HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » The goal of education def...

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:32 AM

 

The goal of education deform: "Public schools" to equal "Welfare schools"

Be forewarned: the recent (Georgia) referendum on Constitutional Amendment 1 related to state-approved charter schools is being viewed by its authors and key supporters as much more than an endorsement for increasing the number of charter schools and — they have promised us — improving academic achievement. They view it as an endorsement for drastically altering public education as most Americans define it.

To better understand what I mean, think about the terms “public housing,” “public hospital,” and “public school.” For most people, the term “public housing” conjures up images of low cost, government-subsidized housing for people with little or no income who cannot afford to buy or rent their own homes. Similarly, the term “public hospital” is commonly used to refer to publicly funded hospitals that primarily serve those members of society who have little or no income or private health insurance.

Unlike the previous terms, the term “public school” does not normally conjure up images of places where only “poor people” attend school. Rather, for most of our nation’s history, the term has most commonly been thought of as the place where American children of all descriptions attend school. It is the place where children from the lowest income level to some in the highest income level, and the vast majority in between, come to learn how to read, write, and calculate, as well as countless other lessons, such as how to be good citizens. It is the place that America as a whole is educated.

This is the concept of public education that many of those who pushed the charter amendment apparently wish to change. Some would very much like to see the day when most American children attend schools other than what we currently define as “public schools.” They would prefer that parents place their children either in charter schools or, even better, receive vouchers from the government and send the children to private schools of their choice. Traditional public schools (schools for children of all types) would be replaced with a new type of public school — one for those children whose parents were not motivated enough to move them into a charter or private school or for whom there were none available. In other words, public schools will come to be viewed similarly to public housing and public hospitals, as places for children whose parents, for whatever reasons, cannot find a better alternative.

The charter amendment debate is not over, because the debate was never about charter schools. It was about the nature of public education. It will reappear again and again as the “conservatives” (people who want to conserve and protect the traditional American concept of public schools) and the “neo-radicals” (those who wish to drastically change the nature of public education) debate the numerous measures that the “neo-rads” will put forth each and every legislative session in the name of “providing greater school choice” for Georgia’s parents.

http://blogs.ajc.com/get-schooled-blog/2012/11/28/charter-school-amendment-debate-far-from-over-next-up-in-the-georgia-legislature-redefining-public-schools/

25 replies, 2424 views

Reply to this thread

Back to top Alert abuse

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 25 replies Author Time Post
Reply The goal of education deform: "Public schools" to equal "Welfare schools" (Original post)
HiPointDem Dec 2012 OP
gollygee Dec 2012 #1
JDPriestly Dec 2012 #19
xchrom Dec 2012 #2
Coyotl Dec 2012 #3
ProSense Dec 2012 #6
LWolf Dec 2012 #4
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #5
XemaSab Dec 2012 #7
Starry Messenger Dec 2012 #13
XemaSab Dec 2012 #16
Starry Messenger Dec 2012 #18
TheKentuckian Dec 2012 #17
JDPriestly Dec 2012 #20
LWolf Dec 2012 #24
Odin2005 Dec 2012 #8
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #9
gollygee Dec 2012 #10
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #23
Dustlawyer Dec 2012 #11
RC Dec 2012 #14
Starry Messenger Dec 2012 #12
liberal_at_heart Dec 2012 #15
HiPointDem Dec 2012 #22
goclark Dec 2012 #21
yurbud Feb 2014 #25

Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:36 AM

1. They see anything public

as something they could privitize and make money on.

Eventually we'll end up with charter schools and a voucher to put toward it, and those who can't afford a charter school will go to one of the few public schools. Those schools will not be places anyone would want their children to go.

This is all part of the Chicago School of Economics that has been pushed on us for the past few decades.

But anyway, I agree with you completely. K&R

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to gollygee (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:27 AM

19. Ironically, the more we privatize, the more in debt we fall.

Republicans can either warn about the fiscal cliff or defend privatization.

If we face a fiscal cliff, we have to look at what has changed in our economy since the time when we did not face a fiscal cliff.

First, we are engaged militarily in more places all over the earth -- and hiring private companies to support our relatively small military.

Second, we have pretty much done away with tariffs, sometimes due to trade agreements, sometimes simply out of faith in free trade. This has led to an increase in imports, lower wages for American workers -- and a diminished tax base in the US.

Third, we have privatized a lot of work that our government used to do. Proponents of privatization argue that it is cheaper. But they have yet to prove that. And one of the facts that strongly suggests that privatization is more expensive is that fiscal cliff that everyone talks about. Where did the tax money go? Well, much of it went to private contractors. And there is utterly no indication that private contractors do work better than civil servants, government employees do.

Privatization is a scam. It is yet another product being sold to the American people by the snake oil salesmen in the advertising business. Horrors!

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:56 AM

2. du rec. nt

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:20 AM

3. It is all about profit, privatizing public money into private pockets.

Don't kid yourself, this is about making money, and one of the largest piles of public money is education funding. The politics is more diverse, but profit is behind this movement no matter who gets dragged into the debate.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Coyotl (Reply #3)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:36 AM

6. Exactly, and

the push here is very deliberate. Get people to hype private schools and stir up negativity toward public schools.

Could Federal Educational Vouchers Aimed at the Poor and Useable in Public Schools Work?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002312347

Would you buy your way out of bad public schools by sending your child to a private school?
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10021953969

Jindal voucher overhaul unconstitutionally diverts public funds to private schools, judge rules
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014322479

The RW consistently targets public school because they're consistently being under funded in efforts to push privatization.

This also plays directly into the attitude toward teachers and unions. I wonder how many people praising private schools would support Jindal's plan?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:23 AM

4. This spin on "public"

is visible even here at DU, where "public" SHOULD be given full support.

Instead, when I logged on this morning, the thread at the top of the page was about escape from "bad public schools."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to LWolf (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:26 AM

5. yes, although the pro-privatization people have toned down the bashing a bit since some

 

really egregious cases of privatized school criminality got publicized, they still find ways....

i really despise the upper middle classes some days.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to LWolf (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:40 AM

7. Are you denying that there actually are terrible public schools out there?

http://projects.latimes.com/schools/custom-ranking/county/alameda/statistic/sat-scores/order/lowest/

Would you send your kids to a school where the average SAT score is 1001? Why or why not?

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to XemaSab (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 09:47 AM

13. I think the first five schools on that list are charters actually.

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #13)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:04 AM

16. Let's do some internets research:

Berkeley Technology Academy is a continuation school.

Robeson School of Visual and Performing Arts is a regular public school.

East Oakland School Of The Arts is a regular public school.

Oakland Aviation High is a charter school.

Business, Entrepreneurial School Of Tech is a regular public school.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to XemaSab (Reply #16)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:12 AM

18. I'm on my tablet, so thank you. :)

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Starry Messenger (Reply #13)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:08 AM

17. Anti-education zealots will happily use failing Charter school to flog against Public schools

That is part of why they were so eager to label them as such. Just throw the name out there in a list.

Those that get caught will just paint it as the exception. The game will go on until actual public schools are pretty much toast, then all the sudden they will notice the charter schools mostly suck and then the voucher push can start again with increased support among Democratic voters who by then will just want to hope their kid will have a chance.

Once vouchers are accepted then the work of stagnating and then reducing their value can begin.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to XemaSab (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:44 AM

20. Before I judge a school based on the performance of the children attending the school,

I want to know the educational levels of the parents of the children attending the school.

I want to know the percentage of children whose families are earning low wages or troubled by divorce, job loss, foreclosures, illness, etc.

The fact is that, while some children from families that are not educated do very well in school, and some children who grow up in homes of PhDs or MDs don't do so well, in general, a child's performance in the classroom reflects the level of education of his parents and grandparents.

Income is not a sure predictor. This is especially true in a country of immigrants such as ours. Immigrant parents may be very well educated and lead well disciplined, goal-oriented lives, yet accept jobs that don't pay well due to their poor English.

On the other hand, children from wealthy homes may rebel and not do well at all.

But in general, if you look at the socioeconomic level of the parents of the children a school serves, you will see a correlation with the test scores. So judging the quality of a school by the scores of the students is likely to be misleading to say the least.

To the extent that students in charter schools perform better than those in public schools, the difference is probably due to the involvement and motivation of the parents, the commitment of the parents to insure that their child works and does well in school.

The quality of teaching, teachers and education in public schools is, in my experience excellent when the teachers are dealing with students whose parents are involved and supportive and when the children come from homes that emphasize reading, arithmetic, working hard and making sure their child has the confidence and other psychological tools necessary for success.

Teachers and schools are responsible for providing the learning environment and materials. Parents have to provide a child who wants to learn and take advantage of what the school has to offer.

I watch my children deal with their own children, and I think how lucky the little ones are. I cannot count the number of articles and books my daughter and son-in-law have read on how to raise their child. They are up on all the research. When a child comes from a family in which the parents care that much, he or she has a huge head start. And like so many young parents, my children choose where they live according to "the quality of the schools." Their children would do perfectly well in what is called an "underperforming" school.

My mother did, and she went to a one-room school with a teacher who was barely out of high school and had barely a lick of common sense much less education. The child and the child's parents determine how well the child will be educated.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to XemaSab (Reply #7)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 08:34 AM

24. What makes a school "bad?"

Test scores?

I'm not a worshiper of standardized test scores to begin with. As an educator, I know that there are crucial factors that affect those scores that don't have anything to do with the building or the teacher.

I also know that you get what you pay for and what you mandate. Literally. A "terrible" school can be filled with caring professionals who are doing a great job, within the limits they are given. That is a fact every teacher, in every school, has to confront.

Poorly performing schools are a product of America's driving obsession with domestic tax cuts, privatization, profit, and ensuring a large population of "have nots" to provide cheap labor and cannon fodder than anything else. Abandoning them is a moral atrocity. Labeling them "terrible," instead of America's political disease that deliberately engineers the proper setting for poor performance is part of the problem, not the solution.

I sent my kids to their local public schools. In working class neighborhoods. They learned. Their SATS were fine. My oldest is finishing his M.A. this year.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:45 AM

8. And in the South it will mean "black schools".

The whole "School Choice" movement was started by white Southerners who didn't like sending their kids to integrated schools.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Odin2005 (Reply #8)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:48 AM

9. it will mean black schools in a lot of the north as well.

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Odin2005 (Reply #8)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:49 AM

10. Oh it'll mean that in the north too

There isn't that much intregration in the north anymore, and there really wasn't a lot to begin with. I think we northerners give ourselves too much credit.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to gollygee (Reply #10)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:12 PM

23. +1

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 09:33 AM

11. They want to make public schools so bad that everyone who can will support, and use, Charter

Schools.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to Dustlawyer (Reply #11)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 09:55 AM

14. +100 BINGO! Because that is where the money is.

 

Kids who will grow up to work at minimum wage jobs don't need all that much education anyway. "You want fries with that?" or "Hey look, here's one with the fabric design on the pocket properly lined up with the design on the shirt."

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 09:42 AM

12. k&r

 

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:03 AM

15. the democrats are behind the eight ball on this issue

They have been ignoring this issue for decades. They assumed the status quo would be adequate. There are millions of dissatisfied parents out there who are waiting for leadership on this issue. The democrats let the republicans be the first one out of the gate with a solution to the issue. The republicans of course are wrong on this issue, but even as the republicans are coming out with all this garbage the democratic politicians are still silent. Silence is no longer acceptable. The democrats need to not only address charters but also need to address the massive problems that we have already been having for decades such as class size, funding, and curriculum.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #15)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:11 AM

22. What a misrepresentation of the facts. DEMOCRATIC & REPUBLICAN EDUCATION POLICIES ARE

 

IDENTICAL. THE ENTIRE RULING CLASS IS BEHIND WHAT'S GOING On, UNITED, IN SOLIDARITY, and misrepresenting 'the massive problem,' just as you are.

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:05 AM

21. I supervised beginning teachers in both -- Public Schools win !

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink


Response to HiPointDem (Original post)

Tue Feb 25, 2014, 12:16 AM

25. kick

Reply to this post

Back to top Alert abuse Link here Permalink

Reply to this thread