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Thu Dec 27, 2012, 08:56 PM

Jobs aside, how many people here could honestly shoot a person.

I could not--either to injure or to kill. That's just me. I know my limitations, morally and physically. It is a choice that I make not to assume that every person is potentially an enemy or intends to do me harm. Even when I have been in situations where I felt threatened, picking up a weapon was not the first thing that came to mind. I'm asking because I know my own limits and harming someone else is not within those boundaries for me.

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Reply Jobs aside, how many people here could honestly shoot a person. (Original post)
Skidmore Dec 2012 OP
DollarBillHines Dec 2012 #1
Lizzie Poppet Dec 2012 #2
Daemonaquila Dec 2012 #5
loli phabay Dec 2012 #10
Lizzie Poppet Dec 2012 #19
GreenStormCloud Dec 2012 #24
loli phabay Dec 2012 #7
Daemonaquila Dec 2012 #3
Arkansas Granny Dec 2012 #4
jody Dec 2012 #6
Deep13 Dec 2012 #8
sarisataka Dec 2012 #9
OneTenthofOnePercent Dec 2012 #11
TheKentuckian Dec 2012 #12
cbrer Dec 2012 #13
Barack_America Dec 2012 #14
Selatius Dec 2012 #15
GeorgeGist Dec 2012 #16
freethought Dec 2012 #17
Old Codger Dec 2012 #18
a la izquierda Dec 2012 #20
X_Digger Dec 2012 #21
lynne Dec 2012 #22
hack89 Dec 2012 #23
former-republican Dec 2012 #25
JEFF9K Dec 2012 #26

Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:04 PM

1. If my family or my property were at risk? No problem.

If someone was trying to kick in my door or trying to light one of our barns on fire, they would be dead, dead, dead.

I would have no problem doing what I had to do to protect us.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:07 PM

2. I don't think anyone knows until the situation actually arises.

At least they don't know if they could or not...they might be able to know they couldn't. I believe I would be able to. I have a rather cold, analytical personality. I think so...but I don't know so...no one does until it happens.

As an aside, one doesn't shoot to injure or kill in a defensive situation. One shoots to stop. Only about one in five gunshot wounds are fatal (although that's for each wound, not wounding incidents, and trained shooters will almost always "double tap" two shots). But trained shooters are also taught that if you do not feel you have a legal and ethical right to kill someone, then you should not shoot at all...because there remains a significant chance that they will die. Shooting to just "wing 'em," however, is only for the movies.

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Response to Lizzie Poppet (Reply #2)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:16 PM

5. Not true, really.

If you've ever had to defend yourself, and especially if you've ever killed an animal for food, you do know if you could pull that trigger.

Also, truly well-trained shooters often can choose a less lethal target. It's no different than any other martial arts training. But that also will be determined by caliber and ammo type (or with bows, your draw and arrowhead). But guns are always chancier regardless - very easy to make a mistake when rushed in close quarters, especially if using a poor choice of weapon for the circumstances.

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Response to Daemonaquila (Reply #5)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:20 PM

10. what do you mean by less lethal targets. there is only one target its called center mass

 

And you shoot until the threat is stopped regardless if its two rounds or ten.

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Response to Daemonaquila (Reply #5)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:45 PM

19. I have.

I've actually had a DGU, in fact (no shots fired). I've still never shot anyone, so I don' tknow that I could...I just hae strong reason to believe I could.

I have never heard of a single recognized instructor or course of study in the use of firearms in combat that teaches shooting to wound. Several, in fact, state very specifically against such a tactic. A very good shooter could conceivably do so...but that is taught in the overwhelming majority of cases is to shoot for center of mass.

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Response to Daemonaquila (Reply #5)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:22 PM

24. Deliberately shooting to wound is illegal.

The only reason to shoot someone is that the felon is doing something so evil that they must be stopped immediately, even if they die as a result of being stopped. You must wait until you have no other options, until you are in the gravest extreme. That applies in all states, even in SYG states.

If you shoot to wound, you are attempt extreme persuasion, not incapacitation. After your wounding shot you are planning to evaluate the situation to see if more shooting is needed. If you have the time to evaluate your shot, then you fired too early as you were not yet in the gravest extreme.

If you pull the trigger, you must be at the point where his agression must be stopped immedately, and you aim at center mass, and keep shooting until he is no longer a threat. If he dies, that's his problem.

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Response to Lizzie Poppet (Reply #2)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:17 PM

7. yup your trained that if a weapon is drawn then you have to be ready to kill

 

Some people are just not able to make that decision and wash out of police academys and the military. I admire them for realising it and not endangering the people next to them.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:09 PM

3. I could.

I don't want to be in a position where killing is the only option vs taking nonlethal action, but I would if it seemed absolutely necessary. Baseball bats and other less dire responses are more comfortable given my training.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:11 PM

4. I can't honestly say that I could shoot someone.

I've never been in a situation where I wished I had a gun, so I can't give a definite answer.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)


Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:19 PM

8. "Jobs aside?"

Under the right circumstances with the right provocation, not only are we all capable of killing, we are all capable of murdering and even participating in ethnic cleansing. There is only one kind of person in the world and it doesn't take much to seperate us from out constructed notions of morality and civility.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:20 PM

9. I commend you

for knowing yourself and your limits. It is a question every one should ask themselves.

I know, for me, the answer is yes. I don't know if that makes me better or you. In many ways it may be you.

In either case, we are just folks.

Peace to you

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:23 PM

11. I don't think anybody knows for sure until the moment of reckoning...

 

But I feel that, if threatened, I would have no problems with it. I think that knowing yourself and how you would react is probably more important than whether or not you would react with lethal force at all.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:26 PM

12. Sure as I can be, knife and hands if I needed to as well.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:30 PM

13. True evil exists in the world.

 

If I had an opportunity to blast Adam Lanza before he killed those kids, I'd have pulled the trigger.

Yes, despite the obvious pathology of his mental instability.

Yes, it would have affected me for the rest of my life.

Yes today those 20 kids would be squealing while opening presents and getting tickled by their folks.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:32 PM

14. I could, far too easily I suspect.

Not so much in my own defense but, threaten my son? Oh yeah, I will shoot you, or kill you with my bare hands.

I admit that I have a temper, which is just one of the many reasons I will not keep firearms in my house.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:35 PM

15. I'd aim for the center of mass, but that's just training.

I would have to make a conscious effort to aim for the kneecaps or other non-vital areas of the body if it came to defending myself in my own home.

Outside of the home, no, in all probability I wouldn't shoot to kill.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:42 PM

16. Adam Lanza?

In a heartbeat. Phucking monster!

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:42 PM

17. I once had training that could have lead to a career in federal law enforcement

I'll admit it in advance that is was for the National Park Service. I had trained as a seasonal law enforcement ranger. I had the federal commission, defense, firearms, and various other types of training. I had a revolver on my waste and a shotgun in the cruiser. There was one particular incident that almost had me draw my firearm on someone. Fortunately, I didn't have to do that but I came to realization that I probably should try an alternate career. There are a number of people that I trained with that, even years later, are full-time with the NPS. To them, I take of my hat and salute them.

When you first train with firearms it's easy to shoot at paper targets. You know they're not real. However, if an incident arises where you actually have to draw down on someone, asking yourself if you can pull the trigger becomes much harder to answer. At my particular incident, I could not answer that question. My supervisors gave me good reviews that season and said that my chances of getting a nomination to FLETC (Federal Law Enforcement Training Center) were excellent. Politely, I told them that I probably follow another career path. That was 20 years ago and I have never looked back.

In the few years that followed, a number of coworkers asked me about buying a pistol or other type of gun for self-defense or home defense. They would often ask me if I thought it was a good idea. I would ask them a blunt but simple question-"Are you sure you could kill someone?" The question would often catch them off guard and if they hesitated answering the question my answer would often be "No." I would simply explain that one had better be damned sure that you can pull that trigger on another human being and that thinking about it was not the same as actually doing it. I would also emphasize the risk that the presence of a gun in the house poses to risk to others and children. Think carefully before buying one.

There was one or two who answered my question with a quick and deliberate "Yes". If memory serves me correctly one of them spent time in the military so that was no surprise. I would then tell them that if they think it is needed, at the very least, get some training on the weapon and make sure that they get means to secure the weapon and its ammo when it's not needed, trigger locks, locked ammunition storage and the like.

I remember one person actually did look into into buying a handgun but was shocked at the prices they saw. For them, I guess price of the weapon was enough to discourage the idea of buying a handgun.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 09:44 PM

18. No sweat

Have no qualms whatsoever if situation calls for lethal force (threat of severe bodily harm or death to myself or others)
called IDOL (In Defense Of Life)

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:08 PM

20. I honestly don't think I could unless seriously provoked.

I don't kill bugs in my house, and I cried that a groundhog got hit in front of my house.
Now, I could definitely break kneecaps with my baseball bat. But kill? Let's hope I never have to find out.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:10 PM

21. I've been faced with the choice, and I was prepared to shoot.

In the aftermath of Hurricane Ike, I was in Galveston trying to get phone service back up for residents.

As I was ferrying network testing gear from my truck to the switch, I was approached by a guy asking for money. I offered him a bottle of water and an energy bar.

He became agitated and again demanded money. He got close enough that I could see that he had a mouth full of mostly black stumps instead of teeth, and continued to follow me as I went around my truck to the open driver's door (big equipment truck, not a pickup).

As I reached into the center console of my truck for a bottle of water, I heard a 'snick'- he'd pulled a knife and took a step toward me. I reached instead for the handgun I kept by the seat. I put the open truck door between us, and told him to GTFO. He took another step toward me; I raised my pistol and pointed it at his chest. He did a double-take, then turned and ran. I got on the company radio, and an hour later, a DPS officer came by to check on me. He took my statement and left.

I had the shakes for an hour, and the dead-fish smell of the Texas coast after a storm didn't help settle my stomach.

The thing that really pissed me off later? I would have gladly gotten on the radio and gotten him picked up by the crisis response center ran by the Texas City FD / TX National Guard about ten minutes away.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:17 PM

22. Wouldn't have any problem with it -

- if I was threatened or any family member/friend was threatened. If I have to make a choice as to who lives, I'm choosing my family every time.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:20 PM

23. To defend myself or my family? Wouldn't hesitate for a second. nt

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:27 PM

25. OP you don't know because you haven't been there

 

If you had you wouldn't be posting this because you would be dead or you would have killed someone.

Feeling threatened and knowing someone is going to kill you is not the same thing.

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Response to Skidmore (Original post)

Thu Dec 27, 2012, 10:32 PM

26. Hunting

I don't even understand how a decent person could go hunting. I heard a story about ball player Jim Thome asking a teammate to go deer hunting with him. The teammate was heard to say "I couldn't shoot a deer; I'd start crying!"

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