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Tue Nov 13, 2012, 07:04 PM

President Obama's Opening Move: Raise $1.6 Trillion In New Tax Revenue From The Wealthy

President Obama's Opening Move: Raise $1.6 Trillion In New Tax Revenue From The Wealthy

by TomP

I really like this! No pre-negotation concessions. Starting with his proposed budget.

President Obama will begin talks with congressional leaders Friday with a plan to raise $1.6 trillion in new tax revenue from the wealthy — making clear that, at least the outset, a wide gulf remains between congressional Republicans and the White House on the most contentious point in the negotiations.
snip

Rather, Obama will present his 2013 budget as his starting point — a plan that sought to reduce borrowing over the next 10 years by $4 trillion.

snip

Obama’s previous proposal called for raising $1.6 trillion in new taxes on the wealthy by allowing tax rates to increase, imposing a new special tax on millionaires and limiting deductions for the wealthy. He also proposed $340 billion in health-care and entitlement savings, continuing $1.1 trillion in spending cuts already passed into law and generating another $1 trillion in savings through the end of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan.

The demand for $1.6 trillion in new taxes is far greater than Obama proposed in negotiations with House Speaker John Boehner (R-Ohio) in summer 2011. At the time, Obama wavered between $800 billion and $1.2 trillion in new tax revenue, depending on how much in entitlement cuts Republicans were demanding.


WaPo: Obama to open fiscal talks with plan to raise taxes on wealthy

Elections have consequences, Mr. Boehner. And the Bush tax cuts will expire at the end of the year. The leverage is ours and the President is strong.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/11/13/1161340/-President-Obama-s-Opening-Move-Raise-1-6-Trillion-In-New-Tax-Revenue-From-The-Wealthy

Obama promises liberal groups he'll end Bush tax cuts for wealthy
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/11/13/1161302/-Obama-promises-liberal-groups-he-ll-end-Bush-tax-cuts-for-nbsp-wealthy

33 replies, 2727 views

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Arrow 33 replies Author Time Post
Reply President Obama's Opening Move: Raise $1.6 Trillion In New Tax Revenue From The Wealthy (Original post)
ProSense Nov 2012 OP
The Magistrate Nov 2012 #1
Betsy Ross Nov 2012 #11
TahitiNut Nov 2012 #16
jaysunb Nov 2012 #18
The Magistrate Nov 2012 #20
BlueStreak Nov 2012 #27
sheshe2 Nov 2012 #2
freshwest Nov 2012 #4
sheshe2 Nov 2012 #8
JNelson6563 Nov 2012 #3
freshwest Nov 2012 #5
sheshe2 Nov 2012 #9
freshwest Nov 2012 #10
Cha Nov 2012 #6
hrmjustin Nov 2012 #7
BlueCaliDem Nov 2012 #12
Maynar Nov 2012 #13
ancianita Nov 2012 #14
grahamhgreen Nov 2012 #15
SnoopDog Nov 2012 #17
MannyGoldstein Nov 2012 #19
taught_me_patience Nov 2012 #21
MannyGoldstein Nov 2012 #22
Fumesucker Nov 2012 #23
taught_me_patience Nov 2012 #31
MannyGoldstein Nov 2012 #33
JoeyT Nov 2012 #25
reformist2 Nov 2012 #30
taught_me_patience Nov 2012 #32
ProSense Nov 2012 #24
JoeyT Nov 2012 #26
AllyCat Nov 2012 #28
reformist2 Nov 2012 #29

Response to ProSense (Original post)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 07:10 PM

1. If Stuck To, Ma'am, This Ought To Do

Details about those 'health care and entitlement' items need to be examined, though.

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Response to The Magistrate (Reply #1)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 09:18 PM

11. Yes! Nt

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Response to The Magistrate (Reply #1)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 09:38 PM

16. Health care (Medicare) costs could be dramatically reduced ...

... merely by eliminating the statutory language prohibiting negotiation for lowest drug prices under Medicare Part D, instead mandating them. At that point, the Medicare program should come down HARD on big pharma and get at LEAST as low a price as the VA. THAT particular (INSANE!) provision was a "poison pill" planted by Bush/Cheney to attack the fiscal health of Medicare, with the intention of killing Medicare itself. (Bastards!)

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Response to TahitiNut (Reply #16)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 10:02 PM

18. That Obama is a tricky guy....huh

Go through the side door to reaffirm and strengthen the program. When the Republicans resist.....well...lookie everybody.

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Response to TahitiNut (Reply #16)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 11:59 PM

20. That Would, Sir, Be An Excellent Move

Things like that are why I would want to see details; I know there are savings that could benefit the programs greatly.

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Response to The Magistrate (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 09:04 AM

27. But he isn't going to stick to it. Read his lips carefully

The only thing he has promised to stick to is the top tax rate. Well that is virtually nothing because almost none of the 0.1% income is taxed at the top rate. The big items are the Cap Gains at 20% (Clinton) versus 15% (Bush) and dividends taxes as ordinary income (Clinton) or 15% (Bush). Obama hasn't said a peep about these things, but they make up the lion's share of the $1.6 trillion. And Obama has not promised to keep them in place.

We is going to give away most of that $1.6 Tn.

But I have to give him a little credit. At least this time, he didn't give it away before the negotiations even started. I guess that is an improvement for him.

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 07:10 PM

2. I like this!

Elections have consequences, Mr. Boehner. And the Bush tax cuts will expire at the end of the year. The leverage is ours and the President is strong.

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Response to sheshe2 (Reply #2)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 08:06 PM

4. The irony!

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Response to freshwest (Reply #4)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 08:36 PM

8. LOL

Also I would be the first one to volunteer to clean up the Winger's mess after their heads explode.

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 07:36 PM

3. Wingers' heads explode.

Details at 11:00.



Julie

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Response to JNelson6563 (Reply #3)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 08:07 PM

5. As usual, it'll be Democrats who have to clean up the mess, from that, too...

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Response to JNelson6563 (Reply #3)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 08:37 PM

9. Is it 11:00 yet?

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Response to sheshe2 (Reply #9)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 08:51 PM

10. Not yet, but the shrieks and gargling noises will begin about that time, followed by popping sounds.

We'll claim it was merely firecrackers so as not to alarm their neighbors, then send the cleaning crews.



Oooh, that was gross! myself!!!

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 08:08 PM

6. Thanks ProSense. & THANKS TO PRESIDENT OBAMA.

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 08:10 PM

7. Thank you MR. President.

Stick to your guns.

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 09:20 PM

12. Thanks, Prosense. You've made my evening once again!

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 09:26 PM

13. I am for this.

More than you can know.

But the shrieks of "Socialism!" will abound, and make the going tough.

No reason not to do it, though. When the going gets tough, and all that.

Do it, Mr President. It needs to be done.

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 09:29 PM

14. Now THAT'S an opener!

Suck on that, Mitch-man, photo op man!

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 09:30 PM

15. OH! I'm starting to feel the love....!

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 09:43 PM

17. Something is not correct with this post...

The WaPo article never says what the dailylkos post states...????

For instance and most importantly, the article never states 'He also proposed $340 billion in health-care and entitlement savings..."

I don't know if WaPo changed their article or the dailykos person copied some other article...


Here is what the article states; "Obama’s 2013 budget sought to reduce borrowing over the next 10 years by about $4 trillion, counting $1.1 trillion in agency cuts already in force. In addition to raising taxes, Obama proposed to slice $340 billion from health-care programs and to count about $1 trillion in savings from ending the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. "

Link: http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/obama-to-open-fiscal-talks-with-plan-to-raise-taxes-on-wealthy/2012/11/13/9984cd78-2dc1-11e2-89d4-040c9330702a_story_1.html

Anybody know what is going on with this?

Why would they include the 'entitlement' part?

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Tue Nov 13, 2012, 10:05 PM

19. Opening position: the rich pay a lower tax rate than do the middle class

And Social Security... we know where that's going.

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 12:29 AM

21. Seems a bit unfair to raise rates and limit deductions

for only one segment of the population. Edited to add that I feel pretty uncomfortable about this. I'm ok with paying more taxes, but everybody needs to pay more. Raising taxes on only one segment of the population really is class warfare.

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Response to taught_me_patience (Reply #21)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 05:17 AM

22. How do you feel about the wealthiest paying a far-lower tax rate

than many in the middle class?

Is that class warfare?

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #22)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 05:20 AM

23. The wealthy bought those low tax rates fair and square

Good politicians don't come cheap you know.

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Response to MannyGoldstein (Reply #22)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 11:32 AM

31. Well you have to look at the reason

The main reason is because capital gains is taxed at a much lower rate than ordinary income. However, the 15% capital gains rate is available to all people. I pay 15% on my capital gains just like Warren Buffet does on his. The fairest solution would be to treat capital gains as ordinary income. We would all pay more, but the rich would likely pay a lot more.

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Response to taught_me_patience (Reply #31)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 12:15 PM

33. I totally agree with you.

60 years ago, the wealthiest Americans paid roughly 50% of their incomes in federal taxes while the median worker paid about 7%. And the economy was booming for everyone.

Today, the wealthiest and the median both pay around 15%. Upper-middle income workers pay upwards of 25%. And the economy is a catastrophe. I (and Warren Buffet) believe that this is all the result of decades of class warfare by the wealthy against everyone else, and it should be undone. I'm not sure that undoing it should, itself, be considered class warfare.

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Response to taught_me_patience (Reply #21)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:52 AM

25. I agree completely.

Capital gains should be taxed at the same rate as income.

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Response to taught_me_patience (Reply #21)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 10:45 AM

30. You may not realize it, but you are arguing against different rates for different income levels.


Figuring out who should pay what is admittedly more of an art than a science, but it only stands to reason that people with higher incomes are going to have to pay higher rates.

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Response to reformist2 (Reply #30)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 11:35 AM

32. Not really

I'm arguing that raising both the tax rate and limiting deductions on only one group of people amounts to class warfare in my mind. Many people tend to forget that the Bush tax cuts, while benefitting the rich disproportionately, cut taxes on all incomes. I would be ok with simply doing away will all of the Bush tax cuts at all income levels.

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:36 AM

24. Ha! Look who is singing the praises of "big government"

Christie Reverses Stand on Tax Increases After Storm.
http://sync.democraticunderground.com/10021812763

Reality bites!

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 08:53 AM

26. Rec.

Whee!

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 10:40 AM

28. But he's going to cut medicare and social security

And the fiscal cliff and the grand bargain and, and , and.....what other scary things? I forgot.

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Response to ProSense (Original post)

Wed Nov 14, 2012, 10:42 AM

29. Sorry, but NOT GOOD ENOUGH, Mr. Obama. Any deal needs to be 1:1 wrt tax increases/spending cuts.

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