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DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » I feel more disconnected ...

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:41 AM

fujiyama (14,609 posts)

I feel more disconnected from this country than ever before...

Last edited Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:48 AM USA/ET - Edit history (2)

So I'm 31 male, and maybe it's just me. I don't get this country. I thought I did, but now I really feel like I don't ever since the shooting at Sandy Hook. Maybe it's the fact that I live in the South now and I'm not really all that into guns. Or violent video games for that matter.

I've been feeling sort of out there for a while now, but my values feel especially distant from many, if not most I meet or know especially my peer group.

And this isn't really particularly ideological. I consider myself fairly moderate - left of center on most issues, centrist on a few, and maybe even right of center on some (OK I'll admit I can't think of the issue).

But the obsession with firearms in this country just strikes me as strange and somewhat fanatical. Even on this issue, I think my viewpoint isn't extreme. I've been to the range and I'm not against people owning guns for self defense, hunting, and target practice. I just don't see the point or purpose of civilians owning AR-15s and high capacity clips. Fine. I know there are many that agree with me and some that disagree. That's not really the issue. It's more the paranoia I see in this country on an everyday basis. People have lost all faith in just about every major institution. The government in particular, but also the banks, corporations in general, the health care industry, and higher education. People are still over leveraged and no one sees anything changing. And the frustration is understandable. The standard of living is slipping and I see no long term solutions by anyone that really addresses anything (on either the left or the right).

I just see and hear constant bitterness. I'm constantly bombarded with not only talking points, but irrational conspiracy theories. The new and popular one is that these recent mass shootings are some plan by the government to take away guns. It's tiring. When people believe everything is some far off plan by the powerful, there is no point in even discussing the issue. After all, if you dismiss paranoid talk, you're just another sheep.

I think I need to leave this country for a while. I'm not naive and know that every nation and society faces challenges (and people aren't necessarily any less provincial minded or ignorant in other countries). It's something I've noticed especially Americans love to ignore - we've always got the solution it seems, and we love to never learn from other nations' experiences on any issue - whether it comes to guns, health care, or anything else for that matter.

And frankly all the paranoia is making me nervous - and I've even been tempted to go buy a gun, something that makes me feel, well somewhat uncomfortable. But in a nation armed to the teeth, I'm starting to feel like I have no fucking choice. And that makes me feel like I need an out. Maybe I'm the one that's losing perspective. After all violent crime statistics are at record lows right? Even though mass shootings seem to be a daily occurrence. And that's not surprising considering the number of guns out there. Maybe this is just a normal reaction to the horrific act that took place that day. But it feels like a deeper feeling of discontent - are my values that far off?

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Arrow 34 replies Author Time Post
Reply I feel more disconnected from this country than ever before... (Original post)
 fujiyama Dec 2012 OP
LineReply There is a lot you have said that I can relate to.
 defacto7 Dec 2012 #1
LineReply You're not alone.
 napoleon_in_rags Dec 2012 #2
LineLineReply Hey...
 renie408 Dec 2012 #4
LineLineLineReply Thank you for acknowledging my words.
 napoleon_in_rags Dec 2012 #9
LineLineLineLineReply I agree.
 renie408 Dec 2012 #10
LineLineLineLineLineNew Reply We all know this is the way the forward.
 napoleon_in_rags Dec 2012 #34
LineLineReply Blazing a moral path forward...
 love_katz Dec 2012 #14
LineLineLineNew Reply Working on it love_katz. Thanks for your hugs. As funny as it sounds, they mean a lot.
 napoleon_in_rags Dec 2012 #33
LineLineNew Reply "
 H2O Man Dec 2012 #30
LineReply I hear you. I am a 48 year old woman and feel the same way sometimes.
 renie408 Dec 2012 #3
LineReply If violent crime is at a low, but mass murders are at a high, doesn't that strike you as strange?
 HiPointDem Dec 2012 #5
LineLineReply The mass murders are driven by something different than the retail murders
 Fumesucker Dec 2012 #17
LineLineLineReply yes. yet both use guns.
 HiPointDem Dec 2012 #18
LineLineLineLineReply A common characteristic suggests a common solution n/t
 Fumesucker Dec 2012 #19
LineReply I felt disconnected when everyone was screaming "Nahn Wun Wun!" and cheering on
 MADem Dec 2012 #6
LineReply Have i changed? or has America Changed?
 jambo101 Dec 2012 #7
LineReply I'm a 29 year old male...
 jal777 Dec 2012 #8
LineLineReply interesting the sound difference at new years eve
 Sunlei Dec 2012 #24
LineLineNew Reply Of course, the government of Mexico would suggest that our liberal gun laws are why they can
 Bluenorthwest Dec 2012 #27
LineReply I can relate to what you said, although I do believe
 plethoro Dec 2012 #11
LineReply I think buying a bunch of guns is missing the point.
 love_katz Dec 2012 #12
LineReply This:
 Quantess Dec 2012 #13
LineLineReply I think Winston Churchill had it about right
 Fumesucker Dec 2012 #20
LineReply I'm twice as old as you-
 marew Dec 2012 #15
LineReply K&R - really good post and replies; ty all. n/t
 gtar100 Dec 2012 #16
LineReply Why run away from the issue? I have lived in other countries..
 HipChick Dec 2012 #21
LineReply You are not alone...
 mark67 Dec 2012 #22
LineReply I think you've nailed it. The people in this nation (not anyone reading this, of course) have gone
 Egalitarian Thug Dec 2012 #23
LineLineNew Reply You echo my thoughts.
 99Forever Dec 2012 #28
LineNew Reply My cousin moved from the US to Denmark in 1983..
 SummerSnow Dec 2012 #25
LineNew Reply What country ? There's no country here.
 RagAss Dec 2012 #26
LineNew Reply If there were such a thing as a World Citizenship I would apply for it.
 lunatica Dec 2012 #29
LineNew Reply I am not sure what you need to feel connected
 hfojvt Dec 2012 #31
LineNew Reply You should read Bob Altemeyer's, "The Authoritarians." It will shine light on where the US is at.
 CrispyQ Dec 2012 #32

Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:21 AM

Star Member defacto7 (3,255 posts)

1. There is a lot you have said that I can relate to.

I'm a little older than you, 56, and I have been watching America slip into paranoia for years. The difference now is it's paranoia and ignorance. You can sum up the reasons for that in 200 pages of subjective meandering but the reasons, though important, don't matter as much as the fact that it seems to be the fact. Paranoia is rampant and stupidity is a commodity.

To contrast, there are a lot of good people in America who are not swayed by the frenzy, who are firm in the understanding that we are facing a crisis but are damn sure we are not going to let fear and lost hope devour us. The one statement you made that I don't share is that feeling of buying a weapon. That is the fear, the disease being spread by every other fearful unthinking and out of control person that has succumbed to the pressures and sales pitches. I hope you don't go there. Find some peace instead and discard the hate wave.

You know, maybe you should travel. Get out of the states for a while if you can. Go somewhere that you know is more friendly to you. Maybe there are places in the states you feel safer. I know there are places I feel more relaxed than where I live now and there are time I have to get away. I live in gun and corporate hell and that is insane to me. So maybe take some time and get your legs back. Just don't fall for the trap that you already see very clearly. You do see clearly and you are not alone.


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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:29 AM

napoleon_in_rags (3,626 posts)

2. You're not alone.

A lot of people are feeling and seeing the same things. And yes, the nature of an arms race is that everybody feels they need the arms to defend themselves due to what the other guy is doing. So you're not alone in wanting better guns either.

But the way I see it, the real challenges we face right now are with our minds. Everybody, from major advertisers to news networks, wants a piece of how we think. The question many of us face is: Can we salvage a meaningful sense of identity with so many powerful forces influencing us this way or that way? It seems so complicated, but I believe the answer is often to take it back to fundamentals. Have a beer. Look at a flower. Give somebody a hug...And if you don't know anybody, than give that poor hobo on the bus a hug. We have the power. Contrary to what Mao says, it doesn't blossom from the barrel of a gun, but rather it comes from the individual making sovereign choices about how he or she wishes to live his or her life, and branches out to others, in a way invisible to the media until it becomes so large as to be undeniable.

As far as paranoia, there is a good one and bad one. Take preppers for instance: the ones stockpiling guns preparing to arise as victorious rulers from the zombie apocalypse will be sorely disappointed, as the US military is going nowhere. But the ones gathering food and medicine, and living sustainably, so that when the red cross comes after the next extreme weather event they say "no thanks, I don't need the aid, but here's some blankets for the seniors down the street" are blazing a moral path forward that is worthy of following.

We are all feeling that uncertainty right now. I believe it wont go away any time soon. But times of great risk are times of great rewards, maybe not monetary, but just as real all the same. I believe the challenge we all face is to find a way of living that feels right, and to share it with others.

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Response to napoleon_in_rags (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:36 AM

Star Member renie408 (9,193 posts)

4. Hey...

"But the ones gathering food and medicine, and living sustainably, so that when the red cross comes after the next extreme weather event they say "no thanks, I don't need the aid, but here's some blankets for the seniors down the street" are blazing a moral path forward that is worthy of following."

That's awesome!

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Response to renie408 (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:10 AM

napoleon_in_rags (3,626 posts)

9. Thank you for acknowledging my words.

Last edited Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:15 AM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

I appreciate that, as this has relevance to me beyond disaster preparedness: The global warming problem is one of the many that burns in my mind every time I hear that latest story about it, and at this point, I'm beginning to think that the solution may lie with the people rather than governments. In this sense, individuals who are empowering themselves by preparing themselves to live sustainably, off the grid if necessary, are helping blaze a path for the rest of us. They are defining what a lower carbon - or lower fossil fuel - or lower economic functioning - but pleasant and liveable future may look like.

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Response to napoleon_in_rags (Reply #9)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:33 AM

Star Member renie408 (9,193 posts)

10. I agree.

Change in global warming will have to be a grassroots effort.

You know, in some ways this past economic downturn has been a blessing for us. We are struggling, but have learned what a life less driven by consumerism feels like. Minus the stress, I think it is a pretty good way to live. I used to think we were 'poor' because I couldn't have all the 'things' I thought I wanted. I have since learned what I really want, what is really important and what I can live without.

We could stand a little more financial security. But over all we have learned how to enjoy life with a lot less 'stuff'. Maybe other people have, too.

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Response to renie408 (Reply #10)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 05:22 AM

napoleon_in_rags (3,626 posts)

34. We all know this is the way the forward.

Truthful anecdote from my own life: Every now and then, my girlfriend and I will find ourselves squeezed, out of money for many days. We adapt by buying lentils and rice and spices rather than pre-made food, by walking when before we would have driven. And the funny thing about all that is that we are never less happy for having done all that. Simple living never takes anything from us, indeed it actually makes us stronger.

These guys in DC, looking at the cliff, looking at a situation they had NOTHING to do with creating, but was dropped in their lap by irresponsible and pathetic former "leaders". I hope they see the strength and goodness of the people. Morality and ethically good behavior is the redeeming treasure of the impoverished, so that however poor one is, ethical conduct gives a true sense of dignity and self worth. This is Gandhi's "soul force", it can never be taken away. It will always be the case that the sacrifices made by people heading in the right moral direction bring more pleasure than the "benefits" wrought by robbing others and future generations. Great leaders demand for their people these highest moral treasures, not these false "benefits" that starve and deplete souls of others.

Peace and Love,
NiR.

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Response to napoleon_in_rags (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:16 AM

love_katz (468 posts)

14. Blazing a moral path forward...

Exactly!

to you, napolean_in_rags.

There is room at the table for all of us...if we so choose.

Learning to live sustainably, in harmony with nature and learning to see each other as our community IS the moral path forward.

The challenges are many, among them learning how to live sustainably which means being in harmony with nature, and learning to drop our fears of each other, see each other as our community, and ward off the efforts of the fear mongers to drive wedges between us and get us to tear at each other.

Here is my prayer/toast for 2013 and beyond: that we see all of this, and choose to take the moral path forward. Let it Be!

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Response to love_katz (Reply #14)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 05:12 AM

napoleon_in_rags (3,626 posts)

33. Working on it love_katz. Thanks for your hugs. As funny as it sounds, they mean a lot.

We all need each other to be as inspiring as we can be at this point. Every little tiny effort counts and matters, whether we immediately see the effects or not.

Peace!

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Response to napoleon_in_rags (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:04 AM

H2O Man (48,586 posts)

30. "

(and the language he used)

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:34 AM

Star Member renie408 (9,193 posts)

3. I hear you. I am a 48 year old woman and feel the same way sometimes.

Last edited Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:35 AM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

I am just dumbfounded that people saw what happened last week and this caused applications for gun licenses to go up 300% in the Charlotte-Mecklenburg area.

BUT...I know several serious gun enthusiasts personally (and I also live in the South) who have changed their tune over this whole thing. They now think we need a ban on assault weapons and/or high capacity clips. That is a big step around here.

Sometimes I would like to leave this country and go live somewhere else for awhile just to see if we really ARE all that different from other people.

BTW...I wouldn't bother with getting the gun. Allowing their paranoia to rub off on you isn't going to help.

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:44 AM

HiPointDem (16,905 posts)

5. If violent crime is at a low, but mass murders are at a high, doesn't that strike you as strange?

Why would the usual type of gun crime be going down, while an unusual type is going up?

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Response to HiPointDem (Reply #5)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:41 AM

Fumesucker (31,579 posts)

17. The mass murders are driven by something different than the retail murders

That would be my wild ass speculation.

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #17)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:46 AM

HiPointDem (16,905 posts)

18. yes. yet both use guns.

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Response to HiPointDem (Reply #18)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:49 AM

Fumesucker (31,579 posts)

19. A common characteristic suggests a common solution n/t

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:49 AM

MADem (85,977 posts)

6. I felt disconnected when everyone was screaming "Nahn Wun Wun!" and cheering on

a war against Iraq because a bunch of guys from Saudi funded by a Saudi-Yemeni living in Afghanistan ran planes into buildings.

The Bush Years were the "disconnected" ones, in my opinion.

Fifty years ago, if a little child was kidnapped in Utah, no one in New England would ever even hear about it. Now, with the 24 hour news cycle and "instant" updates, everyone from Maine to California knows about it within hours of the child being snatched.

Information is processed differently now. It's different from the 1950s and 60s, certainly, even different from the eighties and nineties. Everything is NOW NOW NOW and then you've got Twitter and other social media, spewing out the very latest, some of it unvetted bullshit, some of it 'early facts.'

The swiftness and sheer fire hose nature of the way information is presented is challenging for some people--it's hard to parse, but that's what must be done when presented with so many bits and pieces of information, and some of it OPINION disguised as information (Faux is a champion in this regard). So we just need to be our own editors, and discriminate a bit--no, that CGI eagle really didn't snatch the baby in Canada, that was a hoax; yes, Wayne LaPierre did get his ass handed to him on MTP....if it gets to be too much, take a step or two back.

Anytime I think I have something to cry about, I think back to the Bush years....it's way better these days.

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:50 AM

jambo101 (396 posts)

7. Have i changed? or has America Changed?

Last edited Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:54 AM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

I emigrated to Canada some 30 years ago for work related reasons and always thought when i retired that i would return to St Pete Fla.
In recent years on visits to family and friends i've been noticing a change in the overall demeanor of said family and friends, ones political stance has now become an obsession with many and if you're not in compliance with some ones political stance you are no longer viewed as a friend,in fact it feels to me as if i'm hated for merely being leaning left of center politically
My Dad and Brother have become total politicos and now spend many hours of their free time listening to all manner of rightwing media crap,of course my arrival for a visit from Canada usually incurs the Family Communist has come to visit attitude and bro and Dad continually try to engage me in political debate,politics to me is on par with reading the phone book or watching paint dry,,boring.
Bro is now a total gun nut and has over 50 guns, his idea of fun is no longer going fishing or a motorbike ride or just hang at a local beach bar now an afternoon at the gun range or a gun show is what he likes to do., Mom and Dad are now fully armed as well..WTF
I'm now retired and as i'm not into guns or politics i'm rethinking the idea of returning to Fla.When i left Fla. back in the mid 70's it seemed to be a much happier place,now it seems every one is mad and pissed off,hate seems to be the prevailing attitude, every one has a gun and conversation is usually about politics..
For now i'm remaining in Canada as i just dont feel like having to deal with all the issues America is now going through..
From my Canadian objective viewpoint i feel like telling America to get a grip,your losing it.

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:51 AM

jal777 (59 posts)

8. I'm a 29 year old male...

Last edited Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:54 AM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

I have been involved in shooting sports for about 21 years of my life. People are and will be obsesed with just about anything in life. It may be cars, girls, men, drugs, liqour, sports, tobacco, ect. I shoot the ar platform for fun and keep it at home for personal defense. If its good enough for law enforcement to protect their lives why should it be any different for me? I was out in Guadalajara Mexico last New Year's Eve. Guns in Mexico are very restricted. Mostly limited to .380 and .38special for handguns. Guess what it sounded like when the clock hit 12am? Thousands and thousands of rounds from full auto ak's, AR's, and high caliber handguns. All these weapons are illegal in Mexico and somehow through the black market they got there. People will always get what they want be it drugs, guns, ect even if laws exist that ban them.

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Response to jal777 (Reply #8)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:24 AM

Star Member Sunlei (2,237 posts)

24. interesting the sound difference at new years eve

I lived in Mexico city right before the Bush Years, no gun shot sounds that New Years. Moved to Houston, murder rate was very high, lots of gang bangers and on New years eve one could hear some auto fire.

This Admin. did change the law. An arrested person is deported from jail. Murder rate did go down here and across the USA. They went overboard as we know today, any arrest even a traffic ticket can get a person deported.

No more auto fire sounds here, now it sounds like personal guns.

Would be fine if all those Americans kept their guns at home, used a range or official venue, but they don't.

They want to shoot things, a lot go 'plinking' shoot at wildlife or shoot from their cars. Had my old dog shot in the leg a couple years ago. My friend had their horse shot dead. People go out on the public lands with their guns and the BLM finds wild horses gut shot or dead all the time. It's legal now in Texas to shoot wild hogs from helicopters..they don't even use the meat or land the chopper!! they just spray auto-fire from the air.

I don't know what the answer is except perhaps trace bullets directly to their owner. So they can be held accountable for any damages.

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Response to jal777 (Reply #8)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:42 AM

Bluenorthwest (24,142 posts)

27. Of course, the government of Mexico would suggest that our liberal gun laws are why they can

not control guns in spite of their own laws. So in a way, your story supports stricter gun control laws here, to help end what you witnesses there.
"In Mexico, politicians and members of civil society have long made a link between US gun laws and the firepower of Mexico's cartels.

Asked whether greater gun control north of the border would improve security in Mexican communities, PRI Senator Arturo Zamora was emphatic: "Definitely it would, yes. In June, the Defence Ministry stated that in the last six years, it confiscated more than 12 million cartridges of different calibres."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-20825061

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:01 AM

plethoro (594 posts)

11. I can relate to what you said, although I do believe

 

there IS a move by the rich and powerful to render us nothing more than slaves. But the feelings you cite are exactly the way I feel on a daily basis. I have enough money to leave, and I am really thinking of it before life in this country finally kills me.

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:05 AM

love_katz (468 posts)

12. I think buying a bunch of guns is missing the point.

The people who survive social upheaval the best are people who have good connections with family or friends whom they can call on to work together at need.

If we do have some kind of economic collapse, no one has the prolonged fire power that would be needed to hold off the starving hordes.

The poster who talked about people who learn to live off the grid for practical and positive reasons, including being able to give blankets to less prepared older folks in need, has absolutely the right idea. We need to look at living more in harmony with nature, and working together as communities, seeing our mutual needs.

And you are not crazy for feeling or thinking differently than the unfortunate blind sheeple that you are encountering. You are seeing the issues more clearly than they are. I hope you find supportive like-minded others to join together with.

I know you have said you are located in the south, so you may not have groups like City Repair in Portland, Oregon. However, City Repair has a web site, with lots of great ideas posted online. Maybe they can help you find like-minded persons in your area, or they could show you how to start a similar group where you live.

I wish you the very best of luck in finding the people and support that you need!

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:16 AM

Quantess (23,935 posts)

13. This:

It's something I've noticed especially Americans love to ignore - we've always got the solution it seems, and we love to never learn from other nations' experiences on any issue - whether it comes to guns, health care, or anything else for that matter.

But Americans have to keep doing things their own way even if it hurts them, because otherwise it wouldn't be America! I hear you. I struggle to figure out the American psyche. It seems like stupidity has the loudest voice.

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Response to Quantess (Reply #13)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:52 AM

Fumesucker (31,579 posts)

20. I think Winston Churchill had it about right

"The Americans can always be trusted to do the right thing, once all other possibilities have been exhausted."

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:18 AM

marew (1,068 posts)

15. I'm twice as old as you-

There is nothing wrong with your feelings, not a thing.
I've seen so much change in so many ways. My dad was career military and served in WWII and Korea. He was so proud of his country and how our country took care of its own. Now we are going down the road of greed and selfishness, we want to arm ourselves with advanced weapons and live in fortresses, kindness and compassion are rare qualities among so many people, and a big bank account is the only measure of success.
I can't help but think that so many are so unhappy because they believe externals will make people happy. And when more money, more things, a bigger house, and a fancier car don't bring them joy, they incorrectly assume they don't have enough. And then they feel they need bigger guns to keep all they have to themselves. Look at the most recent shooter's mother. She reportedly lived in a mansion on a couple of acres but believed she had to have multiple weapons to protect what she had. She lost it all anyway and allowed, by her abject negligence, absolutely intolerable pain for so many others.
I just can't imagine the suffering so many families are experiencing this time of year for so many reasons. My heart breaks for all those suffering for so many reasons.

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:33 AM

Star Member gtar100 (2,528 posts)

16. K&R - really good post and replies; ty all. n/t

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:55 AM

HipChick (9,419 posts)

21. Why run away from the issue? I have lived in other countries..


Here is no better than there sometimes..

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:07 AM

mark67 (5 posts)

22. You are not alone...

Last edited Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:17 AM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

...and I think the last election proves that. The cruel, irony is the "great calamity" the extreme gun culture fears-UN black helicopters/Obama releasing his secret black army/suburban neighborhoods being overrun by "swarthy minorities". etc...will more than likely be self inflicted if it actually happens. History bears this out-as a cover for gaining or maintaining power, the persecuted majority will manufacture an "incident" to justify the shootings and killings that follow.

At the moment, however, most of the extreme gun nut community is ignorant, paranoid, and lazy. These guys aren't studying horticulture, economics, running marathons, learning languages, living ascetic lifestyles in preparation for building the US Valhalla. Instead these people are tuned into Beck, Limbaugh, and Fox, are mostly overweight, and spend their time sitting on the couch eating chips and screaming at CNN and other media "libruls".

I think the real fight for us is political. We must keep the extremists divided and leaderless. We must take no prisoners, play to win, and hold our politicians accountable. We should hold nationwide boycotts against products or services to punish corporations who place rampant greed and ridiculous profits above the the best interests of the American people or the common good. That's where I think the focus should remain until we clean up this mess we're in.

Sorry for the melodrama-I'm new to DU and I've had this on my chest for quite a while!

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:13 AM

Egalitarian Thug (7,089 posts)

23. I think you've nailed it. The people in this nation (not anyone reading this, of course) have gone

completely 'round the bend. We were always a bit strange, inclined toward violence, and too respectful of authority, but the last 10 - 15 years have seen us go completely nuts.

If I had the option, I'd get out of here as quickly as possible. Something's going to happen and I think it's going to be ugly.

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Response to Egalitarian Thug (Reply #23)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:56 AM

99Forever (5,167 posts)

28. You echo my thoughts.

Also like you, getting out just isn't an option for us. If it were, we would leave today. There is a shitstorm brewing, of that there is no doubt. The element that is stockpiling weapons and tons of ammo, actually thinks they stand a chance of taking on the "gub'mint" and winning. We all know just how idiotic that is, but that won't stop them from trying.

Ugly, indeed. I mourn the land I grew up in, it's already gone, but just doesn't know it yet.

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:09 AM

SummerSnow (935 posts)

25. My cousin moved from the US to Denmark in 1983..

A few years ago her mother wanted her to move back to the US.My cousin said she would give it some thought. When she came back for a visit she decided after 3 weeks she would be returning to Denmark and never moving back to the US.She said what happened here? I can't come back to this.

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:13 AM

RagAss (13,408 posts)

26. What country ? There's no country here.

This is a haven for the rich. Stop thinking of it as a country and it all makes sense.

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:58 AM

lunatica (28,842 posts)

29. If there were such a thing as a World Citizenship I would apply for it.

Fundamentally we are all cut from the same cloth. To be human is to have certain things in common with all other humans. They're all listed in our Bill of Rights. Everyone deserves those. We have more in common with our worst 'enemies' than we have differences but in order to reach out to what makes us similar we must do so consciously and with deliberate intent.

It would be great if every government had one ministry or one department devoted to the active pursuit of peace.

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:21 AM

hfojvt (31,310 posts)

31. I am not sure what you need to feel connected

I don't see constant bitterness in the people around me, nor am I bombarded with conspiracy theories.

I don't even see an obsession with firearms.

At least, nobody I interact with is talking all that much about firearms. If they were obsessed, you'd think they would talk and talk about their obsession.

You seem to have a bit of a superiority complex, seeing so many others as "provincial and ignorant". Maybe you should stay and try to teach others all of this vast information that you have and they don't.

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Response to fujiyama (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:29 AM

Star Member CrispyQ (16,038 posts)

32. You should read Bob Altemeyer's, "The Authoritarians." It will shine light on where the US is at.

There are authoritarian leaders & authoritarian followers. The leaders are generally smart, disciplined & ruthless. The followers are mostly ignorant & fearful. And now they're mad. They're mad because they've lived their life by the rules they were told to live by & they are not getting the rewards they were told they would get. The leaders point to liberals, women, Blacks, Hispanics, gays & non-believers & tell them, "It's their fault that society is in decline & it's their fault that you are not getting what you deserve." Because they are followers, they believe it.

http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/

The entire book is available at a link on the left hand side of the screen. His comment on the teabaggers is good, too.

Before you buy a gun, consider taking a gun class first. That's what I did. I actually took two classes before I decided I didn't want one in my home. It's a grave responsibility. I don't think you get a sense of how serious gun ownership is until you learn some basic gun safety. And if you decide to purchase one, everyone is better off that you took the class.

And lastly, your values are not that far off! Remember, we have a media that tows the corporate line & wants drama for ratings. They give the batshit crazies a megaphone, so their voice sounds louder than it actually is. I don't have any suggestions for how to reach out to like minded people in your area, but there have to be ways. Perhaps your local democratic party, or a Universalist church, if you're so inclined, or maybe just volunteer at the library. Just throwing out ideas where I think more liberal types would gather.

Good luck & don't let the bastards get you down!



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