomination of Hagel:

Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) on Sunday expressed dismay at reports President Obama would tap former Sen. Chuck Hagel (R-Neb.) for Secretary of Defense, calling it an ďin your faceĒ selection.

ďHe has long severed his ties with the Republican party. This is an in your face nomination of the president to all of us who are supportive of Israel,Ē he added.


Whatís so amazing to me is that Graham, who used to be (I donít know if he still is) a reserve JAG officer, swore an oath when he joined the military. Here it is:

I, , do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God.


Oddly enough, there is not one word in there about Israel. Maybe Graham isnít clear that we arenít nominating Chuck Hagel to be Israelís Secretary of Defense, but our own.

...So I want to have this fight. Letís let Graham and all the others go in front of a camera and proclaim to the world that their top consideration for the American Secretary of Defense isÖ his deference to foreign nation. Bring it on, Lindsey.

http://www.balloon-juice.com/2013/01/06/i-want-to-have-this-fight-too/

28 replies, 2417 views

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Reply "we arenít nominating Chuck Hagel to be Israelís Secretary of Defense, but our own" (Original post)
phantom power Jan 2013 OP
TwilightGardener Jan 2013 #1
HERVEPA Jan 2013 #2
freshwest Jan 2013 #3
Lordquinton Jan 2013 #11
freshwest Jan 2013 #13
Lordquinton Jan 2013 #19
freshwest Jan 2013 #20
Qutzupalotl Jan 2013 #26
freshwest Jan 2013 #28
Skittles Jan 2013 #22
HERVEPA Jan 2013 #24
TwilightGardener Jan 2013 #4
Indykatie Jan 2013 #9
TwilightGardener Jan 2013 #10
leftyohiolib Jan 2013 #6
Ken Burch Jan 2013 #15
A Simple Game Jan 2013 #16
NoMoreWarNow Jan 2013 #23
spanone Jan 2013 #5
Posteritatis Jan 2013 #7
calimary Jan 2013 #12
pwb Jan 2013 #8
LittleBlue Jan 2013 #14
bemildred Jan 2013 #17
Cynicus Emeritus Jan 2013 #18
xxxsdesdexxx Jan 2013 #21
malaise Jan 2013 #25
Jester Messiah Jan 2013 #27

Response to phantom power (Original post)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:35 PM

1. Yes, I think it would be very enlightening to have the Armed Services committee

demanding (on TV) to know why Hagel, a guy who got his ass shot at twice in Vietnam, happens to declare primary loyalty to the United States. What a fucked up bass-ackwards political world we live in.

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Response to TwilightGardener (Reply #1)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:44 PM

2. Well, he is anti-gay and anti-choice, but I don't think that matters to you anti-Israel folks

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Response to HERVEPA (Reply #2)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 01:58 PM

3. Please link so it can be discussed. We are discussing Defense, not human rights.

And I'm not 'anti-Israeli' and don't see any threads saying that Obama or Hagel are, either.

Please be so kind as to link what you are saying, because this seems off topic, but we can discuss it if you've found otherwise.

Lindsay Graham is worthless, and his opposition simply makes me want Hagel more.

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Response to freshwest (Reply #3)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 04:10 PM

11. We are never not discussing human rights

nt

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Response to Lordquinton (Reply #11)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 04:12 PM

13. True, just no links to say Hagel is anti-Israeli, humans, etc. as asserted.

I don't respect Graham's record on human rights or value his opinion saying Hagel is not pro-Israeli or whatever it is that he wants as a Secretary of Defense. That is who the OP is referring to as part of an anti-Hagel group, and what the person I replied seems to indicate that 'anti-gay and anti-choice' has a relationship to 'anti-Israel folks.'

Hagel will do what the laws require and whatever policy is in place for the military, not domestic issuses and he can't overturn the current directives on gay rights in the service and there are effort to change military funding for choise, not easy with a boatload of Grahams and other wackjobs.

The Israeli set of issues is not as important to me as domestic ones, and I won't be drawn into the I/P group. If that is the intention of bringing it up here, it shoudn't be in General Discussion, but can hashed out there. I don't like the GOP or Graham, but do like Obama, Kerry and Cleland who want Hagel on the job. If that clarifies anything for you as to where I'm coming from asking another poster a question, fine, if not, we can part ways. I'm not an I/P poster.

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Response to freshwest (Reply #13)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:49 PM

19. After reading that

I do agree with you 90% (only because I'm sure we disagree somewhere ) Certainly if the GOP is against someone, then there is a good chance they have some trait that would be good for the position.

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Response to Lordquinton (Reply #19)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:55 PM

20. Thanks and just found this bit about Hagel:

Last edited Sun Jan 6, 2013, 08:23 PM - Edit history (1)

Obama is currently coming under heavy fire for his reported choice of former Senator Chuck Hagel to be defense secretary. Hagel wants to get out of Afghanistan soon, does not want a war with Iran, favors negotiations with Hamas, and supports cuts in military spending.

Not only the neo-conservatives, but some of the most powerful interests in the country, including the right wing of the pro-Israel lobby, have launched a smear campaign. But so far, Obama has not backed down. This could have something to do with the fact that he no longer has to run for re-election.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jan/05/paul-krugman-obama-treasury-secretary

Sounds like Obama is keeping his promises.

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Response to freshwest (Reply #20)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 01:23 PM

26. "supports cuts in military spending"

That could be the real reason for the Republicans' outcry. The Israel issue is something they can proclaim loudly, but reminding voters that the R's are bought by the defense industry, that's something they don't want to do.

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Response to Qutzupalotl (Reply #26)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 01:41 PM

28. Agreed. The Israel issue may be cover for their sponsors, and used as dog whistle for their fundies.

Even libertarian hero Rand Paul (R-scumbag) was forced to break his campaign promises to cut military spending as pork by the big guns in the GOP within days of being sworn into office.

Rand, like his daddy Ron, ended up talking out of both sides of their mouths about making peace abroad and signed up for pork in their districts.

Their 'principles' never stood in the way of their profits. Libertarians who make their living off of defense contracts excuse living off the taxpayer dime anyway they can. All the while screaming about paying taxes themselves.

Graham is playing to the GOP's other wing, the religiously gullible. Israel is a meme which they believe gives them authority to stomp on people. It will always be used to buy them off, whether it helps anyone in the Middle East or not.

Definite signs of a cover-up by Graham.

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Response to Lordquinton (Reply #11)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 10:09 PM

22. THANK YOU

WTF is with these folk, treating HUMAN RIGHTS as a SEPARATE ISSUE???

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Response to Skittles (Reply #22)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 10:00 AM

24. Some people are unable to make the connections

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Response to HERVEPA (Reply #2)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 02:13 PM

4. Prove that I am anti-Israel in any way. It's not anti-Israel to recognize

how the neocons/AIPAC/defense industry are trying to paint Hagel as "OMG HE IS TEH ANTI-GAY" to give Senate Dems cover to oppose Hagel when those agencies are mostly (but not all) Republican. It's hilarious and transparent.

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Response to TwilightGardener (Reply #4)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 03:53 PM

9. Neo Cons Wouldn't Give A Shit About Hagel's Other Positions if He Shared Their War Views

including total support for all things Israel. Their complaints about him only serves to enhance my support for the nomination. Many people have views that evolved on many things including gay rights. I believe that Hagel will support the president's agenda effectively.

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Response to Indykatie (Reply #9)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 04:09 PM

10. Yep--funny to watch magazines like the Weekly Standard suddenly obsessed

with gay rights, trumpeting the Log Cabin Repubs and Barney Frank's opposition. If that doesn't say how much they're trying to manipulate this process to their advantage, I don't know what will.

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Response to HERVEPA (Reply #2)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 02:19 PM

6. isreal's a big boy now maybe it's tme to stop nursing at the breast of the us

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Response to HERVEPA (Reply #2)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 04:27 PM

15. First of all, Hagel admitted he was wrong to say what he said about Hormel

So he really isn't "anti-gay" anymore(unless we're assuming that you're always anti-gay if you ever said anything anti-gay at any point in your life, even if you recanted that particular opinion publicly).

Two, the Secretary of Defense has little if anything to do with abortion policy(Obama has ordered the DoD to cover abortion funding in the cases the pro-choice movement wanted it covered, so Hagel can't do anything to stop that).

Three...is Hagel REALLY "anti-Israel"? Or is he just saying that Israel shouldn't get special deference. Why isn't it ENOUGH just for the U.S. to support Israel's right to exist-why do we NEED to do anything beyond that? Is it really necessary to choose sides between them and the Palestinians(especially now, since Israel no longer has any claim to moral superiority over the Palestinian side, and is nothing but simply another country in another war)?

The fact is, Israel's survival is assured no matter what. That country doesn't need special deference or special protection. It's covered already.

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Response to HERVEPA (Reply #2)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 04:28 PM

16. It sounds to me like he could be

anti-gay, anti-choice, and pro-Israel and you would be fine with him.

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Response to HERVEPA (Reply #2)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 06:50 AM

23. Glenn Greenwald, who is gay, addressed the anti-gay issue

 

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Response to phantom power (Original post)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 02:19 PM

5. does this fucker ever stop whining?

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Response to spanone (Reply #5)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 02:42 PM

7. He probably sleeps sometimes. (nt)

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Response to spanone (Reply #5)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 04:10 PM

12. Well, I guess he believes in doing repeatedly that which he does best.

And the OP makes a very good point. This is the United States of America's Defense Department we're talking about. Not the Israeli Defense Department.

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Response to phantom power (Original post)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 03:24 PM

8. Graham again? Well that is 1 percent of the senate

One percent makes him sound little, like he is. Your opinion means very little Mr Graham. You are not speaker of America. We have all heard you and don't care what you think about anything. Please stay off T V and just shut up.
Mr Hagel is a decorated Nam veteran. What are you again?, a chickenhawk reserve officer?. Wow, not very impressive compared to Hagel a real combat vet.

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Response to phantom power (Original post)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 04:14 PM

14. So sick of the Likud deciding who we should nominate

Fuck em, go Hagel. Obama shouldn't be forced to support the Rethuglican candidate for SecDef.

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Response to phantom power (Original post)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 04:50 PM

17. You lost Buddy, get used to it. nt

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Response to phantom power (Original post)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 05:57 PM

18. SecDef should have a basic opposition to war.

 

Last edited Sun Jan 6, 2013, 06:37 PM - Edit history (1)

We need someone in that job that first of all has an appreciation of the enormous sacrifice of war. Also one that has no outside conflict of interest in war profiteering, or undo support of other countries, is independent thinking, and puts defense of US interests here at home as his #1 priority.

What we don't need is someone like McCain, Graham, Lieberman (good, he's now out of a job) and others of neo-con beliefs would support. They'd all have a circle wxx dream imagining the body bags needed to bring back young American servicemen thrown into fighting a new war with Iran on the USA dime and not in USA interests. Not only would we need thousands of body bags for Americans, it would be a death knell for social programs Medicare and Social Security and our infrastructure. It would be the downfall of the USA. We need to purge their beliefs from society.

Americans on both sides of the political aisle must soon remove themselves from the fog of Facebook and the Hollywood media hype, and start cluing themselves into opposing what is not in our USA interest. If they don't begin to understand the dire reality of what is coming, they will have nothing and then wonder why their families have become peasants.

Obama supports Hagel and so do I. My email in support to my elected officials and Obama is in the mail.

PS: How do I recommend this important thread?

Edited: I figured it out.

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Response to phantom power (Original post)

Sun Jan 6, 2013, 07:32 PM

21. I'm sick of those who think we need to check with Israel first before we approve or disapprove.

Sorry, but we're not the United States of Israel. We do what's best for us and our interests regardless of how it affects Israel. Our interests, as Republicans view them, should not always come at the behest of Israel. Israel is not always right. They are wrong in allowing their citizens to create settlements in Palestinian territory. If Israel decides to launch an attack on Iran, or some other country, we should critically think about whether it's in our interest or not to get involved. If it's not in our interest, we should stay out of it regardless of how it affects Israel.

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Response to phantom power (Original post)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 10:05 AM

25. It may be a great signal to Netanayu not to bite the hand

that's been feeding him for decades

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Response to phantom power (Original post)

Mon Jan 7, 2013, 01:29 PM

27. About time.

I don't think we should be anti-Israel or pro-Israel, any more than we're anti-Bermuda or pro-Paraguay. It's just another nation, a face in the crowd. Why should we take such pains to be their big friend when all they do is piss people off?

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