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Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:42 PM

MUST READ: If R$R Prevail On Medicaid Kids Get Ready To Sign Over YOUR House -----

for nursing home care for a loved one. This topic came up on the Ed Schultz Show just before it ended. With the cuts in Medicaid which pays for nursing home expenses for loved ones with NO ASSETS of their own, the states would be allowed to saddle the offspring with the debt of nursing home care.

Before a loved one is put in a nursing home the children and maybe even the grandchildren would have to sign a document as the person or persons responsible for the nursing home bill. Otherwise the individual WOULD NOT be admitted. So the family would be faced with providing 24/7 home health care for that person UNLESS THEY SIGN FOR FINANCIAL RESPONSIBILITY.

Remanding Medicaid to the states REMOVES PRESENT FEDERAL PROTECTIONS that keeps the states from ATTACHING the assets of family members of the individual going into a nursing home.

Payment of nursing home care WAS THE RULE before Medicaid was passed. My mother's sisters who were in state had to pay toward my grandmother's nursing home care.

Now I have posted this pending travesty on this board at least two times with almost no response. PEOPLE NEED TO GET THIS AND UNDERSTAND WHAT R$R and the GOP is up to. Because you could be in a position of losing your own assets if these bastards get their way. Newt Gingrinch almost got this done when Clinton was in office and he vetoed the budget bill and it was removed. That is why the GOP was ready to murder Clinton literally

Everyone who can be swayed needs to KNOW THIS. I know this because my mother was in a nursing home for four years and that legislation was ON THE TABLE at the time.

ADDENDUM ---FOLKS I AM REALLY SERIOUS ABOUT THIS MADNESS AND THE NEED TO SPREAD THE WORD FAR AND WIDE.
Remember the huge cuts will go to tax breaks for guys like the Kochs. Do we need to go back to the time when old people were sometimes left at the bus or train station with a note on them. And will your Medicare "coupon" pay for your health care under such a situation?

BTW This post needs to go viral anywhere you can take it. They will deny it but THEY ARE GOD DAMNED LIARS.

42 replies, 2597 views

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Arrow 42 replies Author Time Post
Reply MUST READ: If R$R Prevail On Medicaid Kids Get Ready To Sign Over YOUR House ----- (Original post)
TheMastersNemesis Oct 2012 OP
ejpoeta Oct 2012 #1
dixiegrrrrl Oct 2012 #28
zingrr Oct 2012 #30
ejpoeta Oct 2012 #35
dixiegrrrrl Oct 2012 #39
bettyellen Oct 2012 #41
virgogal Oct 2012 #2
TheMastersNemesis Oct 2012 #4
snappyturtle Oct 2012 #6
jmowreader Oct 2012 #12
virgogal Oct 2012 #20
We People Oct 2012 #42
snappyturtle Oct 2012 #3
BadgerKid Oct 2012 #5
HiPointDem Oct 2012 #10
Hoyt Oct 2012 #13
TheMastersNemesis Oct 2012 #17
liberalhistorian Oct 2012 #25
Politicalboi Oct 2012 #7
MrYikes Oct 2012 #8
HiPointDem Oct 2012 #9
TheMastersNemesis Oct 2012 #11
TheOther95Percent Oct 2012 #14
haikugal Oct 2012 #21
fleur-de-lisa Oct 2012 #15
jmowreader Oct 2012 #16
PotatoChip Oct 2012 #24
DonRedwood Oct 2012 #31
TheMastersNemesis Oct 2012 #18
Hatchling Oct 2012 #19
tblue Oct 2012 #22
exboyfil Oct 2012 #23
zingrr Oct 2012 #29
DonRedwood Oct 2012 #32
exboyfil Oct 2012 #33
liberalhistorian Oct 2012 #26
PotatoChip Oct 2012 #27
liberalhistorian Oct 2012 #36
vankuria Oct 2012 #34
Digit Oct 2012 #37
beac Oct 2012 #38
renate Oct 2012 #40

Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:45 PM

1. REc for exposure. I had no idea about this. Another thing no one hears about in

the MSM. I think this would be an important thing. My parents are gone now, but it is scary nonetheless. Sure wouldn't want my kids strapped with the cost for my care!

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Response to ejpoeta (Reply #1)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 07:57 PM

28. These are the states which DO NOT have a "filial support" law--yet

Alabama........Missouri
Arizona...........Nebraska
Colorado...........New Mexico
florida.............New York
Colorado.........Oklahoma
Hawaii............So. Carolina
Idaho.............Texas
Illinois..............District of Columbia
Kansas
Maine
Michigan
Minnisota

Here is the link to pdf that contains the states and the law codes I used tinyurl, the actual url is a mile long)
http://tinyurl.com/9lord8f

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Response to dixiegrrrrl (Reply #28)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 08:12 PM

30. FL requires you to sell everything first

 

In FL you can't have more than $2000 in assets..you are required to sell everything and put into fund which they force you to spend first and then Medicaid and/or medicare will kick in....It is sad that after you work your whole life and put money into medicaid, medicare and social security the Republican governors are forcing you into bankruptcy!!

This isn't the American Dream...and this is not right!!!!

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Response to zingrr (Reply #30)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 09:35 PM

35. i believe we have spend down too here in ny. but what is being described is worse...

instead of just having to liquidate all your own assets and then be done with it, your family members are forced to be responsible.

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Response to zingrr (Reply #30)

Sat Oct 20, 2012, 12:15 PM

39. Medicare does not require a sell down.

Medicare is federal, therefore the law has to be equal to everyone in the country, and Medicare coverage is NOT based on your income.( Medicare premiums may be highter for very high income people)

Medicaid is actually part Federal, part state, and Medicaid qualification is for very low income people, thus the selldown.

The income qualifications for Medicaid have been around for decades, and is not based on the political affiliation of the Governors.

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Response to dixiegrrrrl (Reply #39)

Sat Oct 20, 2012, 01:27 PM

41. And Medicare doesn't help if you need 24/7 care?

So that's no help.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:49 PM

2. What's R$R ?

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Response to virgogal (Reply #2)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:51 PM

4. Romney//Ryan

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Response to virgogal (Reply #2)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:52 PM

6. Romney and Ryan nt

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Response to virgogal (Reply #2)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:57 PM

12. It's usually R&R

Which is a brand of Canadian whiskey...ironic in that Romney doesn't touch the stuff and Ryan probably won't, and prescient in that if they get in, you will.

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Response to jmowreader (Reply #12)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 04:32 PM

20. Thanks.

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Response to jmowreader (Reply #12)

Sat Oct 20, 2012, 01:56 PM

42. Here's something different: Gekko/Galt

Saw it on Facebook - brilliant. Connects them to the particular character they're emulating in real life.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:50 PM

3. Thanks so much for posting this information! I didn't see it before.

Funny just last night I was told by a repuke whose only 'news' source is Hannity(!) that when the ACA (Obmamcare) is in full swing, she and her husband's private health insurance will skyrocket to pay for those "deadbeats" who can't afford insurance! I didn't even know where to start and it was going on midnight so...............

HOWEVER, I really appreciate your post. Will change my planning as I just turned 65 to avoid being a problem for my kids. ......just in case. I think the President will handily win!

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:51 PM

5. I thought some states already make kids financially responsible.

A month or two ago, it was mentioned on DU or in an linked article.

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Response to BadgerKid (Reply #5)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:54 PM

10. hadn't heard that. can you find a link?

 

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Response to BadgerKid (Reply #5)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 04:03 PM

13. They definitely do if parents gave assets to kids to become eligible for nursing home care

under Medicaid. There are rules as to how long look-back period is.

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Response to Hoyt (Reply #13)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 04:13 PM

17. This Situation Is The Way It Is Now But ----

sending the Medicaid program back to the states would essentially remove the FEDERAL MANDATES that protect the family assets. Going back to the state allows the states to pass each law individually. And the block grant on Medicaid could be an open grant allowing it to be used for ANYTHING.

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Response to BadgerKid (Reply #5)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 05:43 PM

25. There are, indeed, such "filial responsibility" laws

on the books of a good number of states at this time. The thing is, though, until recently, most of those states had not been enforcing such laws and had not been going after the assets of the children of nursing home residents on Medicaid, nor had most nursing homes been using such laws to go after the children of their residents who are not on Medicaid but who either couldn't or wouldn't pay the bills. So most people didn't know about them even if their state had had the laws on their books for decades, which some have.

However, more and more of these cash-strapped states have begun enforcing such laws, and said enforcement has already financially ruined many families. There was the case, for instance, of the man in Pennsylvania who was held responsible for a $93,000 (yes, that's THOUSANDS) bill for the nursing home his mother was in; the ruling against him was upheld by the appeals court. Never mind that he has little enough, himself. He is financially ruined for the rest of his life. Get ready for more and more of this shit.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:52 PM

7. It's difficult

These assholes don't care their contraception could be taken away either, so this for some is so far into the future, they don't care.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:53 PM

8. okay

We all know medicaid is not being well funded. We know some changes must occur. Maybe the thought of financial pain will cause the proper level of screaming. I believe in full health care for all; maybe this screaming will help that idea along.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:53 PM

9. kr.

 

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 03:56 PM

11. FOLKS WE HAVE GET MEAN AS A JUNK YARD DOG AND HAMMER THESE ASSHOLES POLITICALLY THE VERY LIFE OF

THIS COUNTRY HANGS IN THE BALANCE. WE CAN HAVE NO AND I MEAN NO MERCY.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 04:08 PM

14. Link to this article: http://abcnews.go.com/Business/pennsylvania-son-stuck-moms-93000-nursing-home-

"John Pittas, 47, is fighting a Pennsylvania court's order to pay his mother's $93,000 nursing home stay under a "filial support law" that is in effect in 29 states.

Pennsylvania's statute makes certain family members liable to "care for and maintain or financially assist" certain "indigent" members of the family, a law which some legal experts call "disturbing."

Pittas' mother, Maryann, now 66, was admitted for six months to Liberty Nursing Rehabilitation Center in Allentown, Pa., in September 2007 after breaking two legs in a car accident. In March 2008, Pittas' mother, who was born in the U.S., relocated to Greece, where her two other children live."

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Response to TheOther95Percent (Reply #14)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 04:47 PM

21. This is important

I thought PA's funds for the aging come from the lottery...why are they going after kids this way? Who's pocketing the money? It's never about actually providing care.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 04:11 PM

15. K & R

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 04:12 PM

16. Uhh...guys...they're talking about block granting Medicaid

Two things happen when things are block granted. Neither is good.

One: the states, esp the conservative ones, start a race to the bottom. There is a theory that people will spend thousands of dollars to move to a state that pays $10 more per month in govt benefits. How they came up with this, I have no idea. In addition to being cruel, it's dumb as hell.

Two: Block grant funds have a nasty habit of paying for tax cuts. There really aren't restrictions on how these are used. Think back to the block grants for smoking cessation programs: did one state of the fifty start one? Lots of tax cuts and dropping of the cash into the general fund. The same will happen with Medicaid block grants.

In some cases big centralized government is good...such as when money is involved.

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Response to jmowreader (Reply #16)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 05:31 PM

24. Thank you for the explanation

and to you too MN, for the heads-up OP.

It'd be nice if there was a link to something that would speak to this issue specifically without getting into a long spiel about block grants, ect... I/we here at DU 'get it' but some of our more apolitical and/or elderly family members might not, unless it is spelled out for them in a way that they can understand.

Too bad the MSM doesn't appear to be covering it, otherwise someone would have come up w/a link by now.

Hmmm. Wondering if the AARP or some similar type org. might have relevant info. If I find something, will add a link.

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Response to PotatoChip (Reply #24)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 08:21 PM

31. yup...i'd facebook it if it was a reputable news site.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 04:16 PM

18. Anyone Who Can Put This Info On the Net Should. Spread It Far And Wide. The MSM Will Not Cover It

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 04:16 PM

19. Everytime I see R&R

I think of trains and that they are going to railroad us if they get in office.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 04:52 PM

22. This would destroy Rmoney's chances

if people knew.

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Response to tblue (Reply #22)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 05:06 PM

23. I have put this on Facebook a few times

asked my state congresscritters about it. I would like to get it in front of a Congressional debate. The filial responsibility laws in many states are very scary. My grandmother is in a nursing home in this state, and I worry about my financial exposure.


252.2 PARENTS AND CHILDREN LIABLE.
The father, mother, and children of any poor person, who is unable
to maintain the poor person's self by labor, shall jointly or
severally relieve or maintain such person in such manner as, upon
application to the board of supervisors of the county where such
person has a residence or may be, they may direct.

252.5 REMOTE RELATIVES.
In the absence or inability of nearer relatives, the same
liability shall extend to grandparents, if of ability without
personal labor, and to the grandchildren who are of ability by
personal labor or otherwise.
Section History: Early Form

252.6 ENFORCEMENT OF LIABILITY.
Upon the failure of such relatives to assist or maintain a poor
person who has made application for assistance, the county board of
supervisors, service area advisory board created under section
217.43, or state division of child and family services of the
department of human services may apply to the district court of the
county where the poor person resides or may be found for an order to
compel the assistance or maintenance.

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Response to exboyfil (Reply #23)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 08:09 PM

29. FL Gov Rick Scott purging disabled from Medicaid

 

Wingnut Scott is purging 3000 100% disabled adults under 64 off the Medicaid rolls...just to interrupt cash expenditures. Each of these adults being purged avg about $3000 a month in medicine and $2000 a month in doctors fees, tests, provider services...The avg Medicaid receipent receives less than $1000 a month to live on....no money...no medicine..no doctors...no services...no safety net....The Medicaid Law was written to protect the weakest in our country....instead of protecting the weakest...Gov Scott has broken federal law and a new sign was seen at the GA-FL state line ---"WELCOME TO NAZI FLORIDA --PLAN ON A SLOW AGONIZING DEATH". From what I have been told is all the Republican Governor's have implemented this purge and forced reapplication process which takes 3 to 6 months...

Imagine 3-6 months without your heart medicines, or your cancer treatments, or spinal medications, or pain killers, or dialysis......It is time for the Disabled to revolt against the
those who are slowly killing them!!!!

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Response to exboyfil (Reply #23)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 08:24 PM

32. what is this from? I'd like to read the whole thing

merci!

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 05:53 PM

26. I have been trying to get my wingnut stepsister and her

even worse wingnut, ignorant husband, to understand this, as they live in a "filial responsibility" law state and her father, my stepfather, has been in a nursing home with dementia, in only his sixties, for several years now. They hate Medicaid, Medicare, evil big guv'ment, etc,, etc. (you know the drill), but benefit tremendously from it. Were it not for Medicaid, and the fact that my mother is still alive so most of her income and pension, as well as my stepdad's pension, is taken for his monthly bills before Medicaid kicks in its share, they'd be on the hook legally for thousands of dollars a month that they either don't have or, being the greedy, selfish people that they are, wouldn't want to part with. In fact, it may get to that point, as the state may, indeed, decide to start more aggressively enforcing the law. Given the utterly disgusting, thuggish, wingnut teabagger extraordinaire who's currently occupying the governor's seat, that wouldn't surprise me at all. I'm actually more surprised that they haven't yet.

Unfortunately for them, stepsis and hubby simply WILL NOT LISTEN to those who try to tell them this and DO NOT GET IT. And they have a nice house, new cars, etc., etc. Now, I don't begrudge them any of that at all. But they need to be aware that they could easily lose all of that should their beloved guv, the one they'd love to meet to have over for a beer sometime and whom they practically worship, start enforcing that law. But I'm sure they'll just find another way to blame Dems, instead of recognizing where the true problem is.

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Response to liberalhistorian (Reply #26)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 06:17 PM

27. List of States with 'Filial Responsibility' laws

The states that have filial responsibility laws on their books in some shape or form are Alaska, Arkansas, California, Connecticut, Delaware, Georgia, Indiana, Iowa, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maryland, Massachusetts, Mississippi, Montana, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Jersey, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Dakota, Tennessee, Utah, Vermont, Virginia, and West Virginia.

http://wills.about.com/b/2012/06/13/what-is-filial-responsibility-and-why-should-you-be-concerned-about-it.htm

Thanks for the info you provided. The rest of the article basically just backs up what you pointed out.

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Response to PotatoChip (Reply #27)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 09:44 PM

36. Yep. They live in one (Ohio),

and also where my stepdad is institutionalized, and I live in another (a western state). Now, I would not legally be responsible under those laws for my stepdad, although I remain very concerned for him and want him to receive the best of care, which he's getting. At the cost of my mother having any kind of a decent life after decades of working hard, since they take most of her income and his pension before Medicaid will kick in its share, but it's important that he get that.

Both of my parents live in Ohio and are currently very healthy physically and mentally, although, as we all know, that could change on a dime at any time. I don't know how those laws work in regards to residency; can states go after adult children if they live in a different state from where the parents are receiving care? I don't think they can, but I'm not sure, maybe they could. Now, I wouldn't mind at all helping them as much as I could; indeed, I consider it to be a moral and ethical obligation to do as much for our parents as we're able. But hubby and I really have nothing right now; we rent a home instead of own, we have older car, we hardly have any other assets. So it's not like they could take anything from us, anyway. And if his father, who lives in our state, finds himself needing care (which, given his age, is entirely possible), hubby's siblings, who live in other states, would actually be in a better position than we would, although we'd certainly do whatever we could.

That brings up a whole host of other questions. What if the children are unable financially to do anything, as they, themselves, might not have much? What if they have children to care and provide for and they don't make much money? What if the parents of BOTH spouses are in need of care and they can only be stretched so thin? What if they just. don't. have. it? How can they still be forced to give what they simply don't have? Is there a particular formula, like there is with child support, that takes income and other obligations, including children, into account?

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 09:26 PM

34. I talk to folks about this all the time

but not sure I'm getting through. My Mom spent 2 yrs in a nursing home through Medicaid funding. Her monthly care bill was around 6 grand a month and I could not imagine if my family had to be responsible for this. My poor Mom would've died before strapping her family with this kind of debt. The thought that someone is turned away from nursing home care because there is no one to pick up the tab is cruel and inhuman. What are they gonna do, just put elderly and disabled folks out to the curb to die. By the time nursing home care becomes an option, it's because all other options (home care, adult day programs, etc.) have been exhausted. i know when my Mom needed nursing home care, it was because she fell, fractured her pelvis, could no longer walk and a host of medical issues for which she needed 24 hour supervision/care. We happened to find a very good facility that accepted medicaid and she recieved very good care and they extended her life by 2 yrs., and I'm very grateful to them. If families become responsible to pay for this, it will bankrupt them.

This is one of my biggest fears and I will keep talking about this issue as it is something near and dear to my heart. Thank you for bringing this up.

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 11:16 PM

37. Kick

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Fri Oct 19, 2012, 11:51 PM

38. K&R. This is VERY important.

What Romney and Ryan intend to do to seniors and their families is sickening.

An elderly lady I know is trying desperately to convince the nurses in the assisted living facility where she lives that they will be out of a job if Romney wins. Skyrocketing costs for seniors = no more nice assisted living facilities for seniors to live out their days and no more great jobs for geriatric nurses.

Alas, she says "every dang one of them is voting for Romney... I think they hate Obama b/c he's black and they won't listen to a dang word I say."

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Response to TheMastersNemesis (Original post)

Sat Oct 20, 2012, 12:22 PM

40. most parents wouldn't want their kids to be on the hook any more than the kids would want it

I think you'd see a lot of suicides among the elderly if this came to pass... which certain politicians would see as a very practical solution.

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