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Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:18 PM

4th graders who flunk reading have faces marked

DECLO, Idaho (AP) A fourth-grade teacher in southern Idaho is being criticized after having her students use permanent markers to draw on the faces of classmates who failed to meet reading goals.

Some parents and administrators say the punishments given to nine students in Summer Larsen's class were inappropriate and left the children feeling shamed.

Cindy Hurst said recently her 10-year-old son came home from school Nov. 5 with his entire face including his eyelids scribbled on with green, red and purple markers.

"He was humiliated, he hung his head and wanted to go wash his face," Hurst told The Times-News of Twin Falls (http://bit.ly/QMwMTJ). "He knows he's a slow reader. Now he thinks he should be punished for it."

Larsen, who has taught at the school for six years, didn't respond to requests for comment. But Cassia County School District Superintendent Gaylen Smyer confirmed what took place in her classroom, though he didn't name Larsen.

http://www.bigstory.ap.org/article/fourth-graders-who-flunk-reading-have-faces-marked

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Reply 4th graders who flunk reading have faces marked (Original post)
The Straight Story Nov 2012 OP
Turbineguy Nov 2012 #1
Skidmore Nov 2012 #6
Celebration Nov 2012 #2
Rhiannon12866 Nov 2012 #3
gollygee Nov 2012 #4
PotatoChip Nov 2012 #12
elehhhhna Nov 2012 #27
Klukie Nov 2012 #5
Hekate Nov 2012 #7
backtoblue Nov 2012 #8
Downwinder Nov 2012 #34
aroach Nov 2012 #36
Barack_America Nov 2012 #81
CoffeeCat Nov 2012 #9
Arkansas Granny Nov 2012 #10
siligut Nov 2012 #11
CoffeeCat Nov 2012 #14
elehhhhna Nov 2012 #30
IDoMath Nov 2012 #13
marmar Nov 2012 #17
ohheckyeah Nov 2012 #18
IDoMath Nov 2012 #22
The Straight Story Nov 2012 #25
IDoMath Nov 2012 #29
elehhhhna Nov 2012 #33
IDoMath Nov 2012 #40
ohheckyeah Nov 2012 #63
ohheckyeah Nov 2012 #32
Chan790 Nov 2012 #51
ohheckyeah Nov 2012 #57
elehhhhna Nov 2012 #31
DisgustipatedinCA Nov 2012 #39
IDoMath Nov 2012 #41
DisgustipatedinCA Nov 2012 #43
IDoMath Nov 2012 #45
DisgustipatedinCA Nov 2012 #52
Chan790 Nov 2012 #55
IDoMath Nov 2012 #61
ohheckyeah Nov 2012 #59
ceile Nov 2012 #50
jpak Nov 2012 #60
backscatter712 Nov 2012 #67
HiPointDem Nov 2012 #15
hollysmom Nov 2012 #16
forestpath Nov 2012 #24
Waiting For Everyman Nov 2012 #19
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #94
nichomachus Nov 2012 #20
Downwinder Nov 2012 #21
retread Nov 2012 #23
nenagh Nov 2012 #26
yardwork Nov 2012 #46
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #48
liberal_at_heart Nov 2012 #28
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #38
yardwork Nov 2012 #47
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #58
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #35
yardwork Nov 2012 #53
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #65
yardwork Nov 2012 #83
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #90
yardwork Nov 2012 #96
surrealAmerican Nov 2012 #37
Iwillnevergiveup Nov 2012 #42
yardwork Nov 2012 #44
rrneck Nov 2012 #49
smirkymonkey Nov 2012 #89
HereSince1628 Nov 2012 #54
redwitch Nov 2012 #75
jpak Nov 2012 #56
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #73
Hekate Nov 2012 #82
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #91
Butterbean Nov 2012 #62
Initech Nov 2012 #64
EC Nov 2012 #66
backscatter712 Nov 2012 #68
kath Nov 2012 #69
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #71
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #70
demhottie Nov 2012 #72
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #77
Sabriel Nov 2012 #98
proud2BlibKansan Nov 2012 #74
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #78
Honeycombe8 Nov 2012 #80
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #92
Sheldon Cooper Nov 2012 #76
Hekate Nov 2012 #79
GiaGiovanni Nov 2012 #93
Bad_Ronald Nov 2012 #84
dsc Nov 2012 #85
Whisp Nov 2012 #86
Marrah_G Nov 2012 #87
Auntie Bush Nov 2012 #88
Comrade_McKenzie Nov 2012 #95
former-republican Nov 2012 #97

Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:20 PM

1. Oh noes!

not another Romney tattoo!

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Response to Turbineguy (Reply #1)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:26 PM

6. You pretty much failed in the same way that this teacher did.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:21 PM

2. Summer Larson

Your judgment is so terrible that you do not deserve to have any students!

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:23 PM

3. How awful!



Doesn't this mean the teacher failed, too?

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:23 PM

4. Holy crap

I am trying to imagine how angry I'd be if my daughter came home from school with her face, including even eyelids, scribbled on with permanent marker.

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Response to gollygee (Reply #4)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:30 PM

12. Yup.

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Response to gollygee (Reply #4)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:58 PM

27. you'd feel like your baby was bullied


mark my words, that teacher will be working in a non-union low-paying non-background-checkin' CHARTER school by January 2.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:25 PM

5. This is completely disgusting!!!

I really hope that the teacher is reprimanded. I have a 4th grader who never passes her oral reading fluency benchmark and I would be livid if this happened to her!! Although she doesn't read at the the standards that were set up by Dibels, she has all A's in reading and she scored advanced in the state standardized test at the end of the third grade. The judgment of this teacher was horribly wrong!

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:26 PM

7. What, was she out of dunce caps?

How can you do that to a kid? That teacher should be ashamed of herself, the self-righteous so-and-so.

When I was in school I was a whiz at reading, always above grade level. But if someone had punished me with social humiliation for my performance in math or foreign languages, I would have wanted to drop out of school rather than endure such a thing.

Where is this teacher's empathy? Sorry, I give her an F in that subject.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:27 PM

8. The wrath from this mother if that happened to my child

would be horrific on the grand scale of making news headlines. How humiliating to those kids! The teacher is a bully.

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Response to backtoblue (Reply #8)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:07 PM

34. And encouraging bullying

by having the other students apply the punishment.

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Response to backtoblue (Reply #8)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:08 PM

36. I'm with you

If this had been my kid I'd be needing bail money.

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Response to backtoblue (Reply #8)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 07:35 PM

81. Yup.

Just what I was thinking.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:28 PM

9. What in the hell is wrong with this disgusting teacher?

Some kids ARE slow readers. Some kids are late bloomers. One of my daughters is a straight-A seventh grader who reads three books a week. She was a late bloomer who had trouble reading in elementary school.

I can't IMAGINE what this stupid teacher was thinking. The humiliation of allowing OTHER students to mark up this child's face. These are eight and nine year old kids!

This act was abusive. It was a severe boundary violation, teaching these kids that their bodies deserve violation by a mob of students who were probably laughing, mocking and taunting them as they treated their faces like an object that deserved to be vandalized--like spray painting graffiti on a cement wall.

This teacher showed such poor judgment and obviously lacks empathy and critical thinking skills. She sounds like a complete idiot who probably has some very deep issues of her own.

If I were the parent, I'd be lawyering up. Intentional infliction of distress, humiliation, harassment--just to start.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:29 PM

10. She should not be teaching children. Period. This is not acceptable.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:29 PM

11. The children had a choice, miss recess or get scribbled on

The students were allowed to choose their own incentive to meet the reading goal, but instead of a reward, the class chose a punishment: Students who failed to meet the goal could either stay inside at recess until it was met, or have their faces written on by classmates who met the goals.

Nine students didn't meet the goals, the paper reported Friday. Three chose to forgo recess, and the other six chose to have their faces marked on.

"Although all the students in the class agreed to the incentive, once it occurred it was not so well received. Nor should it have been," Smyer said.


I don't know why children would choose punishment, rather than reward. I am guessing an overly authoritarian environment.

Some parents were supportive, however. Karla Christensen, whose daughter met Larsen's reading goals, said the teacher was just trying to motivate students.


While the children made the choice, it seems, the teacher should have known better. Children don't learn well through humiliation.

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Response to siligut (Reply #11)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:35 PM

14. But to a child--missing recess is very concrete and almost measurable to them...

This teacher set up a false choice--because in a child's mind missing recess is so awful to them. This is their only time to socialize, get fresh air and to have fun outside, during their seven hour day. It's easy to say--I'll take the other punishment.

I don't think these kids--who are only eight and nine years old--really understood the ramifications of the alternative or knew how they would feel when a mob of kids marks up your face and humiliates you.

It's like asking an eight-year old--Do you want to have your bike taken away, or do you want to do some welding with a blow torch by yourself? It was an unfair choice, but I think the teacher knew that.

This should have NEVER been an alternative. Humiliating children and singling them out--when they are trying their best--is not humane. It is disgusting.

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Response to siligut (Reply #11)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:59 PM

30. hey! bullying is a motivator!

that mom is right!

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)


Response to IDoMath (Reply #13)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:39 PM

17. Being publicly humiliated is about an hour past "criticism", don't you think?

nt

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Response to IDoMath (Reply #13)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:43 PM

18. Obviously you don't know the difference

between criticism and humiliation.

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Response to ohheckyeah (Reply #18)


Response to IDoMath (Reply #22)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:56 PM

25. I was a nerd too. Played in the chess club. Winners and losers. Classrooms are not sports arenas (nt

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Response to The Straight Story (Reply #25)


Response to IDoMath (Reply #29)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:03 PM

33. if you're intellectualism is being denigrated

you need to hang out with different people. just sayin'.

sounds like you were bullied. have you no compassion for other bullied 9 year olds?

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Response to elehhhhna (Reply #33)


Response to IDoMath (Reply #40)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:41 PM

63. So, marking up the face of someone slower is a

real reward?

Humiliating a kid will teach them not to bully someone else? Like being humiliated taught you that it's wrong to humiliate kids?

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Response to IDoMath (Reply #22)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:01 PM

32. So, why are you okay

with others being humiliated?

Generally fuck you as a response is not considered up to community standards....something to think about.




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Response to ohheckyeah (Reply #32)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:34 PM

51. Ignore him, he's not worth the breath.

A bitter vengeful person who thinks its' okay to humiliate children because they were bullied. Poster says they learned empathy but I think they need an incomplete or a refresher course.

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Response to Chan790 (Reply #51)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:36 PM

57. True - you would think a person

who lived through humiliation would recognize it.

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Response to ohheckyeah (Reply #18)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:00 PM

31. and bullying, and poor sporsmanship, etc. ...

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Response to IDoMath (Reply #13)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:14 PM

39. This is an unoriginal, right-wing talking point.

Where'd you pick it up?

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Response to DisgustipatedinCA (Reply #39)


Response to IDoMath (Reply #41)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:25 PM

43. So you were successful in getting rid of your self-esteem sometime during high school?

Well, congratulations, I guess. Sorry about the right-wing thing. It's just coincidental that you independently came up with self-loathing as a good idea at the same time that droves and droves of fuckwitted, inbred, anti-young-person Republican troglodytes did--it confused me momentarily.

Anyhow, have a great, self-loathing weekend.

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Response to DisgustipatedinCA (Reply #43)


Response to IDoMath (Reply #45)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:34 PM

52. Roll those dice

You may get my post blocked. You may not. Neither outcome will change the basic fact that you are in favor of bullying children because you believe that self-esteem is "crap".

Do what you need to do.

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Response to DisgustipatedinCA (Reply #52)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:35 PM

55. I'd vote to "Leave it Alone". n/t

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Response to DisgustipatedinCA (Reply #52)


Response to IDoMath (Reply #45)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:37 PM

59. From the person

who responded with fuck you? LOL

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Response to IDoMath (Reply #13)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:34 PM

50. Poor you.

Only a fool would think this was a good idea.

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Response to IDoMath (Reply #13)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:38 PM

60. Justifying child abuse is sick high order douchebaggery

Just sayin'

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Response to IDoMath (Reply #13)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:48 PM

67. Why don't you find your nearest university and take Psych 101.

Any basic psych student would tell you that you were completely and utterly wrong, and be able to cite several dozen academic articles to prove it.

What you're talking about is legitimizing abuse.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:37 PM

15. because nothing makes children want to learn as well as shaming does.

 

i mean, everybody knows that, right?

don't we all respond well to shaming?

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:38 PM

16. Isn't this considered assault?

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Response to hollysmom (Reply #16)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:56 PM

24. It is by me.

 

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:48 PM

19. She needs to be fired asap.

That teacher is behaving like a punk herself. That's every kind of fail.

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Response to Waiting For Everyman (Reply #19)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 09:58 PM

94. If you fire her, you need to fire every teacher using peer approaches in the classroom because

 

eventually, they will lead to more of such incidents.

The problem here is the educational "theory" that encourages teachers to allow the 9th graders to decide on classroom management issues.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:48 PM

20. "Is being criticized?"

How about being tarred and feathered? That teacher should be fired and barred from having any contact with children.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:53 PM

21. Institutionalized bullying?

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:55 PM

23. That explains this!! He flunked 4th grade reading.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:56 PM

26. That is despicable... and breaks my heart...

My youngest son was slow at reading...but as he grew up, he loved computer games.

He wanted me to buy him computer game magazines and learned to read extensively in order to understand the tricks involved in Super Mario Bros etc... That was long ago...

He is now a University graduate in Computer Engineering who also loves to draw...

Sometimes I wonder whether some slower readers may not be gifted in other fields... But shaming the child is not a method of encouraging further study.



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Response to nenagh (Reply #26)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:31 PM

46. I was slow in math but quick to learn reading.

I still remember how uncomfortable I felt in elementary school when the children who were not as good at reading had to read out loud. I felt worse for them than I felt for myself when I did poorly at the "game" the teacher made us play that showed off the children who were good at arithmetic.

It's not a good idea to make learning into a competitive game. Some people pick up reading and writing quickly, as I did. Others are math whizzes at a young age. These are natural gifts, encouraged by parents who have the education and leisure to help their children. Not being quick at learning should never, ever be punished. It's not something that the child is doing on purpose. It has nothing to do with poor discipline or not trying hard enough. Children need to be allowed to learn at their own paces.

I did eventually learn math.

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Response to nenagh (Reply #26)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:33 PM

48. Actually, this teacher's blog has some student reading videos that are anything but shaming

 

http://summerlarsendes.blogspot.com/p/farmer-rt-group-1.html

Here's what I think happened. This teacher seems very student centered. A student centered classroom requires that students make many of their own decisions as a class, including decisions about incentivizing learning. The students themselves (according to the AP article) chose the disincentive of writing marker on children's faces. A student centered classroom might in fact go with the student's own idea of an appropriate punishment to see what happens and to talk about it later. I heartily agree that this particular exercise was cruel, and something to be expected of 4th graders whose moral systems are still developing. However, some student centered educational methodologies require going along with such decisions, provided they are not truly dangerous.

You might argue that the exercise was psychologically damaging to students, but remember, there have been lots of educational "experiments" in the past 30 years, such as the discrimination game described in the documentary A Class Divided. Under the guise of education, such psychological experiments certainly affect children, and not only in a good way. One Florida school, for example, decided to play a "Holocaust Game" in which certain random students were chosen to be Jews for a day. There were many children traumatized.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 04:58 PM

28. That's horrible

This is why I think we need teachers with advanced degrees. Teachers with advanced teaching degrees know to how to encourage and motivate without humiliation or shame.

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Response to liberal_at_heart (Reply #28)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:12 PM

38. She actually seems like a devoted teacher. Her blog is available here:

 

Summer Larsen's blog about her students:

http://summerlarsendes.blogspot.com/

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Response to GiaGiovanni (Reply #38)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:32 PM

47. She may be a devoted teacher but she made a terrible mistake.

I still can't imagine how any teacher could think that punishing children for not being as quick to learn something as their peers is a good approach to education.

Frankly, I'm appalled.

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Response to yardwork (Reply #47)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:36 PM

58. Did you read the blog? She's not a horrible person, and the peer approach requires follow through

 

That's one of the reasons I don't believe in peer guidance of education. Certain manipulative children and cliques can end up running the process.

For the record, I disagree with the whole premise: you don't punish kids for learning speeds, you don't put incentivizing in the hands of 9-year olds, and you don't let the students run the show. However, many schools of education radically disagree with me, at least in terms of the latter.

And, sad to say, as schools are judged more and more by test scores, expect more "peer guided incentives (or disincentives) for reading scores.


The blog contains some interesting video:

http://summerlarsendes.blogspot.com/p/farmer-rt-group-1.html

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:08 PM

35. The "punishment" was apparently the idea of the students themselves (a stupid one admittedly)

 

The school involved is Declo Elementary in Declo, Idaho:

https://sites.google.com/a/cassiaschools.org/declo_elementary/faculty-staff

According to AP:

The students were allowed to choose their own incentive to meet the reading goal, but instead of a reward, the class chose a punishment: Students who failed to meet the goal could either stay inside at recess until it was met, or have their faces written on by classmates who met the goals.

Nine students didn't meet the goals, the paper reported Friday. Three chose to forgo recess, and the other six chose to have their faces marked on.

"Although all the students in the class agreed to the incentive, once it occurred it was not so well received. Nor should it have been," Smyer said.


http://www.bigstory.ap.org/article/fourth-graders-who-flunk-reading-have-faces-marked


If you are a teacher, you often try to get students to provide their own incentives: they work harder if it's something meaningful to them and if it's something they have decided on as a class. However, you have to guide the process (insuring the fairness of the outcomes) and you never allow students with developing moral characters to decide upon disincentives. It makes me think that Larsen (the teacher) is either young & inexperienced or very idealistic.



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Response to GiaGiovanni (Reply #35)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:35 PM

53. In other words, the teachers enabled her students to be bullies.

The kids who were quick readers got together and decided to humiliate and abuse their peers who were slower to learn reading. That's called bullying.

This is the kind of mindset that leads teachers and administrators to watch kids being bullied until they literally commit suicide, and never step in and stop the bullying.

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Response to yardwork (Reply #53)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:43 PM

65. The peer approach often results in that, especially with younger children

 

Manipulative children and cliques can often hijack the process. The teacher, usually a well-meaning person full of educational "theory" and good intentions, often doesn't see the mischief under her nose.

For the record, I think the peer approach is ridiculous at the lower grades and that the teacher (and administrators) do need to be the moral authority. However, Mrs. Larsen's activities with her 4th grade class do not exist in a vacuum. Schools of education actively promote peer/student-centered approaches and, in fact, promote crossing children's psychological boundaries.

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Response to GiaGiovanni (Reply #65)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 07:53 PM

83. My children went to a student-centered alternative school, and nothing like this was done.

I've never heard of this before, and I know quite a few early childhood educators. Maybe this is something new. I don't hold with it.

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Response to yardwork (Reply #83)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 09:46 PM

90. What kind of alternative school?

 

Sometimes they escape certain educational trends.

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Response to GiaGiovanni (Reply #90)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 10:31 PM

96. It was founded in the 1970s, based on Piaget's theories.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:12 PM

37. I would be worried as much about the effect of this "punishment" ...

... on the kids who were wielding the markers as the kids who were drawn on. She's teaching them to abuse their peers, and to mistreat others for what? It's not going to make anybody a better reader.

She should not be teaching, and the whole class needs to deal with the aftermath of this incident.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:24 PM

42. If I'd had my face marked on

I'd NEVER want to return to that class or that teacher. Shaming and humiliating are not the roads to learning or success.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:26 PM

44. OMG. What incredible stupidity and cruelty.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:34 PM

49. Fire that incompetent fuck. nt

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Response to rrneck (Reply #49)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 09:23 PM

89. +1000

Thank YOU! What a horrible thing to do to children. She is a sick woman.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:35 PM

54. Teacher needs to write the meaning of STIGMA on her blackboard 1000 times

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Response to HereSince1628 (Reply #54)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:27 PM

75. How about the students write on HER face? nt

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:36 PM

56. Those poor kids! What a sickfuck teacher.

ugh

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Response to jpak (Reply #56)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:14 PM

73. The kids themselves chose the punishment, and some student-centered approaches

 

require follow through on student decisions like this.

This is why I support the traditional classroom and homeschooling.

However, don't assume this teacher was a horrible person. Her training in student-centered (peer) approaches is not unique, but is actually more common than traditional approaches. You might argue that she should have guided the students to a different kind of disincentive (or, better yet, incentive) but one of the issues with peer approaches is that you have to allow the students to make their own decisions.

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Response to GiaGiovanni (Reply #73)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 07:38 PM

82. Thanks for the input, esp the link

People are off on their own tangents and hobbyhorses full tilt by now, as you can see.

As you can also see, I have opinions of my own, but I do appreciate knowing where the teacher might have thought she was coming from, mistaken as she appears to have been. Hopefully it will be a learning experience and not a career-ender.

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Response to Hekate (Reply #82)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 09:48 PM

91. Thanks for a civilized response. A wrongheaded philosophy, supported by research and

 

in-service programs, is not the same as being mentally ill.

I do think parents need to know more about the educational "theories" that affect their children.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:41 PM

62. What if one of these poor kids is an unidentified dyslexic? It happens.

This whole thing just makes me nauseated. I'd be furious if I was the parent.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:42 PM

64. And I thought the education bar was lowered when our former president asked:

"Is our children learning?"

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:45 PM

66. Wow, really?

How could someone be so cruel? Where did this teacher learn this type of behavior?

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 05:49 PM

68. Any punishment for this teacher should involve a tattoo gun... n/t

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:01 PM

69. Yet another reason why I'm glad we homeschooled our kids.

Both of whom are now at top-rated colleges, thank you very much.

But having a kid who has trouble learning gives parents even MORE reason to homeschool.

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Response to kath (Reply #69)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:09 PM

71. I am a HUGE advocate of home schooling, especially considering current education "theory" at

 

university departments of education.

I have friends homeschooling their children and they are all far more advanced than their school-attending peers.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:05 PM

70. The teacher is NOT a horrible person or even an abusive one. It's a peer teaching methodology that

 

is causing the problems here.

The teacher, Mrs. Summer Larsen, has a blog here. You can see student videos of her reading students on this web page. She seems to be a very devoted 4th grade teacher.

The marker incident (above) is part of a common teaching methodology involving the student-centered classroom and peer decision-making. The teacher talks with the students about an issue--in this case, reading scores--and the student come up with class incentives or, in this case, disincentives. There is nothing unusual about this except in the choice of disincentive.

The AP article makes it clear that the students themselves chose the disincentive (punishment).

Recent education "theory" (and I use the term very loosely) has been pushing peer approaches since the 70s and 80s. Those of us who have taken writing classes in the past 30-40 years surely remember "peer review", a fairly useless process in which students are asked to comment on each others' high school or college compositions. If you've gone through this, you remember just how valuable most of your peers' advice was.

Peer related approaches have become more prevalent and more sophisticated. Group decisions involving incentives, disincentives, classroom management, and even choice of topics have become fair game as students are expected to direct more and more of the learning process and the teacher is supposed to erase him or herself from it. Ultimately, school becomes a behavior laboratory, not an academic learning process.

When you buy in to all this student centered/peer oriented "theory", you are required to follow through with student decisions that are made. This, of course, seems the height of silliness to a more traditional teacher who runs the classroom based on the idea that s/he knows better than a bunch of 9-year-olds. Really wise teachers understand that 9-year olds are not innocents and not all well-intentioned. They understand that manipulative students and cliques can hijack any peer process. They also understand that 4th graders are not always up on the consequences of their actions.

A more traditional teacher would never have let this kind of thing happen. But, the trend is against the traditional "teacher-cented" classroom (the one in which the teacher has the authority, decides on the academic topic to be covered, and stops cliques in their tracks.) The future is "student centered learning" in which the teacher is a mere facilitator and students "guide" their own learning using computer software (which essentially means that the software guides their learning.)

Before you tar and feather this teacher, understand that she is not operating in a vacuum. Parents need to be more aware of education "theory" coming from schools of education, and understand how this can directly affect their children.

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Response to GiaGiovanni (Reply #70)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:13 PM

72. Labeling abuse as a "theory" doesn't make it less abusive



It's pretty frightening that you're defending her.

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Response to demhottie (Reply #72)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 07:20 PM

77. Tell that to schools of education.

 

That's where it all begins.

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Response to GiaGiovanni (Reply #77)

Sat Nov 17, 2012, 12:10 AM

98. That's complete bullshit

And if you worked in a teacher ed program, you'd know that.

But you don't.

I don't know where you're getting your misinformation from, but feel free to change your source to one that's a little more in the loop.

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Response to GiaGiovanni (Reply #70)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:21 PM

74. The teacher is an adult. She has an obligation to keep kids safe. She failed.

This doesn't have anything to do with methodology. What a ridiculous excuse.

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Response to proud2BlibKansan (Reply #74)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 07:24 PM

78. Safe, yes. But this has EVERYTHING to do with teaching philosophy coming out of universities

 

Once you take authority from the teacher and turn it over to a peer philosophy, you will end up with these kinds of things happening from time to time.

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Response to GiaGiovanni (Reply #70)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 07:32 PM

80. The reason an adult is the teacher is because students lack the judgment

to make "incentive" and "disincentive" decisions. They don't have the life experience to make those calls, and their brains are not fully developed.

This person should not be a teacher. Teaching methodology or not, when an adult knows that a child is about to be humiliated, that adult has a duty to stop it. If the adult is a teacher, that adult has the added duty to go a step further and explain to the children why the "disincentive" they chose is inappropriate. THAT is teaching.

That person should not be a teacher. She has no empathy for others, and no instinct for teaching.

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Response to Honeycombe8 (Reply #80)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 09:50 PM

92. I agree, but peer approaches make the teacher step away from that role

 

It's not a personality problem, but a philosophical one coming out of the theories in schools of education. Teachers are required to go to countless in-services and trainings which preach that peer decision making is far superior to that of an individual teacher.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 06:31 PM

76. Stunning.

I'm at a loss for words. I simply cannot fathom the thinking behind this, and I shudder to think of what I'd have done were I a parent of one of these kids. I think I might actually be in jail right now.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 07:29 PM

79. Teaches other kids that violating someone else's physical boundaries is acceptable

Hmmmm. Wonder if that would lead to ganging up on a boy with bleach-blond hair and scissoring it off while he cries?

The whole episode and the thinking behind it is awful.

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Response to Hekate (Reply #79)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 09:52 PM

93. Teaches that such violation is OK when the peer group agrees on it

 

That's even more problematic in my opinion.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 08:00 PM

84. My first grade teacher used to pin failed tests to our shirts & force us to keep them there all day

 

Some people simply aren't fit to work with children.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 08:03 PM

85. I am in no way defending this teacher

who deserves any and all criticism she gets. But you will see more of this in the future unless and until we stop this mania about test scores.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 08:04 PM

86. what a crappy human being/teacher. n/t

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 08:08 PM

87. What the hell..........

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 09:04 PM

88. So this teacher believes in "Scarlet Letter" type punishment in 2012.

She needs to be replaced or at least get sensitivity/empathy/compassion training.
I have a good idea! Let the kids who were punished use markers on her face and see how she likes it. Let her explain what happened and why to her husband and kids.
Bet she'd think twice the next time she dolled out punishment.

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 10:01 PM

95. Fire her. None of that sit in a room for a year and get paid bullshit. nt

 

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Response to The Straight Story (Original post)

Fri Nov 16, 2012, 10:44 PM

97. unreal

 

" A fourth-grade teacher in southern Idaho is being criticized"








Really !!!!


She is being criticized for letting her students be bullied and abused with her consent.

Imagine that!

She should be fired immediately.

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