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Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:20 AM

AR-15 In Particular And Guns In General Flying Off The Shelf.

Last edited Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:56 AM - Edit history (1)

We are truly nuts as a nation. Any kind of gun control is going to cause a virtual civil war between pro gun and anti gun constituencies. It ls looking like a vicious political fight to get anything done whatsover.

All AR-15 and assault weapons need to be melted down. They have NO place in civilian hands.

F gun owners who love assault weapons.

74 replies, 6157 views

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Reply AR-15 In Particular And Guns In General Flying Off The Shelf. (Original post)
TheMastersNemesis Dec 2012 OP
doc03 Dec 2012 #1
Lizzie Poppet Dec 2012 #39
ellisonz Dec 2012 #2
TheMastersNemesis Dec 2012 #11
ellisonz Dec 2012 #12
TheMastersNemesis Dec 2012 #21
Tmloft Dec 2012 #17
ellisonz Dec 2012 #25
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #27
Fumesucker Dec 2012 #33
hatrack Dec 2012 #53
SammyWinstonJack Dec 2012 #48
City Lights Dec 2012 #59
The Velveteen Ocelot Dec 2012 #3
Loudly Dec 2012 #4
kelly1mm Dec 2012 #15
Loudly Dec 2012 #32
WastedSaint Dec 2012 #37
Loudly Dec 2012 #43
Bandit Dec 2012 #64
ProgressiveProfessor Dec 2012 #18
Llewlladdwr Dec 2012 #5
Recursion Dec 2012 #6
morningfog Dec 2012 #14
kelly1mm Dec 2012 #16
Recursion Dec 2012 #23
Recursion Dec 2012 #22
Llewlladdwr Dec 2012 #24
AZ Progressive Dec 2012 #7
Tmloft Dec 2012 #20
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #28
WastedSaint Dec 2012 #40
Lizzie Poppet Dec 2012 #41
ElbarDee Dec 2012 #57
AlexSatan Dec 2012 #61
ElbarDee Dec 2012 #62
AlexSatan Dec 2012 #65
ElbarDee Dec 2012 #66
AlexSatan Dec 2012 #67
rl6214 Dec 2012 #45
plethoro Dec 2012 #8
flvegan Dec 2012 #9
Pretzel_Warrior Dec 2012 #10
Flabbergasted Dec 2012 #31
0rganism Dec 2012 #70
julian09 Dec 2012 #13
ellisonz Dec 2012 #26
Warren DeMontague Dec 2012 #19
Recursion Dec 2012 #29
Warren DeMontague Dec 2012 #30
AlexSatan Dec 2012 #50
Fumesucker Dec 2012 #34
Recursion Dec 2012 #35
Fumesucker Dec 2012 #36
Hugabear Dec 2012 #44
OneTenthofOnePercent Dec 2012 #38
WastedSaint Dec 2012 #42
OneTenthofOnePercent Dec 2012 #47
Hoyt Dec 2012 #52
ileus Dec 2012 #54
OneTenthofOnePercent Dec 2012 #63
Paladin Dec 2012 #68
ileus Dec 2012 #72
geek tragedy Dec 2012 #69
Tommy_Carcetti Dec 2012 #71
msongs Dec 2012 #46
SammyWinstonJack Dec 2012 #49
Hoyt Dec 2012 #51
ileus Dec 2012 #55
Hoyt Dec 2012 #60
ileus Dec 2012 #73
Hoyt Dec 2012 #74
Comrade_McKenzie Dec 2012 #56
abelenkpe Dec 2012 #58

Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:23 AM

1. I predict before this week is over all the gun shops will sell out

any gun of that style.

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Response to doc03 (Reply #1)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:50 AM

39. Many of that sort of weapon were ALREADY in very short supply.

Now they'll be almost impossible to find, but not because they're scarce.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:24 AM

2. "Any kind of gun control is going to cause a virtual civil war between pro gun and anti gun"

Let me ask you this in regard to your metaphor: how does a theoretically unarmed "anti gun constituency" fight a war with no gun?

Seems to me like the gun industry has been fighting a war against this nation for over two decades.

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Response to ellisonz (Reply #2)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:36 AM

11. I Am Not Sure What Is Going To Happen ------

What is so sick is that the same AR-15 used in the massacre is flying off the shelves. That fact exposes a particular level of insanity that I have never seen. How can you be so jaded as to love a gun that has killed so many innocents. It is twisted and deranged. This gun control dispute is going to reveal how sick we are as a country.

In the end I do not see anything getting done because the resistance is going to be more fierce than we can imagine based on the reaction I see for even the prospect of debate. Obama's speech has set off a firestorm of resentment.

Chris Matthews on Hardball had this gun wing nut calling for revolution? Tackling the gun issue is going to be a very politically dangerous enterprise. The GOP will exploit it to get power back you can just about count on it. And the Koch's and their ilk will put almost billions into the next election cycle.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Reply #11)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:40 AM

12. I couldn't agree more...

...We're talking about that wing-nut gun scum bag Pratt here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022017504

The power of the GOP/NRA cabal in this regard is overrated.

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Response to ellisonz (Reply #12)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:49 AM

21. I Don't Believe You Can Underestimate The Power Of These People

Even though they may be a minority their voice is a megaphone with the help of hate media and the Koch cabal and its allies.
They are really stirring things up. Between the religious right, hate media, and the gun lobby they are already blaming liberals, lack of religion, secularists, Democrats and Obama for destroying the country. They are whipping the flames of discontent and getting ahead of any debate. The silence of the NRA means they are preparing counter attack on any efforts to discuss the gun issue.

It is becoming obvious that this election did not settle anything. The GOP is bitter and hateful their guy and guys lost and they want revenge on the electorate who voted Obama and Democrats in. Staunch Republicans want the worse for this nation. They will use anyone even the deaths of these children to advance their cause.

I do believe we are moving into a more sectarian attitude in this country like Northern Ireland. It is no longer bipartisan.
Trends tend to evolve slowiy under the radar. My take on the GOP is now ultra extreme and feels it has nothing to lose.
The reaction to the results of this election are still sinking in. Hatred of Obama will be worse now than ever.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Reply #11)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:47 AM

17. The guns used

It was two handguns, not an ar15.

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Response to Tmloft (Reply #17)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:52 AM

25. All of the victims were killed with the .223 Bushmaster AR style carbine.

The handguns were not fired.

Welcome to DU!

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Response to Tmloft (Reply #17)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:53 AM

27. Wrong, it was the Bushmaster

Or are you calling the Coroner and police liars?

NEWTOWN, Conn. -- Adam Lanza used a semiautomatic Bushmaster .223 rifle during his rampage through Sandy Hook Elementary School on Friday, firing dozens of high-velocity rounds as he killed 20 children and six adults, authorities said Sunday.

Lanza, 20, carried "many high-capacity clips" for the lightweight military-style rifle, Lt. Paul Vance, a spokesman for the Connecticut State Police, told The Huffington Post in an email. Two handguns and a shotgun were also recovered at the scene.

The Newtown shooting quickly reignited the national debate over gun control. Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.) pledged on Sunday that she would introduce legislation to reauthorize a federal assault weapons ban passed during the Clinton administration, but allowed to lapse in 2004. Other politicians, like New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg, who leads a national coalition group pushing stricter gun-control measures, also used the shooting to call on President Obama to take immediate action tightening gun laws.

Any move to clamp down on consumer sales of military-style weapons could fall heavily on Bushmaster and its corporate parent, Freedom Group, a private company owned by a New York-based hedge fund, Cerberus Capital Management. According to its 2011 annual report, Freedom Group is the nation's largest manufacturer of military-style semiautomatics, which it calls "modern sporting rifles
."
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/16/school-shooter-adam-lanza_n_2312818.html

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Response to Tmloft (Reply #17)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:40 AM

33. Welcome to DU and please try to keep up



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Response to Tmloft (Reply #17)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 09:43 AM

53. Try following news reports on the massacre, and becoming informed

You'll look less like an asshole, less like a troll and less like a liar.

Have a nice day!

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Reply #11)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 04:59 AM

48. Twisted and deranged=a large portion of the population in this country.

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Response to SammyWinstonJack (Reply #48)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 09:51 AM

59. Sadly, I agree.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:24 AM

3. Isn't that exactly what the NRA, on behalf of the gun manufacturers, wanted?

The gun nuts are just their useful idiots.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:25 AM

4. By executive order, ATF shuts down sales of new units of a whole range of firearms.

 

Who responds to that move, and by what means?

The House of Representatives? By impeachment? After last Friday?

Act now.

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Response to Loudly (Reply #4)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:42 AM

15. A gun shop owner to the Courts asking (and probably receiving) an injunction. There

is very little the President can do on his own via EO. This will need to go through congress.

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Response to kelly1mm (Reply #15)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:35 AM

32. A gun shop owner who would be very uncomfortably famous very quickly.

 

With a lot of potentially unflattering personal information being uncovered about them.

Push, push, appeal, discredit. Now, while public disgust is at flood tide.

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Response to Loudly (Reply #32)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:47 AM

37. Gun store owners are disgusting droogs for the most part. They'd be lining up to be a part of it.

 

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Response to WastedSaint (Reply #37)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:00 AM

43. Consoler-in-Chief versus the Merchants of Death.

 

Just the second term strongman battle the nation needs to force the issue.

Choosing sides and hardening positions in time for the next election campaign.

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Response to kelly1mm (Reply #15)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 03:46 PM

64. Like Andrew Jackson once said, "The Court has made it's decision, now let them back it up"

Actually I probably should not have used quotation marks because it may not be exactly what was said but the jist is the same..

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Response to Loudly (Reply #4)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:47 AM

18. Cannot be done legally, even a Zombie like Shares United would know that

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:26 AM

5. It only makes sense.

These weapons will appreciate in value dramatically if the AWB is re-instated.

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Response to Llewlladdwr (Reply #5)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:27 AM

6. Doubtful. AWB doesn't ban the AR-15

It just means you can't put a bayonet mount on it.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #6)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:42 AM

14. With better drafting, we can ban the AR-15, too.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #14)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:46 AM

16. More importantly, the AWB does not ban the sale, possession, use, or purchase of an ar-15. It

only bans the manufature and import of ar-15's (to use your example). All the stockpiled ar-15's could still be sold, for a rather large profit if the supply of new ar-15's were restricted.

That is what happened in the first AWB.

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Response to kelly1mm (Reply #16)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:50 AM

23. And even then only with a collapsable stock or bayonet lug

If it has only the detachable magazine and uses a traditional stock with no threaded barrel or bayonet lug, it could still be manufactured.

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Response to morningfog (Reply #14)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:49 AM

22. The problem is that's way too many guns

The actual salient characteristics here are "semi automatic weapon that accepts detachable magazines". That's what makes it usable in a mass shooting.

If you want to ban that (or reschedule it under the NFA or whatever) we can certainly try, the reason that's not what the AWB did is because doing that winds up catching way too many guns for it to be politically feasible, and in particular a lot of guns that look much less frightening than the AR-15 despite operating the exact same way. So either you have to grandfather them in (and a ban that grandfathers in a hundred million durable items seems kind of pointless) or you have to figure out a way to take them from people (which is going to be all kinds of problematic).

Once the people working on the 94 ban saw exactly how many guns we were talking about (and that's only gone up since then) they tweaked it to only affect guns that looked like military weapons (and, again, the look doesn't change how they actually operate) because they could sell that (when someone sees an AR-15 they think "that's a deadly assault weapon" despite the fact that it's functionally identical to their grandfather's hunting rifle that they wouldn't want to ban). But the end result was for the manufacturers to weld the stocks and get rid of the bayonet lugs. For that matter Connecticut has an assault weapons ban, and the Bushmaster was legal under it.

Now, you could also simply ban the brand, but somebody else would make the Shrubmaster or whatever in a few weeks.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #6)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:51 AM

24. Maybe. I was around when the original AWB was passed back in 1994.

It definately covered the majority of AR-15 type rifles available at the time since they featured both pistol grips and bayonet lugs. Removing either of these features allowed the weapon to be sold under the ban though and the bayonet lugs tended to be the feature removed since very few people end up fixing bayonets at the range. I remember pre-ban AR-15s that had both features went up in value because of the "cool" factor. Anyway, maybe we'll see, maybe we won't. Christmas is coming and who knows whether the momentum for new legislation will last 'til next year?

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:27 AM

7. Seems that so many American men have small penises

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Response to AZ Progressive (Reply #7)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:48 AM

20. That's a German

Soldier and weapon.

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Response to Tmloft (Reply #20)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:54 AM

28. So

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Response to Tmloft (Reply #20)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:50 AM

40. It's OK, the German MG42 also serves as a penis extenstion for RW Gunner types.

 

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Response to AZ Progressive (Reply #7)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:52 AM

41. Pure comedy gold.

>makes crack about American men and small penises
>posts picture of German

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Response to Lizzie Poppet (Reply #41)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 09:45 AM

57. From a video game I am sure plenty of RW kids have played.

It's part of the entire gun culture that fills this nation.

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Response to ElbarDee (Reply #57)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:18 AM

61. Yes, because only RW kids play violent video games

 

The kids of Democrats only play Hello Kitty: Island Adventure.

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Response to AlexSatan (Reply #61)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:36 PM

62. Just like only RW kids breath air.

Stupid straw man argument.

Only AA kids listen to rap.
Only Asian kids eat Ramen.
Only White kids play hockey.


You assume in my post that I say only RW kids play violent games. I would argue kids that grow up in RW households, surrounded by guns and religion are more prone to buy and play violent video games than those in a progressive household who grow up learning to value love and peace. My kids do not play violent games in my house.

But go on and play with your RW talking points.

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Response to ElbarDee (Reply #62)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 03:49 PM

65. And you base your assumption on what?

 

Nothing. Argue that all you want, but there is nothing to back it up. My guess is there are just as many fundamentalist RW Christians who won't let their kids play violent games as there are progressives who don't.


Take a poll on here. See how many let their kids play violent games.

And you need to define violent games, of course. Do driving games where you can run over little people count? Using older examples, how about games like Mario Cart or Crash Team Racing (with Crash Bandicoot) where you blow up your opponent with missiles or bombs? How about LodeRunner where you trap little guys in holes which are filled in with brick?

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Response to AlexSatan (Reply #65)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 04:02 PM

66. I have gone and read quite a few of your posts here

and they all promote a pro-gun pro-violent game, pro-RW tilt.

"My guess is there are just as many fundamentalist RW Christians who won't let their kids play violent games as there are progressives who don't."

Are you seriously defending these people on a progressive web-site?

Why, yes you are.



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Response to ElbarDee (Reply #66)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 04:14 PM

67. What?

 

Yes, I do support our Constitution as well as logic. I am against any restriction of our freedoms which will have little or no impact on the problems we have. Banning "assault weapons" would have almost no impact. Most of the mass killings have been done with pistols or shotguns.

Banning video games would have little or no effect besides getting some losers out of their mom's basement. But there are lots of folks who use the games for entertainment and do it with no problems. I'm not willing to throw away their (or the game manufacturer's) 1st amendment rights. Personally I don't play but friends of mine do. Probably the biggest gamer I know is a very successful woman with a PhD in engineering.

Which people am I supposedly defending? Fundamentalist RWers who won't let their kids play violent games? Certainly not. In my day, those kids could not watch Road Runner or Tom and Jerry. And I pitied them.

And I defending gamers? Sure. Just as I do those who eat junk food yet are responsible enough to not be obese.

For a progressive, it sure seem like you think people have too many rights in several areas.

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Response to AZ Progressive (Reply #7)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:22 AM

45. Juvenile post

 

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:28 AM

8. I believe gun ownership will increase vastly because of the talk

 

of banning them. Their prices will go up because they'll have to be snuck in and sales will be private done in person at a person's house by prearrangement. When Obama was elected President half my street bought more guns, which is strange because most claimed they voted for Obama. I've never seen an AR-15. I keep one gun in case someone breaks in the house.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:28 AM

9. Did you just say "F(uck) gun owners"?

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:32 AM

10. So actually....NRA blocking any meaningful reform is good for business. The more outrageous the kill

 

The more vehement regular people protest the status quo, the more the crazies decide now is the time to stock up. Very, very sick and amoral. Worse than tobacco lobbyists in some ways.

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Response to Pretzel_Warrior (Reply #10)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:08 AM

31. Yep except extend it....people buy more guns resulting in a higher incidence of massacres which

makes people scream about gun control, which makes people buy more guns, which leads to a higher incidence of massacres, which makes people scream about gun control, which makes people buy more guns, which leads to a higher incidence of massacres,

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Response to Flabbergasted (Reply #31)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 04:59 PM

70. taken to its steamy illogical conclusion, everyone has infinite guns and everyone's dead

in practice, gun nuts eventually buy all the guns and ammo they can afford and we have a massacre+small arms shopping spree every week.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:40 AM

13. How many guns can they shoot at a time?

 

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Response to julian09 (Reply #13)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:53 AM

26. It's not about shooting.

It's about having. Like children and toys.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:47 AM

19. All the more reason to pass a Federal law outlawing not just their sale, but their possession.

Just sayin.

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Response to Warren DeMontague (Reply #19)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 12:57 AM

29. And the tens of millions of AR-15s currently in people's gun safes?

What's the plan there?

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Response to Recursion (Reply #29)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:07 AM

30. I guess we'll burn that bridge when we come to it, won't we.

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Response to Warren DeMontague (Reply #30)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 09:32 AM

50. Yeah, no sense in planning ahead

 

or fully thinking things through!

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Response to Recursion (Reply #29)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:44 AM

34. Are there no foundries, are there no blast furnaces? n/t

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Response to Fumesucker (Reply #34)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:45 AM

35. Are there people willing to go door to door and search for them? (nt)

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Response to Recursion (Reply #35)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:46 AM

36. Ask David Koresh

ETA: And whole lot of Iraqis and Afghans.

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Response to Recursion (Reply #29)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:14 AM

44. Confiscate them.

I'm not talking about door-to-door searches. But if somehow you are found with an AR-15 in your possession, then it gets confiscated immediately.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:49 AM

38. You're telling me! I went to get about 15 hicap rifle mags before prices got too bad...

 

I just wanted a few more mags to stock up in the even they get regulated. Not only was I too late, they are virtually sold out everywhere too. No FAL, AK or AR mags anywhere to be found and they are marked up 50% wherever I did find them! UUggghh. I also noticed everywhere is sold out of actual sporting rifles and receivers.

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Response to OneTenthofOnePercent (Reply #38)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:53 AM

42. I'm very sorry that you weren't able to buy more MurderMags before the NRA types got to them.

 

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Response to WastedSaint (Reply #42)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 04:49 AM

47. Just found some on Midway USA... decent prices too!

 

I only got 8 mags though.

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Response to OneTenthofOnePercent (Reply #47)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 09:41 AM

52. Snap em up and celebrate.

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Response to OneTenthofOnePercent (Reply #47)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 09:44 AM

54. Limit 2 per type.

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Response to ileus (Reply #54)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:51 PM

63. I just made 4 different orders.

 

Yeah, you pay shipping 4 times, but shiping was reasonable and the prices weren't hyperinflated.

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Response to OneTenthofOnePercent (Reply #63)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 04:50 PM

68. How Nice For You.

Why don't you name each of those new magazines after a child murdered at the Connecticut elementary school? Sure to be a hit with your friends at the rifle range.....

(Dark Sarcasm Alert, for those in need....)

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Response to OneTenthofOnePercent (Reply #63)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 06:04 PM

72. Have you checked out pmag prices a CTD?

They upped their prices on non windowed ones to 59 bucks...

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Response to OneTenthofOnePercent (Reply #38)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 04:53 PM

69. Ugh, gun nuts. nt

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Response to OneTenthofOnePercent (Reply #38)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 05:19 PM

71. The entire town of Newtown, CT just shed a single collective tear for you.

Last edited Tue Dec 18, 2012, 06:01 PM - Edit history (1)

I pray to God that this is satire.

Even if it is satire, though, it's pretty shitty satire.

And judging on your past posting history, I don't think it is satire.

Which simply means you come off as a shitty human being. Congratulations.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:25 AM

46. nothing sells better than a pro gun ad featuring 20 dead children nt

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Response to msongs (Reply #46)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 05:06 AM

49. This is one sick country.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 09:40 AM

51. Personally, anyone who would buy a gun just days after Friday, should be deemed unfit to own guns.


Although a Catch-22, I've long felt that anyone who drools over these type weapons should be prevented from acquiring them.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #51)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 09:44 AM

55. You know those basers.

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Response to ileus (Reply #55)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 09:56 AM

60. Yes, I know you guys well. How many of these type weapons do you currently own?



You are one of prime examples. You love to post in gungeon of your latest lethal weapons purchases.

Enjoy your guns.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #60)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 06:05 PM

73. None of my firearms are lethal.

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Response to ileus (Reply #73)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 07:26 PM

74. Usual crud from gungeon elite. Enjoy your guns.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 09:45 AM

56. How long until mass shootings are perpetrated by nuts fearing a loss of their 2A? nt

 

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 09:48 AM

58. The people buying guns now

Are the people who buy guns because they fear the government. AKA insane gun nuts. Unstable paranoid people most likely to live in a home with doomsday preppers, or some such other nonsense. Thus perpetuates the cycle of violence.

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