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Tue Dec 11, 2012, 07:38 AM

Hypothetical, would you support raising the threshold for tax hikes for the rich?

Let me preface this with: Fuck the GOP. They don't deserve a damned thing in this negotiation nor do the filthy rich. Now with that said, say we did this.

Raise the threshold for the tax cut extensions. The poor and middle class keep their extension and we raise the tax rate from 34.5 to 39% on people making over $500k rather than $250k. In exchange we don't make further cuts to SS and Medicare and get another 2 year Unemployment extension. I think the $500k would completely cut out their one media talking point that they parrot which is $250k would cripple small business owners. $500k would be much harder to make that argument about.

Now, say we had to do that or even lifting it to the $750k-$1 million threshold, that would still take a rather large chunk back in taxes from the top 2%. We can also make sure we close those loopholes the GOP claims to want to close. You know act like we're co-opting their ideas in a "compromise".

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Reply Hypothetical, would you support raising the threshold for tax hikes for the rich? (Original post)
MessiahRp Dec 2012 OP
hobbit709 Dec 2012 #1
Warren Stupidity Dec 2012 #2
MessiahRp Dec 2012 #5
Warren Stupidity Dec 2012 #6
MessiahRp Dec 2012 #9
Warren Stupidity Dec 2012 #10
MessiahRp Dec 2012 #13
Warren Stupidity Dec 2012 #17
MessiahRp Dec 2012 #21
ProSense Dec 2012 #7
MessiahRp Dec 2012 #8
ProSense Dec 2012 #18
MessiahRp Dec 2012 #20
ProSense Dec 2012 #23
Coyotl Dec 2012 #3
newfie11 Dec 2012 #4
Johonny Dec 2012 #11
lightcameron Dec 2012 #12
bemildred Dec 2012 #14
Xyzse Dec 2012 #15
democrattotheend Dec 2012 #16
Ikonoklast Dec 2012 #19
ohnoyoudidnt Dec 2012 #22

Response to MessiahRp (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 07:41 AM

1. The bastards would still howl about 500K

that 250K has nothing to do with small business and they know it. But they never let facts get in the way of their fear mongering.

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Response to MessiahRp (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 07:47 AM

2. No. We had a fucking election and this issue was clearly stated.

Our side won. We voted for the candidate who clearly stated that taxes would go up for those making 250,000.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #2)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:34 AM

5. While that is all well and good...

The GOP still runs the House and have the media in their pocket. We can say "We won!" all day long but all it's going to end up doing is hurting the Unemployed who run out of benefits on Dec. 29th.

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Response to MessiahRp (Reply #5)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:54 AM

6. They are the ones that need to make concessions.

The Fiscal Bluff is bullshit. Their precious tax cuts for billionaires expire Jan 1. For once all of us need to stand together and just say no.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #6)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:02 AM

9. Yeah so fuck the unemployed.

They can go live on the streets or starve/freeze to death right?

This is a high level of incompetence to this theory.

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Response to MessiahRp (Reply #9)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 11:06 AM

10. And there it is, the endless excuses for why we should give in.

How about we try something different?

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #10)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:43 PM

13. It must be nice to live in your White Castle

where losing unemployment benefits won't completely cripple your family.

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Response to MessiahRp (Reply #13)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:02 PM

17. Concede first, make excuses later.

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Response to Warren Stupidity (Reply #17)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:48 PM

21. Again your responses and lack of empathy toward the poor show what kind of "Democrat" you are.

Sickening, really.

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Response to MessiahRp (Reply #5)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:57 AM

7. Boehner is boxed in.

"The GOP still runs the House and have the media in their pocket. "

Besides polls showing that Americans would blame Republicans, the President made a very high-profile and sensible proposal (http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021914963). He also supports the already passed Senate bill.

Boehner has three choices:

1) Accept the President's proposal with "dividends to be taxed as ordinary income" and the "estate tax to be levied at 45 percent on inheritances over $3.5 million."

2) Pass the Senate bill, "which currently taxes inheritances over $5 million at 35 percent," but excludes Obama's dividend proposal.

3) Go over the cliff when "the estate tax is scheduled to rise to 55 percent beginning with inheritances exceeding $1 million."

In each case, the tax cuts for the rich end.

Unemployment benefits can be negotiated separately. This is not the same situation as the end of 2010 when extended benefits were a big issue.

Social Security should not be part of any deficit discussion. It has nothing to do with the deficit.

Are talks between Obama and Boehner already breaking down?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021956768

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Response to ProSense (Reply #7)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:01 AM

8. Unemployment will not be negotiated separately.

You should know better. The GOP will use their control of the House to fight back against Dems. First if they have no choice, as you believe, but to cut a deal you better believe that if they don't get what they want in the Fiscal Cliff deal they're going to take it out on the "lazy unemployed". If UE isn't covered in the fiscal cliff negotiations it may be held up completely depending on what the GOP gets out of this other deal.

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Response to MessiahRp (Reply #8)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:10 PM

18. Yes, it will be.

After January 1, the tax cuts for the rich will cease to exist.

That is what Republicans fear most.

Mitch McConnell demands Democrats negotiate with themselves
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021961718

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Response to ProSense (Reply #18)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:46 PM

20. The GOP tied previous UE extensions to getting what they wanted in economic deals

How naive does one have to be to believe they won't do it again?

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Response to MessiahRp (Reply #20)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:54 PM

23. You're ignoring that the situation is much different now.

It will be even more different on January 1.

Just thinking about it...



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Response to MessiahRp (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 07:49 AM

3. Cap deductions. Why do the ubber-rich get massive deductions, more than the average Jane makes?

This change will really alter the deficit equation. There are mortgages on second mansions that are written off income taxes. Not fair. Place limits on itemized deductions per person/household.

Close the "I'm Rich" loopholes.

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Response to MessiahRp (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:42 AM

4. no!

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Response to MessiahRp (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:11 PM

11. yeah probably

If moving from 250 K to a million ended talk about social security and medicare and got unemployment benefits extended then I don't think it would be a horrible compromise by Democrats. There is no way to support such a move if paid benefits were also compromised.

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Response to MessiahRp (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:05 PM

12. I'd say 35% at $500k and 37% at $750k.

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Response to MessiahRp (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:46 PM

14. No deals! Why should we give then a nickel? They are wrong. They lost. nt

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Response to MessiahRp (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:47 PM

15. I wouldn't mind if you change the threshold to 500K.

I don't mind either or.

I don't even mind if all tax cuts expire. Though I prefer if it only goes up at greater than 250K.

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Response to MessiahRp (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:47 PM

16. In theory, I would take that deal

And I would be even happier if they went to 37% for people making over $250k but over 40% for income over $1 million, including unearned income.

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Response to MessiahRp (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:23 PM

19. No. They have almost zero leverage in this.

The Republicans put themselves in a box, and the lid is being closed on them, one day at a time.

It is up to them to make it stop from closing, but not up to us to help them in any way.

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Response to MessiahRp (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:51 PM

22. I would support leaving income tax levels exactly where they are

if we can tax capital gains as income.

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