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Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:18 PM

 

A blunt review of Windows 8

The end is my favorite part, when he really unleashes what he thinks about Win 8.





115 replies, 9838 views

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Arrow 115 replies Author Time Post
Reply A blunt review of Windows 8 (Original post)
quinnox Dec 2012 OP
Gidney N Cloyd Dec 2012 #1
PSPS Dec 2012 #2
RomneyLies Dec 2012 #13
leftlibdem420 Dec 2012 #34
hobbit709 Dec 2012 #79
tblue37 Dec 2012 #32
RKP5637 Dec 2012 #54
Hermes Daughter Dec 2012 #62
PSPS Dec 2012 #66
tradecenter Dec 2012 #96
tblue37 Dec 2012 #113
hobbit709 Dec 2012 #81
tblue37 Dec 2012 #114
RomneyLies Dec 2012 #95
mythology Dec 2012 #42
Jenoch Dec 2012 #50
hobbit709 Dec 2012 #83
randome Dec 2012 #89
WinkyDink Dec 2012 #90
randome Dec 2012 #91
hobbit709 Dec 2012 #94
wake.up.america Dec 2012 #101
Poiuyt Dec 2012 #3
slampoet Dec 2012 #44
GObamaGO Dec 2012 #4
Lugnut Dec 2012 #60
GObamaGO Dec 2012 #61
exboyfil Dec 2012 #5
MattBaggins Dec 2012 #9
DonCoquixote Dec 2012 #6
AtheistCrusader Dec 2012 #33
randome Dec 2012 #35
AtheistCrusader Dec 2012 #49
randome Dec 2012 #76
AtheistCrusader Dec 2012 #105
randome Dec 2012 #106
AtheistCrusader Dec 2012 #111
DonCoquixote Dec 2012 #107
Gore1FL Dec 2012 #39
MattBaggins Dec 2012 #7
originalpckelly Dec 2012 #10
MattBaggins Dec 2012 #14
annabanana Dec 2012 #19
MattBaggins Dec 2012 #23
Lordquinton Dec 2012 #69
matt819 Dec 2012 #36
RC Dec 2012 #56
Fumesucker Dec 2012 #74
Gidney N Cloyd Dec 2012 #15
MattBaggins Dec 2012 #20
randome Dec 2012 #17
MattBaggins Dec 2012 #21
randome Dec 2012 #22
MattBaggins Dec 2012 #24
randome Dec 2012 #26
woo me with science Dec 2012 #25
tinrobot Dec 2012 #41
Lordquinton Dec 2012 #48
RC Dec 2012 #64
hobbit709 Dec 2012 #78
RC Dec 2012 #104
NJCher Dec 2012 #58
Lordquinton Dec 2012 #70
Bonobo Dec 2012 #59
GoCubsGo Dec 2012 #86
IDemo Dec 2012 #8
originalpckelly Dec 2012 #11
RomneyLies Dec 2012 #12
Honeycombe8 Dec 2012 #16
randome Dec 2012 #30
NashvilleLefty Dec 2012 #18
WinkyDink Dec 2012 #92
daa Dec 2012 #27
randome Dec 2012 #28
DainBramaged Dec 2012 #29
Poll_Blind Dec 2012 #31
MotherPetrie Dec 2012 #37
Curmudgeoness Dec 2012 #46
Hermes Daughter Dec 2012 #63
Hosnon Dec 2012 #38
BlueJazz Dec 2012 #40
randome Dec 2012 #43
GoCubsGo Dec 2012 #87
randome Dec 2012 #88
BlueJazz Dec 2012 #110
erodriguez Dec 2012 #45
WinkyDink Dec 2012 #93
plethoro Dec 2012 #47
alfredo Dec 2012 #51
MichaelSoE Dec 2012 #77
alfredo Dec 2012 #97
randome Dec 2012 #98
alfredo Dec 2012 #103
Blue_In_AK Dec 2012 #52
RKP5637 Dec 2012 #53
bkkyosemite Dec 2012 #55
steve2470 Dec 2012 #57
Jenoch Dec 2012 #65
steve2470 Dec 2012 #68
hobbit709 Dec 2012 #82
GoCubsGo Dec 2012 #102
steve2470 Dec 2012 #67
hughee99 Dec 2012 #71
Shanti Mama Dec 2012 #72
Berlum Dec 2012 #73
RedCappedBandit Dec 2012 #75
GoCubsGo Dec 2012 #100
MrMickeysMom Dec 2012 #80
alfredo Dec 2012 #99
bullimiami Dec 2012 #84
LP2K12 Dec 2012 #85
slackmaster Dec 2012 #108
HillWilliam Dec 2012 #109
ecstatic Dec 2012 #112
Egalitarian Thug Dec 2012 #115

Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:27 PM

1. Microsoft is missing the point that users are at a stage where they can handle different UI's.

I can't see why they're pushing Win8 on laptops and desktops.

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Response to Gidney N Cloyd (Reply #1)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:52 PM

2. You're right. Windows 8 just isn't suitable for office computers.

That's what I tell all my clients. And large OEM suppliers like Dell still put Windows 7 on their business-market machines.

But, for those of you who have Windows 8 and miss the Start button, there is a free third-party program that duplicates it that I routinely install on all Windows 8 machines:

http://classicshell.sourceforge.net/

Windows 8 is the biggest fiasco from Microsoft since Vista.

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Response to PSPS (Reply #2)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:49 PM

13. It makes Windows Millenium look BRILLIANT, IMO

 

And Windows Millenium was the biggest fiasco in Windows history, even dwarfing Vista.

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Response to RomneyLies (Reply #13)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:46 PM

34. No, it's not that bad.

 

Windows ME takes one of Microsoft's best consumer OSes (though I still prefer XP and 7) and disables real-mode DOS support and makes it more inefficient and memory greedy. At least they tried to do something worthwhile with Windows 8.

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Response to RomneyLies (Reply #13)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:02 AM

79. It lasted what, about 3 months? Vista at least hung on for years.

ME was the New Coke of the OS world.

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Response to PSPS (Reply #2)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:43 PM

32. New Coke!

I am in the market for a new computer this month, and I dread the idea of getting stuck with Windows 8!

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #32)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 12:21 AM

54. See #53! n/t

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #32)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 01:27 AM

62. Start over with XP

I paid extra on my last T60 for factory installed XP. I think it's been discontinued now but I bought my X220 from a private party and had XP installed. Windows is trouble enough but each system they release gets further and further from workable, IMO.

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #32)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 02:37 AM

66. You can still find machines with Windows 7. Also, you can downgrade to Windows 7.

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Response to PSPS (Reply #66)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:30 AM

96. I just upgraded from XP to Windows 7.

 

I'm still learning the ins and outs but I really like Windows 7, much more user friendly for me.
Heard noting but bad news about Windows 8, think I'll leave it alone.

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Response to PSPS (Reply #66)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 11:29 AM

113. I have XP on my old home computer and W7 on

the one in my office. I very much prefer XP. Is it still possible to get XP on a new computer?

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #32)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:04 AM

81. Buy a copy of Windows 7 or even XP-they're still available.

Better yet, run Linux

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Response to hobbit709 (Reply #81)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 11:34 AM

114. Thanks. The corporate bosses don't understand

that consumers--especially we seniors--do not want to learn a new OS every couple of years. If the benefits of the new OS are ginormous, then it might be worth it, but those of us who use our computers mainly as fancy typewriters and for email and web-surfing do not benefit much from all the new bells and whistles in the new systems.

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Response to tblue37 (Reply #32)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:27 AM

95. DO NO buy ANY Machine with Win8

 

You cna buy one with Win 7 still.

And don't even think of buying one with Win8 then downgrading to Win7. That's paying the Microsoft tax twice!

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Response to Gidney N Cloyd (Reply #1)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:56 PM

42. In my experience users can't handle different UIs

I had a user once ask me if when I replaced their monitor if the desktop would still be the same.

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Response to mythology (Reply #42)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 12:04 AM

50. Your post reminds me of my father.

Although he's nearly 81 years old, he bought his first PC in 1985 and he still has no idea how the operating system works. I recently taught him how to e-mail an attachment but he still does not know how to copy and paste. I recently helped him buy a new laptop and made sure he got system 7 which was almst too much of a change from XP. (I'm proud to say I helped him to get his money's worth out of his 2004 Dell laptop).

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Response to mythology (Reply #42)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:12 AM

83. a good percentage of computer users know nothing beyond the power switch.

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Response to hobbit709 (Reply #83)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:20 AM

89. More than that, a good percentage simply want to get work done, not fiddle with it constantly.

I'm a programmer and I know my way around. Win8 is awful.

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Response to hobbit709 (Reply #83)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:22 AM

90. So what? I don't know about carburetors, either, or microwaves, or electricity.

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #90)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:23 AM

91. Then you're just a lazy, ignorant user, right?

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #90)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:24 AM

94. I've run into some that can't even find a file they saved, since they have no clue

as to where and how it went.

There are some that think the monitor is the computer and the tower case is the hard drive.

But do you know how to open the hood and at least check the water and battery connections?

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Response to Gidney N Cloyd (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 11:19 AM

101. My daughter just bought a laptop for school with win 8. I tried it out - pain in the neck.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:03 PM

3. Computer makers and software designers can't seem to understand that

we just want something that works. We don't need all the fancy features that do nothing but bloat the computer down. Just a good, rock-solid system that you can rely on.

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Response to Poiuyt (Reply #3)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:59 PM

44. Exactly. If i could get a recent hardware package to run Mac System 7, I would.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:06 PM

4. I recently had to replace my computer (running Windows XP)

Since Windows 8 had already been released, I intentionally sought out a computer that still had Windows 7 on it because I had played around on a demo model in the store and really did not like the interface of Windows 8.

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Response to GObamaGO (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 01:06 AM

60. I had to buy a new computer in August.

Thank goodness it came with Windows 7. I like W-7 but I'm still trying to figure out some things. I don't get a lot of computer time to really mess with it but it's working for me. My old computer that bit the dust had XP on it.

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Response to Lugnut (Reply #60)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 01:26 AM

61. The really nice thing was that I got the computer heavily discounted

because it was a close out due to having the Windows 7 operating system. I have found most everything I need to find on Windows 7. I have a feeling that Windows 8 would have had a far steeper learning curve.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:19 PM

5. What these software companies do not understand

Is that it is very expensive in terms of manpower to switch operating interfaces. I don't want to learn new software to do what I have always done. It is fine. In my opinion Windows 7 is a drop off from usability from Windows XP, and I dread the point where I have to go to Windows 8 (I also don't carry a cellphone let alone a smartphone).

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Response to exboyfil (Reply #5)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:32 PM

9. You mean the increased usability?

Where I don't have to waste time with a silly little mouse to get work done?

Say I want to work on my resume. Hit windows key. Without clicking anything just type resume and walla there it is.

Windows 8 is as easy as pushing one button and typing.

Now there is no disputing they rushed this to production and the apps version of Mail, EI, etc. are incomplete pieces of garbage proven by the fact that they are different from the desktop versions. The crappy live tile system was no where near being ready. Total PoS.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:19 PM

6. There is an unwritten law

With Windows, the odd numbered ones: 3.1, 98, XP, & are usually very good.

the even: Millennium, eight, are poison.

There is definite sign that MS has lost it's mojo. I can remember when the only real rivals were Apple (if you wanted to pay three time as much for far less software) or Linux. Android came along and started working on making the personal computer obsolete. MS knew that windows needed to hit it out of the park, to prove that they still defined the show, and instead, they might as well have handed to future to android. Even apple will bleed, as people who were scared of MS realize that there is a new option for those that wants to run applications, write stuff, check facebook, all without dealing with either MS or Apple. Apple will survive because it has the design/snob mojo, MS may not be so lucky.

Windows 9 better be a grand Slam.

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Response to DonCoquixote (Reply #6)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:45 PM

33. How is 98 an odd number?

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #33)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:48 PM

35. It was the 3rd OS from Microsoft. After Win '95.

It does seem as if every other production out of Microsoft sucks big time.

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Response to randome (Reply #35)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 11:22 PM

49. You're forgetting Windows NT 4.0, 98 Second Edition, 2000, etc.

I think 8 is fantastic. Boots in a fraction of the time 7 does, on the same hardware, the start screen took a little getting used to, but it's essentially a graphically organized start menu sorted precisely how I want it to be.

It really comes alive on any touch enabled device.

Memory footprint is smaller. It works pretty good if you get how it's laid out.

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #49)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:44 AM

76. Watch the video at post #49.

Faster boot time means nothing if you can't get things done.

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Response to randome (Reply #76)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 02:02 PM

105. Post 49 is mine...

I'll look around for it.

I can tell you this: I put Win 8 on my mom's Acer Iconia W500 and she just picked it up and starting using it, no problem. I had to tell her like... 3 things, around swiping in from the top and sides. That's it. When she was born, NASA was still doing shit on slide rules.

Having a touch enabled device makes all the difference on this OS, but even if you don't, a big part of it is whether you embrace change or not. There were times when the Apple OS made a huge leap in design, and everyone cried and whined about it, and look at their stock price now.

now, looking for the video you referenced..

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #105)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 02:07 PM

106. LOL! Nicely played. I meant post #51.

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Response to randome (Reply #106)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:00 PM

111. Yeah, I found it. :)

In regards to "I didn't get to see it myself"? on the boot performance, WTF, how do you not get to see the boot time if you actually used it? Argh. You don't need the SSD to see the boot performance improvement. It's insane. I'm running spinning disks right now on this PC, and the boot time is less than half that of 7.


I have never seen the weather app open for no reason. His keyboard was screwed up and had some stupid hotkeys set up or something when he upgraded. That does NOT happen out of the box on any PC with windows 8 in the hands of any user I have EVER seen, and I see a LOT of people using it every day.
To close ANY app, grab it at the top of the screen, and throw it off the bottom of the screen. Closed. Done. Why would an honest reviewer not figure that out? I could see a completely untrained user with no interest and no resources like Google finding it, but a reviewer that is actually attempting to use it? Come on, that's pathetic. He didn't even try to use it. He didn't discover split screen for multiple apps. (Criticism of the OS: More splits, vertical splits would be nicer)
Bing or Google, "Close Apps windows 8" brings up the correct answer first try. First link. (The Bing answer goes straight to the online tutorial pages) it also shows this action in setup, and he ignored it.

He didn't have the touchpad setup properly with the manufacturer's drive, if it was 'swiping' instead of moving the cursor. It was registering his touch as a 'grab' to swipe, rather than moving the mouse. That's HIS FAULT. He installed the OS on his piece of shit laptop, and didn't load the drivers and software from the OEM. He's a moron. It was doing proportional touch, rather than behaving as a mouse. Windows 7 in tablet mode does the SAME thing.

There is a context clue for the swipe in, the app flies in from the left. Completely ignorant.

Product key is in the box on a card. WTF is wrong with this guy. SAME as windows 7. Same as Vista. Same as XP. Same as 2000. I don't remember what was in the Millennium box. Did he get a bootleg copy?
There are UMPTEEN ways to create install disks, easy to discover online. MSFT supplies 3 for free. There are tons. Bootable DVD and USB tool for Windows 7 to make the transition right there on Windows Downloads. If you know enough to know you want to make one, how could you not discover that? And there are a bajillion 3rd party tools, most free, to do the same thing.

Control panels is accessible if you swipe in from the right, or just hit the windows button (LIKE THE OLD GODDAMN START BUTTON) and type 'control', tada. His comparison to Win7 doesn't show depending on how the user configures the start menu (there's a toggle in XP and 7 and Vista). If you're on the desktop and swipe in from the right, control panels is right there in your face.

This is like a reviewer trying to review a new BMW with keyless entry and start, not discovering how to open the door, not asking anyone or looking at the manual, and panning the product as bad because he's an idiot. And he's calling for a recall? Die in a fire, shitty reviewer. This review was utterly useless.

People love the office ribbon when they get used to it. Oh, hey, he even acknowledges that. (The ribbon is built into the OS now, continuity everywhere.) The ribbon is available to third party developers. It's in the guidelines. It's ubiquitous. If he was a developer and READ THE GUIDELINES HE'D KNOW THAT. The reason people like it, is that it is CONTEXTUAL which the reviewer himself whined about needing in an OS. WTF is his deal? GIVE ME THIS (X). Os supplies (X). WTF I HATE (X) THIS SHOULD NEVER HAPPEN. Os: ?? I tried to please you!

The long term goal is obviously to stop using apps that pop out to the desktop. The desktop never needs to be used if you stay in metro at all times. It is only there for legacy apps that people HAVE to use. Those will go away over time, just like the driver transition to the unified driver model in Vista, that everyone hated, but provided 99% of the 'decent' user experience in 7. By 7 launch, the drivers are there, you have deep penetration into all devices for 32 bit and 64 bit drivers, etc. That was most of the teething problems of Vista right there. (And UAC wasn't implemented great, people didn't know how to bypass it, which caused nightmares just like System File Protection in Windows 2000) Yeah, teething is painful. Nobody likes it. Ok, but innovation leads to issues like this. MSFT is playing catch up on user experience here. There's going to be teething problems.

You CAN start ANY app from the start screen. ANY app.

ALL those items are clickable on the charms bar, what the hell is this guy's deal? When you mouse over it, the tile lights up, as the 'clickable' clue he was demanding. Did he load some pre-release beta version or what the hell was his deal?

Also, the feedback button in apps is great. I couldn't figure something out in the mail app, hit feedback, and within 20 minutes, two Microsoft employees replied to me in e-mail with the correct steps. I have never seen that with ANY OS from any company, that was insane.

(Ok, the charms bar name is kinda dumb, I hate calling it that.)

If I had to make one criticism, and I hate do make it, because everyone HATED the old way, but in win98, remember the tutorial that popped up EVERY GODDAMN TIME YOU INSTALLED THE OS, like Clippy? Good for new users but everyone else hated it? Well, there's one that just sort of plays during setup. People walk away while that is running. Nobody watches it. So in addressing the old complaints of I HATE THIS DAMN TUTORIAL I KNOW HOW TO USE A COMPUTER, they made a tutorial that people just ignore. Then they get to the desktop like 5 minutes later, and have no idea what to do. So, I'm afraid to suggest it, because I would HATE IT just like everyone else, if they brought back the forced tutorial, but I think the tutorial during setup is too short, too easily ignored.

Going on to bigger criticisms, in a more honest review, I would think the multimon support is lacking. More splits would be great. Pinning the start and metro interface to one monitor, or making ALL monitors metro would be great. Badly needed.

On the Surface, the memory card should be bitlockerable, and extendible. There are ways to make that happen, but it's not for a novice. It should be simple.

Office 2013... REALLY? Pops out of metro to the Desktop? That is inexcusable, MSFT. WTF.

There are some valid usability criticisms, but this reviewer failed to launch entirely.

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #33)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 02:20 PM

107. because while it was named for the year

it was an "odd" number of windows (I believe it was technically windows 5)

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Response to DonCoquixote (Reply #6)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:53 PM

39. Technically speaking Vista, 7, and 8 are all version 6.x

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:23 PM

7. Yes let's bring back a convoluted system of menus and submenus

because a simplified system of pushing on single fucking button and then just start typing what you want is so much harder.

I will say that the new "metro" start screen should pop up inside the existing desktop environment so as not to disorientate people, but why should we go back to digging through layers upon layers upon layers of folders that don't actually exist; just to find things.

I must be one of the few that actually hopes for a true meta data file system. I want to push one button and type "picture i took in orlando 2009 with mickey" and have that pic pop up.

If this guy knew how to type and not just click through menus he wouldn't have had to re-install his programs.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #7)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:36 PM

10. Except that that's a command line interface.

It's not as easy to understand, it's functions are not exposed to the user.

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Response to originalpckelly (Reply #10)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:50 PM

14. No its not

In windows 8 you never have to scroll or click on the start menu. Just start typing right at the screen and the new search system pops up auto refines as you type.

You have a side bar of icons for further areas to search so you can add network, cloud and other search functions in one interface. The system is still a bit unpolished but is not the terrifying monstrosity people think it is.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #14)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:59 PM

19. I NEED the file folders...

I use the computer like a big file cabinet. Perhaps if I had ever used an ipad or had any need for a smart phone I'd "get" those buttons.

Not interested, thanks

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Response to annabanana (Reply #19)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:03 PM

23. Why can't you have both?

Those folders aren't real after all.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #23)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:25 AM

69. The folders are as real as the rest of the data

The search engine isn't real either.

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Response to annabanana (Reply #19)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:49 PM

36. Precisely.

I have tens of thousands of documents that I've been filing since Windows ME. I know where they are and how to access them.

When I want a program, I click on the quick launch bar. Done. No moving the mouse into the corner to bring up the tile page and then scrolling along the tile page until I find the program I need. And then, when the program's open but I change programs to do something else, I don't click the icon in the quick launch bar only to be told that the program is already open. Then where the hell is it.

And why did they have to "app-ify" everything. You know, sometimes a conventional program does the job just fine. Download the damn thing, install it, and go.

I will grant that the search feature in Windows 8 is first rate. Put that into Windows 7 as an upgrade, and I'm good to go for years.

Maybe Windows 8 is fine for touch screen users or casual computer users. For business? Not a chance. MS took something that wasn't really broke and attempted to fix it. Is it any wonder sales of computers with Windows 8 are off by a significant percentage this season?

I'm returning a laptop I purchased with Windows 8 and will stick with my desktop and Wiondows 7.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #14)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 12:30 AM

56. I have a problem remembering names.

 

But I instantly recognize the name if I see it. Trying find something by typing a name I can't remember is supposed to be somehow good? No thanks, I can scroll a menu much faster.

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Response to RC (Reply #56)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:23 AM

74. Yeah, if you use a lot of different software it's hard to keep it all straight

Maybe half a dozen apps that I use consistently can I remember the names instantly, the rest of them that get used on a sporadic basis I don't recall well at all.

I think that's actually worse than DOS command line, you could always just open your root drive and see what you had installed.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #7)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:52 PM

15. I like to file 'like with like' so I can browse through it later on to find things.

I produce a lot of data/documents in various formats and frequently only have a dim memory of things I've done in the past when the need comes up.

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Response to Gidney N Cloyd (Reply #15)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:59 PM

20. You can still click on "my computer" and going digging through folders

but if windows can get WinFS working finally, the just start typing system might be something you would find beneficial in your circumstance. if you could just type "find presentations from 2009 to 2010" and have it pop them for you is a system I at least look forward to.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #7)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:55 PM

17. Because some people like to have organized desktops?

Instead of scrolling through a couple of feet of options.

Microsoft really hates the 'personal' part of 'personal computing'.

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Response to randome (Reply #17)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:00 PM

21. You can still have that

In fact windows 8 gives me an even cleaner desktop system

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #21)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:02 PM

22. I don't see that at all.

Every view of a screen I've seen is a total clutter of tiles that can be halved in size but not resized or positioned the way you want. The entire desktop is covered.

It has that stupid Aero view where you have no idea what window you are working in unless you click on the tile first.

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Response to randome (Reply #22)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:13 PM

24. I am not fond of the tile system either

That is a good criticism of how Windows 8 was rushed and the start screen is disconcerting and should have opened up in the desktop system. i am less then impressed with the tiles, but the tiles can be removed, repositioned, grouped and new ones added.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #24)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:17 PM

26. But they can't be minimized, right?

So you are forever stuck with a cluttered desktop whether you want to work that way or not.

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Response to randome (Reply #22)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:17 PM

25. Agree. nt

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #7)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:54 PM

41. A good filing system trumps a good search system most of the time.

I like having submenus because it keeps things organized and I can find things without searching.

Within a few clicks I can look at all my Disneyworld pics because they'd be in the photos/2009/Disney folder. Those menus and submenus are very quick to navigate.

Typing "picture i took in orlando 2009 with mickey" means I have to navigate to the search box, click on the box, then take my hand off the mouse to type the search phrase which is a few dozen keystrokes. Overall, it is much less efficient.

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Response to tinrobot (Reply #41)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 11:12 PM

48. The point he is making

is that you don't have to do that, just have to start typing and it will bring it up, if you have it labeled as such, and not DS13940562 like a lot of pictures are labeled as such. Personally I reject his premise that the search engine is better than a file tree, because to search for something using text only means it has to be labeled correctly in the first place, and if it's not then without a file tree youwill be scrolling for days trying to find it.

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Response to Lordquinton (Reply #48)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 01:42 AM

64. I have 107 gigabytes of pictures spanning 4 cameras and over 12 years.

 

And M$ thinks I am supposed to find something by typing a description of whatever picture? Some of my folders have over 700 pictures in them. Yeah, I have taken that many in a day. Giving each picture a unique description is out of the question. They are grouped in dated folders under each camera.

(Yes, they are backed up)

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Response to RC (Reply #64)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:01 AM

78. sounds like my files.

I have 70Gb of mp3 files, almost 2 Tb of video, at least 60Gb of photos and about 400Gb of assorted other files(documents, books, drawings, posters, etc.)
All of it is backed up in at least 3 separate locations on external drives, data DVDs, flash drives, and even a 256Gb SSD full of critical data that sits on the shelf in my cabinet.
And while M$ tries to pretend Linux file systems don't exist, Linux has no problems with FAT32 or NTFS.

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Response to hobbit709 (Reply #78)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 11:55 AM

104. I only have 33 gig of music, buy yeah, the same problem as with my pictures.

 

Having to find something by typing exact command line entries, when you have hundreds of thousands of files, scattered over several hard drives? Then I also have the problem of all the text files and OO documents I've saved over the years. PDF's of important legal stuff. And on and on and on... As simple as typing the name in and it appears? Not in this universe it ain't.

Saying "What were they thinking", is a complement for them by giving them the benefit of the doubt that they could think.
Command line, as in DOS, is enjoyable in small doses, but not in a GUI situation on what is supposed to be the greatest OS since the gods designed the self operating Universe.
If Apple ever opens their computers up, Microsoft would be in real trouble.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 12:55 AM

58. yes yes yes

why should we go back to digging through layers upon layers upon layers of folders that don't actually exist; just to find things.

Can you tell me a little more about that?

I didn't know these folders do not actually exist.

I'm with you on your dream. That's the way it should be.

I have a laptop w/Win 8 and whatever I want, I get by simply typing in what I want in the search engine.



Cher

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Response to NJCher (Reply #58)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:30 AM

70. The folders are as real as anything else on the computer

It's a strawman to make people who don't agree with his premise look like they are old fashioned or something. The folders are something we create and use to organize in a manner to how we would in our own personal office. They do provide a very real framing for the data, and make it possible to find things that are not cataloged to the necessary parameters of a search. It will find everything labeled as being from the "Orlando conference 2009-2010" but if you skipped a folder in the labeling or some other bit falls through the cracks, good luck finding it without a file structure.

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 01:04 AM

59. Ha ha!

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Response to MattBaggins (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:04 AM

86. I keep hearing how bad the tiles are...

To me it's much easier than trying to find something in the old, nested start menu of previous versions. What a pain in the ass. At least one can rearrange the tiles so that the most-used ones are right up front. I agree that a small pop-up would be much easier. My only other real gripe is how many "apps" are closed. There's no "X". You have to drag the top of the screen downward, or use alt-F4. Very annoying. Fine on a touch screen, but not with a mouse, and maddening with at track pad. Fortunately, I don't use the frequently.

And, it's not true that there is no START button, as some are saying. It's just hidden until you drag the mouse to the bottom left hand corner, or use the menu that pops up along the right side. Or, hit the button with the window on it. Other than that, it's not horribly different from other versions. It would be nice if there was some sort of manual that came with the basics, rather than having to go to the Microsoft Help site.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:29 PM

8. I've worked for two major tech companies over the past 12 years

Both clung like barnacles to XP before upgrading to Win7. There is zero chance that either of them, and I would expect most other corporations, will be jumping to Win8 anytime in the near future. Windows 7 is going to duplicate the problem for MS that XP did - they're both simply too good at doing what a desktop OS needs to do in the business environment to justify the expense and IT angst of upgrading to 8. And the same applies for most consumers.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:38 PM

11. Windows 8: Because the Windows brand was starting to recover from Vista.

It's like letting your competitors catch up before you sprint ahead and beat them, only without the sprinting ahead part.

This is why I'm glad I have a Mac. It still has some of the creative soul left over from the good ole days.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:47 PM

12. I refuse to buy any computer with that shit

 

Windows 7 rocks.

Fuck Windows 8.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:54 PM

16. Thx. That was a good, common sense review. And hey...he looks great on Skype!

How is that some people are so photogenic? I look like a washed out something or other. Not fair.

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Response to Honeycombe8 (Reply #16)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:33 PM

30. I think the key is talking to the camera as if it's a real person.

Eye contact.

Maybe even dress it up so it looks like someone, if that helps.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:56 PM

18. It's pretty obvious that they are trying to develop

a touch-screen interface that works on both smart-phones and PC's, with emphasis on the Smart-Phone.

XP was the best and most stable interface. Vista sucked. Win 7 was ok, but still confusing and not nearly as user-friendly as XP despite the propaganda declaring otherwise.

I will admit that XP didn't make allowances for "fat-fingered" responses, but those could be easily addressed rather than the gross mistakes and "hidden" commands that allow Win 8 to perform the simple functions that XP and even Win 7 easily accomplished.

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Response to NashvilleLefty (Reply #18)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:25 AM

92. I believe that intention was even announced, no?

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:22 PM

27. It's just an operating system

It does nothing. Who sits around waiting oh a new OS for my iPad. You don't even have to buy a e iPad for it to work. Microsoft, Dell, HP, going the way of Compaq, Sperry and Digital.

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Response to daa (Reply #27)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:28 PM

28. It's eye candy from both Microsoft's point of view and from the fan boys' point of view.

An operating system should not be constantly reminding you that it's an operating system.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:31 PM

29. Rotting flesh covered in dog shit...my review




Buy WIN 7 while you can to stockpile it.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:37 PM

31. Ok, I actually laughed out loud by the end of that.

My cat is the only other living thing in the house aside from me right now. She was dozing by the heater, lifted her head briefly without opening her eyes, realized she didn't give a shit about anything as long as the heater was still on, and lowered her head again.

PB

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:51 PM

37. They will have to pry XP out of my cold dead hands

 

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Response to MotherPetrie (Reply #37)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 11:06 PM

46. They just did that to me,

fortunately just before Windows 8----my computer died. I am still hating this one, and it is at least closer to XP. I do not like change. But I am screwn.

Good luck keeping XP.

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Response to MotherPetrie (Reply #37)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 01:40 AM

63. XP phase our rumors false

The rumors have been circulating for about seven years now. LOL! Here's an article from 2011 from a tech site. Windows may not offer or service XP but who cares. Rest assured, XP is here to stay.

http://www.techrepublic.com/blog/window-on-windows/windows-xp-continues-to-be-the-operating-system-that-just-wont-die/4916

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:52 PM

38. They really had no choice.

With the rise of Android and its mobile dominance, all it takes is a comparable Office suite and most users have no reason to buy a standard PC (all most of us use is the internet and word processing). For me, once Android integrates QuickOffice and a third party software maker releases a viable Android app, I'll ditch the PC completely at my office.

The new world is all about the ecosystem and screen sizes. Microsoft missed this trend and is quickly trying to catch up to avoid irrelevance.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:54 PM

40. I like 8 ...you just have to get used to doing things faster and different.

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Response to BlueJazz (Reply #40)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:56 PM

43. That's not the point.

Different people have different work habits. Some prefer a clean desktop environment. Some prefer to organize things THEIR way instead of Microsoft's way.

Instead of users getting used to Microsoft's way of doing things, when is Microsoft going to get used to users wanting things THEIR way?

It's been a long time since they paid attention to that.

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Response to randome (Reply #43)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:09 AM

87. Weren't they already doing things Microsoft's way?

If they were using a previous version of a Microsoft OS, they were working under Microsoft's way of doing things. They just adapted to it.

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Response to GoCubsGo (Reply #87)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:19 AM

88. The flexibility has been greatly decreased over the years.

It's almost like they hate the word 'personal' in 'personal computers'.

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Response to randome (Reply #43)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 03:10 PM

110. I agree....it's just as a Tech, I HAVE to get used to some OS's and even stuff I hate....

....like Kodak easy-share.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 11:03 PM

45. Windows 8 is great for touch screens

I think its good. There are some issues I have with it. But after an afternoon of playing with it, I think it is a step forward.

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Response to erodriguez (Reply #45)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 08:27 AM

93. I HATE touch-screens! I even hate to see people using them! Like annoying knitters!

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 11:11 PM

47. I'll never give up my XP. I will be dead before they

 

end support. I used Mellenium for 6 months before going back to XP. I used Vista for about a week when I was putting it on my daughter's computer. I absolutely do NOT want to simply start typing and have stuff come up. I want to be in charge--not the computer. I no longer like anything about Microsoft.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 12:09 AM

51. Another Windows 8 video.

&feature=youtu.be

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Response to alfredo (Reply #51)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:01 AM

77. Great viddy. Thanks a bunch.

Simply, yet elegantly intelligent manner, Mr. Boyko presents the case as to why it is really an epic fail on MS's record.

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Response to MichaelSoE (Reply #77)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:47 AM

97. I liked DOS for getting work done. It went down hill from there.

One thing I liked about Windows was that you could change the wall paper and themes into something that would make your eyes bleed. It always started with that ugly bubble wallpaper that looked like the surface of a farm waste digester. The Pink or orange theme was then overlaid. The Task bar was expanded to take up half the screen. Our supervisor could never figure out which one of us did the enhancements. I'd say I can't help because I only know DOS and MacOS.

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Response to alfredo (Reply #97)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:58 AM

98. I'm all for keeping up with new technology but you touch on some interesting points.

Speaking of DOS: for a while, Microsoft experimented with highlighting only part of a file in Windows Explorer. This made it extremely difficult to see the info for what you had highlighted. They changed finally, presumably because of complaints.

And now it sometimes takes seconds -yes, SECONDS- to display a list of your files in Explorer. That's because the OS has become so needlessly graphical, it has to look up those nonsensical file icons for every single file.

But in DOS, you can actually see your files in an instant. This is the speed with which computers should be operating. Not this painfully resource intensive way.

And finally, after all this time, you STILL cannot print a list of your files from Explorer.

Microsoft has held back the speed and capabilities of computers for too long. They need to get out of the way.

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Response to randome (Reply #98)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 11:22 AM

103. And it was irritating in its ugliness. MacOS then OSX spoiled me. Even Gnome in Linux

was preferable. At the time KDE tried to be Windows, and suffered a bad case of uglies.

I am still looking for a good Linux laptop at the right price.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 12:12 AM

52. I upgraded to 7 from XP a few months ago.

I Ike it fine, don't think I'll be changing.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 12:18 AM

53. Easy Button says Easy! Just use Linux Mint! And Dump Windows 8. n/t

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 12:29 AM

55. Okay you computer wiz es....

Youtube and other sites state to me including paypal that my windows 7 is old and needs to be replaced by windows 8. After seeing this I do not want to go to windows 8. But some say they will not accept windows 7 any longer after a certain date what am I to do.

Actually I have an XP so maybe I'm not 7 but XP I dunno help me please....

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Response to bkkyosemite (Reply #55)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 12:33 AM

57. make sure you patch Windows 7 completely from the official website

They are probably complaining about your version of Internet Explorer. Update it to the latest one you can use on Windows 7, which is IE9 I think. Or, just use Firefox or Opera or Chrome.

eta: Click here to update your OS and IE.

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Response to steve2470 (Reply #57)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 01:56 AM

65. I helped my father buy a new Dell

laptop with Windows 7 and IE 9 did not work well with at all. I deinstalled it back down to IE 8 and it's working wurhout a problem.

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Response to Jenoch (Reply #65)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 02:41 AM

68. yes, IE8 is the default browser for Win7 nt

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Response to bkkyosemite (Reply #55)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:09 AM

82. I have no problem getting on Paypal, Ebay, youtube or anywhere else with XP

They might be telling you that you need to upgrade your browser. IE7 is NOT the OS.
Of course you couldn't pay me to use Internet ExploDer.

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Response to hobbit709 (Reply #82)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 11:21 AM

102. I only keep IE for the rare site that only works with it.

Firefox and Chrome both work with every operating system that is out now, including Windows 8. And, sometimes issues with YouTube, etc., are conflicts with other software. Real Player causes Adobe Flash to crash in Firefox, for instance. I had that issue with XP, and I had it with Windows 8. I got rid of Real Player, and everything works fine now.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 02:38 AM

67. I used the alpha and beta versions of Windows 8....

so I had plenty of time to get adjusted to it.

I have a few tips to adjust to it here

Of course, YMMV and everyone has their own "workarounds".

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 04:02 AM

71. I wonder how many times "windows 8" has been compared to "new coke" so far. n/t

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:11 AM

72. Honestly, I like Win8. Took some getting used to, but...

I will not buy an Apple product for twice the price.

I sold mainframe computers for IBM back in the 70s when the company was being sued for antitrust violations. They were, basically, locking out third party vendors just as Apple does now. As their market share increases they'll have to open up more. Only then will I consider it.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:21 AM

73. Condolences to one and all

n/t

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 06:30 AM

75. Meh, its fine

Just get to the desktop and it functions basically like Windows 7. Can install a start menu pretty easily.

The tile screen is not needed for a pc, imo. If they're trying to make an os for mobile devices... why the hell is it on new PCs?

Really, though, it's just a bunch of gimmicky junk. Most people should be able to use windows 8 exactly like they use windows 7 with a few minutes of customization.

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Response to RedCappedBandit (Reply #75)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 11:11 AM

100. The tile screen is basically the start menu, only horizontal.

And, it stays up until you decide what program you wish to open. No need to hold the mouse button down while you find what you want. I prefer it to the old version, which was a huge pain-in-the-ass with all of its nested sub-menus. One can move stuff around it a lot easier than the old versions of the start menu. You can also easily get rid of the gimicky junk.

I came over from XP, and have never used Windows 7. But, the desktop is still nearly identical to XP. And, I like that the file menu is down one the bottom bar with all the "quick launch" buttons. I suspect that Microsoft will have some updates out to modify the start menu even more, as I am sure they're inundated with complaints about it. Some of the new OS is stupid, like the way some of the "apps" are closed, but as someone else said in this thread, Windows 8 is definitely not the monster it's being made out to be.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:04 AM

80. Perhaps this is yet one more reason to stay with Macintosh?

Yes, I think it is...

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Response to MrMickeysMom (Reply #80)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 11:00 AM

99. I think there is something seriously wrong with upper management at MS.

The example they set will affect the quality of the product produced.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:38 AM

84. got a new pc for my daughter, win 8

took me several hours to make it useable and responsive.

painful.

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Response to bullimiami (Reply #84)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 07:47 AM

85. I can't stand it...

I think what bothers me most is that they basically took Metro from Windows Phone and said, "Hey! People want their PC to be exactly like their phone."

However, to me the system is not what I want. Luckily, I switched to a Mac last November. I do still have a Windows 7 PC in my home, but I don't see ever upgrading to Windows 8 as my wife tried it and hates it as well.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 02:22 PM

108. Eloquent and insightful. Well stated!

 

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 02:53 PM

109. WORST. OS. EVER.

I generally run CentOs because it's easy to install, easy to run, has every possible program I need (movies, development IDEs, music, etc) plus TONS of free stuff. The free stuff in the repositories just works.

So I got this Bright Idea(tm). Since I run XP in VMWare, I'd upgrade one or more to run Windows 8 before M$ grandfathered it out of existence.

I spent a week getting the damn thing to upgrade the first time. When I finally got a VM to run, it will boot 4 or 5 times max, then refuse to boot. From what I can tell, this isn't unusual. My aunt and several friends of mine bought brand new machines with Win 8 on them (and nothing else). Same thing. It will boot 4 or 5 times fine then you have to reinstall Win 8 from the recovery disk.

Oh. You didn't make a recovery disk when you bought the machine. Sorry. You're fucked.

When it did run, what the guy in the vid said is absolutely right. Worst organization ever. Messy, cluttered, ugly, clumsy, weird (you have to bump the mouse in the upper-right corner to find something like a menu). It's like 10 clicks to shut the fucker down. Dizzying array of icons that has no way to organize into something sensible. It looks like a cow farted bran.

Whoever thought that interface was a good idea was on acid. Really bad acid, not even quality shit.

At least with VMs, if I feel another round of masochism coming on (it hasn't happened yet and not likely to in the near future) I can always clone another XP machine off and attempt the upgrade again.

The Win 8 disks went to the bottom of the Stack Of Shit I'll Probably Never Use Again.

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 05:16 PM

112. The risk MS is taking... if users have to start all over again...

The only reason why most people still use MS is because it's what they are used to and comfortable with. If people, particularly older people who are finally becoming comfortable with Windows, are made to start over, what's to stop those users from just switching to Apple or other competitors?

There's a great opening right now for Google or another company to step in and use the KISS approach.

lmao @ this video!

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Response to quinnox (Original post)

Tue Dec 25, 2012, 01:52 PM

115. It looks like windoze 8 may break the record for shortest release to failure record.

 

I think windoze millennium edition is the current holder.

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