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Wed Oct 24, 2012, 01:26 AM

Ted Haggard says gay marriage “should be legal”

Interesting developement....

http://www.christianpost.com/news/ted-haggard-says-gay-marriage-not-biblical-but-should-be-legal-83710/

Colorado evangelical pastor Ted Haggard, who was involved in a sex and drug scandal six years ago, appears to have changed his earlier position against same-sex marriage. In an online debate, he said while biblical law is against homosexual marriage, the state should allow it.

"We've reached a point where human dignity and mutual respect is so important," Haggard said in a recent online debate with Rabbi Benjamin Hecht, director of Orthodox Jewish think tank Nishma.

Responding to the question, "Should same-sex marriage be allowed by the state?" he went on to say, "If someone is dealing with same-sex attraction or homosexuality, and they want someone to be their life partner of the same gender, though we would oppose that in our churches, it should be allowed by the state."

Haggard shared this view during the debate, hosted on deeyoon.com, while maintaining that God intends marriage to be between a man and a woman. He said the roles of the state and religious communities are different. "The state's role is to protect people equally," he emphasized.

22 replies, 2164 views

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Arrow 22 replies Author Time Post
Reply Ted Haggard says gay marriage “should be legal” (Original post)
FreeState Oct 2012 OP
JesterCS Oct 2012 #1
FreeState Oct 2012 #2
greyl Oct 2012 #3
FreeState Oct 2012 #4
greyl Oct 2012 #5
qkvhj Oct 2012 #6
FreeState Oct 2012 #9
Scootaloo Oct 2012 #11
qkvhj Oct 2012 #16
freshwest Oct 2012 #7
freshwest Oct 2012 #18
ljm2002 Oct 2012 #8
WCGreen Oct 2012 #10
FreeState Oct 2012 #14
WCGreen Oct 2012 #15
intaglio Oct 2012 #12
freshwest Oct 2012 #13
spanone Oct 2012 #17
Honeycombe8 Oct 2012 #19
David Zephyr Oct 2012 #20
Honeycombe8 Oct 2012 #21
libdem4life Oct 2012 #22

Response to FreeState (Original post)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 01:28 AM

1. the grammar in that snip is terrible =(

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Response to JesterCS (Reply #1)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 01:29 AM

2. Its a translation....

Not sure why but I couldn't find the article in English...

Edit: font one... adding it to the OP

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Response to JesterCS (Reply #1)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 01:30 AM

3. And, punctuation.

Damn near, unreadable.

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Response to greyl (Reply #3)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 01:32 AM

4. Fixed

(It was a translation... found an article in English )

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Response to FreeState (Reply #4)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 01:42 AM

5. Lol, that explains it. ;) nt

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Response to FreeState (Original post)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 01:49 AM

6. Why is this even an issue

 

What two people want to do is their business. Don't we have other more important things to worry about and take care of.
Take care of the people, jobs, and figure out this healthcare mess. We do not have time to get stupid about gay marriage.

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Response to qkvhj (Reply #6)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 02:13 AM

9. I wish the other side would see it that way

but for them its a money maker (or was) and brought out the bigot vote for them.

For those of us that are LGBT it is a huge issue, not being treated as an equal by your own government causes a lot of issues with jobs, taking care of your loved ones, and obtaining healthcare.

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Response to qkvhj (Reply #6)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 02:16 AM

11. Acknowledging the common dignity of all humans who wish to express love is a pretty big priority

So yes, we do have time to "get stupid about gay marriage," because its legal status - or lack thereof - in our nation is a fucking embarassment in that regard.

Hard to argue for spending money to help people preserve their lives and dignity when our government doesn't even allow two people to legally become a family on their own damn dime, based on the shape of their genitals.

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Response to Scootaloo (Reply #11)

Thu Oct 25, 2012, 06:49 PM

16. Us as a people.

 

Not those of us who support Gay marriage. Us as in the citizens of this country. The problems we face are faced by the vast majority of our people not just those with a D in front of their name. We are not making an issue out of this the latest interpretations of our constitution say we are right. It is the religious right who are wasting the time and treasure of our nation with this stupidity.

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Response to FreeState (Original post)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 01:55 AM

7. It's interesting. I found it good that he was able to say this:

"We've reached a point where human dignity and mutual respect is so important..."

I think he got the point. That's rational and what humanity wants and needs to survive.

Thanks for posting this. I know someone who I was surprised to hear is conflicted on voting for same-sex marriage. I am going to show her this, and also this:


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Response to freshwest (Reply #7)

Sun Oct 28, 2012, 05:49 PM

18. We had a long talk and she was struck by the pastor saying to be against hate and division.

She hadn't heard abourt Haggard, but he made the case well. We went over every objection in the pamphlet, which were wrong, as the measure does not force churches to do anything, the measure guarantees that no one's rights will be taken away.

Also, there is the provision about people over 62 and domestic partnerships. And we discussed the problems they faced, and the problems of people not being allowed to be with their loved ones in the hospital or have property rights.

I went over the case of the man in California who was evicted from his home after his partner broke his hip and had to go to the hospital and all the tragedy and injustice of that.

So, I managed to get 5 votes on the ballot measure for same-sex marriage yesterday. I think it will pass. It feels good.

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Response to FreeState (Original post)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 02:07 AM

8. That is surprising...

...and he does seem to get the point: the state has obligations towards all of its citizens, that may not agree with church doctrine. Good for him. (I never thought I'd say that...)

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Response to FreeState (Original post)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 02:13 AM

10. I am surprised that Ted Haggard came out for Gay Marriage, especially with his

justification that a marriage is basically a contract and you can choose to have a "god" sanctioned rite or a secular joining for legal purposes.

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Response to WCGreen (Reply #10)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 11:09 PM

14. Haggard has always been on the forefront of LGBT rights in the born again movement

Haggard has always been on the forefront of LGBT rights in the born again movement, that not to say he has ever been working for them. However, if you look at his past statements with a comparison of what others in his movement were say at the same time, he seems to be pro-gay in comparison.

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Response to FreeState (Reply #14)

Thu Oct 25, 2012, 12:50 AM

15. I really don't care how anyone worships whatever higher power they gravitate toward...

I just don't want them to try and tell me that I have to worship in their way of looking. To me, that is exactly why we were fighting the Taliban..

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Response to FreeState (Original post)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 03:34 AM

12. It seems Mr Haggard is recovering from hypocrisy

Good for him

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Response to FreeState (Original post)

Wed Oct 24, 2012, 07:45 PM

13. The separation of church and state is the sane choice.

Let people believe whatever they want, so long as they don't enforce that on others in such intimate matters, but leave each person to decide. That is the only just way to go about these issues.

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Response to FreeState (Original post)

Thu Oct 25, 2012, 06:50 PM

17. i fart in his general direction.

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Response to FreeState (Original post)

Sun Oct 28, 2012, 05:53 PM

19. Does anyone really care what that guy thinks or says? nt

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Response to Honeycombe8 (Reply #19)

Sun Oct 28, 2012, 05:56 PM

20. As an activist for LGBTQ issues since the 1960's, I appreciate your sentiments.

While I was in the trenches, living day by day to exist and fighting for my community, this sack of shit was killing my community and benefitting from doing so financially.

Honeycombe8, you sum up my feelings. He needs to work on his own conscience in private, not public.

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Response to David Zephyr (Reply #20)

Sun Oct 28, 2012, 05:59 PM

21. Exactly. He betrayed so many people. It's a little late for him to be conscience-driven. nt

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Response to FreeState (Original post)

Sun Oct 28, 2012, 06:12 PM

22. I'm glad he got back into the RWCF circuit for his family's sake, but he was forced to disavow

his own homosexuality and egregious hypocrisy after his own gay affair. As I recall, he admitted it was his human failure rather than a gift given at birth and they let him back in.

Biblical Law is used here as Old Testament Mosaic, Levitical Law and also demands stoning your children and killing animals for sacrifice and casting out your wife and a whole host of horrors. No where does any of it belong in Christ's family.

So, I give it a 50% for LGBT rights.

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