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Mon Dec 10, 2012, 06:42 AM

Move Over, NRA. Meet the Knife Lobby.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/knife-rights-second-amendment



Knife rights activists say the Second Amendment protects your right to wield anything from a bowie knife to a cutlass.


Move Over, NRA. Meet the Knife Lobby.
óBy Richard Grant
November/December 2012 Issue

Doug Ritter was carrying two pocketknives and a Leatherman on his belt as he entered a suburban barbecue restaurant near his home in Gilbert, Arizona. "If we were in New York City right now, I could be arrested and sentenced to a year in prison for carrying these knives," he told me as we stood in line at the counter.

Sitting down to carve into a big platter of pork and brisket, Ritter, the founder and chairman of Knife Rights Inc., laid out his arguments for restoring our right to carry switchblades, double-edged daggers, combat knives, bowie knives, stilettos, and cutlasses on any street in America. "Knives are essential tools used by millions of Americans every day, at work, at home, at play," he said. "And on rare occasions, they're also used as an arm in self-defense, or to defend one's family. When the Second Amendment talks about the right to bear arms, it doesn't specify firearms in particular."

Ritter, a 59-year-old survival equipment expert, has carried a pocketknife since he was seven, and he feels naked without one. "It's part of getting dressed, like pulling on your pants in the morning," he said. He started Knife Rights in late 2006 after reading a Wall Street Journal article that portrayed military-style tactical knives as a deadly menace but offered no statistics linking them to any crimes.

His group now has more than 2,200 members. Its legal arm receives most of its funding from the knife industry. Its chief lobbyist sits on the National Rifle Association's board of directors, and its website is strewn with overheated endorsements from the likes of Ted Nugent ("God Bless Knife Rights!") and NRA executive vice president Wayne LaPierre.

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Reply Move Over, NRA. Meet the Knife Lobby. (Original post)
unhappycamper Dec 2012 OP
MadHound Dec 2012 #1
RKP5637 Dec 2012 #2
former-republican Dec 2012 #3
RKP5637 Dec 2012 #6
former-republican Dec 2012 #7
RKP5637 Dec 2012 #9
guardian Dec 2012 #20
AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #45
PavePusher Dec 2012 #66
onehandle Dec 2012 #4
TheCowsCameHome Dec 2012 #16
actslikeacarrot Dec 2012 #17
Arkana Dec 2012 #18
slackmaster Dec 2012 #23
The Straight Story Dec 2012 #83
Paladin Dec 2012 #5
Remmah2 Dec 2012 #62
PavePusher Dec 2012 #68
geckosfeet Dec 2012 #8
justanidea Dec 2012 #10
slackmaster Dec 2012 #26
PavePusher Dec 2012 #69
slackmaster Dec 2012 #86
PavePusher Dec 2012 #89
OneGrassRoot Dec 2012 #11
PavePusher Dec 2012 #72
OneGrassRoot Dec 2012 #84
PavePusher Dec 2012 #90
OneGrassRoot Dec 2012 #94
PavePusher Dec 2012 #99
OneGrassRoot Dec 2012 #100
DetlefK Dec 2012 #12
Paladin Dec 2012 #13
RKP5637 Dec 2012 #15
Romulox Dec 2012 #24
Paladin Dec 2012 #34
Romulox Dec 2012 #36
Paladin Dec 2012 #52
Romulox Dec 2012 #58
PavePusher Dec 2012 #74
hootinholler Dec 2012 #28
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #33
PavePusher Dec 2012 #76
zappaman Dec 2012 #81
Buns_of_Fire Dec 2012 #19
AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #47
Buns_of_Fire Dec 2012 #93
wandy Dec 2012 #27
justanidea Dec 2012 #30
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #35
derby378 Dec 2012 #54
Trunk Monkey Dec 2012 #65
MrScorpio Dec 2012 #14
Xyzse Dec 2012 #42
-..__... Dec 2012 #21
slackmaster Dec 2012 #22
Logical Dec 2012 #32
slackmaster Dec 2012 #38
Logical Dec 2012 #61
Paladin Dec 2012 #37
slackmaster Dec 2012 #39
Paladin Dec 2012 #50
oldhippie Dec 2012 #77
slackmaster Dec 2012 #85
Romulox Dec 2012 #25
justanidea Dec 2012 #29
MicaelS Dec 2012 #44
Romulox Dec 2012 #59
MicaelS Dec 2012 #70
ieoeja Dec 2012 #31
RED ONE Dec 2012 #40
Xyzse Dec 2012 #41
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #46
Xyzse Dec 2012 #51
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #55
Xyzse Dec 2012 #56
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #57
zappaman Dec 2012 #60
Xyzse Dec 2012 #64
nadinbrzezinski Dec 2012 #73
Xyzse Dec 2012 #75
RED ONE Dec 2012 #43
AnotherMcIntosh Dec 2012 #48
Aerows Dec 2012 #49
Liberal_in_LA Dec 2012 #79
spin Dec 2012 #87
Aerows Dec 2012 #98
guardian Dec 2012 #105
spin Dec 2012 #107
guardian Dec 2012 #109
Aerows Dec 2012 #97
nolabels Dec 2012 #53
Remmah2 Dec 2012 #63
Liberal_in_LA Dec 2012 #78
bongbong Dec 2012 #67
justanidea Dec 2012 #71
ieoeja Dec 2012 #95
Union Scribe Dec 2012 #96
ieoeja Dec 2012 #104
spin Dec 2012 #91
Initech Dec 2012 #80
MrYikes Dec 2012 #82
hedgehog Dec 2012 #88
spin Dec 2012 #92
Riftaxe Dec 2012 #102
Riftaxe Dec 2012 #101
spin Dec 2012 #108
Azathoth Dec 2012 #103
slackmaster Dec 2012 #106
Azathoth Dec 2012 #110

Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 06:51 AM

1. I have no problem with this,

 

And yes, I carry a knife with me wherever I go because it comes in handy far too many times to leave without it.

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Response to MadHound (Reply #1)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:01 AM

2. I've carried a pocket knife for years and years, much like my father for years and years, it just

goes in my pocket each day. I used to carry a Leatherman on my belt. And this is illegal in some places. I had no idea. What bullshit that is, to be illegal.

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Response to RKP5637 (Reply #2)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:14 AM

3. It might be in a court room but other than that I don't know of any city

 

in the U.S you can't carry a pocket knife of a blade length 4" or under .

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Response to former-republican (Reply #3)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:21 AM

6. Here's an interesting web site on this ...

I haven't looked it over in detail, but glancing at it, there seems to be some interesting information. Some of it's old info. and some is new. What you said makes sense to me as a general rule.

State Knife Laws
http://pweb.netcom.com/~brlevine/sta-law.htm#N-R

Added update:

"Office of the Queens District Attorney of Queens County
Queens criminal Courts Building
125-01 Queens Blvd.
Kew Gardens NY 11415

Cover letter:

As per your request the law strictly prohibits a person from
carrying any type of knife with a blade of 4" or over (Four) in
length. Enclosed is a copy (highlighted) of the statute.

Signed: Mary A. Moris A.D.A

See: http://knife-expert.com/ny.txt

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Response to RKP5637 (Reply #6)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:31 AM

7. Thanks , one thing you have to be careful of now

 

is the assisted opening knives in some states.

Depending on what interruption the LEO decides if one is found in your possession

I know in my state one police officer arrested the person and they charged him with carrying a switch blade.



Nanny states , they know what's best for you.

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Response to former-republican (Reply #7)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:36 AM

9. I just updated my earlier post to you on this thread, about NY and

their 4" knife law, as you were saying. Thanks!

As is often, we push everyone through nanny laws because of the few offenders.

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Response to former-republican (Reply #3)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:04 AM

20. Many states' laws restrict max blade length

 

to less than 4". Many states have 3.5" max. Some have 3" max.

http://thefiringline.com/library/blades/knifelaws.html

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Response to guardian (Reply #20)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:37 AM

45. And some, of course as shown by your link, restict knives regardless of length.

 

I.e., in some States, the fact that a publicly carried knife has a blade less than 2 inches (such as a box cutter) would not provide a safe harbor.

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Response to former-republican (Reply #3)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 02:30 PM

66. Knife laws are, literally, all over the map, especially in urban areas.

 

Legal blade length in some areas is illegal in the next town or county. Folding knives that lock (a safety feature, ever had a folder close on the back of your fingers?) are frequently illegal. And why an arbitrary length? I don't need the government to tell me what length of knife I need for any purpose. That's not government's job.

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:19 AM

4. Who is society to tell me that I can't carry my broadsword into a Starbucks?

There could be Highlanders inside waiting to ambush me.

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Response to onehandle (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:39 AM

16. A thick crust bagel needs to know who's boss.

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Response to onehandle (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:46 AM

17. Starbucks is holy ground..

...noone will fight you there.

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Response to onehandle (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:49 AM

18. I sighed as I stared at the waiter and drew my Hanzo steel

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Response to onehandle (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:20 AM

23. If you lived here in California nobody would be telling you that you can't do that

 

Openly carried, sheathed swords and machetes are perfectly legal to carry in public in most places.

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Response to onehandle (Reply #4)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:53 PM

83. Well, it would be fair since the people working there have sharp weapons

Knives and their bigger cousins are pretty much everywhere already

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:19 AM

5. "Survival Equipment Expert"


That tells me all I need to know about this guy.....

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Response to Paladin (Reply #5)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 01:55 PM

62. A PhD from the University of West Virginia.

 

A real cut up in class.

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Response to Paladin (Reply #5)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 02:54 PM

68. What does it tell you? Share with the rest of us. n/t

 

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:33 AM

8. Knives, swords and other sharpened implements have been key survival tools for humans

for millennia. Sharpened sticks and stones gave humans "the edge" over other beasts. They also proved to be efficient tools for cutting food, making clothing, defending one self, making shelter and killing each other.

One issue with daggers and double edged weapons is that they were often carried concealed and used by criminals to threaten and overpower. In the US, legislation outlawing the use of these items dates to approximately the early 1800's. It was around this time that states started outlawing dueling with firearms.

on edit: I wish ted nugent would just GO AWAY.

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:49 AM

10. I carry a pocket knife (Spyderco Tenacious) with me almost everywhere I go.

 

Not for self-defense (that's what a gun is for) but just because it comes in handy. I'm usually lost if I don't have it.

I also keep a really nice Leatherman Surge multi-tool in my car.

I've always felt the laws against switchblades were a bit silly. Another example of Hollywood movies shaping public opinion. Most quality folding knives can be flicked open with one hand almost as fast as a switchblade.

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Response to justanidea (Reply #10)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:30 AM

26. I wouldn't carry a switchblade because of the possibility of it opening accidentally in my pocket

 

That would not be fun.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #26)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 02:58 PM

69. Most have a safety lock, much as on a gun, just for that purpose.

 

Usually they are dual-purpose in that they will keep the knife from non-purposely opening and closing as well.

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #69)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:11 PM

86. Yes, the one I use at home as a letter opener has that feature

 

Even if it was legal for me to carry in my state, I'd still carry the CRKT M16 instead.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #86)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:20 PM

89. Good choice, that's my current carry knife as well.

 

I used to have a Gerber Griptilian, lost it on a mtn bike ride a few years ago. Loved that knife...

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:52 AM

11. Doesn't matter if it's guns, knives or any other weapon...

My problem is the culture surrounding them in this country. Rather than treat the weapons with seriousness and respect, there's an "in-your-face" Wild West culture surrounding it. I see more and more people casually posing with their guns (not at a shooting range, in their living rooms) and knives like it's some new form of bling, and naming their weapons. There are even companies targeting women, offering pastel-colored AK-47s and such!

It seems to diminish the seriousness of weapons and, imho, can lead to more accidents.

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Response to OneGrassRoot (Reply #11)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:04 PM

72. Yeah, cars should only come in one color too.....

 

so as to not "diminish their seriousness".

Seriously?

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #72)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:57 PM

84. Sorry, lame reply. n/t

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Response to OneGrassRoot (Reply #84)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:22 PM

90. Well, it was rather a lame hypothesis. n/t

 

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #90)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:49 PM

94. Sorry, PavePusher. I hate this topic and shouldn't have interjected...

but I did, so let me try again to express my opinion, which is merely that - my opinion.

Edit to add that I realize this OP is about knives...my comment is what brought guns into the mix. My bad.

First, I'm not someone who advocates banning guns, so let's set that straight right off the bat.

You seemed to focus on my comment about the AK47 being offered in pink and other cute bling-like options and likened it to cars.

So, I assumed you were making the "cars are weapons, too" argument. Were you?

Even though cars are definitely dangerous, I don't equate them with weapons, which were specifically designed as an instrument of attack or defense in combat against adversary.

Cars weren't designed to be an instrument of attack or defense in combat against an adversary, though certainly they can be misused -- accidentally or intentionally -- as such.

Anything can be used as a weapon, but was it designed with that express purpose like guns? That's where I'm coming from.

I think anytime weapons are trivialized within a culture, that presents a danger in and of itself.

To me, when adults are posing with Glocks and AK47s for Christmas pictures as just one example of this "culture" I speak of, that seems to trivialize something that shouldn't be trivialized. Even if people posed with hunting rifles I could see that, as the hunting rifles have a purpose. And these aren't people who are into guns as a sport for marksmanship either. They're into guns because the criminals have guns and the government wants to take all the guns. Period.

Even the most careful, well-intentioned gun owner can make mistakes. Tragic accidents happen. But I think this Wild West culture that is growing in the last five years is conducive to more accidents because there's a chest thumping mentality that goes along with it. They want to shove as many guns in the face of any non-NRA person as they can, because it's their right, and it just leads to a lot of unnecessary shit and it is a growing culture in and of itself.

My dad and grandfathers owned guns. We never saw them. They weren't something to be named and showed off. They had a purpose, and the purpose wasn't to be a display of bling like I'm seeing today in people I know. Bottom line: What I'm witnessing is a lot of white people acting like thugs, though these same people view any non-white person with a gun as a criminal. When it comes to the increase in gun ownership and the way the owners behave with guns since 2008, it is my very, very strong opinion that there is a very, very strong racial component to it.

That's my story.

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Response to OneGrassRoot (Reply #94)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:06 PM

99. I appreciate the in-depth reply.

 

Oddly, this time I wasn't trying to do the cars/weapons analogy so much as an actual color=/=seriousness assertion. I realize I didn't express it well, mea culpa. I don't think making firearms in colors other black or brown detracts from their seriousness any more than offering cars in colors other than Henery Ford's basic black does for cars. In fact, people have decorated their firearms in all manner of ways for hundreds of years, so the phenomenon is nothing new.

Did you know that an AK-pattern rifle makes an excellent hunting rifle? With a hunting legal magazine (semi-auto's have been used in hunting for over 100 years) it has ballistics almost identical to the .30-30 lever-action. But that's beside the point.....

"But I think this Wild West culture that is growing in the last five years is conducive to more accidents..." Except that accident statistics, per capita, are dropping. And I have never seen anyone "shove(ing)... guns" into anyone's face. Carrying openly is not that, any more than two men holding hands and kissing in public is shoving homosexuality in anyones face. Lawful, peaceful exercise of a Constitutional Right should never need to be hidden as if shameful. SOme people have done so as political statements. So what? People do all sorts of things as political statements. Many of them are over-reacting. So what? Again, nothing new under the sun.

And I think your assumption of racism is pretty unfounded. I belong to several gun-discussion boards and the people who get the most support there are minorities and women. Gun control itself has deeply racist roots. Are there some gun owners who are racists? Sure there are. But they certainly aren't the norm. And they get tossed off most of the groups I belong to pretty quickly.

I think one of the problems here is the media saturation. They are the ones truely trying to shove everything in our faces, through every means possible, 24 hours/day. This media-driven perception bias makes even the highly uncommon appear to occur everywhere, all the time. But the perception is not the reality.

That's part of my story. Thanks for your time!

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Response to PavePusher (Reply #99)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:17 PM

100. quick reply...

(sorry, no time to read or respond in depth)

Just wanted to say again that my comments and opinions are based strictly on my very direct observations of others...friends, family, acquaintances....not media related.

My opinions are based on what I'm directly observing; maybe they're not reflective of the situation at large.



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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 07:54 AM

12. "That's not a knife. THIS is a knife."



It's basically just a matter of blade-size. The blade of a pocket-knife is only 2-3" long and barely sharp enough to cut cooked meat. (Although you could stab someone, it's very pointy.)

I've been carrying a pocket-knife with me wherever I go for all my adult life (except for planes and when there's reason to believe there's gonna be security/bouncers at a venue). It's not about being able to defend myself, but about the reassurance to have a basic set of tools at hand.



Carrying huge blades is like carrying an assault-weapon: If it's about self-defense, why do you need the capacity to kill several people in a short time?

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Response to DetlefK (Reply #12)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:31 AM

13. I Dunno---Are You Sure It's "Tactical" Enough?


A person upthread mentioned a Spyderco Tenacious (described it as just a "pocket knife"). I looked up that Spyderco knife online---just reading the description of it made me want to enlist in the Special Forces.

(Sarcasm notice, for those perpetually in need of it.)

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Response to Paladin (Reply #13)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:39 AM

15. I looked it up too, "Spyderco Tenacious." I can see it in the court room, as the DA says, and they

were carrying a "Spyderco Tenacious," as the jury leans forward with looks of horror on their face. And the onlookers wonder with deer in the headlight looks, "now what kind of spider is that?" lol

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Response to Paladin (Reply #13)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:21 AM

24. THIS is what a "Spyderco Tenacious" (3.3" blade) looks like. Melodramatic much?





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Response to Romulox (Reply #24)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:11 AM

34. There Are Four Spyderco Knives In That Series.


They are named (in alpha order): Ambitious, Persistence, Resiliance, and Tenacious. And then there's that way-cool hole in the blade.

I'd be a little careful in who you accuse of being melodramatic......

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Response to Paladin (Reply #34)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:16 AM

36. Right, but the "Spyderco Tenacious" is a *specific* knife in that series.

I'd be a little careful in who you accuse of being melodramatic......


There you go again.

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Response to Romulox (Reply #36)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:56 AM

52. My Point Having Been (In Case You Missed It):


Those names which Spyderco used on those knives have more melodrama to them than I'll generate for the next week. Which says a lot about the nature of the market Spyderco is after.

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Response to Paladin (Reply #52)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 01:26 PM

58. There's nothing wrong with either the name or the knife. Your point was silly. nt

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Response to Paladin (Reply #52)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:10 PM

74. Just like the Ford "Fusion", or a Chevy "Volt". right? n/t

 

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Response to Paladin (Reply #13)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:44 AM

28. Just ask any wine bottle in range

Yes I carry a swiss army and opted for the corkscrew over scissors as it seemed more useful.

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Response to Paladin (Reply #13)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:11 AM

33. They are short blades

Now the serrated 6inch blade I carried as part of my rescue kit (outisde of work) would have, rightfully so, gotten me in trouble.

These days it goes with us in hiking trips. And might just join the first aid kit.

But a spiderco is a well made, very short blade.

Many in EMS and police carry those too. My preference for daily use...a Swiss Army knife.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #33)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:27 PM

76. Why "rightfully so"?

 

Why endorse the creation of a crime where there is no intent to harm?

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #33)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:49 PM

81. I thought you told us before it was a 10" blade?

It shrunk?

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Response to DetlefK (Reply #12)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 09:04 AM

19. That reminds me of the one I had confiscated by the TSA -- at a Bus Terminal!

(Where I honestly DIDN'T have any reason to believe they'd be checking out the populace, since there have been so few instances of Greyhounds being hijacked and driven into buildings. )

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Response to Buns_of_Fire (Reply #19)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:39 AM

47. It may be that not enough people are flying to keep the TSA fully entertained.

 

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Response to AnotherMcIntosh (Reply #47)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:36 PM

93. I guess. Good thing I'd forgotten my Leatherman.

Those pliers can give a nasty pinch, and, since they're spring-loaded, I could have dispensed MULTIPLE pinches before I was subdued and packaged up for Gitmo!

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Response to DetlefK (Reply #12)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:38 AM

27. That's not a knife. That is a tool......

A definite form of self defense in a world where you occasionally need the capacity to tighten a screw.

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Response to DetlefK (Reply #12)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:01 AM

30. I've never been a fan of Swiss Army knives.

 

Yes they have a lot of convenient tools in them, but many of them are too small and flimsy for any serious work.

I keep a Leatherman Squirt PS4 on my keychain as my little handy tool. It seems more sturdy than it's Swiss Army counterparts IMHO.


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Response to justanidea (Reply #30)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:13 AM

35. I go to court way too often

To put it in a key chain. Though the flashlight has had a few questions from Sherriffs.

Go figure, a flashlight.

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Response to justanidea (Reply #30)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 12:30 PM

54. My Victorinox Swiss Army Knife has gotten me out of a few jams on the road

Unfortunately, I've misplaced it, and would very much like to find it once again.

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Response to justanidea (Reply #30)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 02:18 PM

65. I always likd the roach clip that came on a swiss army knife NT

 

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 08:33 AM

14. I want a katana and a gurkha

I already have a Gerber

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Response to MrScorpio (Reply #14)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:27 AM

42. I have both!

Quite a few of the former, one of the latter.

I want to one day have a Schiavona.

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:13 AM

21. Some people really have no business owning edged weapons...

 



Not only that, they're dangerous... they'll cut your fucking throat wide open!...

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:18 AM

22. I've carried a folding lock-blade knife almost every day for nearly 40 years

 

I started doing so at age 15 while I was in high school, after getting beaten up by some surfer bullies.

My current EDC* knife is a CRKT M16-13Z. I like it because it's light, strong, and very easy to open with one hand, and it cost me only $17 from SteepAndCheap.com.



California has very reasonable knife laws.



*EDC = Every Day Carry in the parlance of our time.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #22)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:09 AM

32. Does it swing open with one hand?

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Response to Logical (Reply #32)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:21 AM

38. There is spring tension that tends to keep it closed. That makes it compliant with Section 653k...

 

...of the California Penal Code, i.e. it doesn't qualify as a switchblade. (Which is true of most folding knives on the market.)

The little tab that protrudes downward sticks up when the knife is closed. That can be actuated with the index finger to get the blade moving. There are also thumb studs on both sides of the blade. It's quite easy to open with one hand - Open it partway with the tab or a thumb stud, and a little flick of the wrist opens the blade.

One of the nicest features of 653k is that it has no limit on blade length for a folding knife that is carried closed. But many other states (including Texas) require blades of not more than 4 inches, so the majority of folding knifes (including mine) have blades of less than 4 inches.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #38)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 01:47 PM

61. Nice, I will have to get one

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #22)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:17 AM

37. Where's The 30-Round Magazine And Flash Suppressor?


(Sarcasm alert, because there's bound to be somebody on this thread who needs it.....)

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Response to Paladin (Reply #37)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:22 AM

39. They're right next to That Shoulder Thing That Goes Up

 

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #39)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:50 AM

50. OK, Looks Like You Can Walk Out The Front Door, Now.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #22)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:42 PM

77. The CRKT M-16 is one of my favorite EDCs .....

 

Like many, I have carried a pocketknife of one type or another in my left front pocket pretty much every day since my dad gave me my first Cub Scout knife on my 8th birthday, about 56 years ago. I've carried SAKs, Case Trappers, Stockmen, Buck Folding Hunters, Gerbers, William Henrys, and the above CRKT. Currently residing in my left front pocket is a Chris Reeve small Sebenza.

I can't imagine getting dressed without slipping a knife in my pocket. Oddly enough, I have never cut or stabbed anyone (except myself) in all those years.

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Response to oldhippie (Reply #77)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:06 PM

85. In all the years I have carried a knife for self-defense, I have brandished one exactly one time.

 

Way back when I was 20 or 21 years old. I rode a moped in those days because I couldn't afford a car and my schedule didn't allow for bicycle commuting. My bike was stalling out and needed to have the spark plug cleaned and points adjusted. I was stopped in a somewhat remote area.

Four young men approached me. I could tell from their manner of dress and their gestures that they were gang members.

The leader of the group approached me and pounded his fists together. He asked me if I wanted to fight.

I held up my socket wrench in one hand, and my Buck Folding Hunter in the other (I had been using that to clean the spark plug.)

I said "I'm sorry, I didn't quite understand what you said."

The four turned around and walked away. I guess they figured whatever a college student had with him wasn't worth getting injured for.

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:22 AM

25. What a completely phoney, completely ginned up "issue".

Also, most of the comments on the Mother Jones website were painfully stupid. Yes, a pocket knife is just like an H-bomb.

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Response to Romulox (Reply #25)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:56 AM

29. People who make the H-bomb argument when dicussing 2A issues remind me of anti-gay rights people.

 

You know, the ones who like to say that if two gay people who love each other are allowed to get married, they should be allowed to get married and engage in polygamy with 10 dogs.


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Response to Romulox (Reply #25)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:35 AM

44. Hardly "a completely phoney, completely ginned up issue."

If nothing else it's a direct pushback against the idiocy of cities like NYC and countries like the UK.

Doug Ritter was carrying two pocketknives and a Leatherman on his belt as he entered a suburban barbecue restaurant near his home in Gilbert, Arizona. "If we were in New York City right now, I could be arrested and sentenced to a year in prison for carrying these knives," he told me as we stood in line at the counter.

But Knife Rights has run into sharp opposition in New York City. In 2010, Manhattan District Attorney Cyrus Vance Jr. held a press conference showcasing hundreds of "illegal knives" after his undercover investigators had bought dozens at stores like Home Depot and Eastern Mountain Sports. The stores agreed to pay nearly $1.9 million in penalties. An adviser to Mayor Michael Bloomberg praised the DA for removing "a threat that was hiding in plain sight." Knife Rights is suing the city and Vance for allegedly misclassifying ordinary one-handed folding knives as illegal switchblades or gravity knives. (Gravity knives are not opened by a spring or by pushing the blade out, but rather by releasing a latch that lets the blade "drop" out.)

It's hard to determine whether New York-style anti-knife laws actually make the streets safer. According to the FBI, knives were used in 13 percent of homicides in 2010. Jan Billeb, the executive director of the American Knife and Tool Institute ("Imagine Your Life Without a Knife"), claims that the overwhelming majority of knife crimes are committed with kitchen knives.

Ritter worries that if "the demonization of knives" continues, we'll end up like Europe, where knives are often strictly regulated. He recalls a trip to England, where folding blades longer than three inches are illegal and you can't carry any knife in public "without good reason." (Self-defense doesn't count.) Ritter was testing life rafts on a sailboat when the ropes got tangled. "The only practical solution was to start cutting some lines loose," he recalled. "The rest of the folks were all connected with marine safety, but I was the only person that had a knife on board. Not even the captain of this boat. When I pulled it out and opened it up, it was like, 'Oh my God, he's got a knife. Look at that thing!' It was a little three-inch folder, just another tool I carry, and truly a critical piece of safety gear on a boat."

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Response to MicaelS (Reply #44)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 01:29 PM

59. In the sense that Mother Jones is attempting to create hysteria where none should exist. nt

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Response to Romulox (Reply #59)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:00 PM

70. Ah, I see your point. Thank you. n/t

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:03 AM

31. Carried a sword in Chicago on many occasions. Encouters with cops go like this:


"Is that real?"

"Yup."

"Okay."


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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:22 AM

40. Knife Lobby

Whats worse in the bowling ball rights lobby is rolling up! !! !!! That's right, anyone, just anyone can with no background check can purchase a deadly bowling ball Help us ban this deadly menace.

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:25 AM

41. I've Been Waiting for This

My Butterflies became illegal years after I got them.

I also want to be able to buy Body Armor of any type. I have some that has after a few years are now not allowed to be sold. Though I want a better one which I can not buy.

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Response to Xyzse (Reply #41)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:38 AM

46. Pray tell me what do you need body armor for?

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #46)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:52 AM

51. Well, since I don't own guns.

I don't own them or anything. If I am going for self defense, body armor to me makes more sense.
I don't have to pack heat, but if something bad does happen, I'd like a bit more survivability.

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Response to Xyzse (Reply #51)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 12:32 PM

55. You do know how to wear it

And how to take care of it, and that it is not bullet proof I hope.

I was a medic, I wore it, and I knew a riffle round was going through...and it is all but comfy. But hey...it makes zero sense unless you are in certain lines of work.

Oh and I forgot, see thread subject...make sure you include chain mail...knives defeat the best of Kevlar every day and twice on Sunday.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #55)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 01:02 PM

56. Yep!

I currently have one of those things you get from Scuba gear with swimming with the sharks, if and when the Zombie Apocalypse does happen.

Regardless, I just want it for the heck of it. I doubt I'd go around wearing something like that any time soon.

I'd also like wearing it when I practice with friends with them using Airsoft Pistols. I like knowing how to wear and use some things. Body armor is just one of them.

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Response to Xyzse (Reply #56)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 01:06 PM

57. Now air soft makes sense

See if the cops will ll you some really expired, and rank i might add, Kevlar.

It might not stop a .22 at that point, but it will reduce those welts.

I don't do it, or I would have kept mine for that

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #57)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 01:34 PM

60. You were very lucky too

Being in "multiple shootouts" like you have been including once where "an engine block" saved your life, makes you very lucky indeed.
Not to mention, extremely brave!

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #57)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 02:13 PM

64. I can agree with that.

My knowledge on guns and modern armor is limited to what I've read.
Like I mentioned earlier, the only type of armor I have at the moment is the chain link you can get from scuba gear.

In regards to getting actual ballistic armor, I'd want one just to see how I can move around with it.
I don't see myself trolling around with it other than if I go around with some friends who would shoot at me with airsoft pistols while I try to whack them with a shinai. ((Yes, it is for fun and exercise))

I still consider avoiding potential bad situations the best form of self defense, but hey, I'd still want one for that sake.

Other than that, I guess I should just get a weighted vest. Though I'll take your suggestion on that part.

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Response to Xyzse (Reply #64)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:08 PM

73. I have...it is bulky

It is hot...and they have gotten less bulky, but doing CPR chest compressions with one on was worst than wearing structural firefighting gear and a SCBA tank...they just got in the way.

They have gotten less bulky.

FYI there s a company in Bogota that specializes in putting panels in business wear, they are rated high, for small arms.

And the Shinai sounds like fun.

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Response to nadinbrzezinski (Reply #73)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:12 PM

75. Yes it is!

And thanks for the info.

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:28 AM

43. question

Is that a sword in your pocket are are you glad to see me?

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:47 AM

48. If those who post that the 2A only authorizes muskets and flint-locks, would they agree that the 2A

 

also authorizes sabers and cutlasses?

Where's their support for this.

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 11:50 AM

49. I carry a pocket knife

It's on my keychain. It saves my fingernails if I need to open a box or something. Panicking about people carrying pocket knives is ridiculous.

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Response to Aerows (Reply #49)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:45 PM

79. are you licensed to carry that?

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Reply #79)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:11 PM

87. In Florida I can carry a large concealed fixed blade knife if I wish ...

as I have a concealed weapons permit.

In the rural town where I live I often carry a 4" fixed blade hunting knife on my belt exposed. If I go to a more urban area such as Tampa I simly conceal this knife to avoid any hassels from the local authorities who do not always understand Florida weapons law.

I use knives as tools as I have no training in knife fighting. I carry a snub nosed .38 for self defense.

My Florida carry permit does not allow me to carry a knife in the states that have reciprocity with Florida.

FLORIDA'S RECIPROCITY STATES

***snip***

(1) While Florida's law allows licensees to carry stun guns, knives, and billy clubs in a concealed fashion, the laws in these states allow for concealed carry of handguns or pistols ONLY, NOT WEAPONS IN GENERAL. Florida license holders are prohibited from carrying other types of weapons while in these states.
http://licgweb.doacs.state.fl.us/news/concealed_carry.html



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Response to spin (Reply #87)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:57 PM

98. I live in Mississippi

Though I lived in St. Pete for 10 years. If you have a problem with people carrying knives, the South is not for you. LOL.

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Response to spin (Reply #87)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 01:35 PM

105. You are lucky

 

Here in Colorado our concealed weapons permit is actually a Concealed Handgun Permit. So I can carry my XDm 45 with two 13 rd mags most everywhere. But if I carry a knife with a blade longer than 3.5" I'll get in trouble for carrying a concealed weapon.

So I can carry this with 14 rounds of 45 ACP


But not this (3.6" blade)


Go figure.

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Response to guardian (Reply #105)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 03:13 PM

107. Your 3.5" Benchmade folder is an excellent tool for everyday use. ...

In Florida you can carry a "common pocket knife" clipped to your pocket and it is not considered to be a concealed weapon. However the police in Florida seem to lack understanding of Florida's knife laws. I was once asked by a police officer if I had a concealed weapons permit when he observed a Benchmade knife clipped to my pants pocket in a gun store.

I politely showed him my carry permit but as I look back on the incident I fault myself for not mentioning to him that my knife was not concealed.

Knives often have a nasty reputation in many states. I find this strange that so many states prohibit carrying knife if it has a blade longer than 4" even for those who have a handgun carry permit. It makes little sense to me.

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Response to spin (Reply #107)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 05:30 PM

109. "It makes little sense to me."

 

These sorts of idiot laws come from the same ilk as the anti gun types who are protecting us from ourselves.

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Response to Liberal_in_LA (Reply #79)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:55 PM

97. LOL

an inch and a half long blade. If I needed to be licensed for it, I assure you, my tool kit for repairing servers contains things far more intimidating. I haven't gotten stopped on a flight, yet.

EDIT: Not that I carry my car keys on flights - I can't. I have to check my bag of tools, but my point is that I have things far more *interesting* than a pen knife could ever be in my tool kit as a result of my profession. Doesn't hurt that I am tiny and blond, but still manage to look intimidating while doing so

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 12:06 PM

53. I sometimes venture out of the house without my pants

but i always remember to bring my pocketknife.

Somebody is very insecure and or stupid if they think a knife would be so indispensable.

Tools are nice but the more experience you have the more you know the tool that is most important is the one between your ears.

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 01:56 PM

63. The sharpest thread in the DU!

 

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Response to Remmah2 (Reply #63)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:45 PM

78. lol n/t

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 02:36 PM

67. A different subspecies of Delicatcus Flowerus

 

Scared, cowardly people need their weapons at all times. You never know when a "thug" (wink, wink; to a Delicate Flower it means "anybody browner than I am") will attack you. Delicate Flowers know that, no matter how small or deserted, the streets of Everytown USA are like Baghdad, only worse!

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Response to bongbong (Reply #67)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:01 PM

71. You're right. I use my knife to cut a lot of brown things.

 

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Response to justanidea (Reply #71)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:52 PM

95. I use my car keys or comb. Rips right through the tape. n/t

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Response to ieoeja (Reply #95)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:53 PM

96. That's going to leave adhesive all over your keys.

Not good.

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Response to Union Scribe (Reply #96)

Tue Dec 11, 2012, 10:06 AM

104. Been doing it for decades. Haven't had a problem yet. n/t

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Response to bongbong (Reply #67)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:26 PM

91. I qualify as one of your delicate flowers ...

I ALWAYS have a knife on my person.

I use whatever knife I happen to be carrying many times each day to open packages, slice wire, cut food etc. etc. A knife is a very useful tool.

For self defense I legally carry a snub nosed revolver. Fortunately I have never had to use it for my protection and I doubt that I ever will. It's there if I ever need it. Since i have no skill in knife fighting which is a separate martial art than defensive shooting, I don't view a knife as a weapon.

Your "delicate flowers" insult is original and funny. I have been insulted many times here on DU because I own firearms and have a carry permit. I take no offense at such insults and find them merely amusing. I could easy insult you in return but I am inherently a very polite individual. Since I do carry a lethal weapon, I feel that being slow to anger and respectful of other's opinions to be a positive trait.

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:47 PM

80. "You know why I use a knife? Guns are too quick." - The Joker

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 03:49 PM

82. They passed a law forbidding school bus drivers from carrying a pocket knife.

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:18 PM

88. My sons and daughters all looked upon getting their own, authentic Leathermen as a rite

of passage. They were sad when the tools were banned from the high school.

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Response to hedgehog (Reply #88)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 04:29 PM

92. When I attended high school most boys carried a pocket knife. ...

Of course that was back in the 60s.

We did have occasional fist fights at school but nobody ever pulled a knife.

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Response to spin (Reply #92)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:38 PM

102. There was no stigma about having guns in your cars

when i was in school, it was just assumed, during hunting season they would be in most of the vehicles in the parking lot.

Somehow, we survived with zero incidents...LOL

on edit: sure we had the usual fist fights as well, usually over the inane of things that seemed to matter at that age.

I suppose it was a different time, when we expected more out of young people then being demented lunatics. But since we have set the bar so low these days, how could we expect more?

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:36 PM

101. I have always carried a knife

it is a simple tool, and quite useful.

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Response to Riftaxe (Reply #101)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 03:31 PM

108. I also always have a knife on me but many people have asked me why. ...

Before I retired the same people who asked me that question would often spend five minutes looking for a pair of scissors to cut a tie strap or an exacto knife to open a cardboard box. I would laugh and hand them my folder. I would then explain to them, "You will probably waste a week of your life looking for a sharp object to use as a tool. Now perhaps you will understand why I carry my knife."

A number of my co-workers started to carry a blade. For a while it became a fad at work which some supervisors frowned on. The engineering supervisor cautioned his staff about this practice after one of the younger engineers formed a habit of flicking his knife open for no reason. This boss felt it looked unprofessional and might scare some people or customers. One engineer bought a cheap locking knife and managed to badly cut himself when the lock failed. I took the time to explain to him that I carried a quality folder like my Benchmade axis lock blade as cheap folders are often dangerous junk.

I worked with a number of extremely intelligent engineers during my career and I found that while they were brilliant they often lacked commonsense.

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Response to unhappycamper (Original post)

Mon Dec 10, 2012, 10:58 PM

103. Not for nothing, but over-the-top weapons like axes and broadswords have *never* been protected

by the Second Amendment, at least so far as the right to bear them is concerned. There were laws on the books back when the Constitution was ratified banning people from carrying stuff like that around. If this guy is agitating for cutlasses and samurai swords, then he's delusional.

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Response to Azathoth (Reply #103)

Wed Dec 12, 2012, 01:38 PM

106. Laws in colonial America did not prohibit people from carrying sheathed swords

 

Just like most state laws today.

Here in California I can wear a sword or machete all day long if I want to.

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Response to slackmaster (Reply #106)

Thu Dec 13, 2012, 02:41 AM

110. The laws were a patchwork

Last edited Thu Dec 13, 2012, 03:18 AM - Edit history (1)

Obviously, they didn't ban things like officers' swords and cavalry sabers. But there were certain regulations and prohibitions. In fact, Scalia himself recently cited one such colonial law banning "frightening" weapons like axes, the moral being that even Scalia recognizes the Second Amendment admits historical, common sense limits. Over the top nonsense like broadswords and cutlasses in the local Starbucks is not, and never was, constitutionally protected, even if states choose to allow it.

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