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Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:39 PM

WEAR YOUR SEAT BELT. NO EXCEPTIONS, GODDAMMIT.

I plan to be a pain in the ass about this to everyone I know for the rest of my life. Which thankfully has been extended due to a seat belt.

Saturday evening my car, a Pontiac Vibe, got rammed from behind by another driver in a heavy duty pickup truck. (A “RAM” truck, not coincidentally.) My car rolled across lanes of traffic, and landed on its roof in the center strip between the northbound and southbound lanes.

I was suspended upside down, held in place by – you guessed it – my seat belt. I reached down and turned off the ignition, which released the door locks. Then I unbuckled my seat belt, lowered myself down, and crawled out the passenger side door.

If I hadn’t worn my seat belt I would not be posting this today. I want to state that again: If I hadn’t worn my seat belt I would not be posting this today.

WEAR YOUR SEAT BELT. EVERY GODDAMNED TIME YOU GET INTO A VEHICLE. NO EXCEPTIONS, GODDAMMIT. The next time I hear some douche-canoe claim that not wearing a seat belt is “a matter of personal choice” or “a victimless crime” or “a blow against the Nanny State” – - I will personally kick that douche-canoe’s sorry loser ass into next week, find him or her next Tuesday, and kick his or her sorry loser ass again.

That is all.

312 replies, 22693 views

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Reply WEAR YOUR SEAT BELT. NO EXCEPTIONS, GODDAMMIT. (Original post)
mac56 Dec 2012 OP
Terra Alta Dec 2012 #1
mac56 Dec 2012 #3
roguevalley Dec 2012 #131
kracer20 Dec 2012 #215
kiva Dec 2012 #292
SharonAnn Dec 2012 #305
Terra Alta Dec 2012 #310
mac56 Dec 2012 #311
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #2
mac56 Dec 2012 #4
teddy51 Dec 2012 #10
mac56 Dec 2012 #12
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #98
mac56 Dec 2012 #100
freshwest Dec 2012 #193
Raine1967 Dec 2012 #206
freshwest Dec 2012 #218
mac56 Dec 2012 #300
freshwest Dec 2012 #301
Skittles Dec 2012 #66
mac56 Dec 2012 #71
Aerows Dec 2012 #242
Cracklin Charlie Dec 2012 #103
mac56 Dec 2012 #104
shanti Dec 2012 #5
mac56 Dec 2012 #8
teddy51 Dec 2012 #6
mac56 Dec 2012 #9
niyad Dec 2012 #7
mac56 Dec 2012 #11
pkdu Dec 2012 #13
mac56 Dec 2012 #16
dflprincess Dec 2012 #32
mac56 Dec 2012 #35
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mac56 Dec 2012 #53
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hrmjustin Dec 2012 #19
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mac56 Dec 2012 #21
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Care Acutely Dec 2012 #231
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Fumesucker Dec 2012 #289
CaliforniaPeggy Dec 2012 #20
mac56 Dec 2012 #22
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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:42 PM

1. I put my seat belt on every time I get into a vehicle.

It's automatic for me; I do it without even thinking about it. If I weren't wearing a seat belt, I'd feel naked.

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Response to Terra Alta (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:44 PM

3. good

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Response to mac56 (Reply #3)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:20 AM

131. we had a wreck up here yesterday I believe and two dies, one injured.

the two died didn't have seat belts. the one who did lives

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Response to roguevalley (Reply #131)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:25 PM

215. Local paramedic friend of mine said she has never unbuckled a dead body n/t

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Response to kracer20 (Reply #215)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 11:19 PM

292. Sister on the show Rosanne said this to her nieces.

The smartass one said "What, you just leave the dead ones buckled in?"

That said, I always buckle my seatbelt and do not let anyone in my car ride unbuckled.

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Response to Terra Alta (Reply #1)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 03:24 PM

305. My cousin was killed last Thursday "wasn't wearing a seat belt."

Driving a big Ram pickup truck, he went off the road at night and wasn't found till daybreak.

I don't know the details yet, but I thought, "WTF? Not wearing a seat belt?" How horrible for his wife and 4 children to know that detail.

My mother died in a car accident on an Interstate years ago and was wearing a seat belt. The car was hit by a semi, spun around, flipped over and landed on its roof. She was killed instantly. Probably one of the very few who were unbuckled after they died in an accident. It may seem silly, but we felt some comfort knowing that she tried to do the things to protect herself.

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Response to SharonAnn (Reply #305)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 05:05 PM

310. sorry about your cousin.

My thoughts go out to his family.

I can't think of any good reason why anyone wouldn't wear a seat belt. It saves lives, people.

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Response to SharonAnn (Reply #305)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 05:20 PM

311. That's terrible. I am so sorry.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:43 PM

2. I take it a step further

You refuse to put it on, you do nor ride with me.

Yup, that easy.

Oh and good luck with the insurance company...

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:44 PM

4. Word to the herd.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:47 PM

10. In many areas it is the responsibility of the driver to make sure all in the car are belted

 

in and the driver can be charged.

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Response to teddy51 (Reply #10)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:48 PM

12. I endorse that.

It's always been the policy in my car, and sure as hell it's gonna stay that way.

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Response to teddy51 (Reply #10)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:55 PM

98. Can we make this national?

I learned that from mom though... that is her policy to this day...

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #98)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:57 PM

100. I can get behind that.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #98)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:31 PM

193. There are still states where that isn't the law? Bet they're the 'pro-life' states, too.

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Response to freshwest (Reply #193)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:57 PM

206. Unless the law has changed since I left Georgia 3 years ago

You can legally drive a pick up truck and not wear a seatbelt. The sponsor of the bill (can't remember the name) has that put into the seatbelt law because he didn't want to have to wear it in his truck.

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Response to Raine1967 (Reply #206)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:39 PM

218. I can understand that with a farm truck, low speed, in the field, getting in and out...

Sounds as if that was in traffic, too. I'm not sure what the reason not to wear a seatbelt in a car in traffic would be. I used to hear that if the car got into water they might drown. Mostly, it's the rebels without a cause thing. I'll bet he was cheered for protecting their free-dumbs!

People who fought helmet laws won the case to not wear them. The argument for the bike helmet was they'd end up brain damaged and be taking up public money, so that it was a public matter. It didn't matter to those who opposed wearing them. Some doctors called the guys who refused wear helmets 'organ donors.'

I thought it was cold, but after a while, you just say, 'Meh.'

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Response to freshwest (Reply #218)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 02:32 PM

300. "I don't need no brain-bucket! I got brains to spare!"

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Response to mac56 (Reply #300)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 02:46 PM

301. Hehehe. Yep, sometimes all you can do is just say 'Meh.'

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:27 PM

66. I do that too

I also refuse to talk to people who call me on a cell phone while driving

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Response to Skittles (Reply #66)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:30 PM

71. amen, Skittles

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Response to Skittles (Reply #66)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:02 PM

242. Yep, and cell phones

Every single time I or a family member has been in an auto accident in the last decade, the person that hit them was talking on a cell phone.

People should shut the hell up, get where they are going and pay attention to the road. I cannot reinforce that strongly enough.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #2)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:03 AM

103. Same here.

Car does not move until all riders seat belts are fastened. No exceptions.

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Response to Cracklin Charlie (Reply #103)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:03 AM

104. right on CC

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:45 PM

5. as the survivor of a head-on collision

38 years ago (and no seat belt), i totally agree!! glad you made it out ok

did your airbag go off?

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Response to shanti (Reply #5)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:46 PM

8. No, it didn't.

Never had a car with airbags before. I suspect it was because the initial impact was from behind, and the subsequent ones were from rolling horizontally.

Thanks, by the way.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:46 PM

6. Glad your ok, and an excellent post. No excuse in this day and age for not wearing a seat

 

belt. This has been the law in most States for years, as well as many other countries.

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Response to teddy51 (Reply #6)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:47 PM

9. Thanks.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:46 PM

7. glad you are here to post this message--, and, as nadin said, good luck with the insurance co.

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Response to niyad (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:47 PM

11. Appreciated.

So far the insurance company has been excellent to deal with.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:51 PM

13. Gota be honest...sometimes it takes the , ding,ding,ding as back i down the driveway...

But I always don't. What State you in , apparently fellow xpat?

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Response to pkdu (Reply #13)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:52 PM

16. Minnesota

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Response to mac56 (Reply #16)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:59 PM

32. Did your accident happen after the snow started?

I swear I always wind up with a huge pick up on my tail when it's slippery.

(And really glad you're okay - you should be the poster child for seatbelts)

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Response to dflprincess (Reply #32)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:01 PM

35. Amazingly, no.

I'm up in East Central MN and the snow didn't start til after midnight.

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Response to dflprincess (Reply #32)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:59 AM

178. It seems those trucks are the least able to stop and the most likely

to be riding with the front bumper on my Obama sticker. Had one of those last night on my way home in the snowy Wisco night. Kept slowing down, down, down hoping he would pass and to lessen the impact if he did hit me. 6 miles. Never passed, then whizzed past me in the next town in a 25 mph zone.

Seatbelts. Every time. Every ride.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #16)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:06 PM

41. So Cal here...you can understand my total cognitive dissonance about waking up with Palm Trees and

Sunshine everyday ....I could give a crap if I see a snowflake ever again! (says the guy who grew up in Aberdeen)

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Response to pkdu (Reply #41)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:19 PM

53. Indeed.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:51 PM

14. I always do.

 

Always.

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Response to FruitHoops (Reply #14)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:53 PM

18. Don't stop.

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Response to FruitHoops (Reply #14)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:53 PM

19. Welcome to DU and I hope you enjoy the site.

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Response to FruitHoops (Reply #14)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:22 AM

119. Welcome to DU, FruitHoops! n/t

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:51 PM

15. Yikes!

I'm glad you are ok! That must have been so scary!

I always wear my seat belt.

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Response to RiffRandell (Reply #15)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:53 PM

21. good!

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:52 PM

17. PLEASE Listen to this OP...This is very important and don't talk....

on you cell phone holding it up to your ear with one hand or text while you are driving.



Tikki
many of us have a story like the OP's...

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Response to Tikki (Reply #17)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:54 PM

23. Yeah, I agree.

I'm just mighty thankful to be able to tell this one.

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Response to Tikki (Reply #17)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:55 PM

97. Texting and driving

is like a time bomb looking for a clock. Punishment should be a sucker punch and device confiscated with a $5,000 fine and one year revocation of privileges.

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Response to The Wizard (Reply #97)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:58 PM

101. You said it.

Never safe.

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Response to Tikki (Reply #17)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:12 PM

213. Yep. People talking on the Cell Phone while driving are a hazzard!

I had a Cell Phone Talker pull out in front of me yesterday.

I had to slam on the brakes, and my cheeseburger went flying,
spilled my coffee,
knocked my cigarette right out of my hand,
and my CD collection slid off my lap onto the floor!

Those Cell Phone talkers are DANGEROUS!

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #213)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:13 PM

231. Are you one of those people who believes yourself to be uniquely abled? Superman?

Super-cell-phone-talking-while-driving-is-no-problem-for-me-because-I'm-just-that-good-man?

I'm certain everyone understands that there are many opportunities for distraction while driving. Data show time after time after time that people who believe they are good at multi-tasking at even a mildly moderate level of complexity when one of those tasks is driving are fooling themselves. Period.

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Response to Care Acutely (Reply #231)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:55 PM

239. No. I'm one of those people with a sense of humor,

...but would also like to point out that ANYTHING that distracts a driver from 100% focus on Driving-the-Car is dangerous.

I had a friend several years ago who wrecked his car because he was trying to put on his seat belt WHILE DRIVING!
(I have to own that one too. I've done it).

Looking down to change the radio station or adjust the air conditioning has caused accidents and injured people.

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Response to bvar22 (Reply #213)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:29 PM

289. Good thing your laptop didn't slide off the steering wheel shelf

That could have cracked the screen.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:53 PM

20. I ALWAYS wear mine, and so do my passengers!

It is such a simple and smart thing to do.

I am so glad you're OK.

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Response to CaliforniaPeggy (Reply #20)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:53 PM

22. Thank you, my dear California Peggy!

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:55 PM

24. I always do, and I make any passengers buckle up too.

Glad you are OK!

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Response to MiniMe (Reply #24)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:56 PM

25. Thanks.

It was undoubtedly the most frightening thing I've ever experienced.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:56 PM

26. Count me as another who always wears a seat belt

and anyone who rides with me wears one.

There is NO EXCUSE ever for not wearing them.

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Response to SheilaT (Reply #26)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:58 PM

28. No excuse at all.

Even less of an excuse now, because I plan to kick the ass of anyone I know who doesn't wear one.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:57 PM

27. My garage does not have a door opener

putting on a seat belt has gotten to be such a habit that there have been times when I try to get out of the car to close the garage door and realize I put my seat belt on before I backed out of the garage.

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Response to dflprincess (Reply #27)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:59 PM

31. A wise fellow DFL'er!

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:58 PM

29. I got window-shield in my face

I wore my seatbelt all the time after that.

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Response to Confusious (Reply #29)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:59 PM

33. Ouch. Hope that never happens again.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:59 PM

30. Glad you are still here to share that excellent message!

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Response to GreenPartyVoter (Reply #30)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:00 PM

34. Oh man, you said it all right there.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #34)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:04 PM

38. *hugs*

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:02 PM

36. I am so glad you are still with us.

I've worn my seatbelt since before the law was inacted requiring it.
Highway Patrol only rarely unbuckles corpses.

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Response to Ilsa (Reply #36)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:04 PM

37. I've been told that and never really believed it till now.

Thanks.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:06 PM

39. Excellent advice!

And if you don't want to wear it for yourself,think of the others in your vehicle,unbelted people during a collision become projectiles that can kill others in the car.

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Response to wendylaroux (Reply #39)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:19 PM

52. So true.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:06 PM

40. One more point. A non seatbelt wearing person can be thrown around the car

and thereby injure a seatbelt wearing person.

One more reason to wear one.

Good post. Thanks!

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #40)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:20 PM

54. Another good reason.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #40)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:21 AM

108. Was going to make this exact point!

Went to driving school many years ago for a ticket, & this really resonated with me. Don't know if the story was true but the officer mentioned a wreck where someone in the backseat caused the death of the seatbelt-wearing driver by basically being thrown & flying into him head-to-head.
Have ALWAYS worn my seatbelt since one of my uncle's most traumatic memories was having to inform a friend about their teenage child's death due to not wearing theirs. Had another uncle die by getting thrown from a car due to being unbelted.

To mac56 - I am so happy you survived such a horrible accident.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:07 PM

42. Seatbelts have saved our family a lot of pain.j

I was alone In one car when a driver pulled out leaving me no escape.I had my seatbelt on. My husband and I were in a sMall pickup that was totalled when a car slid on ice into us.We were fine.Our son rolled and totalled his car on a wet slippery road. He is fine. We ate believers.

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Response to s-cubed (Reply #42)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:09 PM

45. Did they taste good?

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Response to ErikJ (Reply #45)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:43 PM

82. That's what I was wondering.

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Response to s-cubed (Reply #42)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:22 PM

56. This is why I don't understand not wearing one every time.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #56)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:55 PM

95. I have had occasion to ride in other people's vehicles that were not equipped with them.

Both times? Wreck. Got lucky.

I refuse to get in a car without belts now. Shoulder preferred. 5-point even better.

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #95)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:56 PM

99. yup

Back when I was a young'un they were aftermarket addons.

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #95)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:27 PM

217. 5 pt belts

My 6 year old's carseat can safely secure a child up to 85 pounds in a 5 point harness. So, I still use it that way instead of using the booster. I think adults should have a 5 pt as well. It's the safest option.

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Response to Tree-Hugger (Reply #217)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:42 PM

222. I think it should certainly be an option for the driver at least.

Easier to maintain control of the vehicle when you don't have to fight to keep your butt in the seat.

Still, in rollovers especially, harnesses would be a massive benefit for the passengers. In lateral impacts and rollovers, people can 'come out' of the shoulder belts.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:08 PM

43. What about just in the neighborhood?

I always fasten my belt but sometimes when going a few blocks to the store "forget".
I remember being in London in 1983 and seeing every person buckled up which at the time I thought was odd as most Americans didnt then. Now I think it is pretty universal here too... In my city at least.

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Response to ErikJ (Reply #43)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:21 PM

55. Every time, Erik.

This could have happened a block from my home just as easily.

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Response to ErikJ (Reply #43)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:00 PM

185. You don't have to be going very fast

to suffer a serious injury. If you're going 25 mph, and someone else going 25 veers and hits you head on, that's like hitting a brick wall at 50 mph. Would you want to risk that without a seatbelt?

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Response to skepticscott (Reply #185)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:13 PM

245. They used to tour to high schools around here with "The Convincer"

Essentially it was a machine pulled on a trailer by a truck like a tiny carnival ride. It was two seats that rolled 25 feet down a ramp into a barrier. The operator would say "Depending on your weight, this only gets up to like 15-20 mph at the bottom. You can wear the belt if you want to. You want the seat belt?"

They'd demonstrate it with one unbelted dummy and one belted. It worked pretty good.

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Response to ErikJ (Reply #43)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:24 PM

288. I cracked a windshield with my head when my sister

rear ended somebody in the school parking lot in high school (I was the passenger in the front seat, she was driving). She was going approx. 10-15 mph., and I got a small cut on my scalp right by my forehead from where it smacked the windshield. I hadn't put my seat belt on yet, we always wore them, but I hadn't put mine on yet because I didn't think anything could happen. Live and learn.

So yeah, even in the neighborhood.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:09 PM

44. Thankful that you are able to post...

I agree a thousand percent, everyone needs wear their seat belt. I just heard on the news about an accident involving four teenagers; three died, the only survivor was the teen wearing a seatbelt. It's not always going to prevent serious injury or worse but the belts do increase the odds that like you, we walk away.

I tell everyone who gets in my car...buckle up or get out...they aren't riding with me with out them fastened.

Stay safe everyone!

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Response to CherokeeDem (Reply #44)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:23 PM

58. Would that more did what you do.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:10 PM

46. Glad you are ok.

I don't move my car until all passengers are belted in. No matter how much of a hurry I am in. Dh used to start backing out of the driveway without everyone being buckled in, but he doesn't do that anymore. I have killer arching eyebrows.

I did forget to buckle up my kid once. He was about 3. I feel pretty stupid asking my now-teenagers if they are buckled in, but that one incident left an impression on me. I only drove a few miles with him inadvertently unbuckled, but it scared the hell out of me. I sometimes opt to adjust my mirror to see if they are buckled in....

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Response to MissB (Reply #46)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:25 PM

60. Glad you and he made it.

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Response to MissB (Reply #46)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:30 AM

165. Isn't it funny how times change?

I did forget to buckle up my kid once. He was about 3.


When I was a kid; we typically rode around in the back of a pickup. My kids (the youngest turns 18 tomorrow) never rode in the back of a vehicle.

We used to go on long trips when I was a kid and slept in the back window of the car. We rode with 7 (2 adults 5 kids) in the cab of a pickup at times.

I typically have my seatbelt on when I turn on the ignition. I used to ride a motorcycle and always wore a helmet, gloves and coveralls.

We were so lucky to have not been killed doing all that crazy stuff.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:10 PM

47. In my company, if you move a company vehicle without . . .

All vehicle occupants being properly restrained, you are fired. Period.

If you are driving your own vehicle but are on company business (say commuting to work) and you don't wear your seatbelt, you're fired.

If you're driving your own vehicle and not on company business and a colleague sees you, you'll hear from your boss the next day, and he/she will suggest that maybe this isn't the company for you.

And don't even think of answering your phone in the car, hands-free set or not.

Unsurprisingly, we have the best safety record in our (rather dangerous) industry. But most of our competitors in that same industry are almost as good. Some people do get it.

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Response to MrModerate (Reply #47)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:25 PM

62. You are in good company, literally.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:13 PM

48. Yessir, a message worth repeating.

I haven't even thought to put it on when I get in a vehicle, it's automatic. Anyone who rides with me, wears a seatbelt or they can walk.

It's wonderful to hear that you came thru your wreck so well and are here with us with such an important reminder.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #48)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:26 PM

64. Thanks, 99.

As I mentioned I intend to be on message about this for the rest of my life.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:15 PM

49. Fucken A right.

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Response to Iggo (Reply #49)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:27 PM

65. word

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:17 PM

50. I had to train my MIL, but I don't go anyplace if passengers aren't belted

My former son-in-law filled my grandson's head with some nonsense about "choice" when he was 7 y.o., but fortunately my husband had a talk with the kid about the difference between "an opinion" and "the law."

Glad you're okay.

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Response to Hekate (Reply #50)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:27 PM

67. Thanks.

Understandable in a seven-year-old but glad your hubby gave him a reality check.

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Response to Hekate (Reply #50)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:42 PM

201. Gee I wonder

If your former sil would think having the choice of burying his kid if he died because he wasn't buckled in?

And if he makes the choice for himself does he want to continue making good choices or not have to worry about making choices after he dies in a car crash?

The law in most cases is there to help you make the right choice. He may not have thought so. And an opinion does not mean one makes the right choice.

Thankfully your husband had a good talk.

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Response to LiberalFighter (Reply #201)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:56 PM

225. By this time we're pretty sure our former SIL is a complete narcissistic ass

But his little boy still loves him, so there's every incentive to speak gently. We cannot do anything about what goes on in daddy's car, but we have totally made our point about ours. Among other things we explained that "we can't afford the size of the fine if we get pulled over by a cop," and from time to time I talk about how much our national concepts of car-safety and traffic-safety have changed in my lifetime alone. He's bright -- he gets it.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:17 PM

51. You do not rule by decree. There are fines for not wearing such and if people are willing to accept

the possibility of being fined and the risk of injury or death that is their business. It's not yours to decide for them, regardless of your threats of physical assault.

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Response to RB TexLa (Reply #51)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:29 PM

68. Okay.

Glad I am still here to read your opposing viewpoint. I will note that the social cost, including emergency responders, is considerable.

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Response to RB TexLa (Reply #51)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:41 PM

78. Just know that whether I rule by decree or not, any friend of mine who does not buckle up

will receive an ass kicking. Bank it.

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Response to RB TexLa (Reply #51)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:28 AM

110. Wow

really?

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Response to RB TexLa (Reply #51)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:34 AM

124. Well you refuse to wear it in my car

You can find another ride.

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Response to RB TexLa (Reply #51)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:08 AM

146. My car, my rules

you want a lift from me? put on your damn seat belt. or walk if you refuse. your choice.

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Response to RB TexLa (Reply #51)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:54 AM

174. And like clockwork....

....we can always count on you to make the wrong choice.

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Response to ProudToBeBlueInRhody (Reply #174)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 02:28 AM

296. so when exactly

did being a violent control freak, become a progressive value?

Can we do this with every issue?

Anybody who smokes cigarettes will get their a$$ kicked by me.
Anybody who smokes marijuana will get their a$$ kicked by me.
Anybody who rides a motorcycle will get their a$$ kicked by me.

Of course, we will back up our "logic" with some personal anecdote how

my favorite uncle died of lung cancer and he was only 41
my best friend in high school started smoking dope, gave up his dream of being a professional baseball player and made it his life's ambition to get on disability.
I knew this guy once who got killed riding a motorcycle.

I mean, dammit, different opinions, different points of view and especially any sort of potential risk just should not be tolerated.

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Response to RB TexLa (Reply #51)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:40 PM

200. HE'S NOT THE BOSS OF YOU

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Response to RB TexLa (Reply #51)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:47 PM

202. Once upon a time in my primordial life I was a volunteer fireman...

living in a small town I would sometimes respond to auto wreck that had people I know involved in them.

A close friend of mine who shared your same idea about not wearing a seat belt for the same vague reasons you gave.

One night I got a call on the box. It was a car wreck on the main drag of our town.

So up and out I went and made the truck.

The scene was a mess, car rear ended. It was sent spinning out of control. The driver that caused the accident was drunk.

The person on the receiving end was coming home from a late work shift. That person wasn't wearing a seat belt. That person was my same friend who only days before regaled me with the virtues of not wearing a seat belt.

My friend was in ICU for 2 weeks and had permanent brain damage.

When the drunk rear-ended him, and sent his cars spinning out of control, my friend banged around inside the car, as it slammed in to a telephone pole, like a pin ball.

It was a very clear case of, "if he had only worn his seatbelt". This took place 30 years ago.

So justify it all you want, show stat after stat, give your reason after reason, but all I have to show you is ICU's and morgues filled with my reasons.

Cheers and have a nice day.

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Response to Javaman (Reply #202)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:01 PM

227. I had a friend who was an occupational therapist...

She had pretty strong feelings about motorcycle helmets and seat belts. One of her rehab cases was a two-fer: mother and daughter who went through the same windshield at the same time. Lotta brain damage.

I'm pretty sure there are people who think nothing will ever happen to them personally.

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Response to RB TexLa (Reply #51)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:53 PM

205. Well, here's the real-world situation.

The people who are overall-responsible, and wear seatbelts, also usually strive to have some health and/or accident insurance, car insurance, etc. The "mavericks" who glory in their independence, also often pass on such socially responsible conventions ("often" - not "always"). Get in a wreck without your seatbelt and without insurance, and if you survive, you will run up an unbelievable medical bill; someone will have to eventually pay this bill, and that may likely include RB TexLa.

My good friend's daughter was on a celebration trip with a friend, days after high school graduation. She was a passenger, asleep, and wearing her seatbelt/shoulder harness. Her friend loss control of the car and rolled it several times (no alcohol or drugs involved, just youthful inexperience). The sleeping girl was thrown so badly that the seatbelt actually broke, but it saved her life. Her neck was broken, and she was bleeding from her ears. At first, they did not think she would survive, then thought she would be a quadraplegic, then a paraplegic, but against all odds (and with many surgeries), she is actually up and walking with a cane, going to college, and making a life for herself. Without the seatbelt, there is no question she would be dead.

A second note: The above young lady, by age 19, had run up over $1 million in medical bills and had already exhausted her lifetime coverage limit on her medical insurance and the driver's car insurance. And with the preexisting condition, she would not be eligible for insurance with any other company. Thanks to Obamacare, she has a chance to be covered again.

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Response to colorado_ufo (Reply #205)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:21 PM

233. Question Re: Obamacare and pre-existing conditions...

 

Does anyone know the answer to this- although insurance companies can't exclude someone for pre-existing conditions- is there any limit on what they can charge the person for coverage?

and yes- i know that google is my friend- but i just wondered if anyone might happen to know. that and i'm kinda lazy about that kind of thing...so many keystrokes...

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Response to colorado_ufo (Reply #205)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 02:13 AM

295. here's another real life situation

I, myself, have ridden and driven hundreds of thousands of miles without wearing a seatbelt, not been in any accidents and walked away without so much as a scratch or a medical bill. Sure, if I had some ham, I could have some ham and eggs if I had some eggs, but a whole lot of those "what ifs" never actually come to pass.

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Response to RB TexLa (Reply #51)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:35 PM

235. ROFL

"I don't wear seatbelts with YOU!"

Been nice knowing you, RB.

NOT

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Response to RB TexLa (Reply #51)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:12 PM

244. You're always reliable -

And your posts are reliably stupid.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:23 PM

57. I have done many stupid and risky things (and continue to do so), but I always buckle up

I am also a Seatbelt Nazi with anyone else in a vehicle with me, be they passenger or driver.

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Response to Tom Ripley (Reply #57)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:29 PM

69. right on

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:24 PM

59. I feel naked if I don't have it on.

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Response to neverforget (Reply #59)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:30 PM

70. That right there is my goal for everyone I know.

You will not feel right without it.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #70)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:11 AM

106. And if a passenger refuses to put their seatbelt on, I wait until they put

it on to move the vehicle.

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Response to neverforget (Reply #59)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:15 AM

117. I've driven naked but still put it on

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Response to TrogL (Reply #117)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 11:09 PM

291. Lol good for you!

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:25 PM

61. mac56, I m glad that you are still here with us.

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Response to Tom Ripley (Reply #61)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:31 PM

72. Thanks, Tom.

I'm so goddamned lucky I can't even believe it.

(Edited for poor word choice.)

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:26 PM

63. I always wear my seatbeat and so does everyone else in my vehicles...

Only stupid people ride around in cars without wearing their seatbelt.

By the way, it's required in California.

'Click it or ticket' is posted everywhere on the highways.

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Response to Playinghardball (Reply #63)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:34 PM

74. Glad it's required there.

Even so, the word must be shared.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:33 PM

73. I won't drive if anyone is unrestrained

When I was in college, many more years ago than I like to admit, a classmate was thrown from the car in an accident and the car he had been riding in ran him over & killed him. He was 20. I will never forget that & have never failed to wear a seatbelt since then.
It always scared me that my kid's schoolbuses didnt have enough seatbelts & they didn't make the kids wear them.

Glad you are ok, mac.

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Response to Danmel (Reply #73)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:36 PM

75. Thanks, Danmel

That's the thing. Even if I had gotten out, there's every chance the damn thing would have rolled over on me. And the schoolbus thing has always scared me too.

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Response to Danmel (Reply #73)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:40 PM

77. Same here.

I was in a pretty low-speed collision one month before the seat belt went into law in Texaso more than 2 decades ag. My face met the windshield. I had only minor injuries, but to me it was a warning of how much worse it could have been had the accident been at a higher rate of speed. I have not driven or ridden in a car without my seat belt since, and I do not leave park until passengers buckle up.

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Response to Lisa0825 (Reply #77)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:42 PM

79. Thank god you are okay, Lisa.

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Response to Danmel (Reply #73)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:35 AM

125. The school bus thing drove me crazy. The district's excuse?

That the seats were designed so the children were in an "egg carton" designed to protect them in the event of an accident.

But there was a problem with that. These were middle school students, and many of them had to sit three to a seat -- on a 39 inch seat. Have you even seen a middle schooler that was only 13 inches wide? So one of the kids was just perched on the edge of the seat, dangling into the aisle. There was no protection for that kid!

So if they installed seat belts in the buses, they'd have to admit that three kids couldn't fit in the space, and then they'd need more buses.

I told them that middle schoolers were too big to fit three to a seat, and they said it would work if the smaller ones sat with the bigger ones -- as if kids chose their seat mates by their widths! Anyway, I measured my 2nd grader across the shoulders and he was already 14 or 15 inches wide. My middle schooler, who was tall and thin, measured 17 inches across. There wasn't any realistic and safe way to fit three middle schoolers in 39 inches, unless a couple of them were smaller than my second grader.

I called the district; I even called the state department of education. No luck. They just kept insisting the unbelted seats were safe because of the egg carton design, and they couldn't seem to understand that if you were mostly planted in the aisle nothing would stop you from plunging down the aisle in the event of a crash.

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Response to pnwmom (Reply #125)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:41 PM

221. Kids in most buses are screwed no matter what.

Walk onto a schoolbus and look at how the seats are anchored some time. Compare that to the anchorage in your car. If you had three kids belted to the average bus bench, and that bus were to get into a major accident, the odds are very high that the deceleration forces would simply rip the bench from the floor.

On top of that, there's a lack of torso space between seats in school buses. If the kid is sitting up when the impact occurs, inertia will swing the kid head first into the top back of the seat in front of them...most of which are bare steel, or thinly covered unpadded steel. Your kid will stay in his seat, but his brains will be scrambled.

Putting seat belts on buses with traditional benches is pointless. You really need to replace all of the seating in the bus, lowering its capacity, to make the kids safer.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:39 PM

76. Hey! It's a free country!! Nobody in the movies wears the damn things

^^^ ^^^ ^^^ ^^^

This was a difficult transition for me, like 10 years ago. Three tickets
in a row, 2 from the same officer, at same intersection.

It became too damn expensive to not buckle up, so I altered my habitual
behavior.

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Response to 99th_Monkey (Reply #76)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:42 PM

81. My dad always told me, lessons cost money!

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Response to mac56 (Reply #81)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:49 AM

132. Yes, it helps to think of it that way.

It's not like the money was really wasted, just
invested in my future well-being.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:42 PM

80. cars should not start unless the belts are buckled, for all the arrogant dumbfucks out there

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Response to spanone (Reply #80)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:44 PM

84. I would add, buckled AROUND A PERSON.

I could predict some ways to override that.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:43 PM

83. My first new car was a Ford Pinto

Bought it in 1977. Was driving north to Oshkosh in Wisconsin during the winter and it had snowed. The plow trucks had been out to salt the roads. Turned out to be icier than I thought and slid and rolled the car several times with seat belt intact. What probably also helped was the several feet of snow off the road to lessen the impact. I think it was the first year that Ford started their seat belt program guarantee. Minor damage to the car.

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Response to LiberalFighter (Reply #83)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:45 PM

86. Glad of the snow in your case, LF.

And believe me, I usually don't take that stance.

I remember when they were optional addons. Only the richest people in our town had them!

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Response to mac56 (Reply #86)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:22 PM

189. Yes! It should be mandatory for all cars to have

snow.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:44 PM

85. Do you remember how we got seatbeelts in all our cars?

Ralph. Nader. I remember when my children were little, there was no law, either for seat belts or child seats. I would hold my arm across the front seat to catch them if I had to stop real quick or turned a corner. I still do that sometimes (hold my arm across) when someone is riding with me...

Thanks, mac56, for telling about this. I'm sure you have reached someone here that doesn't normally use their seat belt. So glad that you are ok. Heck, I would have had a heart attack WITH a seat belt on!

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Response to ReRe (Reply #85)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:47 PM

88. Thanks, ReRe.

It's good for me that you reminded me about Nader's efforts on this.

And I still do the arm thing sometimes myself.

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Response to ReRe (Reply #85)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:53 AM

135. Nader and Volvo.

My 1962 Volvo 122s had three point belts in the front, and lap belts in the back as standard equipment. It was years before US iron implemented three point belts. Then, they implemented them so stupidly that it really was an extraordinary hassle.

The Volvo belts were easy, and designed to be so, which is why I wore them at the time. Of course, Volvo has always been known for safety innovation, which is why I still drive one, a 1995 940 now.

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Response to longship (Reply #135)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:57 AM

136. Cool...

...man. I bet it's real nice.....

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Response to ReRe (Reply #136)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 11:11 AM

181. Yup! 17 years old.

I am one of those Volvo driving libruls!

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Response to ReRe (Reply #85)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:39 AM

168. Ralph Nader. That's why the animosity towards him on this site

sickens me. I was thinking about him with every post I read in this thread.

Back before there were seatbelts, the area where I live was practically wilderness. There was an interstate highway not far from me, with a four-way stop sign at the intersection. It was the only stop for maybe 20+ miles back.

People regularly ran the sign, coming from waaay further out in the country and not expecting it. It was an extremely dangerous intersection.

One day a couple of young mothers a few streets over decided to take their girls to the store.
A motorist ran that sign, probably going about 60mph. He rammed their car and the girls were thrown out of the vehicle and killed. They buried the girls in their Easter dresses. Even more horrific, one of the girls' fathers was on the volunteer life squad and he responded to the accident.

Also, when I left the hospital after the birth of my daughter, I sat in the front seat of the car and the nurse handed my daughter to me. My husband and I drove home with me holding my newborn daughter on my lap. I can barely stand to think about that, even so many years later.

And does anyone here remember those little toddler car seats with the plastic steering wheel that hooked over the back of the seat? I used those. If I'd had an accident the seat would have come unhooked and gone directly through the windshield.

So when DUers can't give Nader credit for the lives he's saved it just makes me want to





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Response to truth2power (Reply #168)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:11 PM

187. I know what you mean...

... I was half afraid to mention his name. Al Gore won that election. And it wasn't Ralph's fault that he didn't. The SC f'ed us all, and looking back on it, I can barely believe that it happened....except for the fact that we suffered so through GWBs tenure. The last time I seen Ralph (I think on C-Span), he did not look good. Yes, he did save allot of lives, and probably many of ours.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:47 PM

87. Way back when...

...I was a student, I worked as a forensic photographer, and shot quit a number of traffic accidents. I really don't think most folks have any idea as to the level of carnage possible in a car wreak nor do they comprehend just how fragile human bodies are. Traveling in a vehicle without wearing a seatbelt is idiotic.

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Response to shoreline (Reply #87)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:48 PM

89. oh man, word to the herd

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:49 PM

90. No

one rides in my vehicles unless they are wearing their seat belts.

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Response to Incitatus (Reply #90)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:50 PM

92. Right on

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Response to Incitatus (Reply #90)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:52 AM

173. +100

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:50 PM

91. I wear my seat belt 600 miles everyday. I

do think in cars they could follow the example of the big trucks you see on the highway. In my Freightliner it has a seat belt adjuster so the strap is not cutting into you and that makes it comfortable to wear!

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Response to B Calm (Reply #91)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:52 PM

94. Yeah!

"But it's uncomfortable" will not qualify as an excuse from my friends. How comfortable do they think an ass kicking will be?

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:52 PM

93. I'm glad you're ok. And yes, I always wear my seat belt.

I used to do it just to avoid the fine- here in NY, it's I believe a $75 fine if you're caught not wearing one. However, after a car accident I had a few years ago similar to yours, where the seat belt saved me, I realized there's a much better reason for wearing it than a potential monetary fine.

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Response to richmwill (Reply #93)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:55 PM

96. If the fine works, it's fine with me.

Different strokes for different folks.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:58 PM

102. I always say it's a person's choice

to wear one or not, but if they choose not to wear one they won't be riding with me. I'm not going to be responsible for their death.

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Response to JoeyT (Reply #102)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:05 AM

105. You're more lenient than I am, Joey.

I've acquired a zero tolerance stance on this one.

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Response to JoeyT (Reply #102)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:27 AM

120. I don't want to be paying their medical bills

I helped out in an accident a few weeks ago. I drive up to the scene and there was a wrecked car and a lady stumbling around on the sidewalk. Another car drove up with an off duty policeman so I let him deal with her while I dealt with her car and directing traffic. The air bags were deployed and the seat belts extended so she obviously had been wearing them.

I think it made the difference between her going through the windshield into a telephone pole and walking (badly) and talking.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:17 AM

107. Glad you're OK. I wouldn't think of not wearing mine--

my kids have never been allowed to ride without theirs. It's a religion in our household.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:23 AM

109. Please feel free to try to kick my ass.

It IS a personal choice. It's a personal choice to drink, to smoke, to eat bacon cheeseburgers with extra bacon every day for lunch, to ride a bike without a helmet, to ride without a seatbelt, to skydive, to hike in remote places, to climb Mount Everest, and a whole lot of other things that people want to get preachy about.

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Response to Daemonaquila (Reply #109)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:12 AM

116. by all means, do whatever you want

as long as your actions don't harm or cause others hardship.

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Response to Daemonaquila (Reply #109)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:29 AM

121. And the rest if us get to pay your medical bills

In the form of increased health care costs and insurance rates. Hospital emergency rooms are crowded enough without your sorry ass in there cause you're too stupid to use the safety equipment

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Response to TrogL (Reply #121)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 07:31 AM

143. Seems a bit harsh...

...are you THAT sure you live a perfect lifestyle??? Also, common sense aside there is still at least one state (mine) were it is legal for adults to drive without them AND we have a higher seatbelt usage than several "mandatory" states.

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Response to Daemonaquila (Reply #109)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:29 AM

150. I won't point out all the false equivalencies in your post. Don't have the time.

I hope, though, you have one friend who thinks like I do.

And unless you own your own fleet of ambulances, hire your own private team of EMTs, and drive on your own private highways, don't deny that there is a social cost to unsafe motor vehicle operation.

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Response to Daemonaquila (Reply #109)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:56 AM

176. Is physics also a personal choice?

Do the laws of it just not apply to you?

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Response to Daemonaquila (Reply #109)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:06 PM

211. Darwin was right.

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Response to Daemonaquila (Reply #109)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:19 PM

247. Shall we nominate you for a Darwin Award?

I eat bacon cheeseburgers with foie gras and wear a seat belt. And wear a helmet when I bike - motor or bicycle. And I hope to live a long time.

Don't be an ass and stop using false equivalences.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:28 AM

111. Buckle up for safety, buckle up!


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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:35 AM

112. I've made a 100% improvement

with wearing a seat belt. For years I would just shrug it off and complain that it was an inconvenience. Not anymore.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:41 AM

113. And there's an unexpected side benefit...

With two kids in the back seat, the worst I ever had to hear was "DAD! HE'S LOOKING AT ME AGAIN!"

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:57 AM

114. As others have stated, I also feel "naked" without it.

Even as kids in the 1960s, we had to wear the seatbelts. Not nearly as safe then as they are today, but a lap-style seatbelt probably kept me from being thrown through the back window of my father's 1964 MGB when I was rear-ended. I still cracked my head on the back window, not breaking anything but the seat (it was bent backwards.)

I would also like to add "Don't try to beat the train!!!"
Not that I've tried, but I was ready to kick a friend's butt for doing just that.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:10 AM

115. I always use my seat belt.

It's become an automatic part of driving for me. Two years ago my son was driving his rig and a deer ran out from the side of the road. When he swerved to miss it the load shifted and his truck ended up on it's side. If he hadn't had his seat belt on that would've been his last ride.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:20 AM

118. I got a ticket for this last year.

I'm getting better though.

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Response to wercal (Reply #118)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:10 AM

128. Hey! Welcome to DU

Hope you'll keep using that seat belt, we'd love to have you around here for a long time.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:31 AM

122. Not to mention bicycle and motorcycle helmets.

You're able to post because you buckled your seat belt. I'm able to respond because I wore my helmet.

When my bicycle hit that gouge in the road (on a downhill, no less), my head hit the pavement so hard that I was knocked unconscious even with the helmet on. Without the helmet... reduce Obama's margin by one.

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Response to Jim Lane (Reply #122)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:51 AM

157. right on, Jim

Glad you and I can exchange messages.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:34 AM

123. In my husband's small high school, three kids died in 4 years

because they didn't wear seatbelts. The cars rolled, they were ejected, and the cars rolled on top of them. Every time.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:39 AM

126. Oh boy!! I just *LOVE* some internet tough guy talk!

Oh, and by the way.... I'm *texting this* as I'm doing 80mph down the highway on my Harley, with my girlfriend sitting on my lap "cowgirl style" in a mini-skirt, and we're not wearing helmets!

WEAR YOUR SEAT BELT. EVERY GODDAMNED TIME YOU GET INTO A VEHICLE. NO EXCEPTIONS, GODDAMMIT. The next time I hear some douche-canoe claim that not wearing a seat belt is “a matter of personal choice” or “a victimless crime” or “a blow against the Nanny State” – - I will personally kick that douche-canoe’s sorry loser ass into next week, find him or her next Tuesday, and kick his or her sorry loser ass again.

That is all.




Internet tough guys *ALWAYS* crack me up! Here's what really happened, right? You crashed your Big Wheel and you weren't wearing your elbow pads, knee pads and helmet like mommy told you, so she grounded you from it for a week? I think that sounds more like it, because you sound like a 6 year old pitching a fit. Thanks for the laugh, dude!

Ghost

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Response to Ghost in the Machine (Reply #126)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:31 AM

151. I'm so glad that I'm still around to read your snark

that I won't even tell you to "bite me."

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Response to mac56 (Reply #151)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:51 PM

204. I'm glad you're still around too..... I guess during my snark overdose I forgot to mention that fact

In the discussion thread: SEATBELTS
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Response to MrDiaz (Original post)
Tue Nov 20, 2012, 07:11 PM

Ghost in the Machine (12,986 posts)
29. I drove tow trucks for 2 years in Dade & Broward Counties in Florida.. I've seen firsthand, too many....

....times to count, the results of not wearing seatbelts. I buckle up every time I get in a vehicle, no matter who is driving, and mine doesn't move until everyone is buckled up.. Period.

Peace,

Ghost
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=1858621


"Motorcycles are everywhere, Look Twice, Save A Life!" and "Loud Pipes Save Lives" are two of *my* personal favorites, right up there with "Buckle Up! The Life You Save May Be Your Own".

I hope you're still around for many more years to come... and maybe even provide us with a little more snark-worthy material Even YOU have to admit your post was a little bit overboard, don't you think? Calling other DU'ers "douche-canoes" and threatening to "beat anyones ass" that disagreed with you *could* have gotten you alerted on, and possibly shit-canned. Did you consider those options first, plus the fact that you might get a few replies like mine, or did you just think everyone would fall at your feet and tell you what a "gawd" you were for imparting such wisdom on us underlings??

Peace out,

Ghost

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Response to Ghost in the Machine (Reply #126)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:50 AM

156. You're The One Spewing The Internet Tough Guy Talk.


And it's really stupid talk, at that.

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Response to Paladin (Reply #156)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:53 AM

159. There's always at least one.

Doesn't matter. If even one person reads this thread and smartens up about seat belt use, I'm happy.

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Response to Paladin (Reply #156)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:05 PM

210. Please show me where, exactly, that I'm threatening to kick other DU'ers' asses "into next week"

"then finding them again and kicking their asses again". Now would be a good time to do it, otherwise you're just making yourself look like an ignorant, lying fool.

If you want to see spewing stupid talk, just read your own reply. Now get to work finding those threats!

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:09 AM

127. I still remember the campaign we did back at DOT back in the 80s

To get people to recognize the importance of using seat belts. We have certainly come a long way since then when a significant portion of our population didn't wear their seat belts. I am so glad that you survived this crash. I hope you have caused some people to wake up and buckle up.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:25 AM

129. My thing is stopping people from working under a car....

without proper jackstands. I've lost two good friends from this when the car slipped and crushed them. I don't know anyone close who was killed from not using seat belts that I can recall.

I'm not saying seatbelts are a bad idea. If I thought I was going to get in a wreck, I'd wear a safety harness, a helmet, and a fire suit. I always wear a lap belt in my '72 Triumph TR6 though, because it wasn't designed for collisions like modern rides.

You can spread the word about seatbelts, and I'll continue grabbing shade tree mechanics by their ankles and offering them 3 ton jack stands.

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Response to JohnnyRingo (Reply #129)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:37 AM

152. deal

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Response to mac56 (Reply #152)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 11:13 PM

312. Here's a British PSI for you...

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="?rel=0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Clever way to get the point across.

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Response to JohnnyRingo (Reply #129)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:31 PM

195. Your Triumph

doesn't have three-point belts? My '73 did (does).

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Response to RobinA (Reply #195)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:00 PM

226. No, in '71 it wasn't required.

Just a lap belt, but I think a shoulder harness may have been a dealer installed option that year.

That was one of the ways Triumph allowed their dealers to make extra money. Many corporate approved options like floor mats, custom stripe decals, and even air conditioning was manufactured by companies Amco and installed locally by dealers.

I'm not sure harnesses were required by '73 (they probably were), but it's possible your TR had a dealer installed seat belt. Mine has a bolt inside on the rear wheel well where a harness could be fitted, but I never saw them on earlier models. I believe 1972 was the first year they were required on all cars in the US, though many domestics were using them earlier.

In case of an accident, I may find the optional can opener a useful tool. LOL.

This is mine:



...And this one belongs to DUer and my Sig Other SampleGirl. She lets me drive it if I work on it (lol) Her '64 TR4 is a lot nicer than mine:




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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:30 AM

130. While i probably should

I rarely do, fortunately it is not against the law...yet.

Thank you for the reminder.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:38 AM

133. My Brother's story

My brother was a passenger in a car in an accident where a semi pulled out right in front of them while they were traveling at the legal speed of 40mph. They didn't have time to stop. This was just past an intersection and they had a green light throughout. The car went under the trailer taking off the top of the small car. My brother - unable to convince the drive to STOP trying to stop the car - dove for the floor. He wasn't wearing a seat belt and neither was the driver - who DID dive for the floor, but was still slightly injured by glass to his face. My brother felt the wheels of the truck start to climb his side of the car a bit but then the truck stopped before they were crushed to death. So - my brother knew that the only reason he survived was because he didn't have a seat belt on, and for some years after that could not bring himself to use them despite our entreaties that he was at risk. Some years later he started to use them again - mostly because the law required it. I did understand his fears and also that he simply could not bring himself to use them for some time. Of course that never affected the behaviors of myself and other family members. But it's an interesting story.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:42 AM

134. My father's story

My father drove a lot for his job and was on the road 2-3 weeks out of the month. He was purchasing and installing seat belts in his cars before they were standard equipment.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:58 AM

137. Cannot believe it's not the law to wear a seat belt.

Here in Ireland / UK it's illegal to drive without having everyone in the car, front and back, belted up. It's the driver's responsibility so if you're pulled you can expect penalty points and a hefty fine.

This Public Information film shows graphically what can happen when even one passenger doesn't belt up.

Glad to hear you walked away Mac.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:01 AM

138. This cannot be said enough.

Would have been dead or worse myself had I not worn my seat belt and did not have air bags. All I ended up with is a broken foot and glasses.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:08 AM

139. I had a housemate die because he refused to wear a seatbelt.

It would have been a survivable accident if he had his belt on. Whenever he rode with me I would tell him "I'm not pulling out of the drive until you put your belt on"

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:32 AM

140. Speaking as an EMT . . . WEAR YOUR SEAT BELT

I'm an EMT with our local rescue squad. We are in a rural county with a small population and no major highways, thus, most of the vehicle accidents we encounter and low or moderate speed affairs where someone ran into a ditch dodging a deer, or, missed a curve due to fog or intoxication.

We don't see a lot of serious injuries in vehicle accidents here, HOWEVER, in every accident in which I have been on scene, if the driver or occupant(s) were not wearing a seat belt, there were injuries ranging from moderate to dead. The last accident we worked was one week ago -- a guy left a local watering hole about 8:00 PM; he lived alone so no one noticed when he did not arrive home. Around 5:30 the next morning someone noticed a banged-up truck sitting in the middle of a field with one headlight shining -- they called 911. We found him 75 feet away from the truck -- he was dead, cold and stiff, probably been lying there since the previous night -- seat belt was not fastened, driver's door was flung open. Accident reconstruction showed he left the road at 60-70 MPH, hit a small embankment, became airborne, truck landed on its top after flying about 50 feet, rolled a few times -- he was ejected during one of these rolls.

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Response to OldRedneck (Reply #140)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:49 AM

155. That's how it is around here, too.

In the vast majority of the fatal wrecks in rural areas here, people were not wearing seat belts, and were ejected from their vehicles. I know people who died that way, and I know people who survived with only a few bumps and bruises because they wore their seat belts. I feel sorry for the county deputies and EMTs around here, because they have to face such fatal wrecks at least monthly.

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Response to OldRedneck (Reply #140)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:46 AM

170. I'm the one waiting for the EMT in the ER

me, my portable xray machine, 15 plates and 4 lead aprons. I'm the one who would much rather take a chest and rib films. I hate going to the morgue, I hate the sound of the fathers scream, the spouses keening wails, the soft sobs of an 8 year old who knows mom isn't coming home.
Wear the frigging seatbelt for them, and the ER staff.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 07:26 AM

141. Another member of the 'still here because of seatbelts' club here....

wear them, please.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 07:27 AM

142. Damn right.

It should be everyone's second nature by now. A seatbelt saved my best friend's life 20-odd years ago.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 07:52 AM

144. "I do not want to spend the rest of my life picking your teeth out of my skull"

thats what i say to passengers who won't buckle in. or this, "I am not interested in watching your body fly through the windshield"

the ones who are not buckled become a moving solid force in an accident. read Spaulding Grey's account of his life changing accident. I think because he wasn't buckled his head knocked into the drivers head, causing him a life altering and depression producing injury which finally ended in his suicide.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:04 AM

145. My car NEVER moves until everyone is belted in.

No exceptions.

In the late 80s I was working for NYNEX and we had to attend all sorts of safety films. I remember a film named "Room to Live" which was narrated by A Maryland State Trooper. It made an impact with me.



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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:12 AM

147. PLEASE....read these incredible statistics......PLEASE....

1979.........TRAFFIC DEATHS.....APPROX,....52,000
2011.........TRAFFIC DEATHS.....APPROX.....32,000..............
...40 PER CENT REDUCTION

DUE TO ACCEPTANCE OF SEATBELTS, AND REGULATIONS OF THEM,
AIR BAGS, OTHER SAFETY DEVICES..

AND LAWS THAT SAY YOU MUST HAVE A SEATBELT ON.............

DURING THE SAME 32 YEARS...

............................ THERE HAS BEEN A 40 PERCENT INCREASE IN CARS AND MILES DRIVEN

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Response to Stuart G (Reply #147)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:39 PM

199. I'm Not Against Seatbelts

I wear one always, but there are lies, damn lies, and statistics. I think increased car safety accounts for some of this.

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Response to Stuart G (Reply #147)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:02 PM

208. You know that isn't a good comparison.

But including the miles driven is a good one that you included.

Here is another.
How about 1979 population 225 million and 2011 population 311 million? A 38% increase in population and 40% decrease in traffic accidents.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:12 AM

148. I used to be lackadaisical about seat belts

back in college. I'd go to school every morning, down the highway, with or without a seat belt on. Then a well-known, well-loved professor at my school died in a car wreck. The dean wrote a letter in the school paper, stating that had she been wearing a seat belt, she would have walked away with bumps & bruises. But she wasn't, & they had to have a closed-casket service because of all the injuries to her face.

I admit to being vain. I've worn a seat belt ever since, which I know saved my life on one occasion about 10 years ago.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:14 AM

149. It's habitually ingrained into my psyche. Thanks to mandatory seat-belt laws.

We were poor, one ticket could've sent the entire family into starvation for a month as the ticket was paid.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:39 AM

153. I wore my seatbelt every time I was in the car. However. . .

 

I still have an issue laws dictating morality and things like seat belt laws make me wonder: if someone wants to be an ass and not wear the seat belt, they deserve whatever happens to them IF an accident happens.

I'm lucky your survived. I wear my seat belt. Everyone that got into my car wore their seat belt or the car didn't start.

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Response to Nanjing to Seoul (Reply #153)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:44 AM

154. I'm with you to a point.

Upthread I told a poster that unless he owns his own fleet of ambulances, hires his own private team of EMTs, and drives on his own personal highways, he can't deny that there's a social cost to unsafe vehicle operation.

Welcome to DU, by the way.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:53 AM

158. I don't feel right without them.

Besides having it ingrained in me from being forced to watch those awful films in Driver's Ed, I just don't feel comfortable being in a vehicle without them. And, believe it or not, part of it is that they help my back! They keep me from slouching. An added bonus!

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:08 AM

160. When I was 5 I fell out of a moving car because I wasn't wearing a seatbelt.

The door wasn't closed and I reached for it to close it as my mom was turning. This was the 70's, so it was a different time.

I somersaulted across a busy street and somehow managed to avoid getting squashed. I was so lucky.

Ever since then my mom made me wear my seat belt, a habit that remains today.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:25 AM

161. Amen to that

My sister survived a head on collision because of her seat belt. A 16 year-old student, at the school I work, died when she was thrown from the vehicle she was in. Not wearing her seat belt. All of her friends are still mourning the loss of their friend! My idiot sister-in-law always clips the seat belt behind her and annoys the hell out of me. Well, not just for that I guess (snark).

They save lives, and prevent unneeded stress on your loved ones!

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:35 AM

162. I have a big jagged "Frankenstein"-like scar across my forehead..

from an accident in the 1970s. No seatbelt. It could have been a lot worse, but I certainly learned my lesson. Wear the belts, folks!!

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:58 AM

163. Not as preachy as you

I'm a bit more willing to "live and let die" on these topics. I do insist that front seat passengers buckle up when I;'m driving, but mostly to cover myself with the cops.

I will say I've grown up just buckling up and it is second nature to me. I get in the car to pull it out of the garage for washing, and find that I've buckled up. I got in once to just read a map, and found I had buckled up. I was in a passenger seat once and thought about unbuckling because I was messing with my boots. Instead I just put some slack in the chest belt so I could bend over easier. No more than I had done this, while I was lacing them up, the driver hit the brakes HARD. My nose stopped about an inch from the dash. I don't really think about taking off a seatbelt much anymore.

I know folks that have real "confort" issues with them, mostly fairly skinny folks, or short folks. I've also know a few large breasted folks that had real hard times. There are solutions to these, and I have to say, that's what test drives are for too. A car should "fit". If it doesn't, buy something else. If you're renting, and it doesn't "fit", ask for something different. A 6'7" friend of mine had a short list of vehicles he knew "fit" and more importantly ones that did not. When they gave him the keys, if he saw it was a "wrong one" he immediately asked for something else. A quick explanation connected to "safety" usually stopped all discussion and got him a new one.

Oh, by the by, head rests are amazingly important to everything working as intended. You should always adjust your head rest if it is adjustable. It is intended to be positioned "just so" and if it is in the "wrong place" it can hurt as much as help.

Oh, and since we're on the subject. You short folks that sit close to the steering wheel. Don't sit any closer than you have to. That airbag isn't really designed for people to be "that" close. The modern ones are somewhat better. And driving with one hand at the 12:00 position is a great way to get your arm broken by driving it straight into your nose. I'f you are going to drive one handed, put it at 6:00. And you passengers, be careful about putting stuff on the dash. Many of them have airbags that open the dash up. It can launch those cell phones at you like bullets.

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Response to zipplewrath (Reply #163)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:06 AM

164. I'm still here, so I plan to preach it.

"Live and let die"? If they have their own ambulances, their own private EMTs, and drive on their own private roads. Then maybe.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #164)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:21 PM

188. Risk assessment

As a former competetive skydiver, I tend not to be as judgemental as others about risk assessment. And I certainly don't see myself as a prophet on any topic, certainly not enough to become "evangelical" about the whole thing. Ambulances are already "private", so are the EMT's inside of them. I'm not sure what private roads have to do with seat belts because by the time the seat belt is being used, the crash is already occuring.

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Response to zipplewrath (Reply #188)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:25 PM

191. I'm not a skydiver so have no point of reference here.

If you think it is wise and advantageous to drive without a seat belt, please proceed. Start a thread and I will be sure to look in on it.



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Response to mac56 (Reply #191)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:32 PM

196. I don't think so

As I explained earlier. However, I'm not ready to judge 330 million other peoples points of view without hearing them first either.

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Response to zipplewrath (Reply #163)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:49 PM

203. Everybody I've Ever Known

(maybe 5 people) who has been in a accident where the airbag deployed has been injured by said bag. Broken wrists seem to be popular. I'm not saying airbags are bad, those injuries were these people's worst injuries. Just sayin'.

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Response to RobinA (Reply #203)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:13 PM

214. Yeah, trade off at best

Air bags hurt. You're creating one "collision" to avoid a more serious one. The basic rationale is that it's better to be hurt than dead. A bit like ejection seats in aircraft. You often still get hurt, but you live to tell about it.

I do wish there was some "interlock" of some sort that recognized that you had a seat belt on so that the bag could function "differently" an potentially reduce the kinds of injuries we see. i.e. realize you don't have to stop my whole body mass from hitting the dashboard, just my face.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:34 AM

166. WOW! Glad you are OK!

Thanks for the reminder... My car has one of those annoying sound that won't go away until I lock my seat belt. Thank you again

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:35 AM

167. Make it click!

That's my rule. I heard as many clicks as I have passengers in the car, or the car doesn't move.

Glad you came out of that situation unscathed. And thank you for posting this. Nothing makes an impression like a first hand account from one who is thankful to be alive!

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Response to hamsterjill (Reply #167)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 11:46 AM

183. click it or ticket

that's the saying here in cali.

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Response to shanti (Reply #183)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:34 PM

197. In Texas, too.

At least Texas got ONE thing right!!! LOL

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:44 AM

169. Absolutely - Seat belts have saved me from death and serious injury

And thanks to your post, 'douche-canoe' is my new favorite insult.

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Response to rox63 (Reply #169)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 11:00 AM

179. Glad to be of some small service, rox

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:47 AM

171. It's a rule in my car

No seatbelt, no ride.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:47 AM

172. I was just thinking the other day how ODD it would feel now to drive (or ride in) a car

without a seat belt on, how the seat belt makes me feel more "one" with the car and how much more comfortable seat belts have become over the years (being on the short side, I can remember how shoulder belts used to dig into my neck back in the day.)

Hurrah for seat belts. I'm a fan!

And glad you are still around to be their champion, mac56!

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:55 AM

175. I've never had my life saved because I was wearing a belt.

It's just my luck that the first time I drive without one; I'll be in the accident where 'wearing a belt would have saved my life'. So I always wear my seatbelt.

The little woman flipped the car end over end 2-1/2 times about 20 years ago. There's no way she would have walked away had she not been wearing a seat belt.

If someone wants to make the argument that it's a matter of personal choice; let them argue it to the judge. Click it or ticket is the motto here.

You don't do it for yourself anyway; you do it for your friends and family that shouldn't have to live with your loss.

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Response to Blanks (Reply #175)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:59 AM

177. oh man, you said it all

I had to call my elderly mom to tell her what had happened. Her sadness was profound. I can only imagine what she would have gone through if someone else called to say I hadn't made it.

"Your life doesn’t belong to you. The decisions you make affect other people."

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 11:00 AM

180. Amen

I get twitchy if mine is not on.

It's saved me from injury multiple times.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 11:42 AM

182. Very glad you're okay. So what was the deal with the clown who rammed into you -cell phone, texting,

drunk, driving too damned fast, or what?

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Response to kath (Reply #182)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:03 PM

186. Haven't been told much about him.

I was told he was taken to jail.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 11:47 AM

184. Long ago, I began to buckle my seat belt before putting the key in the ignition. Still do.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:24 PM

190. I

get your drift. A person I knew and cared about died because she was not wearing a seat belt in a rollover accident.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:25 PM

192. Never say "no" to an enraged Scotsman...

 

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:31 PM

194. The first thing I do is put on my seat belt. Second is to take it off and get my keys out of my pock

pocket. Third thing is to put my seat belt back on. I've got it down to a routine.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 12:38 PM

198. I thank the seat belt for me being here

Back in October too. The truck didn't fare well, and like your car, it was totaled. We all walked away...it was "a good crash."

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:00 PM

207. Many years ago, a few weeks after Colorado passed it's first seat belt law,

I cruised right through a stop sign that I didn't see. A police man stopped me. He asked me, "Do you know why I pulled you over?"

"I have no idea."

"You ran a stop sign back there."

"There's a stop sign back there?"

"Yes, there is. But I'm pleased to see that you have your seat belt on."

"Well, if you're going to run stop signs, it's a good thing to wear your belt!"

He laughed & didn't give me a ticket! Just told me to pay closer attention.

My mother used to get offended when I would wear a seat belt in her car. Then one day she was in my car & I made her wear her belt. At first she didn't believe that I wouldn't start the truck until she buckled up, but I just sat there, listening to the radio & told her, "I can wait you out, Mom."

Yes, always wear your belt. Always!

I'm glad you are ok!!

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:04 PM

209. I still run into idiots who think seat belts are dangerous.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:08 PM

212. Same here, mac...

Three years ago, driving home after a trip, I fell asleep on a country road.
Car hit the embankment, flew off, traveled ten feet lower than the road, and then tumbled four or five times before coming to rest upside down.

When I came to, I was hanging from the seatbelt.
Broken leg, broken ribs, banged up body... but I'm pretty much back to normal and - more importantly - still here.

Seatbelt? EVERY GODDAMNED TIME.

And can I also add - I don't drive tired, anymore, either...

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:26 PM

216. I fasten my seat belt. I hate it, but I do it. So why do states still allow motorcyclists to ride

with no helmet? Kentucky used to have a helmet law. No longer.

If I have a wreck without a seat belt, I might survive without serious injury. If I get thrown from a motorcycle with no helmet and crack my noodle on the pavement, I'm going to be seriously hurt or dead.

So we have seat belt laws. Why no helmet laws?

Bake

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:39 PM

219. The Halloween storm of 91 in MN ...seat belts saved me

We were driving from Wisconsin to Minnesota after the big storm, roads were still bad. We were on an off ramp in Duluth when we started to skid and ended up sideways on the ramp. Before we could move, I saw headlights coming at me...I was a passenger... a taxi barreled into us and sent us ricocheting off the guard rails.

We both had our seat belts on. The officer at the scene said if we didn't we would have been thrown from the car unto the train tracks below (and yes a train was passing) and would have been dead.


I always wear a seat belt, I still get a little nervous on off ramps though.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:40 PM

220. Wow!

That is incredibly frightening. I am so glad that you are okay and that you can come share your story with us.

When I was a little girl, back in the early 80's, my dad had a big white Oldsmobile station wagon. We would always ride way in the back part of it. We never wore seat belts. Then, my dad started working trauma. He never started his car without everyone belted in again.

When I was in 6th grade, my brother's best friend, around 22 years old, was asleep in the back of a mall security van (during his break). Another security guard got in the car and began driving around. He lost control of the car, hit a curb and my brother's friend went flying through the windshield and only stopped when his head crashed into a light pole. I remember driving by the scene of the accident days later and seeing the bits of hair, blood and skull debris still stuck to that pole.

In 2011, my breaks failed on a rainy day. Thankfully, I was not going super fast - I was going about 20 miles an hour. I ended up slamming into the back of a woman who was stopped at a red light. My son was secured in his car seat, thank God, and I was wearing my seat belt. My head lurched forward and a few items that were unsecured in my car flew to the front. Had I not been in a seat belt, my whole body would have smashed into my steering wheel or dashboard. Since I was not going very fast, I probably would have been left with a few bruises and other non life-threatening injuries. However, I was 19 weeks pregnant at the time and I shudder to think what would have happened to my baby had I not been wearing my seat belt.

No one rides in my car without proper restraint. Hell, I even buckle my cats in (in their carriers) when they have to make a trip to the vet.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:54 PM

223. Seatbelts minimize damage even in nonfatal collisions.

The amazing part about this is that you *rolled* (sounds like more than once), landing UPSIDE DOWN, and came to rest still conscious so you could disable the vehicle, and extract yourself from the car and walk away. It sounds like you didn't need to go to the hospital, but I would expect you might have minor bumps and scrapes.

Without the seatbelt, you would have tumbled like you were in a clothes dryer:

- at minimum sustaining some bone-crunching blows to the head and twisting tangle injuries to arms and legs, likely bleeding wounds, potentially broken bones, wrenched joints, concussion, that likely would have sent you to the hospital (alive but with medical bills that would hopefully have gotten paid by the other driver if he'd had insurance and not driven off.)

- landing upside down *could* have knocked you unconscious, meaning your car wouldn't get shut off, which increases the chance that there could have been a fire that you would not have escaped from.

- at worst landing inverted could have dropped you on your head, snapping your neck and you would have died. Or you could have been ejected through the windshield or a window, landing on concrete, potentially in front of other speeding cars.

I always tell this to my friends who say they don't like to wear their seatbelt: Most accidents will be minor. If you bash a telephone pole at 35 miles an hour wearing your seat belt it's a humiliating insurance claim. Without the belt, it's the steering column rammed into your sternum at 35 mph and possibly the bones in your face smashed flat by the windshield. No seat belt=potential death or scarring injures/reconstructive facial surgery. Even avoiding the broken nose you can sustain on the dashboard in a minor fender-bender is worth clicking your damn seat belt.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 01:55 PM

224. Buckle Up Idiots

 

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:09 PM

228. Princess Diana

EDIT: It turns out there are conflicting stories about whether or not Trevor Rees-Jones was wearing a seat belt or not. The original stories said that he was, but further investigation done years later revealed that he was not wearing one. He barely survived, most likely because the point of impact was on the driver's side of the Mercedes S280.

I always point out that in that horrific crash that utterly destroyed the large Mercedes they were in, of the four occupants inside, the only one that survived was also the only one wearing a seat belt.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:10 PM

229. I won't put the whatever I'm driving in gear until the seat belts are fastened.

It feels strange not being belted-in when I'm out on 3 wheels instead of 4.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:12 PM

230. I'm Pro-Choice. It should be left up to the driver and each passenger.

 

as long as they are consenting adults.

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Response to Mel Content (Reply #230)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:56 PM

240. The other adults need to consent also.

If you've seen crash videos, an unsecured body can become a deadly projectile and dangerous to people who are belted correctly.

The unsecured person becomes flailing elbows, knees skull...like being in a boxing match.

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Response to forgotmylogin (Reply #240)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:09 PM

270. or- they can choose not to ride with the unbelted.

 

that's why they make buses.

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Response to Mel Content (Reply #270)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:14 PM

271. Obviously you've never lived in a rural area

or been a young kid with no other transportation options besides what's in front of you.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #271)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:31 PM

272. most people don't.

 

And when i was a young kid, there was generally a bike involved with getting me places.

But you're either pro-choice, or you're not.

I am.

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Response to Mel Content (Reply #272)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 05:46 PM

273. "Most people don't" = some people do.

You're arguing that those who don't live in urban areas are stuck with the limited options they have? And might have to resign themselves to traveling in unsafe conditions?

Doesn't sound all that "pro-choice" to me.

To quote Inigo Montoya: "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."

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Response to mac56 (Reply #273)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:07 PM

274. If you're going to be Pro-choice- you have to respect people's choices.

 

If someone chooses not to wear a seatbelt- you can then choose whether or not you want to ride in the car with them.
BUT- the ultimate choice about seatbelts belongs to the driver- if they say buckle-up in their car- you don't have a choice about that- but once again, you can choose whether or not to ride.

If people in rural areas are unhappy with their limited transportation options- they probably shouldn't live in a rural area.
But- it's their choice.

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Response to Mel Content (Reply #274)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:19 PM

275. No offense, but I've been pro-choice for 40 years.

And "my way or the highway" isn't like any pro-choice ideology I've ever heard.

By your logic: if four people are in the car, and one of them refuses to buckle up, that person's "choice" must be respected? And if they get into an accident, and the non-buckled person becomes a projectile, what about the other three people's choices to ride in a safe vehicle?

I think you need to think this through some more before you bandy that phrase around.

To quote Patton Oswalt: "'You’ve gotta respect everyone’s beliefs.' No, you don’t. That’s what gets us in trouble. Look, you have to acknowledge everyone’s beliefs, and then you have to reserve the right to go: 'That is f---ing stupid. Are you kidding me?' I acknowledge that you believe that, that’s great, but I’m not going to respect it. I have an uncle that believes he saw Sasquatch. We do not believe him, nor do we respect him!"

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Response to mac56 (Reply #275)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:47 PM

277. people can choose whether to ride, or whether to ride in the back...

 

and put the unbuckler in the front seat.

it's amazing how many supposedly 'pro-choice' people want people to have no choices in certain situations of their choosing.

oh, the hypocrisy.

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Response to Mel Content (Reply #277)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:52 PM

281. So in your dictionary, "pro-choice" means "pro-foolish choices"?

Choices that expose other people to the risk of harm?

All choices must be accommodated?

If I choose to swing my arm around in the air, must you accommodate that even as it nears your chin?

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Response to mac56 (Reply #281)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 07:10 PM

285. yep.

 

as long as those choices don't put another person in imminent danger.


and just to let you know- there are laws against things like assault and battery to cover the flailing arm situation.

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Response to Mel Content (Reply #277)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:59 PM

283. You are so effective at defending your position.

I urge you to start a thread where you defend not wearing a seat belt.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #283)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 07:13 PM

286. I'm defending a person having the choice whether or not to wear a seat belt.

 

like i said- I'm pro-choice.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:17 PM

232. K and R

I put my belt on anytime I get into a vehicle.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:24 PM

234. Hell yeah!

Ever since my car accident in 2001, I wear it no matter whose car I'm in.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:36 PM

236. Good advice, for sure

But what, exactly, is a "douche-canoe"?

Angel in Texas

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:44 PM

237. I'm torn on seatbelts.

If I'm driving around town, I don't wear one. If I'm out on the highway, I do. I've gotten ticketed twice for not wearing a seatbelt while driving around here on the local 25 MPH roads.

I have written about this here before, but a friend, his wife, and their 14 year old child burned alive in their car because they couldn't get out of their seat belts after another car crossed the expressway and hit them. Crash investigators and the autopsies found that they survived the crash, and were conscious, and tried to escape.

So I kind of think....If I was going to die in an auto accident, would I rather die instantly if I'm ejected from the car, or burn alive?

Another thing: Seatbelts fail. A lot. Especially in rollover crashes. I wonder how many people who die from being unbelted were actually belted, and there was seatbelt failure.

Plenty of police around here unbuckle dead people...It happens at least two or three times a year.

Anyway, Mac56, I am very glad that you are okay.

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Response to kurtzapril4 (Reply #237)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:07 PM

243. Most crashes experienced will be minor.

A seatbelt enhances your safety, but does not guarantee it. In a bad enough crash, nothing will save you. But these multi-car stunt-driver type collisions are rare. Most of the time an accident is going to happen on a routine local trip where you're not thinking about it...this is where the seatbelt does what it's supposed to.

At 35 mph, bashing a telephone pole wearing a seat belt is a humiliating insurance claim. Without the seatbelt, it's the steering column rammed into your sternum at 35 mph. Medical bills which may or may not be paid by the other driver.

It's the difference between a sore shoulder and a broken nose on the dashboard involving reconstructive surgery. It's the difference between consciousness in a fire or underwater and not where you may have less than a minute to get your wits together and get out. To survive a burning car or a water crash, first you must survive the impact. Hitting water in a car may as well be concrete. Water is *not* compressible and not cushy to hit at speed.

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Response to kurtzapril4 (Reply #237)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:21 PM

248. Advocating NOT wearing seatbelts?

Really? You might as well be for driving with "a few drinks in you" or while chit-chatting on the phone. Some things are pretty simple - a device saves your life in a car accident, so you use it. In some situations, nothing you do is going to save your life. In a few situations, people fell out of airplanes and survived. That's not a good reason to advocate not using a parachute when you jump from one.

Lord. Especially when it is so easy.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #248)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:29 PM

266. Uhhhh....no.

IF you had bothered to read my post, you'd know I advocated no such thing.

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Response to kurtzapril4 (Reply #266)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:35 PM

268. I bothered to read your post

I also bothered to respond with my opinion.

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Response to kurtzapril4 (Reply #237)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:56 PM

262. You shoudl not be torn. It is true that seat belts fail a lot - especially in rollovers - but they

fail far less than 1% of the time. If 200 million people drive sometime during the day, a failure rate of one tenth of 1% would be an unacceptable number of failures, but it would not excuse disregarding the single biggest improvement in automotive safety since the car was invented. Condoms fail more than seat belts, but the rare failure is not an excuse to disregard all protection.

It is true that some people have died from an inability to escape a burning or sinking car, but that is an extreme rarity as compared to the vast numbers of people who have had their lives saved by seat belts. Refusing to wear a seat belt on such grounds is like refusing to take a well-proven medication to treat an otherwise fatal illness because of the rare side effect from the medication. The risk you are seeking to avoidi by not wearing your seat belt is tiny compared to the risk you are embracing by going unbelted.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 02:46 PM

238. We had seat belts in our 1951 Chevy because my mother was a terrible driver.

Every time she hit the brakes we'd land on the floor until we got seat belts.

Then that car was t-boned by a driver going the wrong way up a one way street. We (my mother, my brother and myself) were all wearing seat belts. We were fine. The driver of the other car - not so much.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:00 PM

241. Agree with you

Not wearing a seatbelt is stupidity. I was in an accident in my Trans Am on the interstate. I wouldn't be here posting either, had I not been wearing a seatbelt.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:18 PM

246. what if your seatbelt cut your arm off and you died from blood loss?

 

why is it not a "matter of personal choice" or "a victim less crime" or "a blow against the nanny state"?

you could say the same about smoking cigarettes, no?

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Response to underoath (Reply #246)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:24 PM

249. False equivalencies.

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Response to GoneOffShore (Reply #249)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:32 PM

251. More like

"I can't stand the fact that it is against the law to jump into a fire because someone, somewhere at one time jumped into a fire and survived, so why should it be viewed as harmful intent to myself if I do it? The law sucks telling me I shouldn't jump into a fire and puts me in a mental health facility when I do it."

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Response to Aerows (Reply #251)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:33 PM

267. Indeed. As the expression goes:

Teh Stupid - It burns.

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Response to underoath (Reply #246)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:28 PM

250. People have survived falling out of airplanes

without a parachute. People have died because their parachute tangled them up on the way down.

Which do you prefer, your chances jumping out of an airplane with no parachute or with one? Oh, that terrible nanny state mandating that you use a parachute.

I'll take the parachute and the seat belt. You can take your chances without either, and also take your chances getting a ticket because you are too stubborn to use one for your own good. See, you have choices aplenty.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #250)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:37 PM

252. well fudge it, im still not gonna wear my seatbelt.

 

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Response to underoath (Reply #252)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:39 PM

255. Good for you

Don't gripe when you get a ticket, or become seriously injured in a car accident because you aren't wearing one. It certainly is your choice.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #255)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:42 PM

258. exactly.

 

And ill also drive 85 on the express way.

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Response to underoath (Reply #258)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:53 PM

260. And hopefully

You will get pulled over often enough that it becomes to financially burdensome or you lose your license before you kill someone else or yourself. We all make our own choices, but thankfully, we do have laws that curtail making choices for other people - like those people that get harmed or killed by people that don't give a damn about themselves or others.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #260)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:56 PM

261. how can I kill someone else by not wearing my seatbelt?

 

bunch a what-ifs..

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Response to underoath (Reply #261)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:01 PM

263. Your comment about going 85 up the expressway

. You are pretty fun. You need to keep up with what you post.

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Response to underoath (Reply #246)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:40 PM

256. A crash sufficient to cut an arm off due to interaction with the seatbelt would kill an unbelted

occupant.

Wearing a seat belt is largely a matter of choice but it is a very selfish and immature choice that no one should make because those who are catastrophically injured due to the failure to wear a seat belt are a burden on the public medical care and welfare systems funded by all of us.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:37 PM

253. Ill still not wear my seatbelt, thanks for your concern.

 

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Response to underoath (Reply #253)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:45 PM

259. Helmets can only protect functioning brains; seat belts only protect those smart enough to use them

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:37 PM

254. Agreed ...

My nephews and Nieces refuse to ride with me because I don't put the car in gear until all seatbelts are buckled. I've even pulled to the side of the road when one of them unbuckled while we were in route.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 03:41 PM

257. Before you put on your seat belt..........

Make sure your car is road worthy (or if you know how, check to see if your tires are at least mostly full of air )

We who have lost family and friends in accidents know they can become very tragic and it takes care to prevent them.

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Response to nolabels (Reply #257)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:10 PM

265. "My tires and tubes are doing fine but the air is showing through"

--Hank Williams, Settin' the Woods on Fire

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:07 PM

264. I saw a wreck happen in front of me once. Don't know what caused it, but

as I was entering the highway from an onramp, I realized I saw headlights pointed at me amongst a sea of tailights. In the time it took for that to register, I realized the headlights were spinning and flipping and then I saw the car flipping ass over teakettle. It ricocheted, upside down, off the embankment at the side of the highway, and came back down to rest right side up on the highway. I pulled over and RAN as fast as I could to the car, thinking this was going to be the worst mangled mess of a dead body I'll ever see.

That car flipped so violently there were engine parts strewn across the road. All the windows were smashed, and I remember seeing text books all over the road, too.

The guy was not only not dead, but conscious! He was dazed, confused, and God only know what internal injuries he had, but he was alive. He was wearing his seatbelt.

That was the day I decided to rethink my "I fucking hate seatbelts and I'll never wear mine" policy. And also decided it was time to give in to the trend and get a cell phone. First time I had ever wished I had one.

Still hate it. Still fight having to wear one when I go 1/2 a mile down the road to the post office. But I grit my teeth and wear it.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 04:49 PM

269. How wonderful that you survived--that could have been a very bad scene.

Do go to the doctor and get checked out--whiplash can take its sweet time providing you with symptoms ...

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:33 PM

276. I don't think any law that compels you to do something for "your own good" should exist.

 

An exception is where your stupidity directly contributes to the harm of others. Texting while driving, drinking while driving etc.

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Response to Pacafishmate (Reply #276)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:47 PM

278. Being an unsecured passenger in a moving motor vehicle...?

Directly contributes to the harm of others.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #278)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:52 PM

280. Perhaps we can clarify the law, but that is just getting into semantics.

 

Different rules for driving alone vs. driving with passengers?

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Response to Pacafishmate (Reply #280)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:54 PM

282. Why don't you start a thread where you advocate for not wearing a seat belt?

I promise to look in on it.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #282)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 07:02 PM

284. I don't advocate it, I advocate that it should be legal.

 

Just like I don't recommend suicide to anyone, but still feel it should be allowable. There is a limit to coercion and that limit is when one's actions , no matter how personally damaging, do not physically injure others. ( Emotional injury is too subjective.)

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Response to Pacafishmate (Reply #284)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 01:28 AM

294. "I don't advocate it, I advocate that it should be legal."

Wow. I haven't seen tap-dancing like that since Fred Astaire.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #294)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 10:36 AM

297. I acknowledge that it is safer to drive with a belt.

 

I don't think we should force people to do something even if it clearly benefits them. Have you read J.S. Mill's On Liberty ? You know the foundations of liberalism?

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Response to Pacafishmate (Reply #297)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 11:06 AM

299. Quoting John Stuart Mill:

"A person may cause evil to others not only by his action but by his inaction, and in either case he is justly accountable to them for the injury."

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 06:49 PM

279. Been doing it since I could sit on a regular seat

Sometimes, I do have to remind my mom >.>

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:15 PM

287. How horrifying! Thank you for this.

I am really bad about never wearing my seatbelt. I know statistically most accidents occur something like within 4 miles of your house but for some reason, I never seem to wear mine when I go to work (1.5 miles from home) only when I am going a greater distance.

This is a good wakeup call.

I didn't read the thread, but if you aren't anti-chiropractic, may I suggest a visit? You got tossed pretty violently and could end up with pains down the road (or things like vertigo) that a good chiro can detect and start therapy on before a regular doc would be able to diagnose it. That, and registering now as a client can help with getting physical therapy appointments with PT staff more quickly if/as needed. The insurance of the guy who hit you will likely pay too - given the massive lawsuit you are about to file.

Things like vertigo and pinched nerves can be worked out with specific maneuvers by PT as opposed to pharma from the Doc - and be more effective for "non-injury injuries" (is there a term for that?) that can accompany a wreck like that. Saved my like after a bad fall trying to move stuff and tripping on the stairs. My back didn't start hurting until weeks later, but now is like new and I can now fix my vertigo at home with the PT they taught me.

Be well and let your body rest if you are able. A crash like that is a real shock to the system.

You have my attention, and I promise - I will put it on.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 09:18 PM

290. I drive for a living as a "Road Salesman".

i've been married to my seatbelt for years. I fell naked without one.

Glad you are ok.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 12:33 AM

293. First off I am glad you are safe and able to post here. I know I wear my seat belt

everytime I get into a car BUT my Sister-in-law has been in 2 accidents in her life where IF she had been wearing a seat belt in either of the accidents she would have died.

I don't post this to argue with you I just post this to say I can understand why some people are not too eager too.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 10:41 AM

298. Too much seatbelt is illegal too, though

Really. I had a cage and 5-point harnesses when I autocrossed my old 240SX (it's a very corner-hard sport, the tighter you're strapped in the better) and I had to take out the belts when I got it inspected every year - even though they were FIA-approved with a quick-release buckle, grab the knob at the center of your body and turn, they were "too restraining" and "interfered with easy escape" as well as "not allowing adequate body motion in a crash". Honest to gawd, the PA DMV told me this.

Didn't stop me though. I also ride in full race gear, sans knee pucks. There's no such thing as too much protective gear.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 03:11 PM

302. i am glad you

 

were wearing yours... but it is not your place to tell me or anyone else what they have to do! I don't tell every smoker he shouldn't smoke, nor do i tell fat people they shouldn't eat as much...these are all personal choices in which are victimless actions. The only harm done is done to the one who makes that choice.

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Response to MrDiaz (Reply #302)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 03:21 PM

304. Thanks, but I don't agree with your comparisons.

I agree that an obese person does not directly impact the safety of any other person, and it should be noted that "eating too much" is not the only cause of obesity.
A smoker directly impacts the safety of other people. Second-hand smoke and fire risks. That's why smoking areas are restricted.
A person in a car does indeed impact the safety of other people if he doesn't buckle up. If there are other passengers in the car, he will often become a projectile in a collision and cause harm to them. Plus there is significant societal cost (e.g., for state troopers, EMTs, rescue vehicles, emergency rooms).
So no, these are not victimless actions. The one making the choice is not the only one harmed.
But if someone wants to start a thread that encourages not buckling up, I'll look in on it.

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Response to mac56 (Reply #304)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 03:57 PM

306. here is a post i made on 11/20/12

 

Just posed the question, it was more of a debate.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021857994

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Response to MrDiaz (Reply #306)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 04:09 PM

308. Yeah, many of the same opinions as on this thread.

The very first quote on yours says it all: "You are a complete and utter idiot to not wear a seatbelt. If we have to save idiots from themselves by forcing them to wear them, so be it. The forces involved in an accident (or even a short stop) are so strong that there is no way to brace yourself. Same deal with motorcycle and bicycle helmets. If you are insisting on not wearing a helmet, how about you don't get insurance or an ambulance when you get hurt."

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 03:19 PM

303. in april of 1997 I had a car accident. I was not wearing a seatbelt.

I do not remember this personally, but my now husband said he saw the tail lights go up in the air and the car went end over end 3 times. He was following me in his car. I was ejected from the passenger side window which was closed btw. When I woke up I was underneath something. I could see the moon through some branches. I could hear bob calling me. He said he stepped on my hand but I don't remember that. I heard him say the car was on me. Oh well, now that I know what I am pinned under... I surely can get it off me. Nope. Didn't budge. I think I freaked out and started screaming get it off get it off. Ambulance came and fire department got it off me. I remember going in a helicopter. I was lucky. I had glass in my eyes and along the right side of my face and in my hands. I had bruises from being thrown around the car. I think I bent the shifter. I got a hairline fracture in my leg but other than that and the glass I was ok. Thank god. I was lucky. I did get a ticket for not wearing a seatbelt too. I'd say the accident was enough of a punishment, but eh. I ALWAYS wear my seatbelt ever since. And so do my kids.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 03:58 PM

307. wow, that must have been terrifying.

I am so glad you are ok! I was wearing my seat belt when I had an accident on that scale. I'd hydroplaned on the ramp coming off the highway at high speed and hit the median. My car went air born and after hitting a tree and flipping sideways landed on the other side of the road. all the tires were blown and windows shattered.

I had bruises up and down my body from the seat belt, steering wheel and from being bashed around inside the car and I was in shock(trying to start the car) but I was alive. I can still recall the sound of it all. and the people running up to the car with horrified looks on their faces. To this day I can't believe, on that busy road, that no one was on that side at the time.

So scary. If I hadn't been wearing my seat belt I probably would have gone through the windshield. Again, I am so glad you are OK and are using the experience to warn others.

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Response to mac56 (Original post)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 04:10 PM

309. wow!

glad you ok

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