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Fri Nov 9, 2012, 02:30 PM

Democrats do not need to get in a prolonged debate about the expiring tax cuts.

Just let them expire. Let the Republicans make their case in the media. We should have nothing more to say on the subject. They are ending.

To debate them every day in the media only strengthens the weakened Republican Party, just like it did with the healthcare debate. Democrats tend to lose these types of debates.

"All we are doing is asking the wealthy to pay just a little bit more" sounds weak and apologetic. The tax cuts are ending. Period.

The people do not need further education on this subject. There should be nothing to negotiate. After the tax cuts expire, we should debate the tax loopholes and try to pass a larger tax reform package.

Listening to the WH spokesman sounds like everything is still the same. There was no election. C'mon people! Show a little backbone.

It is just my opinion that they are being a little too timid.

45 replies, 2080 views

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Reply Democrats do not need to get in a prolonged debate about the expiring tax cuts. (Original post)
kentuck Nov 2012 OP
patrice Nov 2012 #1
Tansy_Gold Nov 2012 #2
Hydra Nov 2012 #23
Tansy_Gold Nov 2012 #29
Hydra Nov 2012 #34
Tansy_Gold Nov 2012 #38
kentuck Nov 2012 #24
elleng Nov 2012 #3
freshwest Nov 2012 #31
southmost Nov 2012 #4
sadbear Nov 2012 #5
kentuck Nov 2012 #6
sadbear Nov 2012 #7
kentuck Nov 2012 #9
sadbear Nov 2012 #10
kentuck Nov 2012 #12
sadbear Nov 2012 #13
kentuck Nov 2012 #14
sadbear Nov 2012 #15
kentuck Nov 2012 #16
sadbear Nov 2012 #18
kentuck Nov 2012 #20
sadbear Nov 2012 #22
kentuck Nov 2012 #30
sadbear Nov 2012 #32
lefthandedskyhook Nov 2012 #45
RepublicansRZombies Nov 2012 #8
99Forever Nov 2012 #11
RepublicansRZombies Nov 2012 #43
99Forever Nov 2012 #44
No DUplicitous DUpe Nov 2012 #17
rhett o rick Nov 2012 #19
kentuck Nov 2012 #21
Hydra Nov 2012 #27
kentuck Nov 2012 #28
Hydra Nov 2012 #33
kentuck Nov 2012 #35
Autumn Nov 2012 #25
kentuck Nov 2012 #26
JoePhilly Nov 2012 #36
kentuck Nov 2012 #37
JoePhilly Nov 2012 #41
closeupready Nov 2012 #39
Puzzledtraveller Nov 2012 #40
2Design Nov 2012 #42

Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 02:34 PM

1. K&R & Agreed!



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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 02:35 PM

2. The debate -- and the TIM-idity -- has been going on since November 2008

When Obama announced his economic transition team a couple weeks after that election, the cry went up right here on DU that he would just let the booooosh tax cuts expire and that would be the end of it. And I swore up and down that it wouldn't happen and guess fucking what? It didn't happen.


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Response to Tansy_Gold (Reply #2)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:33 PM

23. Sucks being Cassandra, doesn't it?

Keep doing it though- the truth needs to be heard, no matter how many people think it needs to be buried.

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Response to Hydra (Reply #23)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:40 PM

29. It's why I have this:



And carry it in my purse at all times.

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Response to Tansy_Gold (Reply #29)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 04:00 PM

34. LOL

Do you stamp that on people's foreheads? :p

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Response to Hydra (Reply #34)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 04:09 PM

38. It started as a joke with my kids

At every "I told you so" moment, I'd tell them to put out a hand and I'd give them a virtual stamp on the back of the hand. Then one day I happed to see a little rubber stamp kiosk where you could buy an envelope and send it in for a custom stamp from either Rubber Stampede or Ink-A-Doo, I can't remember which. So I had it made. I've carried it with me ever since.

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Response to Tansy_Gold (Reply #2)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:35 PM

24. Get back in line!

What are you doing??

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 02:35 PM

3. Yes and he's trying to shut that guy up without being impolite, imo.

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Response to elleng (Reply #3)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:45 PM

31. A local newspaper yesterday reposted this from an earlier NYT editorial:

...Mr. Obama further ridiculed the budget’s deficit-cutting goal as “laughable” because it refuses to acknowledge the need for new revenues...

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/04/opinion/calling-radicalism-by-its-name.html?_r=2&pagewanted=all&

I want the automatic measure to happen that they forced on us. Look to see an ocean of bull from the right on how it will destroy the country. The GOP has also threatened to pull their Debt Limit game again. This is why this battle is far from over.

The country would have been over if Ayn Rand/Romney/Ryan were installed in the White House, but we were all saved by the strength of those who weathered harrassment for simply speaking their mind voting.

We should never coddle people who encourage not voting, and must change the way people vote state by state.

Reid announced there will NO changes in Social Security, no matter what the GOP tries to shove.



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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 02:37 PM

4. recommended!

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 02:39 PM

5. Yep we gotta get out in front of this issue and frame it first.

Republicans are willing to go over the "fiscal cliff" in order to preserve tax cuts for the wealthy. They're holding the country hostage AGAIN.

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Response to sadbear (Reply #5)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 02:42 PM

6. Yes, we are so good at framing.

They should just shut the hell up and let them expire if the House does nothing.

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Response to kentuck (Reply #6)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 02:46 PM

7. You don't think that approach would backfire.

The truth doesn't matter. We saw that in the fight of ACA. If they're able frame this as Democrats wanting to raise EVERYONE's taxes, or some other such nonsense, they will win. And we'll be forced to "compromise" away earned benefits without ANY tax increases.

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Response to sadbear (Reply #7)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 02:56 PM

9. The media really proved themselves in this election.

They are not credible with their polls and partisan information. The "fiscal cliff" is presently a speed bump. If the Repubs threaten to shut down the government, with a prolonged debate, over raising the debt limit, what would you suggest at that time?

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Response to kentuck (Reply #9)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:06 PM

10. Were we not successful in framing the most recent debt ceiling dabates?

The debt ceiling is intertwined with the "fiscal cliff" in that the both illustrate the main policy difference between us and them. In order to avoid "economic disaster" we are willing to make certain cuts if they agree to tax increases on the wealthy. But we all know that they won't budge. All we have to do is go out and say this EVERYDAY (is it not true?). But yeah, once we have consistently and constantly framed it, when we do "go over the cliff", the American people will have no doubt who bears the blame (even if it's not the disaster everyone makes it out to be.) A win is a win.

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Response to sadbear (Reply #10)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:09 PM

12. How were we successful??

Our credit rating was lowered and the Senate was unable to put forth a budget. That is why they are having this debate because it failed.

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Response to kentuck (Reply #12)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:11 PM

13. We just won Tuesday night.

America prefers our way over theirs'.

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Response to sadbear (Reply #13)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:11 PM

14. Thank you.

For proving the point.

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Response to kentuck (Reply #14)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:15 PM

15. But our way requires framing.

That's how we won.

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Response to sadbear (Reply #15)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:17 PM

16. That's a mtter of opinion.

The President got 9 million less votes than in 2008.

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Response to kentuck (Reply #16)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:19 PM

18. Carrot Top would have gotten that many votes in 2008.

2008 was about what a disaster President Bush was, not necessarily about how awesome Senator Obama was.

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Response to sadbear (Reply #18)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:21 PM

20. Are you saying Carrot Top would have beaten Sarah Palin?

And John McCain?

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Response to kentuck (Reply #20)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:24 PM

22. YES!

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Response to sadbear (Reply #22)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:45 PM

30. And just think...

Romney got 3 million less votes than McCain and Palin. Carrot Top would have destroyed Romney, right?

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Response to kentuck (Reply #30)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:48 PM

32. Now you're being silly.

Carrot Top would never run against Romney.

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Response to sadbear (Reply #10)

Sat Nov 10, 2012, 12:58 PM

45. Call it the fiscal pothole

The Banksters want to fill it in with straw.

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 02:54 PM

8. we need to demand a return to the tax rates of Eisenhower

 


We need to start making more demands, like demanding that they pay for the stupid ass war on terror.

This is bullshit they expect our children to pay for their lies and destruction FOREVER!

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:09 PM

11. We have already compromised to them.

They designed the tax cuts to expire and voted for that to happen. We are simply doing as they wish.

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Response to 99Forever (Reply #11)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 04:44 PM

43. We have compromised way too long, now they blame us for what they did to the economy

 


If they insist on acting like three year olds, they need to be treated like three year olds.

And right now, the Republican party needs a time out, very badly.

They need to sit in the corner and think about what they have done.

We need to ignore their whining and do what is right for the country.

The adults are in charge now.

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Response to RepublicansRZombies (Reply #43)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 04:53 PM

44. Couldn't agree with you more.

No more capitulating.

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:19 PM

17. I agree 100%. nt

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:20 PM

19. Dems need to submit a bill immediately to replicate the tax cuts for the first $250k.

Force the Repubs to vote it down.

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Response to rhett o rick (Reply #19)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:22 PM

21. I cannot stand to think...

That we have to listen to this "fiscal cliff" bullshit until the end of December. There is no reason for it.

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Response to kentuck (Reply #21)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:38 PM

27. Sure there is

They're manufacturing consent for a cave in again.

The drum started the SECOND the election was over. They had this all crafted and ready to go.

"Grand Bargain" + Bush Tax cuts extension + continued FICA drop- expect to hear it until January.

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Response to Hydra (Reply #27)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:40 PM

28. Dammit!

(My hands over my ears) I don't want to hear that shit!

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Response to kentuck (Reply #28)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:59 PM

33. Me either

Especially since they're using this "Fiscal Cliff" argument.

"If we don't give the 1% what they want, they'll fire everyone!"

Gee, where have I heard THAT one before?

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Response to Hydra (Reply #33)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 04:02 PM

35. Yes

We would rather live on our knees than die on our feet...

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:35 PM

25. There doesn't need to be any debate at all. None at all. Let them expire.

K/R

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Response to Autumn (Reply #25)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 03:37 PM

26. Absolutely!

Unless the Republicans say they want to extend the tax cuts for those making less than $250K, then we MIGHT make a deal with them. That is the way to negotiate with these guys.

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 04:03 PM

36. The media is working very hard to push an immediate deal ... Obama doe not need one.

The media is hoping they can force a quick deal because as the "cliff" approaches, the GOP's leverage drops.

I think Obama can frame this to his advantage, and then let the GOP twist in the wind.

The Patreaus resignation should help Obama ... it will dominate the news for a few days ... and the cliff will come closer.

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Response to JoePhilly (Reply #36)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 04:08 PM

37. Yes, the great media!!

That was so credible with their predictions and polls in the election that just ended.

We really need to debate this whole bunch of crap once again??

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Response to kentuck (Reply #37)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 04:14 PM

41. Exactly ... the seem totally unaware of their own predictions.

I saw a Joe Scab panel praise Chucky for how "accurate" he was. I died laughing. Chucky spent WEEKS trying to explain how a 269 tie was likely, and how Romney had a wide array of paths to 270.

I've said for a long time that Obama pushed the bush tax cuts back for a reason. He could not let them all expire in term 1, the media would have said he "raised taxes on the 95% making under 250k" ... and if he broke that promise, he was never getting a 2nd term.

By putting the expiration date in the lame duck, he has the power. He can't run again. SO he has no political liability if they all expire. But the GOP congress can't vote against keeping those middle class taxes.

I'm hoping Harry proposes an extension of the middle class cuts during the lame duck. Make the GOP leaders say no to that. Squeeze them.

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 04:09 PM

39. K&R - No debate is necessary. Voters gave him a mandate.

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 04:11 PM

40. I agree, we need to keep the against them ongoing as I truly believe

the want the sequestration, like scuttling the ship, at this point whatever they can let happen to make this administration seem at fault. So, we should sit on our hands too.

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Response to kentuck (Original post)

Fri Nov 9, 2012, 04:32 PM

42. agree

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