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Fri Jan 4, 2013, 01:13 PM

 

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This message was self-deleted by its author (No Compromise) on Sat Jan 5, 2013, 10:36 AM. When the original post in a discussion thread is self-deleted, the entire discussion thread is automatically locked so new replies cannot be posted.

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Reply This message was self-deleted by its author (Original post)
No Compromise Jan 2013 OP
No Compromise Jan 2013 #1
MineralMan Jan 2013 #2
IDoMath Jan 2013 #15
No Compromise Jan 2013 #3
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #9
mike_c Jan 2013 #4
AngryAmish Jan 2013 #5
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #8
mike_c Jan 2013 #10
Coyotl Jan 2013 #6
kestrel91316 Jan 2013 #7
LeftInTX Jan 2013 #11
mike_c Jan 2013 #14
Retrograde Jan 2013 #12
SidDithers Jan 2013 #13
SidDithers Jan 2013 #16
backscatter712 Jan 2013 #17
RomneyLies Jan 2013 #18
Dr. Strange Jan 2013 #19
SidDithers Jan 2013 #20
SidDithers Jan 2013 #21
Drahthaardogs Jan 2013 #22

Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 01:53 PM

1. What is strange is that they would force this on us and not allow us to label it

 

Who does the FDA work for?

from another article
French Study Finds Tumors and Organ Damage in Rats Fed Monsanto Corn
http://truth-out.org/news/item/11639-french-study-finds-tumors-and-organ-damage-in-rats-fed-monsanto-corn

"It's bizarre and dramatic for us that the US government," said Séralini, "has not requested to make serious tests before releasing these products into the environment because these GMOs are pesticide sponges, and we know that pesticides can be harmful to humans."

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 01:58 PM

2. I think you do not understand what you are reading, and

I further think the writer at the link also does not understand what she is writing about. And that is all I will say about that.

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Response to MineralMan (Reply #2)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 03:59 PM

15. +1

 

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 02:17 PM

3. E. Coli Outbreak Threatens Europe

 



A recent outbreak of a relatively new strain of the E. coli virus is threatening a number of nations in Europe. The food-borne intestinal virus has currently affected around 8 European countries, the hardest hit so far of which is Germany. The severity and the rate that the E. coli outbreak spread throughout Europe have perplexed many experts.

The E. coli virus is a relatively common organism that can be found in the digestive systems of humans and other mammals. But experts say that the one that affected Germany and the other nations is a much more aggressive form called Enterohaemorrhagic E. coli or EHEC that also is resistant to common antibiotics. This strain is known to cause severe stomach pain, diarrhea, stroke and even coma. In Germany, reports say that 16 people have died due to the EHEC infection with many others in serious condition. Over Europe, more than 1,000 people have been known to be infected with around 373 of them considered serious.

It was previously said that the outbreak started from imported cucumbers coming from Spain. But updated reports from Germany admitted that they were not since the cucumbers tested for E. coli were of a different strain of the bacterium. The experts further stated that the primary source of the outbreak remains a mystery for now. But they do add that the probable source may be vegetables since cattle manure generally used as fertilizer to grow them may contain E. coli and may end up in the produce.

http://www.gm.org/science/genetic-modification/gm-organisms/e-coli-outbreak-threatens-europe/

As of 2005, Monsanto owns Seminis. It is estimated that Seminis controls 40 percent of the U.S. vegetable seed market and 20 percent of the world market—supplying the genetics for 55 percent of the lettuce on U.S. supermarket shelves, 75 percent of the tomatoes, and 85 percent of the peppers, with strong holdings in beans, cucumbers, squash, melons, broccoli, cabbage, spinach and peas. The company’s biggest revenue source comes from tomato and peppers seeds, followed by cucumbers and beans.


http://www.emergencyhomesteader.com/a-complete-list-of-seed-companies-owned-by-monsanto-and-a-complete-list-of-seed-companies-not-owned-by-monsanto/

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Response to No Compromise (Reply #3)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 02:57 PM

9. Poor sanitation, use of raw manure, and feedlot factory farming is responsible for the

Shiga-toxic E coli problem, along with misuse of antibiotics. It has nothing whatsoever to do with genetic engineering of anything.

Try not to exhibit such a medieval fear of science.

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 02:17 PM

4. you strike me as being rather ignorant about science....

You do realize there are probably as many E. coli cells sitting in your chair as there are your own cells, or damned nearly. We are full of E. coli and related bacteria. Do you know the difference between pathogenic and non-pathogenic E. coli? Do you know why E. coli is used as a common expression vector when cloning and screening useful genes?

I suspect that if you knew the answers to those questions you would not post silly stuff like the OP. You can take some solace in being joined by many other people equally ignorant about science and genetics-- did you know there is a whole movement of modern Luddites who fear genetic engineering EVEN THOUGH THEY DON'T KNOW DIDDLY ABOUT IT? Can you imagine that? A whole movement that feeds off it's collective ignorance and fear of things it doesn't understand to stoke ever higher levels of fear and outrage? Other then the Tea Party, I mean. Yes siree, it's the anti-GMO science massa-cree movement.

/rant

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Response to mike_c (Reply #4)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 02:19 PM

5. what this guy said

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Response to mike_c (Reply #4)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 02:54 PM

8. I don't like the idea of genetically engineered crops and salmon because of the virtual guarantee

that the modified genetic material will wind up where it's not wanted or even dangerous. But even I know how very useful genetic engineering can be. It has given us fabulous rabies and feline leukemia virus vaccines for cats, for instance. But those genes stay confined to the lab and in biological products which do not pose an environmental or genetic risk to anything else.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #8)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 03:12 PM

10. well, setting aside all the arguments about how likely that is...

...and really, I don't agree that it's inevitable by any means, nor do I agree that criteria like "where it's not wanted or even dangerous" have any real world meaning. OK, a gene that increases the speed of weight gain in farmed fish, for example-- under what circumstances might that be "dangerous?" I think we too often allow emotional arguments to chain and thereby undermine one another, i.e. we imagine hypothetical and generally unrealistic fears like, say, horrible pathogenicity being engineered into a food plant, that MIGHT then escape into natural populations, and that "contaminates" more realistic thinking with the idea that engineered genes escaping from cultivation must be awful. But that ignores the unlikelihood of the first premise and jumps right to the utterly unrealistic conclusion based on sloppy thinking.

But setting that all aside for a moment-- don't forget that any such gene that does "escape" cultivation will be subject to natural selection (or at least its phenotype will) and will be progressively edited out of natural populations unless it actually confers reproductive advantages under natural settings-- the very definition of "good" genetic modification. Most GMO engineering only confers advantage under artificial selection and enhanced nutrition in ag settings-- outside that context expressing those genes is usually pretty expensive. That's probably one reason we DON'T see widespread genetic contamination of natural populations with engineered genomes-- that's only likely when there is a mechanism for escape AND when the engineered phenotype is beneficial to the organism.

There is an exception that concerns me-- development of resistance to population management of pests and pathogens, but that's a different discussion, I think.

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 02:20 PM

6. Do some research before you post maybe.

You are on to a huge story, but missed it entirely.

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 02:51 PM

7. No. There is no mechanism for what you are hypothesizing.

The E coli they use in genetic engineering is NOT STEC/shigatoxic E coli/ E coli O157H7.

End of subject. Now go relax.

And yes, I DO have a degree in microbiology.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #7)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 03:18 PM

11. E. Coli wouldn't be in the seeds either?

Isn't it used to produce crops(usually via tissue culture). These crops are grown by seed companies and the seeds are sold to farmers?

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Response to LeftInTX (Reply #11)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 03:39 PM

14. no....

There are lots of uses for bacterial cells in molecular biology, but none of them result in bacterial contamination of products. Here's an analogy that might help-- although there are lots of uses for hammers and wrenches on manufacturing lines, you don't find them in your box of cereal.

One of the primary uses of E. coli-- nonpathogenic E. coli-- in genetic engineering is as an expression and screening vector during cloning of a gene of interest, such as one (for example) that conveys higher nutritional content in fruits. In order to make sure you have the gene and it's functional, you clone it into rapidly growing bacteria, often along with a promoter or "switch" for turning that gene on or off. The success rate for cloning isn't typically high, but it doesn't need to be because even if you only get your gene of interest into one bacterial cell's genome, that cell will reproduce a whole colony containing millions of progeny-- and millions of copies of your gene-- in short order. If you clone a combined gene that includes both your gene of interest, plus a gene that conveys antibiotic resistance or the ability to grow on modified medium, the combined cassette of genes is easy to screen out of all the untransformed "background" bacterial cells-- the untransformed cells die on the modified medium, and the successfully cloned colonies remain. If you included a promoter you can experiment with transcribing and translating the gene product, or you can just use the bacteria to maintain your cloned gene.

Your gene of interest can then be maintained almost indefinitely in those E. coli cells. But they are not used directly to insert the gene into crop plants. Instead, the gene is cut out from their genome and a variety of methods can be used to insert it into the genome of the target plant species.

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 03:25 PM

12. Every human being on the planet has a gut full of E.coli

So do the rest of the mammals. The E. coli outbreaks that make the news are the result of poor sanitation - food preparers not washing their hands after defecation, raw feces being used as fertilizer, insufficiently clean produce, cross-contamination in processing plants.

E. coli is used for a lot of bacteriological research because it's common and easy to grow. For more than you probably care to know about the critters, check out Zimmer's book Microcosm: E. coli and the New Science of Life.

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 03:37 PM

13. Woo...

More from the fine folk at farmwars.info

"Chemtrails and Monsanto’s New Aluminum Resistance Gene – Coincidence?"

"What do HAARP, Chemtrails, and Global Warming all have in common?"

"Thirty Pieces of Silver – The Ron Paul Betrayal"

"Immunization Graphs – The Real Story on Vaccine Effectiveness
Actual statistics prove that vaccines HAVE NOT prevented disease."

and on and on.

Your source is a big pile of poo. How anyone can believe anything posted at that site is a mystery.

Sid

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 05:02 PM

16. Kick for woo in GD!...nt

Sid

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 05:05 PM

17. There's zillions of different varieties of E. Coli.

A small subset of them are the harmful variants that sicken and kill people.

Quite a few subspecies live in your gut, and are supposed to - they're part of your intestinal flora.

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 05:10 PM

18. woo woo

 

woo

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 05:13 PM

19. They also use dihydrogen monoxide.

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Response to Dr. Strange (Reply #19)

Fri Jan 4, 2013, 06:40 PM

20. Awesome...

Ever hear about the radio DJ who announced on April 1 that the city's water supply had become contaminated with dihydrogen monoxide? Gullible overreaction ensued.

http://web.kitsapsun.com/redesign/2004-04-02/local/438974.shtml

Sid

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Sat Jan 5, 2013, 09:42 AM

21. Kick for woo in GD...nt

Sid

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Response to No Compromise (Original post)

Sat Jan 5, 2013, 09:48 AM

22. No.

That is all.

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