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Fri Nov 30, 2012, 12:16 AM

AAA warns E15 gasoline could cause car damage

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2012/11/30/aaa-e15-gas-harm-cars/1735793/

AAA warns E15 gasoline could cause car damage
Gary Strauss, USA TODAY
E15, a higher blend of ethanol and gasoline, has rolled out in a handful of states. But its use in older vehicles is generating warnings from AAA, which says E15 could be harmful to pre-2012 vehicles.

12:04AM EST November 30. 2012 - The AAA says the Environmental Protection Agency and gasoline retailers should halt the sale of E15, a new ethanol blend that could damage millions of vehicles and void car warranties.

AAA, which issued its warning Friday, says just 12 million of more than 240 million cars, trucks and SUVs now in use have manufacturers' approval for E15. Flex-fuel vehicles, 2012 and newer General Motors vehicles, 2013 Fords and 2001 and later model Porsches are the exceptions, according to AAA, the nation's largest motorist group, with 53.5 million members.

"It is clear that millions of Americans are unfamiliar with E15, which means there is a strong possibility that many may improperly fill up using this gasoline and damage their vehicle," AAA President and CEO Robert Darbelnet tells USA TODAY. "Bringing E15 to the market without adequate safeguards does not responsibly meet the needs of consumers."

BMW, Chrysler, Nissan, Toyota and VW have said their warranties will not cover fuel-related claims caused by E15. Ford, Honda, Kia, Mercedes-Benz and Volvo have said E15 use will void warranties, says Darbelnet, citing potential corrosive damage to fuel lines, gaskets and other engine components. ...

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Response to jsr (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 12:42 AM

1. So, the US will probably proceed and the new car manufacturers are licking their chops at all

of the potential sales. I've heard this a number of times from various sources, it's unwise and beyond that it's utterly stupid.

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Response to jsr (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 12:45 AM

2. Oh just shut the hell up and go out and buy a $40K chevy volt. No worries, right? /sarc off. eom

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Response to jsr (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 12:54 AM

3. What a load of codswallop.

This is the same story heard years ago warning us about the immenent dangers of using 'gasahol' when ethanol-blended gasoline first came out, and the same thing when biodiesel blends were first mandated.

Nothing happened then, either.



The AAA is relying on an American Petroleum Institute study saying that E15 is bad...c'mon, what do you think they were going to say?

The EPA does some fairly extensive testing of any new fuel blends coming to market, I think that I'll trust them over the Oil Industry lobbyists when they say E15 will cause few, if any problems.

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Response to Ikonoklast (Reply #3)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 01:26 AM

5. One thing is for sure

it would be nice to not lose warranty coverage on ones vehicle.

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Response to jsr (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 01:08 AM

4. In the 1990's I had a 1965 Ford Fairlane...

...When leaded gas was eliminated, I heard horror stories about how this was going ruin the classic cars' engines.
For awhile I bought an additive, but gave up after awhile.
My car was fine for years. I finally sold it with no engine problems. I'm realizing now that this was my first experience with petroleum industry B.S.

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Response to lexw (Reply #4)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 01:29 AM

6. I remember seeing pistons with holes in them

from using unleaded gasoline in an engine designed for leaded fuel. Fair to say it was a weak design, just thought I'd mention it.

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Response to BootinUp (Reply #6)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 01:39 AM

7. Thx. Me and my paranoia stand corrected. :)

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Response to lexw (Reply #7)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 02:01 AM

8. There's enough additives now, that aren't lead, that vintage cars can get away with it.

I don't know any classic car owners that still add lead, but for a time, it was necessary.

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Response to AtheistCrusader (Reply #8)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 02:22 AM

10. okay. thx. I didn't know this.

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Response to BootinUp (Reply #6)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 11:58 AM

15. That would have mostly caused by pre-ignition detonation.

People tried to get by using a lower octane fuel, which is what the new unleaded "Regular" actually is.

They may have got by using lower octane fuel if they adjusted the ignition timing, but that is beyond most people to either diagnose for the proper setting or even understand why.

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Response to lexw (Reply #4)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 04:06 AM

12. it's actually gotten worse since then.

in the 90's, yes, it was largely hype. the concern then was valve seat wear. turns out that many manufacturers used quality metals in their valve seats that did not wear as fast as expected. now it's a different issue. almost all current production engines have roller lifters, while older engines have flat lifters, the flat lifters need the lead or ZDDP in the oil, which is being reduced because new engines don't need it. the result is flattened cam lobes. generally, if the engine is a runner, it will be fine. but newly rebuilt engines are at great risk and should use additives.

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Response to uncle ray (Reply #12)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 06:18 AM

14. There is additives for oils for old engines or use this stuff...

 

Amsoil ZROD

AMSOIL Z-ROD™ Synthetic Motor Oil is specially engineered for classic and high-performance vehicles. It features a high-zinc formulation to prevent wear on flat-tappet camshafts and other critical engine components, along with a proprietary blend of rust and corrosion inhibitors for added protection during long-term storage. Z-ROD Synthetic Motor Oil is designed to perform on the street and protect during storage.

AMSOIL, the leader in automotive synthetic lubrication, produced the world’s first API-qualified synthetic motor oil in 1972. Trust the extensive experience of AMSOIL, the First in Synthetics®, to do the best job protecting your engine.

Protects Flat-Tappet Cams
The lifters and cam lobes on flat-tappet camshafts common to classic and high performance vehicles slide rapidly against one another, producing high friction and heat. The friction between the two components can eventually wear down the cam and affect valve operation, ultimately resulting in lost engine power and reduced efficiency. In addition, these areas are splash-lubricated rather than pressure lubricated like other areas of the engine, which adds extra strain on anti-wear additives like the zinc and phosphorus in zinc dialkyldithiophosphate (ZDDP).

AMSOIL Z-ROD Synthetic Motor Oil is formulated with high levels of ZDDP to protect flat-tappet cams, lifters, rockers and other areas susceptible to wear. Its high-zinc, high-phosphorus formulation provides the extra wear protection these critical splash-lubricated components require.


http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/zrt.aspx

This stuff ain't cheap but is good for 5000 miles of 1 year which makes taking care of older vehicles a lot easier.


I try to sell Amsoil prods but people are so cheap I need to give out samples to show people how effectively the products work.

I do not ship & am not trying so sell to anyone here, If anyone has any oil related questions I am 1/2 competent & will answer anything I can.

Amsoil is the only product I use in my car or motorcycles, I am on limited income & am a very careful shopper. My car has only 127k miles on it & will last me about 20 more years. 2 m/c have about 30k miles each, they will last the rest of my life.


GAS W/O ANY ETHANOL Locator: http://pure-gas.org/

My car goes further on 10 gallons of pure gas than 11 gallons of E-10!!

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Response to jsr (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 02:03 AM

9. Well, if it blows up my 05' scion, I'll get a leaf.

I'd rather not, but it's way way out of warranty now anyway. 130k miles, runs like a top.

Won't last forever though.

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Response to jsr (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 02:31 AM

11. Adding food to fuel is just a really dumb idea anyway, especially in light of the fact that it takes

 

more fuel to convert the food in the first place.

The answer has been and is still staring us in the face. We simply have to stop burning fossil fuels to move stuff around.

Oil is wonderful stuff, and if we grow up and face reality there is still plenty of it. But we simply have to convert to other methods of moving stuff around than those we are using for no other reason than to preserve an obsolete, entrenched industry.

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Response to jsr (Original post)

Fri Nov 30, 2012, 04:54 AM

13. Ethanol = Genetically Mutant Clusterf*ck, Inc.

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