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DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » I'm NOT truly advocating ...

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 07:36 PM

Star Member phylny (2,855 posts)

I'm NOT truly advocating this, but imagine how much louder the outcry would be for gun control

and how much more horrified Americans would be if we actually saw the carnage the gunman caused on Friday? If our lawmakers were made to vote on gun control measures after viewing pictures of the victims, of the hallways and classrooms? If we knew that they saw it and refused to budge, even after seeing?

Again, I cannot even begin to imagine what the children, teachers, and first responders witnessed, but we lived in a sanitized world. At this point, I'd do anything I could to make our politicians, the assholes at the NRA, and our gun toting, Rambo-wannabee fellow citizens wake up and realize what they've done with their refusal to be reasonable.

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Arrow 37 replies Author Time Post
Reply I'm NOT truly advocating this, but imagine how much louder the outcry would be for gun control (Original post)
 phylny Dec 2012 OP
LineReply Can't do that though, (as much as I would like to see it) the parents would also be subjected
 teddy51 Dec 2012 #1
LineLineReply Yes, I understand and agree.
 phylny Dec 2012 #3
LineLineLineReply They took the pictures for parents
 nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #5
LineLineLineLineReply They took pictures for the parents? What insight do you have into that, exactly?
 TheManInTheMac Dec 2012 #12
LineLineLineLineLineReply Standard procedure at a grisly scene. The OP
 nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #15
LineLineLineLineLineLineReply OK. Thanks; I didn't know that.
 TheManInTheMac Dec 2012 #20
LineReply True.
 MrSlayer Dec 2012 #2
LineLineReply problem: the "Arm the teachers" contingent
 0rganism Dec 2012 #14
LineReply We had that exact discussion at the paper last night
 nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #4
LineReply They should send photos to the leadership of the NRA
 malaise Dec 2012 #6
LineReply Those gory films of auto wrecks sure had an impact when learning to drive.
 Hoyt Dec 2012 #7
LineLineNew Reply My son told me that don't show them anymore
 LeftInTX Dec 2012 #37
LineReply I whole heartedly agree!
 proud2BlibKansan Dec 2012 #8
LineReply It would stop working after awhile
 IDoMath Dec 2012 #9
LineReply How about showing the carnage US drones make under command of the Commander in Chief? And people
 jody Dec 2012 #10
LineLineReply You must have had a really, really really bad day
 2ndAmForComputers Dec 2012 #24
LineLineLineReply Considering that Obama and Mittens pretty much agreed on drone policy...
 dairydog91 Dec 2012 #26
LineReply I disagree. In this case, the smiling faces of the kids will do more.
 jerseyjack Dec 2012 #11
LineReply Binders of bloody shredded bodies
 SoCalDem Dec 2012 #13
LineReply Can you imagine being a parent of one of these kids, and having to live this horrible
 teddy51 Dec 2012 #16
LineLineReply Hopefully they're not paying attention to the media
 DearHeart Dec 2012 #18
LineReply The constituents NEED to inundate them with faxes, emails, and phone calls telling them that we want
 DearHeart Dec 2012 #17
LineReply there were pictures only congress was allowed to view back in bush era
 orleans Dec 2012 #19
LineLineReply That was Abu Ghraib n/t
 Fumesucker Dec 2012 #25
LineLineReply Torture at Abu Ghraib
 nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #27
LineLineLineNew Reply yes--that's right. i remember now. thanks. n/t
 orleans Dec 2012 #34
LineReply WTF!
 HappyMe Dec 2012 #21
LineReply Horrible, disgusting idea. Seeing the photos of the smiling kids when they were still alive,
 Nye Bevan Dec 2012 #22
LineLineNew Reply no, *we* don't need to see that. i know i certainly don't. but maybe congress does
 orleans Dec 2012 #36
LineReply Besides the lack of consideration for the victims families, it might not have the effect you desire.
 still_one Dec 2012 #23
LineNew Reply Pro-Life tactic
 JustABozoOnThisBus Dec 2012 #28
LineLineNew Reply You mean, Anti-Choice tactic.
 2ndAmForComputers Dec 2012 #31
LineLineLineNew Reply You say "potato" ...
 JustABozoOnThisBus Dec 2012 #32
LineNew Reply Well, after WWII, the allies forced the German citizens of the towns that
 Cleita Dec 2012 #29
LineNew Reply What is someone shot up the NRA Headquarters? (not that I'm encouraging anyone)
 JPZenger Dec 2012 #30
LineLineNew Reply Not all here would mourn. nt
 JustABozoOnThisBus Dec 2012 #33
LineNew Reply It took the photo of a little Vietnamese girl, naked and burning with napalm to end the Vietnam War.
 libdem4life Dec 2012 #35

Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 07:37 PM

Star Member teddy51 (3,491 posts)

1. Can't do that though, (as much as I would like to see it) the parents would also be subjected

 

to this as well.

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Response to teddy51 (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 07:40 PM

Star Member phylny (2,855 posts)

3. Yes, I understand and agree.

Last edited Mon Dec 17, 2012, 07:41 PM USA/ET - Edit history (1)

I believe I read or heard that parents were shown pictures, not the bodies, to identify their children.

I'm sure the pictures were cleaned up somehow. I simply cannot imagine. Or I can imagine, and it is terrifying to do so.

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Response to phylny (Reply #3)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 07:42 PM

nadinbrzezinski (120,136 posts)

5. They took the pictures for parents

After they cleaned the bodies as much as possible.

I got insight into that.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #5)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 08:35 PM

TheManInTheMac (924 posts)

12. They took pictures for the parents? What insight do you have into that, exactly?

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Response to TheManInTheMac (Reply #12)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 08:41 PM

nadinbrzezinski (120,136 posts)

15. Standard procedure at a grisly scene. The OP

Said they showed parents photos for identification. This is what is done...you wash the body, remove as much of the blood and gore. You are trying to protect them from the worst of it.

In an ER setting you also remove breathing tubes and IV. I'm talking protocols.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #15)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:11 AM

TheManInTheMac (924 posts)

20. OK. Thanks; I didn't know that.

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 07:39 PM

Star Member MrSlayer (21,312 posts)

2. True.

They really should show the pictures of the aftermath. You want to move some people? That's the way to do it.

At the very least, show them to the congress. Force them to view the pictures before voting on a control measure.

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Response to MrSlayer (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 08:39 PM

Star Member 0rganism (16,915 posts)

14. problem: the "Arm the teachers" contingent

There's a fairly large portion of the legislature and the public who appear to believe that the answer to gun violence is more guns, guns for everyone. Showing such pictures might only reinforce that viewpoint.

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 07:41 PM

nadinbrzezinski (120,136 posts)

4. We had that exact discussion at the paper last night

I grew up in another country where these photos, or at least the bloody sheets, regularly run.

We don't do it out of respect for the families, and I get it...but I believe we need to stop sanitizing it.

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 07:43 PM

Star Member malaise (105,918 posts)

6. They should send photos to the leadership of the NRA

Fuggers

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 07:43 PM

Star Member Hoyt (12,089 posts)

7. Those gory films of auto wrecks sure had an impact when learning to drive.

Not saying I never drove dangerously, but burnt people were always in the back of my mind.

One reason I'm against NRA certified instructors teaching gun safety, they ain't real enough.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #7)

Wed Dec 19, 2012, 12:04 AM

LeftInTX (2,180 posts)

37. My son told me that don't show them anymore

I remember this horrible fire safety movie. I was convinced smoldering cigarette butts were the worse thing on earth, until I saw the syphilis movie.

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 07:44 PM

Star Member proud2BlibKansan (96,356 posts)

8. I whole heartedly agree!

How about just showing the pictures too Congress?

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 07:49 PM

IDoMath (404 posts)

9. It would stop working after awhile

 

I didn't believe that media violence was a problem until I watched the planes fly into the World Trade Center and realized that my own reaction was "Cool effect." It took me several minutes to really process that real people had been involved. All due to the fact that I was watching it on television.

In contrast, when I've experienced violence and trauma of others in real life, the reality is undeniable and leaves scars on the psyche.

While I agree we live in a sanitized world and that needs to be fixed somehow, the TV creates an unreality filter to all we see and hear.

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 08:01 PM

Star Member jody (26,624 posts)

10. How about showing the carnage US drones make under command of the Commander in Chief? And people

 

wonder why most people in the Middle East hate the United States!

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Response to jody (Reply #10)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:36 AM

2ndAmForComputers (3,307 posts)

24. You must have had a really, really really bad day

41 days ago.

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Response to 2ndAmForComputers (Reply #24)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:16 AM

dairydog91 (765 posts)

26. Considering that Obama and Mittens pretty much agreed on drone policy...

It's probably more just a sense of despair at how Americans from both parties are so cheerily oblivious to the several hundred children who've been turned into Kiddee Puree by America's lovely drones.

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 08:11 PM

Star Member jerseyjack (1,361 posts)

11. I disagree. In this case, the smiling faces of the kids will do more.

 

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 08:37 PM

Star Member SoCalDem (99,661 posts)

13. Binders of bloody shredded bodies

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022014847

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:33 PM

Star Member teddy51 (3,491 posts)

16. Can you imagine being a parent of one of these kids, and having to live this horrible

 

nightmare over and over again while media continues to show these pictures?

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Response to teddy51 (Reply #16)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:58 PM

DearHeart (672 posts)

18. Hopefully they're not paying attention to the media

I can't even imagine what horror these parents are going through!! I don't have children and I thank God for that now! I could never go through something like this and not lose my mind!!

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Mon Dec 17, 2012, 09:51 PM

DearHeart (672 posts)

17. The constituents NEED to inundate them with faxes, emails, and phone calls telling them that we want

I truly hoping that people have finally woken up...granted, not the gun-lovers, but the rest of the country! I don't want any more CHILDREN OR ADULTS to die in another massacre! I don't want any more parents, siblings, grandparents, friends to have their loved ones ripped from their lives for no reason!!

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 02:08 AM

orleans (21,693 posts)

19. there were pictures only congress was allowed to view back in bush era

--can't remember what they were of...
was it katrina? 9/11? some part of the war?
damn.
can't remember -- but the pics were supposedly very powerful & disturbing (too disturbing for us of course so they were not released publicly)

so yes--i think it is a GREAT idea to have them view what happened at that school.

let them be haunted by the knowledge that this is where their inaction has lead us and be haunted by the knowledge that if they don't do something to change these laws it could happen all over again

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Response to orleans (Reply #19)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:42 AM

Fumesucker (31,551 posts)

25. That was Abu Ghraib n/t

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Response to orleans (Reply #19)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:42 AM

nadinbrzezinski (120,136 posts)

27. Torture at Abu Ghraib

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #27)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:30 PM

orleans (21,693 posts)

34. yes--that's right. i remember now. thanks. n/t

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:16 AM

Star Member HappyMe (11,702 posts)

21. WTF!

NO!

Ridiculous and what about people grieving....using the bodies of dead children to forward a political point is the most heartless idea.

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:21 AM

Star Member Nye Bevan (10,773 posts)

22. Horrible, disgusting idea. Seeing the photos of the smiling kids when they were still alive,

who are now gone, and the faces of their grieving parents, is enough.

We don't need to see mangled and bloody intestines, shattered bones, and brains.

Please self-delete.

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Response to Nye Bevan (Reply #22)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:43 PM

orleans (21,693 posts)

36. no, *we* don't need to see that. i know i certainly don't. but maybe congress does

so they can put everything into context when they vote to protect or not protect children & adults

our government had photos and booklets of the devastation and piles of bodies at the concentration camps that weren't for public viewing. (i know because my father worked on these booklets when he was in the army and brought one home with him that i found when i was seven years old!)

same thing with the abu ghraib photos we never saw but congress did.

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 10:31 AM

Star Member still_one (31,073 posts)

23. Besides the lack of consideration for the victims families, it might not have the effect you desire.

Those who advocate assault weapons and increased magazines, would say it justifies more proliferation.

A far more effective course is showing pictures of the beautiful children and people taken away in their prime

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:44 AM

Star Member JustABozoOnThisBus (9,913 posts)

28. Pro-Life tactic

We don't like it when women are forced to look at images before abortions. We shouldn't advocate the same thing when it suits our agenda.

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Response to JustABozoOnThisBus (Reply #28)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 01:37 PM

2ndAmForComputers (3,307 posts)

31. You mean, Anti-Choice tactic.

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Response to 2ndAmForComputers (Reply #31)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 04:03 PM

Star Member JustABozoOnThisBus (9,913 posts)

32. You say "potato" ...

... I say teabagging thug.

But yes, anti-choice (for 99%ers - the 1% will "dash to Paris on a shopping trip")

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:45 AM

Cleita (64,444 posts)

29. Well, after WWII, the allies forced the German citizens of the towns that

Last edited Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:47 AM USA/ET - Edit history (2)

held concentration camps to tour those camps and view firsthand the atrocities committed there so they no longer could deny that they knew anything about it. Maybe a tour and power point presentation should be in order for NRA members and the executives of gun manufacturers in order to get a business license and should be mandatory viewing as part of getting a newly purchased gun registered.

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:46 AM

JPZenger (5,637 posts)

30. What is someone shot up the NRA Headquarters? (not that I'm encouraging anyone)

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Response to JPZenger (Reply #30)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 04:04 PM

Star Member JustABozoOnThisBus (9,913 posts)

33. Not all here would mourn. nt

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Response to phylny (Original post)

Tue Dec 18, 2012, 11:37 PM

Star Member libdem4life (1,783 posts)

35. It took the photo of a little Vietnamese girl, naked and burning with napalm to end the Vietnam War.

That photo is etched in my memory. At the time, I believed that it was the approved vehicle to end the war. Even so, it succeeded. But she survived...and lived to tell the story.

Perhaps it's time, this time for the dead to speak. RIP little ones.

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