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Mon Dec 24, 2012, 02:54 PM

The Straight Story (41,489 posts)

NY gunman who ambushed firefighters had served time for manslaughter in his grandmother's death

WEBSTER, N.Y. (AP) — Police in New York state say a man who ambushed firefighters had served 17 years for manslaughter in the death of his grandmother.

Webster Police Chief Gerald Pickering says 62-year-old William Spengler was found dead of a self-inflicted gunshot to the head.

Police say he set fire to a car and house to lure firefighters to his house on the shore of Lake Ontario early Monday.

When firefighters arrived, he opened fire, probably with a rifle. Two firefighters died at the scene and two others were hospitalized. A fifth first responder was injured.

http://bigstory.ap.org/article/firefighter-shot-scene-blaze-western-ny

28 replies, 1220 views

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28 replies	Author	Time	Post
NY gunman who ambushed firefighters had served time for manslaughter in his grandmother's death (Original post)	The Straight Story	Dec 2012	OP
So how did he get that riffle?	nadinbrzezinski	Dec 2012	#1
By breaking the law (nt)	Recursion	Dec 2012	#4
What's a riffle? n/t	zappaman	Dec 2012	#15
It's a place in a stream where skillful use of	MineralMan	Dec 2012	#19
Riffles can be had for about $6.50 a foot	Brother Buzz	Dec 2012	#16
That seems like a cheap riffle!	zappaman	Dec 2012	#26
No waiting, but the selection has narrowed; no cutthroat trout	Brother Buzz	Dec 2012	#28
A "law abiding" Gun CULTurist ultimately supplied his weapon	jpak	Dec 2012	#2
Or he stole it, like the last two shooters (nt)	Recursion	Dec 2012	#6
So, how'd he get that rifle?	Drunken Irishman	Dec 2012	#3
Illegally (nt)	Recursion	Dec 2012	#5
wow, that's way too easy to do. can we track down who he got it from and punish them?	bettyellen	Dec 2012	#7
Possibly, depending on its provenance	Recursion	Dec 2012	#8
How could a felon purchase a firearm	janx	Dec 2012	#9
The ORIGINAL retail sale was certainly not the transaction that put the weapon in the hands...	slackmaster	Dec 2012	#10
Ah, I misread. Thanks for the correction. n/t	janx	Dec 2012	#11
I know a felon with a huge collection of guns.	Whovian	Dec 2012	#14
If you know this is true then this man is breaking the law......	Logical	Dec 2012	#18
I don't believe so in AL	Whovian	Dec 2012	#27
Well, either he wasn't a felon yet when he bought it 17+ years ago	Recursion	Dec 2012	#12
With so many guns on the street	TheCowsCameHome	Dec 2012	#24
A local media report says that three lived in the home...	Earth_First	Dec 2012	#13
WTH..	Cha	Dec 2012	#17
So any degree of murder should be life in prison with no parole? 2nd? 3rd? Involuntary manslaughter?	Logical	Dec 2012	#20
This guy beat grandma to death with a hammer.	LisaL	Dec 2012	#21
Thank you for stating the obvious.	Cha	Dec 2012	#22
OK, so what was he convicted of? Details please.	Logical	Dec 2012	#23
If it was a hammer why did the NRA fight so hard to protect him?	realgreen	Dec 2012	#25

Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 02:57 PM

nadinbrzezinski (120,358 posts)

1. So how did he get that riffle?

Oh never mind. MORE GUNZ

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:02 PM

Recursion (25,543 posts)

4. By breaking the law (nt)

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:24 PM

zappaman (8,375 posts)

15. What's a riffle? n/t

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Response to zappaman (Reply #15)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:42 PM

MineralMan (53,994 posts)

19. It's a place in a stream where skillful use of

Last edited Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:44 PM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

a fly rod may well produce a very nice trout. As seen in the foreground in the photo below. Further, one cannot usually see a trout in a riffle, so a rifle would not be useful in killing a trout in a riffle.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:35 PM

Brother Buzz (8,372 posts)

16. Riffles can be had for about $6.50 a foot

Richard Brautigan found a trout stream in the back of a junk-yard, stacked up in sections behind broken cars and abandoned cookers. The sections cost $6.50 per foot.

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Response to Brother Buzz (Reply #16)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:57 PM

zappaman (8,375 posts)

26. That seems like a cheap riffle!

Can anyone get a riffle?
Is there a waiting period?

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Response to zappaman (Reply #26)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:21 PM

Brother Buzz (8,372 posts)

28. No waiting, but the selection has narrowed; no cutthroat trout

It's strictly a catch and release trout stream, and the rumor persists, one section contains a hunchback rainbow trout.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 02:59 PM

jpak (26,923 posts)

2. A "law abiding" Gun CULTurist ultimately supplied his weapon

Someone bought it "legally" and sold it "legally".

yup

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Response to jpak (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:03 PM

Recursion (25,543 posts)

6. Or he stole it, like the last two shooters (nt)

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:00 PM

Drunken Irishman (24,587 posts)

3. So, how'd he get that rifle?

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Response to Drunken Irishman (Reply #3)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:02 PM

Recursion (25,543 posts)

5. Illegally (nt)

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Response to Recursion (Reply #5)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:04 PM

bettyellen (20,123 posts)

7. wow, that's way too easy to do. can we track down who he got it from and punish them?

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Response to bettyellen (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:09 PM

Recursion (25,543 posts)

8. Possibly, depending on its provenance

We're stuck with the unfortunate problem that guns in general are not registered. I wish it were otherwise. However, if the original retail sale of the rifle was somewhat recent, it may have been recorded.

Long guns, in general, have less of a paper trail than handguns because (the headlines of the past few weeks notwithstanding) they're used only in a tiny minority of crimes.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #8)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:11 PM

janx (21,732 posts)

9. How could a felon purchase a firearm

at a retail location?

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Response to janx (Reply #9)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:12 PM

slackmaster (60,567 posts)

10. The ORIGINAL retail sale was certainly not the transaction that put the weapon in the hands...

...of a felon.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #10)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:14 PM

janx (21,732 posts)

11. Ah, I misread. Thanks for the correction. n/t

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #10)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:18 PM

Whovian (2,866 posts)

14. I know a felon with a huge collection of guns.

When I asked him about this he explained they were in his wife's name.

This guy is a business owner, big in his church and community. His felony came from when he ran down a homeless man while drunk. Not my favorite acquaintance. But a good example of how easy it is for anyone to get a gun.

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Response to Whovian (Reply #14)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:41 PM

Logical (8,068 posts)

18. If you know this is true then this man is breaking the law......

A felon CANNOT have a unsecured gun in his house, no matter who it belongs to.

If it is in a safe and the felon does not know the combination then that is OK.

Or stored offsite is ok.

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Response to Logical (Reply #18)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:04 PM

Whovian (2,866 posts)

27. I don't believe so in AL

But if I am wrong, I will happily turn Ron Hardy's ass in.

Oh, Gee did I say his name? His company's name?

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Response to janx (Reply #9)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:14 PM

Recursion (25,543 posts)

12. Well, either he wasn't a felon yet when he bought it 17+ years ago

or somebody else bought it more recently, and either illegally transferred it to him, or he stole it from him.

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Response to Drunken Irishman (Reply #3)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:55 PM

TheCowsCameHome (27,703 posts)

24. With so many guns on the street

Last edited Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:10 PM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

it probably wasn't difficult to obtain one.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:15 PM

Earth_First (11,602 posts)

13. A local media report says that three lived in the home...

Last edited Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:22 PM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

His sister and their mother who died in October.

I hope his sister was not a victim in this horrendous tragedy...

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:40 PM

Cha (124,597 posts)

17. WTH..

The gunman, William Spengler, had served more than 17 years in prison for beating his 92-year-old grandmother to death with a hammer in 1980 at the house next to where Monday's attack happened, Pickering said at afternoon news conference. Spengler, 62, was paroled in 1998 and had led a quiet life since, authorities said. Convicted felons are not allowed to possess weapons.

Never should have been let out, imv.

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Response to Cha (Reply #17)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:42 PM

Logical (8,068 posts)

20. So any degree of murder should be life in prison with no parole? 2nd? 3rd? Involuntary manslaughter?

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Response to Logical (Reply #20)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:45 PM

LisaL (22,819 posts)

21. This guy beat grandma to death with a hammer.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #21)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:50 PM

Cha (124,597 posts)

22. Thank you for stating the obvious.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #21)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:53 PM

Logical (8,068 posts)

23. OK, so what was he convicted of? Details please.

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Response to Cha (Reply #17)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:44 PM

realgreen (47 posts)

25. If it was a hammer why did the NRA fight so hard to protect him?

It had to of been a gun.

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