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Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:26 PM

Is it hypocritical for folks who decline organ donation to be organ recipients?

A few experiences I've had in the ICU where a patient's family has declined organ donation prompted this question.

43 replies, 1948 views

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Reply Is it hypocritical for folks who decline organ donation to be organ recipients? (Original post)
NNguyenMD Dec 2012 OP
union_maid Dec 2012 #1
Recursion Dec 2012 #2
justice1 Dec 2012 #38
banned from Kos Dec 2012 #3
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #4
Panasonic Dec 2012 #5
brewens Dec 2012 #6
Arkansas Granny Dec 2012 #7
lastlib Dec 2012 #8
NNguyenMD Dec 2012 #15
robinlynne Dec 2012 #26
NNguyenMD Dec 2012 #34
Posteritatis Dec 2012 #30
Skittles Dec 2012 #9
SheilaT Dec 2012 #10
Blasphemer Dec 2012 #11
Glitterati Dec 2012 #12
Blasphemer Dec 2012 #13
Glitterati Dec 2012 #41
OneTenthofOnePercent Dec 2012 #14
NNguyenMD Dec 2012 #18
OneTenthofOnePercent Dec 2012 #19
BigDemVoter Dec 2012 #16
NNguyenMD Dec 2012 #20
REP Dec 2012 #17
Bigmack Dec 2012 #21
JI7 Dec 2012 #22
OldDem2012 Dec 2012 #23
Daemonaquila Dec 2012 #24
NNguyenMD Dec 2012 #29
Luke5420 Dec 2012 #25
bluesbassman Dec 2012 #27
Dorian Gray Dec 2012 #36
Scootaloo Dec 2012 #28
KT2000 Dec 2012 #31
NNguyenMD Dec 2012 #32
ismnotwasm Dec 2012 #33
mitchtv Dec 2012 #35
ismnotwasm Dec 2012 #37
truebluegreen Dec 2012 #39
Lugnut Dec 2012 #40
RomneyLies Dec 2012 #42
cecilfirefox Dec 2012 #43

Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:27 PM

1. Well, yes

Of course, if the family is making the decision and not the patient, I guess that wouldn't apply.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:30 PM

2. I've totally never understood that

I mean, unless you're in one of those small religious sects that has a theological reason against it, why the hell do people care what happens to their organs after they're dead? It's weird to me.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 11:53 PM

38. My mom watched Coma back in the 70's, and will not even consider it.

Her theory being, the rich would start harvesting organs, before the poor were done with them...Come to think of it, this has been done in other parts of the world.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:31 PM

3. I am a (prospective) organ donor

 

so I say yes.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:31 PM

4. I am an organ donor

So yes.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:38 PM

5. Yes.

 

Also an organ donor. My dad encouraged me even after reading the Jewish law about it.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:46 PM

6. I hear frequently that people won't donate because they charge for the organ or blood.

It's usually someone I can tell is a crank, not too smart or usually both. I work for a blood center. I usually don't waste my time on those people.

I've explained to several that while we are a not for profit corporation, I and the rest of the staff are paid and in some cases fairly highly trained. In my case, I make around $38 thousand, so we aren't exactly the highest paid people around.

We of course have to charge for the blood, even though people donate it to us. It's the same with the organ donors. That is something I understood long before I got a job in the business. I was both a blood and organ donor. Soon I will make my 100th platelet donation, and that's at about three units per donation.

I have also seen the organ harvest team get off the plane at our local airport. They rushed by wheeling their equipment and piled in a van headed for the hospital. I can assure you that isn't cheap.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:46 PM

7. Yes.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:58 PM

8. OTOH, do you want people who have defective organs to be donating those organs to others?

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Response to lastlib (Reply #8)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:28 PM

15. More like if you're personally against organ donation...

for whatever reason, shouldn't you be against being an organ recipient for a medical condition.

Also, shouldn't society be able to decline giving organs to people who have refused to sign up as organ donors in the past.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Reply #15)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:05 PM

26. YOu know. Your idea could save a lot of lives. If we made donation mandatory to be able to receive,

everyone would sign up in a minute. More lives would be saved. winner!

In China, elder care is provided by people starting in their forties. The number of hours you give to help older people is counted. that is the number of hours you get when you are older. Makes absolute sense !

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Response to robinlynne (Reply #26)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:42 PM

34. Thanks robinlynne, it's just something that's bothered me

I understand when a family is grieving, organ donation is one of the last subjects they want to discuss.

But at the same time, I feel that most people would not hesitate to receive an organ if it meant life or death.

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Response to lastlib (Reply #8)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:29 PM

30. Presumably the doctors have some kind of say in whether an organ is defective or not. (nt)

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:18 PM

9. of course it is

just like it is hypocritical for healthy people to expect to receive blood if they need it when they could never be bothered to donate blood - the world is filled with hypocrites

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:21 PM

10. Yes. And it's also hypocritical for those opposed to things like stem cell research

to then avail themselves of the benefits of the research. As Skittles said, there are a lot of hypocrites out there.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:22 PM

11. Hell, yes.

If someone had a belief system (spiritual or otherwise) that precludes donation, they sure as hell should not be accepting donated organs. I would only make an exception for children or incapacitated people whose guardians decline donation for them.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:23 PM

12. Not always

My husband was an organ donor. But, they couldn't take his organs when he died because of a hospital acquired MRSA infection.

Sometimes, there are simply mitigating factors which prevent organ donation out of a person's control.

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Response to Glitterati (Reply #12)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:27 PM

13. I wouldn't put that in the same category

He didn't decline, really. He was willing to serve others but unable to do so for reasons outside of his control.

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Response to Blasphemer (Reply #13)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 06:46 PM

41. That's true, but

If he was eligible for a heart transplant, we would have joyfully accepted.

It wasn't a decision we got to make, but I assure you he would have preferred to walk his daughter down the aisle and held his grandchildren.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:27 PM

14. It's their body, thier choice, and they can do what they want to it.

 

Doesn't matter if it's logical, makes sense or is hypocritical. People only really have to answer to their own personal metric and what they think of themselves. People worry too much about garnering everyone else's approval of their lifestyle.

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Response to OneTenthofOnePercent (Reply #14)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:37 PM

18. I agree that you should never be forced to donate your organs

but does that person who decline to join the organ donation pool get to receive an organ when the time comes when they need one?

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Response to NNguyenMD (Reply #18)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:41 PM

19. Under the current laws, yes. Is it hypocritical... maybe. How about this scenario:

 

A woman has an abortion (no problem, completely her choice). Should she subsequently be barred from ever adopting a child or receiving any other reproductive treatments?

I say no.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:28 PM

16. Depends. . .

Some people don't qualify for organ donation. . .

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Response to BigDemVoter (Reply #16)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:53 PM

20. True, but most folks even most physicians

aren't able to determine who is suitable and who isn't. That's why it's important to have a large pool.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:32 PM

17. Due to the disease that makes me a potential recipient, I'm not good donor material

If I ever get to the point I need tx, my major organs will be in worse shape than they are now (kidney disease is hard on everything) but I give blood when ever I'm allowed to do so, and anyone is welcome to what they can use.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:56 PM

21. Hey... part me out like an old Chevy. WTF...I won't need them anymore. nt

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:01 PM

22. yes, unless the reason is they can't donate because of medical reasons

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:03 PM

23. Yes, absolutely. nt.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:58 PM

24. No.

People have many reasons to not donate, including being willing but not wanting to register that automatically and have it on their drivers license. They don't want it to possibly influence an ER or other medical decision, but expect family members would make a reasonable decision. Others choose not to out of respect for their family members' wishes. There's no hypocrisy, any more than not supporting research into a particular condition one's entire life, then developing that condition and getting treatment others have paid for.

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Response to Daemonaquila (Reply #24)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:28 PM

29. Donated organs are an incredibly scarce resource

As a matter of fairness, I don't see how someone who refused to be listed as an organ donor can in good conscience expect to be listed on a transplant list for a heart, liver or kidney.

People die waiting for the next available organ. The families and patients who do donate, are giving an incredibly personal gift. Out of respect to these donors, these organs should not go to those who refuse to contribute or feel entitled to this gift of life.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)


Response to Luke5420 (Reply #25)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:13 PM

27. No, do you have any links to verified intances of this occurring?

Sounds rather like urban myth to me.

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Response to bluesbassman (Reply #27)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:46 PM

36. I think that was the idea that the FICTIONAL

book Coma was based upon.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:13 PM

28. It's hypocritical, but that shouldn't be a bar to receiving treatment they need

I can't imagine the outlook that makes people not want to donate organs. Frankly, if I'm dead, my heart isn't doing me an ounce of good, might as well give it to someone else!

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:31 PM

31. I am a potential organ donor but

I will not accept donor organs for myself.

I do think it is hypocritical to decline donation if one is open to the possibility of receiving organ donation. Maybe the people have health problems that they don't want to talk about that would prevent donation.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:35 PM

32. Thanks for everyone's thoughtful replies

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:41 PM

33. Not exactly

I work in transplant and its all to often a ethical knifes edge. Devout Jehovah's Witnesses, for instance will accept a transplant (kidney anyway) but still refuse blood products.

You learn to be careful with judgement and pick your battles. In transplant, people will question everything from the gender to the age to the race of the patient. Which are usually the wrong questions.

We give what's called en bloc kidney's--that's both kidneys from a deceased child--to 50 or 60 year old people. It's not wrong.

In ICU, death is such an emotional experience, decisions aren't always made with clear thought.

So while could be hypocritical in some instances I suppose, not in all.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:34 PM

35. question: Is it hypocritical for organ administrators to refuse donated organs

to marijuana users, yet accept organ donations from pot smokers?

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Response to mitchtv (Reply #35)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 11:13 PM

37. Any known drug use is disclosed to the recipient

It's their choice to accept what are called 'high risk organs', including drug overdoses victims etc.


The pot smoking thing is mostly because of the profound immunosuppression one needs for a successful transplant makes the recipient extremely vulnerable to very deadly,opportunistic fungus infections.


I did ask an infectious disease doctor during a lecture if cooking and/or baking it would kill off any mold or fungus, and he said he didn't know. It would be nice TO know, because getting a transplant is rough.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 12:27 AM

39. Yes.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 01:08 AM

40. Yes.

I am an organ donor. I am also donating my body to science for use wherever it's needed. I won't need any body parts when I'm gone and if my body can be used for research of any kind, have at it.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 06:49 PM

42. IMO, organ donation should be mandatory.

 

Once dead, nobody has any reason to keep them.

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Response to NNguyenMD (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 06:55 PM

43. Absolutely, yes- you don't pay into the system, you don't get benefits by it. If I were a legislator

it's something I'd try to put into law.

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