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Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:15 PM

Ryan Lanza Says,"You Have No Right To Call My Brother Names When He Isnít Here"


Ryan Lanza, the older brother of Sandy Hook Elementary shooter Adam Lanza, says he's a victim of the massacre by losing both his mother and brother.

Ryan, in a message to the NY Post via Facebook, said, "ďI am a victim ... I loss my mom and brother."

Ryan also posted pics of his brother and mother, each with a message underneath. For his brother, he wrote, "I will miss you bro. I will always love you as long as I live." For his mother ... "I miss you mom. I love you so much. You will be always in my heart."

The Post says Ryan is responding to Facebook posts wishing that his brother "rot in hell" ... saying, "I am so tired of people blaming me for something my brother did. I love Adam ... But you have no right to call my brother names when he isnít here no more. Just let my brother rest in peace. Please. Respect that."

Some media outlets mistakenly named Ryan the shooter because Adam was carrying his older brother's ID at the time of the massacre.

http://www.tmz.com/category/connecticut-school-shooting/

174 replies, 10181 views

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Reply Ryan Lanza Says,"You Have No Right To Call My Brother Names When He Isnít Here" (Original post)
HipChick Dec 2012 OP
Warpy Dec 2012 #1
kestrel91316 Dec 2012 #45
patrice Dec 2012 #52
antigone382 Dec 2012 #54
LisaL Dec 2012 #56
DakotaLady Dec 2012 #78
antigone382 Dec 2012 #88
LisaL Dec 2012 #115
antigone382 Dec 2012 #118
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #103
zappaman Dec 2012 #105
UnrepentantLiberal Dec 2012 #163
Beaverhausen Dec 2012 #155
MH1 Dec 2012 #83
MichaelHarris Dec 2012 #158
antigone382 Dec 2012 #159
malaise Dec 2012 #89
antigone382 Dec 2012 #100
Zoeisright Dec 2012 #107
NewsCenter28 Dec 2012 #161
tblue Dec 2012 #112
Whisp Dec 2012 #120
cali Dec 2012 #2
laundry_queen Dec 2012 #22
Gman Dec 2012 #24
WolverineDG Dec 2012 #26
uppityperson Dec 2012 #95
WolverineDG Dec 2012 #127
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #46
antigone382 Dec 2012 #96
cali Dec 2012 #139
antigone382 Dec 2012 #156
tblue Dec 2012 #113
CJCRANE Dec 2012 #3
WolverineDG Dec 2012 #29
CJCRANE Dec 2012 #44
TwilightGardener Dec 2012 #4
tj_crackersnatch Dec 2012 #63
antigone382 Dec 2012 #97
KittyWampus Dec 2012 #99
fishwax Dec 2012 #5
Posteritatis Dec 2012 #10
R. Daneel Olivaw Dec 2012 #31
etherealtruth Dec 2012 #6
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #9
CJCRANE Dec 2012 #14
etherealtruth Dec 2012 #18
Arkansas Granny Dec 2012 #19
smackd Dec 2012 #38
alarimer Dec 2012 #84
get the red out Dec 2012 #58
cascadiance Dec 2012 #140
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #7
rainlillie Dec 2012 #13
etherealtruth Dec 2012 #15
CreekDog Dec 2012 #25
NYC Liberal Dec 2012 #33
MissMillie Dec 2012 #172
nc4bo Dec 2012 #8
CreekDog Dec 2012 #27
nc4bo Dec 2012 #50
Paladin Dec 2012 #32
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #47
nc4bo Dec 2012 #70
DevonRex Dec 2012 #86
Paladin Dec 2012 #75
DevonRex Dec 2012 #62
help.help. me rhoda Dec 2012 #87
CaliforniaPeggy Dec 2012 #91
happy xenusmas eve Dec 2012 #171
DevonRex Dec 2012 #94
rainlillie Dec 2012 #11
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #16
Tuesday Afternoon Dec 2012 #12
FedUpWithIt All Dec 2012 #17
Comrade_McKenzie Dec 2012 #20
HipChick Dec 2012 #21
etherealtruth Dec 2012 #23
CreekDog Dec 2012 #30
LisaL Dec 2012 #55
HipChick Dec 2012 #60
LisaL Dec 2012 #61
HipChick Dec 2012 #65
LisaL Dec 2012 #77
brentspeak Dec 2012 #81
Lone_Star_Dem Dec 2012 #147
valerief Dec 2012 #28
Posteritatis Dec 2012 #37
OldDem2012 Dec 2012 #34
HipChick Dec 2012 #68
ann--- Dec 2012 #35
Initech Dec 2012 #36
ann--- Dec 2012 #41
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #48
proud2BlibKansan Dec 2012 #39
ann--- Dec 2012 #42
brentspeak Dec 2012 #40
Marrah_G Dec 2012 #43
ibegurpard Dec 2012 #49
patrice Dec 2012 #51
LisaL Dec 2012 #53
99Forever Dec 2012 #57
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #74
99Forever Dec 2012 #76
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #145
99Forever Dec 2012 #150
Sadiedog Dec 2012 #116
99Forever Dec 2012 #117
Sadiedog Dec 2012 #121
LanternWaste Dec 2012 #169
99Forever Dec 2012 #170
DevonRex Dec 2012 #59
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #72
backscatter712 Dec 2012 #64
WinkyDink Dec 2012 #67
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #69
backscatter712 Dec 2012 #73
GObamaGO Dec 2012 #164
TeamPooka Dec 2012 #66
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #71
fishwax Dec 2012 #106
patrice Dec 2012 #79
AndyA Dec 2012 #80
still_one Dec 2012 #82
help.help. me rhoda Dec 2012 #85
help.help. me rhoda Dec 2012 #90
easttexaslefty Dec 2012 #92
help.help. me rhoda Dec 2012 #93
Catherina Dec 2012 #98
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #101
The Velveteen Ocelot Dec 2012 #102
Catherina Dec 2012 #104
Cha Dec 2012 #108
southernyankeebelle Dec 2012 #109
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #110
southernyankeebelle Dec 2012 #114
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #122
southernyankeebelle Dec 2012 #174
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #143
southernyankeebelle Dec 2012 #173
MFM008 Dec 2012 #111
Blue_In_AK Dec 2012 #119
LisaL Dec 2012 #124
Blue_In_AK Dec 2012 #125
alp227 Dec 2012 #123
The Velveteen Ocelot Dec 2012 #126
Lone_Star_Dem Dec 2012 #148
samsingh Dec 2012 #128
The Velveteen Ocelot Dec 2012 #129
samsingh Dec 2012 #131
The Velveteen Ocelot Dec 2012 #133
samsingh Dec 2012 #136
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #142
samsingh Dec 2012 #167
RedCappedBandit Dec 2012 #130
Fumesucker Dec 2012 #132
The Velveteen Ocelot Dec 2012 #134
obamanut2012 Dec 2012 #141
Lone_Star_Dem Dec 2012 #152
GObamaGO Dec 2012 #135
LisaL Dec 2012 #137
GObamaGO Dec 2012 #138
BigDemVoter Dec 2012 #144
Honeycombe8 Dec 2012 #146
LisaL Dec 2012 #149
Honeycombe8 Dec 2012 #151
LisaL Dec 2012 #154
LineReply s
LiberalMadeline Dec 2012 #153
DapperDon Dec 2012 #157
Arkana Dec 2012 #160
LisaL Dec 2012 #162
GObamaGO Dec 2012 #165
Catherina Dec 2012 #166
HappyMe Dec 2012 #168

Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:20 PM

1. "when he isn't here no more"

Guns weren't the only problem in that family.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #1)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:21 PM

45. And this: ".....I loss my mom and brother....."

Not to make light, but I smell typical RW semi-literacy.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #45)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:10 PM

52. Bingo. TTE, "Just saying/believing/feeling makes whatever true," no need to understand how things

like words work.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #45)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:14 PM

54. You have no idea what his political leanings are.

We are supposed to be the party of the poor and working class...who may or may not be able to quote Shakespeare. Not to mention I have a lot of friends who are dyslexic and really can't do anything about the fact that their writing isn't perfect. This may or may not be the case with this guy.

You have no idea what it is like to be in this guy's shoes. He didn't do anything to cause what happened. Ridiculing him over a couple of spelling and grammar errors is disgusting.

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Response to antigone382 (Reply #54)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:18 PM

56. Ryan Lanza is a college graduate.

So presumably should be able to write without grammatical errors. Whoever wrote this might not be Ryan Lanza.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #56)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:02 PM

78. Might not be ...

That is what I thought too ... maybe not Ryan Lanza.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #56)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:50 PM

88. You would think so, but I would say this is not necessarily true.

I am at a pretty well regarded liberal arts school and we graduate students every year who still have major writing problems; this could be due to the much larger numbers of students who are going to college, or any number of factors. In the case of people with dyslexia and other learning disabilities, colleges do have to adjust their expectations to what the students are capable of doing (I of course have no idea whether this is the case with Lanza). Also, even a college educated person might be more prone to error if they are writing while highly emotional, which he undoubtedly is right now.

You could very well be right, but I wouldn't rule out that it is Lanza.

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Response to antigone382 (Reply #88)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 05:27 PM

115. Ryan Lanza didn't post these messages.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #115)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 06:36 PM

118. Thanks for the info. n/t

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Response to LisaL (Reply #56)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:27 PM

103. I hold a masters

And still make mistakes. Sorry Lisa...empathy is a good thing.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #103)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:34 PM

105. really? you hold a masters?

Do tell!
What is it in and how are you using it in the real world?
I envy you folks with masters since it helps to find and keep a great job!

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Response to zappaman (Reply #105)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 12:43 AM

163. Oh jeeze...

 

I'm speechless

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #103)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:48 PM

155. IT'S A HOAX. Damn it

I wish people would stop posting in this thread. It's been proven to be a hoax.

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Response to antigone382 (Reply #54)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:35 PM

83. THANK YOU. nt

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Response to antigone382 (Reply #54)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 11:10 PM

158. his family

was politically conservative, it's been reported in a number of newspapers.

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Response to MichaelHarris (Reply #158)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 11:19 PM

159. So is half of my immediate family. I hope their beliefs are not projected on me.

Nevertheless, I know plenty of liberals who have less than perfect grammar and spelling...some of them on this board. And even if he were conservative, it is my belief that one's humanity in such situations doesn't begin and end with one's political perspective. It is very likely some of the grieving parents of the slain children are conservatives. It doesn't make their situation any less tragic.

In any case, he apparently didn't even make these statements. The whole thing seems to have been a hoax.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #45)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:51 PM

89. I wonder if he posts in Freeperville

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Response to malaise (Reply #89)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:25 PM

100. What did he do to offend you?

...have public attention forced on him at the absolute worst possible point in his life?

I am glad to see that most of the people in this thread have the basic capacity for empathy to not judge someone who is in a situation with absolutely no positive aspects.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #45)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:41 PM

107. Yep. Those kids were home schooled.

And the mother was a repuke dim bulb.

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Response to kestrel91316 (Reply #45)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 11:36 PM

161. That's a good point

My "Internet friend", a rabid right winger, has just a basic grasp of literacy as well.

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Response to Warpy (Reply #1)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:57 PM

112. How dare you

make me reading a serious op like this?!

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Response to Warpy (Reply #1)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 07:05 PM

120. maybe he was crying when he wrote that.

that was really mean, Warpy.

Can you imagine what he is going through.

He was not the killer - just a reminder!
And loving his brother is what brothers and family do - no matter what. Still loving him does not make Ryan guilty of the crimes too.

this makes me very very sad.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:22 PM

2. wow. that is startlingly narcissistic.

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Response to cali (Reply #2)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:49 PM

22. Just slightly. nt

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Response to cali (Reply #2)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:56 PM

24. Sounds like serious grieving to me

He's had a whole lot to deal with in the last week.

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Response to cali (Reply #2)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:03 PM

26. He's grieving

he's having to come to grips with not only losing his mother & brother in one day, but with the fact his brother killed her, 20 kids, & 6 teachers. That's not narcissistic.

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Response to WolverineDG (Reply #26)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:58 PM

95. Seriously. I don't get the hatred and mocking of this person. He has to deal with a hell of a lot of

crap going down.

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Response to uppityperson (Reply #95)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:20 PM

127. Because someone has to be punished

& since the perpetrator killed himself, his brother is the next best thing.

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Response to cali (Reply #2)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:44 PM

46. Not at all

He is grieving and in shock.

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Response to cali (Reply #2)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:01 PM

96. I invite you to trade lives with him if you think you could do a better job in this circumstance.

He didn't ask to be the public face of the Lanzas. The media plastered his name, photo, and facebook page all over the world before he even knew what was going on (and I share guilt for posting the original news story identifying him as the killer in LBN), and who knows what kind of awful messages he has received since then from irrational assholes? He has lost his privacy, his family, and even the right to grieve without the outcomes of his mother and brothers' lives being laid at his feet.

I cannot claim to comprehend anything near on the scale of burying your baby brother after he has committed such a heinous act, but I have the tiniest inkling of what it's like when someone you grieve becomes an object of public scorn in their deaths. I have buried friends whose deaths were the results of awful decisions--drunk driving, heroin addiction, etc. In the public there is no empathy for you and what you have lost, only finger wagging for their bad choices. In the moment you see no reflection of whatever complex and fully human individual your loved one may have been--they are simply a cautionary tale to be dissected as publicly as possible. I would not argue that it is worse than losing your six your old child to a crazed gunman, but it is its own form of hell, and I would not judge anyone in the midst of trying to navigate it.

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Response to antigone382 (Reply #96)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:04 PM

139. I seriouly think it would behoove him simply to follow his father's exmple

His father, who surely is also grieving, made a dignified statement mourning the loss of the lives Adam took and has maintained silence since.

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Response to cali (Reply #139)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:57 PM

156. Be that as it may, as a person who has grieved, I have few expectations of the grieving.

Not that it matters, since apparently this entire supposed statement was not actually made by Ryan--the "facebook interview" referenced by NYP appears to be a hoax. Even if he did make such statements, the wisest choice is not always the emotionally possible one. Moreover, Ryan's experience of this event was arguably much more traumatizing and public than his father's was.

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Response to cali (Reply #2)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 05:05 PM

113. The whole family I guess was a little off.

He doesn't like how people are reacting what his brother did? Oh. Sorry. I heard he hadn't seen his bro in a couple years. He's grieving, fine. That's normal. I am sure he loved his brother, but that's a startling lack of self-awareness right there. Are we sure this guy is safe?

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:25 PM

3. He can say what he likes

of course, but he comes across as a bit mouthy/bolshy esp. with the whole "fuck you CNN" etc posts.

Sometimes it's better to keep quiet until you've figured out what's going on.

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Response to CJCRANE (Reply #3)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:04 PM

29. He said that when CNN identified him as the shooter

& was telling the world he was dead.

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Response to WolverineDG (Reply #29)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:14 PM

44. I understand why he wrote those things

and I can give him some slack considering he's just a young guy in a very difficult situation...I just think he would get more sympathy if he didn't lash out like that.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:25 PM

4. This is why social media can suck. It would be better if he

stayed off FB right now. It's natural to want to defend your family members, no matter what they did--but he needs to grieve and do some PRIVATE personal reflection, and not offer up his distressed thoughts for public consumption right now.

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Response to TwilightGardener (Reply #4)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:37 PM

63. this

^^^^^

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Response to TwilightGardener (Reply #4)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:05 PM

97. Understood, but at this point does he really have that option?

His grief became a public experience before he even knew what had happened. His face, name, and facebook page were plastered all over the internet within hours when he was identified as the shooter, and then revealed to be the shooter's older brother. Who knows what kind of hate messages he is receiving? Who knows how much he is being bombarded by the media for interviews, etc.? Who knows what he may be getting from people every time he walks down the street? When you feel like you are at the center of public scrutiny, you may feel you have no choice but to respond publicly.

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Response to TwilightGardener (Reply #4)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:21 PM

99. Twilight, I suspect you may around my ageÖ I grew up without Facebook, computers. Social media can

definitely suck. But for many younger people it is a fact of life.

But I do agree, it seems social media like Facebook has become an integral part of our lives but we haven't built the appropriate social customs to deal with it fully.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:25 PM

5. No doubt that it's been a hard few weeks for him

As to the calling of names: people are going to call Adam names and worse, though I'm not sure why one would choose to do so on Ryan's facebook page.

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Response to fishwax (Reply #5)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:31 PM

10. People enjoy doing the guilt-by-association thing.

Someone does something sufficiently bad, people will hold it against their grandchildren, never mind their siblings.

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Response to Posteritatis (Reply #10)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:07 PM

31. Yes, that's true enough.


The internets can really bring out the worst in people. I would probably delete my FB page as well as my brothers. This guy has lost the better part of his family to gun violence. It is a hard thing to bear this kind of pain even without the barrage of hate he is going to get.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:29 PM

6. I am going to break from the other responses ...

... as far as I know this guy did not do anything wrong.

As horrific as what his brother did is (horrific barely covers it) ... this guy has been through hell, as well.

In the face of absence of evidence to the contrary, this guy played no role in this (ie no evidence indicating any complicity in any of this) ... I feel compassion for this guy. One can be horrified by the deranged actions of the brother and still love the brother as he knew him.

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Response to etherealtruth (Reply #6)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:30 PM

9. I 100% agree with you

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Response to etherealtruth (Reply #6)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:33 PM

14. Maybe this is the best way for him to cope...

by being assertive and sticking up for himself and his family.

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Response to CJCRANE (Reply #14)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:37 PM

18. How would any of us act in this situation?

I don't think we know ... and pray we never find out.

If my little brother (he's 46 years old) committed heinous acts ... It would be impossible for me to erase the memories of 46 years of love. I would despise the acts ... but, he would always be my brother (at this point even writing this is ridiculous because he is such a good guy ... but .... )

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Response to etherealtruth (Reply #6)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:39 PM

19. I totally agree. He needs time and space to grieve as much as other survivors

of this tragedy. He is not going to miss his brother any less, regardless what he did.

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Response to etherealtruth (Reply #6)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:12 PM

38. agreed...likely his entire world has crumbled...

...similar to the other affected families. not knowing any details about him personally, i feel compassion for him. he's a victim, too.

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Response to smackd (Reply #38)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:38 PM

84. Especially since, for the rest of his life, he will be known as the brother of the Newtown killer.

I cannot imagine this at all.

And the rest of the world is tarring him with the same brush, all because of the atrociously irresponsible journalism early on.

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Response to etherealtruth (Reply #6)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:22 PM

58. That was my first response also

I can't imagine being in his position. I do know I can't imagine not loving my only sibling.

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Response to etherealtruth (Reply #6)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:54 PM

140. I'm with you to some extent...

He certainly doesn't deserve to be put in the same category of monster that most of us think of his brother being in.

I think he needs to understand at some point that much as he's frustrated that the nation is calling him a monster for what his brother did, and perhaps blaming his mother for owning the guns that killed so many horribly, the nation feels frustrated if he says that we can't call his brother the monster we feel that we saw that can be the only way to describe an entity that would want to pump five bullets in to a totally innocent and young child (and many of them that way at that).

If I were him, I'd pull back from making public comments now and come to personal terms with what happened. Hopefully he has someone in his life that understands who he is personally inside that he can lean on for some support in trying to getting back his perspective on things.

Then later, if he can regain that sense of balance that might be difficult or impossible for him to do, really try to build up an account of his brother and mother's life in total and try to help us all personally understand what happened in his family that would lead to the animosity that had his mother and father split apart, and he himself cutting himself off from communicating to his brother for two years. If that could all help us understand how his brother might have been a decent person at one point that he wants us to believe he was at one point, and how that transition happened to have his brother turn in to the monster he became, then perhaps we can all thank Ryan for helping us understand more what creates this kind of horrible behavior in Adam's and many other killers' cases in society. That would be a contribution to help us all, and might help the rest of society embrace him at some point as more of an innocent victim, than perhaps a component of what lead his brother to become horribly nuts, which pretty much all of us don't understand at this point and are mostly speculating on might be the case, and perhaps harmfully too.

I don't think now is the time for him to do this, as it sounds like he's still got a lot of personal issues he needs to come to terms with before he can do this in the right way, but if he avoids becoming a prominent figure for the time being, it will perhaps leave room for him later to be a more positive part of the big picture of this horrible event and its after effects.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:29 PM

7. He is a victim, I feel very bad for him

Mother killed, brother dead after killing almost 30 people, he was perp walked, having lies about his mother and brother posted all over (including here).

It's his BROTHER.

I hope he can heal.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #7)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:32 PM

13. Yes, I too feel that he is a victim.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #7)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:33 PM

15. I think we posted similar sentiments at ~ the same time

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #7)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:02 PM

25. he is a victim

i don't understand why people can't put themselves in Ryan's shoes, instead of making it seem as though Ryan owes the world an apology and has no right to grieve the loss of his mother and brother.

i don't get it.

can people not accept that this is a tragedy, a horrific killing of so many adults and children, it remains that, almost incomparable.

but why can't people, while accepting that, also accept that someone like Ryan, would also have it as a personal tragedy and loss --albeit a complicated one because of what his brother did, a loss nonetheless.

i don't understand people who cannot understand that these things can all be true simultaneously.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #7)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:08 PM

33. I agree 100%. He, too, is dealing with something unimagineable.

How would any of us react after somene we loved very much did something like this?

In time I believe (and hope) he will come to terms with everything that has happened and find a way to cope with it. People need to stop harassing a victim.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 01:29 PM

172. spot on (n/t)

.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:29 PM

8. How did your brother get your ID?

Wonder if there's an answer to that question yet?

OTOH it's probably difficult to rationalize that your own brother killed 20 babies and 6 innocent adults, one of your parents and himself.

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Response to nc4bo (Reply #8)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:04 PM

27. you seem to be blaming the older brother for what the younger brother did

would you like to jail him?

would you like to require him to not grieve the death of his mother and brother?

i don't think we have anything in common. you want to blame a guy who is not guilty for one of the two most horrific crimes of this year.

i think that is un-American, and i am using that term after very carefully thinking it through.

because wanting someone who did not do a crime to suffer for it is un-American.

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Response to CreekDog (Reply #27)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:50 PM

50. And you are putting words into my mouth.

He didn't pull the trigger so quite frankly, I don't care what happens to him unless it can help with figuring out what went wrong in this household - perhaps preventing it from happening again or the knowledge being used as a warning sign for other people.

I'm pitied out atm but I'm sure there are others who can provide more than enough on my behalf.









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Response to nc4bo (Reply #8)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:08 PM

32. Yeah, I Keep Waiting For That Matter To Be Straightened Out.


Anybody hear anythng?

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Response to nc4bo (Reply #8)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:46 PM

47. Who cares?

It doesn't matter.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #47)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:49 PM

70. It may not matter but maybe it could have.

I am just speculating...it's really all any of us have right now, alot of what ifs.

What if he attempted to use his older brother's ID so he could purchase guns? Wasn't he reported to have tried to buy a gun before he went on his massacre? We don't know.

What if the gunshop owner suspected the ID was fake and didn't report it? What if it was immediately reported and authorities notified (like what happens in credit card theft)?

What if the older brother suspected his younger brother attempted to get ID in the other brother's name? Could reporting the activity have changed anything? We don't know.

Could warning signs have alerted people or warned people in Adam's circle or whomever had personal contact with him?

You're probably right, it doesn't matter but what if it did?



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Response to nc4bo (Reply #70)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:46 PM

86. He was old enough to buy a long gun

which is what he tried to buy. He had a car so he had his own DL.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #47)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:52 PM

75. Yeah, Actually, It Does Matter. (nt)

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Response to nc4bo (Reply #8)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:34 PM

62. First, nobody said it was valid ID.

Ryan used to live there. Second, Adam could have renewed Ryan's CT license online without his knowledge after Ryan moved to NJ . I renewed both my sons' DLs for them when they were away at University.

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Response to nc4bo (Reply #8)


Response to help.help. me rhoda (Reply #87)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:52 PM

91. I'm not sure what you're getting at...

Can you clarify?

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Reply #91)


Response to help.help. me rhoda (Reply #87)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:55 PM

94. Been at the nog already?

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:31 PM

11. Ryan didn't do anything wrong,

He shouldn't have to pay for the actions of his brother. I do think it would be wise for him to get out of the spotlight.

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Response to rainlillie (Reply #11)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:34 PM

16. It's probably how he's trying to deal with it

Although the best thing he can do for HIMSELF is stay offline.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:32 PM

12. sad. sad. sad situation.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:37 PM

17. I am sure nobody can truly imagine what this man is going through.

My heart goes out to him and i wish him peace and healing.

People who are persecuting him should be ashamed. He is innocent of any crime. He has suffered great loss. He is left with a confounding nightmare to try and sort through and recover from. Through no actions of his own, he will suffer vilification by those too narrow minded to place blame only where it belongs. He did nothing different from one day to the next and like the victims families, his life will never be the same.

I recommend the movie Beautiful Boy for anyone interested in getting some sense of the remaining family's possible perspective.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:40 PM

20. Give him a goddamn break, people. nt

 

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:47 PM

21. He should shut down his FB and lay low..


Emotions are still raw, and I'm sure there are folks holding him responsible for his brothers actions

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Response to HipChick (Reply #21)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 12:49 PM

23. That would be probably be most helpful for him

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Response to HipChick (Reply #21)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:05 PM

30. of course, it would be hard to do that without further isolating him from his friends and family

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Response to HipChick (Reply #21)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:15 PM

55. As far as I can tell, he did shut it down.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #55)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:26 PM

60. the media reports shows screen captures of his Facebook

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Response to HipChick (Reply #60)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:30 PM

61. I am sorry, but just because somebody claims to be Ryan Lanza while chatting with NYP,

doesn't make it so.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #61)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:44 PM

65. Do you even know how to access Facebook

and verify yourself?

Why he does't have a family attorney speaking on his behalf?

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Response to HipChick (Reply #65)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:00 PM

77. Seriously? You think everything posted on facebook is truth and nothing but the truth?

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Response to HipChick (Reply #60)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:17 PM

81. His Facebook profile is still active?

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Response to HipChick (Reply #60)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:07 PM

147. The update below the pics states his family says it was an impostor.

UPDATE: A spokesman for the Lanza family says an impostor is behind Ryan Lanza's Facebook page and that Ryan did not post the messages in this story.


Honestly, the statement he's said to have made doesn't sound accurate for a college educated person.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:04 PM

28. Why won't TMZ leave this guy alone? We all should. nt

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Response to valerief (Reply #28)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:11 PM

37. It's an entertainment gossip site. Their entire MO is stalking. (nt)

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:09 PM

34. I think he should have stayed away from posting anything anywhere...

....nothing good will come of this.

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Response to OldDem2012 (Reply #34)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:47 PM

68. Agree..he needs to lay low, before he comes a victim

of someone dealing with some raw emotion from this..

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Response to HipChick (Original post)


Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:11 PM

36. He killed 20 children. He isn't getting off that easy.

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Response to Initech (Reply #36)


Response to Initech (Reply #36)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:48 PM

48. He didn't kill anyone

Although the cops perp walked him as the shooter for the media.

He is a VICTIM.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:12 PM

39. This is very sad. I feel sorry for him.

He didn't do anything wrong. Poor kid. What a burden.

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Response to proud2BlibKansan (Reply #39)


Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:12 PM

40. Might be a hoax

Where's Ryan Lanza's Facebook page? And the NY Post didn't post any snapshots of the alleged comments.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:14 PM

43. He's a young man dealing with an unimaginable situation

My heart breaks for him as much as for the families of the other victims. Maybe even more, because he has to live the fact that his brother not only killed his mother, but also slaughtered so many innocent children.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 01:49 PM

49. I certainly feel sorry for this poor guy

But I think that he needs to learn the lesson that sometimes the best thing to say is nothing at all.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:07 PM

51. I agree, Ryan. Understanding is not excusing, is not approval. & Hate is slavery. nt

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:12 PM

53. Where is the evidence that whoever posted this, really is Ryan Lanza?

I am concerned he is being victimized all over again.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:22 PM

57. Well Ryan Lanza....

... I'm fresh out of compassion for your family, I used mine up for the victims of your mother's weapons, used by your brother to slaughter them, and their families and friends.

It's not that I blame you, it's just that your "feelings" simply don't matter. I'll call your fucking monster of a sibling any damn name I please. That's just the way it is when babies get murdered.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #57)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:51 PM

74. Why di you have "feelings" in scare quotes?

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #74)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:55 PM

76. WTF?

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #76)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:00 PM

145. Why do you have "feelings" in scare quotes?

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #145)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:19 PM

150. scare quotes????

WTF?

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #57)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 05:43 PM

116. Sad!

I have a whole lot of compassion for this young man. It takes nothing away from the other victims to feel for this man too!

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Response to Sadiedog (Reply #116)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 05:50 PM

117. You have that right.

I didn't say otherwise.

I won't tell you who to feel compassion for and would appreciate if you would be courteous enough to do the same for me.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #117)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 07:05 PM

121. Ok.

I said nothing to you about who you should feel compassion for. Perhaps you misunderstood what i was stating. Sorry that you took offense to what I wrote it really was not meant that way.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #57)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 11:02 AM

169. Rather, you have made the conscious decision to deny extending compassion

"I'm fresh out of compassion for your family, I used mine up for..."

Rather, you have made the conscious decision to deny extending compassion, as compassion exists, for all practical purposes, in unlimited quantities.



"I'll call your fucking monster of a sibling any damn name I please..."

I have few doubts that you may truly believe that to be an appropriate response, despite your deep knowledge that this reaction merely strengthens the hatred that already exists in this world, and that you will rationalize labeling the deceased "any damn you name you please" and justify that a petulant name-calling is worthy in some odd way.

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Response to LanternWaste (Reply #169)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 11:11 AM

170. Oh my!

Are you a self-righteous, self appointed dispenser of guilt trips?

I think you are and promise to give all due consideration that I always do to people such as yourself.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:25 PM

59. He's probably been defending little bro his whole life

and he would feel terrible if he stopped now. That's what family does once there's no way to change the outcome. They try to lend a little of the human side to their loved ones. Poor guy. He's going through hell.

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Response to DevonRex (Reply #59)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:50 PM

72. Yup

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:39 PM

64. I feel bad for Ryan, and even for Adam.

Ryan because he lost two family members - duh.

Even Adam, because I'm convinced he'd have to be pretty seriously ill to do what he did.

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Response to backscatter712 (Reply #64)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:47 PM

67. Do you "feel bad" for the S.S. men who shot multitudes of children?

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #67)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:48 PM

69. JFC

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Response to WinkyDink (Reply #67)


Response to WinkyDink (Reply #67)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 01:18 AM

164. Paging Mike Godwin

Mike Godwin to the white courtesy phone.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)


Response to TeamPooka (Reply #66)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 02:49 PM

71. Totally ridiculous

As well as many other things.

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Response to TeamPooka (Reply #66)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:40 PM

106. yeesh.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:08 PM

79. I stand with Ryan Lanza against the bullying tyranny of cruelty & gossip! nt

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:13 PM

80. I feel bad for Ryan, it's not easy losing your mother and your brother in this way.

That does not excuse the fact that his brother took innocent lives, and their families are also hurting right now through no fault of their own.

Ryan's brother is a murderer. Perhaps Ryan could try to do something positive now like coming out against the crazy gun culture in this country, and working toward serious change so that mass murders like this aren't so common in the future.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:28 PM

82. Frankly, what would you expect someone to say in that situation. If someone you loved did something

so awful, I suspect most people would not say anything if they were in the same shoes, but if they did, of course they would be defensive against the indefensible

Because of what happened through his brother he will bear that burden for the rest of his life, and I cannot add anything to the torment I am sure he is feeling

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Response to HipChick (Original post)


Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:51 PM

90. And he was carrying his brother's ID because...?

 

And there was supposedly a confrontation between Adam and 4 school employees but three of them are dead the fourth didn't work the day of the "massacre?"

And who let him in so he could even confront anyone?

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 03:54 PM

92. People need to leave him the fuck alone.

He's not responsible for what his brother did. He's grieving his brother & his mother.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)


Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:15 PM

98. That is SO NOT his Facebook page.

I saw his original Facebook page where he posted the day of the shooting, before he even realized his brother was the murderer, and that ain't it.

After the massacre, he set his page to private. Here are some screenshots of his page, not that nonsense above.






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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:26 PM

101. And if the country has empathy...

They will do such.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:26 PM

102. I wouldn't be surprised to find out this is a fake.

It doesn't pass the smell test.

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #102)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:32 PM

104. It's a total fake: " NY Post admits "Ryan Lanza Facebook interview" was fake"

Brentspeak just posted " NY Post admits "Ryan Lanza Facebook interview" here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022061030


It didn't pass the smell test at all.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:47 PM

108. Yeah, we do have a right.. UnFreakingfortunately. Wow..

is he insensitive to the tragedy or what!

wth

Edit: I can from reading the posts that this was a "fake". That makes more sense. I kept thinking about reading that he hadn't seen his brother for "two years".

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:47 PM

109. All I can say is tell that to the families who lost loved ones.

 

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #109)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:53 PM

110. Sadly he also lost two family members

Empathy s a good thing. Try it.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #110)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 05:16 PM

114. yes your right. I do feel terrible for the young man. I feel very bad for his brother that

 

he didn't get the care he should have when he was younger. The mother and father had the financial funds that could have gotten him the help when he was younger but they didn't follow through. The mother paid with her life. That is very very sad. I do feel sorry for him. But please don't dismiss innocent people who got murdered. It wasn't their fault either. Ryan should understand peoples outrage at the moment and if he is smart he would lay low and let time heal the outrage and people can come to their senses and realize he didn't have anything to do with it.

But please don't say I don't have empathy because I do. But at the moment I have more empathy for the families who are innocent.

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #114)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 07:30 PM

122. I can do it for both

And I learned this taking care of people who did horrendous things, hating the monstrous act is fine, hating the monster comes at a cost to you.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #122)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:07 PM

174. good for your. I am proud of you.

 

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Response to southernyankeebelle (Reply #114)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:57 PM

143. There is no such thing as "more empathy"

You either feel it or you don't. It doesn't have levels or tiers.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #143)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 09:07 PM

173. your right. lets leave it at that.

 

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 04:53 PM

111. I seeeeeee

Dude, your brother was a coward, his actions deny him any of the usual sympathies accourded to the deceased. This whole family seems to be afflicted.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 07:01 PM

119. Whether or not this is really Ryan,

I would not want to be in his shoes. None of this was his fault, and I'm sure he's grieving not only the deaths of his mother and brother but the other victims, as well.

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Response to Blue_In_AK (Reply #119)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 07:51 PM

124. It's really not Ryan.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #124)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 07:53 PM

125. But it still must be a very difficult time for him,

in any event. I feel very sorry for him.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 07:39 PM

123. Please self-delete - this is a hoax

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:19 PM

126. The story is a HOAX.

http://www.chron.com/news/article/Newtown-shooter-s-brother-I-am-a-victim-4142152.php

And I'm really disgusted by some of the responses to the "story." Even if it had been true, how about a little compassion for this poor guy?

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #126)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:15 PM

148. Yes, it is. The NY Post has an update saying so as well.

I posted this up thread before I saw your post.

I agree about some of the responses. It's just sad.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:20 PM

128. this one could be a lunatic as well

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Response to samsingh (Reply #128)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:23 PM

129. Just stop it. The story is a hoax

and Ryan Lanza is an innocent person who doesn't deserve all this crap.

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #129)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:41 PM

131. maybe the nra is a hoax they are too afraid to stop

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Response to samsingh (Reply #131)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:46 PM

133. What's the NRA got to do with this thread?

It's about Ryan Lanza and the stupid bullshit he's had to put up with - the Facebook hoax being the icing on the cake.

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #133)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:56 PM

136. i don't feel sorry for the murderers brother - i'm more concerned about the victims

and the nra that enabled this massacre.

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Response to samsingh (Reply #136)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:56 PM

142. He is also a victim

He has my sympathy and compassion.

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Response to obamanut2012 (Reply #142)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:28 AM

167. there's no evidence that he's a victim


the mother apparently was going to get the boy mental health treatment and yet had lots of accessible guns in the house. i'm neutral to the boy (i'm probably harsh and focused on the other victims who were more removed from the situation).

here are the circular arguments i'm hearing:

- can't blame guns

- can't provide universal health care and mental health treatment

- expect the family to help family members, but can't blame them either

- don't blame the nra

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:25 PM

130. A) As noted upthread, this story is a hoax

B) If my brother murdered my mother and then killed himself after killing 20 children and six other adults, I'd feel victimized as well. This thread is garbage.

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Response to RedCappedBandit (Reply #130)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:43 PM

132. Yeah, but it sure sorted the sheep from the goats

Two quite different basic reactions to the very same piece of "information".



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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #132)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:53 PM

134. I'm embarrassed for DU at some of the responses.

Really hateful stuff, doesn't belong here.

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Response to The Velveteen Ocelot (Reply #134)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:55 PM

141. agreed

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Response to RedCappedBandit (Reply #130)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:25 PM

152. Some sick person did this to create more hate toward Ryan Lanza.

Which appears to be working as planned, even on some here.

It's not as if Ryan Lanza doesn't have enough to be dealing with right now. He also has some freak out stirring up public hate against him. It's a pathetic situation.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:53 PM

135. The truth is, he did lose both his mother and his brother in the massacre

Regardless of the fact that his brother was the murderer, it is still painful. Probably more painful because of the guilt of not knowing whether there was anything he could have done to change the direction of his brother's life. Please have some compassion for him, I cannot even imagine how painful this situation is for him.

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Response to GObamaGO (Reply #135)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 08:56 PM

137. I don't think somebody posting these things and pretending to be him is making him feel any better.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #137)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:02 PM

138. True

It is just awful all around. I cannot find any good in the entire course of events.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 09:59 PM

144. Ryan Lanza IS a victim. . . but ADAM LANZA is NOT

I don't believe in hell, and I'm not wishing anything like that on Adam Lanza. Sick man. Sick act. Too bad he didn't just kill himself and not go to that school. But sick nor not, he's no victim.

Nonetheless, I DO feel sorry for his brother. He's going to have to live with this, just as the other survivors will--for the rest of his life.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:03 PM

146. Well, it's his brother and mother. He's not objective. He may still be in shock, too.

Or .... maybe this is how things get this bad. I've noticed this before on several occasions, when a guy does something really bad like this. His family sticks by him, either insisting he didn't do it (despite hard evidence to the contrary), or making excuses or downgrading what he did. You can see how the guy got that bad, if he had never been held accountable during his life for doing anything bad.

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Response to Honeycombe8 (Reply #146)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:18 PM

149. It's a hoax.

He didn't post any of the things attributed to him.

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Response to LisaL (Reply #149)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:20 PM

151. Oh. What a jerk-y thing for someone to do. That explains the bad grammar. nt

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Response to Honeycombe8 (Reply #151)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:26 PM

154. Sure does.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 10:26 PM

153. s

 

Good on him.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 11:03 PM

157. Ryan is very much a victim.

 

He did lose a mother and brother. I can't imagine the pain he feels. He not only lost a mother and brother, but he has to live with the fact that his brother killed so many innocent people. Children. Tiny defenseless children.

He is wrong that we can't call him names, though. I feel sorrow that his brother ever felt that it was an option to go to an elementary and shoot up tiny defenseless children. But I will deal with it on my own terms. If that means calling the killer a sorry piece of shit, then so be it. It is what it is.

I have lost a sibling, so I have a clue what that is like. I don't have a clue what it is like to lose a sibling in this manner. It can't be easy, and it has to hurt to hear such terrible things about your sibling. Still, people have to deal with it in whatever terms they can. Death of a small child is always the worst, IMO, and when you can focus your blame on someone or something, then it is human nature to do so. Fact is his brother went to a school and shot a bunch of kids and some other people. Was he mentally ill? No doubt. Does that change the hurt people feel? Does that make it somehow easier to focus the blame on an illness rather than him? No. No. and No.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 11:36 PM

160. Hey Ryan--your brother is an inhuman monster and a stinking coward

who shot up a school full of LITTLE KIDS. Mentally ill, yes, but fuck that.

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Response to Arkana (Reply #160)

Sun Dec 23, 2012, 11:50 PM

162. This story is a hoax.

Ryan Lanza didn't post any of these things.

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Response to Arkana (Reply #160)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 01:21 AM

165. And Ryan Lanza did none of it.

Have some empathy and compassion.

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Response to Arkana (Reply #160)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:21 AM

166. Wow, the ugly here just keeps getting uglier

One day, if life chooses to give you a mentally ill child or relative who commits such an abominable act, I hope you remember your lack of empathy for other innocent people in pain and struggling to cope with such a horror.

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Response to HipChick (Original post)

Mon Dec 24, 2012, 10:34 AM

168. Good grief!

This "story" is a load of crap, a hoax, whatever you want to call it.

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