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Wed Nov 7, 2012, 05:52 PM

So is Donelly an improvement over Lugar or status quo?

Based on what little I know, It's a wash. He's about the same as Lugar, but he slightly strengthens the Democratic caucus and we averted a disaster with Mourdoch.

40 replies, 1657 views

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Reply So is Donelly an improvement over Lugar or status quo? (Original post)
RandySF Nov 2012 OP
Sekhmets Daughter Nov 2012 #1
RandySF Nov 2012 #3
Sekhmets Daughter Nov 2012 #14
still_one Nov 2012 #7
BlueMan Votes Nov 2012 #11
still_one Nov 2012 #12
BlueMan Votes Nov 2012 #24
still_one Nov 2012 #26
BlueMan Votes Nov 2012 #34
Sekhmets Daughter Nov 2012 #16
BlueMan Votes Nov 2012 #25
Sekhmets Daughter Nov 2012 #27
Sekhmets Daughter Nov 2012 #13
still_one Nov 2012 #15
Sekhmets Daughter Nov 2012 #18
still_one Nov 2012 #19
Sekhmets Daughter Nov 2012 #23
Tommy_Carcetti Nov 2012 #35
Sekhmets Daughter Nov 2012 #40
LynneSin Nov 2012 #36
Carnage251 Nov 2012 #2
RandySF Nov 2012 #5
2pooped2pop Nov 2012 #10
FSogol Nov 2012 #20
2pooped2pop Nov 2012 #22
JI7 Nov 2012 #4
still_one Nov 2012 #8
MADem Nov 2012 #6
LiberalFighter Nov 2012 #31
OrwellwasRight Nov 2012 #32
MADem Nov 2012 #38
Tx4obama Nov 2012 #9
geek tragedy Nov 2012 #17
longship Nov 2012 #21
spanone Nov 2012 #28
gravity Nov 2012 #29
LiberalFighter Nov 2012 #30
cali Nov 2012 #33
onenote Nov 2012 #39
obamanut2012 Nov 2012 #37

Response to RandySF (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 05:56 PM

1. He's a pro-life Dem...

But he's much younger that Lugar and not everything is tied to social issues...he's an improvement I think...time will tell.

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 05:58 PM

3. True, but I mean overall.

I did hear him mention the auto rescue, so it sounds like he's with us on essential economic issues.

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Response to RandySF (Reply #3)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:32 PM

14. Absolutely.

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #1)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:01 PM

7. He also believes in exceptions for rape and incest

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Response to still_one (Reply #7)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:13 PM

11. i have ZERO respect for people who are against abortion "with exceptions".

 

Either it's a human life or it isn't.
i'm definitely pro-choice (i chose to have a vasectomy)
but i can respect the opinion of those who see it as a human life- WITHOUT exceptions.

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Response to BlueMan Votes (Reply #11)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:25 PM

12. I am very pro choice myself, but I do not respect anyone who has it without exceptions, that is

Garbage. First of all it is a women's choice, that is the key' but to tell her, just to be consistent that because you were raped you have to carry to term, bullshit.

No woman asked to be raped period

And I have no respect for a third party telling someone else to be consistent about their concept of what life is, especially under those circumstances

I can name a lot of issues where people are inconsistent on issues of life and death

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Response to still_one (Reply #12)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 08:06 PM

24. that is what you and i believe- other people have different beliefs.

 

at least the no exception people aren't hypocrites about theirs, and i can respect that.

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Response to BlueMan Votes (Reply #24)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 02:35 AM

26. If it applies to them that is fine, but they want to apply THEIR values to everyone

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Response to still_one (Reply #26)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 10:12 AM

34. not all of them.

 

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Response to BlueMan Votes (Reply #11)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:38 PM

16. That's because

you don't have a uterus

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #16)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 08:08 PM

25. yes i do.

 

it's in a jar in the back of my fridge.

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Response to BlueMan Votes (Reply #25)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 08:41 AM

27. explains much.

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Response to still_one (Reply #7)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:32 PM

13. I thought that would go without saying....

No Democrat is so bat shit crazy to think otherwise. Thanks for clarifying that, however. I should have said it myself.

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #13)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:35 PM

15. The whole point of course is choice, not what someone else want to dictate

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Response to still_one (Reply #15)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:43 PM

18. Yes, the point of the abortion wars

is choice, but let's not make the same mistakes the republicans made by insisting on party purity. A pro-life Dem is not going to attempt to over turn Roe v Wade. Given the choice between Murdoch and Donnelly, and face it, that's the only choice available in Indiana in this day and age, I'll take Donnelly.

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #18)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:50 PM

19. I agree, and obviously the people of Indiana see a distinction also which is why we won

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Response to still_one (Reply #19)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 07:39 PM

23. Yep...

I think it says a lot about where the majority of the country really is...

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #1)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 10:13 AM

35. That's only a problem if you are a single issue voter. nt

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Response to Tommy_Carcetti (Reply #35)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 10:58 AM

40. Agreed

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Response to Sekhmets Daughter (Reply #1)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 10:19 AM

36. Donnelly seems like Bob Casey Jr. - pro-life but actually cares about the fetus AFTER it's born

I'm not too worried about a pro-life candidate if they help pass laws to help working class people including healthcare, education and other quality of life laws.

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Response to RandySF (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 05:57 PM

2. I was wondering when this crap was gonna happen

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Response to Carnage251 (Reply #2)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 05:59 PM

5. I'm just curious.

I was going through the new senators to see if the senate overall shifted left or right.

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Response to RandySF (Reply #5)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:08 PM

10. No, it's a valid question.

Lugar was good, compared to other repuglicans. Donnelly (sp) is not liberal but will caucus with the dems and probably mostly vote with them. He probably could not have gotten in if he were too left. It is Indiana.

It's a win but not as great as say Warren or Grayson's win.

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Response to 2pooped2pop (Reply #10)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:54 PM

20. In some states, that's the best we can do. I see no reason to start bashing Donnelly.

Lugar was a good vote on common sense military/foreign affairs issues, but rubber stamped a lot of Bush crap. Good riddance.

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Response to FSogol (Reply #20)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 07:31 PM

22. Oh believe me, I am for Donnelly

I am in Indiana. I have not followed him so I don't know much about him, but believe me, any dem is a step up.

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Response to RandySF (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 05:59 PM

4. i kind of wish it was still Lugar there

he was one of the decent republicans. and i kind of prefer someone like him over conservative Dems who may regularly go on fox and be trotted out as "even dems oppose............".

but we haven't seen how he actually will be. i hope he is more like Ben Nelson was than lieberman or Bayh. Ben Nelson voted with republcans in many cases but mostly stayed quiet while Lieberman and bayh would go on Fox and other tv shows and bash democrats.

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Response to JI7 (Reply #4)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:03 PM

8. No way. If this was 30 years ago maybe, but we need all the numbers we can get, especially with the

Likes of McConnell

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Response to RandySF (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 05:59 PM

6. Donnelly. He'll respond to Reid's direction, I'm betting.

And the Dem leadership in the Senate will give him the wiggle room he needs to stay "correct" with his constituents (i.e., he'll only have to vote in a distasteful way if they can't get enough crossovers from the other team).

One hand washes the other; both wash the face.

I expect he'll be way easier to wrangle than, say, a Joe Lieberman.

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Response to MADem (Reply #6)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 09:06 AM

31. Which is one advantage for us since

he received major support from that caucus financially and otherwise.

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Response to MADem (Reply #6)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 09:09 AM

32. He's not much different than the other Democratic Senators

He won't be with the progressives, but he won't be an asshole like Ben Nelson or Joe Lieberman either. So yes, it is very different than Lugar. In the House, he understood and supported labor and fair trade issues if not perfectly, at least regularly.

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Response to OrwellwasRight (Reply #32)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 10:24 AM

38. He'll be nice if he wants some cash from some of those huge PACS that

some of the silverback senators have accumulated. Reid only asks for 'discipline' when it's imperative, too--not like the GOP, who demand it on a vote for something stupid, like renaming Freedom Fries in the cafeteria! (That's hyperbole, but you take my sense...)

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Response to RandySF (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:05 PM

9. Lugar was a Republican. Donelly is a Democrat, so he won't be caucusing with the GOPers :)




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Response to RandySF (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 06:39 PM

17. Ideologically some similarities, but he wears our jersey.

He'll vote for Reid not McConnell.

He'll vote to break filibusters.

He'll vote against the crazy shit the House votes for.

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Response to RandySF (Original post)

Wed Nov 7, 2012, 07:24 PM

21. It's simple. Donnelly will caucus with his fellow Democrats.

The arithmetic is trivial.

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Response to RandySF (Original post)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 08:46 AM

28. he's better than mourdock

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Response to RandySF (Original post)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 08:52 AM

29. Donelly won't worry about a Tea Party primary challenger

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Response to RandySF (Original post)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 09:04 AM

30. The order of my preference between known Senators (past and current and candidates) in Indiana

Birch Bayh
Vance Hartke
Joe Hogsett
Joe Donnelly
Evan Bayh
Richard Lugar
Dan Quayle
Dan Coats
Richard Murdoch

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Response to RandySF (Original post)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 09:16 AM

33. Lugar was, I think, better. But Donelly will caucus with the dems.

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Response to cali (Reply #33)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 10:46 AM

39. Lugar has voted with the repubs 85 percent of the time this Congress

He also voted against Lily Ledbetter, against the Recovery act, for the House repubs budget bill (the Ryan plan) and against the Senate Democrats budget plan, and against the repeal of DADT.

Donnelly won't be good on right to choose issues, but overall he'll be a significant improvement over Lugar.

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Response to RandySF (Original post)

Thu Nov 8, 2012, 10:20 AM

37. Tim Kaine is also an anti choice Democrat

And quite anti gay rights. He is, however, a helluva a lot better than Charles Allen... and even Jim Webb on some issues.

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